20 major reasons to reject the Premillennial doctrine

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Douggg

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Psalms 110:1-7 predicted this unique dual office of Christ, saying, The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool. The LORD shall send the rod of thy strength out of Zion: rule thou in the midst of thine enemies. Thy people shall be willing in the day of thy power, in the beauties of holiness from the womb of the morning: thou hast the dew of thy youth. The LORD hath sworn, and will not repent, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchizedek. The Lord at thy right hand shall strike through kings in the day of his wrath. He shall judge among the heathen, he shall fill the places with the dead bodies; he shall wound the heads over many countries. He shall drink of the brook in the way: therefore shall he lift up the head.”

Psalm 110 blows apart the Premil fixation with a future earthly millennial kingdom. Everything about the, Old Testament Messianic prophecies is current and heavenly. They are shown repeatedly to be occurring now in this intra-Advent period (also known as the “last days”). The scene we are looking at relates to a revelation David received of the ascended Messiah exalted to the highest place in the universe – at the right hand of God.

Hebrews 6:20: “Jesus, made an high priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec.”

Hebrews 7:1-2: “For this Melchisedec, king of Salem, priest of the most high God, who met Abraham returning from the slaughter of the kings, and blessed him; To whom also Abraham gave a tenth part of all; first being by interpretation King of righteousness, and after that also King of Salem, which is, King of peace.”

Hebrews 7:11-12: “If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (for under it the people received the law,) what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron? For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.”

Hebrews 7:16-24 tells us that Christ is made, not after the law of a carnal commandment, but after the power of an endless life. For he testifieth, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec. For there is verily a disannulling of the commandment going before for the weakness and unprofitableness thereof. For the law made nothing perfect, but the bringing in of a better hope did; by the which we draw nigh unto God. And inasmuch as not without an oath he was made priest: (For those priests were made without an oath; but this with an oath by him that said unto him, The Lord sware and will not repent, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec:) By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament. And they truly were many priests, because they were not suffered to continue by reason of death: But this man, because he continueth ever, hath an unchangeable priesthood.”

This reading confirms that Christ holds this holy office “for ever.” Hebrews 5:6, 6:20, 7:3, 17 and 21 repeats this great truth. The word interpreted “unchangeable” here is very significant in the light of the teaching of the Black. It comes from the Greek word aparabatos, which simply means non-transferable. It is a legal word. For example, it relates to a judge laying down a decision that is unalterable and non-transferable. It also describes something which belongs to one person and cannot be transferred to anyone else. This means that no one else can hold the Melchizedek priesthood. Christ continues alone in this role, having an unchangeable non-transferable priestly office. Unlike the old covenant priesthood, Christ has no successors in this office. The reason being He never dies. Therefore, He never needs replaced.

Christ is consecrated a Priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec, by an oath which stands fast for evermore. Hebrews 7:27-28 confirms this, telling us that Christ “needeth not daily, as those high priests, to offer up sacrifice, first for his own sins, and then for the people’s: for this he did once, when he offered up himself. For the law maketh men high priests which have infirmity; but the word of the oath, which was since the law, maketh the Son, who is consecrated for evermore.”

Once again there is no end to the Lord’s hold on this office. What is more, this priesthood that belongs to Christ is far superior to the old one because it is established with an oath of God which indicates something sure, final, eternal and unchanging. We therefore need no other high priest or no other mediator (1 Timothy 2:5). Christ will not (or cannot) share this office with another, neither can He hand the baton over to others. He holds it firm and alone as of right and by way of an everlasting oath. Those that purport to steal this sacred title enter into the dangerous arena of heresy.
Amil has the tendency to quote scriptures that Jesus is the messiah, Lord of lords, King of kings - as if pre-trib, pre-mil is not aware of all the passages in the bible about Jesus; pre-trib, pre-mil are just as familiar and knowledgeable about those, as Amil.

The issue is God's three point plan - the mystery of God who He has declared to His servants the prophets.

1. does God have a plan to bring Israel, the Jews, corporately speaking, to salvation in Jesus?
2. does God have a plan to end the sordid state of existence man has been in ever since the garden of eden; and replace it with man being in an idyllic existence in the everlasting Kingdom of God?
3. does God have a plan to destroy Satan and his angels, and their kingdom, forever?

Yes, to all of the above. The issue is not about questioning anything about Jesus. pre-trib, pre-mil, do not need a new covenant theology sermon about what is in the bible about Jesus.

Revelation 10:7 But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets.

When Amil starts sermonizing new covenant theology - pre-trib, pre-mil should just say stop, get back on the issue of God's three point plan.

Nothing you have written invalidates the pre-trib, pre-mil position.
 
