Sin...?

LoveGodsWord said:

Gentiles do not enter into Gods' Kingdom.

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Since Jesus, yes, we do.
Otherwise none of us would be here.

LoveGodsWord said:

Gentile believers on the other hand according to the scriptures are all those who believe and follow what Gods' Word says

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Gentiles are non Jews, full stop. That's what "Gentile" means; someone who is not Jewish.
In the OT, Hebrews, later known as Jews, were God's chosen because they had been saved from Egypt, given God's law and told how to live as his holy people. Anyone who had not been rescued from Egypt, did not believe there was only one God and did not have his law, was not in the faith, was not one of his people, was unclean and was called a "gentile" - non Jew.

The early church were astounded to discover that God cared for, spoke to and sent his Holy Spirit on Gentiles too. Gentiles Christians are those who have come to the faith from a non Jewish background, and are now God's people also.
The church is all believers - Jews, Gentiles, Catholics, Protestants etc. People who don't accept the Christian faith are unbelievers, or non Christians. People who don't accept the Jewish faith - which they believe to be the only faith - are still called Gentiles.

SabbathBlessings said:

I am very confused by your posts and having a hard time following what you stand for. One minute you say you keep the Sabbath, the next you seem to be arguing against the Sabbath

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I said that I keep A Sabbath, but I suspect it is not the Sabbath that you think I should keep.
I certainly have a day of rest - several of them, in fact. I also have a day on which I worship God - all of them, actually. And we meet for corporate worship on Sunday, the day of resurrection, when the author and perfecter of our faith was raised from the dead.
I suspect you don't agree with this, though.

I am trying to understand and, yes, challenge, what folks mean by keeping the Sabbath.
This is not a Sabbath thread, it is a thread about sin. But there have been many threads on the Sabbath which, it seems to me, can be summed up as, "you must spend Saturdays doing nothing except worshipping God."

THAT is what I am challenging.
Firstly because "Saturday" is not a Biblical word. "Saturday" was named after the planet and a Roman God; it is Saturn's day.
Secondly, God DID create all the days; there is no day that, alone, belongs to him - as Scripture says "THIS is the day that the Lord has made". I hope all Christians would say that they live for God, seek his will and worship him every day, not just one.
Thirdly, there are many people who work on a Saturday, and who have to - nurses, medics, care assistants, fire fighters, the police, charity workers etc etc. The Lord knows they work, and serve him, on a Saturday, and it is not a sin to do so.
Fourthly, Jesus healed on the Sabbath and also allowed his disciples to walk through a cornfield, picking and eating the corn. He was criticised for both, yet he never sinned. He taught that he is Lord of the Sabbath and that the Sabbath is made for man. As you have already agreed, God gave us one day on which to rest, refresh and recharge our batteries and to remember him. Many people do just that - but not necessarily on a Saturday.
Fifthly, Paul says that whatever work we do we should remember that we are doing it for the Lord, Colossians 3:17, Colossians 3:23. Whatever we do and whenever we do it, if we are Christians, we are doing it for God and in his name. We still need one day out when we can relax and recharge, but in a very real sense, we are serving and worshipping in our work - the work that God has given us to do.

I suspect that you will say that these are all excuses and I am "trying to get out of" keeping the Sabbath. Maybe I'm not keeping it as YOU would want me to, but that doesn't mean that I am sinning or not honouring God.

SabbathBlessings said:

Making all days equal makes the Sabbath just any other day which is not what scripture says.

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It's not what the OT says.
Are you saying that only one day belongs to God; that on the other days we can live for ourselves, do as we please, and he is only worthy of our time and worship on one day of the week?

SabbathBlessings said:

When someone really understands the sacredness of God’s holy day advocating against is not typical.

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So you don't believe that ALL days are created by the Lord, given to us by the Lord and that he wants us to worship him, and live holy lives, on those days too?
Today is Monday - yet I will still honour and serve our holy God today, as I do every day. How about you?

SabbathBlessings said:

Jesus tells us those who keep traditions (which is Sunday worship)

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That is an interpretation - neither "Sunday" nor "Saturday" are mentioned in Scripture.

SabbathBlessings said:

There is no commandment to keep Sunday holy but there is for the seventh day. Matthew 15:3-9.

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I wasn't aware that we needed a command to worship God and celebrate the day of the week that he raised his Son from the dead.
If he had not done that, we would have no faith - unless we were Jews.
God showed that Jesus was who he said he was by raising him from the dead - why should we not honour him, celebrate him and worship him as holy?

Back in the OT there was no concept that God was with us, and IN us, all the time. They were given special days on which to worship the Lord so that they didn't forget everything that he had done for them. Look at all the feast days and festivals given to commemorate the exodus, or some part of it. Then there was Purim, to celebrate God's deliverance of the Jews through Esther.
In the NT, Paul says that the man who considers that only one day is special, does so for the Lord; and those who consider all days are alike, do so for the Lord, Romans 14:5-6. Each should be convinced in their own minds, for we all belong to the Lord.
So a person who says that God created all days, and that we can rest, worship him and serve him on any day, is no worse, or worse off, than someone who says "we HAVE to keep only one day as special."

SabbathBlessings said:

God’s holy laws seem pretty universal to me

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Again, how do you define the law?
If you are talking only about the 10 commandments, fair enough. But how can you single those out from everything else written in Exodus and Leviticus? God's people were told not to eat pork - yet that isn't in the 10 commandments. Neither are the laws about not touching dead people, or offering animal sacrifices - yet all of these appear in the OT as laws given by God.

SabbathBlessings said:

You made an accusation that I pick and choose which laws I keep.

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No, I ASKED you which laws you keep.
I am trying to get someone to explain to me what they mean by "the law" - just the 10 commandments or everything in Leviticus? To me, if someone talks about God's commands give at Sinai, that should mean ALL of them - stoning someone who doesn't keep the Sabbath is his command just as much as keeping the Sabbath is his command. Offering animals as sacrifices is his command also - yet even the Jews don't do that today, and we, who have Jesus, certainly don't.

SabbathBlessings said:

I follow scripture and whatever is God’s will I will follow.

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Well if you keep ALL the commands written in Leviticus, God's word; I admire your consistency.
Even the Jews don't keep all those today, and there is certainly no law that Christians have to.

SabbathBlessings said:

We know the Sabbath is not every going to change from being Gods holy day because there is no scripture stating this,

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Why does there need to be?
There are many things that Scripture does NOT say - like celebrating the incarnation, the day on which Jesus was raised or Pentecost. Scripture does not say that we should have certain jobs, live in a certain place, go to a certain church, marry/not marry. Scripture does not say that we can use computers to spread the Gospel, or use power-point slides/photographs to worship God. Scripture does not say that we have to go into a building, that we call a church, one day a week in order to worship God and express our faith.
There is no command in Scripture to do any of these things; that does not mean it is wrong to do so.

SabbathBlessings said:

God changes not and I believe and have faith that what God hand wrote for us on stone now in our hearts is meant to be eternal.

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Great.
If you are convinced in your heart that it is right for you to keep the Sabbath - whatever that means to you; go ahead.
Just don't imply that those who don't share your conviction and who believe that ALL days are the Lord's days, are wrong, sinful or somehow bad Christians. (I'm not saying that you said that; but some do.)

