How are we saved?

Neostarwcc · Oct 15, 2021

We are saved by faith alone, through Christ alone. by the grace of God alone.

Salvation is NOT by works however a truly regenerate person will always have works. If your life is not fruitful or if you do not have the desire to be fruitful than God does not live within you.

Because of salvation is eternally secure does not excuse our commandment to believe in and follow the Bible. We are not saved by hyper grace and God's grace has always from Adam and Eve to the last people on earth been for God's elect.

We are by nature totally depraved from birth until death. It's only by God granting us a new heart that it's even possible to come to God in the first place. God is in control and God will not lose one of the Elect in the end.

This new nature is not forced upon us but Rather allows God's elect to willingly come to Christ in the first place.

All this being said, we should not be thinking about God being unfair (he's not humans have a warped theory of what is fair or not fair."

Rather our salvation should be spent pursuing holiness. Because of God were completely fair we ALL deserve to be punished for our sins against God. Every past one of us. So while God chose some and not others, it should blow your mind. Those who go to hell deserve to go there, I do, you do. But those who God chooses to save (which is a very large number of people google jt) earn God's eternal favor and thanks to Christ's death on the cross its as if he never sinned.

I know what some of you are thinking,, but I don't believe now so I'm forever condemned if this is true. That is a lie straight from Satsn if a person doesn't believe now, it doesn't mean they never will. There are people God converts on their death bed. There are atheists (wave) that God converts. There is nothing preventing nobody outside of the power of God.

A_Thinker · Oct 15, 2021

Neostarwcc said:
We are saved by faith alone, through Christ alone. by the grace of God alone.

Salvation is NOT by works however a truly regenerate person will always have works. If your life is not fruitful or if you do not have the desire to be fruitful than God does not live within you.

Because of salvation is eternally secure does not excuse our commandment to believe in and follow the Bible. We are not saved by hyper grace and God's grace has always from Adam and Eve to the last people on earth been for God's elect.

We are by nature totally depraved from birth until death. It's only by God granting us a new heart that it's even possible to come to God in the first place. God is in control and God will not lose one of the Elect in the end.

This new nature is not forced upon us but Rather allows God's elect to willingly come to Christ in the first place.

All this being said, we should not be thinking about God being unfair (he's not humans have a warped theory of what is fair or not fair."

Rather our salvation should be spent pursuing holiness. Because of God were completely fair we ALL deserve to be punished for our sins against God. Every past one of us. So while God chose some and not others, it should blow your mind. Those who go to hell deserve to go there, I do, you do. But those who God chooses to save (which is a very large number of people google jt) earn God's eternal favor and thanks to Christ's death on the cross its as if he never sinned.

I know what some of you are thinking,, but I don't believe now so I'm forever condemned if this is true. That is a lie straight from Satan if a person doesn't believe now, it doesn't mean they never will. There are people God converts on their death bed. There are atheists (wave) that God converts. There is nothing preventing nobody outside of the power of God.

God saves us ... because He loves us. All we have to do is accept His loving offer of life with Him.

We all may have moments of doubt, ... but I suggest that we REST in the knowledge that God loves us ... and is sustaining us, and is working things out for us. And that He has a glorious future in store for us ...

1 Corinthians 2:9

“No eye has seen, no ear has heard,
and no mind has imagined
what God has prepared
for those who love Him.”

Hammster · Oct 15, 2021

To be more technical, we don’t have faith to become regenerated. We have faith because we are regenerated. The Father chooses, the Son makes the sacrifices, and the Spirit converts.

Blade · Oct 15, 2021

The gospel we share it to ever creature "And He said to them, “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature.". For God so loved the world He gave His only son. Every one gets a choice..thats who God chooses.

anna ~ grace · Oct 15, 2021

Just trust in Christ, and with His help, live for Him. It’s all grace, and it’s also our will responding to His Will, mercy, calling, and ability to save us. Through faith, and through how we live. It’s a journey.

Hammster · Oct 15, 2021

Blade said:
The gospel we share it to ever creature "And He said to them, “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature.". For God so loved the world He gave His only son. Every one gets a choice..thats who God chooses.

That’s not choosing.

ViaCrucis · Oct 15, 2021

Lutherans confess faith and regeneration to be one and the same: neither precedes the other. The giving of faith is regeneration. Faith comes extra nos, from outside of ourselves, as the gift of God by the Means of God's Grace: Word and Sacrament.