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Douggg

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Guojing

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Faithful Israel embraced it. Apostate Israel rejected it. It is the same today. It will be the same just before Jesus comes. Paul shows throughout his teaching that there are two groups within Israel: one faithful and true, the other unfaithful and merely professing. One is known as “the election” (or “the elect”) and the other as the “blinded” or ‘hardened ones’. One is a friend of God, the other is an enemy of His. God shows Himself bound to one, and strongly against the other. Sadly, Dispensationalists back the wrong Israel in their teachings. They choose natural Christ-rejecting apostate Israel, above the elect spiritual remnant in order to justify their false doctrine. In doing so, they miss the whole development of faithful Israel into the New Testament Church.

The issue on whether we gentile believers are also Israel is a separate discussion.
 
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sovereigngrace

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Amil has the tendency to quote scriptures that Jesus is the messiah, Lord of lords, King of kings - as if pre-trib, pre-mil is not aware of all the passages in the bible about Jesus; pre-trib, pre-mil are just as familiar and knowledgeable about those, as Amil.

The issue is God's three point plan - the mystery of God who He has declared to His servants the prophets.

1. does God have a plan to bring Israel, the Jews, corporately speaking, to salvation in Jesus?
2. does God have a plan to end the sordid state of existence man has been in ever since the garden of eden; and replace it with man being in an idyllic existence in the everlasting Kingdom of God?
3. does God have a plan to destroy Satan and his angels, and their kingdom, forever?

Yes, to all of the above. The issue is not about questioning anything about Jesus. pre-trib, pre-mil, do not need a new covenant theology sermon about what is in the bible about Jesus.

Revelation 10:7 But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets.

When Amil starts sermonizing new covenant theology - pre-trib, pre-mil should just say stop, get back on the issue of God's three point plan.

Nothing you have written invalidates the pre-trib, pre-mil position.

My last post shows the error of Premil.

And yes, God has a plan for Israel. It is the same as Ireland, Italy and Iceland, etc, etc. It is called the cross.
 
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jgr

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That great. They will not be in Israel for long, because the rapture could happen anytime.

Living daily with the Jewish antichrist, they, unlike dispen futurites, are acutely aware that the rapture is a delusional deception.
 
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jgr

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Amil has the tendency to quote scriptures that Jesus is the messiah, Lord of lords, King of kings - as if pre-trib, pre-mil is not aware of all the passages in the bible about Jesus; pre-trib, pre-mil are just as familiar and knowledgeable about those, as Amil.

Then why does pretrib/premil not quote and explain them with the same clarity and insight?

The reason is simple. Pretrib/premil is incapable of exercising the spiritual discernment which is the requisite for the spiritual understanding of these Scriptures.

Its pharisaic talmudic literality precludes such discernment and understanding.

Its denial of the complete fulfillment in Christ's perfect and finished work at Calvary blinds it.

Its refusal to recognize the vast realities and significance of God's watershed Covenant change paralyzes it.

Its elevation of Israel over Christ in God's prophetic plan distracts it.

Its compulsive obsession with the fallacies and fantasies of counterfeit future expectation deceives it.

Its thinking is the thinking of the natural man.

As saith the Scripture:
1 Corinthians 2:14
But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
 
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Spiritual Jew

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Since I did not give any passage from the Olivet Discourse, I thought the answer was obviously no.
Why do you suppose that Jesus didn't say anything about ruling anyone on earth in the Olivet Discourse? He did talk about His second coming and about the judgment occurring when He comes with His angels (Matthew 25:31-46). And He talked about some people inheriting eternal life and the rest being cast into everlasting fire at that time. But nothing about ruling anyone between the time of His second coming and the judgment. Seems to me if such a thing was going to happen He would have mentioned it. But He didn't.
 
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Spiritual Jew

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Israel the nation is currently fallen so the New Covenant could not have begun for them (Romans 11:11).
That verse isn't talking about the entire nation as having fallen, it's talking about individual unbelievers stumbling, but not beyond recovery.

In Romans 11:23 Paul said about those unbelievers in Israel: "if they do not persist in unbelief, they will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again.". He was talking about the very ones who were cut off in his day having the opportunity to be grafted in again. They can't be grafted in again unless they were grafted in before, so that verse applied to those individuals in Paul's day who had been grafted in before but had been cut off because of unbelief. Paul made it clear that a remnant of people in Israel were saved (Romans 11:5), so there is no basis for trying to say that the entire nation was fallen.

The verse you quoted stated clearly " is ready to vanish away", so that verse does not allow you to conclude that Israel is under the New Covenant.

They must first accept the conditions, before it can begin, just like they did in Exodus 24 for the Old Covenant to begin for them.
Some of them have accepted the conditions over the past almost 2,000 years. Why are you acting as if none of them have been saved in the past almost 2,000 years? All of them have had the opportunity to be saved under the conditions of the new covenant and some have been saved on an ongoing basis going all the way back to the day of Pentecost when 3,000 of them were saved (Acts 2:41). Do you think otherwise? If so, that would mean you believe God hasn't given the people of Israel the opportunity to be saved for the past 2,000 years, which is not true at all.
 
