One Reason to Reject Amill Doctrine

DavidPT

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Jamdoc

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I will respond as I wish, not as you demand. Amils become accustomed to avoidance, whether their posts are long or short. I wonder why? Amils are attracted to the meat of the Word rather than the milk.

Amills are attracted to the sound of their own voice in an argument is what it comes across as.
 
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DavidPT

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What are you talking about?

1 Corinthians 6:2-3 says, Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters? Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?”

Scripture clearly shows us that “the saints will judge the world” and “shall judge angels.” In short, the righteous judge the wicked through their spiritual standing “in Christ.” As “joint-heirs” with the Savior (Romans 8:18), we stand with Him in the judgment. This is a very privileged position.

When does this happen?

When Jesus comes in His glory. Jesus said, in Matthew 19:28, “Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.”

This fits in with countless passages in Holy Writ that demonstrate that judgment day is an event that occurs on the last day, where the righteous are rewarded and the wicked are banished to the lake of fire. We do not need to import anything else into these. For you to do otherwise is to depict your millennium as one ongoing judgment of natural Israel. This is the opposite to classic Premil that elevates Israel to a favor place in their millennium and shows them restoring their whole old covenant apparatus in the presence of Jesus.

This passage locates “the regeneration” at the second coming “when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory.” Here, they will be judging the twelve tribes of Israel."

I don’t believe this is talking about twelve literal stone judgment seats; it is simply referring to the authority that will be exercised by the redeemed when He appears. Unbelieving Israel will be judged by the redeemed saints of all nations – they are “the regeneration” that join Him “when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory” to judge the nations. Israel is shown to be judged at the second coming. Like every other Christ-rejecting nation, they will be cast into the lake of fire. Only those that love Christ will be saved. This is therefore an allusion to the general judgment which occurs at Christ's coming. The elect will judge the Christ rejecting nations and the twelve tribes of Israel that have rejected Christ since His earthly ministry. This passage is simply identifying the group of people that will “sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel” – namely “ye which have followed me, in the regeneration.” This regeneration refers to those who have been changed into Christ's image. This is evidently talking about the elect of all time. It is the elect (both Jew and Gentile) that will judge Christ-rejecting Israel. A future earthly millennial kingdom is not remotely mentioned in this reading.

Barnes in his commentary says re the "regeneration," “the word also means any great change, or a restoration of things to a former state or to a better state. In this sense it is probably used here. It refers to that great revolution-that restoration of order in the universe-that universal new birth which will occur when the dead shall rise, and all human things shall be changed, and a new order of things shall start up out of the ruins of the old, when the Son of man shall come to judgment. The passage, then, should be read, "Ye which have followed me shall, as a reward in the great day of the resurrection of the dead, and of forming the new and eternal order of things-the day of judgment, the regeneration-be signally honored and blessed.”

John Gill writes: “this new dispensation is called the regeneration, and which more manifestly took place after our Lord's resurrection, and ascension, and the pouring down of the Spirit; wherefore the phrase may be connected with the following words, when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory in the regeneration; not in the resurrection of the dead, or at the last judgment, but in this new state of things, which now began to appear with another face: for the apostles having a new commission to preach the Gospel to all the world; and being endued with power from on high for such service, in a short time went every where preaching the word, with great success. Gentiles were converted, as well as Jews, and both brought into a Gospel church state.”

Jesus said, in Luke 22:29-30: “I appoint unto you a kingdom, as my Father hath appointed unto me; That ye may eat and drink at my table in my kingdom, and sit on thrones judging the twelve tribes of Israel.”

Luke 22:29-30 is not denoting any particular order but simply two realities that happen when Jesus comes. It is simply reinforcing the fact that we are going to carry authority in the age to come and will enjoy sweet fellowship forever. Again, there is no millennium mentioned or inferred here. You force that into the text.

The righteous witness of the elect will testify against the ungodly on the last day. No one will be without excuse.

The resurrection/judgment are tied together. It obviously takes one to allow the other. For there to be one general judgment then Scripture must also teach one general resurrection. This I believe Scripture does in several places.

I believe there is one physical resurrection day that sees one all-encompassing raising of mankind. However, within that one resurrection there are two distinct categories of rising embodied: (1) unto “life,” and (2) unto “damnation.” Notwithstanding, there is an undoubted order to the general resurrection; the dead in Christ will rise first, etc.

It is at this great concluding event that both the righteous and the wicked will be raised to face the great final judgment. Notwithstanding, there are two aspects to the one all-consummating resurrection day.

Jesus said in Matthew 12:41-42, “The men of Nineveh shall rise [Gr. anistemi Strong’s 450] in judgment with this generation, and shall condemn it: because they repented at the preaching of Jonas; and, behold, a greater than Jonas is here. The queen of the south shall rise up [Gr. egeiro Strong’s 1453] in the judgment with this generation, and shall condemn it: for she came from the uttermost parts of the earth to hear the wisdom of Solomon; and, behold, a greater than Solomon is here.”

The righteous Old Testament Gentile saint – the queen of the south – is raised at the same time as the wicked Pharisees of Christ’s day to stand before the same judgment seat of Christ.

This is further impressed in the parallel portion in Luke 11:31, only with an additional example, saying, “The queen of the south shall rise up [Gr. egeiro Strong’s 1453] in the judgment with the men of this generation, and condemn them: for she came from the utmost parts of the earth to hear the wisdom of Solomon; and, behold, a greater than Solomon is here. The men of Nineveh shall rise up [Gr. anistemi Strong’s 450] in the judgment with this generation, and shall condemn it: for they repented at the preaching of Jonas; and, behold, a greater than Jonas is here.”

Here, the two main words used throughout the New Testament for resurrection are applied to the general resurrection that occurs on Judgment Day when the Old Testament time saints and wicked join the New Testament saints and wicked at the judgment. Remember the queen of the south and Nineveh are presented as Old Testament Gentile saints that will “rise up in the judgment with” the wicked unbelieving Jews of Christ’s day. There is no prolonged parenthesis period separating the resurrection of the wicked dead and the resurrection of the righteous dead. They both “rise up” at the same time. The Old Testament Gentile city of Nineveh is shown to “rise up in the judgment with” (or meta) the religious Jewish world of Christ’s day and “condemn it.” The Greek word meta (3326) is described in Strong’s concordance as “a primary preposition (often used adverbially); properly, denoting accompaniment; ‘amid’.”


First of all, per Amil there is only the GWTJ once Christ returns, followed by the NHNE. God alone is the one judging everyone at that judgment. God alone is the only one that has everyone's works recorded in books. There is no way in million years that Luke 22:30 has a single thing to do with the GWTJ. How do you apply this to the GWTJ since this is something they do while sitting upon thrones judging the twelve tribes of Israel----That ye may eat and drink at my table in my kingdom?

There are other senses to judge in, such as helping to make proper decisions for someone. If one has read the OT, and I'm sure you have, the following would be an example of the sense I am meaning.

Exodus 18:13 And it came to pass on the morrow, that Moses sat to judge the people: and the people stood by Moses from the morning unto the evening.
14 And when Moses' father in law saw all that he did to the people, he said, What is this thing that thou doest to the people? why sittest thou thyself alone, and all the people stand by thee from morning unto even?
15 And Moses said unto his father in law, Because the people come unto me to enquire of God:
16 When they have a matter, they come unto me; and I judge between one and another, and I do make them know the statutes of God, and his laws.


