Discussion Where do false prophets go

lismore

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And trying to prophesy who will win an election, who is that to benefit and why would God need to tell you?

There is a phrase repeated again and again in the bible, in one form or another, after the Lord has shared something that is going to happen.

'Then you will know that I alone am God and there is no other'.

He reveals secrets so that we will know he is the only God and Lord of mankind.

Every word of God is flawless, he is a shield for those who take refuge in Him (Proverbs 30:5).

Because every word of God is flawless we can trust in Him, we can trust absolutely in his word, the one who does not lie, because we know as he reveals the future that he holds the future.

The Lord himself has already said what he thinks of the ilk you are referring to:

Jeremiah 14:14 Then the Lord said to me, “The prophets are prophesying lies in my name. I have not sent them or appointed them or spoken to them. They are prophesying to you false visions, divinations, idolatries and the delusions of their own minds".

Jeremiah 23: 32 Indeed, I am against those who prophesy false dreams,” declares the Lord. “They tell them and lead my people astray with their reckless lies, yet I did not send or appoint them. They do not benefit these people in the least,” declares the Lord.

Prophesying lies in God's name is a big deal and should rightly be viewed with utter horror. The Lord says 'I have not sent them!', 'I am against them!'.

Every word of God is FLAWLESS!

God Bless :)
 
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GoldenKingGaze

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There is a phrase repeated again and again in the bible, in one form or another, after the Lord has shared something that is going to happen.

'Then you will know that I alone am God and there is no other'.

He reveals secrets so that we will know he is the only God and Lord of mankind.

Every word of God is flawless, he is a shield for those who take refuge in Him (Proverbs 30:5).

Because every word of God is flawless we can trust in Him, we can trust absolutely in his word, the one who does not lie, because we know as he reveals the future that he holds the future.

The Lord himself has already said what he thinks of the ilk you are referring to:

Jeremiah 14:14 Then the Lord said to me, “The prophets are prophesying lies in my name. I have not sent them or appointed them or spoken to them. They are prophesying to you false visions, divinations, idolatries and the delusions of their own minds".

Jeremiah 23: 32 Indeed, I am against those who prophesy false dreams,” declares the Lord. “They tell them and lead my people astray with their reckless lies, yet I did not send or appoint them. They do not benefit these people in the least,” declares the Lord.

Prophesying lies in God's name is a big deal and should rightly be viewed with utter horror. The Lord says 'I have not sent them!', 'I am against them!'.

Every word of God is FLAWLESS!

God Bless :)
God is patient and kind in the New Testament, leading to repentances. Nothing can separate us from the love of God neither death nor life nor angels...

Jesus' blood makes their hearts clean again when we pray.

Old Testament prophecy was of a different nature to the new. Prophecy should edify and encourage. I think it should be about the aspirations of some persons consciences. Hope giving, persistence giving. And redirecting if their is error.
 
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lismore

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Old Testament prophecy was of a different nature to the new. Prophecy should edify and encourage. I think it should be about the aspirations of some persons consciences. Hope giving, persistence giving. And redirecting if their is error.

Hello. You seem to be suggesting that popularity is of greater importance than truth. When The Lord (who cannot lie) speaks it is true, every word of God is flawless.

I don't believe a born again believer will be cavalier with God's name or with claiming to speak for God.

For the time will come when people will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear (2 Timothy 4:3)

These are the days we're living in. Many people don't want truth, they want speakers to say whatever they want to hear.

When the foundation of biblical truth is lacking it is small wonder that many 'prophets' seem to be continually getting it wrong.

God Bless :)
 
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GoldenKingGaze

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Hello. You seem to be suggesting that popularity is of greater importance than truth. When The Lord (who cannot lie) speaks it is true, every word of God is flawless.

I don't believe a born again believer will be cavalier with God's name or with claiming to speak for God.

For the time will come when people will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear (2 Timothy 4:3)

These are the days we're living in. Many people don't want truth, they want speakers to say whatever they want to hear.

When the foundation of biblical truth is lacking it is small wonder that many 'prophets' seem to be continually getting it wrong.

God Bless :)
No, not popularity, scriptural definition. I don't agree with the false prophecy. So I don't want to hear, what I'd like to hear over the truth. I was saying prophecy should encourage and build people up, according to the scripture inspired conscience... So don't have itching ears Lismore.

From this sin like any other, the false prophets hearts can be cleaned in Jesus' blood and they can get it right in the future.
 
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lismore

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No, not popularity, scriptural definition. I don't agree with the false prophecy. So I don't want to hear, what I'd like to hear over the truth. I was saying prophecy should encourage and build people up, according to the scripture inspired conscience... So don't have itching ears Lismore.

