Uttar Pradesh government says early use of Ivermectin helped to keep positivity, deaths low

JustSomeBloke · Sep 15, 2021

Uttar Pradesh government says early use of Ivermectin helped to keep positivity, deaths low

A year after the country’s first Covid-19 cluster, with 5 cases, was reported in Agra district, the Uttar Pradesh government has claimed that it was the first state to have introduced a large-scale “prophylactic and therapeutic” use of Ivermectin and added that the drug helped the state to maintain a lower fatality and positivity rate as compared to other states.

Ponderous Curmudgeon · Sep 15, 2021

JustSomeBloke said:
Uttar Pradesh government says early use of Ivermectin helped to keep positivity, deaths low

A year after the country’s first Covid-19 cluster, with 5 cases, was reported in Agra district, the Uttar Pradesh government has claimed that it was the first state to have introduced a large-scale “prophylactic and therapeutic” use of Ivermectin and added that the drug helped the state to maintain a lower fatality and positivity rate as compared to other states.

So no actual data or controlled studies, basically a big anecdote. From the article: : the state Health Department said it would conduct a controlled study once the second wave of the pandemic subsides.: This is most definitely not how you determine the efficacy of a treatment.

JustSomeBloke · Sep 15, 2021

Ponderous Curmudgeon said:
So no actual data or controlled studies, basically a big anecdote. From the article: : the state Health Department said it would conduct a controlled study once the second wave of the pandemic subsides.: This is most definitely not how you determine the efficacy of a treatment.

The Undeniable Ivermectin Miracle in India’s 240m Populated Largest State, Uttar Pradesh

Ponderous Curmudgeon · Sep 15, 2021

JustSomeBloke said:
The Undeniable Ivermectin Miracle in India’s 240m Populated Largest State, Uttar Pradesh

Well you have enough to create a hypothesis now, to bad they are waiting till after the wave to test it.

JustSomeBloke · Sep 15, 2021

Ponderous Curmudgeon said:
Well you have enough to create a hypothesis now, to bad they are waiting till after the wave to test it.

Brihaha · Sep 15, 2021

Yeah well, Nicki Minaj's cousin's boyfriend in Trinidad said not to get vaccinated cause his testicles swelled up after receiving the jab too. I'm not sure either of these examples qualifies as peer reviewed evidence in the medical profession.

KCfromNC · Sep 16, 2021

JustSomeBloke said:

Can you explain exactly what the variable p means in the context of this chart and how it was calculated?

pitabread · Sep 16, 2021

Ponderous Curmudgeon said:
So no actual data or controlled studies, basically a big anecdote. From the article: : the state Health Department said it would conduct a controlled study once the second wave of the pandemic subsides.: This is most definitely not how you determine the efficacy of a treatment.

At this point I'm convinced anti-vaxxers are being contrarian just for the sake of it.

JustSomeBloke · Sep 17, 2021

Brihaha said:
Yeah well, Nicki Minaj's cousin's boyfriend in Trinidad said not to get vaccinated cause his testicles swelled up after receiving the jab too. I'm not sure either of these examples qualifies as peer reviewed evidence in the medical profession.

I've just visited Nicki Minaj's Twitter feed to see what the fuss is about. And I can't stop laughing!

The assorted liberals and pro-vaxxers must be tearing their hair out. They've tried to rein her in, and failed miserably. She's their worst nightmare. An outspoken woman of colour with a large following, tweeting 'wrong-think' and 'anti-vaxx', and refusing to apologise, back down, or be cancelled. What next? Will Twitter dare to permanently ban her?

P.S. I don't recommend checking her twitter feed. She uses quite a few rude words.

Brihaha · Sep 17, 2021

JustSomeBloke said:
I've just visited Nicki Minaj's Twitter feed to see what the fuss is about. And I can't stop laughing!

The assorted liberals and pro-vaxxers must be tearing their hair out. They've tried to rein her in, and failed miserably. She's their worst nightmare. An outspoken woman of colour with a large following, tweeting 'wrong-think' and 'anti-vaxx', and refusing to apologise, back down, or be cancelled. What next? Will Twitter dare to permanently ban her?

P.S. I don't recommend checking her twitter feed. She uses quite a few rude words.

Nicki is quite a character. I don't do any twitter or facebook. I am sorry I have to hear that stuff on the media I do consume. I understand her reluctance to get vaccinated as a black woman tho. It's just hilarious when people eschew the advice of seriously qualified medical professionals yet are willing to listen to John Q. Swollennads on social media for medical advice. It boggles my mind.

rambot · Sep 17, 2021

JustSomeBloke said:
I've just visited Nicki Minaj's Twitter feed to see what the fuss is about. And I can't stop laughing!

