Are non-Jewish Christians commanded to keep the 7th Day Sabbath

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LoveGodsWord

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Oh, no. You played "the God card". What am I supposed to do with that?
(I say this to help you, as you are sincerely trying to help me, I believe.)

Though what are saying about the Spirit working in you may well be true, it is VERY bad form to impose that thought on others.

You just set up a situation where I have to choose to follow you, as a self-declared representative of God, or follow the Spirit in me, that you are therefore inferring is Satan. (since our opinions don't line up)

I love you, but this is a VERY ugly thing to do to another believer. I'm strong enough to resist such a power play, but I fear that others less mature, or confident in their faith would be taken in by such a ploy. You aren't a charlatan, are you? (I hope not)

I implore you to consider what I am saying carefully. Thanks.
Again, I think your heart is in the right place, I'm waiting your mouth to catch up. - lol

The God's Word card you mean? According to the scriptures there is no other card that can be played as only God's Word is true and we should believe and follow them according to Romans 3:4 and Acts of the Apostles 5:29. Our thoughts are not Gods' thought and our opinions matter little in Gods' eyes. As far as truth is concerned there is only one definition and that is God's Word *see John 17:17.
Ignoring Gods' Word does not make it disappear according to the scriptures *John 12:47-48.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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Romans 14:4-8 NIV
Who are you to judge someone else’s servant? To their own master, servants stand or fall. And they will stand, for the Lord is able to make them stand.
5 One person considers one day more sacred than another; another considers every day alike. Each of them should be fully convinced in their own mind. 6 Whoever regards one day as special does so to the Lord. Whoever eats meat does so to the Lord, for they give thanks to God; and whoever abstains does so to the Lord and gives thanks to God. 7 For none of us lives for ourselves alone, and none of us dies for ourselves alone. 8 If we live, we live for the Lord; and if we die, we die for the Lord. So, whether we live or die, we belong to the Lord.

Lets be honest now. Where in all of the chapter of Romans 14 is it talking about God's 4th commandments "seventh day" Sabbath of God's 10 commandments that give us the knowledge of what sin is when broken? So if you cannot show me where Romans 14:4-6 is talking about God's seventh day Sabbath what method of bible study are you using? Your reading into the scripture what the scriptures do not say and do not teach. Some call this method of bible interpretation eisegesis, which is reading into the scriptures what the scriptures do not say and teach. Where as we should be reading the meaning out of scripture (exegesis). Romans 14 is not talking anywhere about God's 4th commandment or anyone of God's 10 commandments for that matter. It is talking about eating and not eating on days that men esteem over other days and judging others in this regards. It is not talking anywhere about what days God esteems over other days and we know in the scriptures that the things that men esteem are an abomination in Gods' eyes according to Luke 16:15. So how does Romans 14:4-6 support your view that God's 4th commandment of the 10 commandments are abolished and we are now commanded to keep Sunday as a holy day of rest? - It doesn't as it is one of God's 10 commandments according to the scriptures that give us the knowledge of what sin is when broken according to Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4 and according to James in James 2:10-11 if we knowingly break anyone of God's 10 commandments which includes Gods' 4th commandment we stand guilty before God of sin.