Ignore something like this though, and instead contradict Scripture by not having God alone being the one judging men on judgment day.
 
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sovereigngrace

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First of all, per Amil there is only the GWTJ once Christ returns, followed by the NHNE. God alone is the one judging everyone at that judgment. God alone is the only one that has everyone's works recorded in books. There is no way in million years that Luke 22:30 has a single thing to do with the GWTJ. How do you apply this to the GWTJ since this is something they do while sitting upon thrones judging the twelve tribes of Israel----That ye may eat and drink at my table in my kingdom?

There are other senses to judge in, such as helping making proper decisions for someone. If one has read the OT, and I'm sure you have, the following would be an example of the sense I am meaning.

Exodus 18:13 And it came to pass on the morrow, that Moses sat to judge the people: and the people stood by Moses from the morning unto the evening.
14 And when Moses' father in law saw all that he did to the people, he said, What is this thing that thou doest to the people? why sittest thou thyself alone, and all the people stand by thee from morning unto even?
15 And Moses said unto his father in law, Because the people come unto me to enquire of God:
16 When they have a matter, they come unto me; and I judge between one and another, and I do make them know the statutes of God, and his laws.


Ignore something like this though, and instead contradict Scripture by not having God alone being the one judging men on judgment day.

What other Scripture do you consider corroborates your opinion of Revelation 20 and teaches there are two distinct future judgement days (that will see all mankind stand before Christ to give account for their lives) separated by a literal 1000 years+?

Premillennialists make much about the distinctiveness between the judgment seat of Christ and the great white throne, is there any passage in Scripture (including Revelation 20) that describes two different thrones?

Is there anywhere else in Scripture that describes a ‘white throne’ or ‘great white throne’?

Where does it call the “great white throne” the “great white throne for sinners” as Premillennialists label it? Where in Revelation 20:11:15 does it limit this judgement to the ungodly?
 
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jeffweedaman

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Can't you see what you are doing here, though? You have an answer for one thing but not an answer for something else as well, in this case meaning an answer for Matthew 19:28 and Luke 22:30 and how that supports Amil rather than Premil instead.

Matthew 19:28 And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.


We all follow him in the regeneration David . The Ministry of reconciliation has already been given to us as well.
The word that Jesus has already spoke will judge people the last day when he sits on his glorious throne.
The Gospel word that we already preach will judge them on the last day as we are already seated with him in the heavenly realms preaching that same word.
Silly to apply this to some future ministry. It is a reality already.
 
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chad kincham

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Where in Barnabas 15:4 did he say (and I quote you): "Behold, the day of the Lord shall be as a thousand years"?

You obviously have a false translation - one that fits your theology. Here is how it really reads:

It is written concerning the Sabbath in the Decalogue which [the Lord] spoke, face to face, to Moses on Mount Sinai, "And sanctify ye the Sabbath of the Lord with clean hands and a pure heart. And He says in another place, "If my sons keep the Sabbath, then will I cause my mercy to rest upon them. The Sabbath is mentioned at the beginning of the creation [thus]: "And God made in six days the works of His hands, and made an end on the seventh day, and rested on it, and sanctified it.” Attend, my children, to the meaning of this expression, He finished in six days.This implieth that the Lord will finish all things in six thousand years, for a day is with Him a thousand years. And He Himself testifieth, saying, Behold, to-day will be as a thousand years.” Therefore, my children, in six days, that is, in six thousand years, all things will be finished.And He rested on the seventh day.” This meaneth: when His Son, coming [again], shall destroy the time of the wicked man, and judge the ungodly, and change the-sun, and the moon, and the stars, then shall He truly rest on the seventh day. Moreover, He says, Thou shalt sanctify it with pure hands and a pure heart.If, therefore, any one can now sanctify the day which God hath sanctified, except he is pure in heart in all things, we are deceived. Behold, therefore: certainly then one properly resting sanctifies it, when we ourselves, having received the promise, wickedness no longer existing, and all things having been made new by the Lord, shall be able to work righteousness. Then we shall be able to sanctify it, having been first sanctified ourselves. Further, He says to them, "Your new moons and your Sabbath I cannot endure." Ye perceive how He speaks: Your present Sabbaths are not acceptable to Me, but that is which I have made, [namely this,] when, giving rest to all things, I shall make a beginning of the eighth day, that is, a beginning of another world. Wherefore, also, we keep the eighth day with joyfulness, the day also on which Jesus rose again from the dead. And when He had manifested Himself, He ascended into the heavens.
So?

If you can’t understand those words, look up sabbath millennium and Barnabas, because he expects a millennium rest after 6,000 years, aka Gods rest for His people, that the sabbath day of rest given to Israel, was also a foreshadow of.
 
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chad kincham

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What you are ignoring is what he said in Barnabas 15:4----saying; Behold, the day of the Lord shall be as a thousand years.

And since he took the thousand years as literal, he is meaning the DOTL will involve a literal thousand years.

If common sense counts for anything, it is common sense that after 6 comes 7, and after 7 comes 8, and that 7 and 8 are not the same number. It is not common sense that after 6 comes 8 instead. If Barnabas concluded that Jesus rose on the 8th day, and that the Jews take Saturday to be meaning the 7th day, did Barnabas then think Jesus rose on Saturday the 7th day? Or did he actually know how to add correctly, thus he knew 8 comes after 7 and that 7 and 8 are not the same number, thus he was meaning Sunday being the day Jesus rose? In the same way, if there are 6000 years in this age according to Barnabas, and that there is then a 7th day and an 8th day, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that Barnabas took the 7th day to be meaning the thousand years in Revelation 20, and that he took the 8th day to be meaning after the great white throne judgment.
The 8th day is reference to the fact His kingdom continues on, as it’s never ending.
The millennium is all about the time Saran is bound and the final battle afterwards.
,
 
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jeffweedaman

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So?

If you can’t understand those words, look up sabbath millennium and Barnabas, because he expects a millennium rest after 6,000 years, aka Gods rest for His people, that the sabbath day of rest given to Israel, was also a foreshadow of.


Matt 11
27 All things have been handed over to Me by My Father; and no one knows the Son except the Father; nor does anyone know the Father except the Son, and anyone to whom the Son determines to reveal Him.

28 “Come to Me, all who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. 29 Take My yoke upon you and learn from Me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. 30 For My yoke is comfortable, and My burden is light.”
 
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chad kincham

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The truth about the millennium and the early church being Premil.

