aiki

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If God made me, why can't just being myself honor him?

Well, just being yourself is actually the core problem that God has with you - and with everyone else. In-and-of yourself, you are an offense to God. So am I. Without Christ, we're repugnant, wicked, foul creatures, deserving of eternal hell. Our hearts are "deceitful above all things and desperately wicked" (Jeremiah 17:9); there is "none righteous, no, not one" (Romans 3:10); apart from God, we are all bound under the power of our own flesh, the world and the devil (Ephesians 2:1-3); we are natural enemies of God, wanting our own way rather than His (Colossians 1:21; Titus 3:3-4; Romans 8:5-8). "Just being me," then, is why I need to be saved; "me" is horrible, evil and in rebellion toward God. The same is true for everyone else, too - including you. Do you believe it?

I need Christ to make me what I can't be by myself: pure, righteous, pleasing to God. He is the only way to God (Acts 4:12; John 14:6), the sole Mediator between God and us (1 Timothy 1:25), our salvation from the hell we deserve to endure (John 3:16-20; Romans 2:3-10). Do you believe it?

When I became a child of God, a disciple of Christ, I was no longer my own, free to live as I please:

1 Corinthians 6:19-20
19 Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit within you, whom you have from God? You are not your own,
20 for you were bought with a price. So glorify God in your body
.

Colossians 3:1-3
1 If then you have been raised with Christ, seek the things that are above, where Christ is, seated at the right hand of God.
2 Set your minds on things that are above, not on things that are on earth.
3 For you have died, and your life is hidden with Christ in God.

Romans 6:22
22 But now that you have been set free from sin and have become slaves of God, the fruit you get leads to sanctification and its end, eternal life.

This is what God is offering to us in Christ: a new life in him exchanged for our old, self-centered, God-denying life. Salvation isn't just a get-out-of-hell-free card, eternal "fire insurance," but a coming under the authority of God, made a slave of God, to serve Him as His ambassador of light in a world of darkness. Do you believe it? Will you live as His servant of light?
 
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GreekOrthodox

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Zechariah 8 mentions playing.
3 Thus says the Lord: I have returned to Zion and will dwell in the midst of Jerusalem, and Jerusalem shall be called the faithful city, and the mountain of the Lord of hosts, the holy mountain. 4 Thus says the Lord of hosts: Old men and old women shall again sit in the streets of Jerusalem, each with staff in hand because of great age. 5 And the streets of the city shall be full of boys and girls playing in its streets.
 
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My games,
My first computer games, Zork, Wizardry, Oregon Trail and Ultima
Skyrim and Elder Scrolls
Civilization and other style 4X games
Lord of the Rings Online (but inactive for years now)

Personally, I prefer in-person games, Dungeons and Dragons (for over 40 years now) as well as board games such as Catan, Betrayal on the House on the Hill, Munchkin, Carcassone, Ticket to Ride.
 
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Thatgirloncfforums

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I believe that I sin but not continuously. No father would say to their child, 'you are evil, repugnant and an offense to me. Being yourself, my child, is what I have against you'. That's child abuse. If God felt that way, he never would have died for me. He didn't die to make himself feel better about me


Well, just being yourself is actually the core problem that God has with you - and with everyone else. In-and-of yourself, you are an offense to God. So am I. Without Christ, we're repugnant, wicked, foul creatures, deserving of eternal hell. Our hearts are "deceitful above all things and desperately wicked" (Jeremiah 17:9); there is "none righteous, no, not one" (Romans 3:10); apart from God, we are all bound under the power of our own flesh, the world and the devil (Ephesians 2:1-3); we are natural enemies of God, wanting our own way rather than His (Colossians 1:21; Titus 3:3-4; Romans 8:5-8). "Just being me," then, is why I need to be saved; "me" is horrible, evil and in rebellion toward God. The same is true for everyone else, too - including you. Do you believe it?

I need Christ to make me what I can't be by myself: pure, righteous, pleasing to God. He is the only way to God (Acts 4:12; John 14:6), the sole Mediator between God and us (1 Timothy 1:25), our salvation from the hell we deserve to endure (John 3:16-20; Romans 2:3-10). Do you believe it?

When I became a child of God, a disciple of Christ, I was no longer my own, free to live as I please:

1 Corinthians 6:19-20
19 Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit within you, whom you have from God? You are not your own,
20 for you were bought with a price. So glorify God in your body
.

Colossians 3:1-3
1 If then you have been raised with Christ, seek the things that are above, where Christ is, seated at the right hand of God.
2 Set your minds on things that are above, not on things that are on earth.
3 For you have died, and your life is hidden with Christ in God.

Romans 6:22
22 But now that you have been set free from sin and have become slaves of God, the fruit you get leads to sanctification and its end, eternal life.