Thus the baptized is a born again believer in Jesus Christ. This is just as true of infants as it is full grown adults--everyone who comes to the baptismal font is a sinner in need of God's saving mercy and grace that is in Jesus Christ; and everyone who is baptized is the child of God by grace, clothed with Christ, and a member of the Communion of Saints.

Faith does not precede regeneration; nor does regeneration precede faith. God regenerates and gives faith by the power of His efficacious word (Romans 10:16, Isaiah 55:11)

The person who has faith is the renewed and regenerated child of God, in Jesus Christ, by the power of the Holy Spirit. The regenerated person has faith, because God is the One who gives faith to sinners as a pure gift of His grace.

So it is impossible to separate faith and regeneration. The regenerate have faith, the faithful are regenerated. And this is all purely and solely by the work of God, as pure gift through the Gospel.

-CryptoLutheran

anna ~ grace · Oct 15, 2021

ViaCrucis said:
Lutherans confess faith and regeneration to be one and the same: neither precedes the other. The giving of faith is regeneration. Faith comes extra nos, from outside of ourselves, as the gift of God by the Means of God's Grace: Word and Sacrament.

Thus the baptized is a born again believer in Jesus Christ. This is just as true of infants as it is full grown adults--everyone who comes to the baptismal font is a sinner in need of God's saving mercy and grace that is in Jesus Christ; and everyone who is baptized is the child of God by grace, clothed with Christ, and a member of the Communion of Saints.

Faith does not precede regeneration; nor does regeneration precede faith. God regenerates and gives faith by the power of His efficacious word (Romans 10:16, Isaiah 55:11)

The person who has faith is the renewed and regenerated child of God, in Jesus Christ, by the power of the Holy Spirit. The regenerated person has faith, because God is the One who gives faith to sinners as a pure gift of His grace.

So it is impossible to separate faith and regeneration. The regenerate have faith, the faithful are regenerated. And this is all purely and solely by the work of God, as pure gift through the Gospel.

-CryptoLutheran

I don’t agree with Lutheran theology, but it’s always nice to have someone who knows what they’re talking about explain it. Thank you. It’s cool how you described that.

I have heard some degree of overlap thought possible between Eastern Orthodox theosis, and the Lutheran view of Soteriology. It’s neat to hear your explanation, and I enjoy reading your comments.

98cwitr · Oct 15, 2021

Blade said:
The gospel we share it to ever creature "And He said to them, “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature.". For God so loved the world He gave His only son. Every one gets a choice..thats who God chooses.

If you must reference John 3:16, please consider 17-21 in context. It paints the true picture. Taking John 3:16 out of context without including 17-21 breeds heresies.

Why do you suppose God's creates people He knows will never believe?

We are saved via the regeneration, by God's Grace, of the Holy Spirit.

Strong in Him · Oct 15, 2021

Neostarwcc said:
We are saved by faith alone, through Christ alone. by the grace of God alone.

Salvation is NOT by works however a truly regenerate person will always have works. If your life is not fruitful or if you do not have the desire to be fruitful than God does not live within you.

Because of salvation is eternally secure does not excuse our commandment to believe in and follow the Bible. We are not saved by hyper grace and God's grace has always from Adam and Eve to the last people on earth been for God's elect.

If by "elect" you mean that God created everyone but selected, in advance, the people who would go to heaven, and God's grace is only for them then, no; God's grace is for everyone.
If you are thinking of Remnant theology though where, out of all those created, only a few will be saved then, yes; that is what Scripture teaches all the way through. Eg Abraham was promised more descendants than the stars in the sky. Ishmael was Abraham's son too, yet Jesus' line was traced back to Jacob and Isaac. Millions of people were on earth but only 8 were saved in the ark etc.

Neostarwcc said:
Rather our salvation should be spent pursuing holiness. Because of God were completely fair we ALL deserve to be punished for our sins against God. Every past one of us. So while God chose some and not others, it should blow your mind.

Not only would that not be fair, it would not be love.

Yes, we all deserved hell because of our sin. But if God has chosen only some and not others, on what basis does he make that choice? We can earn nothing by our works, so the only thing left on which to base his choice would be a whim. "I'll save that one, but I don't like the look of that one", or "I've saved the last few hundred, it's about time I sent someone to hell". :sick:

Heaven forbid!

