SDA--Seal of God vs. Mark of the Beast

tall73 · Jul 30, 2021

In another thread this topic came up. It would be good to have an Adventist (or more than one) go verse by verse through the relevant chapters in Revelation to explain their view.

While there have been a number of Sabbath threads, this aspect of SDA doctrine is less discussed.

Freth · Jul 30, 2021

I gave a summary of this topic in another thread recently. You can find it here.

tall73 · Jul 30, 2021

Freth said:
I gave a summary of this topic in another thread recently. You can find it here.

That was the thread that spawned this one later on, but you didn't go through all of the relevant chapters on the subject.

Adventist Heretic · Jul 31, 2021

Many people don't understand the SDA view, that it is written from the Prophetic perspective. That a future time will come when there is widespread apostasy that God's people will not be able to tell Good from Evil and who is loyal to God and who is not.

There will be a time when evil increases so much that, Evil comes into the church from the world and Gods people must make a distinction between themselves and the world. "Come out of her My people and be not partaker of her sins. and receive not her plagues " Rev 18:4.

During the time of Apostasy, 2 characteristic emerge Gods disciples, they obey Gods commands and have faith in Jesus. "Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus". Rev 14:12,

At the time of this Apostasy, God sends out a messenger to call is people to return to the Creator and Worship and Identify with Him, for the hour of his Social Justice has come." Rev 14:7 He said in a loud voice, “Fear God and give him glory, because the hour of his judgment has come. Worship him who made the heavens, the earth, the sea and the springs of water.”

The call to return to the Creator is a direct reference to remember our origins and God original desire us for us. His desire for us to be fruitful & multiply, biblical prosperity, where become all you were created to be, his desire for good, abundance and for us to represent Him properly in healthy relationship and authority, called the Image of God.

We believe this is best done by observing the Sabbath. It is the best way to show loyalty to the Creator, His Order, His Way and His Law. For it shows our origins, Sabbath was a sign of the Covenant with Israel and we are grafted into Israel. Sabbath was also used as a sign of Loyalty while in captivity in a foreign land, Babylon. Sabbath also reminds us of the promise of when he will rule and reign for 1000 years on earth and restore his order. Sabbath calls us to wait for this event and not try to restore things by means of the government coercion and force, loyalty to Christ must be by love and by choice.

BobRyan · Jul 31, 2021

As we saw on another thread - SDAs like many other Denominations admit that all TEN of the TEN Commandments continue in the NT and are "written on the heart and mind" under the Jer 31:31-34 New Covenant.

And the "ten" are the unit of law having "honor your father and mother as the first commandment with a promise" Eph 6:2

1 John 3:4 says that even in the NT "Sin IS transgression of the Law" so that means even the Sabbath is part of the moral law of God - and by definition the "moral law of God" defines what sin is Rom 3:20 (And Eph 6:2 reminds us that this includes that unit of Law having "honor your father and mother" in it.

20 ... "for through the Law comes knowledge of sin."

Rev 13 informs the reader that the mark of the beast involves violating some portion of the moral law of God (images, and worship of the beast) -- " so then sin". In the New Testament "Sin IS transgression of the law" 1 John 3:4 And since in Rev 13 it is in the context of worshiping the beast, an image to the beast etc - it must include some form of idolatry , false worship etc.

"making an image to the beast" is to make something that looks like the beast - or doing something that looks like the same thing that the beast does.

Certainly idolatry would be in opposition to part of that moral law of God.

By contrast in Rev 14:12 "the saints KEEP the Commandments of God AND their faith in Jesus" - which is part of the Three Angels Messages in Rev 14. This is where SDA Fundamental Beliefs comes in (belief #13) - because one of those beliefs is to preach the "everlasting Gospel" Rev 14:6 - as proclaimed to all the world at the end of time in the three angels messages found in Rev 14.

BobRyan · Jul 31, 2021

Given the details in post #5 as background - then the SDA position is "a prediction" that in the future - religious liberty will be smashed, intolerance of Christian freedom to worship God as the Bible dictates prohibited, liberty of conscience denied.

Some other Christians may "predict" that no such thing will happen in the future.