Strong in Him said:

Since Jesus, yes, we do. Otherwise none of us would be here.Gentiles are non Jews, full stop. That's what "Gentile" means; someone who is not Jewish. In the OT, Hebrews, later known as Jews, were God's chosen because they had been saved from Egypt, given God's law and told how to live as his holy people. Anyone who had not been rescued from Egypt, did not believe there was only one God and did not have his law, was not in the faith, was not one of his people, was unclean and was called a "gentile" - non Jew. The early church were astounded to discover that God cared for, spoke to and sent his Holy Spirit on Gentiles too. Gentiles Christians are those who have come to the faith from a non Jewish background, and are now God's people also. The church is all believers - Jews, Gentiles, Catholics, Protestants etc. People who don't accept the Christian faith are unbelievers, or non Christians. People who don't accept the Jewish faith - which they believe to be the only faith - are still called Gentiles.

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Believing gentiles are no longer Gentiles, they are grafted into Gods true Israel (Romans 11:13-27) under the new covenant (Hebrews 8:10-12 from Jeremiah 31:31-34 and Ezekiel 36:24-27). Did you read the post you are responding to and the scriptures provided there in post # 257 linked? We are in the new covenant now not the old covenant. God's Israel is no longer all those born of the flesh of the seen of Abraham, but are now all those who are born of the Spirit to believe and follow Gods' Word *Romans 9:6-8; Galatians 3:27-28; Romans 2:28-29. If you are not a part of Gods' Israel in the new covenant we have no part in Gods' new covenant promise which God gave specifically to Israel *see Hebrews 8:10-12 from Jeremiah 31:31-34 and Ezekiel 36:24-27. There are no more Jews and Gentiles born of the flesh. All are one in Christ's Israel born of the Spirit of God through faith in Gods 'Word under the new covenant *Ephesians 2:11-13. As posted earlier, God did not make the new covenant with Gentiles.

Take care.

LoveGodsWord said:

Believing gentiles are no longer Gentiles

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The word Gentile still means anyone who isn't a Jew. To the Jews we are all Gentiles.

We, who are non Jews, don't usually call ourselves Gentiles - as we are non Jews the word means nothing to us. We are believers in the Lord Jesus and Christians - and also God's children.

When we talk about our faith we don't talk about Jews and Gentiles, but about Christians and non Christians.

LoveGodsword: "According to the scriptures if we break anyone of God's 10 commandments we are guilty of breaking all of them according to James 2:10-11"




You do realize LoveGodsword, every time you speak about the Sabbath ( in defense of the Sabbath and your religion based on the keeping of it) you use verses that do not say what you say, and not only is Sabbath missing from every reminder of what laws the Gentiles are to keep in Christs law, there is reminder of specific laws, such as coveting, lieing, stealing, adultery, obey mother and father, idolatry, blasphemy.

Another evidence is, all the laws, the lawless do predicted for the end of the world, contain all of the laws we are told in the new testament ( as Gentiles grafted into Israel in one new man of liberty and faith in the law of Christ) but, all that the wicked do, who pretend to hold belief in Christ in this ending time, never is Sabbath abuse taught as an offence the evil ones through the devil practice wrong.

Here are the ten for us to remember I guess..

• I am the Lord thy God: thou shalt not have strange Gods before me
• Thou shall not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain
• Remember to keep holy the Lord's Day
• Honour thy father and thy mother
• Thou shalt not kill
• Thou shalt not commit adultery
• Thou shalt not steal
• Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour
• Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's wife
• Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's goods

Here are two examples, of people, with a form of Godliness, in this ending time, and what wrongs they do, notice, as I said, the evidence proves, Sabbath breaking is not listed as one of the offences, so why do you insist it is LoveGodsword?

Fornication/covet neighbours wife is, not commit adultery is, coveteousness/covet neighbours goods is, to not honour father and mother is, to not kill/murder is, to take the Lords name in vain/haters of God is, covenant breakers/having other Gods before the Lord is, bearing false witness against neighbour is/ inventers of evil things.

Are can be found in the first example of Romans 1, but where s anything about Sabbath breaking?


Romans 1:29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:



Repeated in 2 Timothy, coveting, disobedient to parents, covenant brerakers, false/bearing false witness, lovers of other than God/having other Gods before the Lord ( idols) but it is entirely the same always, Sabbath breaking is never witnessed as an offence done by people in the end of the world..


2 Timothy 3:2 For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,
3 Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good,
4 Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.





If it comes under a remember of what the works of the flesh are, we would know that Sabbath breaking is wrong, you quote Romans yourself, and James, they do not contain sabbath either, Romans 13 contains:

Not do adultery,
Not kill,
Not steal,
Not bear false witness,
Not covet.

The other commandment must then include loving our neighbour as ourselves, which again is exactly what James teaches, and then not only Sabbath keeping is not listed as a commandment to be kept, it is not witnessed as a commandment of offence the ones who blaspheme Gods name now, at the end of the world, are doing.


Romans 13:9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.



James 2, is the royal law ( to the law of Christ to bear one anothers BURDENS)

To love our neighbour as ourselves, and love is not done by adultery, or killing, it is done by laying our lives down for the brothers, and not taking off of them what thy love the most ( their wife)

That separates law keeping, and faith in righteousness, as Sabbath keeping is not an act of love to bear your neighbours burdens, which is the faith of Christ, even as He did every day until the death, which example we follow..

James 2:8 If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well:
9 But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors.
10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.
11 For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.
12 So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.
13 For he shall have judgment without mercy, that hath shewed no mercy; and mercy rejoiceth against judgment.


As we see, we are without law, ( Sabbath was law) but we are under the law to Christ, and you will struggle hard to find Christ supporting Sabbath keeping, as the Pharisees tried to do that onto Christ, and He opposed them entirely ( as they are the faithless law keepers as we are taught, exampled and all know in the whole world)..


Galatians 6:2 Bear ye one another's burdens, and so fulfil the law of Christ.

1 Corinthians 9:21 To them that are without law, as without law, (being not without law to God, but under the law to Christ,) that I might gain them that are without law.

prophecy_uk said:

LoveGodsword: "According to the scriptures if we break anyone of God's 10 commandments we are guilty of breaking all of them according to James 2:10-11"




You do realize LoveGodsword, every time you speak about the Sabbath ( in defense of the Sabbath and your religion based on the keeping of it) you use verses that do not say what you say, and not only is Sabbath missing from every reminder of what laws the Gentiles are to keep in Christs law, there is reminder of specific laws, such as coveting, lieing, stealing, adultery, obey mother and father, idolatry, blasphemy.

Another evidence is, all the laws, the lawless do predicted for the end of the world, contain all of the laws we are told in the new testament ( as Gentiles grafted into Israel in one new man of liberty and faith in the law of Christ) but, all that the wicked do, who pretend to hold belief in Christ in this ending time, never is Sabbath abuse taught as an offence the evil ones through the devil practice wrong.

Here are the ten for us to remember I guess..

• I am the Lord thy God: thou shalt not have strange Gods before me
• Thou shall not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain
• Remember to keep holy the Lord's Day
• Honour thy father and thy mother
• Thou shalt not kill
• Thou shalt not commit adultery
• Thou shalt not steal
• Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour
• Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's wife
• Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's goods

Here are two examples, of people, with a form of Godliness, in this ending time, and what wrongs they do, notice, as I said, the evidence proves, Sabbath breaking is not listed as one of the offences, so why do you insist it is LoveGodsword?

