How do you test if you are saved? What can a believer do if he doesn't see fruit?

zoidar

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Test yourselves to see if you are in the faith; examine yourselves! Or do you not recognize this about yourselves, that Jesus Christ is in you⁠—unless indeed you fail the test?
— 2 Corinthians 13:5

How do you test yourself? And what is a believer to do if he fails the test?

Edit:

Is this like looking if you have fruit in your life? I hear it all the time if you don't have fruit in your life you are not a born again believer. Ok, let's say you notice you don't bear fruit, then what? No one seems to say what to do if you don't bear fruit.

Edit 2.

I see from the responses that some of you are giving me personal advice. That's very kind of you, but it's not that much that I'm looking for advice to myself (then I would have posted it in "Request for advice"). I'm trying to understand what Paul means and want to know what a believer can do that notices he doesn't bear fruit.
 
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d taylor

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Test yourselves to see if you are in the faith; examine yourselves! Or do you not recognize this about yourselves, that Jesus Christ is in you⁠—unless indeed you fail the test?
— 2 Corinthians 13:5

How do I test myself? And what do I do if I fail the test?

Why are you miss stating this verse, it does not say test yourself to see if you are saved.
 
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Rapture Bound

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Test yourselves to see if you are in the faith; examine yourselves! Or do you not recognize this about yourselves, that Jesus Christ is in you⁠—unless indeed you fail the test?
— 2 Corinthians 13:5

How do I test myself? And what do I do if I fail the test?

Here's an excellent article that addresses your first question, "How do I test myself?" from The Berean Christian Bible Study Resources entitled," How Can You Be Sure of Your Salvation Status?" < http://www.bcbsr.com/topics/certain.html >

As for your second question, "And what do I do if I fail the test?", perhaps my post on August 26, 2021, post #63 may shed a little more light on this incredibly important question entitled, "Connecting the Dots between Justification and Glorification" < Can a genuine, blood-bought, regenerated believer forfeit their salvation? >

The above post attempts to provide additional insight to the nature of saving faith both subjectively and objectively, and it's relationship to the security it provides when we fully trust and rest in Christ's atoning work for us... God Bless.
 
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zoidar

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Here's an excellent article that addresses your first question, "How do I test myself?" from The Berean Christian Bible Study Resources entitled," How Can You Be Sure of Your Salvation Status?" < http://www.bcbsr.com/topics/certain.html >

As for your second question, "And what do I do if I fail the test?", perhaps my post on August 26, 2021, post #63 may shed a little more light on this incredibly important question entitled, "Connecting the Dots between Justification and Glorification" < Can a genuine, blood-bought, regenerated believer forfeit their salvation? >

The above post attempts to provide additional insight to the nature of saving faith both subjectively and objectively, and it's relationship to the security it provides when we fully trust and rest in Christ's atoning work for us... God Bless.

Thanks for sharing!

I hear it all the time if you don't have fruit in your life you are not a born again believer. Ok, let's say I notice I don't bear fruit, then what? No one seems to say what to do if you don't bear fruit.
 
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d taylor

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I thought that is what it meant. Feel free to show me what it means.

Why would you think it means that, when the verse never mentions testing to see if you are saved that is eisegesis.

Paul is speaking to believers telling them to test to see if they are in the faith. In other words to see if Christ is abiding in them. Are they living a life where the Messiah is a working presence in them bringing glory to God.

Maybe this will be an easy example to see this. Take Paul (for an example) who was gifted by God to be able to heal and preform miracles. Paul was only able to do this (heal and preform miracles) because he was living his life so that The Messiah was abiding in Him. The healing, etc.. was not something that Paul had to power to do on his on God gifted that to Him and he was able to do this as long as he was in the faith.

So if Paul began to live his life for himself by living away from the faith. He would have lost his ability to heal and preform miracles.

The disqualified in this (verse) is not about being disqualified in regarded to a believer receiving Eternal Life. It is a disqualified in connection to a believer and rewards.

If a believer looks to his works for assurance, he can never have absolute assurance since no believers works and life are flawless or perfect.

