Entire IHOP quit in the middle of their shift

rturner76

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Seriously though, the government always wastes very much more money than it ever gives to the poor, etc, with a ton of other programs/pork that they try hard to keep us from finding out about and/or knowing, etc, usually having to do with elections and getting re-elected continually usually, etc...

God Bless!
Yeah I was reading about how the Fed (Prez) has access to all these discretionary funds that get doled out to the businesses/government offices/infrastructure projects/tax credits on and on city, county, private business, and state. They (he) gets a request and it's no or yes. They're called Presidental Discretionary Grants. It's all favor for a favor. You keep your people voting for me and I'll line your people's pockets with grant money.

A lot of good programs get money but it's a bunch of pigs at the trough.
 
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Hammster

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Legal theft means that it was done without permission. As long as you have representation, you have given your permission. That is why people being able to vote is so important.
Spin it how you want, it’s still immoral.
 
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Hammster

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Huh? Who said anything about paying people equally or unequally?
You did. “Government subsidizes business when it pays welfare benefits to people who are working but not earning enough to get by.” If you want to avoid govt subsidies, you have to pay people unequally because not everyone has the same needs.
You might want to read up on how markets work. I think you’re missing the point.
I don’t think so. But feel free to enlighten me.
 
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Hammster

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We're talking about a starting point to determine what a "livable wage" might be.
And you won’t tell us what that is. It’s this mysterious number.
 
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John Mullally

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I can't link to it because of the language in the video, but if you Google "IHOP employees quit" you'll get the results. They join a growing number of people leaving businesses abandoned due to low wages and being over worked. I truly hope with all my heart and soul that more walkouts continue, and on a larger scale. When we, the people, refuse to work for the old guys driving expensive cars, living in multi million dollar homes, going on exotic vacations, and cripple them, then things will change. Cripple the corporate thugs claiming they can't pay living wages while living in luxury.
IHOP not only stands for a restaurant chain, it also stands for the much criticized (by Cessationists) International House of Prayer - led by Mike Bickle in Kansas City. At first, based upon this being Christian Forums, I though you were talking about their staff!
 
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Occams Barber

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And you won’t tell us what that is. It’s this mysterious number.


Working out a liveable wage takes a lot of data but it isn't that difficult to do.

Back in 1907, the Australian Court of Arbitration handed down a decision (the "Harvester Decision") that the minimum wage for an unskilled labourer in the Harvester machinery factory should be enough to support the worker and his family. The amount was seven shillings. It was calculated by adding up the costs of maintaining a family unit of the worker plus a wife and three children.
Harvester Case | Waltzing Matilda and the Sunshine Harvester Factory (fwc.gov.au)

This decision carried through to all wages in Australia where wages for skilled labour and various trades were seen as variation to the basic wage. The basic wage is adjusted annually taking into account inflation and things like productivity gains.

In Australia, minimum wage rates are set by a statutory body (the Fair Work Commission) independent of Parliament.

If Australia could do it in 1907 I'm sure it's not beyond the US in 2021.

OB
 
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The One Reborn

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Which doesn’t change the fact that it’s theft.

Are you one of these people who thinks all taxation is theft?

Because if that's the case then there really is no point in anyone having a conversation on this topic with you because you are so incredibly far removed from reality.
 
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John Mullally

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Working out a liveable wage takes a lot of data but it isn't that difficult to do.

Back in 1907, the Australian Court of Arbitration handed down a decision (the "Harvester Decision") that the minimum wage for an unskilled labourer in the Harvester machinery factory should be enough to support the worker and his family. The amount was seven shillings. It was calculated by adding up the costs of maintaining a family unit of the worker plus a wife and three children.
Harvester Case | Waltzing Matilda and the Sunshine Harvester Factory (fwc.gov.au)

This decision carried through to all wages in Australia where wages for skilled labour and various trades were seen as variation to the basic wage. The basic wage is adjusted annually taking into account inflation and things like productivity gains.

In Australia, minimum wage rates are set by a statutory body (the Fair Work Commission) independent of Parliament.

If Australia could do it in 1907 I'm sure it's not beyond the US in 2021.

OB
If you ask 10 different groups about "What is a livable wage in the US in 2021" across the political spectrum, you will get wildly different answers. Ever heard of the Market System - its Occum's Razor stupid simple.
 
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Occams Barber

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If you ask 10 different groups about "What is a livable wage in the US in 2021" across the political spectrum, you will get wildly different answers.