Fornication/covet neighbours wife is, not commit adultery is, coveteousness/covet neighbours goods is, to not honour father and mother is, to not kill/murder is, to take the Lords name in vain/haters of God is, covenant breakers/having other Gods before the Lord is, bearing false witness against neighbour is/ inventers of evil things.

Are can be found in the first example of Romans 1, but where s anything about Sabbath breaking?


Romans 1:29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:



Repeated in 2 Timothy, coveting, disobedient to parents, covenant brerakers, false/bearing false witness, lovers of other than God/having other Gods before the Lord ( idols) but it is entirely the same always, Sabbath breaking is never witnessed as an offence done by people in the end of the world..


2 Timothy 3:2 For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,
3 Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good,
4 Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.





If it comes under a remember of what the works of the flesh are, we would know that Sabbath breaking is wrong, you quote Romans yourself, and James, they do not contain sabbath either, Romans 13 contains:

Not do adultery,
Not kill,
Not steal,
Not bear false witness,
Not covet.

The other commandment must then include loving our neighbour as ourselves, which again is exactly what James teaches, and then not only Sabbath keeping is not listed as a commandment to be kept, it is not witnessed as a commandment of offence the ones who blaspheme Gods name now, at the end of the world, are doing.


Romans 13:9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.



James 2, is the royal law ( to the law of Christ to bear one anothers BURDENS)

To love our neighbour as ourselves, and love is not done by adultery, or killing, it is done by laying our lives down for the brothers, and not taking off of them what thy love the most ( their wife)

That separates law keeping, and faith in righteousness, as Sabbath keeping is not an act of love to bear your neighbours burdens, which is the faith of Christ, even as He did every day until the death, which example we follow..

James 2:8 If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well:
9 But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors.
10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.
11 For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.
12 So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.
13 For he shall have judgment without mercy, that hath shewed no mercy; and mercy rejoiceth against judgment.


As we see, we are without law, ( Sabbath was law) but we are under the law to Christ, and you will struggle hard to find Christ supporting Sabbath keeping, as the Pharisees tried to do that onto Christ, and He opposed them entirely ( as they are the faithless law keepers as we are taught, exampled and all know in the whole world)..


Galatians 6:2 Bear ye one another's burdens, and so fulfil the law of Christ.

1 Corinthians 9:21 To them that are without law, as without law, (being not without law to God, but under the law to Christ,) that I might gain them that are without law.

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It seems like you are okay with the Ten Commandments as long as it agrees with your will and not God’s will.

The set of the Ten Commandments you quoted did not come from God. Those are the Catholic Ten Commandments that was altered despite God telling us to not change one Word. Proverbs 30:5-6

These are God’s Ten Commandments that He not only spoke He wrote with His own hand and stored in the ark of the Covenant in His Holy Temple.

3 “You shall have no other gods before Me.
4 “You shall not make for yourself a carved image—any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that isin the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; 5 you shall not bow down to them nor serve them. For I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children to the third and fourth generations of those who hate Me, 6 but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments.
7 “You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain, for the Lord will not hold him guiltless who takes His name in vain.
8 “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates. 11 For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it.
12 “Honor your father and your mother, that your days may be long upon the land which the Lord your God is giving you.
13 “You shall not murder.
14 “You shall not commit adultery.
15 “You shall not steal.
16 “You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.
17 “You shall not covet your neighbor’s house; you shall not covet your neighbor’s wife, nor his male servant, nor his female servant, nor his ox, nor his donkey, nor anything that is your neighbor’s.”

Unless you think the pope can save you, I would suggest following the Creator and the not creation.

Strong in Him said:

The word Gentile still means anyone who isn't a Jew. To the Jews we are all Gentiles. We, who are non Jews, don't usually call ourselves Gentiles - as we are non Jews the word means nothing to us. We are believers in the Lord Jesus and Christians - and also God's children. When we talk about our faith we don't talk about Jews and Gentiles, but about Christians and non Christians.

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The scriptures do not agree with you here SIH. As posted earlier according to the scriptures, believing gentiles are no longer Gentiles they are grafted into Gods true Israel (Romans 11:13-27) under the new covenant (Hebrews 8:10-12 from Jeremiah 31:31-34 and Ezekiel 36:24-27). Did you read the post you are responding to and the scriptures provided there in post # 257 linked? We are in the new covenant now not the old covenant. God's Israel is no longer all those born of the flesh of the seen of Abraham, but are now all those who are born of the Spirit to believe and follow Gods' Word *Romans 9:6-8; Galatians 3:27-28; Romans 2:28-29. If you are not are not a part of Gods' Israel in the new covenant you have no part in Gods' new covenant promise which God give to Israel *Hebrews 8:10-12 from Jeremiah 31:31-34 and Ezekiel 36:24-27. There are no more Jews and Gentiles . All are one in Christ under the new covenant *Ephesians 2:11-13. As posted earlier, God did not make the new covenant with Gentiles.

Take care.

Strong in Him said:

I said that I keep A Sabbath, but I suspect it is not the Sabbath that you think I should keep.
I certainly have a day of rest - several of them, in fact. I also have a day on which I worship God - all of them, actually. And we meet for corporate worship on Sunday, the day of resurrection, when the author and perfecter of our faith was raised from the dead.
I suspect you don't agree with this, though.

I am trying to understand and, yes, challenge, what folks mean by keeping the Sabbath.
This is not a Sabbath thread, it is a thread about sin. But there have been many threads on the Sabbath which, it seems to me, can be summed up as, "you must spend Saturdays doing nothing except worshipping God."

THAT is what I am challenging.
Firstly because "Saturday" is not a Biblical word. "Saturday" was named after the planet and a Roman God; it is Saturn's day.
Secondly, God DID create all the days; there is no day that, alone, belongs to him - as Scripture says "THIS is the day that the Lord has made". I hope all Christians would say that they live for God, seek his will and worship him every day, not just one.
Thirdly, there are many people who work on a Saturday, and who have to - nurses, medics, care assistants, fire fighters, the police, charity workers etc etc. The Lord knows they work, and serve him, on a Saturday, and it is not a sin to do so.
Fourthly, Jesus healed on the Sabbath and also allowed his disciples to walk through a cornfield, picking and eating the corn. He was criticised for both, yet he never sinned. He taught that he is Lord of the Sabbath and that the Sabbath is made for man. As you have already agreed, God gave us one day on which to rest, refresh and recharge our batteries and to remember him. Many people do just that - but not necessarily on a Saturday.
Fifthly, Paul says that whatever work we do we should remember that we are doing it for the Lord, Colossians 3:17, Colossians 3:23. Whatever we do and whenever we do it, if we are Christians, we are doing it for God and in his name. We still need one day out when we can relax and recharge, but in a very real sense, we are serving and worshipping in our work - the work that God has given us to do.

I suspect that you will say that these are all excuses and I am "trying to get out of" keeping the Sabbath. Maybe I'm not keeping it as YOU would want me to, but that doesn't mean that I am sinning or not honouring God.



It's not what the OT says.
Are you saying that only one day belongs to God; that on the other days we can live for ourselves, do as we please, and he is only worthy of our time and worship on one day of the week?



So you don't believe that ALL days are created by the Lord, given to us by the Lord and that he wants us to worship him, and live holy lives, on those days too?
Today is Monday - yet I will still honour and serve our holy God today, as I do every day. How about you?