The Early Church Fathers were almost exclusively premillennialists and taught an Eschatological Gospel of Both Comings of Jesus. Consider the following testimony from the Fathers. The Epistle of Barnabus, written late first century/early second century and regarded as equal to Scripture by Origen, denotes the Creation Week as a pattern for human history—one day equals one thousand years—six thousand years of history and the Sabbath rest on the seventh day equates to the Millennium (The Epistle of Barnabus 15:4-5). Papias, an early second century Bishop and disciple of John the Apostle, was recorded by Eusebius (the Early Church historian) to have believed that “there will be a millennium after the resurrection from the dead, when the personal reign of Christ will be established on this earth” (Fragments of Papias VI). Justin Martyr also stated that he was taught his premillennial beliefs from John the Apostle and cited Isaiah 65:17-25, Luke 20:35-36 and Revelation 20:4-6 as references for the Millennium and Psalm 90:4 to support the one day as one thousand years belief (Falls 1965:277).
Theophilus, a second century Bishop of Antioch, spoke of a millennial state which is “intermediate between earth and heaven” (Daley Hope 2003:24). Both Melito, a second century Bishop of Sardis, and Hegesippus maintained a chiliastic position (Remains of the Second and Third Centuries: Melito the Philosopher, Hegesippus, 1 ANF 8:755, 763). The Didache: Teaching of the 12 Apostles addresses the Apostasy, the Rapture of the Saints, the antichrist, the Tribulation, and the Second Advent, drawing on scriptures from Matthew 24; John 5:25; Acts 1:2; 1 Corinthians 15:23, 52; 1 Thessalonians 4:16-18; 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8; and Revelation 1:7; 19:11 (The Fathers of the Church, The Didache: Teaching of the 12 Apostles:183-4). Irenaeus, disciple of Polycarp, disciple of John the Apostle, was a definite premillennarian. Irenaeus was also the first to detail prophetic events after the writing of the New Testament and
©Copyright David Hebert, 2009. All rights reserved. 1
The Need for Teaching the Eschatological Gospel of Both Comings of Jesus Christ in the 21st Century . . . .
gave the Church the first system of premillennial interpretation (Ladd 1956:25-26). Tertullian was an avid premillennialist in the late second and early third centuries and wrote much about the millennial kingdom, even as a defense against heresy (Tertullian Part First: The Apology 48).
Early Church historian Sextus Julius Africanus and N. African Bishop Commodianus both wrote about six thousand years of history and the glorious Millennium following (much like The Epistle of Barnabus) around AD 240 (Julius Africanus 3:18:4; Commodianus ANF 4:209, 211-12, 218). Hippolytus, a disciple of Irenaeus, also taught about six thousand years of history, the Second Coming and then a resurrection kingdom of saints (Ladd 1956:30-1). Nepos, a third century Egyptian Bishop, defended chiliasm against the allegorical interpretation of the Millennium (as recorded by Eusebius 7:24).
Third century Father Methodius wrote about the millennial rest after the Tribulation and equated the Millennium to the Jewish Feast of Tabernacles (or Booths). Methodius also vigorously defended the premillennial view against the allegorical view of Origen (Daley Hope 2003:61-3). Victorinus, Latin-speaking Bishop martyred under Diocletian, formed his premillennial beliefs under Papias, Irenaeus and Methodius. He used Revelation 20-21 as his main scriptural text (Daley Hope 2003:65-6). Lactantius, tutor in the courts of Diocletian and Constantine, believed and taught a six thousand year history followed by one thousand years of Christ reigning on earth (Lactantius 7:14, 25). Finally, and according to J. Dwight Pentecost, Cyprian, Severus and the First Ecumenical Council at Nicea (AD 325) are cited as advocates of premillennialism (1980:373-4) - (Hebert 2004b:3-5).
This testimony may best summed up by Ladd: “With one exception [Caius] there is no Church Father before Origen who opposed the millenarian interpretation, and there is no one before Augustine whose extant writings offer a different interpretation of Revelation 20 than that
©Copyright David Hebert, 2009. All rights reserved. 2

The Need for Teaching the Eschatological Gospel of Both Comings of Jesus Christ in the 21st Century . . . .
of a future earthly kingdom consonant with the natural interpretation of the language” (Ladd 1952:23). Add to this the testimony of Justin Martyr (outlined in Section 1.3.3.1 above), the balance of testimony from Daley continued in an essay entitled “Apocalypticism in Early Christian Theology” (2003), and Richard Kyle’s section on “Early Millenarian Movements” (1998:35-40), and there remains conclusive evidence that the Eschatological Gospel of Both Comings of Jesus Christ was a primary doctrinal concern and hope of the Early Church.
The following Patristic writings on both advents/comings of Jesus also serve to bolster this conclusion: Tertullian in Chapter 7 of Book 3 of The Five Books Against Marcion (ANF 3:326-7); Origen in Chapter 29 of Book 2 of Origen Against Celsus (ANF 4:443); Hippolytus in sections 1, 2 and 21 of Appendix to the Works of Hippolytus: A Discourse by the most blessed Hippolytus, bishop and martyr, on the end of the world, and on the Antichrist, and on the second coming of our lord Jesus Christ (ANF 5:242, 247); Gregory Thaumaturgus in Sections 6, 15, 17, and 18 of Part 2 of A Sectional Confession of Faith (ANF 6:42, 44, 45); Chapter 69 of Recognitions of Clement Book 1 of the Pseudo-Clementine Literature (ANF 8:95); and Augustine in relation to resurrection in Chapters 15 and 19 of Book 1 of Contents of Christian Doctrine: Containing a General View of the Subjects Treated in Holy Scripture (NPNF 1-2:526-7). This hope of the Eschatological Gospel was also perpetuated in the Early Church through the Sacraments of Holy Communion and Baptism (as a sign of fulfilling the Great Commission) and the celebration of the Christian Festivals of the church year (liturgical calendar).
During Holy Communion, the Words of Institution were repeated, as cited by Paul in 1 Corinthians 11:26: “For as often as you eat the bread and drink this cup, you proclaim the Lord’s death until He comes” [emphasis added]. The Lord’s Prayer was also recited, which includes “Thy kingdom come . . . For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory forever. Amen”
 
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sovereigngrace

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So?

If you can’t understand those words, look up sabbath millennium and Barnabas, because he expects a millennium rest after 6,000 years, aka Gods rest for His people, that the sabbath day of rest given to Israel, was also a foreshadow of.

Yes, an eternal rest. He was not alone among the Amils.

Whilst the unregenerate Jews continued to zealously celebrate their Sabbath on a Saturday (their 7th day), early Christians considered their Sabbath day Sunday as the 8th, because it embodied the idea of new beginnings revealed in the supernatural resurrection of Christ. But the mainly Jewish early Church, in its infant state, saw Sunday starting at sun-down on the Roman Saturday. Therefore, uniquely, the 7th Roman day also saw the appearance of the 8th Jewish day.

The introduction of Sunday-keeping was a notable mark of differentiation between Christianity and Judaism. While most orthodox Christians did not observe the Sabbath in the Jewish sense, many Jewish believers did attend the synagogue on the Jewish Sabbath because it was the only way many had of accessing the Old Testament Scriptures. In the synagogue, they had the benefit of hearing the public reading of the inspired pages. As a result, Christian gatherings often took place on a Saturday evening after the Jewish Sabbath had ended. This replaced the traditional Havdallah service, a Jewish religious ceremony that marks the symbolic end of Sabbath and the ushering in of a new week.

It was here that they would discuss what they had earlier heard in the synagogue, give a Christian sense of the inspired text and examine the messianic significance of these readings. As the Gospel spread to the major Christian communities in Antioch, Alexandria, Rome, Asia Minor and throughout the Roman Empire this custom was widely observed. These post-Sabbath meetings became the norm.

So, having Church on Saturday evening after sun-set constituted Sunday worship from a Jewish perspective or Saturday worship within the regular Roman system. It was easy for Christians to view this overlap as both the 7th and the 8th day of the week, and therefore fit their theological paradigm.

Clement of Alexandria, Egypt (A.D. 150 - 215)

Clement associates the coming of the Lord with the 8th day. This was common in early church literature. This was found in both Amillennialist and Premillennialist writings.

