the standard of righteousness

prophecy_uk

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Clare: " It is our faith which God works in us. (Philippians 2:13)."



Yes, I thought I might answer more on peoples idea that they have the faith, and that it is not given by God ?

No breaches in the spirit are acceptable, that is why we need the Spirit of God to replace our tongue/reasoning.

Then God puts His Spirit within us, which causes us to walk in His statutes, to keep His judgments and to do them, or we did not have the faith/faithfulness to come near to God at all, hence why Romans testified, none sought God, not one, who also instead of the wholesome tongue, their tongues all being open sepulchers, this declares for us the STANDARD OF RIGHTEOUSNESS, AS THERE IS NONE RIGHTEOUS, NO NOT ONE, AS NONE DID GOOD, AND NONE SOUGHT GOD..


Proverbs 15:4 A wholesome tongue is a tree of life: but perverseness therein is a breach in the spirit.

Ezekiel 36:27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

Romans 3:10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:

Romans 3:11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.
12 They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one.




Then we understand ( given to believe) that it is the Lord calling the remnant, they then can call on the name of the Lord, as witnessed in the Apostles, called, and chosen, they did not choose Him, He chose them and ordained them, enabling them, then the Son is revealed in the Lord's Apostles..




Joel 2:32 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be delivered: for in mount Zion and in Jerusalem shall be deliverance, as the Lord hath said, and in the remnant whom the Lord shall call.

Galatians 1:15 But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother's womb, and called me by his grace,
16 To reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the heathen; immediately I conferred not with flesh and blood:

1 Timothy 1:12 And I thank Christ Jesus our Lord, who hath enabled me, for that he counted me faithful, putting me into the ministry;

John 15:16 Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that ye should go and bring forth fruit, and that your fruit should remain: that whatsoever ye shall ask of the Father in my name, he may give it you.




No man can approach to the light that is Christ by their own strength/faith, no man can see Him and live, except the Father draws him, even the words are Spirit, and some believe not ( must be given eyes to see with, ears to hear with and a heart to perceive with) and Jesus told many of the disciples except it was given to them of the Father no man can go to the Son, then many disciples went away to never return...


1 Timothy 6:16 Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.

John 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

John 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.
64 But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who should betray him.
65 And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.
66 From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him.



So no man can know the Father, only the Son does( as He is Him) and the Son will reveal the Father and the Son to them, as the Son was revealed to the Apostles ( told just above Galatians 1:15-16)


The calling then is the Lords, or nobody goes in the righteousness of Christ at all, only the ones naught, and despised, are chosen, ans the mighty and wise are rejected, so that no flesh can glory in His presence, for by our own strength ( mans own faith) no man shall prevail ( nor ever did prevail or find God)..


Matthew 11:27 All things are delivered unto me of my Father: and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father; neither knoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal him.

1 Corinthians 1:26 For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called:
27 But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty;
28 And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are:
29 That no flesh should glory in his presence.

1 Samuel 2:9 He will keep the feet of his saints, and the wicked shall be silent in darkness; for by strength shall no man prevail.

Deuteronomy 29:4 Yet the Lord hath not given you an heart to perceive, and eyes to see, and ears to hear, unto this day.




Now Deuteronomy 29:4 above, highlights how the heart was missing for Israel ( this is the new Spirit and the new heart given through putting in Christ if called)

Hebrews 4, how the word preached did not profit Israel, as they had no faith for it ( no ears to hear with given yet) and the works of Gods creation are done through His faith, until He rested from those works.

Then for the rest, we labour to not fall after that same example of unbelief ( unbelief is in not labouring and doing works of evil) ..



Hebrews 11:3 Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.

Hebrews 4: 1 Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it.
2 For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.
3 For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.

Hebrews 4:9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.
10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.
11 Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.



God will show that it is not of anyone who wills, as nobody can approach and nobody has the heart to approach also, only the only begotten Son of God can and does, and that is by Gods mercy, others are hardened ion the deceitfulness of sin ( which they insist is their doctrine to sometimes sin)

But finally, regarding faith and whose it is, faith is a fruit of the Spirit of God, we need t have the same Spirit of faith, to believe, and to speak faithfully..



Romans 9:15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.
16 So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.
17 For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth.
18 Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth.
19 Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will?

2 Corinthians 4:13 We having the same spirit of faith, according as it is written, I believed, and therefore have I spoken; we also believe, and therefore speak;

Galatians 5:22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith.
 
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TedT

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God does not expect us to be perfect.
Really? Be holy for the LORD your GOD is holy, right, 1 Peter 1:15-16?

