Does anyone actually believe Jack Chick's theology?

Aussie Pete · Aug 17, 2021

Bible Highlighter said:
I think the story is a parallel of our spiritual Father knowing all things.
The Parable also expresses the same truth in James 5:19-20, as well (as I mentioned before). For the son was said to be DEAD and he is now alive AGAIN. These words are speaking in spiritual terms. He was dead spiritually when he lived it up with prostitutes and he became alive AGAIN after he came back home to the father and was seeking forgiveness with him.

How is it possible to be unborn again? God caused us to be born again. He put us into Christ. Who then can reverse that? Sin breaks fellowship. It does not change relationship. Christians have eternal life. That means exactly what it says. Eternal. Now a Christian can lose the experience of eternal life. They can be restored very easily. Why? Because sin is the exception for a Christian, unlike unbelievers, who sin by nature.

Humble_Disciple said:
In this Jack Chick tract, a Christian couple is sent to eternal conscious torment in hell for actually obeying Jesus' commands to love your neighbor, serve the poor, heal the sick, make disciples of all nations, etc.:

This has to be the most absurd Bible tract I've ever seen. Does anyone actually base their soteriology on Chick tracts?

All this tract seems to do is discourage people from obeying Christ through fear and intimidation. Was Jack Chick a radical antinomian?

The tract even quotes Matthew 7:23 out of context. When Jesus says "Depart from me, I never knew you," he is speaking specifically to people who never followed His commandments:

Matthew 7
15 “Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves. 16 By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? 17 Likewise, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. 18 A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit. 19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20 Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them. 21 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22 Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’ 23 Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’

How could Jesus be any more clear than "Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire"? (Matthew 7:19)

Jesus said that, if you love Him, you will keep His commandments (John 14:15), that except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, you will not enter the Kingdom of Heaven (Matthew 5:20) and Hebrews 12:14 says that, without holiness, no one will see the Lord.

Without God's sanctifying grace, given by Christ's imparted righteousness, this righteousness wouldn't be possible:

The doctrine of imparted righteousness is that Christ died to save people from sin rather than just to give them an excuse to continue in sin. This power over sin is freely given by Christ's sanctifying grace to those who trust in Him.

While one might not like the source, this breaks down how Chick quoted verses on good works out of context to suit his own theology and agenda:

I've not heard of Jack Chick until now. He was somewhat extreme, obviously. I also think that he counterbalanced some of the "easy believism" and "let's not offend anyone" attitudes that have become prevalent. I don't agree with every word that Paul Washer says, but he also is an antidote to the complacent and lifeless "Christianism" that infects the modern church in the Western world.

I'm not convinced that we need to attack other religions, except maybe the pseudo Christian like Mormonism or Jehovah's Witnesses. But we do need to be ready to witness to all people, whatever their beliefs. It is also not an evil thing to offend people. The gospel is offensive to those who reject it. If you don't want to offend then you must disobey the great commission.

Guojing · Aug 17, 2021

Hammster said:
The thing is, based on what’s in the text, he wasn’t really sorry. He was sorry for his circumstances, though. And he thought being a servant of his father was better than being in his current position.

His motivation for returning was clearly stated in Luke 15:17

17 “When he came to his senses, he said, ‘How many of my father’s hired servants have food to spare, and here I am starving to death!

You are right, his main motivation for returning is to have enough food to eat.

Aussie Pete · Aug 18, 2021

Guojing said:
His motivation for returning was clearly stated in Luke 15:17

17 “When he came to his senses, he said, ‘How many of my father’s hired servants have food to spare, and here I am starving to death!

You are right, his main motivation for returning is to have enough food to eat.

"He came to his senses." He realised that it was better to be a servant in his father's house than a slave in a pig pen. I don't recall the father having one word of rebuke for the son. The parable is not about the son anyway. It demonstrates God's heart towards His people who stray. The father saw the young man while he was still a long way off, and ran to meet him. It would be great if more Christians were more like the father and less like the elder brother.

Guojing · Aug 18, 2021

Aussie Pete said:
"He came to his senses." He realised that it was better to be a servant in his father's house than a slave in a pig pen. I don't recall the father having one word of rebuke for the son. The parable is not about the son anyway. It demonstrates God's heart towards His people who stray. The father saw the young man while he was still a long way off, and ran to meet him. It would be great if more Christians were more like the father and less like the elder brother.

Correct, its all about the Father.

But let's not kid ourselves in thinking that the prodigal son cared about or loved his father.

Bible Highlighter · Aug 18, 2021

Aussie Pete said:
How is it possible to be unborn again?

Again, while a person cannot be unborn, they can die. A dead son does partake in family meals, picnics, and or family reunions. So there is no relationship with a dead son. The dead son is in the grave. They are gone.

