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goykYes, certainly, all the Christians had in mind is causing trouble. Really? Do you always support Antifa?
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goykYes, certainly, all the Christians had in mind is causing trouble. Really? Do you always support Antifa?
Who said that?Since you all have bought into the Covid is a hoax theory Im bowing out
...it was antifa that attacked the service...That’s probably why that group is there to cause trouble. The proud boys are branded terrorists in Canada.
That can't be correct as videos and pictures show the pastor being pepper sprayed on stage and antifa throwing stuff into the crowd. If it was over, why were they still there and why was the pastor still on stage?The original story from the local Portland Tribune is somewhat different in context. It appears that the pastor's event actually went on and concluded as scheduled, but "left-wing anti-fascists, often dubbed antifa" and counter-protestors in Proud Boys colors clashed after the Christian meeting had concluded.
Pamplin Media Group - Left-, right-wing groups clash at rally in downtown Portland
Romans Chapter 13 comes to mind.
It's best for Christians to stay out of these politically energized disputes.
An unrecognized pastor contracting an informal political "gang" for lack of better terms (proud boys), as security for his preaching, is just as concerning as the political "gang" (antifa) that clashed with the proud boys.
No human being should be indulging in that behaviour. We are not dealing with country borders anymore. We are ambassadors from heaven to a dying world. God have mercy on us all.The bottom line here is that families were there for worship. This wasn't your run of the mill random street preacher who was screaming at everyone. This was a planned worship and preaching event in a public park. Even then, it doesn't matter. This is America, one should not be physically assaulted for processing their faith in public. Want to question them, debate them? Go nuts. But to spray pepper spray where children are present, throw flashbangs, smoke bombs and the like, is completely unamerican and wrong.
He is not unrecognized. His recognition was removed recently by the Canadian Government in an act of persecution.
Did he contract them? How do you know?Romans Chapter 13 comes to mind.
It's best for Christians to stay out of these politically energized disputes.
An unrecognized pastor contracting an informal political "gang" for lack of better terms (proud boys), as security for his preaching, is just as concerning as the political "gang" (antifa) that clashed with the proud boys.
Jesus told us we will be persecuted. The bible and prayer have been taken out of schools and hospitals and courtrooms the whole world over, and what it is being replaced with is ridicule and hatred of Christ and all things Christian. There are people being beheaded in other countries you have no idea where for their faith in Christ. In the picture it is clear that this antifa group is proudly satanic. I don't see the confusion here. This is persecution. A worship event was interrupted with smoke bombs and pepper spray where women and children were present. Why? Are we not allowed to worship in the open anymore, either?Violence in the street is disgusting. What happened is disgusting. Proud Boys and anti-fascists are to be deplored. But I am not convinced that this preacher guy was there for benign purposes. It has been said that he had Proud Boys as his security guards. Nothing is as it seems.
There seems to be an increasing view among Christians [some] on this board, that they are being persecuted, or will be persecuted if we don't watch out. That is just bunk. That seems to be in the playbook of some Christians to preach the gospel of victimhood and grievance.
I think the persecution in the minds of some are not for the right reason, not for defending the Gospel of Jesus Christ, but for defending a more 'poltically energized' goal.
Furthermore, I think that the 'Woe is us, we are being persecuted' Christians next logical step is "Let's hit the streets"
At that point the wolf and the sheep will be revealed.
Did he contract them? How do you know?
If he's out hiring politically charged thugs with paintball guns to defend his gatherings, he's probably illegitimate. I don't know what kind of church you attend, but if you're surrounded by guys with paintball guns in kevlar vests, you're probably not doing it right.
Considering he was unjustly arrested by police who had broken Canadian law multiple times by interrupting his services, and was arrested for violating a court order that was kept a secret from him by the government and considering they shuttered the doors to his Church, he's doing the right thing
Um.. you are making a lot of assumptions. Obviously on the street anyone can show up.Like I said above, if you're following a pastor who is getting tied up in political armed gang-like conflicts, you're doing it wrong. And no Christian should be trying to argue against this. Christ is our King, not neo-fascists, not anti-fascists either.
If you attend a sermon and it's surrounded by random political activist "militants" in kevlar vests with paint guns, I would implore you to flee as fast as you can.
The bottom line here is that families were there for worship. This wasn't your run of the mill random street preacher who was screaming at everyone. This was a planned worship and preaching event in a public park. Even then, it doesn't matter. This is America, one should not be physically assaulted for processing their faith in public. Want to question them, debate them? Go nuts. But to spray pepper spray where children are present, throw flashbangs, smoke bombs and the like, is completely unamerican and wrong.
according to the Portland Tribune linked in post #16 the service was long done...it was antifa that attacked the service...
Um.. you are making a lot of assumptions. Obviously on the street anyone can show up.
I would agree if he really was there to antagonise and not to hold an open worship service. Religious freedoms are being eroded every day, and one faith in particular is being singled out. Judging by who our enemy is, that should not come as a big surprise. One day we will cry for our freedoms, and then the question will come: why did you not fight for them then?Well why else would they be there? Most preachers have control over their own "security". If a bunch of guys walked into my church with kevlar vests and paintball guns claiming to be there to defend our lead pastor, they'd be kicked out and probably fined. Unless the church wanted them to be there. And honestly, that should be a huge red flag for all of us.
Extremism attracts extremism and we shouldn't be in that mix. If you find yourself among political activists intermingled with church, who are participating in armed conflicts. You need to flee as fast as you can away from these people.
When Paul wrote his chapter on Romans, he was highlighting the value of the gospel over political theater. But pulling in right wing activists to defend your sermon, you'd be doing the exact opposite of what Paul calls for us to do.
Jesus mission wasn't to lead an army against the Roman government. It was to preach the good news.
We are here to spread the gospel, not to get caught up between political infighting. Our King is Jesus. Not anyone else. We shouldn't be caught between clashes of political extremists.
It's not our mission to join these gangs one way or the other. And they don't represent us or our interests. the proud boys don't represent Christ. And we shouldn't want to melt our identity with theirs. Same with antifa. If you're a Christian and you're around people trying to topple the government. Go read Romans and flee.