20 major reasons to reject the Premillennial doctrine

Status
Not open for further replies.

Douggg

anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist
May 28, 2009
28,781
3,421
Non-dispensationalist
✟359,693.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
You totally totally sidestepped 1 Thessalonians 4:15-5:7. You do not address any of the detailed arguments and attached supported reasoning I submitted on this. You didn't present anything in your response to show that there is any tribulation period in-between your supposed 2 future comings. That is because they are not in the text, or any other. You must force it in there. The burden of proof is with you to prove this. The fact is: the reason you do not is because you cannot. You are arguing from silence! The reality is: 1 Thessalonians 4:15-5:7 forbids Pretrib.
You are in combat mode. Please tame the emotions.

On your list, could you please insert "the beginning of the Day of the Lord" at the appropriate place?

I have read through you list, and you did a good job on communicating your position. Although I disagree with several parts of it.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

sovereigngrace

Well-Known Member
Dec 9, 2019
9,042
3,450
USA
Visit site
✟202,584.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
The moment they rebelled after they listened to Satan, like Cain and Adam, they let sin into the world. They were consumed by fire like the angels who rebelled were chained in darkness.

Were they sinners before they rebelled? No. Was Adam a sinner before he disobeyed God? No. Adam was not created as a sinner. This is the Millennium, and humans are not born with sin natures, because sin is not present in the Millennium. Daniel 9:24 is a reality after the 7th Trumpet stops sounding. All of Adam's flesh and blood will be destroyed and sent to Death. Only those resurrected into new permanent incorruptible physical bodies will live in the Millennium. Not the glorified church. They are in Paradise, that city not on earth, but in the heavens. Hebrews 11.

God is not going to finally finish the 70th week, and then destroy the earth. There will be a perfect Lord's Day, 1000 years where Daniel 9:24 will be the reality. Revelation 10:6-7 is still future. Daniel's 70th week still needs to be completed at the 7th Trumpet.

"And sware by him that liveth for ever and ever, who created heaven, and the things that therein are, and the earth, and the things that therein are, and the sea, and the things which are therein, that there should be time no longer: But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets."

If you think the mystery of God was completed in the first century, then you will reject the Millennium, because many think we already lived out that mystery.

You are totally wrong on this. Of course they are sinners. Mortal man is a sinner. He is born in sin. Man is totally depraved.

Romans 3:23 tells us, “For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God.”

Man is a rebel outside of Christ; He doesn’t understand the deep things of God and he does not have the ability to fulfill the high demands of God.

Romans 3:10-12 explains why, saying, There is none righteous, no, not one: There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God. They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one."

Man by nature will always run from God. He will never come to God. His nature is to rebel against God. When man goes over the natural line of outright rejection of God then he becomes reprobate. This is the end of every man natural. That is why he needs a supernatural intervention where Christ first opens his eyes. When he then sees his awful predicament then he repents and believes.

There is nothing good in him.

Isa 64:7 "And there is none that calleth upon thy name, that stirreth up himself to take hold of thee: for thou hast hid thy face from us, and hast consumed us, because of our iniquities."

We are incapable of saving ourselves or pleasing God!

The Psalmist outlines man’s grim state: “Behold, I was shapen in iniquity; and in sin did my mother conceive me” (Psalm 51:5). That’s why the Bible says in Ephesians 2:3: "Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others."

We are rebels against God and His plan and purpose for our lives. This is crystal clear for those who do not have to impose their private interpretation on the sacred pages.

Ephesians 2:1 reveals we are dead in trespasses and sins.” Colossians 2:13 personalizes this truth to the individual, saying, you, being dead in your sins.”

Every man since Adam is born with original sin and completely guilty before a righteous God. He is spiritually dead. Romans 5:12, 15, 18-19 confirms, “as by one man (Adam) sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned ... For if through the offence of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, which is by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many ... as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life. For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.”

This is talking about inherent sin. Spiritual death was the nature that was passed on from Adam. We are all born with it. Man – in all generations – inherited Adam’s awful sinful nature, which ultimately separates man from a holy God. I prefer to give all the glory to God on every issue. Until you grasp that you will never see that salvation is eternal. Faith in Scripture is supernatural. (1) It comes from God. (2) It regenerates. It changes a dead man into an alive man. (3) It changes a man from a lover of sin to a hater of sin, a hater of righteousness to a lover of it.
 
Upvote 0

sovereigngrace

Well-Known Member
Dec 9, 2019
9,042
3,450
USA
Visit site
✟202,584.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
You are in combat mood. Please tame the emotions.