Examine Yourselves (2 Corinthians 13:5) – Grace Evangelical Society

Test Yourselves to See If You Are in the Faith: Assurance Based on Our Works? – 2 Corinthians 13:5 – Grace Evangelical Society


 
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zoidar

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Why would you think it means that, when the verse never mentions testing to see if you are saved that is eisegesis.

Paul is speaking to believers telling them to test to see if they are in the faith. In other words to see if Christ is abiding in them. Are they living a life where the Messiah is a working presence in them bringing glory to God.

Maybe this will be an easy example to see this. Take Paul (for an example) who was gifted by God to be able to heal and preform miracles. Paul was only able to do this (heal and preform miracles) because he was living his life so that The Messiah was abiding in Him. The healing, etc.. was not something that Paul had to power to do on his on God gifted that to Him and he was able to do this as long as he was in the faith.

So if Paul began to live his life for himself by living away from the faith. He would have lost his ability to heal and preform miracles.

The disqualified in this (verse) is not about being disqualified in regarded to a believer receiving Eternal Life. It is a disqualified in connection to a believer and rewards.

If a believer looks to his works for assurance, he can never have absolute assurance since no believers works and life are flawless or perfect.

Examine Yourselves (2 Corinthians 13:5) – Grace Evangelical Society

Test Yourselves to See If You Are in the Faith: Assurance Based on Our Works? – 2 Corinthians 13:5 – Grace Evangelical Society


Could not this lead to accusing oneself for people not being healed when we pray for them, that it is because we are not fully abiding in Christ?

It might be like you say that this verse has nothing to do with whether we are born again or not. But most Christians say if we don't have fruit in our life our faith is dead. Honestly I have never really liked the verse, since I have questioned myself like the clip says, if I'm good enough.

If we set this verse aside then. What is it that proves we have been born again? A change in our life right? So if a Christian haven't seen a true change, where does he start?
 
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d taylor

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Could not this lead to accusing oneself for people not being healed when we pray for them, that it is because we are not fully abiding in Christ?

It might be like you say that this verse has nothing to do with whether we are born again or not. But most Christians say if we don't have fruit in our life our faith is dead. Honestly I have never really liked the verse, since I have questioned myself like the clip says, if I'm good enough.

If we set this verse aside then. What is it that proves we have been born again? A change in our life right? So if a Christian haven't seen a true change, where does he start?

Praying for healing is not the same as what Paul did, he was a person who God worked miracles through. If you were sick or even died and Paul came to you the healing would have been immediately.

That is not the same as say a group of believers praying for healing of a person where God may or may not answer the prayers by healing the said person.

So what is being accomplished in that regard today, still is no judge as to a believer or to judge a person. God may or may not heal today, but God knows why, really no one else could muster a reason why a healing did or did not happen.

What proves a person has been born again as you ask
What is it that proves we have been born again? A change in our life right? So if a Christian haven't seen a true change, where does he start?

What better proof that the promise of Jesus (The Messiah), Jesus simply states that when a person believes He is the promised Messiah from the prophecies of The Tanakh and trust in The Messiah for God's free gift of Eternal Life they have Eternal Life never to lose it. It is not based on a life change or doing something for God (repenting, obedience, producing fruit, confessing Christ, trying to live sinless, etc..).

Can this get any clearer than stated by these verses ( note they are not place in any specific order)

“Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life.

Most assuredly, I say to you, he who believes in Me has everlasting life


And Jesus said to them, “I am the bread of life. He who comes to Me shall never hunger, and he who believes in Me shall never thirst.

Do not labor for the food which perishes, but for the food which endures to everlasting life, which the Son of Man will give you, because God the Father has set His seal on Him.”
Then they said to Him, “What shall we do, that we may work the works of God?”
Jesus answered and said to them, “This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He sent.”


Jesus answered and said to her, “Whoever drinks of this water will thirst again, but whoever drinks of the water that I shall give him will never thirst. But the water that I shall give him will become in him a fountain of water springing up into everlasting life.”

Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. He who believes in Me, though he may die, he shall live. And whoever lives and believes in Me shall never die. Do you believe this?”
She said to Him, “Yes, Lord, I believe that You are the Christ, the Son of God, who is to come into the world.”
 