Neostarwcc said:
We are by nature totally depraved from birth until death. It's only by God granting us a new heart that it's even possible to come to God in the first place.

We come to God, believe in him and indicate that we believe he died for us, THEN we get a new heart.
"If anyone is IN Christ he is a new creation", 2 Corinthians 5:17. "If we confess our sin, God will forgive us and make us clean", 1 John 1:9.
I haven't heard of anyone getting a new heart and forgiveness from God before they have even come to God.

Neostarwcc said:
Those who go to hell deserve to go there, I do, you do. But those who God chooses to save (which is a very large number of people google jt) earn God's eternal favor and thanks to Christ's death on the cross its as if he never sinned.

So you believe in a God who saves on a whim? Love always perseveres, always hopes, always trusts, 1 Corinthians 13:7. God doesn't give up on people - which wouldn't be the case if he had chosen not to save them in the first place.
We can't EARN our salvation but we can choose to accept an altar call, pray a prayer, say 'yes' to God and accept the salvation that he has already provided for us.
God's free gift is for everyone, Romans 6:23, 2 Peter 3:9 - not just for a few who have been randomly chosen on some whim.

Danthemailman · Oct 15, 2021

Ephesians 2:8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9 not of works, lest anyone should boast.

Acts 16:30 And he brought them out and said, “Sirs, what must I do to be saved?” 31 So they said, “Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved, you and your household.”

d taylor · Oct 15, 2021

Saved, salvation in The Bible does not always mean salvation from hell.

If a person wants to really understand what God is offering a person. To look at what God is offering in the Bible. It is stated as a free gift and the free gift being offered is Eternal Life. And how to receive this free gift is to believe that Jesus is the promised Messiah from the prophecies of The Tanakh and trust in The Messiah for Eternal Life.

A person who does this, receives God's free gift of Eternal Life never to lose this gift, because of any actions/sins they will do in their life time on earth.

prophecy_uk · Oct 16, 2021

Jesus chooses the 12, and ordained them...

John 15:16 Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that ye should go and bring forth fruit, and that your fruit should remain: that whatsoever ye shall ask of the Father in my name, he may give it you.

Jesus was set as a light for the Gentiles, and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed..

Acts 13:46 Then Paul and Barnabas waxed bold, and said, It was necessary that the word of God should first have been spoken to you: but seeing ye put it from you, and judge yourselves unworthy of everlasting life, lo, we turn to the Gentiles.
47 For so hath the Lord commanded us, saying, I have set thee to be a light of the Gentiles, that thou shouldest be for salvation unto the ends of the earth.
48 And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.

God also appointed a day to judge the world, by Jesus Christ whom He ordained..

Acts 17:31 Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by that man whom he hath ordained; whereof he hath given assurance unto all men, in that he hath raised him from the dead.

That rock of offence has many stumble at the word, they are disobedient, as appointed...

1 Peter 2:8 And a stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence, even to them which stumble at the word, being disobedient: whereunto also they were appointed.

Apostle Paul speaks things hard to be understood, the unlearned ( of the Father) are unstable, qnd that is why they wrest against them, to their own destruction..

2 Peter 3:16 As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.

So all of the viewpoints and conversations, the likes, the winners, the informative, not only is told to be going on, but it is what has been set to be done. None of them are correct, and even if they were, it means very little, as it can help nobody at all.

Calvanists may give their grace speeches, but they seek grace first and formost for themselves, that is as far from Gods grace as possible.

Lutherans confessing faith and regeneration, again, is not any confession that we see in Christ, he confessed what to follow to be saved, it is again the opposite to Lutherans, where do they confess as Jesus says exactly how to be saved, and THE WAY IT IS DONE ( BELIEVED)..

Luke 17:33 Whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it; and whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it.

Mark 8:35 For whosoever will save his life shall lose it; but whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel's, the same shall save it.

Mark 10:27 And Jesus looking upon them saith, With men it is impossible, but not with God: for with God all things are possible.
28 Then Peter began to say unto him, Lo, we have left all, and have followed thee.
29 And Jesus answered and said, Verily I say unto you, There is no man that hath left house, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my sake, and the gospel's,
30 But he shall receive an hundredfold now in this time, houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, with persecutions; and in the world to come eternal life.
31 But many that are first shall be last; and the last first.

fhansen · Oct 16, 2021

Neostarwcc said:
We are saved by faith alone, through Christ alone. by the grace of God alone.