Clement explains in chapter 16 of The Stromata (Book 6), speaking on the 4th commandment:

The world was created by God, and that He gave us the seventh day as a rest, on account of the trouble that there is in life. For

God is incapable of weariness, and suffering, and want. But we who bear flesh need rest. The seventh day, therefore, is proclaimed a rest— abstraction from ills— preparing for the Primal Day, our true rest.

Clement looks forward to the eternal Sabbath and to the “true rest” that will accompany it. But he too equates the Sabbath with the 8th day (Sunday), only spiritually relating this to resurrection day:

For the eighth may possibly turn out to be properly the seventh, and the seventh manifestly the sixth, and the latter properly the Sabbath, and the seventh a day of work. For the creation of the world was concluded in six days.

They reckon the number seven motherless and childless, interpreting the Sabbath, and figuratively expressing the nature of the rest, in which they neither marry nor are given in marriage any more.

Clement further explains in chapter 14 of The Stromata (Book 5):

The Lord's day Plato prophetically speaks … after the wandering orbs the journey leads to heaven, that is, to the eighth motion and day … But the seventh day is recognised as sacred, not by the Hebrews only, but also by the Greeks.

The Jewish concept of Saturday as the Sabbath is superseded in early Christian thinking by Sunday as the 7th day. The whole victory of Sunday as resurrection day easily fits in with the future reality of the future resurrection and the introduction of the eternal Sabbath. This was so because many Amillennialist and Premillennialist saw the world lasting only 6,000 years (6 days). The only difference being that Premillennialists saw a one thousand year Sabbath rest when Christ comes, whereas Amillennialist saw an eternal Sabbath rest being introduced.

Origen Alexandria, Egypt (185-254)

Against Celsus (Contra Celsum, Book VI, Chapter 61:

God ended on the sixth day His works which He had made, and ceased on the seventh day from all His works which He had made: and God blessed the seventh day, and hallowed it, because on it He had ceased from all His works which He had begun to make; and imagining the expression, He ceased on the seventh day, to be the same as this, He rested on the seventh day, he makes the remark: After this, indeed, he is weary, like a very bad workman, who stands in need of rest to refresh himself! For he knows nothing of the day of the Sabbath and rest of God, which follows the completion of the world's creation, and which lasts during the duration of the world, and in which all those will keep festival with God who have done all their works in their six days, and who, because they have omitted none of their duties, will ascend to the contemplation (of celestial things), and to the assembly of righteous and blessed beings.​

Origen, in Selecta in Psalmos 118, states:

The number eight, which contains the power of the resurrection, is the figure of the world to come, just as the number seven is the symbol of this present world.

Origen presents the number seven as an eschatological symbol representing this present evil age, and the number eighth as an eschatological figure of the world to come. This was subtly denigrating and eliminating the importance of the Jewish seventh day.

Origen submits in his Homily on Number 23:4

The true Sabbath on which God rests from all his works will be the future age, when pain and grief flee away and God will be all in all. On that Sabbath God will graciously allow us to celebrate with him.

Jerome Rome, Italy (331-420 AD)

Against Jovinianus (Book II) Chapter 25.

Being in bondage during the six days of this world, on the seventh day, the true and eternal Sabbath, we shall be free.

Epistle 139:8

“A thousand years in thy sight as yesterday.” From this passage, and from the epistle which is attributed to the apostle Peter, I conclude that the custom comes of taking a thousand years for one day; with the result, that is, that just as the universe was fashioned in six days, so one believes that it will last only six thousand years, and that afterwards will come the sevenfold and the eightfold number, when the true Sabbath will be kept.

Homily 3, on Psalm 7. FC 48, p. 26.

We have both a first and an eighth day; we receive the kingdom of heaven on the eighth; the eighth day after the sabbath is again the first day from the beginning.

Hilary Bishop of Poitiers, Gaul (modern-day France) (300 –368 AD)

His Commentary on Matthew 17 explain:

After six days, Peter, James and John were taken apart from the others and brought to the top of the mountain. As they were looking on, the Lord was transfigured and resplendent in all the brilliance of his garments. In this manner there is preserved an underlying principle, a number and an example. It was after six days that the Lord was shown in his glory by his clothing; that is; the honour of the heavenly kingdom is prefigured in the unfolding of six thousand years.

Basil, Caesarea Mazaca, (AD 329-379)

The Hexaemeron (Homily 2), 8:

God, who made the nature of time, measured it out and determined it by intervals of days. He ordered the week to revolve from period to period upon itself, to count the movement of time, forming the week of one day revolving seven times upon itself; a proper circle begins and ends with itself. Such is also the character of eternity, to revolve upon itself and to end nowhere. If then the beginning of time is called “one day” rather than the “first day,” it is because Scripture wishes to establish its relationship with eternity.

He adds:

The day of the Lord, Scripture says, is great and very terrible, and elsewhere Woe unto you that desire the day of the Lord: to what end is it for you? The day of the Lord is darkness and not light. A day of darkness for those who are worthy of darkness. No; this day without evening, without succession and without end is not unknown to Scripture, and it is the day that the Psalmist calls the eighth day, because it is outside this time of weeks. Thus whether you call it day, or whether you call it eternity, you express the same idea.
He sums up:

Give this state the name of day; there are not several, but only one. If you call it eternity still it is unique and not manifold. Thus it is in order that you may carry your thoughts forward towards a future life, that Scripture marks by the word one the day which is the type of eternity, the first fruits of days, the contemporary of light, the holy Lord's day honoured by the Resurrection of our Lord. And the evening and the morning were one day.

The coming of Christ, and the introduction of the eternal state, is likened to the 7th day of creation, but designated the eighth day to fit in with the early Christian understanding of Sunday rest. The emphasizing of it having no “succession” or “end” reinforces his perception that the day of the Lord is both climactic and eternal.

Migne, Patr. Graec., 29, 49.

The Lord’s Day is great and glorious. The Scripture knows this day without evening, having no other day, a day without end; the psalmist called it the eighth day, since it is outside of time measured in weeks. Whether you call it a day or an age, it is all the same. If you call it an aeon, it is one, and not a part of a whole.

In De Spiritu Sancto 27:66:

We pray standing, on the first day of the week, but we do not all know the reason. On the day of the resurrection (or standing again Grk. ἀ νάστασις) we remind ourselves of the grace given to us by standing at prayer, not only because we rose with Christ, and are bound to seek those things which are above, but because the day seems to us to be in some sense an image of the age which we expect, wherefore, though it is the beginning of days, it is not called by Moses first, but one. For he says There was evening, and there was morning, one day, as though the same day often recurred. Now one and eighth are the same, in itself distinctly indicating that really one and eighth of which the Psalmist makes mention in certain titles of the Psalms, the state which follows after this present time, the day which knows no waning or eventide, and no successor, that age which ends not or grows old.

He continues:

[A]ll Pentecost is a reminder of the resurrection expected in the age to come. For that one and first day, if seven times multiplied by seven, completes the seven weeks of the holy Pentecost; for, beginning at the first, Pentecost ends with the same, making fifty revolutions through the like intervening days. And so it is a likeness of eternity, beginning as it does and ending, as in a circling course, at the same point.

Gregory the Theologian, Nazianzus, Turkey (AD 325-389)

Gregory the Theologian teaches in On the New Lord's Day, PG 36.612C-13A:

This is what the divine Solomon wishes to symbolize when he commands a part, seven to some, that is, this life; and to others, eight, or the future life. He is speaking here of good works and of the restoration (apokatastasis) of the next life. The great David seems to sing of this day in the psalms on the octave.