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Rapture Bound

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zoidar replied, "Is this like looking if I have fruit in my life? I hear it all the time if you don't have fruit in your life you are not a born again believer. Ok, let's say I notice I don't bear fruit, then what? No one seems to say what to do if you don't bear fruit."

Yeah, the issue that you bring up is one that really needs to be addressed. It really cuts
to the core of what it actually means to have a true, living, saving experience and
relationship with he One True God through Jesus Christ.

What to do if we do not bear fruit? Well, what really needs to be understood here is how
that fruit is produced. It is critical to understand that God will produce fruit in those,
and only those, who have experienced the new birth (John 3:3-8). All who have received the life-imparting seed of the Holy Spirit will, to one degree or another, produce fruit.

Matthew 13:23,"But he who received seed on the good ground is he who hears the word and understands it, who indeed bears fruit and produces: some a hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.”

Galatians 5:22-23,"But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness,
goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control. Against such there is no law."

We cannot get "the cart (fruit) before the horse (Holy Spirit regeneration)"... it is from
this perspective I now approach this topic. There cannot be any "fruit" until there is
actually a "root"... and that "root" is in essence the impartation of the Holy Spirit's
regenerative work at a person's new birth experience. (Titus 3:5).

With that said, the key questions here can now be re-worded to say, "How does a person know that they have received the new birth experience?"..in other words, "What are the actual, perceivable, knowable, changes take place in a person's mind/heart as a result of their conversion/new birth experience?"

It has commonly been said, and rightly so, that the Christian faith should not be based upon feelings or emotions. But it is also true that feelings and emotions will necessarily
accompany a person's full and free pardon of ever sin they ever have, or ever will commit. And when I say, "feelings and emotions" here I am specifically referring to the aspect of (the subjective or personal) knowing that they have experienced a full forgiveness of their sins through a new birth experience. Can a person's sins be forgiven without that person realizing that their sins have been forgiven? How can a person have any confidence at all that they have been accepted before God without this knowledge? Do we say after receiving Jesus as Lord and Savior, "I think I became a Christian today, I don't know if I really believe it or not, or if I will actually go to heaven when I die, but I'm excited anyway?"... this really sounds ridiculous to me, but yet that is the theology of many professing Christians, whether they realize it or not.

So, in a nut-shell, what is necessary here is honestly evaluating if we have in actuality
experienced this new birth event. Right along side of the aspect of owning the general
qualities listed as the fruit of regeneration is the aspect of the renewal of our minds;
that is, the incredible "re-shaping" of our "world-view" that occurs and originates at our
regeneration concerning the fallen, sinful state of mankind, our relationship to God..our
ultimate reason, and purpose for existing.. the driving force that inspires us to wake up
each morning.


Titus 3:5," not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us, through the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit,"

Many have greatly underestimated, and failed to grasp the magnitude of the renewing, regenerating work of the Holy Spirit, and His radical transformational effect upon the
believer's nature. The Apostle Paul regards this change from sin to righteousness, from bondage to freedom, from death to life, as summed up in one definite act of the past; potentially available to all men in Jesus' sacrificial death and resurrection, and actualized (effectual) in each individual when they place their trust in Christ's atoning work. It is the definiteness, the absoluteness of this change, considered as a historical crisis, which forms the central idea of St Paul’s teaching, and which the aorist marks.

2 Corinthians 5:17-21,"Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; old things have passed away; behold, all things have become new."

What is the condition of renewal? ‘If any man be in Christ’-how distinctly that implies something more than human in Paul’s conception of Christ. It implies personal union with Him, so that He is the very element or atmosphere in which we live. And that union is brought about by faith in Him.

How does such a state of union with Christ make a man a new creation? It gives a new aim and center for our lives. Then we live not unto ourselves; then everything is different and looks so, for the center is shifted. That union introduces a constant reference to Him and contemplation of His death for us, it leads to self-abnegation.

It puts all life under the influence of a new love. ‘The love of Christ constraineth.’ As is a man’s love, so is his life. The mightiest devolution is to excite a new love, by which old loves and tastes are expelled. ‘A new affection’ has ‘expulsive power,’ as the new sap rising in the springtime pushes off the lingering withered leaves. So union with Him meets the difficulty arising from inclination still hankering after evil. The new love gives a new and mighty motive for obedience.