Salvation is NOT by works however a truly regenerate person will always have works. If your life is not fruitful or if you do not have the desire to be fruitful than God does not live within you.

Because of salvation is eternally secure does not excuse our commandment to believe in and follow the Bible. We are not saved by hyper grace and God's grace has always from Adam and Eve to the last people on earth been for God's elect.

We are by nature totally depraved from birth until death. It's only by God granting us a new heart that it's even possible to come to God in the first place. God is in control and God will not lose one of the Elect in the end.

This new nature is not forced upon us but Rather allows God's elect to willingly come to Christ in the first place.

All this being said, we should not be thinking about God being unfair (he's not humans have a warped theory of what is fair or not fair."

Rather our salvation should be spent pursuing holiness. Because of God were completely fair we ALL deserve to be punished for our sins against God. Every past one of us. So while God chose some and not others, it should blow your mind. Those who go to hell deserve to go there, I do, you do. But those who God chooses to save (which is a very large number of people google jt) earn God's eternal favor and thanks to Christ's death on the cross its as if he never sinned.

I know what some of you are thinking,, but I don't believe now so I'm forever condemned if this is true. That is a lie straight from Satsn if a person doesn't believe now, it doesn't mean they never will. There are people God converts on their death bed. There are atheists (wave) that God converts. There is nothing preventing nobody outside of the power of God.

Faith in God is relationship with the only Being who can accomplish in us the righteousness or holiness that we were made for but do not possess on our own, apart from Him. “Apart from Me you can do nothing” John 15:5.

Our job is to turn to Him, in response to grace, and remain in Him, cooperating with His work in us. We can turn away at any time; we can return to the flesh and until we fully love Him with our whole heart, soul, mind, and strength we’re still not fully bound to Him, not placing Him first above all else; we haven’t yet fully chosen good over evil and could still fail in that endeavor. But that’s a work of grace, a work of His; we’re to get on board and remain on that journey with Him, and He’ll get us there.

Love defines justice or righteousness for man and at the end of the day we’ll be judged on that love.

bling · Oct 16, 2021

Neostarwcc said:
Rather our salvation should be spent pursuing holiness. Because of God were completely fair we ALL deserve to be punished for our sins against God. Every past one of us. So while God chose some and not others, it should blow your mind. Those who go to hell deserve to go there, I do, you do. But those who God chooses to save (which is a very large number of people google jt) earn God's eternal favor and thanks to Christ's death on the cross its as if he never sinned.

I know what some of you are thinking,, but I don't believe now so I'm forever condemned if this is true. That is a lie straight from Satsn if a person doesn't believe now, it doesn't mean they never will. There are people God converts on their death bed. There are atheists (wave) that God converts. There is nothing preventing nobody outside of the power of God.

A rescuer who could just as easily and safely rescue everyone in a burning building but only chose to save a few would be rightly harshly thought as being terrible, so that cannot be the way God is.

We know:

The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance." - 2 Peter 3:9 KJV

1 I urge, then, first of all, that petitions, prayers, intercession and thanksgiving be made for all people— 2 for kings and all those in authority, that we may live peaceful and quiet lives in all godliness and holiness. 3 This is good, and pleases God our Savior, 4 who wants all people to be saved and to come to a knowledge of the truth. 5 For there is one God and one mediator between God and mankind, the man Christ Jesus, 6 who gave himself as a ransom for all people. This has now been witnessed to at the proper time. 1 Tim. 2: 1-6

If God desires all men to be saved, as I believe 1 Timothy 2:4 and 2 Peter 3:9 declares, and not everyone is saved, those two axioms, seem contradictory. So how does one interpret 1 Timothy 2:4 and 2 Peter 3:9 without concluding that God does not desire all to be saved.

The only way Calvinism interpret 2 Peter and 1 Timothy is to say Peter and Paul are only talking to those already saved (elect), and walkway, but even though Paul and Peter are addressing just Christians, does not mean they are not presenting a truth about God’s Love for all people who ever lived (this is the Love we are to have for all people). Paul is definitely addressing no Christians in the context talking about praying for “all people” and including “kings and all in authority” and “one God” would include non-Christians also.

