Neogaia777

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Personally, I don't like anything that says "if we do", "and/or obey", or "whatever", etc, "this or that", etc, if "we do it", and therefore do make and/or do ultimately save ourselves, etc, then I want nothing to do with it, and rather stand on the side of the sinners or those condemned, if we are to make ourselves, and/or be our own Saviors always, etc...

I don't think it's a genuine faith or belief, if we have to save ourselves, or did save ourselves, (we might think), etc...

Anyway don't think it's truly genuine or truly true at all, but false, etc... And maybe even "anti", etc, IDK?, etc... But at the very least false and fake and a lie, etc...

And I want to be a true convert, etc, have only God get absolutely all of the credit for saving me completely only, etc...

And if that can't be...? Then, like I said; then I'd rather stand judged along with all of the rest of the sinners, and those standing or sitting condemned in the end, etc...

If that cannot ever be, etc...

God Bless!
 
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Neogaia777

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Personally, I don't like anything that says "if we do", "and/or obey", or "whatever", etc, "this or that", etc, if "we do it", and therefore do make and/or do ultimately save ourselves, etc, then I want nothing to do with it, and rather stand on the side of the sinners or those condemned, if we are to make ourselves, and/or be our own Saviors always, etc...

I don't think it's a genuine faith or belief, if we have to save ourselves, or did save ourselves, (we might think), etc...

Anyway don't think it's truly genuine or truly true at all, but false, etc... And maybe even "anti", etc, IDK?, etc... But at the very least false and fake and a lie, etc...

And I want to be a true convert, etc, have only God get absolutely all of the credit for saving me completely only, etc...

And if that can't be...? Then, like I said; then I'd rather stand judged along with all of the rest of the sinners, and those standing or sitting condemned in the end, etc...

If that cannot ever be, etc...

God Bless!
If God does not make you clean, can you really ever truly be clean, etc...?

Anyway...

I digress...

God Bless!
 
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Neogaia777

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Personally, I don't like anything that says "if we do", "and/or obey", or "whatever", etc, "this or that", etc, if "we do it", and therefore do make and/or do ultimately save ourselves, etc, then I want nothing to do with it, and rather stand on the side of the sinners or those condemned, if we are to make ourselves, and/or be our own Saviors always, etc...

I don't think it's a genuine faith or belief, if we have to save ourselves, or did save ourselves, (we might think), etc...

Anyway don't think it's truly genuine or truly true at all, but false, etc... And maybe even "anti", etc, IDK?, etc... But at the very least false and fake and a lie, etc...

And I want to be a true convert, etc, have only God get absolutely all of the credit for saving me completely only, etc...

And if that can't be...? Then, like I said; then I'd rather stand judged along with all of the rest of the sinners, and those standing or sitting condemned in the end, etc...

If that cannot ever be, etc...

God Bless!

If God does not make you clean, can you really ever truly be clean, etc...?

Anyway...

I digress...

God Bless!

But am I asking to be made "perfect"...? I do not know...? I just know I just only want to be what/how/like God made me, and/or intended for me to be, etc...

Which could be process along the way, etc...

And be either saved, or not saved, based on just only that and that only, etc...

Will it lead to perfection this side of life for me? I do not know? But I just want to be as God would always have me be at each and every age and stage of my life only, etc, until the day that I do finally pass away or cross over for good, etc...

God Bless!
 
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prophecy_uk

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False brothers came to bring the believers into bondage, from their liberty in Christ, but the Greeks did not want to be circumcised, as the Jews wanted this ( to be law keepers without faith in Christ)....




Galatians 2:3 But neither Titus, who was with me, being a Greek, was compelled to be circumcised:
4 And that because of false brethren unawares brought in, who came in privily to spy out our liberty which we have in Christ Jesus, that they might bring us into bondage:


Apostle Paul, teaching us the commandments of God ( now sanctified in Christ not in a seventh day sanctified) shows the breaking of the law ( for the Jews with no faith in Christ) makes them uncircumcised.

By the letter the Jew Sabbath law keeper, transgressed the same law.

Circumcision is not outward an more, it is in the heart ( in the Spirit of the Lord in us) and not in the unfaithful letter any more ( same as sabbath keeping is the letter of the law for Judaism or SDA) but the praise now is no longer seen by men, it is only known by the Lord, that is how it is all in the heart..


Romans 2:25 For circumcision verily profiteth, if thou keep the law: but if thou be a breaker of the law, thy circumcision is made uncircumcision.
26 Therefore if the uncircumcision keep the righteousness of the law, shall not his uncircumcision be counted for circumcision?
27 And shall not uncircumcision which is by nature, if it fulfil the law, judge thee, who by the letter and circumcision dost transgress the law?
28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:
29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.



Beware they spoil us through deceit, after the tradition of men ( of the Jews law keeping) and not after Christ ( in the faith of Christ)

In Christ, we are complete in Him, to b made with the circumcision made witout hands, by the circumcision of Christ ( all sins are put off by the body that law keepers still are in sins, in)..


Colossians 2:8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.
9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.
10 And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:
11 In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:



We are quickened together with Christ, forgiving all tresspasses, and all the accusation of the curse of the law, and then, not only they cannott judge you in their flesh circumcision, nor can they judge you in respect of a sabbath day, as we are free from the curse of the law..