Even so - all cases of "future prediction" are tested when it is seen that it does not happen that way or that it in fact does happen that way - in what actually transpires in the future.

How much "fine grain detail" one can have about that future (though it be much-discussed) depends on either being a very good "guesser" or having direct input from God on those details. Still at a certain more general level -- the Bible is giving us some good information about it in Rev 12, 13 and 14.

1. The Mark of the beast according to Rev 13:16-18 is always and only in the context of setting up the image to the beast. It can only follow that event.

2. And so it is in context of the efforts made to force people to worship the beast.

3. Signs and wonders are associated with the efforts to get all of mankind to worship the beast. And this is consistent with 2 Thess 2 and Matt 24. It deceives "the whole earth"

4. The second beast sets up the image to the beast - but individuals are being directed to:

a. worship the beast,
b. receive the mark of the beast

5. It deceives all who live on the earth -- Rev 13: 8 All who live on the earth will worship him, everyone whose name has not been written since the foundation of the world in the book of life of the Lamb who has been slaughtered.

Rev 13:13 He performs great signs, so that he even makes fire come down out of the sky to the earth in the presence of people. 14 And he deceives those who live on the earth because of the signs which it was given him to perform in the presence of the beast, telling those who live on the earth to make an image to the beast who *had the wound of the sword and has come to life.

2 Thess 2:8 Then that lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will eliminate with the breath of His mouth and bring to an end by the appearance of His coming; 9 that is, the one whose coming is in accord with the activity of Satan, with all power and false signs and wonders, 10 and with all the deception of wickedness for those who perish, because they did not accept the love of the truth so as to be saved.

Matt 24:23 Then if anyone says to you, ‘Behold, here is the Christ,’ or ‘He is over here,’ do not believe him. 24 For false christs and false prophets will arise and will provide great signs and wonders, so as to mislead, if possible, even the elect.

BobRyan · Jul 31, 2021

The end-time singular event -- Seal of God -- in Rev 14 and Rev 7 is presented in contrast to the Rev 13 mark of the beast.

Rev 7
"2 And I saw another angel ascending from the rising of the sun, holding the seal of the living God; and he called out with a loud voice to the four angels to whom it was granted to harm the earth and the sea, 3 saying, “Do not harm the earth, or the sea, or the trees until we have sealed the bond-servants of our God on their foreheads. 4 And I heard the number of those who were sealed: 144,000, sealed”

Rev 14:1 Then I looked, and behold, the Lamb was standing on Mount Zion, and with Him 144,000 who had His name and the name of His Father written on their foreheads. ... 3 And they *sang a new song before the throne and before the four living creatures and the elders; and no one was able to learn the song except the 144,000 who had been purchased from the earth.

============= another sealing process - all through history

In Eph 1 it is the Holy Spirit in all ages sealing the people of God into truth and via the process of sanctification.

Eph 1:13 In Him, you also, after listening to the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation—having also believed, you were sealed in Him with the Holy Spirit of the promise, 14 who is a first installment of our inheritance, in regard to the redemption of God’s own possession, to the praise of His glory.

============ there are attributes of a seal found in the Law itself

In terms of the Law itself - the Sabbath has aspects to it that are similar to what can be found in certain government seals (name, title, domain/territory).
Name: YHWH
Title: God
Domain/Territory: Heaven and Earth

Ex 20
10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the LORD (YHWH) your God; ... 11 For in six days the LORD (YHWH) made the heavens and the earth, the sea and everything that is in them, and He rested on the seventh day; for that reason the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy

Freth · Jul 31, 2021

The central issue surrounding the Seal of God/Mark of the Beast is worship. Several chapters of Revelation cover this topic of worship.

The Mark of the Beast - Worship of the Beast; False Worship

Revelation 13:4 And they worshipped the dragon [Satan] which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?

Revelation 13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him [the first beast/beast that rises out of the sea; ultimately Satan], whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

Revelation 13:12 And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed.

Revelation 13:15 And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.

Revelation 14:9-11 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand, The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb: And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.

Revelation 16:2 And the first went, and poured out his vial upon the earth; and there fell a noisome and grievous sore upon the men which had the mark of the beast, and upon them which worshipped his image.