That is an interpretation - neither "Sunday" nor "Saturday" are mentioned in Scripture.



I wasn't aware that we needed a command to worship God and celebrate the day of the week that he raised his Son from the dead.
If he had not done that, we would have no faith - unless we were Jews.
God showed that Jesus was who he said he was by raising him from the dead - why should we not honour him, celebrate him and worship him as holy?

Back in the OT there was no concept that God was with us, and IN us, all the time. They were given special days on which to worship the Lord so that they didn't forget everything that he had done for them. Look at all the feast days and festivals given to commemorate the exodus, or some part of it. Then there was Purim, to celebrate God's deliverance of the Jews through Esther.
In the NT, Paul says that the man who considers that only one day is special, does so for the Lord; and those who consider all days are alike, do so for the Lord, Romans 14:5-6. Each should be convinced in their own minds, for we all belong to the Lord.
So a person who says that God created all days, and that we can rest, worship him and serve him on any day, is no worse, or worse off, than someone who says "we HAVE to keep only one day as special."



Again, how do you define the law?
If you are talking only about the 10 commandments, fair enough. But how can you single those out from everything else written in Exodus and Leviticus? God's people were told not to eat pork - yet that isn't in the 10 commandments. Neither are the laws about not touching dead people, or offering animal sacrifices - yet all of these appear in the OT as laws given by God.



No, I ASKED you which laws you keep.
I am trying to get someone to explain to me what they mean by "the law" - just the 10 commandments or everything in Leviticus? To me, if someone talks about God's commands give at Sinai, that should mean ALL of them - stoning someone who doesn't keep the Sabbath is his command just as much as keeping the Sabbath is his command. Offering animals as sacrifices is his command also - yet even the Jews don't do that today, and we, who have Jesus, certainly don't.



Well if you keep ALL the commands written in Leviticus, God's word; I admire your consistency.
Even the Jews don't keep all those today, and there is certainly no law that Christians have to.



Why does there need to be?
There are many things that Scripture does NOT say - like celebrating the incarnation, the day on which Jesus was raised or Pentecost. Scripture does not say that we should have certain jobs, live in a certain place, go to a certain church, marry/not marry. Scripture does not say that we can use computers to spread the Gospel, or use power-point slides/photographs to worship God. Scripture does not say that we have to go into a building, that we call a church, one day a week in order to worship God and express our faith.
There is no command in Scripture to do any of these things; that does not mean it is wrong to do so.



Great.
If you are convinced in your heart that it is right for you to keep the Sabbath - whatever that means to you; go ahead.
Just don't imply that those who don't share your conviction and who believe that ALL days are the Lord's days, are wrong, sinful or somehow bad Christians. (I'm not saying that you said that; but some do.)

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Perhaps another read at the 4th commandment would help if you are going to reference it should be followed as God instructed.

Exodus 20:8 “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates. 11 For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it.

If you read this very easy to read commandment written by our Creator you can see it’s not a Sabbath day we are to keep holy. There is only one day that is the Sabbath and according to God and it is the seventh day. It’s not a multiple choice.

Just like the week at Creation. God worked six days and stopped working, just like He commanded us on the seventh day because that is the holy day of the Lord thy God.

Genesis 2:1 Thus the heavens and the earth, and all the host of them, were finished. 2 And on the seventh day God ended His work which He had done, and He rested on the seventh day from all His work which He had done. 3 Then God blessed the seventh day and sanctified it, because in it He rested from all His work which God had created and made.

You’re argument is with the scripture.

God bless

prophecy_uk said:

You do realize LoveGodsword, every time you speak about the Sabbath ( in defense of the Sabbath and your religion based on the keeping of it) you use verses that do not say what you say, and not only is Sabbath missing from every reminder of what laws the Gentiles are to keep in Christs law, there is reminder of specific laws, such as coveting, lieing, stealing, adultery, obey mother and father, idolatry, blasphemy. Another evidence is, all the laws, the lawless do predicted for the end of the world, contain all of the laws we are told in the new testament ( as Gentiles grafted into Israel in one new man of liberty and faith in the law of Christ) but, all that the wicked do, who pretend to hold belief in Christ in this ending time, never is Sabbath abuse taught as an offence the evil ones through the devil practice wrong.

Here are the ten for us to remember I guess..

• I am the Lord thy God: thou shalt not have strange Gods before me
• Thou shall not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain
• Remember to keep holy the Lord's Day
• Honour thy father and thy mother
• Thou shalt not kill
• Thou shalt not commit adultery
• Thou shalt not steal
• Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour
• Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's wife
• Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's goods

Actually no the bible says no such thing. You may want to read Exodus 20:3-17 for yourself.

Here are two examples, of people, with a form of Godliness, in this ending time, and what wrongs they do, notice, as I said, the evidence proves, Sabbath breaking is not listed as one of the offences, so why do you insist it is LoveGodsword?


Fornication/covet neighbours wife is, not commit adultery is, coveteousness/covet neighbours goods is, to not honour father and mother is, to not kill/murder is, to take the Lords name in vain/haters of God is, covenant breakers/having other Gods before the Lord is, bearing false witness against neighbour is/ inventers of evil things.

Are can be found in the first example of Romans 1, but where s anything about Sabbath breaking?


Romans 1:29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:

Repeated in 2 Timothy, coveting, disobedient to parents, covenant brerakers, false/bearing false witness, lovers of other than God/having other Gods before the Lord ( idols) but it is entirely the same always, Sabbath breaking is never witnessed as an offence done by people in the end of the world..


2 Timothy 3:2 For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,
3 Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good,
4 Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.


If it comes under a remember of what the works of the flesh are, we would know that Sabbath breaking is wrong, you quote Romans yourself, and James, they do not contain sabbath either, Romans 13 contains:

Not do adultery,
Not kill,
Not steal,
Not bear false witness,
Not covet.

The other commandment must then include loving our neighbour as ourselves, which again is exactly what James teaches, and then not only Sabbath keeping is not listed as a commandment to be kept, it is not witnessed as a commandment of offence the ones who blaspheme Gods name now, at the end of the world, are doing.


Romans 13:9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

James 2, is the royal law ( to the law of Christ to bear one anothers BURDENS)

To love our neighbour as ourselves, and love is not done by adultery, or killing, it is done by laying our lives down for the brothers, and not taking off of them what thy love the most ( their wife)

That separates law keeping, and faith in righteousness, as Sabbath keeping is not an act of love to bear your neighbours burdens, which is the faith of Christ, even as He did every day until the death, which example we follow..

James 2:8 If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well:
9 But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors.
10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.
11 For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.
12 So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.
13 For he shall have judgment without mercy, that hath shewed no mercy; and mercy rejoiceth against judgment.


As we see, we are without law, ( Sabbath was law) but we are under the law to Christ, and you will struggle hard to find Christ supporting Sabbath keeping, as the Pharisees tried to do that onto Christ, and He opposed them entirely ( as they are the faithless law keepers as we are taught, exampled and all know in the whole world)..


Galatians 6:2 Bear ye one another's burdens, and so fulfil the law of Christ.

1 Corinthians 9:21 To them that are without law, as without law, (being not without law to God, but under the law to Christ,) that I might gain them that are without law.