Colossians 2:13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
15 And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.
16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:

Galatians 3:13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:



Summary: We put on a complete and new man, renewed in the image of God now, this then proves there is no longer Greek nor Jew, no longer circumcision and uncircumcision, no divisions, but Christ is all and in all, no sabbath judging nor keeping, and no circumcision by the letter of the law, as the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life, and our faith does not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God..


Colossians 3:10 And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him:
11 Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all.

1 Corinthians 2:5 That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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LoveGodsword: " There are two rests here. One is to the rest we enter into by believing and following Gods Word which is our rest and the rest we enter into by believing and following God’s Word to God’s rest which is the seventh day Sabbath.

"Hebrews 4:3-5 defines God's rest by saying [3], For we which have believed do enter into rest (our rest from or the gospel rest of believing and following God's Word), as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest (God's rest): although the works were finished from the foundation of the world. [4], For he spoke in a certain place of the "seventh day" on this wise, And God did rest the "seventh day" from all his works. [5], And in this place again, If they shall enter into my rest ("seventh day")."




There is one rest. It is a sanctified rest, to remember how the Lord created the Heavens and the earth, and then Colossians tells us, Jesus Christ created all things, by Him and for Him ( For our Lord Jesus Christ.)


There is one rest, not self created, interpreted words saying , " (our rest from or the gospel rest of believing and following God's Word)"...





Here is God, which is Jesus Christ, creating the Heavens and the earth then sanctifying it ...



Genesis 2:3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.


Colossians 1:16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:





Jesus did all the works on earth this time, to shake the Heavens and the earth, to remove them, in order to replace them for ever so they never can be moved again, this is how the remembrance of the creations of the Heavens and the earth, is now a new creation, and works finished by Jesus Christ on earth ( the antichrist denies Christ came in the flesh) and how the sanctified day was replaced by the true sanctification and everlasting creation of the Kingdom of Heaven within us by Jesus Christ..



Hebrews 12:26 Whose voice then shook the earth: but now he hath promised, saying, Yet once more I shake not the earth only, but also heaven.
27 And this word, Yet once more, signifieth the removing of those things that are shaken, as of things that are made, that those things which cannot be shaken may remain.







So the works were finished from the foundation of the world, but new works Christ had to finish, and that was when Christ rested, when He was sanctified on the death and rising..




Hebrews 4:3 For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.

John 5:36 But I have greater witness than that of John: for the works which the Father hath given me to finish, the same works that I do, bear witness of me, that the Father hath sent me.






Remember the day that God sanctified, to be remembered for the creation of Jesus Christ, of the Heavens and the earth.

That sanctification was improved, replaced, God that is Holy shall be sanctified in righteousness.

Jesus did this, He sanctified Himself ( by rising from the dead to glory) to also sanctify all who believe in Christ through the truth ( the truth of Jesus Christ which is the Holy Ghost given into us/the Spirit of truth)...



Genesis 2::3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

Isaiah 5:16 But the Lord of hosts shall be exalted in judgment, and God that is holy shall be sanctified in righteousness.

John 17:19 And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also might be sanctified through the truth.




The offering of the body of Christ sanctifies us ( keeping the sabbath rest sanctified nobody ever) the same as keeping the law, nobody lived, it is not of faith, it was therefore death in the letter, curse and only the ones who did them would live in them ( but all in Adam die in in and unbelief in the righteousness of Christ).

Jesus did sanctify us, and Sabbath day sancification keepers, deny the sanctification of Christ, once, and for all, but Jesus triumphed over all, therefore no man can judge us ( or Jesus Christ) in respect of the sabbath days, which are now a shadow, but all is of Christ ( sanctified in Him) now..



Hebrews 10:10 By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

Hebrews 2:9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.

Colossians 2:15 And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.
16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.




Here is example of all of this, the disciples of Jesus did not keep any sabbath days, they worked by plucking corn, of course LoveGodsword states that to do good on the sabbath day is lawful, yet, just like the Pharisees, he cannot support working on the sabbath days, or doing what is good for us ( our own pleasure on the sabbath as the disciples of Jesus did to the displeasure of the Pharisee, sabbath keepers) Jesus Christ is greater than the temple, as He is the Temple, and we are the Temple with Him ( sanctified by the Lord in us in Holiness all days the same...




Isaiah 58:13 If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the Lord, honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words:


Matthew 12:1 At that time Jesus went on the sabbath day through the corn; and his disciples were an hungred, and began to pluck the ears of corn and to eat.
2 But when the Pharisees saw it, they said unto him, Behold, thy disciples do that which is not lawful to do upon the sabbath day.
3 But he said unto them, Have ye not read what David did, when he was an hungred, and they that were with him;
4 How he entered into the house of God, and did eat the shewbread, which was not lawful for him to eat, neither for them which were with him, but only for the priests?
5 Or have ye not read in the law, how that on the sabbath days the priests in the temple profane the sabbath, and are blameless?
6 But I say unto you, That in this place is one greater than the temple.




The purpose of this answer is to clarify for the ones teaching law, ( which is against the faith of Christ) how they say we need to rest on the Sabbath, or if we do not, we break the Sabbath and are sinners ,( they even go so far as to say Jesus Christ is a sinner if He broke the Sabbath) but Jesus is not only not shown as resting on the sabbath days, He is shown to be non stop doing the works of God on those very same sabbath days, and not resting at all.