Take Care.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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It seems pretty obvious that winter and the sabbath both result in conditions that make evacuation more difficult. But why go for the most likely interpretation when you can go with a convoluted one crammed into a particular doctrine?
All you have are your words here. Yet it is Jesus that knew his disciples would be continuing to keep His Sabbath commandment well after His death and resurrection as shown in Matthew 24:15-20 and is these scriptures your not able to explain away with your words that are not Gods Word. We should all be careful to believe what Gods' Word says.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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Wrong! Instead of repeating the writings of EGW perhaps you should learn on your own what people like me are doing.
I know your post here is to someone else so I hope you do not mind me sharing a few comments. All you have posted here is what the majority of mainstream fallen Christianity teaches as an excuse to sin and break God's commandments which is eisegesis or trying to read into the scripture what the scriptures do not say and do not teach. That said let's see if what I am saying here is true or not true?
I think I have said enough around here that you should realize I obey all the commandments specifically for me a gentile Christian. See e.g. Acts 15:1, 5, 1, 20-22, 15:24, 28-29-28, 21:24-26
There is not a single scripture you have provided here that says Gods' 10 commandments are no longer a requirement for Christian living! The problem here is that your disregarding the contexts given in Acts of the Apostles 15:1-2 that prove what the subject matter and topic of conversation is over. Your interpretation of the above scripture you apply to Gods' 10 commandments that includes of course Gods 4th commandment that is one of God's 10 commandments that give us the knowledge of what sin is when broken according to the new covenant scriptures (Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4) to make your argument about Acts 15 being about the Sabbath puts your teachings in a bit of a dilemma because by applying Acts of the Apostle 15 to Gods' 4th commandment of the 10 commandments you need to apply your interpretation to all of Gods 10 commandments as it is written in James if we show partiality to keeping God's law and break anyone of them we stand guilty before the law as transgressors *James 2:10-11. So if your making your argument in Acts of the Apostles 15 your also making your argument about worshiping other God's, taking God's name in vain, lying, stealing, murder and everyone of God's 10 commandments that are not mentioned in Acts of the Apostles 15. You may not have realized this but this unbiblical interpretation of the scriptures also puts Paul in contradiction with Paul because after the decision made at Jerusalem some time latter Paul visits the gentile Corinthian believers and says in 1 Corinthians 7:19 "Circumcision is nothing and uncircumcision is nothing but the keeping of the commandments of God.

Let's continue...
Acts 15:1 1 And certain men which came down from Judaea taught the brethren, and said, Except ye be circumcised after the manner of Moses, ye cannot be saved. The only requirement in this vs. is circumcision, nothing about the Sabbath
The there is nothing about any of God's 10 commandment in Acts of the Apostles 15. You left out Acts of the Apostles 15:2 here which is important to the interpretation of these scriptures. So let's add the context back in to the discussion that you have left out as both Acts of the Apostles 15:1-2 show us what the subject matter is for the whole chapter of Acts 15 and what is being discussed in Jerusalem.

Acts of the Apostles 15:1-2
[1], And certain men who came down from Judea taught the brethren, and said, EXCEPT YOU BE CIRCUMCISED AFTER THE MANNER OF MOSES YOU CANNOT BE SAVED.

NOTE: ACTS 15:1 is the question that needs to be answered and the topic of conversation and CONTEXT of the chapter of ACTS 15. Here we have Jewish believers coming to Paul and Barnabas saying if the new GENTILES believers are not circumcised and made proselytes then they cannot be saved. This is the chapter context and issue of contention.

[2], When therefore Paul and Barnabas had no small dissension and dispute with them, THEY DETERMINED THAT PAUL AND BARNABAS AND CERTAIN OF THEM SHOULD GO UP TO JERUSALEM UNTO THE APOSTLES AND ELDERS ABOUT THIS QUESTION.

NOTE: ACTS 15:2 Which question? Weather your salvation depends on being CIRCUMCISED. The question here was never over is God's 10 commandments a requirement for Christian living. They then traveled to Jerusalem about this question to determine if new gentile believers needed to be circumcised in order to be saved. Once they got to Jerusalem, the question was then asked and the discussion continued with the Pharisees stating their case first in Acts of the Apostles 15:5..

Acts 15:5 5 But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses.
The requirements stated in this vs. is circumcision and keep the law of Moses. Which would be difficult unless they were also given the law of Moses. No record of that.

[5], But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees who believed, saying, It is needful to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses.

NOTE: KEEP in mind here the question was never over if gentile believers should obey God's 10 Commandments but to keep the Shadow laws of Moses, in this case circumcision as a means of salvation. Circumcision is from the law of Moses not God’s 10 Commandments written by God on two tables of stone. The laws of Moses also included the Levitical Priesthood, the old covenant laws for remission of sins and animal sacrifices, the annual Feast days these were all laws written in the Mosaic book of the law which were prophetic in nature pointing to Jesus as the Messiah and His work on our behalf in the new covenant based on better promises. There is nowhere in Acts of the Apostle 15:5 that says anywhere in context and subject matter that we are discussing Gods' 10 commandments. The topic of conversation, subject matter and the question being considered at Jerusalem was "Is circumcision a requirement for salvation of new gentile believers. Not is Gods' 10 commandments still the standard of Christian living. So lets look at v5-6 together once more..