That union breaks the terrible chain that binds us to the past. ‘All died.’ The past is broken as much as if we were dead. It is broken by the great act of forgiveness. Sin holds men by making them feel as if what has been must be-an awful entail of evil. In Christ we die to former self.

That union brings a new divine power to work in us. ‘I live, yet not I, but Christ liveth in me.’ It sets us in a new world which yet is the old. All things are changed if we are changed. They are the same old things, but seen in a new light, used for new purposes, disclosing new relations and powers. Earth becomes a school and discipline for heaven. The world is different to a blind man when cured, or to a deaf one,-there are new sights for the one, new sounds for the other. All this is true in the measure in which we live in union with Christ.

Examine yourselves as to whether you are in the faith."

My friends, here is where "the pedal hits the metal," This is where we are heading full speed into a reality check that brings with it eternal implications. All who profess to be followers of Christ must subject themselves to a sincere evaluation of their spiritual condition.

What is the test of genuineness?... in other words, What is the evidence that a person is a true believer (that they have truly been born again - John 3:3-8)? The following is
certainly not a comprehensive listing, but a brief overview of the critical characteristics
that true followers of Christ possess :

(1) A love for, and longing to be with other believers. (1 John 4:7-8,20).

(2) A hunger for, and ability to understand the Bible. (John 6:33-35; Matt.5:6; Ps.119;
1 Cor.2:14-16).

(3) A desire to see others receive Jesus as their Lord and Savior (and rescued from eternal destruction). (Rom.9:1-3; Jude 1:23).

(4) A repulsion or abhorrence towards sinful behavior. (Ps.45:7; 97:10; Proverb 8:13;
Heb.1:9).

(5) A supreme love for God (Matt.22:37-38; 1 John 4:19), and desire to please and obey Him. (1 John 2:15; 1 John 2:5; John 14:21-25; Ps.119:47-48).

(6) An assurance of being a child of God, and experiencing a future reception of the
heavenly inheritance. (John 5:24; 6:40; 10:28; Rom.8:16,38-39; 2 Cor.5:4-5; Eph.4:30;
Phil.1:6; 1 Pet.1:23; 1 John 3:14,19,24; 5:11-13).

Hope this helps... Blessings!
 
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JayH1119

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If we set this verse aside then. What is it that proves we have been born again? A change in our life right? So if a Christian haven't seen a true change, where does he start?

Faith is what "proves we have been born again". Faith leads to a "change in our life". That change may not look like what you expect it to but I'd be willing to bet you wouldn't have been so concerned about your status(?) before faith started working in you. That's a change.

It's always a danger to judge our insides by other people's outsides. Start with prayer.
 
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Clintpauljohnson

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For me fruit is an inner peace, conviction when I sin, I have aspergers so love and joy is hard for me to express. However, the bible states, he that does not love is not abiding in Christ. Maybe I love in a different way that I do not realize.
 
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DaDaBrothers

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How do I test myself?

You test yourself by looking at the fruits you bare. Good fruit means good tree, bad fruit means bad tree. If you are a good tree you must bear at least "thirtyfold" from the seed you received. Your fruit is the works you do.

Matthew 7:20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

Here is your test:

Do you have the Son of God?
1 John 5:12 He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.

Do you keep His commandments?
1 John 2:3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.

Do you walk even as He walked?
1 John 2:6 He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked.

Do you love your brother?
1 John 2:10 He that loveth his brother abideth in the light, and there is none occasion of stumbling in him.

Do you sin?
1 John 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

Do you love with your tongue? Or in deed and in truth ?
1 John 3:18 My little children, let us not love in word, neither in tongue; but in deed and in truth.

Can you show me your faith by your works?
James 2:18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.

I don't bear fruit, then what?

If you don't bear fruit, not only it will not be given, but also everything you seemeth to have will be taken away.
Luke 8:18 Take heed therefore how ye hear: for whosoever hath, to him shall be given; and whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken even that which he seemeth to have.
 