Of course you will get a variety of answers. That's why you throw a collection of economists and sociologists into a room with an objective and a pile of data and let them sort it out. Let them develop a set of principles and a method. Leave the politicians outside.

The results will not be perfect. It will require compromise and lots of averaging and all manner of statistical jigging but... it can be done.

There is a school of thought which wants the perfect to be the enemy of the good. This school is basically the worst enemy of any change. Change is messy. It is less than perfect. But if you expect perfection, nothing will ever change.

Ever heard of the Market System - its Occum's Razor stupid simple.

The market system, taken to extremes, is self destructive. Capitalism depends on people spending money. To spend money people must first have money to spend. If capital squeezes wages too hard it effectively kills the golden goose, the spending consumer, it depends on for its existence.

If enough people are struggling on low wages you've also created the basis for dissatisfaction and social upheaval (sound familiar?). Depress wages enough and revolution isn't far behind.

OB
 
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iluvatar5150

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Are you one of these people who thinks all taxation is theft?

Because if that's the case then there really is no point in anyone having a conversation on this topic with you because you are so incredibly far removed from reality.
The argument that minwage==theft is even more absurd than making the same claim about taxes, because taxes actually are mandatory or “forced” payments while wages are not.
 
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Vylo

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The argument that minwage==theft is even more absurd than making the same claim about taxes, because taxes actually are mandatory or “forced” payments while wages are not.
But you see, we have to call it theft to distract from the wealthy siphoning everything up. Those silly Amazon employees, wanting a living wage and bathroom breaks! Bezos needs the cash to go to space for....uh....reasons!
 
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Hammster

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Are you one of these people who thinks all taxation is theft?

Because if that's the case then there really is no point in anyone having a conversation on this topic with you because you are so incredibly far removed from reality.
We aren’t talking about taxes.
 
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Hammster

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But you see, we have to call it theft to distract from the wealthy siphoning everything up. Those silly Amazon employees, wanting a living wage and bathroom breaks! Bezos needs the cash to go to space for....uh....reasons!
Amazon employees make more than minimum wage. And they aren’t slaves.
 
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98cwitr

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I can't link to it because of the language in the video, but if you Google "IHOP employees quit" you'll get the results. They join a growing number of people leaving businesses abandoned due to low wages and being over worked. I truly hope with all my heart and soul that more walkouts continue, and on a larger scale. When we, the people, refuse to work for the old guys driving expensive cars, living in multi million dollar homes, going on exotic vacations, and cripple them, then things will change. Cripple the corporate thugs claiming they can't pay living wages while living in luxury.

Worrying about what other people have is called coveting. See 10th commandment.
 
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GreekOrthodox

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St. John Chrysostom wrote in the 4th century:

If you cannot remember everything, instead of everything, I beg you, remember this without fail, that not to share our own wealth with the poor is theft from the poor and deprivation of their means of life; we do not possess our own wealth but theirs. If we have this attitude, we will certainly offer our money; and by nourishing Christ in poverty here and laying up great profit hereafter, we will be able to attain the good things which are to come, by the grace and kindness of our Lord Jesus Christ, with Whom (be glory, honor, and might,) to the Father, together with the Holy Spirit, now and ever and unto ages of ages. Amen (On Wealth and Poverty).
 
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RocksInMyHead

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Would you agree McDonalds is more likely to hire someone with no experience than Dillons? I can't speak for every single grocery store in the country, but usually when a high paying job hires someone with no experience, it is the exception not the rule; unless they have some type of apprenticeship program where they teach you a trade. Grocery stores generally don't operate that way.
High paying? Hah. I was making $7.50/hr (minimum wage) when I started and got bumped to $7.75 after a couple months. And none of the jobs there paid particularly well. I was a clerk at the meat counter, and my manager was making about $10-$11/hr iirc. He'd been there for a few years. I quit soon after that for a job that paid better.

The job took no more skill than working in a McDonalds and I highly doubt that their hiring standards were any higher.

Low paying jobs have a reputation of being starter jobs; higher paying jobs do not have such a reputation.
This is a bit of a chicken-and-egg problem. Are the jobs starter jobs because they pay less or do they pay less because they're starter jobs?
 
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Vylo

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Amazon employees make more than minimum wage. And they aren’t slaves.
Oh thank goodness, now they can afford to order depends off amazon so they don't get fired for relieving themselves while their boss uses the money he saved through their torture to needless rocket into the cosmos.
 
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Which is theft. It’s telling a business owner that he has to pay someone a certain wage, even if that job isn’t worth that amount.
Wrong. That is protecting the vulnerable.
 
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