Acts of the Apostles 15:5-6
[5], But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees who believed, saying, It is needful to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses.
[6], And the apostles and elders came together TO CONSIDER THIS MATTER.

NOTE: Once again in agreement with Acts of the Apostles 15:1-2 the matter being considered was "Is circumcision of the law of Moses a requirement for salvation and all of the other Mosaic laws attached with circumcision and the old covenant laws for remission of sins under the old Priesthood. This would of made them old covenant Jews not new covenant Christians who have just accepted Jesus as their Messiah, sacrifice for their sins and great High Priest ministering on their behalf in the heavenly Sanctuary based on better promises *Hebrews 7:1-25; Hebrews 8:1-13: Hebrews 9:1-27 and Hebrews 10:1-22.

Acts 15:10 10 Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear? Here Paul, a Jew, refers to the requirements of the Pharisees as "a yoke upon the neck of the disciples that the fathers were not able to bear."

Let's slow down a little as your leaving out more scripture as you did earlier from Acts of the Apostles 15:1-2. Let's continue from after v6 which we also added back in.

Acts of the Apostles 15:7-10
[7], And when there had been much disputing, PETER ROSE UP, AND SAID UNTO THEM, MEN AND BRETHREN, YOU KNOW HOW THAT A GOOD WHILE AGO GOD MADE CHOICE AMONG US, THAT THE GENTILES BY MY MOUTH SHOULD HEAR THE WORD OF THE GOSPEL, AND BELIEVE.
[8], And God, who knows the hearts, bore them witness, GIVING THEM THE HOLY SPIRIT, EVEN AS HE DID UNTO US;
[9], AND PUT NO DIFFERENCE BETWEEN US AND THEM, PURIFYING THEIR HEARTS BY FAITH.

NOTE: After much discussion between the Apostles, Peter then rose up showing that God gave the gentile believers the Holy Spirit being UNCIRCUMCISED. The point Peter was making was that God gave them the Holy Spirit and they were not circumcised!

[10], NOW THEREFORE WHY TEST GOD, TO PUT A YOKE UPON THE NECK OF THE DISCIPLES, WHICH NEITHER OUR FATHERS NOR WE WERE ABLE TO BEAR?
[11], But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.

NOTE: They came to the conclusion then that salvation is not by being circumcised but be what circumcision pointed to. A new heart by faith. This is made plain latter in other scripture written by PAUL here...

Romans 2 [25] For circumcision verily profits, if you keep the law: but if you are a breaker of the law, your circumcision is made uncircumcision. [26], Therefore if the uncircumcision keeps the righteousness of the law, shall not his uncircumcision be counted for circumcision? [27], And shall not uncircumcision which is by nature, if it fulfills the law, judge you, who by the letter and circumcision do transgress the law? [28], FOR HE IS NOT A JEW, WHO IS ONE; NEITHER IS THAT CIRCUMCISION, WHICH IS OF THE OUTWARD FLESH: [29], BUT HE IS A JEW WHICH IS ONE INWARDLY; AND CIRCUMCISION IS THAT OF THE HEART, IN THE SPIRIT AND NOT IN THE LETTER; WHOSE PRAISE IS NOT OF MEN BUT OF GOD.

Acts 15:20-21 20 But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood 21 For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day. The disciples listed only three requirements for gentile proselytes "abstain from pollutions of idols, fornication, things strangled and from blood." No mention of Sabbath keeping. And no vs. 21 does not mean the proselytes would be attending synagogues. Paul is not so mixed up that he would call obeying the law of Moses a yoke that even the Jews could not bear and then say gentiles must attend synagogues where the Jews would be enforcing those very laws.

[19], THEREFORE MY JUDGMENT IS THAT WE TROUBLE NOT THEM WHO FROM THE GENTILES ARE TURNED TO GOD:
[20], BUT WRITE UNTO THEM THAT THEY ABSTAIN FROM THE DEFILEMENT OF IDOLS, FORNICATION AND THINGS STRANGLED AND FROM BLOOD

NOTE: James conclusion is that new Gentile believers should not be troubled with circumcision as a requirement of salvation which was the matter being considered and the question being discussion as shown in *ACTS 15:1-2; ACTS 15:6 but asks them to abstain from idols, fornication and from things strangled and from blood.