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zoidar

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zoidar replied, "Is this like looking if I have fruit in my life? I hear it all the time if you don't have fruit in your life you are not a born again believer. Ok, let's say I notice I don't bear fruit, then what? No one seems to say what to do if you don't bear fruit."

Yeah, the issue that you bring up is one that really needs to be addressed. It really cuts
to the core of what it actually means to have a true, living, saving experience and
relationship with he One True God through Jesus Christ.

What to do if we do not bear fruit? Well, what really needs to be understood here is how
that fruit is produced. It is critical to understand that God will produce fruit in those,
and only those, who have experienced the new birth (John 3:3-8). All who have received the life-imparting seed of the Holy Spirit will, to one degree or another, produce fruit.

Matthew 13:23,"But he who received seed on the good ground is he who hears the word and understands it, who indeed bears fruit and produces: some a hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.”

Galatians 5:22-23,"But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness,
goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control. Against such there is no law."

We cannot get "the cart (fruit) before the horse (Holy Spirit regeneration)"... it is from
this perspective I now approach this topic. There cannot be any "fruit" until there is
actually a "root"... and that "root" is in essence the impartation of the Holy Spirit's
regenerative work at a person's new birth experience. (Titus 3:5).

With that said, the key questions here can now be re-worded to say, "How does a person know that they have received the new birth experience?"..in other words, "What are the actual, perceivable, knowable, changes take place in a person's mind/heart as a result of their conversion/new birth experience?"

It has commonly been said, and rightly so, that the Christian faith should not be based upon feelings or emotions. But it is also true that feelings and emotions will necessarily
accompany a person's full and free pardon of ever sin they ever have, or ever will commit. And when I say, "feelings and emotions" here I am specifically referring to the aspect of (the subjective or personal) knowing that they have experienced a full forgiveness of their sins through a new birth experience. Can a person's sins be forgiven without that person realizing that their sins have been forgiven? How can a person have any confidence at all that they have been accepted before God without this knowledge? Do we say after receiving Jesus as Lord and Savior, "I think I became a Christian today, I don't know if I really believe it or not, or if I will actually go to heaven when I die, but I'm excited anyway?"... this really sounds ridiculous to me, but yet that is the theology of many professing Christians, whether they realize it or not.

So, in a nut-shell, what is necessary here is honestly evaluating if we have in actuality
experienced this new birth event. Right along side of the aspect of owning the general
qualities listed as the fruit of regeneration is the aspect of the renewal of our minds;
that is, the incredible "re-shaping" of our "world-view" that occurs and originates at our
regeneration concerning the fallen, sinful state of mankind, our relationship to God..our
ultimate reason, and purpose for existing.. the driving force that inspires us to wake up
each morning.


Titus 3:5," not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us, through the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit,"

Many have greatly underestimated, and failed to grasp the magnitude of the renewing, regenerating work of the Holy Spirit, and His radical transformational effect upon the
believer's nature. The Apostle Paul regards this change from sin to righteousness, from bondage to freedom, from death to life, as summed up in one definite act of the past; potentially available to all men in Jesus' sacrificial death and resurrection, and actualized (effectual) in each individual when they place their trust in Christ's atoning work. It is the definiteness, the absoluteness of this change, considered as a historical crisis, which forms the central idea of St Paul’s teaching, and which the aorist marks.

2 Corinthians 5:17-21,"Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; old things have passed away; behold, all things have become new."

What is the condition of renewal? ‘If any man be in Christ’-how distinctly that implies something more than human in Paul’s conception of Christ. It implies personal union with Him, so that He is the very element or atmosphere in which we live. And that union is brought about by faith in Him.

How does such a state of union with Christ make a man a new creation? It gives a new aim and center for our lives. Then we live not unto ourselves; then everything is different and looks so, for the center is shifted. That union introduces a constant reference to Him and contemplation of His death for us, it leads to self-abnegation.

It puts all life under the influence of a new love. ‘The love of Christ constraineth.’ As is a man’s love, so is his life. The mightiest devolution is to excite a new love, by which old loves and tastes are expelled. ‘A new affection’ has ‘expulsive power,’ as the new sap rising in the springtime pushes off the lingering withered leaves. So union with Him meets the difficulty arising from inclination still hankering after evil. The new love gives a new and mighty motive for obedience.

