Clicked, for new christians, wrong category appears. need info on basics

mindfulzen

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As a born atheist, in a home with no christianity ever, what is important? I feel I have done it, seeing as I have not read the book, and give faith without much knowledge on content. But feel it is my duty to learn more. I believe you must be truthful in life, to all people, not hate anybody at all in life. You endure, you never hate. Simple. But I want to know basic stuff that I am clueless on. Must I baptize as an adult? Must I change membership of religion? I do not believe God looks at worldly membershiplists, think he looks at your heart. I had another one before, never resigned, do not think it matters to God, do you think I am wrong and ,must take action?
 
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As a born atheist, in a home with no christianity ever, what is important? I feel I have done it, seeing as I have not read the book, and give faith without much knowledge on content. But feel it is my duty to learn more. I believe you must be truthful in life, to all people, not hate anybody at all in life. You endure, you never hate. Simple. But I want to know basic stuff that I am clueless on. Must I baptize as an adult? Must I change membership of religion? I do not believe God looks at worldly membershiplists, think he looks at your heart. I had another one before, never resigned, do not think it matters to God, do you think I am wrong and ,must take action?

Oh, God definitely looks at the heart! Faith in Christ(Holy Trinity) saves and results in good works. I made a mistake and became a Mormon/Latter-day Saint at age 18. That's not a Christian religion as they claim. I stayed until age thirty. I had to ask them to cancel my membership in order to get them to leave me alone. Later I requested baptism in a Protestant church and that was the right decision --- it was a Trinitarian denomination.

Feel free to ask more questions or to private message me.
 
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Lukaris

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For living daily life by faith you might want to read Matthew 22 & read Romans 13 in which St. Paul summarizes much of what the Lord said in that chapter of Matthew.

Our basic way of doing this is by practice of charity & prayer for ourselves & others as the Lord testifies in Matthew 6:1-15.
 
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timf

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You are on the right track. Your faith in Jesus brings you a new life (regeneration). Once you become regenerated (placed into the body of Christ), the Holy Spirit takes up residence within us. He is also called the Spirit of truth.

The Christian is free to follow a path called the flesh or follow a path called walking by the Spirit (Galatians chapter 5). Following after the Spirit allows the fruit of the Spirit to become manifest in our lives.

There are man denominations (flavors) of Christianity. However, God gives wisdom to all who ask (James chapter one). Part of Christian maturity is growing in wisdom and truth (Christ-likeness - Ephesians chapter 4)

Here is a link to walking by the Spirit (free pdf booklet) that might be interesting

http://christianpioneer.com/ebooks/wbts.pdf

You can also read it as web pages on a cellphone here

Christian Pioneer - Current blog
 
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aiki

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As a born atheist, in a home with no christianity ever, what is important? I feel I have done it, seeing as I have not read the book, and give faith without much knowledge on content. But feel it is my duty to learn more. I believe you must be truthful in life, to all people, not hate anybody at all in life. You endure, you never hate. Simple. But I want to know basic stuff that I am clueless on. Must I baptize as an adult? Must I change membership of religion? I do not believe God looks at worldly membershiplists, think he looks at your heart. I had another one before, never resigned, do not think it matters to God, do you think I am wrong and ,must take action?

Can you "give faith" apart from knowledge? I'm not sure you can. How can you have faith in something about which you are ignorant? Anyway, in light of this, the important thing right now for you is to read the Bible. Gain the knowledge you lack. It will do you little good, though, to just start at the beginning of the Bible and read to its end. Such a project will leave you confused and very likely quitting long before you've read all the way through the Bible. Instead, I'd urge you to read the Gospel of John (4 or 5 times), then the Book of Romans, and then the Book of the Revelation. After you've done this, a look at the Old Testament might be worthwhile (and make more sense).

The Christian life doesn't begin with you and what you do, but with God and what He does in you. God's First and Great Commandment isn't to tell the truth, or love everybody, or endure, but to learn to love Him with all of your being. (Matthew 22:36-38) It's out of a love for God that the rest of the Christian life is supposed to flow. Without a love for God motivating Christian living, the apostle Paul wrote that such living is useless. (1 Corinthians 13:1-3) This is how vital the First and Great Commandment is.

I'd recommend baptism only after you thoroughly understand salvation, being born-again spiritually, and your union with Christ in his death, burial and resurrection, which baptism symbolizes. (Romans 6:1-8) Without this understanding, baptism is just an empty ritual.

God calls you to be His child, a disciple of Christ, not a Baptist, or Presbyterian or Roman Catholic. And you're quite right: God does look on the heart. Outward conformity to His commands can never replace a heart that desires Him deeply, that longs to know and walk with Him, that thirsts for communion with Him. It is this love, this deep desire for Him, that God looks for in our hearts, above all.

Matthew 22:36-38
36 “Teacher, which is the great commandment in the Law?”
37 And he said to him, “You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.
38 This is the great and first commandment.

1 John 4:16-19
16 So we have come to know and to believe the love that God has for us. God is love, and whoever abides in love abides in God, and God abides in him.
17 By this is love perfected with us, so that we may have confidence for the day of judgment, because as he is so also are we in this world.
18 There is no fear in love, but perfect love casts out fear. For fear has to do with punishment, and whoever fears has not been perfected in love.
19 We love because he first loved us.
 
