False Prophets

1rreducibly Complex said:

Matthew 7:15 - Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

...

1. How to identify false prophets.

2. What steps can we take to prevent being fooled by their lies.

In my experience, the type of person likely to be a false prophet delights in putting others down, in the flawed notion doing so lifts themselves higher. They love to negatively label and slander innocents.

They are more comfortable with lies, than truth. Lies come easy to them. While truth is difficult if not impossible for them to find.

They believe reducing the rights and freedoms of others paves the road to future progress and prosperity. Stripping women of the right to vote, stripping americans of the right to bear arms and similar movements which reduce opportunities and prosperity in the world are their favorite things. They are fanatically goal oriented in terms of finding ways for governments to assume greater power at the expense of overall rights, freedom and privacy.

They seek to control everyone and are chronically unable to control themselves.

They want money and power and to make all the important decisions. Then blame everyone except themselves if they make poor choices and are unhappy with the results.

They stand for nothing and fall for everything. They are fooled by every deception and support every horrible idea and terrible candidate who comes along. And lack the self awareness to realize it.

...

Long story short, have you had experiences with false prophets you would care to share. Any advice, tips or insights would be appreciated.

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Are you from the US?

1rreducibly Complex said:

Matthew 7:15 - Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.


They want money and power and to make all the important decisions. Then blame everyone except themselves if they make poor choices and are unhappy with the results.


Long story short, have you had experiences with false prophets you would care to share. Any advice, tips or insights would be appreciated.

Click to expand...

When people quote this verse hardly anyone speaks about the historical context of "the sheep's clothing" being an allusion to the sheep skin mantel worn by the prophet's of Israel as part of their traditional / cultural uniform for their ministry. Instead we reinterpret it according to our own tradition of having costumes for theater, carnivals etc. like a costume for a play, Halloween etc. But that little fact, I think has a lot of bearing on the modern Charismatic movement where a lot of energy has been spent trying to make being a prophet in the Old Testament sense of things a normal thing in Christianity today (It is a title etc. that is on their convention advertisements, books, business cards, personal web sites etc.)

and also, recognizing a false prophet is less a matter of noticing character faults in the person than it is in recognizing the uniqueness of his or her claims.

If they put an important part of the Bible into a light that hardly any Christian church ever before agreed to, you need to be instantly wary.

1rreducibly Complex said:

Matthew 7:15 - Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

...

1. How to identify false prophets.

2. What steps can we take to prevent being fooled by their lies.

In my experience, the type of person likely to be a false prophet delights in putting others down, in the flawed notion doing so lifts themselves higher. They love to negatively label and slander innocents.

They are more comfortable with lies, than truth. Lies come easy to them. While truth is difficult if not impossible for them to find.

They believe reducing the rights and freedoms of others paves the road to future progress and prosperity. Stripping women of the right to vote, stripping americans of the right to bear arms and similar movements which reduce opportunities and prosperity in the world are their favorite things. They are fanatically goal oriented in terms of finding ways for governments to assume greater power at the expense of overall rights, freedom and privacy.

They seek to control everyone and are chronically unable to control themselves.

They want money and power and to make all the important decisions. Then blame everyone except themselves if they make poor choices and are unhappy with the results.

They stand for nothing and fall for everything. They are fooled by every deception and support every horrible idea and terrible candidate who comes along. And lack the self awareness to realize it.

...

Long story short, have you had experiences with false prophets you would care to share. Any advice, tips or insights would be appreciated.

Click to expand...

In Deuteronomy 13:1-5, the way that God instructed His people to determine that someone is a false prophet who is not speaking for Him is if they taught against obeying the Mosaic Law.

1rreducibly Complex said:

Any advice, tips or insights would be appreciated.

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I have seen some stuff out of the Prophetic movement in the Charismatic movement that has caused me some concern. Overall though I have been more concerned with people who have things like Narcistic Personality Disorder and other kinds of related disorders taking advantage of certain Bible passages and Christian culture etc. I encountered 2 pastors who I think had an orientation like that in my past and it was very educational to say the least.