Revelation 19:20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

What is this false worship and who is it that causes it? Daniel 7 has some key information.

Daniel 7:25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws [of God]: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.

Who?

Speaks great words against the most High.
Shall wear out the saints of the most High.
Will think to change God's times and laws.
The saints are given into his hand for 1260 years.

False worship?

The changing of God's times and laws, which causes false worship. What times and laws were changed?
The worship of a figurehead, of man, as a go-between to God. Jesus alone is our mediator.
Worship based on the tradition of men and not the law of God.

The Seal of God - Worship of God; True Worship

What is true worship?

Revelation 14:6-7 And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people, saying with a loud voice, Fear God, and give glory to him; for the hour of his judgment is come: and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters.

This is a very important message. The angel uses a loud voice. One final warning. But what about worship? How do we know how to worship Him? The above passage points directly back to creation and the first worship day.

Genesis 2:1-3 Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them. And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made. And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

Sanctification: set apart as or declare holy; consecrate.

God sanctified the seventh day as a day of rest. God's holy day of worship. No other day was sanctified or set apart, declared holy.

The angel's message in a loud voice is pointing to the same language in Genesis 2, which declares God as creator and the heavens and the earth (and the sea and the fountains of waters) as His territory. This statement is one of authority.

But what of the seal?

Exodus 31:13 Speak thou also unto the children of Israel, saying, Verily my sabbaths ye shall keep: for it is a sign between me and you throughout your generations; that ye may know that I am the Lord that doth sanctify you.

Ezekiel 20:12 Moreover also I gave them my sabbaths, to be a sign between me and them, that they might know that I am the Lord that sanctify them.

Ezekiel 20:20 And hallow my sabbaths; and they shall be a sign between me and you, that ye may know that I am the Lord your God.

Hallow: honor as holy.

Conclusion

At creation, God set apart a day of worship, to be kept holy. We are grafted into Israel; we are a part of the generations of Israel that He spoke of. The Sabbaths spoken of are worship days. We know this because of the sanctification and the holiness, but also because of the Sabbath being a sign between us and God. There is no other day, no other holy worship that spans the entirety of the Bible than the Sabbath.

Thus, the Sabbath being the sign of God is also the seal of God; of true worship, as He sanctified at creation for us to follow.

If this is indeed true, we should see times and laws be a central issue that causes false worship against God's sanctified holy day, the seventh day Sabbath. History shows that this has indeed been the case for some time and continues to be a point of contention in the world today. The Sabbath issue is coming to a head (albeit a false sabbath) and we can see the early signs of it in the news.

The loud voice of the angel is the final call, to recognize God's holy day. In observing the Sabbath, we acknowledge the sign, thus we receive the seal of God at the appropriate time, as per Revelation.

Times and laws (plural). We are to obey the laws of God. No other gods (men, Satan), no graven images/idolatry, remember the Sabbath day to keep it holy, etc.

Adventist Heretic · Jul 31, 2021

BobRyan said:
Given post #5 details - the SDA position is "a prediction" that in the future religious liberty will be smashed, intolerance of Christian freedom to worship God as the Bible dictates prohibited, liberty of conscience denied.

Some others "predict" that no such thing will happen.

All cases of "future prediction" are tested when it is seen that it did happen that way or it did not happen that way - in the future.

How much "fine grain detail" one can have about that much-discussed future scenario depends on either being a very good "guesser" or having direct input from God on those details. Clearly the Bible is giving us some good information about it.

we are moving towards that direction

Adventist Heretic · Jul 31, 2021

check out #4

The Liturgist · Jul 31, 2021

icedragon101 said:
we are moving towards that direction

That’s just not true. If anything, due to the growth of Islam, we are moving to a scenario where worship on Sunday might be prohibited. In fact, in Israel, the weekend consists of Friday and Saturday, so Christians living in Israel already have their holiest day interfered with.

Adventist Heretic · Aug 1, 2021

The Liturgist said:
That’s just not true. If anything, due to the growth of Islam, we are moving to a scenario where worship on Sunday might be prohibited. In fact, in Israel, the weekend consists of Friday and Saturday, so Christians living in Israel already have their holiest day interfered with.

where do you live? I live in the Pacific North west and there is no way Islam is ever gong to dominate here. I also just moved from San Francisco, and there is no way Islam will ever dominate there. In fact the whole western half of the Us is closed Islalm.