“The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?” (Jeremiah 17:9). So we cannot go off our feelings or thoughts we want to be true. The Bible stands true regardless of our personal preferences.

The Parable of the Prodigal Son in Luke 15:11-32 proves that a saved believer can die spiritually, and then come back to God again to the saving of their soul. For when the prodigal son came back home and sought forgiveness with his father over squandering his inheritance on prostitutes, his father said that his son was “dead” and he is “alive AGAIN.” The father said this two times in the parable (Luke 15:24, and Luke 15:32). Seeing the prodigal son did not die physically, this means that the son died spiritually and he became alive again spiritually on the account of his actions. The father said he was lost and now he is found. Generally when we speak of the lost, we are talking about the unsaved. James 5:19-20 also teaches this same truth, as well.

There are many warnings to believers about how they will be cast out if they justify sin in this life. The Son of Man (JESUS) will send forth His angels and they will gather out of HIS KINGDOM all things which offend (i.e. anything that makes another to stumble into sin like false beliefs held by men), and whoever will do iniquity and they will be cast them into the furnace of fire (i.e. the Lake of Fire) (See: Matthew 13:41-42). We again see something similar happen in Matthew 7:23. Jesus tells certain believers who did wonderful works in His name to depart from Him because they also worked iniquity. Iniquity is sin. In Matthew 7:26-27, Jesus says that everyone who does not do what He says, they are like a fool who built His house upon the sand, and when a storm came, great was the fall of that house. This parable came right off of Matthew 7:23 about those believers who justified sin and were told to depart from Him by the Lord Himself. Acts of the Apostles 3:23 says that if every soul who does not hear that prophet (JESUS) they will be destroyed.

Bible Highlighter · Aug 18, 2021

Aussie Pete said:
God caused us to be born again.

Why would Jesus convince Nicodemus to be born again if it was something that was of out of his power?

Anyways, this sounds like Calvinism or Unconditional Election whereby God forces some to be saved and others by default to not be saved against their free own will choice. If this is what you are suggesting this belief is highly unbiblical. 2 Thessalonians 2:10 says that the reason why those who perish are perishing is because they received not the love of the truth that they MIGHT be saved. In Luke 13:3: Jesus basically told people to repent or perish. According to Calvinism: The Elect cannot perish, and the Non-Elect cannot repent. So either Calvinism is true and Jesus was in error, or Jesus was correct and Calvinism is wrong. I choose Jesus and not Calvinism.

You said:
He put us into Christ.

Yes, it is true that genuine believers are baptized into Christ spiritually by God but this is only if we have faith initially by receiving Jesus as our Savior (John 1:12), seeking forgiveness of our sins with Him (Romans 10:13) (Luke 18:9-14), and by believing the gospel in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 (Which essentially is to believe that Christ died for our sins, He was buried, and He was risen three days later on our behalf for salvation).

You said:
Sin breaks fellowship. It does not change relationship.

Actually, there are several passages that tell us that you cannot be out of fellowship with God and be saved.

#1. 1 John 5:12 says He that has the Son has life and He that does not have the Son does not have life. Life is associated with eternal life or salvation.

#2. John 17:3 says eternal life is in knowing the one true God, Jesus Christ. Knowing implies a fellowship. So if you don't know Jesus, then you don't have life (Salvation).

#3. Romans 8:9 says if he a man does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to him.

#4. Psalm 73:27 says God will destroy all those who abandon Him (or go a whoring from Him).

#5. John 15:6 says if a man does not abide in Him, he is cast forth and burned.

#6. 1 John 1:7 says if we walk in the Light as He is in the Light, the blood of Jesus Christ cleanses us from all sin.

#7. Romans 11:21-22 says if you do not continue in his goodness you will be cut off. For if God spared not the natural branches (i.e. the Jews), take heed that he can do the same to you (i.e. Gentile believers). The analogy here is that you are the branch and Christ is the tree. We need to continue in Christ's righteousness or goodness, not our own righteousness or goodness, or we will be cut off because of unbelief.

Hammster · Aug 18, 2021

Bible Highlighter said:
Election whereby God forces some to be saved and others by default to not be saved against their free own will choice.

If you think that’s Calvinism, you are sorely mistaken. And it explains a lot.

Bible Highlighter · Aug 18, 2021

Aussie Pete said:
How is it possible to be unborn again?

To be born into this world means to come into this world and be alive. One can stop being in this world and stop being alive by dying. A Christian can die spiritually if they justify sin.

You said:
Sin breaks fellowship. It does not change relationship.

Here is...

The Bible’s teaching that serious sin is separation from GOD,

[God said to Adam,]
"But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die." (Genesis 2:17).