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rapture> then the great tribulation>then Jesus returns, destroying those armies gathered to make war on Him> then the 1000 year rule of Jesus with a rod of iron over the heathen.

That is the general universal teaching of pre-trib, pre-mil.

You are misinterpreting the passage in verse 18 to mean all people upon the earth. But it is all people, no matter what their importance, who gather to make war on Jesus. Not all people upon the earth.
Tell me which of the heathen will survive His coming and why. Are not all unbelievers heathen? Are they not all against Jesus? Jesus Himself said "Whoever is not with me is against me" (Matthew 12:30).

Paul wrote that when Jesus comes He will take "vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ" (2 Thess 1:7-8).

Do you believe that anyone who does not know God and doesn't obey the gospel of Jesus Christ will survive His coming? If so, why? That contradicts what Paul taught.

So, again, who exactly will these heathen be that Jesus will rule over? What will make it so that they survive while other heathen will not?
 
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Spiritual Jew

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The point is, there is nothing to object about sacrificing animals, even during the Millennium reign of Christ
You don't object to animal sacrifices being performed for the atonement of people's sins in the future? Why would that be necessary, keeping in mind that Jesus Christ's "once for all" sacrificed atoned for people's sins forever? How can you not see that believing in future animal sacrifices for the atonement of sins is a huge insult to Christ and His sacrifice?

You said that the sacrifices and sin offerings mentioned in the Ezekiel 40-48 prophecy would be "to remember the perfect work of Christ on the cross". Can you acknowledge that scripture does not teach that anywhere and that is complete speculation on your part? Ezekiel 45:15-17 indicates what the sacrifices and offerings would be for, as I showed you. You don't need to speculate.
 
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Spiritual Jew

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The nation of Israel never did accept the New Covenant, which required them to acknowledge that Jesus is their promised Messiah, which the leaders rejected at Acts 7.
A remnant of them did accept it (Romans 11:5). You need to stop acting as if the entire nation rejected Christ. That is not the case.
 
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Spiritual Jew

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Because you keep making statements like the following
Please remember that whatever I say, it's my opinion. I don't think I need to follow every comment by saying "in my opinion", do I? You don't even do that yourself. So, just remember that no matter what I say, it's my opinion and I'm not saying it's a fact. Am I very confident about my opinions? Sure. I don't think there's anything wrong with that.
 
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Douggg

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So, again, who exactly will these heathen be that Jesus will rule over? What will make it so that they survive while other heathen will not?
The heathen who are not part of the Armageddon force who gather together to make war on Jesus.
 
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I believe that when God states Jeremiah 31:31 and Hebrews 8:8, it will come to pass.

So even when Israel the nation currently rejected Christ, they will accept him in the future.
How do you think that will come to be that the entire nation would accept Him in the future? Would God make sure of that somehow? If so, do you somehow not know that God is not a respecter of persons (does not show favoritism based on ethnicity or nationality)? Why would God do something for them in relation to salvation that He wouldn't do for the people of other nations?

Acts 10:34 Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons: 35 But in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with him.
 
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The heathen who are not part of the Armageddon force who gather together to make war on Jesus.
But you miss that in Revelation 19:18 John expanded that out to "all people, both free and bond, both small and great" and not just the "kings" and "captains" and "mighty men" who come against Christ.

Do these heathen that you think Jesus will rule over knot know God and not obey the gospel of Jesus Christ? If so, how do you reconcile that with what Paul taught here:

2 Thess 1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, 8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:

Those are the people that will experience "sudden destruction" from which "they shall not escape" as Paul wrote about in 1 Thess 5:2-3. Where did Paul make any exceptions to who Jesus will take vengeance on when He returns? I don't see any indication that anyone who doesn't know God and doesn't obey the gospel of Christ will be spared. And when you read 2 Peter 3:10-12, it becomes even more clear that none of them could survive.
 
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Guojing

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How do you think that will come to be that the entire nation would accept Him in the future? Would God make sure of that somehow? If so, do you somehow not know that God is not a respecter of persons (does not show favoritism based on ethnicity or nationality)? Why would God do something for them in relation to salvation that He wouldn't do for the people of other nations?

Acts 10:34 Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons: 35 But in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with him.

Romans 11:25-28 clearly explains why God would do that for Israel, because of the promise he made to their ancestors, Abraham Issac and Jacob
 
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Guojing

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A remnant of them did accept it (Romans 11:5). You need to stop acting as if the entire nation rejected Christ. That is not the case.

Israel rise and fall based on their leaders. God made it that way (1 Kings 14:16).

So when their leaders stoned Stephen in Acts 7, the entire nation fell with them.

A remnant did accept but that does not detract from that.
 
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sovereigngrace

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Israel rise and fall based on their leaders. God made it that way (1 Kings 14:16).

So when their leaders stoned Stephen in Acts 7, the entire nation fell with them.

A remnant did accept but that does not detract from that.

It is the remnant that are true Israel. The rest are of their father the devil, like any other nation.
 
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