In John 5, what we notice here is the specific command of Jesus to the now healed man, to not only rise up and walk, but to carry his bed with him.

Naturally it was the Sabbath, as Jesus picked these days on purpose to confound the Jews , Acts and 1 Corinthians can remind some other confounded the Lord did on them, Acts 9:22, 1 Corinthians 1:27, but to the ones who believe, they are not confounded by Christ, unlke the Sabbath so called law keepers the Pharisees.


It was not lawful to carry ones bed, but the man answered why he did it, because Jesus said to him, take up your bed, and walk..



1 Peter 2:6 Wherefore also it is contained in the scripture, Behold, I lay in Sion a chief corner stone, elect, precious: and he that believeth on him shall not be confounded.



John 5:8 Jesus saith unto him, Rise, take up thy bed, and walk.
9 And immediately the man was made whole, and took up his bed, and walked: and on the same day was the sabbath.
10 The Jews therefore said unto him that was cured, It is the sabbath day: it is not lawful for thee to carry thy bed.
11 He answered them, He that made me whole, the same said unto me, Take up thy bed, and walk.

Your scriptures are taken out of context leading you to a false interpretation of the scriptures you have provided in your posts. Are you interested in seeing why I say this and to see scriptures evidence that proves this? Of course if your not interested I will not waste my time as it is in no ones interest.
 
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Strong in Him

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Personally, I don't like anything that says "if we do", "and/or obey", or "whatever", etc, "this or that", etc, if "we do it", and therefore do make and/or do ultimately save ourselves, etc, then I want nothing to do with it, and rather stand on the side of the sinners or those condemned, if we are to make ourselves, and/or be our own Saviors always, etc...

You're right; we can't save ourselves.
 
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prophecy_uk

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LoveGodsword: "Your scriptures are taken out of context leading you to a false interpretation of the scriptures you have provided in your posts"


I read what you said, and answered, we were to keep a sanctified day, then we are sanctified in Christ, Christ therefore cannot keep the sabbath day, as that would be supporting the law the Pharisees were in, which as proven in the Epistles, is not of faith, and without Spirit to believe in the risen Lord, which is Him sanctified forever, and is sanctified forever in Him.
 
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prophecy_uk

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On top of that LovesGodsword, you no longer can show Romans 13, and James 2, as the law, without being taught by me, this never mentions the Sabbath as part of that law, nor is it taught in the entire Epistles, nor in Peter or James, but the law is mentioned every single time without the Sabbath included.

Have a nice time trying to ignore when you no longer can.
 
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SabbathBlessings

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Prophecy: "Speak Gods word that supports your showing of the law in the new testament, but how no such word at all speaks of Sabbath keeping as part of any law of Christ, you know in the entire new Testament ?"





SabbathBlessings:


And they returned, and prepared spices and ointments; and rested the sabbath day according to the commandment.
- Luke 23:56


And the next sabbath day came almost the whole city together to hear the word of God.
- Acts 13:44

For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.
- Acts 15:21

And he reasoned in the synagogue every sabbath, and persuaded the Jews and the Greeks.
- Acts 18:4



SabbathBlessings: "Perhaps another read of the NT. Not only is the Sabbath still a commandment its the day the disciples and Jesus kept as our example preaching and reading scriptures in the Temple as their custom on the Sabbath day."



Now, you can have another look with me.

The women, rested on the sabbath according to the commandment ( which the Jews enforced)


The disciples were struggling to believe all that the prophets had spoken, for Christ to suffer all things and then enter into His glory ( to be sanctified for our sakes by the truth).

Mary told the disciples she had seen the Lord, and the disciples also were assembled together and shut the door, for fear of the same enforcing and persecuting Jews against them.

Jesus sends them, to do the will of the Father, as the Son did the will of the Father, and breathed on them the Holy Ghost. ( now they are bold and have no fear of the Jews, no hiding and no keeping of the Jews laws ( as they were now sanctified in Christ, once for all and not sanctified on any sabbath day)

The Jews commanded the disciples, to not do all in the name of Jesus as they were dong now, but the disciples now answered the Jews, they obey God and not man ( or man made enforced laws)..




Luke 23:55 And the women also, which came with him from Galilee, followed after, and beheld the sepulchre, and how his body was laid.
56 And they returned, and prepared spices and ointments; and rested the sabbath day according to the commandment.

Luke 24:24 And certain of them which were with us went to the sepulchre, and found it even so as the women had said: but him they saw not.
25 Then he said unto them, O fools, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken:
26 Ought not Christ to have suffered these things, and to enter into his glory?

John 20:18 Mary Magdalene came and told the disciples that she had seen the Lord, and that he had spoken these things unto her.
19 Then the same day at evening, being the first day of the week, when the doors were shut where the disciples were assembled for fear of the Jews, came Jesus and stood in the midst, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you.

Acts 5:28 Saying, Did not we straitly command you that ye should not teach in this name? and, behold, ye have filled Jerusalem with your doctrine, and intend to bring this man's blood upon us.
29 Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men.

John 20:21 Then said Jesus to them again, Peace be unto you: as my Father hath sent me, even so send I you.
22 And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost:







There is no law mentioned in the new testament, which also says to keep the sabbath, that is against liberty and is false, see examples..