Help!, My Pastor is a Narcissist


For that I note a few things to beware of when dealing with such people even when you think you got them "dead to rights" these little tricks they do to bamboozle you.


1) People who call you to have strict accountability but kind of do whatever they want because they are "the shepherd", "have the anointing" etc. Our relationships including in the Church should be a two way streets and not one way streets where leadership is exempt because they are a special chosen person.


2) Motive Questioning to side step problems. In Philippians saint Paul said he was OK with people preaching the Gospel for selfish gain, or to get him in trouble with the authorities etc. because "at least the Gospel is being preached". Anyway Biblical truth is valuable no matter what the motivation but I point this out because of motive questioning as a cheap tactic to derail and distract you by such people.


3) The use of the "Go to your brother in Secret" gospel verse claimed when you are complaining about stuff they are doing in public! This is another cheap trick that can easily bamboozle someone confronting such folks for their very blatant and often open misdeeds if they are not prepared for it.


4) If you really got them locked in they will probably push your buttons if you are prone to empathy saying "That you judged them etc." and acting like they have severe hurt feelings etc. which will suck you in if you are Mercy gift etc. Be careful of this. It is best to not overplay or exaggerate any claims you make against, and be as professional as possible when you first deal with them. But beware, they can really pull at your heart strings and will use this as there last ditch attempt to put you under their thumb. (They however are not very smart, and will immediately gloat over such a victory which may help to wake you up that you were manipulated).

Albion said:

If they put an important part of the Bible into a light that hardly any Christian church ever before agreed to, you need to be instantly wary.

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Of the church or the important part of the Bible (like for example the Gospel of the Kingdom)?

timothyu said:

Of the church or the important part of the Bible (like for example the Gospel of the Kingdom)?

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Just what I wrote. If the false prophet's revelations are way out of line with historic Christianity, even accounting for the various church splits, then the alert observer should instantly be wary. I'm not referring to how many sacraments there are (7 or 2) or something like that.

But claiming to have found golden plates which tell of a totally different Christ doing things no one had known before...or a completely novel way of interpreting the events recorded in the Bible, like claiming that physical matter is an illusion...those raise red flags.

This won't identify every false prophet, but it may partially answer the question.

Well you could always try a different approach.

1. Assume everyone is a false prophet.
2. Identify the true prophets.

On second thought, maybe we shouldn't.

1rreducibly Complex said:

Matthew 7:15 - Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

...

1. How to identify false prophets.

2. What steps can we take to prevent being fooled by their lies.

In my experience, the type of person likely to be a false prophet delights in putting others down, in the flawed notion doing so lifts themselves higher. They love to negatively label and slander innocents.

They are more comfortable with lies, than truth. Lies come easy to them. While truth is difficult if not impossible for them to find.

They believe reducing the rights and freedoms of others paves the road to future progress and prosperity. Stripping women of the right to vote, stripping americans of the right to bear arms and similar movements which reduce opportunities and prosperity in the world are their favorite things. They are fanatically goal oriented in terms of finding ways for governments to assume greater power at the expense of overall rights, freedom and privacy.

They seek to control everyone and are chronically unable to control themselves.

They want money and power and to make all the important decisions. Then blame everyone except themselves if they make poor choices and are unhappy with the results.

They stand for nothing and fall for everything. They are fooled by every deception and support every horrible idea and terrible candidate who comes along. And lack the self awareness to realize it.

...

Long story short, have you had experiences with false prophets you would care to share. Any advice, tips or insights would be appreciated.

Click to expand...

If they are selling books or seeking out large crowds or Prophet believing churches then they are false.
In LOve
Jay Sea

1rreducibly Complex said:

Matthew 7:15 - Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

...

1. How to identify false prophets.

2. What steps can we take to prevent being fooled by their lies.

In my experience, the type of person likely to be a false prophet delights in putting others down, in the flawed notion doing so lifts themselves higher. They love to negatively label and slander innocents.