BobRyan · Aug 1, 2021

The Liturgist said:
That’s just not true. If anything, due to the growth of Islam, we are moving to a scenario where worship on Sunday might be prohibited. In fact, in Israel, the weekend consists of Friday and Saturday, so Christians living in Israel already have their holiest day interfered with.

The point he was making was in response to my post about religious liberty restricted - freedom of conscience restricted to worship as the Bible dictates.

Your argument about Islam only adds support to the idea that the trend in the future is toward religious liberty restricted - freedom of conscience restricted. So then either way there would be a future scenario where religious liberty and freedom of conscience might not fare so well.

Your post appears to be yet another suggestion for how it might happen.

The Liturgist · Aug 1, 2021

BobRyan said:
The point he was making was in response to my post about religious liberty restricted - freedom of conscience restricted to worship as the Bible dictates.

Your argument about Islam only adds support to the idea that the trend in the future is toward religious liberty restricted - freedom of conscience restricted. It is yet another avenue for it.

The Muslims will prohibit worship on Sunday because they are accustomed to having Friday and Saturday as their weekend.

Adventist Heretic · Aug 1, 2021

Many people don't understand the SDA view, that it is written from the Prophetic perspective. That a future time will come when there is widespread apostasy that God's people will not be able to tell Good from Evil and who is loyal to God and who is not.

There will be a time when evil increases so much that, Evil comes into the church from the world and Gods people must make a distinction between themselves and the world. "Come out of her My people and be not partaker of her sins. and receive not her plagues " Rev 18:4.

During the time of Apostasy, 2 characteristic emerge Gods disciples, they obey Gods commands and have faith in Jesus. "Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus". Rev 14:12,

At the time of this Apostasy, God sends out a messenger to call is people to return to the Creator and Worship and Identify with Him, for the hour of his Social Justice has come." Rev 14:7 He said in a loud voice, “Fear God and give him glory, because the hour of his judgment has come. Worship him who made the heavens, the earth, the sea and the springs of water.”

The call to return to the Creator is a direct reference to remember our origins and God original desire us for us. His desire for us to be fruitful & multiply, biblical prosperity, where become all you were created to be, his desire for good, abundance and for us to represent Him properly in healthy relationship and authority, called the Image of God.

We believe this is best done by observing the Sabbath. It is the best way to show loyalty to the Creator, His Order, His Way and His Law. For it shows our origins, Sabbath was a sign of the Covenant with Israel and we are grafted into Israel. Sabbath was also used as a sign of Loyalty while in captivity in a foreign land, Babylon. Sabbath also reminds us of the promise of when he will rule and reign for 1000 years on earth and restore his order. Sabbath calls us to wait for this event and not try to restore things by means of the government coercion and force, loyalty to Christ must be by love and by choice.

BobRyan · Aug 1, 2021

The Liturgist said:
The Muslims will prohibit worship on Sunday because they are accustomed to having Friday and Saturday as their weekend.

"The Muslim weekly day of rest is Friday. It begins at sundown on Thursday (when one can no longer distinguish between a black thread and a white one held on the back of the hand) and lasts until sundown on Friday".

So for Muslims Saturday is a day off - and used for shopping etc. (A lot of Christians use Saturday the same way - and except for about an hour or so - many Christians use Sunday the same way as well). Sunday is one of their (the Muslim) work-days.

Indeed as you appear to imply - -I agree that it is doubtful that Muslims will favor "religious liberty" and freedom of conscience should all the Christians vanish in the future.

But in the 1260 years of the dark ages in Rev 12 - leading up to the Rev 13 event of the mark of the beast - it does not appear in history that Islam is in charge of all of Europe during that time.

tall73 · Aug 1, 2021

BobRyan said:
The end-time singular event -- Seal of God -- in Rev 14 and Rev 7 is presented in contrast to the Rev 13 mark of the beast.