[Eve said to the serpent,]
"But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die. (Genesis 3:3).

And the serpent said unto the woman,
"Ye shall not surely die." (Genesis 3:4).

"...she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat. And the eyes of them both were opened, and they knew that they were naked..." (Genesis 3:6-7).

"Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned." (Romans 5:12).

"For the wages of sin is death..." (Romans 6:23).

"But your iniquities have separated between you and your God, and your sins have hid his face from you, that he will not hear." (Isaiah 59:2).

"Now we know that God hears not sinners: but if any man be a worshipper of God, and does his will, him he hears." (John 9:31).

“If I regard iniquity in my heart, the Lord will not hear me:” (Psalms 66:18).

“...whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.”
(Matthew 5:22).

28 “But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.
29 And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.
30 And if thy right hand offend thee, cut it off, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.” (Matthew 5:28-30).

“But whoso committeth adultery with a woman lacketh understanding: he that doeth it destroyeth his own soul.” (Proverbs 6:32).

“But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.” (Matthew 6:15).

“Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.” (Matthew 7:21)

Important Note: If you were to look at 1 Thessalonians 4:3 you would learn that the will of God (i.e. the Father) is to be holy or it is our sanctification; And Hebrews 12:14 says, without holiness no man shall see the Lord.

“22 On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’
23 And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.’” (Matthew 7:22-23 ESV).

“26 And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:
27 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.”
(Matthew 7:26-27).

“15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.
16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?
17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.
18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.” (Matthew 7:15-20).

"For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins." (Hebrews 10:26).

"he that commits sin is of the devil." (1 John 3:8).

"everyone who does evil hates the light." (John 3:20).

"Repent therefore of this thy wickedness, and pray God, if perhaps the thought of thine heart may be forgiven thee." (Acts of the Apostles 8:22).

6 "If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth.
7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin." (1 John 1:6-7).

"He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him." (1 John 2:4).

"Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him." (1 John 3:15).

"He that saith he is in the light, and hateth his brother, is in darkness even until now." (1 John 2:9).

"In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother." (1 John 3:10).

41 "The Son of Man will send his angels, and they will gather out of his kingdom all causes of sin and all law-breakers,
42 and throw them into the fiery furnace. In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
43 Then the righteous will shine like the sun in the kingdom of their Father. He who has ears, let him hear." (Matthew 13:41-43 ESV).

“For by thy words thou shalt be justified, and by thy words thou shalt be condemned.” (Matthew 12:37).

"They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate." (Titus 1:16).

3 "If any man teach otherwise, and consent not to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which is according to godliness;
4 He is proud, knowing nothing,..." (1 Timothy 6:3-4).

"...God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble."
(James 4:6).

21 For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.
22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off." (Romans 11:21-22).

16 "There is a sin unto death..."
17 "...and there is a sin not unto death." (1 John 5:16-17).

"But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death." (Revelation 21:8).

19 "Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication,, lasciviousness,
20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God." (Galatians 5:19-21).

5 "Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affe
ction, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry:
6 For which things' sake the wrath of God cometh on the children of disobedience:
7 In the which ye also walked some time, when ye lived in them." (Colossians 3:5-7).

5 “...God;
6 ...will render to every man according to his deeds:
7 To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:
8 But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath,
9 Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile;
10 But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile:
11 For there is no respect of persons with God.
12 For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law” (Romans 2:5-12).

“But when the righteous turneth away from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, and doeth according to all the abominations that the wicked man doeth, shall he live? All his righteousness that he hath done shall not be mentioned: in his trespass that he hath trespassed, and in his sin that he hath sinned, in them shall he die.” (Ezekiel 18:24).

9 “Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God. “ (1 Corinthians 6:9-10).

“Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.” (James 2:17).

"And cast ye the unprofitable servant into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth." (Matthew 25:30).

“For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.” (Romans 8:13).

Now of course, a Christian can repent and be restored back to spiritual life again. For we have an advocate named Jesus Christ that we can go to (1 John 2:1). For if we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness (1 John 1:9). So let us boldly come before the throne of grace and find help in time of need (Hebrews 4:16).

Hammster · Aug 18, 2021

Bible Highlighter said:
Now of course, a Christian can repent and be restored back to spiritual life again.

Not according to Hebrews 4:6, if you are going to be consistent.

Bible Highlighter · Aug 18, 2021

Aussie Pete said:
Christians have eternal life. That means exactly what it says. Eternal.