And holiness, being in perfect accord with GOD's nature and purpose to which you are called is the full measure of righteousness.

Better read Heb 12:5-11 again, where we are told to expect painful discipline, scourged as with a whip, if we are lax in our diligence to being TRAINED in righteousness.
 
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Clare73

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But in accomplishing our Salvation, only Christ could justify us, and that without any of our own works
Justification did not accomplish salvation.

Salvation comes before justification. . .it is salvation which acomplishes justification.

Salvation = penalty for sin paid, sin remitted, through faith, not by works (Ephesians 2:8-9)

Justification = declaration of "not guilty" by God, who is Judge, in right standing with his justice (due to salvation), and the righteousness of Christ (1 Corinthians 1:30) being credited/accounted/reckoned/ imputed to one by faith apart from works (Romans 4:5),
as righteousness was credited to Abraham by faith apart from works (Genesis 15:6; Romans 3:4)

Justification (right standing with God's justice; i.e., "not guilty")
is the result of
salvation (sin paid for, remitted), not the cause of it.
 
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DaDaBrothers

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The standart of righteousness is Jesus Christ, perfect, Holy, without spot nor blemish, no sin, no darkness at all. And this is what is required of us, us who follow Him, because our Father is Holy, if we love Him we keep is commandments and walk in the light, He will cleanse us, and we are clean saints with white robes. "But that which beareth thorns and briers is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing; whose end is to be burned."

Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.

Clare im here to tell you today you have to serve God and do the works, think about what you are saying, if you go to court: Do Judges work with beliefs or with LAWS ? Does a Judge declare a subject "not guilty" based on the subjects belief, or based on THE LAW ?

If you break the law you go to jail or do you think you are justified just because you belive on the Judge?
"Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble."

If you really believe Jesus is King you bow your head and knee, and do as the King says. And the King says "keep my commandments".
So you can profess your faith all you want, but unless you put your money where your mouth is, and love Him in deed and in truth you are no better than the devils because the devils also believe, and tremble.

But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

Christ only imputes righteousness to the law abiding, made saints by the blood of Christ (cleansed), because the devils also believe and they get nothing for just believing, because they dont follow the law.

"Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?"

Everyone has to decide for themselves if they think faith is good enough for God, and they dont have to work. Or if they also have to do the works like servants of God who also believe in Him, obviously.

James 2:24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
 
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RandyPNW

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Justification did not accomplish salvation.

Sorry, Clare--I can't agree. Jesus delivered, with his Salvation, our Justification.
Rom 4.5 However, to the one who does not work but trusts God who justifies the ungodly, their faith is credited as righteousness.


Salvation comes before justification. . .it is salvation which acomplishes justification.
Salvation = penalty for sin paid, sin remitted, through faith, not by works (Ephesians 2:8-9)

Justification = declaration of "not guilty" by God, who is Judge, in right standing with his justice (due to salvation), and the righteousness of Christ (1 Corinthians 1:30) being credited/accounted/reckoned/ imputed to one by faith apart from works (Romans 4:5),
as righteousness was credited to Abraham by faith apart from works (Genesis 15:6; Romans 3:4)

Justification (right standing with God's justice; i.e., "not guilty")
is the result of
salvation (sin paid for, remitted), not the cause of it.

I'm not sure I was trying to split hairs and say that "Justification caused Salvation?" What I'm saying is that the atonement of Christ required that Jesus provided Justification for us even before we accepted it.

That Justification was his own sinless life, given to us as spiritual life. This does not require perfection, but only that we accept this life in place of our own autonomous life and decision-making. It puts us on the right path, even though we remain imperfect until our resurrection.
 
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RandyPNW

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Really? Be holy for the LORD your GOD is holy, right, 1 Peter 1:15-16?

And holiness, being in perfect accord with GOD's nature and purpose to which you are called is the full measure of righteousness.

Better read Heb 12:5-11 again, where we are told to expect painful discipline, scourged as with a whip, if we are lax in our diligence to being TRAINED in righteousness.

Being holy does not require perfection of Man. It requires that we follow a holy God, partaking of His holiness.
 
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RandyPNW

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Again, it doesnt seem you understand Paul, even if you think so !

Okay, you don't think I understand Paul. If you care to discuss this in detail, you're going to have to provide details. If there is a particular matter where you think I'm messing up, I'm prepared to face it, right or wrong.
 
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Clare73

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To all:

If there was something wrong with the Old Law (that has ended with Christ’s death), then God made a mistake.
There was nothing wrong with the law, the error was in man's understanding.