On your list, could you please insert "the beginning of the Day of the Lord" at the appropriate place?

I have read through you list, and you did a good job on communicating your position. Although I disagree with several parts of it.

LOL. Not combat mood or emotions, but rebuttal mode.
 
Upvote 0

Douggg

anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist
May 28, 2009
28,781
3,421
Non-dispensationalist
✟359,693.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
Luke 21:33-36 shows that after the tribulation comes the one-and-only climactic Coming of Christ, which sees the destruction of the wicked and this sin-cursed world.
Could you also put "the tribulation", as you call it, on your list, in the appropriate place?

So far from what I am understanding of your view. Where are you placing "the tribulation" relative to those two items?

saying peace and safety
Jesus's Second Coming (the Day of the Lord)
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Douggg

anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist
May 28, 2009
28,781
3,421
Non-dispensationalist
✟359,693.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
Pretribulationists miss (or ignore) the fact that the promise being given here was actually written to the Philadelphian believers in John’s day.
Written to the church of Philadelphia, but could not have been fulfilled to Christians of that era because the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell of the earth. Not a first century occurrence.

Since the hour of temptation, to try them that dwell on the earth - then Christians fitting the church of Philadelphia profile - have to be taken from the earth.
 
Upvote 0

sovereigngrace

Well-Known Member
Dec 9, 2019
9,042
3,450
USA
Visit site
✟202,584.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Written to the church of Philadelphia, but could not have been fulfilled to Christians of that era because the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell of the earth. Not a first century occurrence.

Since the hour of temptation, to try them that dwell on the earth - then Christians fitting the church of Philadelphia profile - have to be taken from the earth.

You seems to ignore the severity of the hour the seven churches in Asia Minor found themselves in. The Church was being assaulted on all sides – both secularly and religiously. On one side the Roman Empire was on a vicious unrelenting campaign of genocide to obliterate the Gospel witness. The severity of the persecution depended on the area each church was located and the attitude of those enforcing the turmoil. Countless believers throughout the world were being destroyed under the jackboot of Rome. In a religious side-show the Jews were resisting the Church at every step.

The same persecution that the Philadelphian church was to be protected from was the very same trial that the church at Smyrna would have to endure. The Lord said to the church at Smyrna in Revelation 2:10, reference the approaching first century trial, “Fear none of those things which thou shalt suffer: behold, the devil shall cast some of you into prison, that ye may be tried; and ye shall have tribulation ten days: be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life.”

Why do you not apply this passage to the entire Church at the end? Remember Smyrna was specifically told that it would go through a period of distinct tribulation. It seems like Pretribs cherry-pick a church out of the 7 that suits its theology and then places it in an end-time scenario. The reason is that this message does not fit the carefully constructed edifice of your paradigm. The message to the Philadelphia church (and the Pretrib interpretation of the same) suits your paradigm.
 
Last edited:
  • Winner
Reactions: Spiritual Jew
Upvote 0

Timtofly

Well-Known Member
Jun 29, 2020
9,318
568
56
Mount Morris
✟125,159.00
Country
United States
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
You are totally wrong on this. Of course they are sinners. Mortal man is a sinner. He is born in sin. Man is totally depraved.

Romans 3:23 tells us, “For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God.”

Man is a rebel outside of Christ; He doesn’t understand the deep things of God and he does not have the ability to fulfill the high demands of God.

Romans 3:10-12 explains why, saying, There is none righteous, no, not one: There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God. They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one."

Man by nature will always run from God. He will never come to God. His nature is to rebel against God. When man goes over the natural line of outright rejection of God then he becomes reprobate. This is the end of every man natural. That is why he needs a supernatural intervention where Christ first opens his eyes. When he then sees his awful predicament then he repents and believes.

There is nothing good in him.

Isa 64:7 "And there is none that calleth upon thy name, that stirreth up himself to take hold of thee: for thou hast hid thy face from us, and hast consumed us, because of our iniquities."

We are incapable of saving ourselves or pleasing God!

The Psalmist outlines man’s grim state: “Behold, I was shapen in iniquity; and in sin did my mother conceive me” (Psalm 51:5). That’s why the Bible says in Ephesians 2:3: "Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others."

We are rebels against God and His plan and purpose for our lives. This is crystal clear for those who do not have to impose their private interpretation on the sacred pages.

Ephesians 2:1 reveals we are dead in trespasses and sins.” Colossians 2:13 personalizes this truth to the individual, saying, you, being dead in your sins.”