We are sanctified in the truth, the love of the truth, and to love another fulfils the law, all the commandments that are mentioned are to keep loving our neighbour, and anything that is missing, is the same, to fulfil loving our neighbour as ourself, which is not done by resting on the sabbath, but by the same as Christ, to labour to be accepted of Him, on all days and in all ways that are giving of ourselves for others, and not doing this selfish way for us instead..

John 17:17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.


Romans 13:8 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.
9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

2 Corinthians 5:9 Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him.

Hebrews 4:11 Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.

Colossians 1:28 Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus:
29 Whereunto I also labour, striving according to his working, which worketh in me mightily.




We labour to be accepted of Christ, that is how the Apostles laboured to enter into the rest of God, as we see clearly, and then the labourer is worthy of his reward, and that is exactly why the disciples took their reward for labouring in the Lord ( not restring) on the sabbath days..



1 Timothy 5:18 For the scripture saith, thou shalt not muzzle the ox that treadeth out the corn. And, The labourer is worthy of his reward.

Luke 6:1 And it came to pass on the second sabbath after the first, that he went through the corn fields; and his disciples plucked the ears of corn, and did eat, rubbing them in their hands.

I’m not sure why you would ignore so much scripture about the Sabbath in the New Testament. It’s referenced close to 60 times alone in the NT. To be honest I am not sure what is your argument because you haven’t made it clear. First you said there was no scripture showing the law and the Sabbath being mentioned in the NT, which I provided scripture to show this statement is false. Now you seem to indicate there was law but for Jews only. Is this your argument now? Scripture tells us there is only on Truth and one Gospel. God does not make two different holy days one that is Holy only to God and Jews and one that is not holy to God but Holy to everyone else. Maybe you can quote this scripture.

Jesus was accused of not keeping the law and breaking the Sabbath as i noted in multiple scriptures that you seemed to have missed? What law was Jesus accused of breaking? The 4th commandment. Jesus never broke any of His Fathers commandments John 15:10 so as you can clearly see, the Sabbath was still a commandment and it was not lawful to break the commandment. You seem to be indicating that Jesus broke the Sabbath. Is this your argument?


You had a lot of commentary about this scripture Luke 23:56 without showing us any scripture saying that we are allowed to delete the 4th commandment shown being kept after Jesus died.

And they returned, and prepared spices and ointments; and rested the sabbath day according to the commandment.
- Luke 23:56

This verse is after Jesus died, Mary keeping the Sabbath according to the commandment (see Exodus 20:8-11)

Jesus told us the Sabbath was made for us Mark 2:27 and Jesus is our example to follow which He kept all the commandments of God including the Sabbath commandment which was His custom to read God’s Word in the Temple on the Sabbath day. Luke 4:16. Jesus and the disciples did not keep the Sabbath as our example for it to be changed the minute Jesus goes back to heaven. This is an unbiblical doctrine. If Jesus was going to change a commandment of God Jesus would have told His disciples, or Mary or someone.

The Sabbath is the holy day of the Lord thy God period. There is no other scripture that says any other day is holy according to our Creator and Savior except for the seventh day. Genesis 2:1-3, Exodus 20:8-11, Ezekiel 20:12, Ezekiel 20:20, Isaiah 58:13. It’s the only day our Savior blessed and sanctified.

We are told the Sabbath day will continue to be God’s chosen day of worship on the New Earth and Heaven Isaiah 66:23. The Sabbath is consistent though the entire bible as God’s chosen day, the day Jesus kept as our example and Jesus tells us to obey the commandments over traditions Matthew 15:3-9 and obeying traditions is worshipping in vain. Maybe something to pray about. This is something you do not want to get wrong because breaking any of the commandments of God is considered sin. 1 John 3:4 Matthew 5:19

None of the scriptures you posted tell us the 4th commandment is deleted from God’s Covenant of Ten that was personally written by our Savior and stored in God’s Most holy of God’s Temple now written in our heart in the New Covenant.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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I read what you said, and answered, we were to keep a sanctified day, then we are sanctified in Christ, Christ therefore cannot keep the sabbath day, as that would be supporting the law the Pharisees were in, which as proven in the Epistles, is not of faith, and without Spirit to believe in the risen Lord, which is Him sanctified forever, and is sanctified forever in Him.
These are your words not based on scripture and nothing that has been said to you whatsoever. Do you know why? According to the scripture no one has the Spirit of God by being disobedient to the Word of God *John 6:63. John says those who do this are not being truthful in 1 John 2:3-4
 