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According to the scriptures no one can claim to know Christ and hold belief in Christ if they deny His Word and break Gods' commandments, because sin, defined in the scriptures as breaking anyone of Gods' 10 commandments and not believing and following Gods' Word *James 2:10-11; Romans 14:23 and not breaking Gods' commandments is the difference between the children of God and the children of the devil according to John in 1 John 3:4-10. Therefore we do not fulfill God's law by breaking God's law, this is a false teaching and not biblical. According to John those who claim to know God while breaking Gods' commandments are lying and the truth is not in them according to 1 John 2:3-4.

You have only been provided Gods' Word which are not my words but Gods' that you seem to deny with your words that are not God's. What is it that you disagree with in the scriptures that were posted and shared with you in post # 251 linked? As posted to someone else, according to the scriptures in the new covenant, God's 10 commandments have the same role they always had and that is to give us the knowledge of good (moral right doing) and evil (moral wrong doing); sin (moral right doing) and righteousness (moral right doing) *Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4; Psalms 119:172 and if we break anyone of them according to James we stand guilty before God of sin in James 2:10-11. According to the new covenant scriptures, everyone of Gods' 10 commandments are repeated in the new covenant as a requirement for christian living (scripture support here linked).

According to the new covenant scriptures Gentile believers are all those who believe and follow what Gods' Word says so they are not exempt from needing to believe and follow what Gods' Word says. They are believers because they believe and follow what Gods' Word says (faith) and have been grafted in to Gods' true ISRAEL who are defined in the new covenant scriptures as all those who believe and follow Gods' Word *Romans 9:6-8; Galatians 3:27-28; Romans 2:28-29. If we are not apart of Gods' ISRAEL in the new covenant we have no part in Gods' new covenant promise *Hebrews 8:10-12 from Jeremiah 31:31-34 and Ezekiel 36:24-27. Gentile believers are now grafted in because they believe and follow what Gods' Word says *Romans 11:13-27 and we are now all one in Christ *Ephesians 2:11-14; Galatians 3:28 (more scripture support here linked). Your posts are promoting a false doctrine of lawlessness (without law) which is not biblical or supported in the scriptures.

Take Care.

SabbathBlessings said:

You’re argument is with the scripture.

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I wasn't arguing, I was asking you, or someone, to explain:
a) what is meant by the law; all commandments written in Leviticus or only the 10? and
b) practically speaking, how do I keep the Sabbath - when I don't work, and believe every day is a day which God has given me to worship and serve him? If you're saying that Scripture says I HAVE to sit around all day doing nothing on a Saturday; I disagree.

As noted previously in these discussions, no one seems to want to answer this.
There was also no answer to the Scripture that I gave from Romans, saying whether a person considers one day to be special, or all days; we all do so for the Lord.

Strong in Him said:

I wasn't arguing, I was asking you, or someone, to explain:
a) what is meant by the law; all commandments written in Leviticus or only the 10? and
b) practically speaking, how do I keep the Sabbath - when I don't work, and believe every day is a day which God has given me to worship and serve him? If you're saying that Scripture says I HAVE to sit around all day doing nothing on a Saturday; I disagree.

As noted previously in these discussions, no one seems to want to answer this.
There was also no answer to the Scripture that I gave from Romans, saying whether a person considers one day to be special, or all days; we all do so for the Lord.

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I will be happy to answer these questions, give me a few need to run some errands will answer a little later….stay tuned…

LoveGodsWord said:

The scriptures do not agree with you. As posted earlier according to the scriptures, believing gentiles are no longer Gentiles they are grafted into Gods true Israel (Romans 11:13-27) under the new covenant (Hebrews 8:10-12 from Jeremiah 31:31-34 and Ezekiel 36:24-27). Did you read the post you are responding to and the scriptures provided there in post # 257 linked? We are in the new covenant now not the old covenant. God's Israel is no longer all those born of the flesh of the seen of Abraham, but are now all those who are born of the Spirit to believe and follow Gods' Word *Romans 9:6-8; Galatians 3:27-28; Romans 2:28-29. If you are not are not a part of Gods' Israel in the new covenant you have no part in Gods' new covenant promise which God give to Israel *Hebrews 8:10-12 from Jeremiah 31:31-34 and Ezekiel 36:24-27. There are no more Jews and Gentiles . All are one in Christ under the new covenant *Ephesians 2:11-13. As posted earlier, God did not make the new covenant with Gentiles.

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I've no idea what this argument's about; nor do I really care.
A Gentile is a non Jew and always has been.

The Jews believed they alone were God's people and Gentiles were unclean and outside of the Covenant. But after Jesus came, Gentiles, who were previously not God's people, were included together with Jews, who were God's people, into a new family and both are God's people, Ephesians 2:13; Ephesians 2:19-21; Acts of the Apostles 15:14.

I know that I am in the New Covenant - and I am a Gentile, because I'm not a Jew.

Strong in Him said:

I've no idea what this argument's about; nor do I really care.
A Gentile is a non Jew and always has been.

The Jews believed they alone were God's people and Gentiles were unclean and outside of the Covenant. But after Jesus came, Gentiles, who were previously not God's people, were included together with Jews, who were God's people, into a new family and both are God's people, Ephesians 2:13; Ephesians 2:19-21; Acts of the Apostles 15:14.

I know that I am in the New Covenant - and I am a Gentile, because I'm not a Jew.

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If you prayerfully take the time to read the posts and the scriptures shared, you will see that in the new covenant there is no more Jewish and Gentile believers born of the flesh in Gods' true Israel as all believers are now one in Christ. God's true Israel therefore is no longer all those born of the flesh of the seed of Abraham, but are now all those who through faith are born of the Spirit to believe and follow Gods' Word *Romans 9:6-8; Galatians 3:27-28; Romans 2:28-29. If you are not a part of Gods' Israel in the new covenant you have no part in Gods' new covenant promise which God gave to Israel *Hebrews 8:10-12 from Jeremiah 31:31-34 and Ezekiel 36:24-27, who in the new covenant is simply all those who how believe and follow God's Word. There are no more Jews and Gentiles . All are one in Christ under the new covenant *Ephesians 2:11-13. As posted earlier, God did not make the new covenant with Gentiles. In the new covenant a Jew is no longer those outwardly born of the flesh; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: but he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God (Romans 3:28-29).

Take care.

Here is for you SabbathBlessings, and LoveGodsword.


Do you remember you pointed out that Jesus and Apostle Paul went to the house of God, and reasoned on the Sabbath days with the Jews......


Luke 4:31 And came down to Capernaum, a city of Galilee, and taught them on the sabbath days.

Acts 17:2 And Paul, as his manner was, went in unto them, and three sabbath days reasoned with them out of the scriptures,




Now, focus, here is not as false interpretation, as you say it is.

God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it, rested from all His work, ( that is Jesus Christ resting who created all)

The law tells us, to remember the Sabbath day, to keep it HOLY.


Six days men ought to work, and men are to not do any work, on the day that the Lord hallowed ( made Holy and sanctified)

The Synagogue ruler, spoke against Christ, how the work that was done was against the commandment, as there are six days, in which men ought to work.

Jesus did answer how even they release animals on the Sabbath, and how Jesus is releasing people under bonds to satan on the Sabbath.

The ruler of the Synagogue did not understand, those are the works of God, that no other man did on earth, ( this is the Son of man/the Son of God) and He brought judgment to the earth, and spoke to them so they now had sin, for unbelief in seeing the works of God before their eyes..