Every man since Adam is born with original sin and completely guilty before a righteous God. He is spiritually dead. Romans 5:12, 15, 18-19 confirms, “as by one man (Adam) sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned ... For if through the offence of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, which is by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many ... as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life. For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.”

This is talking about inherent sin. Spiritual death was the nature that was passed on from Adam. We are all born with it. Man – in all generations – inherited Adam’s awful sinful nature, which ultimately separates man from a holy God. I prefer to give all the glory to God on every issue. Until you grasp that you will never see that salvation is eternal. Faith in Scripture is supernatural. (1) It comes from God. (2) It regenerates. It changes a dead man into an alive man. (3) It changes a man from a lover of sin to a hater of sin, a hater of righteousness to a lover of it.
You are the one claiming we are in the Millennium. Not me.

Of course because of sin, we are not in the Millennium. You put sin and us in the Millennium against the very Word of God you just quoted.
 
Upvote 0

sovereigngrace

Well-Known Member
Dec 9, 2019
9,042
3,450
USA
Visit site
✟202,584.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
You are the one claiming we are in the Millennium. Not me.

Of course because of sin, we are not in the Millennium. You put sin and us in the Millennium against the very Word of God you just quoted.

I recognize that there are billions of wicked in the millennium as the sand of the sea. You deny the detail in the text and try and portray it as some type of perfect bliss. The reality is: you have billions of religious phonies in your millennium who surround the saints. Where they come from no one knows as the wicked are all destroyed when Jesus comes and the righteouss are eternally glorified. There is no space for your concept.
 
Upvote 0

keras

Writer of studies on Bible prophecy
Feb 7, 2013
13,714
2,493
82
Thames, New Zealand
Visit site
✟293,818.00
Country
New Zealand
Faith
Pentecostal
Marital Status
Married
I recognize that there are billions of wicked in the millennium as the sand of the sea
There will be no ungodly people in the Millennium, until very near the end of that, yet to take place; 1000 year rule of Jesus as King over all the world.
Only when Satan is released for a short while and again deceives many people, will sin be present. Revelation 20:7-9
Why can't you read and understand this plain prophecy?
Lol . Why should something you say change ones beliefs??
Amills understand the prophecies by the light that shines in the NT revelation. Why not join the club?
What I say and promote is the Prophetic Word. That it doesn't suit peoples beliefs, is not my worry.
I will never believe Amill, as that theory conflicts with many Bible prophesies.
 
Upvote 0

jeffweedaman

Well-Known Member
Nov 22, 2020
778
558
60
PROSPECT
✟82,293.00
Country
Australia
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
What I say and promote is the Prophetic Word. That it doesn't suit peoples beliefs, is not my worry.
I will never believe Amill, as that theory conflicts with many Bible prophesies.

None of the NT writers quote the OT prophecies like you do. They therefore do not corroborate what you say.
 
  • Winner
Reactions: Spiritual Jew
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Timtofly

Well-Known Member
Jun 29, 2020
9,318
568
56
Mount Morris
✟125,159.00
Country
United States
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
I recognize that there are billions of wicked in the millennium as the sand of the sea. You deny the detail in the text and try and portray it as some type of perfect bliss. The reality is: you have billions of religious phonies in your millennium who surround the saints. Where they come from no one knows as the wicked are all destroyed when Jesus comes and the righteouss are eternally glorified. There is no space for your concept.
Your imagination is working over time. Where are they called religious phonies?
 
Upvote 0

Guojing

Well-Known Member
Apr 11, 2019
11,844
1,311
sg
✟217,641.00
Country
Singapore
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
There will be no ungodly people in the Millennium, until very near the end of that, yet to take place; 1000 year rule of Jesus as King over all the world.
Only when Satan is released for a short while and again deceives many people, will sin be present. Revelation 20:7-9
Why can't you read and understand this plain prophecy?

What I say and promote is the Prophetic Word. That it doesn't suit peoples beliefs, is not my worry.
I will never believe Amill, as that theory conflicts with many Bible prophesies.

It is interesting to see that Amills actually believe that, even during the millennium reign of Christ, there are still billions of wicked people on Earth.

That is how much they really think of the effectiveness of Christ ruling over the Earth.
 