The assorted liberals and pro-vaxxers must be tearing their hair out. They've tried to rein her in, and failed miserably. She's their worst nightmare. An outspoken woman of colour with a large following, tweeting 'wrong-think' and 'anti-vaxx', and refusing to apologise, back down, or be cancelled. What next? Will Twitter dare to permanently ban her?

P.S. I don't recommend checking her twitter feed. She uses quite a few rude words.

HAHA!
She outed her cousin's friend for getting a Sexually Transmitted Disease.

And you think she's a hero?

rambot · Sep 17, 2021

JustSomeBloke said:

Interesting.

I am kinda curious what it will take for ivermectin reaches the threshold of an appropriate treatment.

That said, if you are ACTUALLY curious about why it hasn't been put into course yet:
Misleading clinical evidence and systematic reviews on ivermectin for COVID-19

Based on observational data, they found that high-dose intravenous immunoglobulin, ivermectin and tocilizumab were associated with reduced mortality rate in critically ill patients. None of the analysed drugs was significantly associated with increased non-cardiac serious adverse events compared with standard care, but the overall certainty of the evidence was very low in all outcomes and reduced the ability for recommendation.

Well now we know why it hasn't been used yet.

JustSomeBloke · Sep 17, 2021

Brihaha said:
Nicki is quite a character. I don't do any twitter or facebook. I am sorry I have to hear that stuff on the media I do consume. I understand her reluctance to get vaccinated as a black woman tho. It's just hilarious when people eschew the advice of seriously qualified medical professionals yet are willing to listen to John Q. Swollennads on social media for medical advice. It boggles my mind.

I don't do Twitter or Facebook either. I've deleted the Twitter and Facebook apps from my phone, never had a Twitter account, and haven't logged into Facebook for years. However, I do sometimes check Twitter and Facebook using a web browser platform, because Twitter is often amusing, and some clubs and social groups have sadly abandoned conventional websites, and now do everything using Facebook.

Anyway, putting all of that to one side, the strange thing is that twice last year I had unexplained testicular pain, and I also had some unexplained eye pain around the same time. Now, I've never had a covid test or vaccine, and I haven't had any of the usual covid symptoms, but I have heard that covid can cause testicular pain and eye pain in some people. In fact, I even saw an article suggesting that Google was experiencing a surge in the number of people searching 'my eyes hurt', and that looking for surges in unusual internet searches might be a good way to identify unusual covid symptoms, and where they are happening in the world (via IP address).

rambot said:
HAHA!
She outed her cousin's friend for getting a Sexually Transmitted Disease.

And you think she's a hero?

If you were better informed and more well read on covid symptoms, you'd know that testicular pain has been reported amongst those infected with covid.

Is there any association of COVID-19 with testicular pain and epididymo-orchitis?
Conclusion: Testicular pain was observed more frequently in hospitalised COVID-19 cases. While no inflammation marker which is related to predict of testicular pain or epididymo-orchitis was found in patients with COVID-19.

rambot · Sep 17, 2021

JustSomeBloke said:
I don't do Twitter or Facebook either. I've deleted the Twitter and Facebook apps from my phone, never had a Twitter account, and haven't logged into Facebook for years. However, I do sometimes check Twitter and Facebook using a web browser platform, because Twitter is often amusing, and some clubs and social groups have sadly abandoned conventional websites, and now do everything using Facebook.

Anyway, putting all of that to one side, the strange thing is that twice last year I had unexplained testicular pain, and I also had some unexplained eye pain around the same time. Now, I've never had a covid test or vaccine, and I haven't had any of the usual covid symptoms, but I have heard that covid can cause testicular pain and eye pain in some people. In fact, I even saw an article suggesting that Google was experiencing a surge in the number of people searching 'my eyes hurt', and that looking for surges in unusual internet searches might be a good way to identify unusual covid symptoms, and where they are happening in the world (via IP address).

If you were better informed and more well read on covid symptoms, you'd know that testicular pain has been reported amongst those infected with covid.

Is there any association of COVID-19 with testicular pain and epididymo-orchitis?
Conclusion: Testicular pain was observed more frequently in hospitalised COVID-19 cases. While no inflammation marker which is related to predict of testicular pain or epididymo-orchitis was found in patients with COVID-19.

Huh.
I thought he got that STD from the vaccine NOT from COVID.... am I remembering it wrong?

JustSomeBloke · Sep 17, 2021

rambot said:
Huh.
I thought he got that STD from the vaccine NOT from COVID.... am I remembering it wrong?

If covid causes spike proteins in the human body, and those spike proteins can cause testicular pain, then it's quite believable that a vaccine that contains spike protein (or induces the body to create spike protein) could result in testicular pain.