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LoveGodsWord

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On top of that LovesGodsword, you no longer can show Romans 13, and James 2, as the law, without being taught by me, this never mentions the Sabbath as part of that law, nor is it taught in the entire Epistles, nor in Peter or James, but the law is mentioned every single time without the Sabbath included.
Have a nice time trying to ignore when you no longer can.
Sorry dear friend but I do not believe you so I guess we will agree to disagree as your words are not God's Word. According to the scriptures if we break anyone of God's 10 commandments we are guilty of breaking all of them according to James 2:10-11. How many of God's 10 commandments are there according to the scriptures (hint: Exodus 34:28; Deuteronomy 4:13; Deuteronomy 10:4)? Everyone of God's 10 commandments are repeated in the new covenant (scriptures here linked). So please do not pretend that they are not as that is not being truthful according to what the scriptures teach. There is not a single scripture in all of the bible that says God's 4th commandment of the 10 commandments is now abolished and we are now commanded to keep Sunday as a holy day of rest. This is a man-made teaching and tradition that has led many away from God's Word to break His commandments. According to Jesus if we knowingly follow man-made teachings and traditions that break the commandments of God we are not worshiping God in Matthew 15:2-9. This begs the question who is the majority of fallen Christianity worshiping; God or man? According to the scriptures Gods' people are in every Church living up the all the light that God has revealed to them *John 10:16, but the hour is coming and now is according to Jesus that Gods' true worshipers must worship the father in Spirit and in truth. God is a Spirit and those who worship Him must worship Him in Spirit and in truth *John 4:23-24. In times of ignorance God winks at but when he gives us a knowledge of the truth of His Word, calls all men everywhere to believe and follow what His Word says *Acts of the Apostles 5:29. God is calling His people where ever they may be to come out from following man-made teachings and traditions back to the pure Word of God *Revelation 18:1-5. Gods' sheep hear his Voice (the Word) and follow Him. According to the scriptures, those who do not hear do not follow because they are not His sheep *John 10:26-27.

Take Care.
 
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I’m not sure why you would ignore so much scripture about the Sabbath in the New Testament. It’s referenced close to 60 times alone in the NT.

Referenced, maybe - but no command to say that Gentiles have to keep it.
 
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Referenced, maybe - but no command to say that Gentiles have to keep it.

Is this really going to be your reason why you are not obeying a commandment of God?

I am assuming you think you do not belong to the New Covenant either or the promises of God, since that was also made to Jews. Jeremiah 31:33 Maybe you can show me the covenant God made with gentiles in scripture? Or maybe if you are part of the promises of the New Covenant you could follow scripture that tells us that we are one in Christ there is no longer Jews or Gentiles.

Galatians 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
 
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Is this really going to be your reason why you are not obeying a commandment of God?

Who says I'm not?

God didn't need to rest from his work and it is very unlikely that he spent a "day", whatever you understand a day to be, doing nothing. So he gave us a day to rest and honour him; for our sakes. We cannot, and are not meant, to work continuously with no time to rest and recharge our batteries. If we try to do so, we will burn out, as well as the danger that we will be too busy for God - as Jesus said, the Sabbath is for men, not man for the Sabbath.

God said "on 6 days you shall do your work and on the 7th, rest."
Many people nowadays seem to have two days off a week from their work, not one - the only people I know who only get 1 day off a week are clergy.
Personally, I don't have a job, so I can rest any day - and do. I also worship God every day because every day is the day that he made, and another day when he has given me life and opportunities.
The only work that I actually do is charity work, which, as I was told in another thread, is permissible on the Sabbath any way.

I am assuming you think you do not belong to the New Covenant either or the promises of God, since that was also made to Jews.

But signed and delivered by Jesus, who lay down his life for everyone.

Maybe you can show me the covenant God made with gentiles in scripture?

The name "Gentiles" was the name given to people who were not God's people and were outside of his promises.
They were unclean. They had not been saved from Egypt nor given God's law or covenant.

In Jesus, Gentiles can be forgiven, come to God, receive his word and be his children.

Galatians 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus.

Exactly.
God's children are no longer just the Jews - Gentiles are included too. How do we become children of God? Through Jesus, John 1:12.

But you seem to be saying that as Gentiles are now God's people too we have to go back and put ourselves under the law that was once given to God's people - and which they showed themselves to be incapable of keeping.
 
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Who says I'm not?
Typically people who argue against the Sabbath commandment means they don’t want to keep it. If thats not the case with you, my apologies!

God didn't need to rest from his work
Amen! God does not need rest from His work, but He rested on the seventh day from Creation and blessed the seventh day. He did not do this for His sake, agreed. He did this as qn example for us.
So he gave us a day to rest and honour him; for our sakes. We cannot, and are not meant, to work continuously with no time to rest and recharge our batteries. If we try to do so, we will burn out, as well as the danger that we will be too busy for God - as Jesus said, the Sabbath is for men, not man for the Sabbath.

God said "on 6 days you shall do your work and on the 7th, rest."
Many people nowadays seem to have two days off a week from their work, not one - the only people I know who only get 1 day off a week are clergy.
Personally, I don't have a job, so I can rest any day - and do. I also worship God every day because every day is the day that he made, and another day when he has given me life and opportunities.
The only work that I actually do is charity work, which, as I was told in another thread, is permissible on the Sabbath any way.

The Sabbath is about holy communion with our Savior. It’s more than a day off. The commandment is to Remember and keep the Sabbath holy and in doing that we rest from our work. We are also told:

Lev 23:3 ‘Six days shall work be done, but the seventh day is a Sabbath of solemn rest, a holy convocation. You shall do no work on it; it is the Sabbath of the LORD in all your dwellings.

While I agree there is nothing wrong with doing good on the Sabbath, the main point of the Sabbath is to have holy time and communion with God on His special day.



Exactly.
God's children are no longer just the Jews - Gentiles are included too. How do we become children of God? Through Jesus, John 1:12.
I’m glad we agree but we can’t just pick the promises we want from the Covenant with the Jews and not the laws or obedience to the law that comes with it. God wrote His laws in our hearts and minds in the New Covenant. Jer 31:33

But you seem to be saying that as Gentiles are now God's people too we have to go back and put ourselves under the law that was once given to God's people - and which they showed themselves to be incapable of keeping.