The law was not given for righteosness (Galatians 3:11-12). . .because righteousness is only from God (Romans 1:17; Galatians 3:21) through faith (Galatians 3:11), apart from works (Romans 4:5), and not througn law keeping.

The law was given only to reveal sin (Romans 3:20, 5:13, 7:7) which had not been revealed during the time from Adam to Moses (Romans 5:13).
But I do not believe God makes mistakes. Yes, Jesus brought in a superior covenant of loving one’s enemies, but that does not mean the Old Covenant and it’s laws did not have their place and purpose in God’s plan. I believe the Old Covenant was a way of showing how God is a rewarder to those who follow Him, and an executor of justice or punishment to those who would rebel against Him.
 
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Clare73

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Yes righteousness does bring life. Prov 12:28;Rom 5:18
One act of righteousness (the cross) brought justification which brings life. (Romans 5:18)
God the Holy Spirit gives Spiritual life unto all whom have been legally made righteous by the obedience of Christ.
And they are legally made righteous through faith apart from works (Romans 4:5).
Basically, Christs death secured spiritual life for all whom He died because by His death He put away their sins which caused their spiritual death, hence their sins being put away, life must be given,
Which it is in justification (Romans 5:18)
and of course all for whom their sins have been put away, Christs righteousness has been imputed 2 Cor 5:21
 
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DaDaBrothers

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Isaiah 1:10 Hear the word of the Lord, ye rulers of Sodom; give ear unto the law of our God, ye people of Gomorrah.

Isaiah 1:19 If ye be willing and obedient, ye shall eat the good of the land:

20 But if ye refuse and rebel, ye shall be devoured with the sword: for the mouth of the Lord hath spoken it.

Being holy does not require perfection of Man. It requires that we follow a holy God, partaking of His holiness.

Holy absolutely requires perfection, in Him there is no darkness at all, no spot nor blemish, and if you really follow the Holy God you will end up Holy too, because His law is perfect and Holy.
Hebrews 6:8 But that which beareth thorns and briers is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing; whose end is to be burned.

faith apart from works

Clare you keep repeating like a bot, you cant just ignore James..
No one is justified by dead faith. Not the devils

James 2:17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
 
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Clare73

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The standart of righteousness is Jesus Christ, perfect, Holy, without spot nor blemish, no sin, no darkness at all. And this is what is required of us, us who follow Him, because our Father is Holy, if we love Him we keep is commandments and walk in the light, He will cleanse us, and we are clean saints with white robes. "But that which beareth thorns and briers is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing; whose end is to be burned."

Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.
Clare im here to tell you today you have to serve God and do the works, think about what you are saying, if you go to court: Do Judges work with beliefs or with LAWS ? Does a Judge declare a subject "not guilty" based on the subjects belief, or based on THE LAW ?
Your misunderstanding is in the meaning of true faith, which is faith which produces works.
No works, no saving faith, only counterfeit faith (Lord! Lord!), which does not save.

But in salvation, it is not the works of true faith which save, it is only the faith itself, apart from its works, which saves.

Sorry, that is authoritative NT teaching in Ephesians 2:8-9; Romans 4:5, 3:21, 28.
 
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Clare73

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Sorry, Clare--I can't agree. Jesus delivered, with his Salvation, our Justification.
Rom 4.5 However, to the one who does not work but trusts God who justifies the ungodly, their faith is credited as righteousness.
Correct. . .Jesus both saved and justified us through faith, apart from its works.
I'm not sure I was trying to split hairs and say that "Justification caused Salvation?" What I'm saying is that the atonement of Christ required that
Jesus provided Justification for us even before we accepted it.
We don't "accept" it, it is sovereignly applied through faith.
That Justification was his own sinless life, given to us as spiritual life.
Actually, justification (dikaiosis) = a declaration of "not guilty," giving a right standing with God's justice through faith, apart from its works (Romans 4:5), in the person and atoning sacrifice (blood--Romans 3:25) of Jesus Christ for the remision of one's sin.

With that justification (declaration of "not guilty") is credited/reckoned/accounted/imparted/imputed
to the believer the righteousess of Jesus Christ (2 Corinthians 5:21; 1 Corinthians 1:30).
 
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Clare73

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Isaiah 1:10 Hear the word of the Lord, ye rulers of Sodom; give ear unto the law of our God, ye people of Gomorrah.