For the same reason, it's entirely believable that people presenting with covid symptoms after vaccination (e.g. shortness of breath caused by blood clots in their lungs), may have acquired those symptoms due to vaccination. Of course you won't see the MSM reporting anything on that, because it goes against the narrative that the vaccines are a life saver and super safe.

This is why intelligent people who are capable of critical thinking do their own research, and read widely outside of the relentlessly pro-vaxx MSM. The fact that you weren't aware of testicular pain being caused by spike proteins shows that you need to step up your reading, and ditch some of the pro-vaxx, biased, single-narrative MSM.

rambot · Sep 17, 2021

JustSomeBloke said:
If covid causes spike proteins in the human body, and those spike proteins can cause testicular pain, then it's quite believable that a vaccine that contains spike protein (or induces the body to create spike protein) could result in testicular pain.

You know, it would have been more sensible to just say "oh right...she was talking about the vaccine" instead of playing pretend scientists like you have a clue.

For the same reason, it's entirely believable that people presenting with covid symptoms after vaccination (e.g. shortness of breath caused by blood clots in their lungs), may have acquired those symptoms due to vaccination. Of course you won't see the MSM reporting anything on that, because it goes against the narrative that the vaccines are a life saver and super safe.

You are not qualified to give medical advice and I strongly suggest you stop.

This is why intelligent people who are capable of critical thinking do their own research, and read widely outside of the relentlessly pro-vaxx MSM. The fact that you weren't aware of testicular pain being caused by spike proteins shows that you need to step up your reading, and ditch some of the pro-vaxx, biased, single-narrative MSM.

Buddy, you COMPLETELY made all of that up. You are mistaking yourself for someone who has even the FIRST clue about what you're talking about with the immune response.

Again, the certainty of it all is what you feel assured in. You are wrong but you feel sure.

JustSomeBloke · Sep 17, 2021

rambot said:
You know, it would have been more sensible to just say "oh right...she was talking about the vaccine" instead of playing pretend scientists like you have a clue.

Spike protein can have the same effect, whether from a covid infection or a covid vaccination. The vaccine scientists initially thought that the spike protein would remain at the injection site, but that has now been proved totally incorrect. The reality is that it's migrating around the human body. Why else do you think there are so many adverse effects reported on VAERS and Yellow Card? Heart inflammation is just one of those adverse effects.

rambot said:
You are not qualified to give medical advice and I strongly suggest you stop.

I'm not advising anyone. Although I can very well understand why some people here would want to deliberately misinterpret what I'm saying as 'advice', because giving medical advice is a breach of forum rules, and they want me banned for my vaccine scepticism.

And I'm just repeating what some very well qualified doctors and scientists have said in the alternative media (they've been cancelled by the MSM and BigTech, because they strayed from the vaccines-good narrative).

rambot said:
Buddy, you COMPLETELY made all of that up. You are mistaking yourself for someone who has even the FIRST clue about what you're talking about with the immune response.

Again, the certainty of it all is what you feel assured in. You are wrong but you feel sure.

I recommend that you read more widely.

rambot · Sep 17, 2021

JustSomeBloke said:
Spike protein can have the same effect, whether from a covid infection or a covid vaccination. The vaccine scientists initially thought that the spike protein would remain at the injection site, but that has now been proved totally incorrect. The reality is that it's migrating around the human body.

Interesting. Sources? Studies? Citations?
Here is information from a source the DIRECTLY contradicts what you are saying:
How long do mRNA and spike proteins last in the body?

And it's not even hard to find. In fact, I typed "spike proteins" into google and it was the first link.
It came up in:
About 36,200,000 results (0.56 seconds)
There's no good reason to not include your information when you are talking about things that are not considered common knowledge (like spike proteins).

As I am neither a scientist or a pompous fool, I will simply provide you with the explanations for this:
https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/10.1161/CIRCULATIONAHA.121.056135

Although the mechanisms for development of myocarditis are not clear, molecular mimicry between the spike protein of severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus-2 (SARS-CoV-2) and self-antigens, trigger of preexisting dysregulated immune pathways in certain individuals, immune response to mRNA, and activation of immunologic pathways, and dysregulated cytokine expression have been proposed.

I barely understand what is being said. But clearly, I don't seem to know as much about you on this so I leave this to you to explain as you need.
That said, I pulled this out from this scientific study as well because it needs to be beaten over some folks' heads til they hear it:

In the pre–COVID-19 era, among 620 195 reports filed at the Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System (VAERS) between 1990 and 2018, 0.1% were attributable to myopericarditis.1 Of those myopericarditis reports, 79% were in males.1 However, VAERS is primarily a safety signal detection and hypothesis-generating system and cannot be used to determine if a vaccine caused an adverse event.4

My emphasis.