Upvote 0

keras

Writer of studies on Bible prophecy
Feb 7, 2013
13,714
2,493
82
Thames, New Zealand
Visit site
✟293,818.00
Country
New Zealand
Faith
Pentecostal
Marital Status
Married
None of the NT writers quote the OT prophecies like you do. They therefore do not corroborate what you say.
Revelation 6:14 The sky rolled up like a scroll......
Isaiah 34:4 ...The heavens will be rolled up like a scroll....

2 Peter 3:7 ..the present heavens and earth are reserved for burning...
Isaiah 66:15 The Lord will come in fire and many will be slain by Him.

Revelation 6:16-17 People will call to the mountains; Hide us from the wrath God and the Lamb, for the great Day of their wrath has come.
Isaiah 2:21 People will hide in the rocks.... when the Lord arises to strike the world with terror.

There are many more parallels like this. The OT and the NT are in harmony.
Then why do some folks remain outside the camp of the saints upon his return???
Please explain.
It would be nice if you provided the scripture.
I assume you mean Revelation 21:27? That refers to Eternity, after the Millennium. I don't believe that any ungodly person will receive immortality, their names are NOT in the Book of Life.
 
Upvote 0

Douggg

anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist
May 28, 2009
28,781
3,421
Non-dispensationalist
✟359,693.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
Why do you not apply this passage to the entire Church at the end? Remember Smyrna was specifically told that it would go through a period of distinct tribulation. It seems like Pretribs cherry-pick a church out of the 7 that suits its theology and then places it in an end-time scenario.
Those 7 churches were located in Asia Minor. The hour of temptation that the Christians of the church of Philidephia were told Jesus would keep them from - is global, not regional.

The 7 churches were literally churches in Asia Minor at the time of John. There is no denial of that.

However, the messages given to the 7 churches establishes 7 profiles which apply to Christians for all times. Not all Christians in the end times fit the profile of the Christians of the church of Philadelphia. Some Christians fit the profile of the Christians of the other churches.

Matthew 24:46 Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing.

47 Verily I say unto you, That he shall make him ruler over all his goods.

48 But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming;

49 And shall begin to smite his fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken;

50 The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of,

51 And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

sovereigngrace

Well-Known Member
Dec 9, 2019
9,042
3,450
USA
Visit site
✟202,584.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Those 7 churches were located in Asia Minor. The hour of temptation that the Christians of the church of Philidephia were told Jesus would keep them from - is global, not regional.

The 7 churches were literally churches in Asia Minor at the time of John. There is no denial of that.

However, the messages given to the 7 churches establishes 7 profiles which apply to Christians for all times. Not all Christians in the end times fit the profile of the Christians of the church of Philadelphia. Some Christians fit the profile of the Christians of the other churches.

Matthew 24:46 Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing.

47 Verily I say unto you, That he shall make him ruler over all his goods.

48 But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming;

49 And shall begin to smite his fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken;

50 The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of,

51 And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

You are missing the point: the promise and reward was specifically to and for the Philadelphian church back in the 1st century. The fact is: there is no surviving church there any more to be rewarded with a "rapture." You are therefore making it an empty and irrelevant promise and an unfulfilled and unrealized reward by Jesus. Of course, it wasn't. There was no rapture back then. That was obviously not what it was talking about.

This church was rather protected from the global 1st century persecution of the Roman Empire. Jesus indeed kept His word, as He always does, thus this promise was experienced and the reward fulfilled.

Meantime, there is not one mention of a rapture followed by a 7-year tribulation followed by a 3rd coming here. In fact, no text in Scripture teaches that or anything close to it, as your failure to supply any hard evidence proves. Pretribbers force it into multiple Scripture where it doesn't exist.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

sovereigngrace

Well-Known Member
Dec 9, 2019
9,042
3,450
USA
Visit site
✟202,584.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Those 7 churches were located in Asia Minor. The hour of temptation that the Christians of the church of Philidephia were told Jesus would keep them from - is global, not regional.

The 7 churches were literally churches in Asia Minor at the time of John. There is no denial of that.

However, the messages given to the 7 churches establishes 7 profiles which apply to Christians for all times. Not all Christians in the end times fit the profile of the Christians of the church of Philadelphia. Some Christians fit the profile of the Christians of the other churches.

Matthew 24:46 Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing.

47 Verily I say unto you, That he shall make him ruler over all his goods.

48 But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming;

49 And shall begin to smite his fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken;

50 The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of,

51 And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

Your interpretation of the word as essentially ‘to remove or take away’ is shown to be totally untenable. It butchers the literal meaning of the word. It gives it a connotation that cannot in any way fit with its usage elsewhere in Scripture. In fact, it forces it to mean the opposite to what it actually means. Applying your meaning to other texts that use the same word ends up changing the whole meaning and sense of multiple Scriptures. In fact, many end up saying the opposite to what they are actually saying. Let us look at some examples.