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mindfulzen

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Oh, God definitely looks at the heart! Faith in Christ(Holy Trinity) saves and results in good works. I made a mistake and became a Mormon/Latter-day Saint at age 18. That's not a Christian religion as they claim. I stayed until age thirty. I had to ask them to cancel my membership in order to get them to leave me alone. Later I requested baptism in a Protestant church and that was the right decision --- it was a Trinitarian denomination.

Feel free to ask more questions or to private message me.
I will probably PM you about something later. For now, I wonder about the baptism thing, fall is coming, might be hard to get adult baptism in cold weather. I also fear lockdown of churches again. And if I feel I must do it, I must first get membership. I reckon that could take a month in the paperwork.
 
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Confused-by-christianity

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As a born atheist, in a home with no christianity ever, what is important? I feel I have done it, seeing as I have not read the book, and give faith without much knowledge on content. But feel it is my duty to learn more. I believe you must be truthful in life, to all people, not hate anybody at all in life. You endure, you never hate. Simple. But I want to know basic stuff that I am clueless on. Must I baptize as an adult? Must I change membership of religion? I do not believe God looks at worldly membershiplists, think he looks at your heart. I had another one before, never resigned, do not think it matters to God, do you think I am wrong and ,must take action?
Love God, Love people. Do to them as you would have done to you.
Pray to Jesus and God - tell the truth in your prayers.
 
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mindfulzen

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Faith is trust. You have faith in all sorts of things in your worldly life. You have faith in the mailman bringing your mail, that your spouse is faithful to you, faith in your kids acting right, etc. How informed you are before you have faith, does not matter to me. If anything, it is a bigger leap of faith if you give it with less knowledge. I have read the baptist John stuff. That is how I got started. His stuff and some of the scripture of his apostles, what others said was important. 4 or 5 times you say, wow. Doing the book of daniel and psalms now.

Not blank on the bible. Just not read it for myself, actual wordings in scripture. Informed by others interpretations, want to interpret passages that seem important myself. I went to sunday school, had 4 hours christianity at school every week for 6, 7 or 8 years. Watched all the movies.

And personal faith is something I was lead to, by events in my life, and the envirnoment I lived in. What happened to others in my life. What it lead me to do. How the world is acting also. How family can stop being family, because of politics, how it can lead neighbours to attack eachothers, because of an election. How people defriend eachothers for politics, etc. Israel constantly attacked as prohecised. Unless I had felt it through life, I could never become christian, because that was not my envirnoment. I had to get faith in order to start reading the bible. Different path for atheists. End it here, and do a part two for the centrepoints about matthew and the other[/QUOTE]
 
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mindfulzen

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Can you "give faith" apart from knowledge? I'm not sure you can. How can you have faith in something about which you are ignorant? Anyway, in light of this, the important thing right now for you is to read the Bible. Gain the knowledge you lack. It will do you little good, though, to just start at the beginning of the Bible and read to its end. Such a project will leave you confused and very likely quitting long before you've read all the way through the Bible. Instead, I'd urge you to read the Gospel of John (4 or 5 times), then the Book of Romans, and then the Book of the Revelation. After you've done this, a look at the Old Testament might be worthwhile (and make more sense).

The Christian life doesn't begin with you and what you do, but with God and what He does in you. God's First and Great Commandment isn't to tell the truth, or love everybody, or endure, but to learn to love Him with all of your being. (Matthew 22:36-38) It's out of a love for God that the rest of the Christian life is supposed to flow. Without a love for God motivating Christian living, the apostle Paul wrote that such living is useless. (1 Corinthians 13:1-3) This is how vital the First and Great Commandment is.

I'd recommend baptism only after you thoroughly understand salvation, being born-again spiritually, and your union with Christ in his death, burial and resurrection, which baptism symbolizes. (Romans 6:1-8) Without this understanding, baptism is just an empty ritual.

God calls you to be His child, a disciple of Christ, not a Baptist, or Presbyterian or Roman Catholic. And you're quite right: God does look on the heart. Outward conformity to His commands can never replace a heart that desires Him deeply, that longs to know and walk with Him, that thirsts for communion with Him. It is this love, this deep desire for Him, that God looks for in our hearts, above all.

Matthew 22:36-38
36 “Teacher, which is the great commandment in the Law?”
37 And he said to him, “You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.
38 This is the great and first commandment.

1 John 4:16-19
16 So we have come to know and to believe the love that God has for us. God is love, and whoever abides in love abides in God, and God abides in him.
17 By this is love perfected with us, so that we may have confidence for the day of judgment, because as he is so also are we in this world.
18 There is no fear in love, but perfect love casts out fear. For fear has to do with punishment, and whoever fears has not been perfected in love.
19 We love because he first loved us.
You are wrong on how my christian life began, it started with me, and letting go of anger. It started with Jesse Lee Peterson entertaining me, and after a while it all made sense, and it was such simple truths. I saw a man with no fear, no anger, who never constrains his opinion, no matter how much people hate him. A truly free individual who just speaks the truth. This was my first step.