Are you saying because we can’t keep the law we shouldn’t try? Jesus gives us the Holy Spirit so we can keep the Commandments John 14:15-18, Acts 5:32. We have an Advocate with Jesus when we stumble and fall, but Jesus never teaches when we stumble to stay down. What is impossible by ourselves, is possible with God.

God bless
 
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Typically people who argue against the Sabbath commandment means they don’t want to keep it. If thats not the case with you, my apologies!

I do observe a Sabbath, but I suspect it's not as you think that I should.

Amen! God does not need rest from His work, but He rested on the seventh day from Creation and blessed the seventh day. He did not do this for His sake, agreed. He did this as qn example for us.

Yes, we rest one day a week - at least - because it's good for us physically, mentally and spiritually.

The Sabbath is about holy communion with our Savior.

Well I don't know about anyone else, but I do that every day.

The commandment is to Remember and keep the Sabbath holy and in doing that we rest from our work. We are also told:

How do I rest from my work on the Sabbath when in fact I don't do any work - except charitable work, once or twice a week?

While I agree there is nothing wrong with doing good on the Sabbath, the main point of the Sabbath is to have holy time and communion with God on His special day.

God created ALL days and declared them to be very good.
The day on which his Son was raised from the dead was a pretty special day - in fact when Christ was on earth making his Father known and doing his will, I suspect all days were equally special.

I’m glad we agree but we can’t just pick the promises we want from the Covenant with the Jews

I am not a Jew and have no ancestors that were Jews. I am not part of any covenant with the Jews - I am in Christ and one of God's children through him.

Are you saying because we can’t keep the law we shouldn’t try?

I'm saying that we, Gentiles, were not given the law at Sinai - the law which Jesus told the Pharisees he had come to fulfil. Read Exodus and the next few books; God often says things like, "I am the Lord who brought you out of Egypt"; "Don't do this, as your forefathers did in Egypt"; "remember that you were slaves in Egypt"; "keep this festival to remind you that you were rescued from Egypt", etc etc.
I was not rescued from Egypt and did not see the plagues nor the miracles that God performed. I have been rescued from sin and death from the One who is greater than Moses. He laid down his life for me, has given me eternal life and made me his child. If HE had said, "now that you belong to God you must keep all the laws that they were given thousands of years ago", I would. But he didn't. He told me to love God, love my neighbour as myself and to love as he loves me.

I also think that there are inconsistencies in what people regard as the law.
A number of people on these forums say/have said "yes, we MUST keep the law; it is wrong to eat pork and to worship God on the "wrong" day".

The law is outlined in Exodus and Leviticus. As well as abstaining from pork and shellfish, it includes instructions for animal sacrifices (which not even the Jews have these days), instructions on hygiene, not touching dead people, those who are bleeding or those with skin conditions, not trimming your beard, stoning anyone who commits adultery or doesn't keep the Sabbath.
Keeping the law - if that is what you feel that you have to do - should mean observing ALL these things; I think it was you who said we can't pick and choose. So yes, keep Saturday as Sabbath and abstain from pork if you want to - but if you don't keep ALL the other laws listed in Leviticus, you are just as bad as people who keep Sunday, or Thursday, as Sabbath.

Often when this point is made in a debate there are reasons given why we don't have to stone adulterers/sabbath breakers, be circumcised and can touch people who have a bleeding wound. Yet these same people will still insist that we keep ALL the law.

Jesus gives us the Holy Spirit so we can keep the Commandments John 14:15-18, Acts 5:32.

His commands to us, yes; not all the hygiene laws written in Leviticus.
In John 14:15 he says "if you love me you will obey what I command."
 
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Referenced, maybe - but no command to say that Gentiles have to keep it.
Gentiles do not enter into Gods' Kingdom. Gentile believers on the other hand according to the scriptures are all those who believe and follow what Gods' Word says so they are not exempt from Gods' Word. They are believers because they believe and follow what Gods' Word says (faith) and have been grafted in to Gods' true ISRAEL who are defined in the new covenant scriptures as all those who believe and follow Gods' Word *Romans 9:6-8; Galatians 3:27-28; Romans 2:28-29. If we are not apart of Gods' ISRAEL in the new covenant we have no part in Gods' new covenant promise *Hebrews 8:10-12 from Jeremiah 31:31-34 and Ezekiel 36:24-27. Gentile believers are now grafted in because they believe and follow what Gods' Word says *Romans 11:13-27 and we are now all one in Christ *Ephesians 2:11-14; Galatians 3:28.

Take Care
 
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SabbathBlessings

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I do observe a Sabbath, but I suspect it's not as you think that I should.



Yes, we rest one day a week - at least - because it's good for us physically, mentally and spiritually.



Well I don't know about anyone else, but I do that every day.



How do I rest from my work on the Sabbath when in fact I don't do any work - except charitable work, once or twice a week?



God created ALL days and declared them to be very good.
The day on which his Son was raised from the dead was a pretty special day - in fact when Christ was on earth making his Father known and doing his will, I suspect all days were equally special.



I am not a Jew and have no ancestors that were Jews. I am not part of any covenant with the Jews - I am in Christ and one of God's children through him.