With all due respect you do have itching ears. When you say 'prophecy should encourage' that is already a very subjective standard that will lead you to believe fantasies. It doesn't matter if the prophecy is true or false as long as you feel that it 'encourages' you? The standard should be truth.

There are dozens of examples in the bible where God speaks and it doesn't 'encourage' the hearers, but it's true, for example:

'The LORD has decreed disaster for you' (1 Kings 22:23)

(Acts 5:9) 'The young men who buried your husband are just outside the door, and they will carry you out, too'

"Whoever stays on in the city will die in war or of starvation ... Those who leave the city and surrender to the Babylonians will live" (Jeremiah 38:2)



From this sin like any other, the false prophets hearts can be cleaned in Jesus' blood and they can get it right in the future.

Titus 1:11 'They must be silenced'.

I would encourage you to stop following false prophets, who clearly aren't hearing from God, rather find a good solid church where truth is preached and the people love the Lord.

2 Timothy 3:13 describes false prophets as evil men and impostors who will grow worse and worse, deceiving and being deceived. What they say many seem 'encouraging' on some level, but it's a deception and they will become even more deceived. Once they go in for ear-tickling over truth they are on a downward spiral.

However false prophets can be useful- believe the opposite of what they say.

God Bless :)
 
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ARBITER01

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With all due respect you do have itching ears. When you say 'prophecy should encourage' that is already a very subjective standard that will lead you to believe fantasies. It doesn't matter if the prophecy is true or false as long as you feel that it 'encourages' you? The standard should be truth.

There are dozens of examples in the bible where God speaks and it doesn't 'encourage' the hearers, but it's true, for example:

I think maybe his context that he was talking about before threw you off Lismore (it probably would me also),...

1Co 14:3 But he that prophesieth speaketh unto men to edification, and exhortation, and comfort.

That word "exhortation" also means encouragement in the Greek. So in the assembly, we should see a tangible edification to our spirit throughout the message (whether tongues, interpretation, or prophesying), as well as the message providing encouragement and comfort,.. the crowning feature being the peace of The Holy Spirit around you during it and slightly after it.
 
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GoldenKingGaze

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With all due respect you do have itching ears. When you say 'prophecy should encourage' that is already a very subjective standard that will lead you to believe fantasies. It doesn't matter if the prophecy is true or false as long as you feel that it 'encourages' you? The standard should be truth.

There are dozens of examples in the bible where God speaks and it doesn't 'encourage' the hearers, but it's true, for example:

'The LORD has decreed disaster for you' (1 Kings 22:23)

(Acts 5:9) 'The young men who buried your husband are just outside the door, and they will carry you out, too'

"Whoever stays on in the city will die in war or of starvation ... Those who leave the city and surrender to the Babylonians will live" (Jeremiah 38:2)





Titus 1:11 'They must be silenced'.

I would encourage you to stop following false prophets, who clearly aren't hearing from God, rather find a good solid church where truth is preached and the people love the Lord.

2 Timothy 3:13 describes false prophets as evil men and impostors who will grow worse and worse, deceiving and being deceived. What they say many seem 'encouraging' on some level, but it's a deception and they will become even more deceived. Once they go in for ear-tickling over truth they are on a downward spiral.

However false prophets can be useful- believe the opposite of what they say.

God Bless :)
1 Corinthians 14:3 was the verse I had in mind. The description of New Testament prophecy.

With prophecy I have found ours here, accurate, with one who got me all wrong. So they say, discern, eat the meat, spit out the bones.

I don't think the erring prophets will go on in error, but Dr Randy Clark began to correct them some months ago. Hopefully they will be made clean in Jesus' powerful blood and speak from it's righteousness in future.
 
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Petros2015

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He sent a lying spirit into the mouths of all the prophets that prophesied that Trump would be the next POTUS ... I was one of them, but Pat Robertson was right in there with me

Truth is a bit like a River.
Love truth, seek truth, follow it upstream.
Christ is the source of Truth, I don't think you can miss Him if you do that.
Test the water every now and then, regardless of what people are saying about it.
If it doesn't taste like Truth, don't follow it
(especially if other people are saying it does)

I'll see you there at the Mountain, God willing
 
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lismore

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.. He sent a lying spirit into the mouths of all the prophets that prophesied that Trump would be the next POTUS ... I was one of them, but Pat Robertson was right in there with me

Hello Gee. A spin-off question.