I was in the intellectual mindset before, and could not have faith, because it had to be proven and make logical sense. So walking on water, Jonah and the whale, would be walls that blocked me from God. I needed to see reverend Peterson, which barely graduated high school, has speechimpediment and dyslexia, become successful in an area that should not suit him. Illogical, and a miracle for him. And then he debates much smarter people with Phd's about various issues, and make them selfdestruct, while he calmly ask them basic questions they have never ever considered. That they need as foundation for what they advocate, otherwise it stands on quicksand foundation and will fall. I had to learn that the basic questions needed answers, before the big questions can be adressed. And see a david vs goliath thing in real life.

So it began with letting go of anger, which is hate, so you can have love in your heart and show it in action, and be guided by it. And we do not view love the same I think. Not hating is love. And later on, I must show devotion to God I think, think that is what will be the equal to what love is for you. Work in progress. And I cannot lie to God, by loving, and asking forgiveness and surrender, before I have done all the required steps. I have to know me, have a pure heart, before I can invite God into my life. And that mens I must also do the required stuff. If life is complicated, and you are new to faith, it is a complicated path, and learningcurve is different from yours.

I do not fear death or hell, no fear. So I have time to wait and learn some more. It cannot hurt to get more knowledge. If the knowledge convinces me, my heart will be more true and faith will only grow stronger. So I wait. Not ready to ask for my ticket to heaven yet. Not worthy yet. It would be lying to God, I will not do that. A remminence of the personality I had as an atheist, that I guess is me, it must be logical and real. So I must find out which denomination I am, and be able to define my belief. Bad idea to ask to enter, and when I get there, I cannot answer questions. I think that would result in me being sent to the other place. From faith, you shall gain knowledge, knowledge shall cement thy faith, and your convictions stands on solid foundation. Now you can surrender thy pure heart.
 
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mindfulzen

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Love God, Love people. Do to them as you would have done to you.
Pray to Jesus and God - tell the truth in your prayers.
I cannot pray yet. If I did it now, it would be lying. Praying would disqualify me from heaven. I do not have anything to pray for now. I asked somebody else to pray for me. I cannot pray to just pray. I must have a reason, and cannot ask for something I desire. It would have to be at the right time, for something I really felt and could not do on my own. I do not think I should pray just to pray. I need to understand more before I am ready for that. I do not know what is said about why, how and what we should pray for. Right now, praying for me, is like driving a car without license and insurance, irresponsible. Nothing worth doing, is ever easy.
 
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aiki

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Faith is trust. You have faith in all sorts of things in your worldly life. You have faith in the mailman bringing your mail, that your spouse is faithful to you, faith in your kids acting right, etc. How informed you are before you have faith, does not matter to me. If anything, it is a bigger leap of faith if you give it with less knowledge.

Yes, I agree. I exercise faith in all sorts of things everyday. But, generally, I do so from a basis of knowledge concerning those things in which I exert faith. Trust and knowledge go together. The more I know a person, the more I tend to trust them (though, not always). I certainly wouldn't hand over the keys to my house, my bank card and pin, and the whereabouts of my loved ones to a total stranger. But God demands access to my entire life, to control and shape as He sees fit. How much more important is it, then, to know Him as well as I can. Paul the apostle wrote to his protege, Timothy, on this matter, indicating the fundamental importance of knowledge to his belief and trust in God:

2 Timothy 1:12
12 ...for I know whom I have believed, and I am convinced that he is able to guard until that Day what has been entrusted to me.

For Paul, the "equation of faith" was: knowledge + belief + conviction = action.

Blind faith is not ever what the Bible urges of us. God may ask us to step out in faith beyond what our rationality and experience may be, but never apart from a solid basis of knowledge and experience from which to do so.

Not blank on the bible. Just not read it for myself, actual wordings in scripture. Informed by others interpretations, want to interpret passages that seem important myself. I went to sunday school, had 4 hours christianity at school every week for 6, 7 or 8 years. Watched all the movies.

Uh huh. Me, too. If you're wanting to study God's word well, then a concordance, Bible lexicon, maybe an interlinear Bible, and a few trusted commentaries will be very helpful.

And personal faith is something I was lead to, by events in my life, and the envirnoment I lived in. What happened to others in my life. What it lead me to do. How the world is acting also. How family can stop being family, because of politics, how it can lead neighbours to attack eachothers, because of an election. How people defriend eachothers for politics, etc. Israel constantly attacked as prohecised. Unless I had felt it through life, I could never become christian, because that was not my envirnoment. I had to get faith in order to start reading the bible. Different path for atheists. End it here, and do a part two for the centrepoints about matthew and the other

God has all sorts of ways of leading us to Himself.
 
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aiki

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You are wrong on how my christian life began, it started with me, and letting go of anger.

??? I don't recall commenting on how your Christian life began... I did, though, point out how important knowledge is to the sort of faith God wants His children to possess.

It started with Jesse Lee Peterson entertaining me, and after a while it all made sense, and it was such simple truths. I saw a man with no fear, no anger, who never constrains his opinion, no matter how much people hate him. A truly free individual who just speaks the truth. This was my first step.