[21], FOR MOSES OF OLD TIME HAS IN EVERY CITY THEM THAT PREACH HIM, BEING READ IN THE SYNAGOGUES EVERY SABBATH.

NOTE: The reason why JAMES sends this letter to the new Gentile believers is that they would continue learning God's Word every Sabbath.

Acts Acts 15:24 24 Forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment: Note Paul says they gave no such commandment i.e. "You must be circumcised, and keep the law."

Not quite it is they gave no such commandment to keep the law of circumcision from the law of Moses. Nothing about gentile believers are now free to break Gods’ 10 commandments and continue in a life of know unrepentant sin. This teaching of lawlessness (without law) is not biblical and is a false teaching that disagrees with the rest of the bible (e.g. see Paul's response to the Corinthian gentile believers after the decision at Jerusalem in 1 Corinthians 7:19).

Perhaps you should reconsider your argument. Do you honestly believe gentile believers are now free to break Gods' commandments and not believe and follow God's Word when the new covenant scriptures teach that it is through Gods' law (10 commandments) that we have a knowledge of what sin is in Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4; Psalms 119:172

……………

CONCLUSION So the conclusion of the matter with CONTEXT added back in is found in v19-20 We are not to trouble the new gentile believers with CIRCUMCISION as a means of salvation. They are new converts that will learn more about GOD'S WORD when? EVERY SABBATH. In the meantime you should abstain from anything offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication.

Nope! Nothing written about the 10 Commandments being abolished in this chapter. Here is what PAUL says of the matter here...

1 Corinthians 7:19 [19] circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, BUT THE KEEPING OF THE COMMANDMENTS OF GOD.

Acts of the Apostles 15 is about “circumcision” as a requirement for salvation and is not even considering Gods 10 Commandments. “Circumcision” is one of the shadow laws of the Mosaic book of the old covenant (Exodus 24:7). Your interpretation of Acts of the Apostles 15 has Paul in contradiction to Paul in 1 Corinthians 7:19.

Take Care.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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Right. The Sabbatarians never talk about the "pray that it won't be winter" part, only the "SEE... we will be observing the Sabbath!" claim. (false)

It would be hard to find a Sabbatarian that is actually praying that it won't be winter when Jesus returns. Which nullifies their claim, I suppose. All, or nothing?

How does Matthew 24:15-20 not show that Gods' people will be keeping the Sabbath commandment well after the death and resurrection of Jesus? It does indeed show this as written in the scriptures as a witness there for all to see.

Matthew 24:15-20
[15], When you therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoever reads, let him understand
[16], THEN LET THEM WHICH BE IN JUDEA FLEE INTO THE MOUNTAINS:
[17], Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house:
[18], Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes.
[19], And woe to them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!
[20], BUT PRAY YOU THAT YOUR FLIGHT BE NOT IN THE WINTER, NEITHER ON THE SABBATH DAY

.........................


It is pretty clear in the very Words of Jesus that His disciples would continue to be keeping the Sabbath well after the death and resurrection of Jesus in the new covenant.

Take Care.
 
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Saint Steven

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The claim by many is that Jesus ended the Sabbath when He died for our sins.
Thanks.
I understand that claim, but I don't see it that way. (it happened sooner than that)

The law was our guardian until Christ came, that we might be justified by faith. Now that this faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian. (the law) Faith = the end of the law. (actually, we were never under the law, so... double whammy)

Galatians 3:23-25 NIV
Before the coming of this faith, we were held in custody under the law, locked up until the faith that was to come would be revealed. 24 So the law was our guardian until Christ came that we might be justified by faith. 25 Now that this faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian.
 
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Saint Steven

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The claim by many is that Jesus ended the Sabbath when He died for our sins. We know this is not true because God’s covenant of Ten is eternal and universal...
But, who was that covenant with? (not us)

Deuteronomy 5:3 NIV
It was not with our ancestors that the Lord made this covenant, but with us, with all of us who are alive here today.
 