I'm saying that we, Gentiles, were not given the law at Sinai - the law which Jesus told the Pharisees he had come to fulfil. Read Exodus and the next few books; God often says things like, "I am the Lord who brought you out of Egypt"; "Don't do this, as your forefathers did in Egypt"; "remember that you were slaves in Egypt"; "keep this festival to remind you that you were rescued from Egypt", etc etc.
I was not rescued from Egypt and did not see the plagues nor the miracles that God performed. I have been rescued from sin and death from the One who is greater than Moses. He laid down his life for me, has given me eternal life and made me his child. If HE had said, "now that you belong to God you must keep all the laws that they were given thousands of years ago", I would. But he didn't. He told me to love God, love my neighbour as myself and to love as he loves me.

I also think that there are inconsistencies in what people regard as the law.
A number of people on these forums say/have said "yes, we MUST keep the law; it is wrong to eat pork and to worship God on the "wrong" day".

The law is outlined in Exodus and Leviticus. As well as abstaining from pork and shellfish, it includes instructions for animal sacrifices (which not even the Jews have these days), instructions on hygiene, not touching dead people, those who are bleeding or those with skin conditions, not trimming your beard, stoning anyone who commits adultery or doesn't keep the Sabbath.
Keeping the law - if that is what you feel that you have to do - should mean observing ALL these things; I think it was you who said we can't pick and choose. So yes, keep Saturday as Sabbath and abstain from pork if you want to - but if you don't keep ALL the other laws listed in Leviticus, you are just as bad as people who keep Sunday, or Thursday, as Sabbath.

Often when this point is made in a debate there are reasons given why we don't have to stone adulterers/sabbath breakers, be circumcised and can touch people who have a bleeding wound. Yet these same people will still insist that we keep ALL the law.



His commands to us, yes; not all the hygiene laws written in Leviticus.
In John 14:15 he says "if you love me you will obey what I command."

No it’s not my place to judge, but we are supposed to teach each other the commandments according to Jesus. Matthew 5:19

I am very confused by your posts and having a hard time following what you stand for. One minute you say you keep the Sabbath, the next you seem to be arguing against the Sabbath saying all days are equally special when God never said anything of this sort. Making all days equal makes the Sabbath just any other day which is not what scripture says. Genesis 2:1-3, Exodus 20:8-11, Isaiah 58:13. The Sabbath is the Lords holy day and the day God commanded us to keep holy.

When someone really understands the sacredness of God’s holy day advocating against is not typical. I am willing to be persecuted and die in order to keep God’s Sabbath holy. Jesus tells us those who keep traditions (which is Sunday worship) over the commandments of God is worshipping in vain. There is no commandment to keep Sunday holy but there is for the seventh day. Matthew 15:3-9.

So if God’s holy laws are only meant for Jews which one of these commandments do you feel was meant only for Jews and Gentiles are free to not obey. God’s holy laws seem pretty universal to me spoken by God to an entire nation, hand written by our Savior and stored in the Most holy of God’s Temple.

Exodus 20:3 “You shall have no other gods before Me.
4 “You shall not make for yourself a carved image—any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that isin the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; 5 you shall not bow down to them nor serve them. For I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children to the third and fourth generations of those who hate Me, 6 but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments.
7 “You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain, for the Lord will not hold him guiltless who takes His name in vain.
8 “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God. In ityou shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who iswithin your gates. 11 For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the Lordblessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it.
12 “Honor your father and your mother, that your days may be long upon the land which the Lord your God is giving you.
13 “You shall not murder.
14 “You shall not commit adultery.
15 “You shall not steal.
16 “You shall not bear false witness against your
neighbor.
17 “You shall not covet your neighbor’s house; you shall not covet your neighbor’s wife, nor his male servant, nor his female servant, nor his ox, nor his donkey, nor anything that is your neighbor’s.”

God placed His holy laws in our hearts in the New Covenant Jer. 31:33 and Jesus came to magnify God’s laws Isaiah 41:21 not to destroy God’s laws Matthew 5:17-30

I am sorry most people don’t see the parallel between where we are now and Moses leading the Israelites out of the wilderness to the promise land. Our promise land is heaven and we are given the same Ten commandments now written in the heart. God has a people and is not literal Israel we are all part of Gods Israel if we are one in Christ and that includes obeying the laws of God.

You made an accusation that I pick and choose which laws I keep. Not sure how you know which laws I keep or not keep. I follow scripture and whatever is God’s will I will follow. If God told us to keep Thursday holy who am I to disregard what God hand wrote for us.

We know the Sabbath is not every going to change from being Gods holy day because there is no scripture stating this, God promised it will be a perpetual covenant Exodus 31:16 and it’s the day we will be worshipping our Lord and Savior on the New Earth Isaiah 66:23. God changes not and I believe and have faith that what God hand wrote for us on stone now in our hearts is meant to be eternal.