Interesting. How about Jesus? Have you found him as compelling as Mr. Peterson?

I was in the intellectual mindset before, and could not have faith, because it had to be proven and make logical sense. So walking on water, Jonah and the whale, would be walls that blocked me from God.

But you could believe, as an atheist, that the universe popped into existence out of nothing? Interesting.

I needed to see reverend Peterson, which barely graduated high school, has speechimpediment and dyslexia, become successful in an area that should not suit him.

But the Resurrection of Christ wasn't really very compelling? Peterson was more impressive?

So it began with letting go of anger, which is hate, so you can have love in your heart and show it in action, and be guided by it. And we do not view love the same I think. Not hating is love.

You're right: This is not how I view love. Merely not hating sets the bar extremely low for what constitutes love. And this is definitely not Jesus's standard for what love is. His bar - the only one that really matters - is far, far, far beyond just not hating something or someone. I don't hate toilet paper. Does this mean I love toilet paper? Nope. How about you? Aren't there all sorts of things in your life you don't hate but which you could not claim to love, either? Rocks, paper, garden hoses, garbage pails, light bulbs, etc. ...

And later on, I must show devotion to God I think, think that is what will be the equal to what love is for you.

Not really, no. Devotion is not love for God; it is the result of love for God (or ought to be). Unfortunately, people can show devotion for God for reasons that have nothing to do with loving Him: fear, self-righteousness, obligation, etc.

Work in progress.

Amen. Join the club. It's a work that never ends.

And I cannot lie to God, by loving, and asking forgiveness and surrender, before I have done all the required steps. I have to know me,

Well, this is certainly how the world thinks. But it isn't what God says to us in His word. The more we are focused on ourselves, the less we are focused on Him. The effort to know ourselves leads away from God, not toward Him. God's made us to be conformed, to one degree or another, upon the things we focus on. This is why companies spend billions every year on attracting our attention. If we fix upon ourselves, becoming occupied with knowing ourselves, we will simply become more set in who we are rather than growing to be more like Jesus. (Hebrews 12:2-3; 2 Corinthians 3:18)

have a pure heart, before I can invite God into my life.

Goodness, no! This is exactly the reverse of what is the case! God purifies your heart for you; you don't purify it yourself for Him. God cleans us up by His power. But He does this only once we've invited Him into our lives to do so. By yourself, you can never make yourself pure enough to satisfy God. This is an important truth of the Gospel. Read Romans 3:23, Jeremiah 17:9, Ephesians 2:1-3. We are sin-sick and can do nothing for ourselves to change this condition. This is why we so desperately need Jesus who, by our faith and trust in him, gives to us his righteousness, thereby making us acceptable to God.

I do not fear death or hell, no fear. So I have time to wait and learn some more.

I think you don't fear because you don't really know what it is of which you should be afraid.

If the knowledge convinces me, my heart will be more true and faith will only grow stronger. So I wait. Not ready to ask for my ticket to heaven yet. Not worthy yet.

You will never be worthy. None of us can ever be worthy of God. This is the amazing thing about what God has done for us through Jesus. We are bound in sin, utterly unable ever to meet God on His terms. And so, God became flesh in the Person of Jesus, and made a way for us to be related to Him as His children, satisfying His terms for us by way of Jesus's atoning sacrifice on the cross. So, you don't have to wait, friend, to deserve God. You will never deserve Him. But that hasn't stopped God from making a way for you to walk with Him.

Ephesians 2:1-9
1 And you were dead in the trespasses and sins
2 in which you once walked, following the course of this world, following the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that is now at work in the sons of disobedience—
3 among whom we all once lived in the passions of our flesh, carrying out the desires of the body and the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, like the rest of mankind.
4 But God, being rich in mercy, because of the great love with which he loved us,
5 even when we were dead in our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ—by grace you have been saved—
6 and raised us up with him and seated us with him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus,
7 so that in the coming ages he might show the immeasurable riches of his grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus.
8 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God,
9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast.


So I must find out which denomination I am, and be able to define my belief.

Nowhere in the Bible does God ever call anyone to a denomination. He calls us to Himself, to Christ, not to the Eastern Orthodox church, or to Lutheranism, or Anglicanism.

Revelation 3:20
20 Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and eat with him, and he with me.


Acts 4:12
12 And there is salvation in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved.


1 Timothy 2:5-6
5 For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,
6 who gave himself as a ransom for all...


From faith, you shall gain knowledge, knowledge shall cement thy faith, and your convictions stands on solid foundation. Now you can surrender thy pure heart.

I think, friend, your cup is maybe too full of your own ideas, pride and self-reliance.
 
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mindfulzen

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Yes, I agree. I exercise faith in all sorts of things everyday. But, generally, I do so from a basis of knowledge concerning those things in which I exert faith. Trust and knowledge go together. The more I know a person, the more I tend to trust them (though, not always). I certainly wouldn't hand over the keys to my house, my bank card and pin, and the whereabouts of my loved ones to a total stranger. But God demands access to my entire life, to control and shape as He sees fit. How much more important is it, then, to know Him as well as I can. Paul the apostle wrote to his protege, Timothy, on this matter, indicating the fundamental importance of knowledge to his belief and trust in God:

2 Timothy 1:12
12 ...for I know whom I have believed, and I am convinced that he is able to guard until that Day what has been entrusted to me.