That union breaks the terrible chain that binds us to the past. ‘All died.’ The past is broken as much as if we were dead. It is broken by the great act of forgiveness. Sin holds men by making them feel as if what has been must be-an awful entail of evil. In Christ we die to former self.

That union brings a new divine power to work in us. ‘I live, yet not I, but Christ liveth in me.’ It sets us in a new world which yet is the old. All things are changed if we are changed. They are the same old things, but seen in a new light, used for new purposes, disclosing new relations and powers. Earth becomes a school and discipline for heaven. The world is different to a blind man when cured, or to a deaf one,-there are new sights for the one, new sounds for the other. All this is true in the measure in which we live in union with Christ.

Examine yourselves as to whether you are in the faith."

My friends, here is where "the pedal hits the metal," This is where we are heading full speed into a reality check that brings with it eternal implications. All who profess to be followers of Christ must subject themselves to a sincere evaluation of their spiritual condition.

What is the test of genuineness?... in other words, What is the evidence that a person is a true believer (that they have truly been born again - John 3:3-8)? The following is
certainly not a comprehensive listing, but a brief overview of the critical characteristics
that true followers of Christ possess :

(1) A love for, and longing to be with other believers. (1 John 4:7-8,20).

(2) A hunger for, and ability to understand the Bible. (John 6:33-35; Matt.5:6; Ps.119;
1 Cor.2:14-16).

(3) A desire to see others receive Jesus as their Lord and Savior (and rescued from eternal destruction). (Rom.9:1-3; Jude 1:23).

(4) A repulsion or abhorrence towards sinful behavior. (Ps.45:7; 97:10; Proverb 8:13;
Heb.1:9).

(5) A supreme love for God (Matt.22:37-38; 1 John 4:19), and desire to please and obey Him. (1 John 2:15; 1 John 2:5; John 14:21-25; Ps.119:47-48).

(6) An assurance of being a child of God, and experiencing a future reception of the
heavenly inheritance. (John 5:24; 6:40; 10:28; Rom.8:16,38-39; 2 Cor.5:4-5; Eph.4:30;
Phil.1:6; 1 Pet.1:23; 1 John 3:14,19,24; 5:11-13).

Hope this helps... Blessings!

I liked your post, but one question seems unanswered. How does one receive the new birth? 2010 I had my new birth experience, but I like to hear your understanding. There are a lot of believers who struggle with this, they believe yet doubt they have been born again.
 
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zoidar

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You test yourself by looking at the fruits you bare. Good fruit means good tree, bad fruit means bad tree. If you are a good tree you must bear at least "thirtyfold" from the seed you received. Your fruit is the works you do.

Matthew 7:20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

Here is your test:

Do you have the Son of God?
1 John 5:12 He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.

Do you keep His commandments?
1 John 2:3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.

Do you walk even as He walked?
1 John 2:6 He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked.

Do you love your brother?
1 John 2:10 He that loveth his brother abideth in the light, and there is none occasion of stumbling in him.

Do you sin?
1 John 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

Do you love with your tongue? Or in deed and in truth ?
1 John 3:18 My little children, let us not love in word, neither in tongue; but in deed and in truth.

Can you show me your faith by your works?
James 2:18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.



If you don't bear fruit, not only it will not be given, but also everything you seemeth to have will be taken away.
Luke 8:18 Take heed therefore how ye hear: for whosoever hath, to him shall be given; and whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken even that which he seemeth to have.

Do you believe you do all this you mention?

You never answered how one is born again to be able to do what you say we must do.
 
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DaDaBrothers

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Do you believe you do all this you mention?

How does my belief in what I do help you test yourself? I shouldnt talk about myself and if I do my testimony is not true. I answerd your question, why do you dodge? You want to talk about myself now? Will you only follow Christ if I do?


You never answered how one is born again to be able to do what you say we must do.

"what I say"? Every question is founded on the word of God. It is not just "what I say".

"born again" is to repent, be baptised and "go and sin no more".
Is a change of hearth, a change of mind. What you were in the past dies to sin, and a new man is born who lives to God. This new man does not sin like the dead man did in the past, this is how you know you are the new man, if you keep His commandments..