If God has indeed 'sent a lying spirit into the mouths of prophets'- and there's a big list of some of the most well known and widely followed American Tel-evangelists and Charismatic leaders. If these people have a lying spirit in their mouth then why are they still on air or in a pulpit giving teachings, giving more prophecies, collecting money? Why are Christians still supporting them? Would this not lead to more deception and confusion? Some of the names on the list have given clearly false prophecies before.

If you went to the dentist and he treated the wrong tooth again and again would you not seek another dentist?

God Bless :)
 
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spiritfilledjm

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Hello Gee. A spin-off question.

If God has indeed 'sent a lying spirit into the mouths of prophets'- and there's a big list of some of the most well known and widely followed American Tel-evangelists and Charismatic leaders. If these people have a lying spirit in their mouth then why are they still on air or in a pulpit giving teachings, giving more prophecies, collecting money? Why are Christians still supporting them? Would this not lead to more deception and confusion? Some of the names on the list have given clearly false prophecies before.

If you went to the dentist and he treated the wrong tooth again and again would you not seek another dentist?

God Bless :)

I'll take a stab at this. Because "many false prophets will arise and lead people astray." as Jesus warned us in Matthew 24:11. Later He even stated, in verse 24, that they would perform signs and wonders to lead people astray, if possible, even the elect. This is why Paul warned the churches repeatedly against following false prophets and implored them to use the gift of discernment and to not believe everything but rather test it.

However, I do not believe that the old televangelists and prosperity teachers and the like that everyone loves to rail on about here are who we need to worry about. Rather it is the false teachers who knowingly speak lies, not that the aforementioned don't, but teaching that God wants you to be rich isn't going to lead someone far enough astray to effect their salvation. Nor is teaching that God wants to heal everyone you just need to send 19.99 for an anointed prayer cloth and you will be healed. They will have their own sins to answer for, however, these are not who we need to worry about too much.

It's the ones who whisper to the flesh that living in sin is perfectly fine. The false teachers who are on TikTok teaching kids and teenagers that homosexuality, abortion, transgenderism and many other sins are perfectly ok because they're not actually sin because the bible doesn't actually say homosexual (this is a bold faced lie). It's the Rob Bell's of the world who are teaching that everyone goes to heaven no matter what because God loves everyone and love wins. Despite the fact that Bell had his ordination stripped from him years ago and left the faith completely, he still gets a platform on CNN whenever they talk about Christianity. These false teachers on TikTok have millions of followers whereas those who speak truth have very few.
 
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lismore

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However, I do not believe that the old televangelists and prosperity teachers and the like that everyone loves to rail on about here are who we need to worry about.

Hi spiritfilledjm. Thank you for a very interesting and well thought out post. I agree with most.

I would just add that I think that some of the Tel-evangelists are indeed ones to worry about, the ones who subtly introduce teachings that could be another gospel. They seem to build their prophecies on this foundation of false teaching, perhaps explaining why so much of their prophecy is wrong.

One example:

Praise be to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us in the heavenly realms with every spiritual blessing in Christ (Ephesians 1:3)

Listening to many prosperity teachers it's always about striving, do this, do that, do more. If you obey you will be blessed if you do not obey you will be cursed, like Deuteronomy chapter 28, Old Testament Law, a prosperity gospel favourite. Many prosperity preachers say that if you tithe to them you will be blessed, otherwise your finances will be under a curse.

But the gospel is that every spiritual blessing is in Christ!

Another might be the nature of prophecy itself. Some speakers seem to say that because they view themselves as 'little gods' and 'death and life are in the power of the tongue', that their words have creative power in the same way as God's. Might explain why they are so cavalier with giving 'prophecies'.

Here is an interesting video about 'New Age Teachings' in the church.


God Bless :)
 
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lismore

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Maybe in hindsight it would have been wiser for many speakers to qualify their prophecies by saying that what they were saying was what they wanted to see happen, or what they thought would be best, rather than bringing God into the equation. God Bless :)
 
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spiritfilledjm

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Maybe in hindsight it would have been wiser for many speakers to qualify their prophecies by saying that what they were saying was what they wanted to see happen, or what they thought would be best, rather than bringing God into the equation. God Bless :)

Then they wouldn't be prophecies at all, just their own predictions and opinions.
 
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Maybe in hindsight it would have been wiser for many speakers to qualify their prophecies by saying that what they were saying was what they wanted to see happen, or what they thought would be best, rather than bringing God into the equation. God Bless :)
Never a good idea to leave God out of the equation. That’s starting from a false and double minded premise that’s the beginning of compromise. But you know that don’t you ..
 
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tturt

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False prophets intentionally lead people away from God. (Matt 24:11, 24; II Pet 2:1).