Everyone who exercises diligence with regard to virtue has in mind the future life. Its beginning is called the "eighth," for it follows this perceptible time when the number seven is dissolved. Therefore, the inscription “for the eighth” advises us not to set our minds on this present age, but to look to the eighth . . . The present time of the seventh number which is subject to measurement will remain; the eighth will succeed it, the full day of the age to come. [J.83-84].

Just as God rested on the seventh day (“the seventh day is the end of creation and encompasses within itself the time coextensive with the creation of this world” [J.188, l.20-22,]​

Moralium 1, 8,12, PL 75, 532:

The story truly indicates that the blessed Job when offering sacrifices on the eighth day, was celebrating the mystery of the resurrection . . . and served the Lord for the hope of the resurrection.

Oratio 44, In novam Dominicam:

He understands “the first day with reference to those that followed and as the eighth day with regard to those that preceded.

The eighth day, for him "refers to the life to come” and therefore “doing good while yet here on earth."

His first Easter Sermon:

"Behold in this the blessed Sabbath of the first creation! Recognize in that Sabbath this Sabbath. Upon this the only begotten God rested indeed, when he in the gospel plan of death observed the Sabbath after the flesh, and when returning to what he was before, he raised with him everything that was lying down, and became to those who sit in darkness and in the shadow of death, life, resurrection, dawn, and day." "This is the day which God made; it differs from the days which God made at the creation to measure time. It marks the beginning of a new creation. Then on this day God created a new heaven and a new earth — the firmament of faith in Christ, and the good soil of the heart.” “Sabbath-keeping implies inactivity with reference to evil.”

Athanasius, Alexandria, (296 – 373AD)

In Athanasius’ On Sabbath and Circumcision Chapter 3 we learn:

The Sabbath was the end of the first creation, the Lord's day was the beginning of the second, in which he renewed and restored the old in the same way as he prescribed that they should formerly observe the Sabbath as a memorial of the end of the first things, so we honor the Lord's day as being the memorial of the new creation.

John Chrysostom, Constantinople, Turkey, (c. 349–407)

John Chrysostom said in his Treatise on Compunction:

What is then the eighth day but that great and manifest day of the Lord which burns like straw and which makes the powers on high tremble? The Scripture calls it the eighth, indicating the change of state and the inauguration of the future life. Indeed, the present life is one week only, beginning on the first day, ending on the seventh and returning to the same unit again, going back to the same beginning and continuing to the same end. It is for this reason that no one calls the Lord’s day the eighth day but only first day. Indeed, the septenary cycle does not extend to the number eight. But when all these things come to an end and dissolve, then the course of the octave will arise.

Tyconius, Africa (c. 330-390)

Several times, one day is 1000 years just as it is written: “in the day you taste from the tree you shall surely die” and the first seven days or seven thousand years: the Lord worked for six days “and rested from all his works on the seventh day and he blessed and sanctified it.” However, the Lord says “my father is working still.” For just as he worked this world for six days, so he works the spiritual world, which is the church, for six thousand years; and he is going to stop on the seventh day, which he has blessed and made eternal (Libellus Regularis, Rule V.6).​
 
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sovereigngrace

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So?

If you can’t understand those words, look up sabbath millennium and Barnabas, because he expects a millennium rest after 6,000 years, aka Gods rest for His people, that the sabbath day of rest given to Israel, was also a foreshadow of.

Augustine (Hippo Regius, Numidia (now Algeria) (354-430 AD)

The leading Amillennialist of the early fathers was Augustine. Augustine in his Letter 55, Chapter 9:17 states:

If, in reading Genesis, you search the record of the seven days, you will find that there was no evening of the seventh day, which signified that the rest of which it was a type was eternal … the seventh day was an emblem, is eternal, and hence the eighth day also will have eternal blessedness, because that rest, being eternal, is taken up by the eighth day … Accordingly the eighth day, which is the first day of the week, represents to us that original life, not taken away, but made eternal.

Augustine explains his understanding of Revelation 20 and especially where the thousand years should be placed in The City of God, Book 20, Chapter 7:

These things happen in the sixth thousand of years or sixth millennium (the latter part of which is now passing), as if during the sixth day, which is to be followed by a Sabbath which has no evening, the endless rest of the saints.

Augustine explains his understanding of Revelation 20 and especially where the thousand years should be placed in The City of God, Book 22, Chapter 30:

The seventh shall be our Sabbath, which shall be brought to a close, not by an evening, but by the Lord's day, as an eighth and eternal day, consecrated by the resurrection of Christ, and prefiguring the eternal repose not only of the spirit, but also of the body. There we shall rest and see, see and love, love and praise. This is what shall be in the end without end. For what other end do we propose to ourselves than to attain to the kingdom of which there is no end?

Augustine explains in better terms what Barnabas and others taught in regard to the 7th day being the eternal fulfillment of the early Church 8th day of the week rest.

Taking a week as a typology of the duration of time, and especially bearing in mind the teaching of Psalm 90:4 and 2 Peter 3:8 that “one day is with the Lord as a thousand years,” many key early fathers came to the conclusion that time from beginning to end will last 6,000 years. Whilst this was true of both Amillennial and Premillennial fathers, they went their separate ways on what form and duration the seventh day would take. Amillennialists saw the 7th day or Sabbath as the eternal rest whereas Premillennialists saw it as the seventh thousand year Sabbath or rest before eternity.

The early writers considered the new heavens and new earth as the both a 7th and an 8th day. Here is how that mystery existed.

He explains (in Book XII, Contra Faustum, Chapter 8, Reply to Faustus the Manichaean):

In the creation God finished His works in six days, and rested on the seventh. The history of the world contains six periods marked by the dealings of God with men. The first period is from Adam to Noah; the second, from Noah to Abraham; the third, from Abraham to David; the fourth, from David to the captivity in Babylon; the fifth, from the captivity to the advent of lowliness of our Lord Jesus Christ; the sixth is now in progress, and will end in the coming of the exalted Saviour to judgment. What answers to the seventh day is the rest of the saints — not in this life, but in another, where the rich man saw Lazarus at rest while he was tormented in hell; where there is no evening, because there is no decay.

Augustine explains (in Book XII, Contra Faustum, Chapter 19, Reply to Faustus the Manichaean):

The seventh day of rest is connected with the eighth of resurrection. For when the saints receive again their bodies after the rest of the intermediate state, the rest will not cease; but rather the whole man, body and soul united, renewed in the immortal health, will attain to the realization of his hope in the enjoyment of eternal life.

In Contra Faustum, (Reply to Faustus the Manichaean ) Chapter 5 he instructs:

We are not afraid to meet your scoff at the Sabbath, when you call it the fetters of Saturn. It is a silly and unmeaning expression, which occurred to you only because you are in the habit of worshipping the sun on what you call Sunday. What you call Sunday we call the Lord’s Day, and on it we do not worship the sun, but the Lord’s resurrection. And in the same way, the fathers observed the rest of the Sabbath, not because they worshipped Saturn, but because it was incumbent at that time, for it was a shadow of things to come, as the apostle testifies.

In Sermon 259:2 he teaches:

The eighth day therefore signifies the new life at the end of the age; the seventh day the future quite of the saints upon the earth. For the Lord will reign on the earth with His saints as the Scripture says, and will have His Church here, separated and cleansed from all infection of wickedness, where no wicked person will enter.