Contrasts

To highlight the irrational and nonsensical nature of Pretrib hermeneutics, we need to apply their mistaken interpretation to other passages that carry the same Greek word.

Matthew 19:17 reads: “Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, (tēreō) keep the commandments.”

Pretrib would have Matthew 19:17 read: “Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, (tēreō) remove or take away the commandments.”

This would be absurd. It expresses the opposite meaning to what is intended.

John 8:51 reads: “Verily, verily, I say unto you, If a man (tēreō) keep my saying, he shall never see death.”

Pretrib would have John 8:51 read: “Verily, verily, I say unto you, If a man (tēreō) remove or take away my saying, he shall never see death.”

John 15:10-20 reads: “If ye (tēreō) keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have (tēreō) kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love … Remember the word that I said unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord. If they have persecuted me, they will also persecute you; if they have (tēreō) kept my saying, they will (tēreō) keep yours also.”

Pretrib would have John 15:10-20 read: “If ye (tēreō) remove or take away my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have (tēreō) removed or taken away my Father's commandments, and abide in his love … Remember the word that I said unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord. If they have persecuted me, they will also persecute you; if they have (tēreō) removed or taken away my saying, they will (tēreō) remove or take away yours also.”

Ephesians 4:3 reads: “Endeavouring to (tēreō) keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace.”

Pretrib would have Ephesians 4:3 read: “Endeavouring (tēreō) to remove or take away the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace.”

Philippians 4:7 reads: “And the peace of God, which passeth all understanding, shall (tēreō) keep your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus.”

Pretrib would have Philippians 4:7 read: “And the peace of God, which passeth all understanding, shall (tēreō) remove or take away your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus.”

2 Timothy 1:12 reads: “For the which cause I also suffer these things: nevertheless I am not ashamed: for I know whom I have believed, and am persuaded that he is able (teros) to keep that which I have committed unto him
against that day.”


Pretrib would have 2 Timothy 1:12 read: “For the which cause I also suffer these things: nevertheless I am not ashamed: for I know whom I have believed, and am persuaded that he is able (tēreō) to remove or take away that which I have committed unto him against that day.

Jude 1:24 reads: “Now unto him that is able (tēreō) to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy.”

Pretrib would have Jude 1:24 read: “Now unto him that is able (tēreō) to remove or take away you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy.”

Conclusion

Pretrib distorts the actual meaning of the Greek word under discussion and attributed the opposite meaning to what it indicates.
 
Last edited:
  • Winner
Reactions: Spiritual Jew
Upvote 0

sovereigngrace

Well-Known Member
Dec 9, 2019
9,042
3,450
USA
Visit site
✟202,584.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
It is interesting to see that Amills actually believe that, even during the millennium reign of Christ, there are still billions of wicked people on Earth.

That is how much they really think of the effectiveness of Christ ruling over the Earth.

The writer of the Hebrews addresses Psalm 110:1 while speaking of Christ, in Hebrews 10:12-13, stating, this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God; from henceforth [ekdechomenos] expecting till his enemies be made his footstool.”

The Greek word ekdechomenos in this passage is only found 6 times in the New Testament although this is the only place where it is rendered “expecting.” Notwithstanding, it fits in beautifully with the 5 other New Testament renderings which are found in varying tenses in the Scriptures and are separately interpreted – to wait, to look and to tarry. A fuller sense of the meaning could thus read, Christ is waiting, looking and expecting “till his enemies be made his footstool.” Moreover, the word employed here in the original relates to the present tense and indicates the current fulfilment of Christ’s glorious heavenly reign. His current reign is overseeing the ongoing Sovereign reign over the nations.

The focus of this passage is Christ’s great triumph rise to the right hand of majesty on high to reign over His enemies, after His devil defeating, sin destroying work at Calvary. There, as man’s great eternal High Priest “after the order of Melchisedec,” Christ currently sits making continual intercession for His people. Moreover, He also currently sits as king upon heaven’s throne, where He reigns over His enemies till all are made His footstool. Thus, Christ presently and perfectly fulfils both the office of king and priest from the right hand of majesty in heaven. What is more, the matter of Christ’s “expecting” or “waiting” here is expressly completed in heaven, not earth, as the Pre-mils would argue, as therefore current.