Almost all patients had resolution of symptoms and signs and improvement in diagnostic markers and imaging with or without treatment.

So a temporary heart inflamation leading to no deaths that resolves itself in a few days.
That's what we're tlaking about here right?

Why else do you think there are so many adverse effects reported on VAERS and Yellow Card? Heart inflammation is just one of those adverse effects.

Well you know my opinion of VAERS and if you don't I'll sum it up: It's unreliable and only suggests a CORRELATIVE relationship. To a reasonable person. But don't trust me, trust the scientists I quote from the above study.

I'm not advising anyone. Although I can very well understand why some people here would want to deliberately misinterpret what I'm saying as 'advice', because giving medical advice is a breach of forum rules, and they want me banned for my vaccine scepticism.

"they" do? Who is this nefarious "they": the people that agree with you. Those that are trying to keep you down, man! Is it that man or commies like me who disagree with you.
Cause listen: I have no interest. I get more upset by bunk or misleading information that you post and don't clarify or own when necessary. But I don't want you banned for that. I'd rather you just learned.

And I'm just repeating what some very well qualified doctors and scientists have said in the alternative media (they've been cancelled by the MSM and BigTech, because they strayed from the vaccines-good narrative).

There are people in every job that suck at it. Terrible teachers, terrible police officers; terrible scientists; terrible doctors; terrible accountant.
But here's the thing. The really bad ones are in the vast minority. And they are not correct by the fact that they are in the minority. In fact, they are almost always wrong. BEcause look at all those other careers. The inept and fakers are the VAST minority of people filling those jobs.

And THAT'S why, minority voices in health care require EXTRA scrutiny and NOT the soft/absent scrutiny you give them.

I recommend that you read more widely.

You just worry about yourself there Dr. Nick.
To be fair, I helped you by putting resources to support my arguments. Please do the same in the future if you want me to read more widely.

JustSomeBloke · Sep 17, 2021

rambot said:
Interesting. Sources? Studies? Citations?
Here is information from a source the DIRECTLY contradicts what you are saying:
How long do mRNA and spike proteins last in the body?

And it's not even hard to find. In fact, I typed "spike proteins" into google and it was the first link.
It came up in:
About 36,200,000 results (0.56 seconds)
There's no good reason to not include your information when you are talking about things that are not considered common knowledge (like spike proteins).

As I am neither a scientist or a pompous fool, I will simply provide you with the explanations for this:
https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/10.1161/CIRCULATIONAHA.121.056135
I barely understand what is being said. But clearly, I don't seem to know as much about you on this so I leave this to you to explain as you need.
That said, I pulled this out from this scientific study as well because it needs to be beaten over some folks' heads til they hear it:
My emphasis.

So a temporary heart inflamation leading to no deaths that resolves itself in a few days.
That's what we're tlaking about here right?

Well you know my opinion of VAERS and if you don't I'll sum it up: It's unreliable and only suggests a CORRELATIVE relationship. To a reasonable person. But don't trust me, trust the scientists I quote from the above study.
"they" do? Who is this nefarious "they": the people that agree with you. Those that are trying to keep you down, man! Is it that man or commies like me who disagree with you.
Cause listen: I have no interest. I get more upset by bunk or misleading information that you post and don't clarify or own when necessary. But I don't want you banned for that. I'd rather you just learned.
There are people in every job that suck at it. Terrible teachers, terrible police officers; terrible scientists; terrible doctors; terrible accountant.
But here's the thing. The really bad ones are in the vast minority. And they are not correct by the fact that they are in the minority. In fact, they are almost always wrong. BEcause look at all those other careers. The inept and fakers are the VAST minority of people filling those jobs.

And THAT'S why, minority voices in health care require EXTRA scrutiny and NOT the soft/absent scrutiny you give them.

You just worry about yourself there Dr. Nick.
To be fair, I helped you by putting resources to support my arguments. Please do the same in the future if you want me to read more widely.

Your response suggests that you need to do a lot of reading. And by that I don't mean 5 minutes looking on Google or looking at the MSM. I mean half to one hour a day for 18 months, seeking out alternative opinions.

And as you are using Google, you need to ditch that first, because they are shadow banning and demoting a lot of content that doesn't fit the BigTech, pro-vaxx world view. Try using duckduckgo instead.

Good luck with your journey of discovery.

rambot · Sep 17, 2021

JustSomeBloke said:
Your response suggests that you need to do a lot of reading.

Given the content of my post (a research paper, and a public health body) I would LITERALLY LOVE to hear how you come to that conclusion.

Uttar Pradesh government says early use of Ivermectin helped to keep positivity, deaths low

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