Rev 7
"2 And I saw another angel ascending from the rising of the sun, holding the seal of the living God; and he called out with a loud voice to the four angels to whom it was granted to harm the earth and the sea, 3 saying, “Do not harm the earth, or the sea, or the trees until we have sealed the bond-servants of our God on their foreheads. 4 And I heard the number of those who were sealed: 144,000, sealed”

Rev 14:1 Then I looked, and behold, the Lamb was standing on Mount Zion, and with Him 144,000 who had His name and the name of His Father written on their foreheads. ... 3 And they *sang a new song before the throne and before the four living creatures and the elders; and no one was able to learn the song except the 144,000 who had been purchased from the earth.

============= another sealing process - all through history

In Eph 1 it is the Holy Spirit in all ages sealing the people of God into truth and via the process of sanctification.

Eph 1:13 In Him, you also, after listening to the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation—having also believed, you were sealed in Him with the Holy Spirit of the promise, 14 who is a first installment of our inheritance, in regard to the redemption of God’s own possession, to the praise of His glory.

The same terminology, sealing, makes the Holy Spirit a natural interpretation.

It does seem though that in the context of Rev. 7, the sealing is a means of marking God's people prior to judgments of some sort impacting the earth. And as you indicate, the Holy Spirit seals believers throughout time. This seems to be a more specific timing.

Often OT allusions in Revelation seem helpful to understanding the book. In this case it calls to mind Ezekiel 9 where we see a judgment from God, and God's servants marked prior to that and then spared.

The previous chapters describe shocking scenes of idolatry among God's people.

Eze 9:1 Then he cried in my ears with a loud voice, saying, “Bring near the executioners of the city, each with his destroying weapon in his hand.”
Eze 9:2 And behold, six men came from the direction of the upper gate, which faces north, each with his weapon for slaughter in his hand, and with them was a man clothed in linen, with a writing case at his waist. And they went in and stood beside the bronze altar.
Eze 9:3 Now the glory of the God of Israel had gone up from the cherub on which it rested to the threshold of the house. And he called to the man clothed in linen, who had the writing case at his waist.
Eze 9:4 And the LORD said to him, “Pass through the city, through Jerusalem, and put a mark on the foreheads of the men who sigh and groan over all the abominations that are committed in it.”
Eze 9:5 And to the others he said in my hearing, “Pass through the city after him, and strike. Your eye shall not spare, and you shall show no pity.
Eze 9:6 Kill old men outright, young men and maidens, little children and women, but touch no one on whom is the mark. And begin at my sanctuary.” So they began with the elders who were before the house.
Eze 9:7 Then he said to them, “Defile the house, and fill the courts with the slain. Go out.” So they went out and struck in the city.
Eze 9:8 And while they were striking, and I was left alone, I fell upon my face, and cried, “Ah, Lord GOD! Will you destroy all the remnant of Israel in the outpouring of your wrath on Jerusalem?”
Eze 9:9 Then he said to me, “The guilt of the house of Israel and Judah is exceedingly great. The land is full of blood, and the city full of injustice. For they say, ‘The LORD has forsaken the land, and the LORD does not see.’
Eze 9:10 As for me, my eye will not spare, nor will I have pity; I will bring their deeds upon their heads.”
Eze 9:11 And behold, the man clothed in linen, with the writing case at his waist, brought back word, saying, “I have done as you commanded me.”

The description of those spared, who received the marking on their foreheads, were those who were following God and grieved at the wickedness they saw. They were spared in the slaughter.

The parallels of marking on the forehead, being spared from God's judgment, loyalty to God and following His commands seems to suggests Revelation 7 may be drawing on these themes.

In this case the seal itself is not a specific action, etc. It is a mark that God assigns so it is know who to pass over in judgment.

It may not even be a particularly visible sign to others, but is visible to God, and His agents, and is the result of loyalty to God.

tall73 · Aug 2, 2021

BobRyan said:
============ there are attributes of a seal found in the Law itself

In terms of the Law itself - the Sabbath has aspects to it that are similar to what can be found in certain government seals (name, title, domain/territory).
Name: YHWH
Title: God
Domain/Territory: Heaven and Earth

Ex 20
10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the LORD (YHWH) your God; ... 11 For in six days the LORD (YHWH) made the heavens and the earth, the sea and everything that is in them, and He rested on the seventh day; for that reason the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy

Perhaps you could clarify, because I have seen different takes on the above information.