This is what God is offering to us in Christ: a new life in him exchanged for our old, self-centered, God-denying life. Salvation isn't just a get-out-of-hell-free card, eternal "fire insurance," but a coming under the authority of God, made a slave of God, to serve Him as His ambassador of light in a world of darkness. Do you believe it? Will you live as His servant of light?
 
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Thatgirloncfforums

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The original Oregon Trail?
My games,
My first computer games, Zork, Wizardry, Oregon Trail and Ultima
Skyrim and Elder Scrolls
Civilization and other style 4X games
Lord of the Rings Online (but inactive for years now)

Personally, I prefer in-person games, Dungeons and Dragons (for over 40 years now) as well as board games such as Catan, Betrayal on the House on the Hill, Munchkin, Carcassone, Ticket to Ride.
 
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aiki

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Zechariah 8 mentions playing.
3 Thus says the Lord: I have returned to Zion and will dwell in the midst of Jerusalem, and Jerusalem shall be called the faithful city, and the mountain of the Lord of hosts, the holy mountain. 4 Thus says the Lord of hosts: Old men and old women shall again sit in the streets of Jerusalem, each with staff in hand because of great age. 5 And the streets of the city shall be full of boys and girls playing in its streets.


...boys and girls playing...

1 Corinthians 13:11
11 When I was a child, I spoke like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I gave up childish ways.

No one is entirely forbidding the playing of games, only the playing of them in a way that diminishes, competes with, and distracts from one's fellowship with God and glorifying Him with one's life. Video gaming, in particular, is designed to provoke more and more gameplay. Many are the believers I know personally who are addicted to Candy Crush, or some MMRPG online, or SmashBrothers, etc. It is a sign of spiritual immaturity to be under bondage to such things - a condition that inevitably leads to harm, in the long run.
 
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Thatgirloncfforums

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Many of these games are developed around a community, wherein being a part of the community is required in order to play and advance.
It seems like you're saying that God in Christ isn't present in the digital world. Aren't all worlds subjected to him?
I agree though, addiction is bad but a person can become addicted to anything.
...boys and girls playing...

1 Corinthians 13:11
11 When I was a child, I spoke like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I gave up childish ways.

No one is entirely forbidding the playing of games, only the playing of them that diminishes, competes with, and distracts from one's fellowship with God and glorifying Him with one's life. Video gaming, in particular, is designed to provoke more and more gameplay. Many are the believers I know personally who are addicted to Candy Crush, or some MMRPG online, or SmashBrothers, etc. It is a sign of spiritual immaturity to be under bondage to such things - a condition that inevitably leads to harm, in the long run.
 
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aiki

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I believe that I sin but not continuously. No father would say to their child, 'you are evil, repugnant and an offense to me. Being yourself, my child, is what I have against you'. That's child abuse. If God felt that way, he never would have died for me. He didn't die to make himself feel better about me

Do you deny the Scripture I offered to you? As the verses I showed you indicated, apart from God, you are a sinner deserving of eternal hell, by nature, rebellious, selfish and sinful. It's from this circumstance that Jesus came to be your Savior. He came to save you, not because you deserved to be saved, not because you were so loveable God just had to save you, but because He is a loving, gracious, merciful God and without his sacrifice on the cross for your sins, you'd be hell-bound when you die. That's the truth of God's word, plain all throughout the entire Bible.

As one of God's children, you are accepted by God because of Jesus (Ephesians 1:6), not because of you. As I already explained, God offers you as a saved child of His, not the freedom to live as you like, serving yourself, but the freedom to live as He always intended you should: as His servant, His ambassador, the hands and heart of Christ to a lost and dying world. As I said, God never made you to live for yourself, but to live for Him. This is the essence of being a Christian, as the verses from Scripture I offered to you explained. Do you deny them?
 
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aiki

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Many of these games are developed around a community, wherein being a part of the community is required in order to play and advance.
It seems like you're saying that God in Christ isn't present in the digital world. Aren't all worlds subjected to him?
I agree though, addiction is bad but a person can become addicted to anything.

God calls His children to serve, first and foremost, the family of God, to use the spiritual gifts He's given each of His children to the benefit of the family of God. Are you doing this in your gaming? Is the family of God blessed and strengthened through your gameplay?

People can become addicted to many things, yes. But not, I think, to anything. And there are some things that are, by their very nature addictive - unlike, say, knitting, or gardening, or wood-carving. Video games are designed to be addictive; they are made to be quickly and powerfully habit-forming. And so, one must be very careful to maintain careful and strict boundaries on gameplay.
 