For Paul, the "equation of faith" was: knowledge + belief + conviction = action.

Blind faith is not ever what the Bible urges of us. God may ask us to step out in faith beyond what our rationality and experience may be, but never apart from a solid basis of knowledge and experience from which to do so.



Uh huh. Me, too. If you're wanting to study God's word well, then a concordance, Bible lexicon, maybe an interlinear Bible, and a few trusted commentaries will be very helpful.



God has all sorts of ways of leading us to Himself.
I am not general, my road was not expected or wanted by me, it just happened. I have always been kind of naive and trusting to people. Never was very awere of evil in people and selfish desires. I have just had faith in people, trusted them, and let go, and been burned a bunch of times. So, I go into things with love, which does not require full knowledge. Not in life this time with people, but religion, same approach.

I moved into an apartment at a lady who had a house, when I went to college. She had an open door with stairs down to me, so she just walked down into my place. I was reserved, so I went out my door, around the house and rang her doorbel for many months. But I trusted her completely from day one, and never had a second thought about her being able to just wonder down and go through my stuff, and see what I did on my computer. Which often was on while I was at school, or at friends. Then we got more and more involved in eachothers life, with me being invited up to her parties, and she came down and partied a bit with me, just us two, watching movies together and eating meals.

Then after about 3 months, I ended up with her friend sleeping over at my place, and I kind of told her that I was attracted to my landlady, which is also a bit naive to do, because she told her that. Then my landlady suddenly came down in her nightgown, revealing way too much and sat too high up in the stairs on a sunday morning, when we drank coffee and chatted. She insisted that I just used the stairs if I wanted to come and have a coffee or chat or whatever. So I did. Did not put 2+2 together yet. Then we watched some movies, some scary so she snuggled and I held her, then some romantic, and soon after that we were lovers, and lived like a couple almost. Shopped together, ate dinner together, And spent like 10 hours together a day. Just walked in and out as we wanted. I never mistrusted her at the time, my computer ws always on, emails always open, full trust. And her kids could also walk down at anytime since the door was open. If they wanted to steal a cigarette or beer. Some people just do trust first. After that I learned about the person. The same goes for God. I was even honest with her about smoking hash, which she did not like at all. There were some cheating along the way too, but we still kept the trust.
 
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mindfulzen

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??? I don't recall commenting on how your Christian life began... I did, though, point out how important knowledge is to the sort of faith God wants His children to possess.



Interesting. How about Jesus? Have you found him as compelling as Mr. Peterson?



But you could believe, as an atheist, that the universe popped into existence out of nothing? Interesting.



But the Resurrection of Christ wasn't really very compelling? Peterson was more impressive?



You're right: This is not how I view love. Merely not hating sets the bar extremely low for what constitutes love. And this is definitely not Jesus's standard for what love is. His bar - the only one that really matters - is far, far, far beyond just not hating something or someone. I don't hate toilet paper. Does this mean I love toilet paper? Nope. How about you? Aren't there all sorts of things in your life you don't hate but which you could not claim to love, either? Rocks, paper, garden hoses, garbage pails, light bulbs, etc. ...



Not really, no. Devotion is not love for God; it is the result of love for God (or ought to be). Unfortunately, people can show devotion for God for reasons that have nothing to do with loving Him: fear, self-righteousness, obligation, etc.



Amen. Join the club. It's a work that never ends.



Well, this is certainly how the world thinks. But it isn't what God says to us in His word. The more we are focused on ourselves, the less we are focused on Him. The effort to know ourselves leads away from God, not toward Him. God's made us to be conformed, to one degree or another, upon the things we focus on. This is why companies spend billions every year on attracting our attention. If we fix upon ourselves, becoming occupied with knowing ourselves, we will simply become more set in who we are rather than growing to be more like Jesus. (Hebrews 12:2-3; 2 Corinthians 3:18)



Goodness, no! This is exactly the reverse of what is the case! God purifies your heart for you; you don't purify it yourself for Him. God cleans us up by His power. But He does this only once we've invited Him into our lives to do so. By yourself, you can never make yourself pure enough to satisfy God. This is an important truth of the Gospel. Read Romans 3:23, Jeremiah 17:9, Ephesians 2:1-3. We are sin-sick and can do nothing for ourselves to change this condition. This is why we so desperately need Jesus who, by our faith and trust in him, gives to us his righteousness, thereby making us acceptable to God.



I think you don't fear because you don't really know what it is of which you should be afraid.



You will never be worthy. None of us can ever be worthy of God. This is the amazing thing about what God has done for us through Jesus. We are bound in sin, utterly unable ever to meet God on His terms. And so, God became flesh in the Person of Jesus, and made a way for us to be related to Him as His children, satisfying His terms for us by way of Jesus's atoning sacrifice on the cross. So, you don't have to wait, friend, to deserve God. You will never deserve Him. But that hasn't stopped God from making a way for you to walk with Him.