Genesis 2:3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

Exodus 20:8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the Lord thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:
11 For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the Lord blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

Luke 13:14 And the ruler of the synagogue answered with indignation, because that Jesus had healed on the sabbath day, and said unto the people, There are six days in which men ought to work: in them therefore come and be healed, and not on the sabbath day.

John 15:24 If I had not done among them the works which none other man did, they had not had sin: but now have they both seen and hated both me and my Father.




SabbathBlessings and LoveGodsword, I said to focus, as this testimony is precisely for yourselves.

Jesus did the miracles in front of Israel, the ruler of the Synagogue spoke with indignation against thew Son of God. Why? Because he had authority over people, and Jesus was taking his authority away, and all they felt was envy towards Christ, and it is why they delivered Him. The Synagogue ruler was rebuked, who accepts rebuke but the children of God?

So though Jesus had done many miracles among them, they believed not on Him, the arm of the Lord was not revealed, their eyes were blinded by God, and their hearts hardened too, but many believed on Him anyway ( in a way a man can without the Spirit) but because of the Pharisees ( and rulers of the Synagoue) they did not confess Christ, or be put out of the Synagogue.

It is the same for people in man made religions, they confess Christ in truth ( in the Spirit of truth) , and they must leave that worldly church ( because the acknowledging of the truth is after godliness, and the question then is, do you love the praise of men more, or the praise of God...........



John 12:37 But though he had done so many miracles before them, yet they believed not on him:
38 That the saying of Esaias the prophet might be fulfilled, which he spake, Lord, who hath believed our report? and to whom hath the arm of the Lord been revealed?
39 Therefore they could not believe, because that Esaias said again,
40 He hath blinded their eyes, and hardened their heart; that they should not see with their eyes, nor understand with their heart, and be converted, and I should heal them.
41 These things said Esaias, when he saw his glory, and spake of him.
42 Nevertheless among the chief rulers also many believed on him; but because of the Pharisees they did not confess him, lest they should be put out of the synagogue:
43 For they loved the praise of men more than the praise of God.

Titus 1:1 Paul, a servant of God, and an apostle of Jesus Christ, according to the faith of God's elect, and the acknowledging of the truth which is after godliness

Mark 15:10 For he knew that the chief priests had delivered him for envy.





The Sabbath is to not do our own pleasure, Jesus did none of His own pleasure on all days, this is to be anointed of the Holy Ghost ( as we are anointed of the Holy Ghost when we believe too)

Jesus spoke whose words every day?

Did Jesus do His ways on six days, and on a seventh day do the Lords pleasure?

No it is testified, He did always the things that please the Father, and spoke the Fathers words. ONLY EVERY DAY, Do you not see that is keeping every day Holy to the Lord....



Isaiah 58:13 If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the Lord, honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words:

John 12:50 And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak.

John 8:29 And he that sent me is with me: the Father hath not left me alone; for I do always those things that please him.




Jesus did not just speak Gods word in the Synagogues, and the Temple, Jesus did the works of God in them too. Jesus entered the Temple to show who did these works of God on the Sabbath, Jesus answered the accusers, how the Father works on the Sabbath, and the Son does only as the Father ( as they are ONE)


Do you see what is lacking in your beliefs, it is the power part, the Gospel of the Word, is not in word only, not just teaching in the Synagogue on the Sabbath, but it must be in the POWER OF GOD, in the Holy Ghost....




John 5:14 Afterward Jesus findeth him in the temple, and said unto him, Behold, thou art made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing come unto thee.
15 The man departed, and told the Jews that it was Jesus, which had made him whole.
16 And therefore did the Jews persecute Jesus, and sought to slay him, because he had done these things on the sabbath day.
17 But Jesus answered them, My Father worketh hitherto, and I work.

1 Thessalonians 1:5 For our gospel came not unto you in word only, but also in power, and in the Holy Ghost, and in much assurance; as ye know what manner of men we were among you for your sake.
6 And ye became followers of us, and of the Lord, having received the word in much affliction, with joy of the Holy Ghost.




Jesus defeated all power of satan, all principalities ( all of the Pharisees and ruler of the Synagogue's oppositions) and those same ones who did judge Jesus over the Sabbath days, that Holy day, cannot any more, as Jesus made all our days Holy, all our words Holy conversation on all days, and all our works the work of God, and God never ended them, but began them in Christ, and we have Christ in us to work, the same works of God...




Colossians 2:15 And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.
16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.





Remember just above, how they loved the praise of men more than the praise of God, which was why they defended their human Synagogues/churches, to stay in them, or be put out of them for confessing Christ in truth, as the acknowledging of the truth is after godliness?


Look at the testimony repeated for you. They ( the Pharisee Jews) wanted the Gentiles to be circumcised in the flesh, as they did not want a life of persecution of Christ ( when in the Spirit of Christs circumcision) They wanted their law kept, to glory in mans flesh.

Romans 2, teaches us, circumcision is in the heart, in the Spirit, and NOT IN THE LETTER, as the letter gives praise of men, but whose praise do we seek, is it of God...




Galatiansx 6:12 As many as desire to make a fair shew in the flesh, they constrain you to be circumcised; only lest they should suffer persecution for the cross of Christ.
13 For neither they themselves who are circumcised keep the law; but desire to have you circumcised, that they may glory in your flesh.

Romans 2:29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.




This testimony is all linked, it is a complete testimony.

How did Abraham receive the promise of eternal life, ( and His faith counted as righteousness) when Abraham was circumcised, or uncircumcised?

The promise that Abraham should be heir to the world, was not through the law, but through the righteousness of faith.

I am saying this now, because that was when the covenant of the Sabbath was given, it was given in faith, when nobody could have faith, to Adam and Eve, and then to the ones of the law, they were given it, as unto the lawless ( they had no faith in it)

Now, the Sabbath is of faith, Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath, and Jesus showed the way to be in faith, in the Sabbath, and on every other day too..




Romans 4:3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.

Romans 4:10 How was it then reckoned? when he was in circumcision, or in uncircumcision? Not in circumcision, but in uncircumcision.
11 And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had yet being uncircumcised: that he might be the father of all them that believe, though they be not circumcised; that righteousness might be imputed unto them also:
12 And the father of circumcision to them who are not of the circumcision only, but who also walk in the steps of that faith of our father Abraham, which he had being yet uncircumcised.
13 For the promise, that he should be the heir of the world, was not to Abraham, or to his seed, through the law, but through the righteousness of faith.

First to SabbathBlessings, I took the list of Ten commandments off a google search, they still are the 10, they were just paraphrased.




LoveGodsword: "According to the scriptures no one can claim to know Christ and hold belief in Christ if they deny His Word and break Gods' commandments, because sin, defined in the scriptures as breaking anyone of Gods' 10 commandments and not believing and following Gods' Word *James 2:10-11; Romans 14:23"




10 commandments are not taught, that is the law.

Why do you speak of James, and the commandments written there for reminder, and yet cant show any word at all on Sabbath in the entire new Testament with regards to the law, and Sabbath included, for us to keep it ?

What you cannot answer, is pointed out, and if you cant show it, written at all, that it needed to be upheld, according to the new covenant, AND in the new testament, what do you think you can base SDA on, but a mans words and opinion?