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Ceallaigh

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Tell me more. - lol

Even though I see a distinct pattern and a lot of repetition, I haven't been keeping a journal so to speak. It's a small group both here and worldwide, so I'm not motivated to put much energy into it. Especially as much as they keep trying to take me down a rabbit hole.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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Thanks.
I understand that claim, but I don't see it that way. (it happened sooner than that)

The law was our guardian until Christ came, that we might be justified by faith. Now that this faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian. (the law) Faith = the end of the law. (actually, we were never under the law, so... double whammy)

Galatians 3:23-25 NIV
Before the coming of this faith, we were held in custody under the law, locked up until the faith that was to come would be revealed. 24 So the law was our guardian until Christ came that we might be justified by faith. 25 Now that this faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian.

According to the scriptures to be "under the law" means to be under the condemnation of the law standing guilty before God guilty of sin - Romans 3:20. The purpose of Gods' law according to God's new covenant scriptures is to give us the knowledge of good (moral right doing) and evil (moral wrong doing); sin (moral wrong doing) and righteousness (moral right doing) *Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4; Psalms 119:172 and to lead us to Christ that we might be forgiven through faith *Galatians 3:22-25. The scriptures here mean that the purpose of God's law is to show us that we are all sinners in need of God's salvation and all have sinned and and stand guilty before God of sin in condemnation and death *Romans 3:9-23.

That is until we come to Christ to seek God's mercy, love and forgiveness and believe his promise of salvation though faith in His Word. When we come to Christ we are no longer "under the law" standing guilty before God of condemnation and death because we have received God's forgiveness and it is written in Romans 8:1-4 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made me free from the law of sin and death. For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

So according to the scripture Galatians 3:22-25 is not saying God's law is abolished when we come to Christ. It is saying we are no longer "under the laws" condemnation and death for our sins, because we have received Gods' forgiveness though faith and accepting Christs sacrifice for our sins so that we can be reconciled and brought back to God as we believe His promise of forgiveness to us as we believe His Words. According to Paul faith does not abolish God's law according to you Steve, it establishes Gods' law in all those who though faith have been born of the Spirit to believe and follow God's Word *see Romans 8:1-4; Romans 3:31; 1 John 3:4-9. Your teachings of lawlessness (without law) is not supported in the scriptures.

Hope this is helpful.
 
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SabbathBlessings

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I know your post here is to someone else so I hope you do not mind me sharing a few comments. All you have posted here is what the majority of mainstream fallen Christianity teaches as an excuse to sin and break God's commandments which is eisegesis or trying to read into the scripture what the scriptures do not say and do not teach. That said let's see if what I am saying here is true or not true?

There is not a single scripture you have provided here that says Gods' 10 commandments are no longer a requirement for Christian living! The problem here is that your disregarding the contexts given in Acts of the Apostles 15:1-2 that prove what the subject matter and topic of conversation is over. Your interpretation of the above scripture you apply to Gods' 10 commandments that includes of course Gods 4th commandment that is one of God's 10 commandments that give us the knowledge of what sin is when broken according to the new covenant scriptures (Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4) to make your argument about Acts 15 being about the Sabbath puts your teachings in a bit of a dilemma because by applying Acts of the Apostle 15 to Gods' 4th commandment of the 10 commandments you need to apply your interpretation to all of Gods 10 commandments as it is written in James if we show partiality to keeping God's law and break anyone of them we stand guilty before the law as transgressors *James 2:10-11. So if your making your argument in Acts of the Apostles 15 your also making your argument about worshiping other God's, taking God's name in vain, lying, stealing, murder and everyone of God's 10 commandments that are not mentioned in Acts of the Apostles 15. You may not have realized this but this unbiblical interpretation of the scriptures also puts Paul in contradiction with Paul because after the decision made at Jerusalem some time latter Paul visits the gentile Corinthian believers and says in 1 Corinthians 7:19 "Circumcision is nothing and uncircumcision is nothing but the keeping of the commandments of God.

Let's continue...