1st make you clean and put away evil:
Isaiah 1:16 Wash you, make you clean; put away the evil of your doings from before mine eyes; cease to do evil;

2nd Learn to do well:
Isaiah 1:17 Learn to do well; seek judgment, relieve the oppressed, judge the fatherless, plead for the widow.

Now obey God or be devoured with the sword:
Isaiah 1:19 If ye be willing and obedient, ye shall eat the good of the land:
20 But if ye refuse and rebel, ye shall be devoured with the sword: for the mouth of the Lord hath spoken it.
 
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zoidar

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How does my belief in what I do help you test yourself? I shouldnt talk about myself and if I do my testimony is not true. I answerd your question, why do you dodge? You want to talk about myself now? Will you only follow Christ if I do?




"what I say"? Every question is founded on the word of God. It is not just "what I say".

"born again" is to repent, be baptised and "go and sin no more".
Is a change of hearth, a change of mind. What you were in the past dies to sin, and a new man is born who lives to God. This new man does not sin like the dead man did in the past, this is how you know you are the new man, if you keep His commandments..

1st make you clean and put away evil:
Isaiah 1:16 Wash you, make you clean; put away the evil of your doings from before mine eyes; cease to do evil;

2nd Learn to do well:
Isaiah 1:17 Learn to do well; seek judgment, relieve the oppressed, judge the fatherless, plead for the widow.

Now obey God or be devoured with the sword:
Isaiah 1:19 If ye be willing and obedient, ye shall eat the good of the land:
20 But if ye refuse and rebel, ye shall be devoured with the sword: for the mouth of the Lord hath spoken it.

I don't think I dodge. I just don't think anyone can do what you say we are to do. Sounds like you are preaching perfection.
 
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Rapture Bound

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zoidar replied, "How does one receive the new birth? 2010 I had my new birth experience, but I like to hear your understanding. There are a lot of believers who struggle with this, they believe yet doubt they have been born again."

It was back in October of 1983 that I experienced my new birth, I can vividly remember that greatest day of my life!...."There are a lot of believers who struggle with this, they believe yet doubt they have been born again." Well, there is good reason for some to struggle like this since their conversion experience may not have been genuine; otherwise the instructions given in 2 Cor.13:5 - "Test yourselves to see if you are in the faith" would be pointless.

However, as I have pointed out in past posts, this is certainly not to say that subsequent to a genuine new birth event a person won't experience doubts and fears concerning their standing with God on some level. The most important objective truth to keep in mind for every person who is beginning their walk with Christ is once they have been justified, their status can and will never change. If a person can truly keep their focus at what Christ has accomplished for them...a complete and finished salvation, rather than focusing on their own righteous performance, they will be able to consistently maintain a security and assurance of their standing before God. The real issue here is, "have they ever truly believed in this scriptural promise?"; if not, then it is most likely they have never truly entered in through the narrow gate - the reception of the imputed righteousness of Christ in exchange for all the sinfulness of the sinner who has truly placed all their trust in Christ's substitutionary work on the cross as their righteousness.

2 Corinthians 5:21," For He made Him who knew no sin to be sin for us, that we might become the righteousness of God in Him."...This is rightly called "The Great Exchange."

""How does one receive the new birth?"...

This is essentially the same as asking, "How do we receive the gift of eternal life?"...

John 1:12,"But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name:"

In a nut-shell, (as you well know this can get very lengthy), I would say:

Mark 1:15,"and saying, “The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand. Repent, and believe in the gospel.”

(1) Believing that Christ has truly died in our place and rose again for the remittal all of our sins - past, present, and future. Trusting that this promise is not too good to be true, but is actually true and intended for each one of us.

(2) Repenting or having a change of mind concerning our relationship with God, and acknowledging that we are sinners through and through, and are in desperate need of forgiveness and asking Him for that forgiveness and reconciliation to Him.

These are the two fundamental truths that must be grasped, acknowledged, truly received, and exercised by a person in order to receive the forgiveness that the scriptures freely offer by God's grace.