By saying God is not wanting and is not patient with the non-elect to have knowledge, be saved, repent, and not perish, means God is not “Loving” toward the some lost, yet “Loving” toward other lost sinners. We are to Love everyone and I really try to Love all and desiring none to be lost, perish, not have knowledge, and not repent.

The answer to God’s selection mechanism has nothing to do with some being worthy, deserving, righteous, honorable or “better” then other people not saved. It all starts with why God made humans in the first place and man’s objective while here on earth:

There are just somethings God cannot do, since they are impossible to do, like:

Create a clone of Jesus (Jesus is not a “made” individual, but is deity which has always existed), you just cannot “make” something that has always existed. Jesus is thus perfect, where made individuals can only be made as good as any being could be made (very good by God’s standard).

We are made “very good”, so what is the really important thing we lack that keeps us from being “perfect” like Christ is perfect? This goes back to our earthly objective, what we are here on earth to try to obtain and it is nothing we can work for, deserve, earn, or payback, so it can only come to us as a pure undeserving gift, which we have to humbly accept it as pure undeserved charity.

The greatest gift God could give us is to be like He is and that is Love. God is doing and allowing everything to help us humbly accept as pure undeserved charity, His Love, so, we can Love like He Loves.

The “problem” is Godly type Love cannot be planted into a human (made instinctive to humans) since that would not be Godly type Love but a robotic type Love (a knee jerk reaction). And, Godly type Love cannot be forced on a person making them accept it, since that would be like a shotgun wedding with God holding the shotgun. It would not be loving on God’s part nor would the Love we received be Godly type Love.

The easiest way for humans to accept God’s charity (Love) is out of a huge need and that need is the relief from the burden of hurting others in the past (sin). By accepting God’s forgiveness, we accept God’s Love (mercy/grace/charity) and thus we will Love much since Jesus has taught us (we also see this in our own lives) “…he that is forgiven much will Love much…” Luke 7: 36-50. Sin is made unbelievably huge so the forgiveness is unbelievably huge resulting in an unbelievable huge Love (Godly type Love).

The real issue is with the fact humans have a hard time humbling themselves to the point of accepting pure undeserved charity (no one likes to take charity and will do almost anything to avoid taking charity). Accepting charity is like the opposite of working to obtain something, but that is the only one way to first obtain “Love”. Those teaching God does the selection independent of any human thought, are also saying you do not have to humble accept God’s pure undeserved charity, since you got God’s charity prior to humbly accepting it.

Yes, God is wanting and is offering to everyone eternal life, which comes with accepting forgiveness and Love, but few are willing and wanting to accept this charity, so they would be unhappy in heaven where there is only Godly type Love (unselfish and unconditional type Love). God does not want unhappy people in heaven (those desiring only a carnal type Love, wanting to be “Loved” for the way they want others to perceive them to be).

The ”choice” humans make that provides God with a “reason” for some and not others is not some noble, honorable, deserving, worthy or righteous choice, but the very simple selfish choice to: be macho, hang in there, be a good soldier of satan, and being willing to take the punishment you fully deserve or wimp out, give up and surrender to your hated enemy and even though you hate this enemy just be willing for selfish reasons (sinful reasons) to humbly accept His pure undeserving charity.

As far as “faith” goes, all mature adults have been gifted by with a “natural” faith, which allows them to trust people and things and they can use it to trust in objects made with human hands. Directing this God given “faith” toward a benevolent creator allows the person to have an illogical hope that benevolent Creator might just provide them with some undeserved charity.

Much more can be said this is brief.

prophecy_uk · Oct 17, 2021

bling said:
A rescuer who could just as easily and safely rescue everyone in a burning building but only chose to save a few would be rightly harshly thought as being terrible, so that cannot be the way God is.

We know:

The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance." - 2 Peter 3:9 KJV

1 I urge, then, first of all, that petitions, prayers, intercession and thanksgiving be made for all people— 2 for kings and all those in authority, that we may live peaceful and quiet lives in all godliness and holiness. 3 This is good, and pleases God our Savior, 4 who wants all people to be saved and to come to a knowledge of the truth. 5 For there is one God and one mediator between God and mankind, the man Christ Jesus, 6 who gave himself as a ransom for all people. This has now been witnessed to at the proper time. 1 Tim. 2: 1-6

If God desires all men to be saved, as I believe 1 Timothy 2:4 and 2 Peter 3:9 declares, and not everyone is saved, those two axioms, seem contradictory. So how does one interpret 1 Timothy 2:4 and 2 Peter 3:9 without concluding that God does not desire all to be saved.

