Wisconsin Assembly bans mention of CRT in school, along with about 100 other things

bekkilyn · Oct 19, 2021

And how are black people treated today? Are they allowed private property? Can they get a basic education or even go to college and get a Ph.D. or become doctors? Are they allowed to vote or even run for public office? Is it possible for a black person to become President of the U.S.? Can they achieve officer rank in the military or even become a general? What exactly is it that black people aren't capable of doing that other people can do?

Der Alte · Oct 19, 2021

Bradskii said:
Popcorn? You were lucky. We lived for three months in a paper bag in a septic tank. We used to have to get up at six in the morning, clean the paper bag, eat a crust of stale bread, go to work down t' mill, fourteen hours a day, week-in week-out, for sixpence a week, and when we got home our Dad would thrash us to sleep wi' his belt.

Is that you Oliver? I've bin wonderin' what happened to you.

The Transcendentian · Oct 19, 2021

essentialsaltes said:
Wisconsin Assembly passes ban on teaching critical race theory

The bill, which passed the Assembly on a 60-38 party-line vote, is all but certain to be vetoed by Democratic Gov. Tony Evers, a former state schools superintendent. The bill has yet to be approved by the Senate.

Banned terms
In testimony before a joint meeting of the Assembly and Senate education committees in August, Rep. Chuck Wichgers, R-Muskego, one of the co-authors of the bill to ban the teaching of critical race theory, outlined a list of additional terms and concepts that he said violate the Equal Protection Clause of the U.S. Constitution and would be prohibited subjects in the classroom under the bill:

Critical Race Theory (CRT)

Action Civics

Social Emotional Learning (SEL)

Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion (DEI)

Culturally responsive teaching

Abolitionist teaching

Affinity groups

Anti-racism

Anti-bias training

Anti-blackness

Anti-meritocracy

Obtuse meritocracy

Centering or de-centering

Collective guilt

Colorism

Conscious and unconscious bias

Critical ethnic studies

Critical pedagogy

Critical self-awareness

Critical self-reflection

Cultural appropriation/misappropriation

Cultural awareness

Cultural competence

Cultural proficiency

Cultural relevance

Cultural responsiveness

Culturally responsive practices

De-centering whiteness

Deconstruct knowledges

Diversity focused

Diversity training

Dominant discourses

Educational justice

Equitable

Equity

Examine “systems"

Free radical therapy

Free radical self/collective care

Hegemony

Identity deconstruction

Implicit/Explicit bias

Inclusivity education

Institutional bias

Institutional oppression

Internalized racial superiority

Internalized racism

Internalized white supremacy

Interrupting racism

Intersection

Intersectionality

Intersectional identities

Intersectional studies

Land acknowledgment

Marginalized identities

Marginalized/Minoritized/Under-represented communities

Microaggressions

Multiculturalism

Neo-segregation

Normativity

Oppressor vs. oppressed

Patriarchy

Protect vulnerable identities

Race essentialism

Racial healing

Racialized identity

Racial justice

Racial prejudice

Racial sensitivity training

Racial supremacy

Reflective exercises

Representation and inclusion

Restorative justice

Restorative practices

Social justice

Spirit murdering

Structural bias

Structural inequity

Structural racism

Systemic bias

Systemic oppression

Systemic racism

Systems of power and oppression

Unconscious bias

White fragility

White privilege

White social capital

White supremacy

Whiteness

Woke

Banning bad ideas is a very bad idea for trying to stop those bad ideas from spreading.

What we need is more free speech for students, so they can openly criticize or approve of ideas being taught.

Also we need to ban the covering up of what is being taught, make it illegal for teachers and schools to lie to parents or to anyone about what they are teaching in the classroom.

Bradskii · Oct 19, 2021

Aldebaran said:
Seeing the resulting atrocities tells a reasonable person volumes about what the relevant text teaches.

It tells you what the results were. If you think that it's only the results one should look at and not the reasons for those results then I guess that investigating the background for any problems that any given society might have wouldn't really interest you.

Did you not do history in school? Or did you do it but just thought it was just dates an' stuff.

bekkilyn · Oct 19, 2021

The Transcendentian said:
Banning bad ideas is a very bad idea for trying to stop those bad ideas from spreading.

What we need is more free speech for students, so they can openly criticize or approve of ideas being taught.

Also we need to ban the covering up of what is being taught, make it illegal for teachers and schools to lie to parents or to anyone about what they are teaching in the classroom.

My first, knee-jerk, reaction to your suggestion is that it sounds pretty reasonable to me.

durangodawood · Oct 19, 2021

Aldebaran said:
..... the Marxist belief that current social conditions are the product of history. This belief comes directly from Marx’s writings....