God promised the obedient Laodiceans of Asia Minor in Revelation 3:21, To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame [speaking of His victorious life, death and resurrection], and am [present tense] set down with my Father in his throne.”

Christ’s great atoning victory at the cross and His current heavenly reign has enabled those that die in Christ to reign with Him in glory.

From this passage, we explicitly see:

(1) The battle was Calvary
(2) The outcome was victory,
(3) His reign is current,
(4) The location is heaven.

Christ’s current heavenly reign over His enemies is inextricably linked to the decisive victory He secured through His life, death and glorious resurrection. Christ’s present reign is therefore (1) to perfectly fulfil Scripture, and (2) to enforce the complete victory that was wrought.

It was only after His resurrection that Christ announced to His disciples, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth (Matthew 28:18). All heaven’s authority was deposited upon Christ through the triumph of Calvary where He triumphantly procured absolute victory over death, hell, sin, Satan and every enemy. Christ thus assumed the heavenly throne of David in perfect fulfilment of Old Testament prophecy and therefore reigns as sovereign king until His last enemy is made His footstool.

Since the resurrection, Christ reigns supreme over all His enemies from His throne in heaven. There, by His Sovereign will, He intercedes for His people. This rule happening only after Christ triumphed over His enemy at the cross and gloriously rising from the dead. Hebrews 12:2 says, that Christ who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.”

The Hebrews writer reveals the omnipotent Divine nature of Christ and His absolute authority as the Son of God. He expresses such truth in comparison to the lower angelic world.

That decisive victory over death, hell, sin, Satan and every enemy was procured at Calvary and resulted in Christ assuming His supreme foreordained office. Once that throne was secured, Christ would then reign from heaven until His enemies are made His footstool thus perfectly fulfilling every detail of that beautiful Old Testament prophecy.

For His enemies to be made His footstool is to simply say He has conquered them. They are now under His sovereign control. He has yet to destroy them. Their final subduing is still future. That happens at the one and only climactic Coming of Christ.

Ephesians 1:19-23 declares, And what is the exceeding greatness of his (God’s) power to us-ward who believe, according to the working of his mighty power, Which he wrought in Christ, when he raised him from the dead, and set him at his own right hand in the heavenly places, Far above all principality, and power, and might, and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this world, but also in that which is to come: and hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church, Which is his body, the fulness of him that filleth all in all.”

Here is a very important passage that again confirms the absolute authority that Christ now enjoys and reveals the unlimited scope of His current rule. It explicitly illustrates the current sovereign reign of Christ over all His enemies from the “right hand” of majesty on high, until the occasion when He finally makes them His footstool – namely His one final future all-consummating Coming. God hath now “put all things (not some) under his feet.” And so as to leave no ambiguity to the reader, we find Paul explaining the fact that Christ’s rule includes both the whole natural and spiritual realm: “all principality, and power, and might, and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this world, but also in that which is to come.”

The phrase “set (kathizō) him at his own right hand” literally reads in the original “seated him at his own right hand.” Many miss the enormity of this language. In ancient times, when a monarch was seated upon their throne it confirmed their formal investiture with regal power. It also often meant that their enemies had been conquered and they were now ruling.
 
Upvote 0

sovereigngrace

Well-Known Member
Dec 9, 2019
9,042
3,450
USA
Visit site
✟202,584.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married

Matthew 24:45-51 says, “Who then is a faithful and wise servant, whom his lord hath made ruler over his household, to give them meat in due season? Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing. Verily I say unto you, That he shall make him ruler over all his goods. But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming; And shall begin to smite his fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken; The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of, And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

Here is strong evidence that the fate that awaits the wicked when Christ returns is total and immediate destruction, just like Noah’s day that has just been alluded to. Just like the wicked of that day scorned the thought of impending judgment, so also will the ungodly be when Jesus returns. But just like these ancient rebels at the deluge were destroyed, the end-time scoffers will be swept away with destruction on the day and hour He appears. What is the fate of the Christ-rejecter left behind at the catching away? Christ “shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.”
 
  • Agree
Reactions: Spiritual Jew
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Douggg

anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist
May 28, 2009
28,781
3,421
Non-dispensationalist
✟359,693.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
Conclusion

Pretrib distorts the actual meaning of the Greek word under discussion and attributed the opposite meaning to what it indicates.
Revelation 3:10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

What you do with the part in blue and underlined? That was what I was talking about not being applicable at the time of John.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
Status
Not open for further replies.