As simple as this may be, many will fall short of receiving the promise of eternal life by either trusting in their own morality/righteous behavior to achieve a righteous standing before God, or - the equal and opposite error of supposing that a purely intellectual acknowledgement of Christ's atoning work is sufficient to receive the promise (i.e, " even the demons believe—and tremble!" - James 2:19), without a sincere, repentant heart.....

2 Timothy 2:19,"Nevertheless the solid foundation of God stands, having this seal: “The Lord knows those who are His,” and, “Let everyone who names the name of Christ depart from iniquity.”








 
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zoidar

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zoidar replied, "How does one receive the new birth? 2010 I had my new birth experience, but I like to hear your understanding. There are a lot of believers who struggle with this, they believe yet doubt they have been born again."

It was back in October of 1983 that I experienced my new birth, I can vividly remember that greatest day of my life!...."There are a lot of believers who struggle with this, they believe yet doubt they have been born again." Well, there is good reason for some to struggle like this since their conversion experience may not have been genuine; otherwise the instructions given in 2 Cor.13:5 - "Test yourselves to see if you are in the faith" would be pointless.

However, as I have pointed out in past posts, this is certainly not to say that subsequent to a genuine new birth event a person won't experience doubts and fears concerning their standing with God on some level. The most important objective truth to keep in mind for every person who is beginning their walk with Christ is once they have been justified, their status can and will never change. If a person can truly keep their focus at what Christ has accomplished for them...a complete and finished salvation, rather than focusing on their own righteous performance, they will be able to consistently maintain a security and assurance of their standing before God. The real issue here is, "have they ever truly believed in this scriptural promise?"; if not, then it is most likely they have never truly entered in through the narrow gate - the reception of the imputed righteousness of Christ in exchange for all the sinfulness of the sinner who has truly placed all their trust in Christ's substitutionary work on the cross as their righteousness.

2 Corinthians 5:21," For He made Him who knew no sin to be sin for us, that we might become the righteousness of God in Him."...This is rightly called "The Great Exchange."

""How does one receive the new birth?"...

This is essentially the same as asking, "How do we receive the gift of eternal life?"...

John 1:12,"But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name:"

In a nut-shell, (as you well know this can get very lengthy), I would say:

Mark 1:15,"and saying, “The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand. Repent, and believe in the gospel.”

(1) Believing that Christ has truly died in our place and rose again for the remittal all of our sins - past, present, and future. Trusting that this promise is not too good to be true, but is actually true and intended for each one of us.

(2) Repenting or having a change of mind concerning our relationship with God, and acknowledging that we are sinners through and through, and are in desperate need of forgiveness and asking Him for that forgiveness and reconciliation to Him.

These are the two fundamental truths that must be grasped, acknowledged, truly received, and exercised by a person in order to receive the forgiveness that the scriptures freely offer by God's grace.

As simple as this may be, many will fall short of receiving the promise of eternal life by either trusting in their own morality/righteous behavior to achieve a righteous standing before God, or - the equal and opposite error of supposing that a purely intellectual acknowledgement of Christ's atoning work is sufficient to receive the promise (i.e, " even the demons believe—and tremble!" - James 2:19), without a sincere, repentant heart.....

2 Timothy 2:19,"Nevertheless the solid foundation of God stands, having this seal: “The Lord knows those who are His,” and, “Let everyone who names the name of Christ depart from iniquity.”
I was four years old when you got born again. :)

I didn't know much when I was born again. All I knew was that Jesus died for our sins and that I was on my way downward. I prayed to God for forgiveness and God was merciful.

Thank you for your response!
 
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Hezekiah81

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Test yourselves to see if you are in the faith; examine yourselves! Or do you not recognize this about yourselves, that Jesus Christ is in you⁠—unless indeed you fail the test?
— 2 Corinthians 13:5

How do I test myself? And what is a believer to do if he fails the test?

Edit:

Is this like looking if I have fruit in my life? I hear it all the time if you don't have fruit in your life you are not a born again believer. Ok, let's say I notice I don't bear fruit, then what? No one seems to say what to do if you don't bear fruit.
Here's how you know you are born again, you despise what God despises and you love what God loves. Trust me you'll know when you receive the set-apart Spirit the change is evident and undeniable.
 
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