Eternal life or Salvation is a person named Jesus Christ. For Christ alone possesses immortality (1 Timothy 6:16). For he that has the Son has life, and He that does not have the Son does not have life (1 John 5:12). For Jesus is one of the major gifts we receive. For Jesus is eternal life (1 John 5:20). For God so loved the world that He GAVE His only begotten Son (John 3:16). But how do we have an assurance that we know Jesus and thus… have eternal life? By keeping His commandments (See: 1 John 2:3). Note: This would not be the 613 Laws of Moses as a whole or package deal, and neither would this be the keeping of the ceremonial OT laws like the Saturday Sabbath, circumcision, dietary laws, and holy days, etc.). Believers are to follow the commands that come from Jesus and His apostles in the New Testament. For the person who says they know the Lord and they do not keep His commandments, they are a liar and the truth is not in them (See: 1 John 2:4). What truth is not in them? Jesus. For Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life (John 14:6). This is why Matthew 13:41-42 will take place. For the Son of Man (Jesus) will send forth His angels and they will gather out of HIS kingdom (Christ’s kingdom) all who do iniquity (sin), and they will be cast into the furnace of fire (i.e. the Lake of Fire). In other words, a person can be in Christ’s kingdom and later cast out by Christ’s angels if they justify sin and or evil. For John 12:48 says he (the person) who does not receive Christ’s words, those words will judge them on the last day. What words? Matthew 5:28-30, Matthew 6:15, Matthew 12:37, etc.

Bible Highlighter · Aug 18, 2021

Aussie Pete said:
sin is the exception for a Christian, unlike unbelievers, who sin by nature.

I have heard Christians justify all kinds of sins in different amounts or levels. Many Christians will admit they cannot help but to commit grievous sin in this life. They basically imply they cannot stop committing serious sin this side of Heaven. So if there is no loss of salvation, then there is no real motivation for a believer to stop committing grievous sin in their life. So it appears that they are not all that different than an unbeliever except for a belief alone in Jesus for salvation. One example is the author of the website called: “Jesus is Savior” (David J. Stewart). Check out his article here:

Jack Chick's False Gospel

According to the article: David J. Stewart thinks that a person is to only believe in Jesus or the gospel for salvation, and that Jack Chick is wrong for telling people to repent (turn from sin) as a part of salvation. For David J. Stewart thinks that a person can be saved while committing fornication. Granted, I think Jack Chick may agree with turning from sin to a degree (as a part of salvation), but I think he holds to the view that we are saved solely by Jesus and that it will lead to a changed life automatically. But the Bible teaches that we are to work out our salvation with fear and trembling (Philippians 2:12). Like with the tract: “Flight 144”: At certain times, Jack Chick does not appear to entirely agree with the full extent in living holy as a part of our Sanctification (Which is what God has chosen us for) (See: 2 Thessalonians 2:13-14); Thus, Chick Publication’s tract called: “Flight 144” implies no works of any kind as a part of the saved Christian life. Did Jack Chick agree with James 2:24? What about Titus 1:16? My concern with his tract “Flight 144” is that it can imply that a person can be lazy for the Lord and they can serve themselves and their sin instead of God. Jesus said, cast the unprofitable servant into outer darkness (Matthew 25:30).

Anyways, David J. Stewart's gospel is what Jude 1:4 warns us about. It makes me want to throw up that Christians think they can turn His grace into a license for immorality like that.

Aussie Pete · Aug 18, 2021

Bible Highlighter said:
I have heard Christians justify all kinds of sins in different amounts or levels. Many Christians will admit they cannot help but to commit grievous sin in this life. They basically imply they cannot stop committing serious sin this side of Heaven. So if there is no loss of salvation, then there is no real motivation for a believer to stop committing grievous sin in their life. So it appears that they are not all that different than an unbeliever except for a belief alone in Jesus for salvation. One example is the author of Jesus is Savior (David J. Stewart). Check out the following link.

Jack Chick's False Gospel

David J. Stewart thinks that a person is to only believe in Jesus or the gospel for salvation, and that Jack Chick is wrong for telling people to repent (turn from sin) as a part of salvation. For David J. Stewart thinks that a person can be saved while committing fornication. Granted, I think Jack Chick may agree with turning from sin to a degree (as a part of salvation), but I think he holds to the view that we are saved solely by Jesus and that it will lead to a changed life automatically. But the Bible teaches that we are to work out our salvation with fear and trembling (Philippians 2:12). Like with the tract: “Flight 144”: At certain times, Jack Chick does not appear to entirely agree with the full extent in living holy as a part of our Sanctification (Which is what God has chosen us for) (See: 2 Thessalonians 2:13-14) implying works of no kind does not enter into the saved Christian life. Did Jack Chick agree with James 2:24? What about Titus 1:16? My concern with his tract “Flight 144” is that it can imply that a person can be lazy for the Lord and they can serve themselves and their sin instead of God. Jesus said, cast the unprofitable servant into outer darkness (Matthew 25:30).