It's not when the word is in error - "'When a prophet speaketh in the name of the Lord, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass, that is the thing which the Lord hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him." Deu 18:22
 
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So ... seems much of the discussion in this thread has been about prominent Christian personalities whose prophecies have proven to be false. What about potentially influential persons in other arenas in life ... say, politics ... that speak falsely 'for God'?

For instance, there is New York Governor Kathy Hochul, who preached from a pulpit in Brooklyn, New York last Sunday. Her message, in part ...


"We are not through this pandemic," Hochul said during her homily at the Christian Cultural Center, a non-denominational megachurch. "I wished we were, but I prayed a lot to God during this time and you know what, God did answer our prayers. He made the smartest men and women, the scientists, the doctors, the researchers — he made them come up with a vaccine. That is from God to us and we must say, ‘Thank you, God. Thank you.'"

Hochul then showed off her necklace that indicated her vaccination status before alleging those who refuse the COVID-19 vaccine "aren't listening to God and what God wants."

"I need you to be my apostles," Hochul told her audience. "I need you to go out and talk about it and say, ‘We owe this to each other. We love each other.’ Jesus taught us to love one another and how do you show that love but to care about each other enough to say, ‘Please get the vaccine because I love you and I want you to live? I want our kids to be safe when they're in schools? I want to be safe when you go to a doctor's office or to a hospital and are treated by somebody?' You don't want to get the virus from them. You're already sick or you wouldn't be there."

The full story, from a segment on the Tucker Carlson show, is linked below.
(Governor Hochul's 'sermon' begins at minute 3:00, but the whole segment is really very interesting.)

NY Gov. Hochul says vaccines are 'from God,' sends out her own 'apostles' to push jabs | Fox News
 
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lismore

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Then they wouldn't be prophecies at all, just their own predictions and opinions.

Yes, precisely. What they said were their own predictions and opinions. So why not just label them as such. God Bless :)
 
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lismore

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Never a good idea to leave God out of the equation. That’s starting from a false and double minded premise that’s the beginning of compromise. But you know that don’t you ..

Hello Cassia. If God is not in the equation then it's not a good idea to say God is in the equation. Trying to speak for God when he hasn't spoken is not a good idea IMO> For example the prophetess Kat Kerr when she said she was taken up to heaven and said God told her that Trump was going to win, then Pence would win the election after that and on and on. She would have been better just saying that a Trump- Pence win was what she would like to happen. God Bless :)
 
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Hello Cassia. If God is not in the equation then it's not a good idea to say God is in the equation. Trying to speak for God when he hasn't spoken is not a good idea IMO> For example the prophetess Kat Kerr when she said she was taken up to heaven and said God told her that Trump was going to win, then Pence would win the election after that and on and on. She would have been better just saying that a Trump- Pence win was what she would like to happen. God Bless :)
Yes better to not leave Him out of any equation or none of it will add up. On account of that’s just the way it is. Can’t say I like it like that.
 
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The legal side of redemption is what God has done for us in Christ and that’s in the past. Romans 4:25, 1 Corinthians 15:3-4, Romans 8:1, Colossians 1:14

(((((((25 who was handed over to death for our trespasses and was raised for our justification. 3 For I handed on to you as of first importance what I in turn had received: that Christ died for our sins in accordance with the scriptures, 4 and that he was buried, and that he was raised on the third day in accordance with the scriptures, 1 There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. 14 in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.)))))

and is the vital part of what the Holy Spirit is doing in the new creation ... The Way of Christianity. That knowledge alone can leave one cold and lifeless yet once understood the knowledge is one of what belongs to the new creation in Christ. Knowledge of the rightful place of one who belongs to Abba and the privileges that become The Truth by the ministry of the Holy Spirit thru the Word in us.

A little study of the legal side may help in this 2 Corinthians 5:21, Romans 3:21-26, Titus 2:14

(((((21 For our sake he made him to be sin who knew no sin, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God. 21 But now, apart from law, the righteousness of God has been disclosed, and is attested by the law and the prophets, 22 the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ[a] for all who believe. For there is no distinction, 23 since all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God; 24 they are now justified by his grace as a gift, through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus, 25 whom God put forward as a sacrifice of atonement[ by his blood, effective through faith. He did this to show his righteousness, because in his divine forbearance he had passed over the sins previously committed; 26 it was to prove at the present time that he himself is righteous and that he justifies the one who has faith in Jesus. 14 He it is who gave himself for us that he might redeem us from all iniquity and purify for himself a people of his own who are zealous for good deeds. )))))