If it is a one-time sealing prior to judgment then that doesn't sound like the seal is the Sabbath itself. First the seal is something placed on those who are already faithful servants. So it seems more to designate them for what they are already rather than an addition to that.

Moreover, the seal is something given to them by a work of God and His servants because of what they do, not something that they do which then marks them.

I think the key issue here, as you point out, is loyalty to the true God, and not worshiping anything else, with idolatry clearly in view in Rev. 13.

However, the quote of the sabbath command does point to a distinguishing feature of the true God, the One who created all things.

BobRyan · Aug 2, 2021

tall73 said:
Perhaps you could clarify, because I have seen different takes on the above information.

If it is a one-time sealing prior to judgment then that doesn't sound like the seal is the Sabbath itself.

In my post I show three dimensions/contexts for it.

The first one is unique to the end of time where "144,000" are sealed and no one but the 144,000 sings that new song etc.

Another one from Eph 1 applies to all Christians in all of time - and is specific to the sanctification work of the Holy Spirit.

Rev 7 is very specific about the fact that Angels participate in placing that seal on the saints at the end of time.

The Law of God has the attribute of a seal in it - but it has always had that characteristic - that is not some new feature of it that appeared in John's day.

LoveGodsWord · Aug 2, 2021

THE HOLY SPIRIT IS GOD'S SEAL THAT IS LINKED TO OBEDIENCE TO GOD'S LAW AND THE SABBATH

The Holy Spirit is linked to obedience to Gods' Word the same way that love is linked to obedience to God's Law. Neither are separated from each other. For example no one shows their love to their fellow man by lying to them; stealing from them, committing adultery with their spouse; murdering them etc...

Romans 13:8-10 [8], Owe no man anything, but to LOVE ONE ANOTHER: for HE THAT LOVES ANOTHER HAS FULFILLED THE LAW. [9], FOR THIS, THOU SHALT NOT COMMIT ADULTERY, THOU SHALT NOT KILL, THOU SHALT NOT STEAL, THOU SHALT NOT LIE, THOU SHALT NOT COVET; and IF THERE SHALL BE ANY OTHER COMMANDMENT, IT IS BRIEFLY SUMMED UP in this saying, namely, THOU SHALT LOVE THY NEIGHBOR AS THYSELF. [10], Love works no ill to his neighbor: therefore LOVE IS THE FULFILLING OF THE LAW.

As shown above (see also Matthew 22:36-40; John 14:15: John 15:10 and 1 John 5:2-3) love is expressed through obedience to God's 10 commandments and obeying His Word. Therefore love is not separated from God's law it is expressed through obedience to God's law and God's Word and is God's new covenant promise in those who believe and follow His Word (Hebrews 8:10-12 from Jeremiah 31:31-34; Ezekiel 36:24-37).

Likewise just as love is not separate from obedience to God's law and His Word; The sealing of God's Spirit is also conditional on believing (present tense active to in the now) to believing and following what God's Word says. For example God's Spirit is the Spirit of the Word of truth of God *John 6:63 and works in us us to sanctify us we believe and follow the truth of Gods' Word *John 17:17.

Therefore God's Spirit also is linked and works through those who believe God's Word giving them power to follow what God's Word says as we believe the truth of Gods' Word....

Acts of the Apostles 5:32 [32], And we are his witnesses of these things; and SO IS THE HOLY GHOST WHO GOD GIVES TO THOSE WHO OBEY HIM.

Turning away from sin which is defined in the scriptures as breaking anyone of Gods' 10 commandments (James 2:10-11; 1 John 3:4) of not believing and following God's Word (Romans 14:23; Matthew 7:21-23; James 2:17-26) and being baptized with a new heart and life to love God through the Spirit is conditional on us receiving God's Spirit...

Acts of the Apostles 2:38 [38], Then Peter said unto them, REPENT AND BE BAPTIZED EVERYONE OF YOU IN THE NAME OF JESUS CHRIST FOR THE REMISSION OF SINS AND YOU SHALL RECEIVE THE HOLY GHOST.