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Thatgirloncfforums

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I'm not apart from God though. Earlier you asked me if I was born again. I said yes. The verses about being God's enemy and a child of wrath no longer apply to me. I'm no longer under the Law. I am forgiven when I sin and perfectly worthy before him, bc Christ lives in me. So, the things that I do are Christ doing them in me. Why can't Jesus play games? Also, if he created me, then it is my sin and anger toward him that he came to separate me from. I am still me. All the good in me from my creation, I still retain.
Do you deny the Scripture I offered to you? As the verses I showed you indicated, apart from God, you are a sinner deserving of eternal hell, by nature, rebellious, selfish and sinful. It's from this circumstance that Jesus came to be your Savior. He came to save you, not because you deserved to be saved, not because you were so loveable God just had to save you, but because He is a loving, gracious, merciful God and without his sacrifice on the cross for your sins, you'd be hell-bound when you die. That's the truth of God's word, plain all throughout the entire Bible.

As one of God's children, you are accepted by God because of Jesus, not because of you. As I already explained, God offers you as a saved child of His, not the freedom to live as you like, serving yourself, but the freedom to live as He always intended you should: as His servant, His ambassador, the hands and heart of Christ to a lost and dying world. As I said, God never made you to live for yourself, but to live for Him. This is the essence of being a Christian, as the verses from Scripture I offered to you explained. Do you deny them?
 
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aiki

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I'm not apart from God though. Earlier you asked me if I was born again. I said yes. The verses about being God's enemy and a child of wrath no longer apply to me. I'm no longer under the Law. I am forgiven when I sin and perfectly worthy before him, bc Christ lives in me. So, the things that I do is Christ doing it in me.

I don't understand your reasoning here. Are you saying that because Christ is in you when you sin, it is Christ who is sinning? Are you saying that whatever you choose to do, because Christ is in you, he agrees with your choice?
 
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Thatgirloncfforums

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Knitting is addictive, so is sewing. I just don't see any difference between interactive art and gaming. Gaming is a high form of art, wherein you are inviting people into your world. And that world can be demonic but it can also be godly. Some friends I played with were Christians and others, not. But God was exposing my nonChristian friends to the Gospel through my presence in the gaming world.
God calls His children to serve, first and foremost, the family of God, to use the spiritual gifts He's given each of His children to the benefit of the family of God. Are you doing this in your gaming? Is the family of God blessed and strengthened through your gameplay?

People can become addicted to many things, yes. But not, I think, to anything. And there are some things that are, by their very nature addictive - unlike, say, knitting, or gardening, or wood-carving. Video games are designed to be addictive; they are made to be quickly and powerfully habit-forming. And so, one must be very careful to maintain careful and strict boundaries on gameplay.
 
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Thatgirloncfforums

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No. I am saying that the good which in me is Christ. Sin is an 'alien work' if you will. When I sin, I am sinning against myself as a good creature of God, as well as God my Creator.
I don't understand your reasoning here. Are you saying that because Christ is in you when you sin, it is Christ who is sinning? Are you saying that whatever you choose to do, because Christ is in you, he agrees with your choice?
 
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aiki

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Knitting is addictive, so is sewing. I

Really? How many knitting or sewing addicts do you know? I've met many drug and alcohol addicts, many sex and inappropriate content addicts, many food addicts, but never a knitting addict. Certainly, there isn't anything intrinsically addictive about knitting, as there is with video gaming, which was my point.

No. I am saying that the good which in me is Christ. Sin is an 'alien work' if you will. When I sin, I am sinning against myself as a good creature of God, as well as God my Creator.

Okay. I understand you better now. Thanks. Not sure how it applies to what we're talking about, though...
 
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I'm not apart from God though. Earlier you asked me if I was born again. I said yes. The verses about being God's enemy and a child of wrath no longer apply to me. I'm no longer under the Law. I am forgiven when I sin and perfectly worthy before him, bc Christ lives in me. So, the things that I do are Christ doing them in me. Why can't Jesus play games? Also, if he created me, then it is my sin and anger toward him that he came to separate me from. I am still me. All the good in me from my creation, I still retain.

Orthodox heaven is similar to Catholic heaven. Dancing is Greek rather than flamenco :)
5f992aacd8b559001cea1218.jpg
 
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Jamdoc

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I don't. I think God will so blow us away, we will be so overcome with awe and wonder by the glorified Christ and God our Father and so in tune with the Holy Spirit, utterly fulfilled by our fellowship with him, that the myriad games we find so necessary, so gratifying, will seem foolish and dull, tepid, ugly things compared to knowing and enjoying our Holy infinite Maker.