Ephesians 2:1-9
1 And you were dead in the trespasses and sins
2 in which you once walked, following the course of this world, following the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that is now at work in the sons of disobedience—
3 among whom we all once lived in the passions of our flesh, carrying out the desires of the body and the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, like the rest of mankind.
4 But God, being rich in mercy, because of the great love with which he loved us,
5 even when we were dead in our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ—by grace you have been saved—
6 and raised us up with him and seated us with him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus,
7 so that in the coming ages he might show the immeasurable riches of his grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus.
8 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God,
9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast.




Nowhere in the Bible does God ever call anyone to a denomination. He calls us to Himself, to Christ, not to the Eastern Orthodox church, or to Lutheranism, or Anglicanism.

Revelation 3:20
20 Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and eat with him, and he with me.


Acts 4:12
12 And there is salvation in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved.


1 Timothy 2:5-6
5 For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,
6 who gave himself as a ransom for all...




I think, friend, your cup is maybe too full of your own ideas, pride and self-reliance.
You said I must start with God. I say honestly that it started with letting go of anger for me. I told you I was a buddhist before that, and then I found a reverend who incorporates some buddhist element like the silent prayer, which is meditation, and very conservative afroamerican ministry. Not standard way for a white european to go that route. And that I disagreed on almost everything the reverend stood for, and that he made very basic arguments, that made my opinions on political issues sink in quicksand. And after that, it was clear for me, that as a leftist, I could not be in favour of issues, that was built on lies, even if the outcome was good in my humanitarian views. If you were never far left, this may not be so relatable to you. I did not have a conservative bone in my body 15 years ago.

Jesus was a good man. He died for our sins, he points to God. I have seen all the movies and documentaries I have found on Jesus. Well versed in it. And his teachings have been spelled out to me at sunday school, school, and training for confirmation.

Just because I was an atheist, does not mean I had an opinion on how the universe came about. I do not know, and was never convinced by any theories. My view is the same as then, we do not know, and will never know, and it does not matter.

"But the Resurrection of Christ wasn't really very compelling? Peterson was more impressive?"

I was an atheist, I did not believe it. No christians had convinced me. It was just stories for me. Does it matter, if the one who convert people are respected by others or not? And you agree that we are not in sync on what love is. It is about becoming dispassionate for me. And doing what is right, instead of being carried away with emotions and desires. Living your faith. My life is a Taxi I drive and in the backseat sits God and directs me, if you need an analogy. And understand that some people have gone through depression, had bouts with addiction, so if you battle that, you often battle anger, depression is lack of love of yourself, so you must fix yourself first. So, JLP became one of many lifecoaches. Good advice from many, some atheists, some from other religions. I do not hate anything in my life right now.

You may be right about the purifying of the heart. Will read those verses you linked. Still, I do not want to have any hatred if I ask forgiveness and invites him in. I will not sin again after that. I do not understand how you can take that so lightly and assume you can sin freely.

Perhaps I should fear, but I do not have fear. Which is why I must learn more, in case I am not awere of something important. And so I should read it myself first. But fearing is also pointless unless it is fear of imminent danger, like a moose charging you, not for me. The ephesians verses are important. I have read them, and will continue to do so. But it is not a licence to sin for me.

I know that God says nothing about denomination, or Jesus, how could they? They came later as christianity fracured into hundreds of different fractions. All are in his Glory, but I live on planet earth or flatearth, so I must find teachings that I think is most correct. The focus is not right in the statechurch here. It requires no effort from me. Jesus said, you shall find me wherever you are, split a rock and I am there, paraphrased. I believe that. So wherever I am, I am in church. We are talking in church now.

I do not have pride.
 
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aiki

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I am not general, my road was not expected or wanted by me, it just happened. I have always been kind of naive and trusting to people. Never was very awere of evil in people and selfish desires. I have just had faith in people, trusted them, and let go, and been burned a bunch of times. So, I go into things with love, which does not require full knowledge. Not in life this time with people, but religion, same approach.

Okay. Regardless, God says that however trusting and charitable you are to others, you don't get anywhere close to the kind of righteous perfection He demands of us all. This is why we need Christ, who is perfect in righteousness and through our faith in him clothes us in his righteousness and so makes us acceptable to God. We can't get to God any other way.

1 Timothy 2:5
5 For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,


John 14:6
6 Jesus said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.


It isn't required by God that you know everything about the Christian faith before entering into a relationship with Him, but there are some things you DO have to know. Those things are what is known as the Gospel, or the Good News of Salvation. If you don't know the Gospel, you can't enter into God's kingdom.

Some people just do trust first. After that I learned about the person. The same goes for God.

God isn't like any other person. We can't just approach Him any old way we like. He tells us how things will go, not the other way 'round. He's God; we aren't. This makes a big difference to dealing with Him.

You said I must start with God. I say honestly that it started with letting go of anger for me. I told you I was a buddhist before that, and then I found a reverend who incorporates some buddhist element like the silent prayer, which is meditation, and very conservative afroamerican ministry. Not standard way for a white european to go that route. And that I disagreed on almost everything the reverend stood for, and that he made very basic arguments, that made my opinions on political issues sink in quicksand. And after that, it was clear for me, that as a leftist, I could not be in favour of issues, that was built on lies, even if the outcome was good in my humanitarian views. If you were never far left, this may not be so relatable to you. I did not have a conservative bone in my body 15 years ago.