They are more comfortable with lies, than truth. Lies come easy to them. While truth is difficult if not impossible for them to find.

They believe reducing the rights and freedoms of others paves the road to future progress and prosperity. Stripping women of the right to vote, stripping americans of the right to bear arms and similar movements which reduce opportunities and prosperity in the world are their favorite things. They are fanatically goal oriented in terms of finding ways for governments to assume greater power at the expense of overall rights, freedom and privacy.

They seek to control everyone and are chronically unable to control themselves.

They want money and power and to make all the important decisions. Then blame everyone except themselves if they make poor choices and are unhappy with the results.

They stand for nothing and fall for everything. They are fooled by every deception and support every horrible idea and terrible candidate who comes along. And lack the self awareness to realize it.

...

Long story short, have you had experiences with false prophets you would care to share. Any advice, tips or insights would be appreciated.

Click to expand...

It seems like you are making false prophets primarily political. That's a mistake. The same mistake some prophetic people have made about their own ministries recently.

topher694 said:

It seems like you are making false prophets primarily political. That's a mistake. The same mistake some prophetic people have made about their own ministries recently.

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Didn't in scripture prophecy have political outcomes or intents. Surely politics is not outside the realm of G-d's prophets? Or the devils Prophets? Discernment is required not simply dismissing any realm that may be used for or against G-d or Man.
In LOve
Jay Sea

Jay Sea said:

Didn't in scripture prophecy have political outcomes or intents. Surely politics is not outside the realm of G-d's prophets? Or the devils Prophets? Discernment is required not simply dismissing any realm that may be used for or against G-d or Man.
In LOve
Jay Sea

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Sure, politics is within the realm of the prophetic, but the prophetic is much, much more than that, and politics is not the primary focus. When politics becomes the primary focus, typically bad things follow.

Albion said:

If the false prophet's revelations are way out of line with historic Christianity, even accounting for the various church splits, then the alert observer should instantly be wary.

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So for instance, thousands of years of ceremony and the blind leading the blind promoting tradition, would be considered more reliable?

Were not the last true prophets the Hebrew king makers of the OT? One could also say John the Baptist was the last as he proclaimed the last King we need.

timothyu said:

So for instance, thousands of years of ceremony and the blind leading the blind promoting tradition, would be considered more reliable?

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Not in my view. After all, if I said--which I did--that identifying which are the authentic, Bible-based sacraments is not enough, the manner in which the clergy dress during worship, gesture, and arrange the prayers isn't likely to be more critical, right?

Albion said:

the manner in which the clergy dress during worship, gesture, and arrange the prayers isn't likely to be more critical, right?

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Exactly because they follow a self identifying tradition designed to promote themselves as authoritative.

Isaiah 8:20. To the law and to the testimony! If they do not speak according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

Albion said:

and also, recognizing a false prophet is less a matter of noticing character faults in the person than it is in recognizing the uniqueness of his or her claims.

If they put an important part of the Bible into a light that hardly any Christian church ever before agreed to, you need to be instantly wary.

Click to expand...

Isaiah 8:20
To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

topher694 said:

Sure, politics is within the realm of the prophetic, but the prophetic is much, much more than that, and politics is not the primary focus. When politics becomes the primary focus, typically bad things follow.

Click to expand...

When I use the word politics I use it in the full sense of dealing with the life of the people as opposed to simply administrative function of government.
In LOve
Jay Sea

Albion said:

and also, recognizing a false prophet is less a matter of noticing character faults in the person than it is in recognizing the uniqueness of his or her claims.

If they put an important part of the Bible into a light that hardly any Christian church ever before agreed to, you need to be instantly wary.

Click to expand...

This is very true. This is, for example, why I reject the claims of some members that Ellen White was a prophet, because no one before her ever taught doctrines like the idea that Our Lord and Savior is St. Michael the Archangel, or spoke of the existence of an “investigative judgement”, or other beliefs which we do not see elsewhere in Christendom.