But knowing God this way doesn't have to wait 'til eternity. It can begin now while we are here on earth. You and I can begin to enjoy God, to know Him as the most fulfilling, awesome Person that He is today. It's very hard for this to occur, though, when we constantly run to games (or t.v., or hobbies, or sports, or whatever) in idle moments, turning our minds from God, tuning out from everything while we stimulate ourselves with the sight and sounds and action of gaming (or whatever). Of course, Christians do this because they don't actually find God very satisfying and they don't believe He can be more delightful and fulfilling than five hours of Minecraft, or SkyRim, or Animal Crossing - or whatever. The problem is that the only way to discover the beauty, richness and wonder of God is to put aside the things that distract us from Him and pursue Him directly, giving Him time and space to show us Himself.

Sounds more like a drug than a relationship with a person.
Where you see all enjoyable activities as just a source of dopamine all being the same thing and then rate them by intensity and so you see God as being the strongest source of Dopamine so you want nothing but to have that reward center hammered by staring at Him or whatever.

Meanwhile I see God as a person, that you have a relationship with, and have fellowship with Him, and I see Him as wanting to DO things with us. Like He wrestled with Jacob. Yes, even playing games and sports with Him. Why not? isn't that what families do together?

Isn't the entire point to be a family member and child of God rather than just a servant?
 
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Jamdoc

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...boys and girls playing...

1 Corinthians 13:11
11 When I was a child, I spoke like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I gave up childish ways.

No one is entirely forbidding the playing of games, only the playing of them in a way that diminishes, competes with, and distracts from one's fellowship with God and glorifying Him with one's life. Video gaming, in particular, is designed to provoke more and more gameplay. Many are the believers I know personally who are addicted to Candy Crush, or some MMRPG online, or SmashBrothers, etc. It is a sign of spiritual immaturity to be under bondage to such things - a condition that inevitably leads to harm, in the long run.


"I can do all things through a verse out of context"

Paul wasn't talking about games he was talking about the need for sign gifts, establishing that they were to legitimize the Church and Jesus to unbelievers, but once they'd served that purpose they were to be put away and the focus was to be on love and charity and worship of Jesus Christ
 
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aiki

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Sounds more like a drug than a relationship with a person.
Where you see all enjoyable activities as just a source of dopamine all being the same thing and then rate them by intensity and so you see God as being the strongest source of Dopamine so you want nothing but to have that reward center hammered by staring at Him or whatever.

We see what we want to see, I guess... But this isn't anything like what I wrote, or intended to convey in my remarks.

Meanwhile I see God as a person, that you have a relationship with, and have fellowship with Him, and I see Him as wanting to DO things with us. Like He wrestled with Jacob. Yes, even playing games and sports with Him. Why not? isn't that what families do together?

This is defining God - His interests and conduct, at least - by your own standard. God tells us in His word, though, what concerns and interests Him and what things He thinks are worth our time and attention, and playing games isn't listed anywhere. We sure don't see the apostles fiddling about idly, daily distracting themselves with useless fantasies. Following Christ was far too... real, too radical and life-consuming, for that sort of thing.

Isn't the entire point to be a family member and child of God rather than just a servant?

It's not one or the other, or one above the other, but both together, complementary, making up our identity in Christ. You aren't a child at the expense of being God's servant and you aren't His servant at the expense of being His child.
 
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aiki

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"I can do all things through a verse out of context"

Show how I've taken the verse from its context and misapplied it.

Paul wasn't talking about games He was talking about the need for sign gifts, establishing that they were to legitimize the Church and Jesus to unbelievers, but once they'd served that purpose they were to be put away and the focus was to be on love and charity and worship of Jesus Christ

I didn't say Paul was talking about games in the verse from 1 Corinthians 13, did I? But the general principle of growth to maturity and the effects that growth cause on how we live is very pertinent to the idea that an OT verse about playing children justifies childish play in adults.
 
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We see what we want to see, I guess... But this isn't anything like what I wrote, or intended to convey in my remarks.



This is defining God - His interests and conduct, at least - by your own standard. God tells us in His word, though, what concerns and interests Him and what things He thinks are worth our time and attention, and playing games isn't listed anywhere. We sure don't see the apostles fiddling about idly, daily distracting themselves with useless fantasies. Following Christ was far too... real, too radical and life-consuming, for that sort of thing.



It's not one or the other, or one above the other, but both together, complementary, making up our identity in Christ. You aren't a child at the expense of being God's servant and you aren't His servant at the expense of being His child.


as I point out and keep pointing out, Jesus played a sport with Jacob, and God designed the entire idea of having fun and playing games, it's all through the natural world that God created. Fathers play with their children, fathers give them the toys to play with teach them games, and play with their children.

I'll be blunt, the more you make God out to be some unrelatable aloof transcendent lofty exalted being, the less I love the god you talk about. Because Jesus was a person who related to other people, and spoke to His disciples as friends, who had compassion on other people.

It's Islam that teaches an unrelatable all powerful tyrant. I can't love Allah.
 
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