And whats sooooo wrong about that?

Sounds pretty reasonable to me. Almost to the point of obvious.

Aldebaran · Oct 19, 2021

Bradskii said:
It tells you what the results were. If you think that it's only the results one should look at and not the reasons for those results then I guess that investigating the background for any problems that any given society might have wouldn't really interest you.

Are you suggesting I read the Nazi propaganda to see if the atrocities they committed may have somehow been justified?

Bradskii · Oct 19, 2021

Aldebaran said:
Does that mean I won't be judged as an oppressor, or assumed that I have some sort of advantage/disadvantage because of my skin color?

How you are judged as an individual will reflect the way you act towards others. No more. No less. Now whether you have any advantages in life is a given. We can make a list and tick them if you like. Tick what you think would give you an advantage or put n/a and it'll be assigned arbitrarily.

Being born with sufficient access to an occupation. Tick.
Being born at a time when it's your choice as to whether you join the armed services. Tick.
Being born in a wealthy country. Tick.
Being born in a democracy. Tick.
Being born into a system that values education. Tick.
Not being born into abject poverty. Tick.
Not being born in a country at war. Tick.

The list goes on. And you carry on filling out the form. Ticking all the boxes you'd want. They are all the things that you think would be an advantage. And you'll eventually come to one that effectively says: Black or white. But don't worry - this is a confidential form. Nobody knows that you are actually making a selection. Nobody is going to know which one you pick.

At this point you might have an internal discussion. 'Hey, it shouldn't make any difference. Black and white - there's no difference except colour. If I pick white then won't that mean I'm a racist?'

But the internal discussion goes on and you convince yourself that it wouldn't be racist. It obviously isn't. And you're not a racist anyway. You know that for certain. The form is just for the benefit of gaining as much of an advantage as one can. It's nothing to do with racism. And you know from experience which box you should tick.

So you make the obvious choice. And just like preferring not to be at war and be conscripted makes you a coward or preferring wealth over poverty doesn't make you a miserly capitalist then your choice of black or white doesn't make you a racist.

But at least all those ticks tell us that you realise there are advantages and disadvantages with every selection. But if someone now says 'Let's look at each selection and discuss why we made them' then you mount your high horse and yell 'No way! I am not a racist! Marxism! You're all in cahoots with the LGBT crowd!'

You simply don't get it, do you...

Aldebaran · Oct 19, 2021

durangodawood said:
And whats sooooo wrong about that?

Sounds pretty reasonable to me. Almost to the point of obvious.

Taking a portion of 2 sentences out of an entire article won't get you the big picture. Read a little further.

Aldebaran · Oct 19, 2021

Bradskii said:
How you are judged as an individual will reflect the way you act towards others. No more. No less. Now whether you have any advantages in life is a given. We can make a list and tick them if you like. Tick what you think would give you an advantage or put n/a and it'll be assigned arbitrarily.

Being born with sufficient access to an occupation. Tick.
Being born at a time when it's your choice as to whether you join the armed services. Tick.
Being born in a wealthy country. Tick.
Being born in a democracy. Tick.
Being born into a system that values education. Tick.
Not being born into abject poverty. Tick.
Not being born in a country at war. Tick.

The list goes on. And you carry on filling out the form. Ticking all the boxes you'd want. They are all the things that you think would be an advantage. And you'll eventually come to one that effectively says: Black or white. But don't worry - this is a confidential form. Nobody knows that you are actually making a selection. Nobody is going to know which one you pick.

At this point you might have an internal discussion. 'Hey, it shouldn't make any difference. Black and white - there's no difference except colour. If I pick white then won't that mean I'm a racist?'

But the internal discussion goes on and you convince yourself that it wouldn't be racist. It obviously isn't. And you're not a racist anyway. You know that for certain. The form is just for the benefit of gaining as much of an advantage as one can. It's nothing to do with racism. And you know from experience which box you should tick.

So you make the obvious choice. And just like preferring not to be at war and be conscripted makes you a coward or preferring wealth over poverty doesn't make you a miserly capitalist then your choice of black or white doesn't make you a racist.

But at least all those ticks tell us that you realise there are advantages and disadvantages with every selection. But if someone now says 'Let's look at each selection and discuss why we made them' then you mount your high horse and yell 'No way! I am not a racist! Marxism! You're all in cahoots with the LGBT crowd!'

You simply don't get it, do you...

You forgot to include the link.

Bradskii · Oct 19, 2021

Aldebaran said:
Are you suggesting I read the Nazi propaganda to see if the atrocities they committed may have somehow been justified?