The there is nothing about any of God's 10 commandment in Acts of the Apostles 15. You left out Acts of the Apostles 15:2 here which is important to the interpretation of these scriptures. So let's add the context back in to the discussion that you have left out as both Acts of the Apostles 15:1-2 show us what the subject matter is for the whole chapter of Acts 15 and what is being discussed in Jerusalem.

Acts of the Apostles 15:1-2
[1], And certain men who came down from Judea taught the brethren, and said, EXCEPT YOU BE CIRCUMCISED AFTER THE MANNER OF MOSES YOU CANNOT BE SAVED.

NOTE: ACTS 15:1 is the question that needs to be answered and the topic of conversation and CONTEXT of the chapter of ACTS 15. Here we have Jewish believers coming to Paul and Barnabas saying if the new GENTILES believers are not circumcised and made proselytes then they cannot be saved. This is the chapter context and issue of contention.

[2], When therefore Paul and Barnabas had no small dissension and dispute with them, THEY DETERMINED THAT PAUL AND BARNABAS AND CERTAIN OF THEM SHOULD GO UP TO JERUSALEM UNTO THE APOSTLES AND ELDERS ABOUT THIS QUESTION.

NOTE: ACTS 15:2 Which question? Weather your salvation depends on being CIRCUMCISED. The question here was never over is God's 10 commandments a requirement for Christian living. They then traveled to Jerusalem about this question to determine if new gentile believers needed to be circumcised in order to be saved. Once they got to Jerusalem, the question was then asked and the discussion continued with the Pharisees stating their case first in Acts of the Apostles 15:5..



[5], But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees who believed, saying, It is needful to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses.

NOTE: KEEP in mind here the question was never over if gentile believers should obey God's 10 Commandments but to keep the Shadow laws of Moses, in this case circumcision as a means of salvation. Circumcision is from the law of Moses not God’s 10 Commandments written by God on two tables of stone. The laws of Moses also included the Levitical Priesthood, the old covenant laws for remission of sins and animal sacrifices, the annual Feast days these were all laws written in the Mosaic book of the law which were prophetic in nature pointing to Jesus as the Messiah and His work on our behalf in the new covenant based on better promises. There is nowhere in Acts of the Apostle 15:5 that says anywhere in context and subject matter that we are discussing Gods' 10 commandments. The topic of conversation, subject matter and the question being considered at Jerusalem was "Is circumcision a requirement for salvation of new gentile believers. Not is Gods' 10 commandments still the standard of Christian living. So lets look at v5-6 together once more..

Acts of the Apostles 15:5-6
[5], But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees who believed, saying, It is needful to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses.
[6], And the apostles and elders came together TO CONSIDER THIS MATTER.

NOTE: Once again in agreement with Acts of the Apostles 15:1-2 the matter being considered was "Is circumcision of the law of Moses a requirement for salvation and all of the other Mosaic laws attached with circumcision and the old covenant laws for remission of sins under the old Priesthood. This would of made them old covenant Jews not new covenant Christians who have just accepted Jesus as their Messiah, sacrifice for their sins and great High Priest ministering on their behalf in the heavenly Sanctuary based on better promises *Hebrews 7:1-25; Hebrews 8:1-13: Hebrews 9:1-27 and Hebrews 10:1-22.



Let's slow down a little as your leaving out more scripture as you did earlier from Acts of the Apostles 15:1-2. Let's continue from after v6 which we also added back in.

Acts of the Apostles 15:7-10
[7], And when there had been much disputing, PETER ROSE UP, AND SAID UNTO THEM, MEN AND BRETHREN, YOU KNOW HOW THAT A GOOD WHILE AGO GOD MADE CHOICE AMONG US, THAT THE GENTILES BY MY MOUTH SHOULD HEAR THE WORD OF THE GOSPEL, AND BELIEVE.
[8], And God, who knows the hearts, bore them witness, GIVING THEM THE HOLY SPIRIT, EVEN AS HE DID UNTO US;
[9], AND PUT NO DIFFERENCE BETWEEN US AND THEM, PURIFYING THEIR HEARTS BY FAITH.