Anyways, David J. Stewart's gospel is what Jude 1:4 warns us about. It makes me want to throw up that Christians think they can turn His grace into a license for immorality like that.

I've gone over this stuff way too many times.......I wonder why I bother commenting. The born again cannot be unborn again. There are people who pretend to be Christians. Churches are packed with them. If God can forgive a murdering adulterer (King David), He can and will forgive believers who struggle with sin. Those who are born again hate sin. That is one of the obvious evidences of being born again. There are many reasons why Christians fail to overcome completely, not the least of which is the abject failure of the church leadership to give God's people the truth that they need. Many would rather pack the building with make believers and pander to them so that the coffers can be kept full. Many leaders will not preach anything offensive because they don't want to lose anyone.

God placed apostles, prophets, evangelists teacher/pastor in the church for a reason. Like James said, those who teach are subject to stricter judgement. I know how that goes because I am a teacher, not because I chose that calling but because God appointed me. But how can I not share what I have been taught myself?

You need to learn the difference between the initial, born again experience and the subsequent salvation of the soul. It is the answer to all OSAS questions, for both those who agree and those who do not.

Bible Highlighter · Aug 18, 2021

Aussie Pete said:
I've gone over this stuff way too many times.......I wonder why I bother commenting. The born again cannot be unborn again. There are people who pretend to be Christians. Churches are packed with them. If God can forgive a murdering adulterer (King David), He can and will forgive believers who struggle with sin. Those who are born again hate sin. That is one of the obvious evidences of being born again. There are many reasons why Christians fail to overcome completely, not the least of which is the abject failure of the church leadership to give God's people the truth that they need. Many would rather pack the building with make believers and pander to them so that the coffers can be kept full. Many leaders will not preach anything offensive because they don't want to lose anyone.

God placed apostles, prophets, evangelists teacher/pastor in the church for a reason. Like James said, those who teach are subject to stricter judgement. I know how that goes because I am a teacher, not because I chose that calling but because God appointed me. But how can I not share what I have been taught myself?

You need to learn the difference between the initial, born again experience and the subsequent salvation of the soul. It is the answer to all OSAS questions, for both those who agree and those who do not.

But you ignore the truth that a person can die after being born.

Again, much of what you believe is not in the Bible. Serious sin separates a believer from God. I have shown this with Scripture. Yet, you believe otherwise. Also, one cannot be out of fellowship with the Lord and still be saved. The Bible repeatedly teaches contrary to what you believe. Also, just hating sin is not enough if one believes that a person can sin and still be saved. For example: Lets say a serial killer has a man tied up and he is about to kill him. Would it really matter if the serial killer told the man that he felt sorry for what he was about to do or he hated in doing what he was about to do? No. What he is doing is still wrong, and his emotions do not mean anything unless he changes his actions. For if a man cheats on his wife and just pays lip service to his wife that he is sorry for cheating on her, it does not mean anything unless he stops the cheating. Otherwise it is just empty lip service and he loves his sin more than his wife. It is the same with God. If we do not change at some point or reform, we are simply loving our sin more than the Lord. The apostle Paul says if any man love not the Lord Jesus Christ, let him be accursed (1 Corinthians 16:22).

Oh, and King David was not saved during the period of time he was committing adultery and murder. Here are a couple of points in Scripture to consider.

#1. Numbers 35:16-18 says it only takes one act of murder to be a murderer; And Leviticus 20:10 says it only takes one act of adultery to be an adulterer.

#2. Jesus Himself regarded just looking at a woman once as an act of adultery (Matthew 5:28).

#3. John says, "No murderer has eternal life abiding in them." (1 John 3:15).

#4. Proverbs 6:32 says "Whosoever commits adultery with a woman lacks understanding: he that does it destroys his own soul."

#5. Jesus Himself says that just looking at a woman in lust (Which is adultery) is potential for a person to be cast bodily in hell fire (See Matthew 5:28-30).

#6. David needed to confess of his sin in order to be forgiven (See Psalms 51).

#7. 1 John 1:9 says if we confess our sins he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

#8. Revelation 21:8 says, "But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone: which is the second death." Murderers and whoremongers will be cast into the lake of fire. All liars will be cast into the lake of fire. ALL liars, and not just some. NO murderer has eternal life abiding in them (1 John 3:15).

So things are not as you say.

Bible Highlighter · Aug 18, 2021

Aussie Pete said:
I've gone over this stuff way too many times.......I wonder why I bother commenting. The born again cannot be unborn again. There are people who pretend to be Christians. Churches are packed with them. If God can forgive a murdering adulterer (King David), He can and will forgive believers who struggle with sin. Those who are born again hate sin. That is one of the obvious evidences of being born again. There are many reasons why Christians fail to overcome completely, not the least of which is the abject failure of the church leadership to give God's people the truth that they need. Many would rather pack the building with make believers and pander to them so that the coffers can be kept full. Many leaders will not preach anything offensive because they don't want to lose anyone.