Okay. None of this is what I would call "starting with God." What you've described here is just a shift in some of your political beliefs, not a motion toward God.

Jesus was a good man. He died for our sins, he points to God. I have seen all the movies and documentaries I have found on Jesus. Well versed in it. And his teachings have been spelled out to me at sunday school, school, and training for confirmation.

Jesus wasn't just a "good man." He was God in the flesh, as the Bible teaches and his resurrection revealed. He could only die for our sins because he was divine. If you were as "well-versed" in Chrisian teaching on Jesus, as you say, this would already be clear to you.

Just because I was an atheist, does not mean I had an opinion on how the universe came about.

At the very least, as an atheist, you'd have ruled God out as a First Cause. That leaves you with only natural, physical causes that take you back, according to modern, mainstream science, to the Big Bang. But what produced the Big Bang? Maybe as the sort of atheist you were, you avoided wondering about this, but many atheists I know just resort to saying, "It came out of nothing for no reason." How this line of thinking is preferable to the Judeo-Christian one I don't know.

I was an atheist, I did not believe it. No christians had convinced me. It was just stories for me. Does it matter, if the one who convert people are respected by others or not? And you agree that we are not in sync on what love is. It is about becoming dispassionate for me.

Becoming dispassionate isn't what it's about for Jesus. And for Christians what "it's about" for him is what "it's about" for them.

And doing what is right, instead of being carried away with emotions and desires. Living your faith. My life is a Taxi I drive and in the backseat sits God and directs me, if you need an analogy.

No, I don't need an analogy. But I would suggest to you that God does not give the steering wheel to anyone. He drives us around, not the reverse. We go where He takes us. This is what it means to walk with God and not just some other human person. God calls the shots; we obey.

And understand that some people have gone through depression, had bouts with addiction, so if you battle that, you often battle anger, depression is lack of love of yourself, so you must fix yourself first.

Well, God says He fixes us; we don't - really, can't - properly fix ourselves. God says to us to come to Him for healing, forgiveness, restoration and fulfillment. Inasmuch as He made us, He knows best how to heal us.

Good advice from many, some atheists, some from other religions.

Only God, friend, knows the best way to advise you. He made you, after all. He's got all the answers.

I do not understand how you can take that so lightly and assume you can sin freely.

??? I don't take sin lightly and assume one can "sin freely." Where did you get that from? Nothing could be farther from the truth. God calls us to be holy people, righteous, sanctified people. I submit to Him every day, many times a day, so that He will make me so.

Perhaps I should fear, but I do not have fear.

One only needs fear in coming to God, not in walking with Him. We approach Him first as a wrathful Judge who can destroy both body and soul in hell, but when we have trusted in Christ and been adopted by God into His family, we are related to God as His children and need never fear God as Judge again.

I do not have pride.

God says different, friend. It is pride that is the Great Sin of humanity. It is evident in almost everything you've written. Not a glaring, overt, ugly sort of pride, but the pride of self-reliance, of knowing better than God, of seeking wisdom according to your thinking rather than to find it in God's word, of believing you can earn your way into God's good graces. This is all pride, at bottom, if you've the courage to see it. Until you do, it will be impossible to really know and enjoy God.

James 4:6-7
6 ... “God opposes the proud, but gives grace to the humble.”
7 Submit yourselves therefore to God...
 
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PROPHECYKID

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I cannot pray yet. If I did it now, it would be lying. Praying would disqualify me from heaven. I do not have anything to pray for now. I asked somebody else to pray for me. I cannot pray to just pray. I must have a reason, and cannot ask for something I desire. It would have to be at the right time, for something I really felt and could not do on my own. I do not think I should pray just to pray. I need to understand more before I am ready for that. I do not know what is said about why, how and what we should pray for. Right now, praying for me, is like driving a car without license and insurance, irresponsible. Nothing worth doing, is ever easy.
I'll just like to ask a question based on what you said here.

When you wake up in the morning, are you grateful to God for allowing you to see another day? If your answer is yes, then you have something to pray about. Prayer is not just about asking for what you want, its also about thanking God for what he has done. So even if you might not have anything in mind to ask for, you can always be thankful to God for something.
 
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mindfulzen

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I'll just like to ask a question based on what you said here.

When you wake up in the morning, are you grateful to God for allowing you to see another day? If your answer is yes, then you have something to pray about. Prayer is not just about asking for what you want, its also about thanking God for what he has done. So even if you might not have anything in mind to ask for, you can always be thankful to God for something.
Have not asked forgiveness yet, and have not read the book yet. It would not be honest to do before I read it. Will do it later. Trying to find a better bible, this one is ancient. But nice words. It would be nice if I could just do it now without any effort at all, butr I cannot. So, I take patience and do my biblestudy now, which I should have done as a kid. I am thankful now, but do not pray till I know more, do not want anything more yet. I am happy to have found faith, no complaints now. Cannot complain, and cannot cherish, because my earthly life is really bad. So it would be a lie, so I wait. Thank you for positive encouragement, much appreciated.
 