NOTE: After much discussion between the Apostles, Peter then rose up showing that God gave the gentile believers the Holy Spirit being UNCIRCUMCISED. The point Peter was making was that God gave them the Holy Spirit and they were not circumcised!

[10], NOW THEREFORE WHY TEST GOD, TO PUT A YOKE UPON THE NECK OF THE DISCIPLES, WHICH NEITHER OUR FATHERS NOR WE WERE ABLE TO BEAR?
[11], But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.

NOTE: They came to the conclusion then that salvation is not by being circumcised but be what circumcision pointed to. A new heart by faith. This is made plain latter in other scripture written by PAUL here...

Romans 2 [25] For circumcision verily profits, if you keep the law: but if you are a breaker of the law, your circumcision is made uncircumcision. [26], Therefore if the uncircumcision keeps the righteousness of the law, shall not his uncircumcision be counted for circumcision? [27], And shall not uncircumcision which is by nature, if it fulfills the law, judge you, who by the letter and circumcision do transgress the law? [28], FOR HE IS NOT A JEW, WHO IS ONE; NEITHER IS THAT CIRCUMCISION, WHICH IS OF THE OUTWARD FLESH: [29], BUT HE IS A JEW WHICH IS ONE INWARDLY; AND CIRCUMCISION IS THAT OF THE HEART, IN THE SPIRIT AND NOT IN THE LETTER; WHOSE PRAISE IS NOT OF MEN BUT OF GOD.



[19], THEREFORE MY JUDGMENT IS THAT WE TROUBLE NOT THEM WHO FROM THE GENTILES ARE TURNED TO GOD:
[20], BUT WRITE UNTO THEM THAT THEY ABSTAIN FROM THE DEFILEMENT OF IDOLS, FORNICATION AND THINGS STRANGLED AND FROM BLOOD

NOTE: James conclusion is that new Gentile believers should not be troubled with circumcision as a requirement of salvation which was the matter being considered and the question being discussion as shown in *ACTS 15:1-2; ACTS 15:6 but asks them to abstain from idols, fornication and from things strangled and from blood.

[21], FOR MOSES OF OLD TIME HAS IN EVERY CITY THEM THAT PREACH HIM, BEING READ IN THE SYNAGOGUES EVERY SABBATH.

NOTE: The reason why JAMES sends this letter to the new Gentile believers is that they would continue learning God's Word every Sabbath.



Not quite it is they gave no such commandment to keep the law of circumcision from the law of Moses. Nothing about gentile believers are now free to break Gods’ 10 commandments and continue in a life of know unrepentant sin. This teaching of lawlessness (without law) is not biblical and is a false teaching that disagrees with the rest of the bible (e.g. see Paul's response to the Corinthian gentile believers after the decision at Jerusalem in 1 Corinthians 7:19).

Perhaps you should reconsider your argument. Do you honestly believe gentile believers are now free to break Gods' commandments and not believe and follow God's Word when the new covenant scriptures teach that it is through Gods' law (10 commandments) that we have a knowledge of what sin is in Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4; Psalms 119:172

……………

CONCLUSION So the conclusion of the matter with CONTEXT added back in is found in v19-20 We are not to trouble the new gentile believers with CIRCUMCISION as a means of salvation. They are new converts that will learn more about GOD'S WORD when? EVERY SABBATH. In the meantime you should abstain from anything offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication.

Nope! Nothing written about the 10 Commandments being abolished in this chapter. Here is what PAUL says of the matter here...

1 Corinthians 7:19 [19] circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, BUT THE KEEPING OF THE COMMANDMENTS OF GOD.

Acts of the Apostles 15 is about “circumcision” as a requirement for salvation and is not even considering Gods 10 Commandments. “Circumcision” is one of the shadow laws of the Mosaic book of the old covenant (Exodus 24:7). Your interpretation of Acts of the Apostles 15 has Paul in contradiction to Paul in 1 Corinthians 7:19.

Take Care.

This should also be a sticky!

Excellent post!
 
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Saint Steven

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... the Sabbath is not a shadow law as it points backward to Creation not forward...
There it is, the term "shadow law".
As if the law can be divided up between "shadow laws" and... not "shadow laws".