God placed apostles, prophets, evangelists teacher/pastor in the church for a reason. Like James said, those who teach are subject to stricter judgement. I know how that goes because I am a teacher, not because I chose that calling but because God appointed me. But how can I not share what I have been taught myself?

You need to learn the difference between the initial, born again experience and the subsequent salvation of the soul. It is the answer to all OSAS questions, for both those who agree and those who do not.

The Bible does not teach OSAS (Once Saved Always Saved) or a sin and still be saved type belief. Almost every page in your New Testament speaks against this kind of belief (if you were to pay more closer attention to what your Bible says).

Here are several lists of verses that makes it absolutely clear that believers can fall away from the faith:

Here is a General List of Verses on How Believers Can Fall Away:

Hebrews 3:12-14
Hebrews 4:11
Hebrews 6:4-9
Hebrews 10:26-30
Hebrews 12:15
1 Timothy 1:18-20
1 Timothy 4:1-7
Galatians 5:2-4
2 Peter 2:20-22
2 Peter 3:17
Luke 8:11-15
1 Corinthians 10:12
2 Thessalonians 2:3

Now, do not misunderstand me, believers cannot lose their salvation (like they would a pair of car keys), but they can forfeit their salvation (i.e. they can willingly throw it away by rebelling against God) by their sinning with no repentance. In fact,

Here is a list of believers who have forfeited their salvation:

Saul (1 Samuel 16:14) (1 Samuel 31:4)
Demas (2 Timothy 4:10)
The Prodigal Son (Luke 15:11-32)
Judas Iscariot (Psalm 41:9) (Luke 6:16) (Acts 1:25)
Hymenaeus and Philetus (2 Timothy 2:17-18)
Unnamed Christians destroyed by false teaching (2 Timothy 2:17-18)
Many Unnamed Disciples (John 6:66)
Some Younger Christian Widows (1 Timothy 5:14-15)
Some Christians Eager For Money (1 Timothy 6:8-10)
Ananias and Sapphira (Acts of the Apostles 5:1-11)

And here is a list of potential fallen believers:

The Servant Who is Not Looking For Him (Luke 12:45-46)
Recent Convert Who is a Potential Spiritual Leader (1 Timothy 3:6)
The Unforgiving in Heart (Matthew 6:14-15)
Luke Warm Unrepentant Believer (Revelation 3:14-22)
Fruitless Christians (John 15:1-10) (Matthew 25:14-30)
Widows That Live in Pleasure (1 Timothy 5:5-6)
Believers Whose Seed Fell Upon the Rocks (Luke 8:13)
Believers Whose Seed Was Choked by Thorns (Matthew 13:22)
Gentile Believer Who Did Not Have on a Wedding Garment (Matthew 22:1-14) (Revelation 19:7-8)
The Potential Fellow Believer Who Erred From the Truth & Was Converted Back (James 5:19-20)

In fact, Paul is against Eternal Security or a sin and still be saved type belief. For Paul says,

We can fall from grace (Galatians 5:4).
We can be moved away from the hope (Colossians 1:23).
We can be a castaway (1 Corinthians 9:27).
We can be cut off just like the Jews if we do not continue in God’s goodness (Romans 11:20-22).
We can sow to the flesh and reap corruption instead of sowing to the Spirit which reaps everlasting life. (Galatians 6:8).
We can deny God by a lack of good works (Titus 1:16).
We can shipwreck our faith (1 Timothy 1:19).
We can deny the faith and be worse than an infidel if we do not provide for our own household (1 Timothy 5:8).
We can err from the faith and pierce ourselves thru with many sorrows if we love and covet after money (1 Timothy 6:10).
Hymnenaeus and Philetus have overthrown the faith of some (2 Timothy 2:18).

These things would not exist in Scripture if things are as you say.

Hammster · Aug 18, 2021

Bible Highlighter said:
The Bible does not teach OSAS (Once Saved Always Saved) or a sin and still be saved type belief. Almost every page in your New Testament speaks against this kind of belief (if you were to pay more closer attention to what your Bible says).