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mindfulzen

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Okay. Regardless, God says that however trusting and charitable you are to others, you don't get anywhere close to the kind of righteous perfection He demands of us all. This is why we need Christ, who is perfect in righteousness and through our faith in him clothes us in his righteousness and so makes us acceptable to God. We can't get to God any other way.

1 Timothy 2:5
5 For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,


John 14:6
6 Jesus said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.


It isn't required by God that you know everything about the Christian faith before entering into a relationship with Him, but there are some things you DO have to know. Those things are what is known as the Gospel, or the Good News of Salvation. If you don't know the Gospel, you can't enter into God's kingdom.



God isn't like any other person. We can't just approach Him any old way we like. He tells us how things will go, not the other way 'round. He's God; we aren't. This makes a big difference to dealing with Him.



Okay. None of this is what I would call "starting with God." What you've described here is just a shift in some of your political beliefs, not a motion toward God.



Jesus wasn't just a "good man." He was God in the flesh, as the Bible teaches and his resurrection revealed. He could only die for our sins because he was divine. If you were as "well-versed" in Chrisian teaching on Jesus, as you say, this would already be clear to you.



At the very least, as an atheist, you'd have ruled God out as a First Cause. That leaves you with only natural, physical causes that take you back, according to modern, mainstream science, to the Big Bang. But what produced the Big Bang? Maybe as the sort of atheist you were, you avoided wondering about this, but many atheists I know just resort to saying, "It came out of nothing for no reason." How this line of thinking is preferable to the Judeo-Christian one I don't know.



Becoming dispassionate isn't what it's about for Jesus. And for Christians what "it's about" for him is what "it's about" for them.



No, I don't need an analogy. But I would suggest to you that God does not give the steering wheel to anyone. He drives us around, not the reverse. We go where He takes us. This is what it means to walk with God and not just some other human person. God calls the shots; we obey.



Well, God says He fixes us; we don't - really, can't - properly fix ourselves. God says to us to come to Him for healing, forgiveness, restoration and fulfillment. Inasmuch as He made us, He knows best how to heal us.



Only God, friend, knows the best way to advise you. He made you, after all. He's got all the answers.



??? I don't take sin lightly and assume one can "sin freely." Where did you get that from? Nothing could be farther from the truth. God calls us to be holy people, righteous, sanctified people. I submit to Him every day, many times a day, so that He will make me so.



One only needs fear in coming to God, not in walking with Him. We approach Him first as a wrathful Judge who can destroy both body and soul in hell, but when we have trusted in Christ and been adopted by God into His family, we are related to God as His children and need never fear God as Judge again.



God says different, friend. It is pride that is the Great Sin of humanity. It is evident in almost everything you've written. Not a glaring, overt, ugly sort of pride, but the pride of self-reliance, of knowing better than God, of seeking wisdom according to your thinking rather than to find it in God's word, of believing you can earn your way into God's good graces. This is all pride, at bottom, if you've the courage to see it. Until you do, it will be impossible to really know and enjoy God.

James 4:6-7
6 ... “God opposes the proud, but gives grace to the humble.”
7 Submit yourselves therefore to God...
There is missing a "in" as before general. I have never questioned Jesus, I was never christian in my former life. I was a sinner and agonostic, and respected for that, for my antitheism if you will. Idid not have a bad heart, it was always good and wellmeaning, but misguided. But I was angry. I believe in Jesus, I know he was a good man, and sent by God, and that is part of my problem here on earth. I do not know any christian people, all the people I know are atheists, and mostly antitheists. They do not like that I have found God and changed my life. Various separate relations unitwed. Some want me back for love, some for free sex, some for drugs, and the family I kept, just want me back no matter what, and are adviced by dishonest people to hook up with my drugdealersagain. Which they are clueless about, that I will not divulge to them, so we do not have the same path or trial. I do not have the same options as you, not telling my family that my cousin is a drugdealer, sorry, not telling them that my former bestfriend is addicted to amphetamie and other pills, sorry. Not telling them that my ex is a nympho. I never invited them into that mess.

I have not approached God yet, I wait because I am not worthy yet. God teach, we learn and do. Yes, I started in the wrong place with politics, traditionally, but regardless, it is where I started, so it is my starting point. Do not question it. That is oner of the places that wherer my anger lingered the most, so makes sense to me.

Jesus was metaphysical, but that is not the point. He could do it without being that, and no disagreement here. Regardless, Jesus, incarnate of God, was a good person. I do not overcomplicate anymore. I dumb it down rather. Come on buddy, if Jesus and God is your friend, why so serious? Why not talk to them as friends? Be blunt, say what you really want.

I am not versed in christianity at all, a newbie. Just started reading the book at like 45 years old. I never claimed knowledge, I ask questions all the time, because I am so clueless.

You made a long comment, so end it with this one for now and do the rest later or tomorrow. Not acceptiing chriistian scripture about the world coming about, does not mean believing in bigbang. As an atheist, I was not a monoløith, and it was accepted. I really think you miss the boat, if you make this communal, it is personal
 
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