This is a doctrinal workaround on your part to deal with these scriptures below. Which say "the law" (the whole law) with no qualifying, or limiting in what the Bible says, that you say we should not change (by adding or subtracting). For shame.

Hebrews 10:1 NIV
The law is only a shadow of the good things that are coming—not the realities themselves. For this reason it can never, by the same sacrifices repeated endlessly year after year, make perfect those who draw near to worship.

Or this one.

Colossians 2:16-17 NIV
Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day. 17 These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality, however, is found in Christ.
 
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SabbathBlessings

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But, who was that covenant with? (not us)

Deuteronomy 5:3 NIV
It was not with our ancestors that the Lord made this covenant, but with us, with all of us who are alive here today.
Are you saying you are not part of the Second Covenant either?
 
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Saint Steven

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... the Sabbath is not a shadow law as it points backward to Creation not forward...
I agree that the the Sabbath points backward to creation, not the other way around. This does not help your case.

To help your case, you need to emphasize that creation points to the Sabbath. (but that might be dishonest) Would the end justify the means? - lol
 
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Ceallaigh

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There it is, the term "shadow law".
As if the law can be divided up between "shadow laws" and... not "shadow laws".

This is a doctrinal workaround on your part to deal with these scriptures below. Which say "the law" (the whole law) with no qualifying, or limiting in what the Bible says, that you say we should not change (by adding or subtracting). For shame.

Hebrews 10:1 NIV
The law is only a shadow of the good things that are coming—not the realities themselves. For this reason it can never, by the same sacrifices repeated endlessly year after year, make perfect those who draw near to worship.

Or this one.

Colossians 2:16-17 NIV
Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day. 17 These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality, however, is found in Christ.

I already know what the response to those will be, because I've already seen it before. I just don't know which one will give it.
 
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Saint Steven

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Jesus confirms by the verse Matthew 24:20 that the Sabbath did not end after He died because in this scripture Jesus is referring to the future after He goes back to heaven.
Right, it did not end for Jews living in Israel. (those he was speaking to) He promised that they would not run out of towns of Israel to flee to before he returned. Get that? "towns of Israel" (to whom does that apply?)

Matthew 10:23 NIV
When you are persecuted in one place, flee to another. Truly I tell you, you will not finish going through the towns of Israel before the Son of Man comes.
 
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Ceallaigh

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This should also be a sticky!

Excellent post!

What, limiting it all down to circumcision? I've seen that plenty of times. However that's probably the most lengthy version I've seen.
 
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SabbathBlessings

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Thanks.
I understand that claim, but I don't see it that way. (it happened sooner than that)

The law was our guardian until Christ came, that we might be justified by faith. Now that this faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian. (the law) Faith = the end of the law. (actually, we were never under the law, so... double whammy)

Galatians 3:23-25 NIV
Before the coming of this faith, we were held in custody under the law, locked up until the faith that was to come would be revealed. 24 So the law was our guardian until Christ came that we might be justified by faith. 25 Now that this faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian.

That’s weird, than why would Jesus and the disciples keep the Sabbath if it ended the minute He came? The Sabbath is mentioned though out the New Testament, close to 60 times showing it was still part of the law, Jesus being accused of breaking the Sabbath- why if there was no law? Jesus never broke the Sabbath or any of God’s commandment John 15:10. Jesus taught directly from the Ten Commandments Matthew 5:17-30, Matthew 19:17. Jesus told us to keep the commandments as thats how we show love to Him- John 14:15, John 15:10, 1 John 5:3 and how He knows us Matthew 7:21-23, 1 John 2:4.

It’s one of the last verses in the bible right before the second coming of our Savior. I truly hope you re-think that the law ended, because whoever taught this to you is in error. It did not come from scriptures. Isaiah 8:20

Revelations 22:14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city. 15 But outside are dogs and sorcerers and sexually immoral and murderers and idolaters, and whoever loves and practices a lie.


Right now it’s not too late to make better decisions based on the Word of God.

God bless
 
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... there will be a lot more prayers asking Jesus that our flight in the hills will not be in winter or on the Sabbath day.
You live in the hills?
No Sabbath-keepers in the open plains? - lol

Seriously, what hills was Jesus referring to? (Israel)
 
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