You'll need to read it to see why they thought the atrocities were justified. Good grief, you don't need to be the smartest guy in the room to realise that if something bad happens then it's a very good idea to find out why so there's a better chance of preventing it from happening again.

They say that those who do not study history are doomed to repeat it. It's not often that I come across someone actively saying that it shouldn't be studied.

Aldebaran · Oct 19, 2021

Bradskii said:
You'll need to read it to see why they thought the atrocities were justified. Good grief, you don't need to be the smartest guy in the room to realise that if something bad happens then it's a very good idea to find out why so there's a better chance of preventing it from happening again.

Enough of what they thought has already been made public as to why they thought it was justified. One of their reasons is because they thought Jews were spreaders of disease. Sound familiar?
"As early as August 1920, Hitler compared the Jews to germs. He stated that diseases cannot be controlled unless you destroy their causes. The influence of the Jews would never disappear without removing its cause, the Jew, from our midst, he said. These radical ideas paved the way for the mass murder of the Jews in the 1940s." Why did Hitler hate the Jews?

Bradskii said:
They say that those who do not study history are doomed to repeat it. It's not often that I come across someone actively saying that it shouldn't be studied.

Ok, then let's take the example given above. If we don't want to see a government attempt to justify the segregation, incarceration or killings of entire groups of people, we should beware of when a government attempts to use health scares against the public, such as saying certain groups of people who vote a certain way are of a particular mind that makes them "superspreaders" of either viruses or "misinformation" that the government deems to be "harmful to the state".

Bradskii · Oct 19, 2021

Aldebaran said:
You forgot to include the link.

Please don't tell me you think there is actually a form that people fill in. Please tell me you forgot to add the smiley face.

Bradskii · Oct 19, 2021

Aldebaran said:
Enough of what they thought has already been made public as to why they thought it was justified.

Fair enough. If you think that reading the book that the architect of the horrors actualy wrote himself will not give you a better understanding of why it happened then that's your opinion.

Aldebaran · Oct 19, 2021

Bradskii said:
Fair enough. If you think that reading the book that the architect of the horrors actualy wrote himself will not give you a better understanding of why it happened then that's your opinion.

If I were to read Hitler's book to find out why he did the things he did, and then noticed that there are people in power today who use the same type of reasoning, would you actually care to learn from the history that ends up being repeated by those who don't learn from it? Or would you be one of those who dismiss such knowledge with comments such as, "Are you seriously comparing [Politician's name] with Hitler?", or simply label it as a use of Godwin's Law?

Bradskii · Oct 19, 2021

Aldebaran said:
If I were to read Hitler's book to find out why he did the things he did, and then noticed that there are people in power today who use the same type of reasoning, would you actually care to learn from the history that ends up being repeated by those who don't learn from it? Or would you be one of those who dismiss such knowledge with comments such as, "Are you seriously comparing [Politician's name] with Hitler?", or simply label it as a use of Godwin's Law?

I'd say 'Well done - glad that you agreed with me that reading it would be beneficial'.

Now, do you have any comment on that hypothetical list? I'd like to know what you think.

rjs330 · Oct 20, 2021

essentialsaltes said:
#1, it's Critical Race Theory.

#2, where is it being mandated?

Why on earth do some keepingasking this question? I know good a well that you have been on other threads regarding this very issue. And unless you failed to read the posts there (maybe you have), it's been shown more than once where CRT is being taught in schools.

Rather than keeping in asking a question that has been answered more than once you should revisit some of those other threads. Anna1st had a really good thread in it.

rjs330 · Oct 20, 2021

rambot said:
Divisive; adv. di-VI-siv
To threaten a white persons concept of equality in the US.

Which white persons? Any of them? All of them or only ones that disagree with you?

FireDragon76 · Oct 20, 2021

Aldebaran said:
If they want to teach history, why not words such as:

Constitution
Freedom
Independence
Individuality
Liberty
Rights

These words are far less divisive that the list in the OP. But that's just on the subject of History. When CRT and all that stuff invades other subjects such as Math, English, Science, etc, then we're looking at a situation where a child's entire education is tainted in a way that will lead them nowhere in the future.

Those words can be divisive in their own right, in certain contexts, especially if they are used to ignore or minimize actual historical events.

FireDragon76 · Oct 20, 2021

Aldebaran said:
Teaching black kids that they are victims of an inherently white-racist country while there are white kids in the classroom does nothing to unite them. And telling white kids that they need to learn how to be "less white" doesn't help either.

It's not a new trend.

Empathy curriculum has been part of school reading curricula for decades going back to the 1960's.

Wisconsin Assembly bans mention of CRT in school, along with about 100 other things

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