Here are several lists of verses that makes it absolutely clear that believers can fall away from the faith:

Here is a General List of Verses on How Believers Can Fall Away:

1 Samuel 16:14
1 Samuel 31:4
Ezekiel 18:24
Hebrews 3:12-14
Hebrews 4:11
Hebrews 6:4-9
Hebrews 10:26-30
Hebrews 12:15
1 Timothy 1:18-20
1 Timothy 4:1-7
Galatians 3:1-5
2 Peter 2:20-22
2 Peter 3:17
Matthew 13:18-23
1 Corinthians 10:12
2 Thessalonians 2:3

Now, do not misunderstand me, believers cannot lose their salvation (like they would a pair of car keys), but they can forfeit their salvation (i.e. they can willingly throw it away by rebelling against God) by their sinning with no repentance. In fact,

Here is a list of believers who have forfeited their salvation:

Saul (1 Samuel 16:14) (1 Samuel 31:4)
Demas (2 Timothy 4:10)
The Prodigal Son (Luke 15:11-32)
Judas Iscariot (Psalm 41:9) (Luke 6:16) (Acts 1:25)
Hymenaeus and Philetus (2 Timothy 2:17-18)
Unnamed Christians destroyed by false teaching (2 Timothy 2:17-18)
Many Unnamed Disciples (John 6:66)
Some Younger Christian Widows (1 Timothy 5:14-15)
Some Christians Eager For Money (1 Timothy 6:8-10)
Ananias and Sapphira (Acts of the Apostles 5:1-11)

And here is a list of potential fallen believers:

The Servant Who is Not Looking For Him (Luke 12:45-46)
Recent Convert Who is a Potential Spiritual Leader (1 Timothy 3:6)
The Unforgiving in Heart (Matthew 6:14-15)
Luke Warm Unrepentant Believer (Revelation 3:14-22)
Fruitless Christians (John 15:1-10) (Matthew 25:14-30)
Widows That Live in Pleasure (1 Timothy 5:5-6)
Believers Whose Seed Fell Upon the Rocks (Luke 8:13)
Believers Whose Seed Was Choked by Thorns (Matthew 13:22)
Gentile Believer Who Did Not Have on a Wedding Garment (Matthew 22:1-14) (Revelation 19:7-8)
The Potential Fellow Believer Who Erred From the Truth & Was Converted Back (James 5:19-20)

In fact, Paul is against Eternal Security or a sin and still be saved type belief. For Paul says,

We can fall from grace (Galatians 5:4).

We can be moved away from the hope (Colossians 1:23).

We can be a castaway (1 Corinthians 9:27).

We can be cut off just like the Jews if we do not continue in God’s goodness (Romans 11:20-22).

We can sow to the flesh and reap corruption instead of sowing to the Spirit which reaps everlasting life. (Galatians 6:8).

We can deny God by a lack of good works (Titus 1:16).

We can shipwreck our faith (1 Timothy 1:19).

We can deny the faith and be worse than an infidel if we do not provide for our own household (1 Timothy 5:8).

We can err from the faith and pierce ourselves thru with many sorrows if we love and covet after money (1 Timothy 6:10).

Hymnenaeus and Philetus have overthrown the faith of some (2 Timothy 2:18).

These things would not exist in Scripture if things are as you say.

Not a single one of those say that a believer can become unsaved.

Bible Highlighter · Aug 18, 2021

Aussie Pete said:
How is it possible to be unborn again? God caused us to be born again. He put us into Christ. Who then can reverse that? Sin breaks fellowship. It does not change relationship. Christians have eternal life. That means exactly what it says. Eternal. Now a Christian can lose the experience of eternal life. They can be restored very easily. Why? Because sin is the exception for a Christian, unlike unbelievers, who sin by nature.

I've not heard of Jack Chick until now. He was somewhat extreme, obviously. I also think that he counterbalanced some of the "easy believism" and "let's not offend anyone" attitudes that have become prevalent. I don't agree with every word that Paul Washer says, but he also is an antidote to the complacent and lifeless "Christianism" that infects the modern church in the Western world.

I'm not convinced that we need to attack other religions, except maybe the pseudo Christian like Mormonism or Jehovah's Witnesses. But we do need to be ready to witness to all people, whatever their beliefs. It is also not an evil thing to offend people. The gospel is offensive to those who reject it. If you don't want to offend then you must disobey the great commission.

I believe Jack Chick’s tracts has led many to Christ, and his resources teach many to trust in the pure Word of God (i.e. To have a faith that does not waver back and forth by every wind of doctrine), but Jack’s ministry that he left behind (like many in the church) does not appear to understand 2 Thessalonians 2:13-14, Titus 1:16, Matthew 25:30, Romans 8:13, etc.

This is important to understand because a person can be initially saved and later fall away and die spiritually. Believers need to work out their salvation with fear and trembling (Philippians 2:12). Hebrews 12:14 says to follow after holiness without which no man shall see the Lord.

For many on the day of judgment are going to be in for a surprise. They will think that they can sin and still be saved all because they had a belief on Jesus, but we know by Matthew 13:41-42, and Matthew 7:21-27 that believers can be cast out of the kingdom because of their sin. I mean, why would one want to take the chance on a sin and still be saved type belief? What if one is wrong? For why take the gamble when there are so many verses that teach against how a believer can sin and still be saved?