into some of the vital facts 2 Corinthians 5:17-18, Ephesians 1:17-23

((17 So if anyone is in Christ, there is a new creation: everything old has passed away; see, everything has become new! 18 All this is from God, who reconciled us to himself through Christ, and has given us the ministry of reconciliation; 17 I pray that the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give you a spirit of wisdom and revelation as you come to know him, 18 so that, with the eyes of your heart enlightened, you may know what is the hope to which he has called you, what are the riches of his glorious inheritance among the saints, 19 and what is the immeasurable greatness of his power for us who believe, according to the working of his great power. 20 God put this power to work in Christ when he raised him from the dead and seated him at his right hand in the heavenly places, 21 far above all rule and authority and power and dominion, and above every name that is named, not only in this age but also in the age to come. 22 And he has put all things under his feet and has made him the head over all things for the church, 23 which is his body, the fullness of him who fills all in all. )))

God has revealed what He’s done for us in the process of building the nature and The Life of the Father into the new creations human spirit. Showing the exceeding greatness of His ability on behalf of those who believe. Colossians 2:15, Galatians 2:20, Romans 6:8, Ephesians 2:6

((((15 He disarmed the rulers and authorities and made a public example of them, triumphing over them in it. 20 and it is no longer I who live, but it is Christ who lives in me. And the life I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me. 8 But if we have died with Christ, we believe that we will also live with him. 6 and raised us up with him and seated us with him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, ))))

giving us a living picture of the work of Jesus Christ. Ephesians 1:4-6

((((4 just as he chose us in Christ before the foundation of the world to be holy and blameless before him in love. 5 He destined us for adoption as his children through Jesus Christ, according to the good pleasure of his will, 6 to the praise of his glorious grace that he freely bestowed on us in the Beloved.))))

We wouldn’t be here reading and studying this if the Father hadn’t drawn us to Himself. Ephesians 3:16-20

((((16 I pray that, according to the riches of his glory, he may grant that you may be strengthened in your inner being with power through his Spirit, 17 and that Christ may dwell in your hearts through faith, as you are being rooted and grounded in love. 18 I pray that you may have the power to comprehend, with all the saints, what is the breadth and length and height and depth, 19 and to know the love of Christ that surpasses knowledge, so that you may be filled with all the fullness of God.20 Now to him who by the power at work within us is able to accomplish abundantly far more than all we can ask or imagine,))))

The new inner nature has received the Life and Nature of God and now the Holy Spirit is building up thru the Word the ability to walk as Christ did, dwelling on the ground of faith within the newly created heart. Jesus’ crown of thorns earned for the new creation many crowns to strive toward, the righteous glory of life Ephesians 3:20

((((20 Now to him who by the power at work within us is able to accomplish abundantly far more than all we can ask or imagine,)))

Which is the power of God in the resurrected life in the new creation. The pleasure that the Father has in His Son finds rest and satisfaction in fitting the new creation into His Purpose. John 16:13-14

((((However, when He, the Spirit of truth, has come, He will guide you into all truth; for He will not speak on His own authority, but whatever He hears He will speak; and He will tell you things to come. He will glorify Me, for He will take of what is Mine and declare it to you.))))

BUT the mind is a matter of persuasive reasoning “Come, let us reason together”, part of the makeup of human beings. Taking each thought captive to Christ is how we gain the mind of Christ while in the midst of performing our reasonable service Romans 12:1-3.

(((( I appeal to you therefore, brothers and sisters, by the mercies of God, to present your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and acceptable to God, which is your spiritual worship. 2 Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your minds, so that you may discern what is the will of God—what is good and acceptable and perfect.3 For by the grace given to me I say to everyone among you not to think of yourself more highly than you ought to think, but to think with sober judgment, each according to the measure of faith that God has assigned.)))))

The mind of Christ gained from our reasonable service is a new added benefit not available before the NT covenant.

YET that’s not really knowing God. Knowing God is to come to a full knowledge of Him, Father and Son, in the hope of the glory set before us. John 17:3 And as it’s expressed in love,

((((3 And this is eternal life, that they may know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom you have sent.))))

THAT is the knowing of Christ Himself. Knowledge that comes from revelation, knowing, the spirit of revelation. Pray for that so as to have the full knowledge of Him. Ephesians 1:17-19

((((((17 I pray that the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give you a spirit of wisdom and revelation as you come to know him, 18 so that, with the eyes of your heart enlightened, you may know what is the hope to which he has called you, what are the riches of his glorious inheritance among the saints, 19 and what is the immeasurable greatness of his power for us who believe, according to the working of his great power.)))))

Knowledge that is foundational to a believer, and is quite necessary.
 
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