Here is James again:


James 2, is the royal law ( to the law of Christ to bear one another's BURDENS)

To love our neighbour as ourselves, and love is not done by adultery, or killing, it is done by laying our lives down for the brothers, and not taking off of them what thy love the most ( their wife)

That separates law keeping, and faith in righteousness, as Sabbath keeping is not an act of love to bear your neighbours burdens, which is the faith of Christ, even as He did every day until the death, which example we follow..

James 2:8 If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well:
9 But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors.
10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.
11 For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.
12 So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.
13 For he shall have judgment without mercy, that hath shewed no mercy; and mercy rejoiceth against judgment.


Galatians 6:2 Bear ye one another's burdens, and so fulfil the law of Christ.

1 Corinthians 9:21 To them that are without law, as without law, (being not without law to God, but under the law to Christ,) that I might gain them that are without law.

prophecy_uk said:

First to SabbathBlessings, I took the list of Ten commandments off a google search, they still are the 10, they were just paraphrased.

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I take God's Word from the scriptures because that is the only Word we can believe.
Why would anyone want to alter what God Himself both spoke and wrote? We are told not to change one Word and that would especially hold true to God's holy laws.

This is God's version found in Exodus 20.

3 “You shall have no other gods before Me.
4 “You shall not make for yourself a carved image—any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; 5 you shall not bow down to them nor serve them. For I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children to the third and fourth generations of those who hate Me, 6 but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments.
7 “You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain, for the Lord will not hold him guiltless who takes His name in vain.
8 “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates. 11 For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it.
12 “Honor your father and your mother, that your days may be long upon the land which the Lord your God is giving you.
13 “You shall not murder.
14 “You shall not commit adultery.
15 “You shall not steal.
16 “You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.
17 “You shall not covet your neighbor’s house; you shall not covet your neighbor’s wife, nor his male servant, nor his female servant, nor his ox, nor his donkey, nor anything that is your neighbor’s.”

Strong in Him said:

I wasn't arguing, I was asking you, or someone, to explain:
a) what is meant by the law; all commandments written in Leviticus or only the 10? and
b) practically speaking, how do I keep the Sabbath - when I don't work, and believe every day is a day which God has given me to worship and serve him? If you're saying that Scripture says I HAVE to sit around all day doing nothing on a Saturday; I disagree.

As noted previously in these discussions, no one seems to want to answer this.
There was also no answer to the Scripture that I gave from Romans, saying whether a person considers one day to be special, or all days; we all do so for the Lord.

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We are in the New Covenant now. In the Old Covenant the wages of sin is death. The New Covenant Jesus took away that penalty as Jesus is our sacrifice. The Old Covenant the sacrificial laws in the Levitical Priesthood which include burnt offerings, feasts days etc. all point to shadow laws which is fulfilled in Christ as He was our perfect Lamb. We now have a new High Priest which is Jesus. Hebrews 10. In the Old Covenant we have the Ten Commandments written on stone in the New Covenant His laws which include the Ten are now written on our hearts and minds. We obey God's laws because of our love which is expressed through obedience. John 14:15-18, John 15:10, 1 John 5:3.

The heath laws which are foods God deemed clean and unclean are not part of the sacrificial system. What God calls an abomination cannot be changed.

How to keep the Sabbath? I love this question and many have a misconception that we just need to rest. If you look at the commandment the first sentence is Remember the Sabbath to keep it holy. Exodus 20:8 We rest from our work so we can keep the Sabbath holy.

This is what we are told about the Sabbath in scriptures:

Lev 23:3 ‘Six days shall work be done, but the seventh day is a Sabbath of solemn rest, a holy convocation.

Holy convocation is a holy assembly. A meeting place where we focus on the Word of God. You see examples of this in scripture where Jesus goes to the Temples on the Sabbath reading God's Word Luke 4:16 as well as the disciples preaching God Word on the Sabbath. Acts 18:4, Luke 4:31, Luke 13:10, Acts 13:42

We are blessed if we keep God's Sabbath

Isaiah 58:13 “If you turn away your foot from the Sabbath,
From doing your pleasure on My holy day,
And call the Sabbath a delight,
The holy day of the Lord honorable,
And shall honor Him, not doing your own ways,
Nor finding your own pleasure,
Nor speaking your own words,
14 Then you shall delight yourself in the Lord;
And I will cause you to ride on the high hills of the earth,
And feed you with the heritage of Jacob your father.
The mouth of the Lord has spoken.”

We are told the Sabbath is a day of solemn rest. I look at it as a day of holy communion with our Creator and Savior. This is the one day I can unplug from everything, phone, TV, work and focus completely on our Savior. I spend this time going to church, reading scripture, bible study, prayer, fellowship with other Christians speaking God's Word and time in nature marveling at all the wonderful things our Savior created for us. It is special time with our Savior and I really think the Sabbath commandment ties into how we are known by Jesus. This is a day about time. God's time. To Remember.

1 John 2:4 He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

Matthew 7:23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’

God bless

Sabbath; "Hebrews 10. In the Old Covenant we have the Ten Commandments written on stone in the New Covenant His laws which include the Ten are now written on our hearts and minds. We obey God's laws because of our love which is expressed through obedience. John 14:15-18, John 15:10, 1 John 5:3."



No ten commandments are told to be written on our hearts.

Looking at your quotes, the message is simple, to love the brothers, and love has to be by the same as Jesus ( as He is love) or it is no love at all.

Somehow you missed this most important part, and exchanged it for Sabbath keeping, when it should be to love one another as Jesus love us, which is the greatest love, to lay His life down for us..

1 John 5:1 Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.
2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.
3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

John 15:12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you.
13 Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.

1 John 3:16 Hereby perceive we the love of God, because he laid down his life for us: and we ought to lay down our lives for the brethren.




Sabbath "Holy convocation is a holy assembly. A meeting place where we focus on the Word of God. You see examples of this in scripture where Jesus goes to the Temples on the Sabbath reading God's Word Luke 4:16 as well as the disciples preaching God Word on the Sabbath. Acts 18:4, Luke 4:31, Luke 13:10, Acts 13:42"



Jesus and the Apostles did more than in word.

Do you see what is lacking in your beliefs, it is the power part, the Gospel of the Word, is not in word only, not just teaching in the Synagogue on the Sabbath, but it must be in the POWER OF GOD, in the Holy Ghost....




John 5:14 Afterward Jesus findeth him in the temple, and said unto him, Behold, thou art made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing come unto thee.
15 The man departed, and told the Jews that it was Jesus, which had made him whole.
16 And therefore did the Jews persecute Jesus, and sought to slay him, because he had done these things on the sabbath day.
17 But Jesus answered them, My Father worketh hitherto, and I work.

1 Thessalonians 1:5 For our gospel came not unto you in word only, but also in power, and in the Holy Ghost, and in much assurance; as ye know what manner of men we were among you for your sake.
6 And ye became followers of us, and of the Lord, having received the word in much affliction, with joy of the Holy Ghost.




Sabbath: "This is the one day I can unplug from everything, phone, TV, work and focus completely on our Savior. I spend this time going to church, reading scripture, bible study, prayer, fellowship with other Christians speaking God's Word "



Let me show you, ( you can ridicule and ignore) but I will show the scripture, how the day came for the disciples to unplug from everything, from work etc, then they took up their cross, learning of the Father, and fellowshipped with the light...