Guojing · Aug 18, 2021

Bible Highlighter said:
I have heard Christians justify all kinds of sins in different amounts or levels. Many Christians will admit they cannot help but to commit grievous sin in this life. They basically imply they cannot stop committing serious sin this side of Heaven. So if there is no loss of salvation, then there is no real motivation for a believer to stop committing grievous sin in their life. So it appears that they are not all that different than an unbeliever except for a belief alone in Jesus for salvation. One example is the author of the website called: “Jesus is Savior” (David J. Stewart). Check out his article here:

Jack Chick's False Gospel

According to the article: David J. Stewart thinks that a person is to only believe in Jesus or the gospel for salvation, and that Jack Chick is wrong for telling people to repent (turn from sin) as a part of salvation. For David J. Stewart thinks that a person can be saved while committing fornication. Granted, I think Jack Chick may agree with turning from sin to a degree (as a part of salvation), but I think he holds to the view that we are saved solely by Jesus and that it will lead to a changed life automatically. But the Bible teaches that we are to work out our salvation with fear and trembling (Philippians 2:12). Like with the tract: “Flight 144”: At certain times, Jack Chick does not appear to entirely agree with the full extent in living holy as a part of our Sanctification (Which is what God has chosen us for) (See: 2 Thessalonians 2:13-14); Thus, Chick Publication’s tract called: “Flight 144” implies no works of any kind as a part of the saved Christian life. Did Jack Chick agree with James 2:24? What about Titus 1:16? My concern with his tract “Flight 144” is that it can imply that a person can be lazy for the Lord and they can serve themselves and their sin instead of God. Jesus said, cast the unprofitable servant into outer darkness (Matthew 25:30).

Anyways, David J. Stewart's gospel is what Jude 1:4 warns us about. It makes me want to throw up that Christians think they can turn His grace into a license for immorality like that.

Out of curiosity, you stated clearly that we are also under the new covenant earlier.

Hebrews 8:12 is a promise under the nc where our sins and lawless deeds will be remembered no more. You believe it’s only for past sins?

Plus Hebrews 8:8-10 stated that the law is written in our hearts. You mean man can still choose to sin when that happens? What do you think written in our hearts meant?

Aussie Pete · Aug 18, 2021

Bible Highlighter said:
I believe Jack Chick’s tracts has led many to Christ, and his resources teach many to trust in the pure Word of God (i.e. To have a faith that does not waver back and forth by every wind of doctrine), but Jack’s ministry that he left behind (like many in the church) does not appear to understand 2 Thessalonians 2:13-14, Titus 1:16, Matthew 25:30, Romans 8:13, etc.

This is important to understand because a person can be initially saved and later fall away and die spiritually. Believers need to work out their salvation with fear and trembling (Philippians 2:12). Hebrews 12:14 says to follow after holiness without which no man shall see the Lord.

For many on the day of judgment are going to be in for a surprise. They will think that they can sin and still be saved all because they had a belief on Jesus, but we know by Matthew 13:41-42, and Matthew 7:21-27 that believers can be cast out of the kingdom because of their sin. I mean, why would one want to take the chance on a sin and still be saved type belief? What if one is wrong? For why take the gamble when there are so many verses that teach against how a believer can sin and still be saved?

How can eternal life not be eternal? I'm not advocating that Christians live in sin, but those who are born again are already in heaven spiritually. If someone tells me that they love to sin and have no conscience, I tell them that they are not born again. Real Christians have a conscience and the indwelling Holy Spirit to convict and empower.

Christians do not automatically grow. When first born again, we know only what we heard that brought us to Christ. Few are like the Wesley brothers, Spurgeon (he was a smoker by the way) or Watchman Nee. We have teachers and preachers for a reason.

The problem is that most teaching is back to front. It starts by telling Christians how they should behave. What Christians need is to know who they are in Christ, who He is in them, what it means to be crucified with Christ, what it means to be a disciple and the importance of the Kingdom of God. Only then should they be corrected where necessary or rebuked if required. Very often problems are resolved by knowing that they have the power to overcome already.

If I had the option of just one book in the Bible to study and teach from, it would be Ephesians. First, the good news of what Christ has secured for us. Then how we should live in the light of what Christ has done. Anything else just risks believers coming under condemnation. Satan is the accuser of the brethren. The Holy Spirit convicts. There is a vast difference, but how many Christians know that?

Does anyone actually believe Jack Chick's theology?

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Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul.

Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul.

Psalm 144:1

Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul.

Psalm 144:1

Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul.

Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul.

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Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul.

Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul.

Psalm 144:1

Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul.

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