The only way Calvinism interpret 2 Peter and 1 Timothy is to say Peter and Paul are only talking to those already saved (elect), and walkway, but even though Paul and Peter are addressing just Christians, does not mean they are not presenting a truth about God’s Love for all people who ever lived (this is the Love we are to have for all people). Paul is definitely addressing no Christians in the context talking about praying for “all people” and including “kings and all in authority” and “one God” would include non-Christians also.

By saying God is not wanting and is not patient with the non-elect to have knowledge, be saved, repent, and not perish, means God is not “Loving” toward the some lost, yet “Loving” toward other lost sinners. We are to Love everyone and I really try to Love all and desiring none to be lost, perish, not have knowledge, and not repent.

The answer to God’s selection mechanism has nothing to do with some being worthy, deserving, righteous, honorable or “better” then other people not saved. It all starts with why God made humans in the first place and man’s objective while here on earth:

There are just somethings God cannot do, since they are impossible to do, like:

Create a clone of Jesus (Jesus is not a “made” individual, but is deity which has always existed), you just cannot “make” something that has always existed. Jesus is thus perfect, where made individuals can only be made as good as any being could be made (very good by God’s standard).

We are made “very good”, so what is the really important thing we lack that keeps us from being “perfect” like Christ is perfect? This goes back to our earthly objective, what we are here on earth to try to obtain and it is nothing we can work for, deserve, earn, or payback, so it can only come to us as a pure undeserving gift, which we have to humbly accept it as pure undeserved charity.

The greatest gift God could give us is to be like He is and that is Love. God is doing and allowing everything to help us humbly accept as pure undeserved charity, His Love, so, we can Love like He Loves.

The “problem” is Godly type Love cannot be planted into a human (made instinctive to humans) since that would not be Godly type Love but a robotic type Love (a knee jerk reaction). And, Godly type Love cannot be forced on a person making them accept it, since that would be like a shotgun wedding with God holding the shotgun. It would not be loving on God’s part nor would the Love we received be Godly type Love.

The easiest way for humans to accept God’s charity (Love) is out of a huge need and that need is the relief from the burden of hurting others in the past (sin). By accepting God’s forgiveness, we accept God’s Love (mercy/grace/charity) and thus we will Love much since Jesus has taught us (we also see this in our own lives) “…he that is forgiven much will Love much…” Luke 7: 36-50. Sin is made unbelievably huge so the forgiveness is unbelievably huge resulting in an unbelievable huge Love (Godly type Love).

The real issue is with the fact humans have a hard time humbling themselves to the point of accepting pure undeserved charity (no one likes to take charity and will do almost anything to avoid taking charity). Accepting charity is like the opposite of working to obtain something, but that is the only one way to first obtain “Love”. Those teaching God does the selection independent of any human thought, are also saying you do not have to humble accept God’s pure undeserved charity, since you got God’s charity prior to humbly accepting it.

Yes, God is wanting and is offering to everyone eternal life, which comes with accepting forgiveness and Love, but few are willing and wanting to accept this charity, so they would be unhappy in heaven where there is only Godly type Love (unselfish and unconditional type Love). God does not want unhappy people in heaven (those desiring only a carnal type Love, wanting to be “Loved” for the way they want others to perceive them to be).

The ”choice” humans make that provides God with a “reason” for some and not others is not some noble, honorable, deserving, worthy or righteous choice, but the very simple selfish choice to: be macho, hang in there, be a good soldier of satan, and being willing to take the punishment you fully deserve or wimp out, give up and surrender to your hated enemy and even though you hate this enemy just be willing for selfish reasons (sinful reasons) to humbly accept His pure undeserving charity.

As far as “faith” goes, all mature adults have been gifted by with a “natural” faith, which allows them to trust people and things and they can use it to trust in objects made with human hands. Directing this God given “faith” toward a benevolent creator allows the person to have an illogical hope that benevolent Creator might just provide them with some undeserved charity.

Much more can be said this is brief.

God does all for purpose, it is not mans purpose, Calvinists like all other divided sects of Christianity, are for self seeking people.