Matthew 4:18 And Jesus, walking by the sea of Galilee, saw two brethren, Simon called Peter, and Andrew his brother, casting a net into the sea: for they were fishers.
19 And he saith unto them, Follow me, and I will make you fishers of men.
20 And they straightway left their nets, and followed him.
21 And going on from thence, he saw other two brethren, James the son of Zebedee, and John his brother, in a ship with Zebedee their father, mending their nets; and he called them.
22 And they immediately left the ship and their father, and followed him.


Luke 5:27 And after these things he went forth, and saw a publican, named Levi, sitting at the receipt of custom: and he said unto him, Follow me.
28 And he left all, rose up, and followed him.

Mark 10:28 Then Peter began to say unto him, Lo, we have left all, and have followed thee.
29 And Jesus answered and said, Verily I say unto you, There is no man that hath left house, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my sake, and the gospel's,
30 But he shall receive an hundredfold now in this time, houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, with persecutions; and in the world to come eternal life.


Matthew 8:19 And a certain scribe came, and said unto him, Master, I will follow thee whithersoever thou goest.
20 And Jesus saith unto him, The foxes have holes, and the birds of the air have nests; but the Son of man hath not where to lay his head.
21 And another of his disciples said unto him, Lord, suffer me first to go and bury my father.
22 But Jesus said unto him, Follow me; and let the dead bury their dead.



That is the true faith, to forsake all they have, Luke 14:16-33, and law keeping, they do not leave all to follow Christ, they continue their lives and change nothing.

prophecy_uk said:

Sabbath; "Hebrews 10. In the Old Covenant we have the Ten Commandments written on stone in the New Covenant His laws which include the Ten are now written on our hearts and minds. We obey God's laws because of our love which is expressed through obedience. John 14:15-18, John 15:10, 1 John 5:3."



No ten commandments are told to be written on our hearts.

Looking at your quotes, the message is simple, to love the brothers, and love has to be by the same as Jesus ( as He is love) or it is no love at all.

Somehow you missed this most important part, and exchanged it for Sabbath keeping, when it should be to love one another as Jesus love us, which is the greatest love, to lay His life down for us..

1 John 5:1 Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.
2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.
3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

John 15:12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you.
13 Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.

1 John 3:16 Hereby perceive we the love of God, because he laid down his life for us: and we ought to lay down our lives for the brethren.




Sabbath "Holy convocation is a holy assembly. A meeting place where we focus on the Word of God. You see examples of this in scripture where Jesus goes to the Temples on the Sabbath reading God's Word Luke 4:16 as well as the disciples preaching God Word on the Sabbath. Acts 18:4, Luke 4:31, Luke 13:10, Acts 13:42"



Jesus and the Apostles did more than in word.

Do you see what is lacking in your beliefs, it is the power part, the Gospel of the Word, is not in word only, not just teaching in the Synagogue on the Sabbath, but it must be in the POWER OF GOD, in the Holy Ghost....




John 5:14 Afterward Jesus findeth him in the temple, and said unto him, Behold, thou art made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing come unto thee.
15 The man departed, and told the Jews that it was Jesus, which had made him whole.
16 And therefore did the Jews persecute Jesus, and sought to slay him, because he had done these things on the sabbath day.
17 But Jesus answered them, My Father worketh hitherto, and I work.

1 Thessalonians 1:5 For our gospel came not unto you in word only, but also in power, and in the Holy Ghost, and in much assurance; as ye know what manner of men we were among you for your sake.
6 And ye became followers of us, and of the Lord, having received the word in much affliction, with joy of the Holy Ghost.




Sabbath: "This is the one day I can unplug from everything, phone, TV, work and focus completely on our Savior. I spend this time going to church, reading scripture, bible study, prayer, fellowship with other Christians speaking God's Word "



Let me show you, ( you can ridicule and ignore) but I will show the scripture, how the day came for the disciples to unplug from everything, from work etc, then they took up their cross, learning of the Father, and fellowshipped with the light...


Matthew 4:18 And Jesus, walking by the sea of Galilee, saw two brethren, Simon called Peter, and Andrew his brother, casting a net into the sea: for they were fishers.
19 And he saith unto them, Follow me, and I will make you fishers of men.
20 And they straightway left their nets, and followed him.
21 And going on from thence, he saw other two brethren, James the son of Zebedee, and John his brother, in a ship with Zebedee their father, mending their nets; and he called them.
22 And they immediately left the ship and their father, and followed him.


Luke 5:27 And after these things he went forth, and saw a publican, named Levi, sitting at the receipt of custom: and he said unto him, Follow me.
28 And he left all, rose up, and followed him.

Mark 10:28 Then Peter began to say unto him, Lo, we have left all, and have followed thee.
29 And Jesus answered and said, Verily I say unto you, There is no man that hath left house, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my sake, and the gospel's,
30 But he shall receive an hundredfold now in this time, houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, with persecutions; and in the world to come eternal life.


Matthew 8:19 And a certain scribe came, and said unto him, Master, I will follow thee whithersoever thou goest.
20 And Jesus saith unto him, The foxes have holes, and the birds of the air have nests; but the Son of man hath not where to lay his head.
21 And another of his disciples said unto him, Lord, suffer me first to go and bury my father.
22 But Jesus said unto him, Follow me; and let the dead bury their dead.



That is the true faith, to forsake all they have, Luke 14:16-33, and law keeping, they do not leave all to follow Christ, they continue their lives and change nothing.

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Your posts are extremely hard to follow, many quotes you provide have no context to the scripture I provided and many are just out of context.

God wrote the New Covenant not Jesus. Why do you think Jesus said He came not to destroy God's laws but to magnify the Gods laws Isaiah 42:21. Magnify means to make greater not smaller. Matthew 5:17-30 Jesus is not at odds with His Fathers laws and told us to keep the commandments just like He did as our example. John 15:10

Jesus quoted from the Old Testament often including the greatest commandants that does not delete the Ten Commandments and love to God is shown through obedience to God's Ten Commandments. Commandments 1-4 is our moral duty to love God and commandments 5-10 is our moral duty how we are to love and treat each other. What you are teaching is lawlessness which is not biblical.

SabbathBlessings said:

Your posts are extremely hard to follow, many quotes you provide have no context to the scripture I provided and many are just out of context.

God wrote the New Covenant not Jesus. Why do you think Jesus said He came not to destroy God's laws but to magnify the Gods laws Isaiah 42:21. Magnify means to make greater not smaller. Matthew 5:17-30 Jesus is not at odds with His Fathers laws and told us to keep the commandments just like He did as our example. John 15:10

Jesus quoted from the Old Testament often including the greatest commandants that does not delete the Ten Commandments and love to God is shown through obedience to God's Ten Commandments. Commandments 1-4 is our moral duty to love God and commandments 5-10 is our moral duty how we are to love and treat each other. What you are teaching is lawlessness which is not biblical.

Click to expand...

So true. Jesus for example in quoting the two great commandments of love to God and our fellow man in Matthew 22:36-40 was actually quoting from Deuteronomy 6:5 and Leviticus 19:18. Paul shows that these are simply a summary of obedience to how we love God and man shown to us from God's 10 commandments in Romans 13:9. Even the Scribes and the Pharisees knew these references as shown in Luke 10:25-28. Many forget that in the days of Jesus and the Apostles their bible was the old testament scriptures and nearly everything we have in the new testament today has come from the old testament scriptures.

God bless sis