God bless
 
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I’m not sure why you would ignore so much scripture about the Sabbath in the New Testament. It’s referenced close to 60 times alone in the NT. To be honest I am not sure what is your argument because you haven’t made it clear. First you said there was no scripture showing the law and the Sabbath being mentioned in the NT, which I provided scripture to show this statement is false. Now you seem to indicate there was law but for Jews only. Is this your argument now? Scripture tells us there is only on Truth and one Gospel. God does not make two different holy days one that is Holy only to God and Jews and one that is not holy to God but Holy to everyone else. Maybe you can quote this scripture.
Jesus was accused of not keeping the law and breaking the Sabbath as i noted in multiple scriptures that you seemed to have missed? What law was Jesus accused of breaking? The 4th commandment. Jesus never broke any of His Fathers commandments John 15:10 so as you can clearly see, the Sabbath was still a commandment and it was not lawful to break the commandment. You seem to be indicating that Jesus broke the Sabbath. Is this your argument?
You had a lot of commentary about this scripture Luke 23:56 without showing us any scripture saying that we are allowed to delete the 4th commandment shown being kept after Jesus died.
And they returned, and prepared spices and ointments; and rested the sabbath day according to the commandment.
- Luke 23:56
This verse is after Jesus died, Mary keeping the Sabbath according to the commandment (see Exodus 20:8-11)
Jesus told us the Sabbath was made for us Mark 2:27 and Jesus is our example to follow which He kept all the commandments of God including the Sabbath commandment which was His custom to read God’s Word in the Temple on the Sabbath day. Luke 4:16. Jesus and the disciples did not keep the Sabbath as our example for it to be changed the minute Jesus goes back to heaven. This is an unbiblical doctrine. If Jesus was going to change a commandment of God Jesus would have told His disciples, or Mary or someone.
The Sabbath is the holy day of the Lord thy God period. There is no other scripture that says any other day is holy according to our Creator and Savior except for the seventh day. Genesis 2:1-3, Exodus 20:8-11, Ezekiel 20:12, Ezekiel 20:20, Isaiah 58:13. It’s the only day our Savior blessed and sanctified.
We are told the Sabbath day will continue to be God’s chosen day of worship on the New Earth and Heaven Isaiah 66:23. The Sabbath is consistent though the entire bible as God’s chosen day, the day Jesus kept as our example and Jesus tells us to obey the commandments over traditions Matthew 15:3-9 and obeying traditions is worshipping in vain. Maybe something to pray about. This is something you do not want to get wrong because breaking any of the commandments of God is considered sin. 1 John 3:4 Matthew 5:19
None of the scriptures you posted tell us the 4th commandment is deleted from God’s Covenant of Ten that was personally written by our Savior and stored in God’s Most holy of God’s Temple now written in our heart in the New Covenant.
All ten commandments are repeated in the NT as required by gentiles EXCEPT the 4th, the Sabbath.
Everyone who is spoken of in the NT who keeps the Sabbath e.g. Paul, Mary were Jews.
The Sabbath was given exclusively to the children of Israel!
Exodus 31:16
16 Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the sabbath, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, for a perpetual covenant.
Leviticus 23:24
24 Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, In the seventh month, in the first day of the month, shall ye have a sabbath, a memorial of blowing of trumpets, an holy convocation.
Leviticus 24:8
8 Every sabbath he shall set it in order before the LORD continually, being taken from the children of Israel by an everlasting covenant.
Leviticus 25:2
2 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, When ye come into the land which I give you, then shall the land keep a sabbath unto the LORD.
Whoever chooses to may keep the Sabbath but there is no command for gentiles to keep the Sabbath.
 
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All ten commandments are repeated in the NT as required by gentiles EXCEPT the 4th, the Sabbath.
Everyone who is spoken of in the NT who keeps the Sabbath e.g. Paul, Mary were Jews.
The Sabbath was given exclusively to the children of Israel!
Exodus 31:16
16 Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the sabbath, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, for a perpetual covenant.
Leviticus 23:24
24 Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, In the seventh month, in the first day of the month, shall ye have a sabbath, a memorial of blowing of trumpets, an holy convocation.
Leviticus 24:8
8 Every sabbath he shall set it in order before the LORD continually, being taken from the children of Israel by an everlasting covenant.
Leviticus 25:2
2 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, When ye come into the land which I give you, then shall the land keep a sabbath unto the LORD.
Whoever chooses to may keep the Sabbath but there is no command for gentiles to keep the Sabbath.

Nonsense. According to the scriptures in the new covenant, God's 10 commandments have the same role they always had and that is to give us the knowledge of good (moral right doing) and evil (moral wrong doing); sin (moral right doing) and righteousness (moral right doing) *Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4; Psalms 119:172 and if we break anyone of them according to James we stand guilty before God of sin in James 2:10-11. According to the new covenant scriptures, everyone of Gods' 10 commandments are repeated in the new covenant as a requirement for christian living (scripture support here linked). According to the new covenant scriptures Gentile believers are all those who believe and follow what Gods' Word says so they are not exempt from Gods' Word. They are believers because they believe and follow what Gods' Word says (faith) and have been grafted in to Gods' true ISRAEL who are defined in the new covenant scriptures as all those who believe and follow Gods' Word *Romans 9:6-8; Galatians 3:27-28; Romans 2:28-29. If we are not apart of Gods' ISRAEL in the new covenant we have no part in Gods' new covenant promise *Hebrews 8:10-12 from Jeremiah 31:31-34 and Ezekiel 36:24-27. Gentile believers are now grafted in because they believe and follow what Gods' Word says *Romans 11:13-27 and we are now all one in Christ *Ephesians 2:11-14; Galatians 3:28 (more scripture support here linked). Your post is promoting the false doctrine of lawlessness (without law) which is not biblical or supported in the scriptures.

Take Care
 
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