Connecting the eternal Sabbath (the 7th day) with the 8th week-day and especially the symbolism of the resurrection associated with it totally nullified any association with apostate Judaism. That included the carnal expectation of an earthly material kingdom where Israel ruled over the Gentile nations. It also distanced Christianity from the foolish hope of the return of the old covenant arrangement after the Coming of Messiah. Making the 7th day the eternal Sabbath allowed those who believed in a climactic Coming of Christ to retain something of the Sabbath 7-day symbolism.

Against The Manichees, Book 1:

41. The Seventh Age. May the evening of this age not find us [in this life], if it has not already begun. This is the evening of which the Lord says, "Do you think that the Son of Man will find faith on the earth when he comes?" After this evening there will come the morning, when the Lord himself will come in glory. Then they to whom he said, "Be perfect as your Father, who is in heaven, is perfect," will rest with Christ from all their works. For such men perform works that are very good. After such works one should hope for rest on the seventh day, which has no evening. Words can in no sense express how God made and created heaven and earth and every creature that he created, but this exposition according to the order of days recounts it as a history of works he did so that it has special regard for the prediction of what is to come.
 
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sovereigngrace

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The truth about the millennium and the early church being Premil.

The Early Church Fathers were almost exclusively premillennialists and taught an Eschatological Gospel of Both Comings of Jesus. Consider the following testimony from the Fathers. The Epistle of Barnabus, written late first century/early second century and regarded as equal to Scripture by Origen, denotes the Creation Week as a pattern for human history—one day equals one thousand years—six thousand years of history and the Sabbath rest on the seventh day equates to the Millennium (The Epistle of Barnabus 15:4-5). Papias, an early second century Bishop and disciple of John the Apostle, was recorded by Eusebius (the Early Church historian) to have believed that “there will be a millennium after the resurrection from the dead, when the personal reign of Christ will be established on this earth” (Fragments of Papias VI). Justin Martyr also stated that he was taught his premillennial beliefs from John the Apostle and cited Isaiah 65:17-25, Luke 20:35-36 and Revelation 20:4-6 as references for the Millennium and Psalm 90:4 to support the one day as one thousand years belief (Falls 1965:277).
Theophilus, a second century Bishop of Antioch, spoke of a millennial state which is “intermediate between earth and heaven” (Daley Hope 2003:24). Both Melito, a second century Bishop of Sardis, and Hegesippus maintained a chiliastic position (Remains of the Second and Third Centuries: Melito the Philosopher, Hegesippus, 1 ANF 8:755, 763). The Didache: Teaching of the 12 Apostles addresses the Apostasy, the Rapture of the Saints, the antichrist, the Tribulation, and the Second Advent, drawing on scriptures from Matthew 24; John 5:25; Acts 1:2; 1 Corinthians 15:23, 52; 1 Thessalonians 4:16-18; 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8; and Revelation 1:7; 19:11 (The Fathers of the Church, The Didache: Teaching of the 12 Apostles:183-4). Irenaeus, disciple of Polycarp, disciple of John the Apostle, was a definite premillennarian. Irenaeus was also the first to detail prophetic events after the writing of the New Testament and
©Copyright David Hebert, 2009. All rights reserved. 1
The Need for Teaching the Eschatological Gospel of Both Comings of Jesus Christ in the 21st Century . . . .
gave the Church the first system of premillennial interpretation (Ladd 1956:25-26). Tertullian was an avid premillennialist in the late second and early third centuries and wrote much about the millennial kingdom, even as a defense against heresy (Tertullian Part First: The Apology 48).
Early Church historian Sextus Julius Africanus and N. African Bishop Commodianus both wrote about six thousand years of history and the glorious Millennium following (much like The Epistle of Barnabus) around AD 240 (Julius Africanus 3:18:4; Commodianus ANF 4:209, 211-12, 218). Hippolytus, a disciple of Irenaeus, also taught about six thousand years of history, the Second Coming and then a resurrection kingdom of saints (Ladd 1956:30-1). Nepos, a third century Egyptian Bishop, defended chiliasm against the allegorical interpretation of the Millennium (as recorded by Eusebius 7:24).
Third century Father Methodius wrote about the millennial rest after the Tribulation and equated the Millennium to the Jewish Feast of Tabernacles (or Booths). Methodius also vigorously defended the premillennial view against the allegorical view of Origen (Daley Hope 2003:61-3). Victorinus, Latin-speaking Bishop martyred under Diocletian, formed his premillennial beliefs under Papias, Irenaeus and Methodius. He used Revelation 20-21 as his main scriptural text (Daley Hope 2003:65-6). Lactantius, tutor in the courts of Diocletian and Constantine, believed and taught a six thousand year history followed by one thousand years of Christ reigning on earth (Lactantius 7:14, 25). Finally, and according to J. Dwight Pentecost, Cyprian, Severus and the First Ecumenical Council at Nicea (AD 325) are cited as advocates of premillennialism (1980:373-4) - (Hebert 2004b:3-5).
This testimony may best summed up by Ladd: “With one exception [Caius] there is no Church Father before Origen who opposed the millenarian interpretation, and there is no one before Augustine whose extant writings offer a different interpretation of Revelation 20 than that
©Copyright David Hebert, 2009. All rights reserved. 2

The Need for Teaching the Eschatological Gospel of Both Comings of Jesus Christ in the 21st Century . . . .
of a future earthly kingdom consonant with the natural interpretation of the language” (Ladd 1952:23). Add to this the testimony of Justin Martyr (outlined in Section 1.3.3.1 above), the balance of testimony from Daley continued in an essay entitled “Apocalypticism in Early Christian Theology” (2003), and Richard Kyle’s section on “Early Millenarian Movements” (1998:35-40), and there remains conclusive evidence that the Eschatological Gospel of Both Comings of Jesus Christ was a primary doctrinal concern and hope of the Early Church.
The following Patristic writings on both advents/comings of Jesus also serve to bolster this conclusion: Tertullian in Chapter 7 of Book 3 of The Five Books Against Marcion (ANF 3:326-7); Origen in Chapter 29 of Book 2 of Origen Against Celsus (ANF 4:443); Hippolytus in sections 1, 2 and 21 of Appendix to the Works of Hippolytus: A Discourse by the most blessed Hippolytus, bishop and martyr, on the end of the world, and on the Antichrist, and on the second coming of our lord Jesus Christ (ANF 5:242, 247); Gregory Thaumaturgus in Sections 6, 15, 17, and 18 of Part 2 of A Sectional Confession of Faith (ANF 6:42, 44, 45); Chapter 69 of Recognitions of Clement Book 1 of the Pseudo-Clementine Literature (ANF 8:95); and Augustine in relation to resurrection in Chapters 15 and 19 of Book 1 of Contents of Christian Doctrine: Containing a General View of the Subjects Treated in Holy Scripture (NPNF 1-2:526-7). This hope of the Eschatological Gospel was also perpetuated in the Early Church through the Sacraments of Holy Communion and Baptism (as a sign of fulfilling the Great Commission) and the celebration of the Christian Festivals of the church year (liturgical calendar).
During Holy Communion, the Words of Institution were repeated, as cited by Paul in 1 Corinthians 11:26: “For as often as you eat the bread and drink this cup, you proclaim the Lord’s death until He comes” [emphasis added]. The Lord’s Prayer was also recited, which includes “Thy kingdom come . . . For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory forever. Amen”

You are posting verbatim copyrighted info. This is illegal. This need reported. There is no personal study in any of these posts. You are copying other peoples stuff and posting them full. As a writer, you are only allowed to post exerts to be legal. You are not doing that.
 