Gods tells His purpose, of course I can explain all for anyone, but for what purpose, I already did explain as I went along on this forum this time..

1 Corinthians 1:26 For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called:
27 But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty;
28 And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are:
29 That no flesh should glory in his presence.

Luke 1:50 And his mercy is on them that fear him from generation to generation.
51 He hath shewed strength with his arm; he hath scattered the proud in the imagination of their hearts.
52 He hath put down the mighty from their seats, and exalted them of low degree.
53 He hath filled the hungry with good things; and the rich he hath sent empty away.

1 Samuel 2:7 The Lord maketh poor, and maketh rich: he bringeth low, and lifteth up.
8 He raiseth up the poor out of the dust, and lifteth up the beggar from the dunghill, to set them among princes, and to make them inherit the throne of glory: for the pillars of the earth are the Lord's, and he hath set the world upon them.
9 He will keep the feet of his saints, and the wicked shall be silent in darkness; for by strength shall no man prevail.
10 The adversaries of the Lord shall be broken to pieces; out of heaven shall he thunder upon them: the Lord shall judge the ends of the earth; and he shall give strength unto his king, and exalt the horn of his anointed.

Strong in Him · Oct 17, 2021

prophecy_uk said:
God does all for purpose,

God is love.
Everything God does is out of love and in love. Rescuing only a few from hell because that's what you have chosen to do, is not love.

prophecy_uk · Oct 17, 2021

Strong in Him said:
God is love.
Everything God does is out of love and in love.

NOW what man is in this time...

2 Peter 2:18 For when they speak great swelling words of vanity, they allure through the lusts of the flesh, through much wantonness, those that were clean escaped from them who live in error.

Jude 1:16 These are murmurers, complainers, walking after their own lusts; and their mouth speaketh great swelling words, having men's persons in admiration because of advantage.

Strong in Him · Oct 17, 2021

prophecy_uk said:
NOW what man is in this time...

2 Peter 2:18 For when they speak great swelling words of vanity, they allure through the lusts of the flesh, through much wantonness, those that were clean escaped from them who live in error.

Jude 1:16 These are murmurers, complainers, walking after their own lusts; and their mouth speaketh great swelling words, having men's persons in admiration because of advantage.

God is love is a Scriptural teaching - I don't get what you are saying.

bling · Oct 17, 2021

prophecy_uk said:
God does all for purpose, it is not mans purpose, Calvinists like all other divided sects of Christianity, are for self seeking people.

Gods tells His purpose, of course I can explain all for anyone, but for what purpose, I already did explain as I went along on this forum this time..

1 Corinthians 1:26 For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called:
27 But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty;
28 And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are:
29 That no flesh should glory in his presence.

Luke 1:50 And his mercy is on them that fear him from generation to generation.
51 He hath shewed strength with his arm; he hath scattered the proud in the imagination of their hearts.
52 He hath put down the mighty from their seats, and exalted them of low degree.
53 He hath filled the hungry with good things; and the rich he hath sent empty away.

1 Samuel 2:7 The Lord maketh poor, and maketh rich: he bringeth low, and lifteth up.
8 He raiseth up the poor out of the dust, and lifteth up the beggar from the dunghill, to set them among princes, and to make them inherit the throne of glory: for the pillars of the earth are the Lord's, and he hath set the world upon them.
9 He will keep the feet of his saints, and the wicked shall be silent in darkness; for by strength shall no man prevail.
10 The adversaries of the Lord shall be broken to pieces; out of heaven shall he thunder upon them: the Lord shall judge the ends of the earth; and he shall give strength unto his king, and exalt the horn of his anointed.

How does any of these passages tell you or anyone else how God selects one person and does not select another person since by your description they can be exactly the same and thus God could go either way?

Are you saying God selects the hungry and poor and rejects the proud and rich?

We understand the saints will be cared for by God and the wicked will go to hell, but we all start out wicked, even the saints, so how does God choose who will be a saint?

We know God is the epitome of Love (Love itself), so that means God is the epitome of unselfishness, doing everything for the sake of others and that becomes God’s sake (helping others who are just willing to accept His help) since He would not “force” His Love on anyone (which is not possible and still be Godly type Love).

What do you men by: “Calvinists like all other divided sects of Christianity, are for self seeking people”?

How are we saved?

We are saved purely by the work and grace of God.

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