Isaiah 1:19 If ye be willing and obedient, ye shall eat the good of the land:

20 But if ye refuse and rebel, ye shall be devoured with the sword: for the mouth of the Lord hath spoken it.
Holy absolutely requires perfection, in Him there is no darkness at all, no spot nor blemish, and if you really follow the Holy God you will end up Holy too, because His law is perfect and Holy.
Hebrews 6:8 But that which beareth thorns and briers is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing; whose end is to be burned.
Clare you keep repeating like a bot, you cant just ignore James..
No one is justified by dead faith. Not the devils.

James 2:17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
I'm not ignoring James.

True faith produces works, but it is the faith itself which saves, not its works (Ephesians 2:8-9).
 
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DaDaBrothers

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But in salvation, it is not the works of true faith which save, it is only the faith itself, apart from its works, which saves.

Clare your statement goes against James let me explain.

1st and foremost you have to understand:
James 2:17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

So when you say "faith itself, apart from works" you are talking about dead faith, and you cannot say this saves anyone, you are deceiving yourself and others..

James 2:19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.

We would both agree the devils have dead faith, and are not saved, why ? because they have no works.

but it is the faith itself which saves, not its works

Again you keep repeating yourself, you say Faith itself, you are refering to dead faith, which does not save anyone, not without works.

James 2:24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.

Faith only is death, but works is perfect faith and justifies Man.
 
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DaDaBrothers

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Jesus both saved and justified us through faith, apart from its works
Again
James 2:17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
You cannot say "saved and justified by dead faith (faith apart from works)

James 1:22 But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.
 
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Some have erroneously suggested that sin was not revealed between the time of Adam and Moses.

But we learn this in the Bible: “If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall behis desire, and thou shalt rule over him.” (Genesis 4:7).
 
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Clare73

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Clare your statement goes against James let me explain.

1st and foremost you have to understand:
James 2:17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
Dead = not living, not existing or operating.
Alone = counterfeit faith (Lord! Lord!) with no works of obedience demonstrating its genuineness, aliveness, viableness to save; i.e., dead faith, which in reality is no genuine faith which saves, but only counterfeit faith, which does not save.
So when you say "faith itself, apart from works" you are talking about dead faith, and you cannot say this saves anyone, you are deceiving yourself and others..
No, that is your misunderstanding of the NT.

Faith apart from its works in the NT does not mean dead (non-existent) faith,
it means genuine saving faith as distinct from its works of obedience demonstrating its genuineness.
James 2:19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.

We would both agree the devils have dead faith, and are not saved, why ? because they have no works.
Beause genuine faith believes in and trusts on Jesus Christ for the forgiveness and remission of sin, and they do neither, therefore, they have "dead" faith, which is not (true) faith at all, and remain in their condemnation.
 
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Clare73

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Again
James 2:17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
You cannot say "saved and justified by dead faith (faith apart from works)
Agreed. . .because you do not understand James.

Faith apart from its own works is not dead faith, it is living genuine faith which is separate from and not equivalent to its works.
They are two different things, the works being the proof of the faith. . .no works, no true faith.
Dead faith is faith with no works to be apart from, therefore, it is not faith at all.

True faith produces works, but the works of that true faith do not save, only the true faith itself saves, apart from its works (Ephesians 2:8-9), which is not to say it has no works.
James 1:22 But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.
Right. . .but the deeds of faith do not save, only the faith itself saves, apart from its deeds.
 
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DaDaBrothers

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the true faith itself saves
James 2:17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

Faith alone is death.
There is no such thing as "true faith itself". Because if its alone is dead.
True faith is with works, not alone.

Faith apart from its own works is not dead faith

This is the exact oposite of what it is written by James.

the works of true faith do not save

Once again the exact oposite of Scripture.
James 2:24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.

only the faith itself saves

You keep repeating your mistake, YOU dont understand James, Faith alone is death
Like I said there is no such thing as "faith alone that saves", because faith alone is dead, only with works can you say you have true faith, you cannot say "true faith by itself", because there is no such thing. True faith is with works, not alone. Faith by itself is dead, with works is alive.

You are justified by works, who make the faith true in deed.
 
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Clare73

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James 2:17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

Faith alone is death.
There is no such thing as "true faith itself". Because if its alone is dead.
True faith is with works, not alone
.
True faith is not its works.
Faith and its works are separate, the works being the proof of the faith. . .and you know that.

You are trying to set James against Paul regarding faith, because you don't want to believe the NT that faith apart from works justifies (Romans 4:5), and that
salvation is through faith not by works (Ephesians 2:8-9).

Justification is by faith apart from its works (Romans 4:5), and
one's faith is justified (proven) by works, which justified (proven) faith, apart from its works
then justifies the believer (James 2:24).

Your issue is with the NT and its refutation of your personal theology, it is not with me.
 
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