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chad kincham

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You are posting verbatim copyrighted info. This is illegal. This need reported. There is no personal study in any of these posts. You are copying other peoples stuff and posting them full. As a writer, you are only allowed to post exerts to be legal. You are not doing that.
it is not illegal - I an not selling it.nor presenting it as my own, and there’s no copyright warning on that website.
 
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sovereigngrace

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it is not illegal - I an not selling it.nor presenting it as my own, and there’s no copyright warning on that website.

I can assuredly tell you: copyright does not mean selling. It means using. You don't seem to have any understanding of the copyright laws. I have written 3 books since 1999. I know the laws. I have a website since 1999. You can only use full articles with permission.
 
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DavidPT

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Where in Barnabas 15:4 did he say (and I quote you): "Behold, the day of the Lord shall be as a thousand years"?

You obviously have a false translation - one that fits your theology. Here is how it really reads:

The Epistle of Barnabas (translation J.B. Lightfoot) ---that was the translation I was quoting from. If that is a false translation, they probably shouldn't be including it at the link. I assumed they were providing accurate translations, or at least close to accurate anyway.

Here is an interesting read if you haven't already read it. It's somewhat lengthy though. Starting at the page labeled in the document---159, is pretty much focusing on the Millennial Ages Theory in chapter 15 of his epistle.


------------------------------
SABBATH IN BARNABAS I59
the six creation days as representing 1000 years each, "He
meaneth this, that in six thousand years the Lord shall bring
all things to an endJJ (15: 4). These six days are followed by
the Sabbath, which apparently represents another millen-
nium commencing "when His Son shall come (15: 5). Then
comes the eighth day, "which is the beginning of another
world (15 : 8). This millennia1 ages idea was not original
with the author, for it is found in the intertestamental
Jewish literature. The earliest reference to it is found in the
Book of Jubilees, which dates from well before Christian
times. 26 The day-millennium equation is stated there as
follows,
And he [Adam] lacked seventy years of one thousand years; for
one thousand years are as one day in the testimony of the heavens
and therefore was it written concerning the tree of knowledge:
"On the day that ye eat thereof ye shall die." For this reason he did
not complete the years of this day; for he died during it.
It remained for a later work to expand this principle into a
complete system, as i t is in the Epistle of Barnabas. This next
step is found in the Book of the Secrets of Enoch (Slavonic),

And I blessed the seventh day, which is the Sabbath, on which
he rested from all his works, And I appointed the eighth day also,
that the eighth day should be the first-created after my work, that
the first seven revolve in the form of the seven thousand, and that
at the beginning of the eighth thousand there should be a time of
not-counting, endless, with neither years nor months nor weeks
nor days nor hours.

https://www.andrews.edu/library/car/cardigital/Periodicals/AUSS/1966-2/1966-2-04.pdf
 
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sovereigngrace

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The Epistle of Barnabas (translation J.B. Lightfoot) ---that was the translation I was quoting from. If that is a false translation, they probably shouldn't be including it at the link. I assumed they were providing accurate translations, or at least close to accurate anyway.

Here is an interesting read if you haven't already read it. It's somewhat lengthy though. Starting at the page labeled in the document---159, is pretty much focusing on the Millennial Ages Theory in chapter 15 of his epistle.


------------------------------
SABBATH IN BARNABAS I59
the six creation days as representing 1000 years each, "He
meaneth this, that in six thousand years the Lord shall bring
all things to an endJJ (15: 4). These six days are followed by
the Sabbath, which apparently represents another millen-
nium commencing "when His Son shall come (15: 5). Then
comes the eighth day, "which is the beginning of another
world (15 : 8). This millennia1 ages idea was not original
with the author, for it is found in the intertestamental
Jewish literature. The earliest reference to it is found in the
Book of Jubilees, which dates from well before Christian
times. 26 The day-millennium equation is stated there as
follows,
And he [Adam] lacked seventy years of one thousand years; for
one thousand years are as one day in the testimony of the heavens
and therefore was it written concerning the tree of knowledge:
"On the day that ye eat thereof ye shall die." For this reason he did
not complete the years of this day; for he died during it.
It remained for a later work to expand this principle into a
complete system, as i t is in the Epistle of Barnabas. This next
step is found in the Book of the Secrets of Enoch (Slavonic),

And I blessed the seventh day, which is the Sabbath, on which
he rested from all his works, And I appointed the eighth day also,
that the eighth day should be the first-created after my work, that
the first seven revolve in the form of the seven thousand, and that
at the beginning of the eighth thousand there should be a time of
not-counting, endless, with neither years nor months nor weeks
nor days nor hours.

https://www.andrews.edu/library/car/cardigital/Periodicals/AUSS/1966-2/1966-2-04.pdf

I do not typically go to outside links as i cannot question them. Thanks any way. If you have any points you want to make then please do.
 
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DavidPT

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I do not typically go to outside links as i cannot question them. Thanks any way. If you have any points you want to make then please do.


It should at least be pretty obvious from that little bit I provided from that pdf, that Barnabas clearly and undeniably concluded that the thousand years are after the 2nd coming, and that he was using sources outside of the Bible, such as Enoch, in order to come to some of those conclusions. But deny it all you want and continue to insist he took the 7th and 8th day to mean the same day. That quote from the book of Enoch I provided, assuming Barnabas relied on that for some of what he concluded, where it appears he obviously did, makes it crystal clear that to Barnabas the 7th day is to be 1000 years in length as well, where only the 8th day was meaning the beginning of a new age to him, a never ending age. That makes him a chiliast then, not an Amil instead, like I and others have been saying all along.
 
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sovereigngrace

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It should at least be pretty obvious from that little bit I provided from that pdf, that Barnabas clearly and undeniably concluded that the thousand years are after the 2nd coming, and that he was using sources outside of the Bible, such as Enoch, in order to come to some of those conclusions. But deny it all you want and continue to insist he took the 7th and 8th day to mean the same day. That quote from the book of Enoch I provided, assuming Barnabas relied on that for some of what he concluded, where it appears he obviously did, makes it crystal clear that to Barnabas the 7th day is to be 1000 years in length as well, where only the 8th day was meaning the beginning of a new age to him, a never ending age. That makes him a chiliast then, not an Amil instead, like I and others have been saying all along.

It doesn't prove anything. Building your mistaken and bias Premil opinion upon the mistaken and bias Premil opinion of another doesn't prove anything but that we are looking at mistaken and bias Premil opinion.
 
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sovereigngrace

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It should at least be pretty obvious from that little bit I provided from that pdf, that Barnabas clearly and undeniably concluded that the thousand years are after the 2nd coming, and that he was using sources outside of the Bible, such as Enoch, in order to come to some of those conclusions. But deny it all you want and continue to insist he took the 7th and 8th day to mean the same day. That quote from the book of Enoch I provided, assuming Barnabas relied on that for some of what he concluded, where it appears he obviously did, makes it crystal clear that to Barnabas the 7th day is to be 1000 years in length as well, where only the 8th day was meaning the beginning of a new age to him, a never ending age. That makes him a chiliast then, not an Amil instead, like I and others have been saying all along.