Just the same as love is not separate from believing and following what God's Word says receiving Gods' Spirit therefore is not separate from believing and following what Gods' Word says and God's Spirit is only given to those who believe and follow what Gods' Word says. Remember God's Spirit is the Spirit of the truth of Gods' Word so it does not work in disobedience to Gods' Word it is expressed in obedience to Gods' Word just as love is expressed through obedience to Gods' 10 commandments as shown earlier.

.............

SABBATH AS THE SEAL OF GOD.

According to the scriptures the Sabbath is the seal of God's 10 commandments because it is the only one of God's 10 commandments that describes God as the creator of all things in heaven and earth and that the commandments of God are a requirement for all mankind.

Exodus 20:11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, AND ALL THAT IN THEM IS, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

The Sabbath linked to obedience to Gods' Word as it is one of Gods 10 commandments that give us the knowledge of what sin (moral wrong doing) is when broken and righteousness (moral right doing) when obeyed *Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4 and if we break anyone of them we stand guilty before God of sin *James 2:10-11.

So to claim we have God's Spirit while knowingly (not unknowingly) breaking anyone of God's 10 commandments is not biblical because God only gives His Spirit to those who obey him *Acts of the Apostles 2:38; Acts of the Apostles 5:29. Therefore according to God's Word we cannot be sealed with Gods' Spirit unless we are (present tense active to now) believing and following the truth of Gods' Word now *Ephesians 1:13; James 2:17-26.

Believing here is to the present tense being active now. That means if we come to a place were we no longer believe and follow Gods' we can grieve and quench and put out God's Spirit from being in us which the scriptures warn us about in Ephesians 4:30 and 1 Thessalonians 5:19.

Faith and obedience therefore to God's Word draws us to God while disobedience and unbelief in God's Word separates us from God...

Isaiah 59:2 But YOUR INIQUITIES HAVE SEPARATED BETWEEN YOU AND YOUR GOD AND YOUR SINS HAVE HID HIS FACE FROM YOU THAT HE WILL NOT HEAR YOU.

Proverbs 28:9 9, HE THAT TURNS HIS EAR FROM HEARING THE LAW EVEN HIS PRAYER SHALL BE AN ABOMINATION .

................

THE SEAL OF GOD IS THE HOLY SPIRIT THAT THOSE RECEIVE WHO BELIEVE AND FOLLOW GOD'S WORD WHICH INCLUDE GOD'S 4TH COMMANDMENT SABBATH

The Sabbath of God's 4th commandment is God's Word and one of God's 10 commandments, therefore cannot be separated from the seal of Gods' Spirit. It is the only commandment in God's 10 commandments that shows that God is the creator of heaven and earth and all things and the 10 commandments are His Word that he expects His people to believe and follow though faith. It is these people God gives His Spirit so that they can walk in His Words and it if Gods seal to those who love God and keep His commandments (John 14:15: John 15:10; 1 John 5:2-3; Revelation 14:12). Just as love is not separate from Gods' law it is expressed through obedience to God's law, obedience to God's law is not separate to receiving and being sealed by God's Spirit. Therefore it is only those who knowingly keep all the commandments of God be faith in God's Word that do not receive the mark of the beast once it is enforced on mankind by the image to the beast by a National Sunday law according to the scriptures..

Revelation 7:3 Saying, HURT NOT THE EARTH, NEITHER THE SEA, NOR THE TREES, TILL WE HAVE SEALED THE SERVANTS OF GOD IN THE FOREHEADS

Revelation 14:12, HERE IS THE PATIENCE OF THE SAINTS; HERE ARE THEY THAT KEEP THE COMMANDMENTS OF GOD AND THE FAITH OF JESUS

Hope this is helpful

God bless.

SDA--Seal of God vs. Mark of the Beast

Sophia7's husband

Well-Known Member

Sophia7's husband

Senior Veteran

Junior Member

Junior Member

Junior Member

Well-Known Member

Senior Veteran

Senior Veteran

Traditional Liturgical Christian

Senior Veteran

Junior Member

Traditional Liturgical Christian

Senior Veteran

Junior Member

Sophia7's husband

Sophia7's husband

Junior Member

Well-Known Member

Similar threads