Because of an ignorance of the early thinking on the 8th day Sunday being the Sabbath (or 7th spiritual day), many commentators mistakenly portray Barnabas as a Premillennialist. They do so even though he explicitly and vividly portrays the second coming as climactic. They fail to see that he saw it as the end of the world. He explained in unambiguous language that the Lord’s return spells the termination of the wicked and the conclusion of all corruption (the result of the fall). He saw the coming of Christ as the time when glorification and perfection would be introduced forever.

What is more, Barnabas never once mentioned or taught about a “one thousand years” future millennium; neither did he detail any of the many fantastic millennial innovations modern-day Premillennialists anticipate for such a future age. He speaks nothing about a future reign of Christ in a thousand years kingdom. He envisioned no mortal sinful survivors at Christ’s appearing to populate the new earth. He did not promote the restarting of the old covenant blood sacrifices, the rebuilding of a future Jewish temple resurrection of the old covenant priesthood. He did not advocate glorified saints sharing the new future earth with mortals satanists, as Premils argue. He did not promote billions of wicked rebels overrunning a future millennium 1000 years after the second coming. He, rather, describes a new pristine eternal day dawning. He didn't teach 2 future resurrections separated by 1000 years+. He didn't recognize 2 future judgments separated by 1000 years+.

In the light of this thorough introduction, let us examine the teaching of Barnabas:

It is written concerning the Sabbath in the Decalogue which [the Lord] spoke, face to face, to Moses on Mount Sinai, "And sanctify ye the Sabbath of the Lord with clean hands and a pure heart. And He says in another place, "If my sons keep the Sabbath, then will I cause my mercy to rest upon them.” The Sabbath is mentioned at the beginning of the creation [thus]: "And God made in six days the works of His hands, and made an end on the seventh day, and rested on it, and sanctified it.” Attend, my children, to the meaning of this expression, “He finished in six days.” This implieth that the Lord will finish all things in six thousand years, for a day is with Him a thousand years. And He Himself testifieth, saying, “Behold, to-day will be as a thousand years.” Therefore, my children, in six days, that is, in six thousand years, all things will be finished.

Barnabas could hardly have made this clearer: “the Lord will finish all things in six thousand years.” He then reinforces this thought by saying: “in six days, that is, in six thousand years, all things will be finished.” There is no way of wriggling out of this. Premillenialists cannot change the decisive language of this ancient father. It is climatic! It is all-consummating! This is unambiguously classic Amillennialism.

He continues, as if to cement his climactic beliefs:

And He rested on the seventh day.This meaneth: when His Son, coming [again], shall destroy the time of the wicked man, and judge the ungodly, and change the-sun, and the moon, and the stars, then shall He truly rest on the seventh day.

Just as if to remove any ambiguity of his climactic beliefs, Barnabas fortifies his opinion that the 6000 years ushers in the end of time. He highlights how this event will see the destruction of the time of the wicked and their final judgment. This is the opposite of the Premillennial position that locates the elimination of the wicked after Satan’s little season, and the mass uprising of the wicked 1,000 years+ after the second coming. He also shows that this will coincide with the physical change that comes to the starry universe at the conflagration. The heavenly planets will be changed at the same time as the earth is renewed: “and change the-sun, and the moon, and the stars.” The ancient writer then adds the postscript: “then shall He truly rest on the seventh day.”

Please see: he believes that the wicked are judged and wiped out before the introduction of the 7th day. The 7th day is therefore considered as a perfect paradise, free of any sin or sinners, death or disease, devil or demon. All rebellion is here finally put down. This too fits the classic Amillennial paradigm, and contradicts the Millennialist one. What is more, the 7th day here is deemed the sabbath rest of God. Barnabas sees it as the believers eternal rest.

He continues:

Moreover, He says, "Thou shalt sanctify it with pure hands and a pure heart.” If, therefore, any one can now sanctify the day which God hath sanctified, except he is pure in heart in all things, we are deceived. Behold, therefore: certainly then one properly resting sanctifies it, when we ourselves, having received the promise, wickedness no longer existing, and all things having been made new by the Lord, shall be able to work righteousness. Then we shall be able to sanctify it, having been first sanctified ourselves.

Here again: he anticipated a sanctified existence for the sanctified saints on a sanctified new earth. The future age is perfect, righteous, incorrupt, eternal, wicked-free, Satan-free, curse-free, sin-free, death-free and decay-free. This is a far cry from the Premillennial debacle of an earth saturated with sin, death, corruption, war, Satan and wicked phonies feigning worship to Christ, when they are in fact, closet Satanists.

He exposes the impotence of the Jewish Saturday sabbath, reminding them of the true Christian sabbath on the Sunday (the 8th day according to early Christian tradition):

"Your new moons and your Sabbath I cannot endure." Ye perceive how He speaks: Your present Sabbaths are not acceptable to Me, but that is which I have made, [namely this,] when, giving rest to all things, I shall make a beginning of the eighth day, that is, a beginning of another world. Wherefore, also, we keep the eighth day with joyfulness [Sunday being considered the early church Sabbath], the day also on which Jesus rose again from the dead [speaking about Sunday]. And when He had manifested Himself, He ascended into the heavens.

Barnabas is not here speaking to a 21st century audience, with all their established eschatological concepts. He is speaking to his own generation, and one that was perfectly familiar with the 8th day theory. He strongly criticizes the Jewish Sabbath (on Saturday) and elevates the Christian Sabbath (Sunday – which the ECFs considered the 8th day) as the true day of rest. The fact that the phrase “the eighth day” was so widely used in early church writings and was widely related to a Sunday Sabbath (every 7 days) reinforces the fact it was common in early church vernacular and it was similarly broadly understood. Remember, there are only 7 days to a week.

No one can surely question that Barnabas was intent on challenging the whole viability of the Jewish Sabbath, which was held on a Saturday. The aim of his teaching was to advance the idea of the superseding of the Jewish Sabbath (the 7th day) under the new covenant with the Christian Sabbath (the 8th day). He believed the Jewish Sabbath had been disposed and had been replaced by a Sabbath rest on the Lord’s Day (resurrection day). According to this early Christian writer, the Jewish Saturday worship did not constitute the true Sabbath. Their Sabbath was rejected by God and because it only served as a symbol of Israel’s rebellion it was unsanctified.

Barnabas simply articulates the popular early church conviction that Sunday was the eight day (and the true Sabbath). He obviously took that from the widespread prevailing thought within the Church of his day. He highlights: because Sunday was the day that “Jesus rose again from the dead” it was a day to be celebrated by believers “with joyfulness.” This was indeed the Christian Sabbath. This was their day of rest.

Samuele Bacchiocchi explains in his exhaustive work From Sabbath to Sunday: “The eighth day is the prolongation of the eschatological Sabbath: that is, after the end of the present age symbolized by the Sabbath, the eighth day marks “the beginning of another world” (v. 8). ‘This is why spend (agomen) even (dio kai) the eighth day with rejoicing’ (v. 9). The eighth day is ‘also (en he kai) the day on which Jesus rose from the dead’ (v. 9). The first theological motivation for the observance of Sunday is of an eschatological nature. The eighth day, in fact, represents “the beginning of a new world.” It is here that appears the incoherence of the author— perhaps acceptable at that time. While, on the one hand, he repudiates the present Sabbath inasmuch as this would have a millennaristic-eschatological significance, on the other hand he justifies the observance of the eighth day by the same eschatological reasons advanced previously to abrogate the Sabbath.”
 
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