Why do SDA preach

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BobRyan

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Okay, it looks like this leads back to post #536.
I'd have to see quotes from those sources to see if they come to the same conclusion given above .

The Baptist Confession of Faith (1689)

So then C.H. Spurgeon and the full section 19

19. The Law of God
  1. God gave to Adam a law of universal obedience which was written in his heart, and He gave him very specific instruction about not eating the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil. By this Adam and all his descendants were bound to personal, total, exact, and perpetual obedience, being promised life upon the fulfilling of the law, and threatened with death upon the breach of it. At the same time Adam was endued with power and ability to keep it.


  2. The same law that was first written in the heart of man continued to be a perfect rule of righteousness after the Fall, and was delivered by God upon Mount Sinai in the TEN commandments, and written in two tables, the first four containing our duty towards God, and the other six, our duty to man.

  3. Besides this law, commonly called the moral law, God was pleased do give the people of Israel ceremonial laws containing several typical ordinances. These ordinances were partly about their worship, and in them Christ was prefigured along with His attributes and qualities, His actions, His sufferings and His benefits. These ordinances also gave instructions about different moral duties. All of these ceremonial laws were appointed only until the time of reformation, when Jesus Christ the true Messiah and the only lawgiver, Who was furnished with power from the Father for this end, cancelled them and took them away.


  4. To the people of Israel He also gave sundry judicial laws which expired when they ceased to be a nation. These are not binding on anyone now by virtue of their being part of the laws of that nation, but their general equity continue to be applicable in modern times.


  5. The moral law ever binds to obedience everyone, justified people as well as others, and not only out of regard for the matter contained in it, but also out of respect for the authority of God the Creator, Who gave the law. Nor does Christ in the Gospel dissolve this law in any way, but He considerably strengthens our obligation to obey it.

  6. Although true believers are not under the law as a covenant of works, to be justified or condemned by it, yet it is of great use to them as well as to others, because as a rule of life it informs them of the will of God and their duty and directs and binds them to walk accordingly. It also reveals and exposes the sinful pollutions of their natures, hearts and lives, and using it for self-examination they may come to greater conviction of sin, greater humility and greater hatred of their sin. They will also gain a clearer sight of their need of Christ and the perfection of His own obedience. It is of further use to regenerate people to restrain their corruptions, because of the way in which it forbids sin. The threatenings of the law serve to show what their sins actually deserve, and what troubles may be expected in this life because of these sins even by regenerate people who are freed from the curse and undiminished rigours of the law. The promises connected with the law also show believers God's approval of obedience, and what blessings they may expect when the law is kept and obeyed, though blessing will not come to them because they have satisfied the law as a covenant of works. If a man does good and refrains from evil simply because the law encourages to the good and deters him from the evil, that is no evidence that he is under the law rather than under grace.

  7. The aforementioned uses of the law are not contrary to the grace of the Gospel, but they sweetly comply with it, as the Spirit of Christ subdues and enables the will of man to do freely and cheerfully those things which the will of God, which is revealed in the law, requires to be done.
 
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BobRyan

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The very same points listed there in #763 from the Baptist Confession of Faith section 19 are also found in the Westminster Confession of Faith - sectn 19, and are as SDAs have been stating them here. Yet they get "you SDAs...you SDAs" kinds of "anything but -- ok I see that --" on this thread.

All the while we are saying "you realize that what you are objecting to are not the 'you SDAs' Bible details about the Sabbath topic but rather the very points where BOTH sides agree".

Only to then hear that this is too confusing a point to follow
 
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BobRyan

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I agree with him that many do indicate the ten commandments are binding. But they tend to apply that to a re-cast version with Sunday. And when you get into the particulars about Sabbath, they are not on board.

Section 19 of both confessions reads exactly as SDAs would have it.

Section 21 or 22 (depending which confession you are reading) will talk about editing the Sabbath commandment to re-point it from the "seventh day" to week-week-day-1 for Christians.

But my point is that instead of the anti-sabbath posts here all landing in agreement on section 22... what they are doing is opposing everything SDAs say in affirmation of section 19 and saying "you SDAs... you SDAs..." at the end of those opposing statements "as if" we authored C.H. Spurgeon's Baptist Confession of Faith. I simply appeal to basic "reason"

When MMXX began to question that and I included those links I asked if having that information had any "implications" for his objections to those points. Have been trying to get an answer to that for days.
 
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Adventist Heretic

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Did you read post #566?

Excerpt:

Deuteronomy 5:2-3 says
"The Lord our God made a covenant with us at Horeb. The Lord did not make this covenant with our fathers, but with us, with all those of us alive here today."
 
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Adventist Heretic

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I don't deny that that passage is there in some way the covenant at horeb is different than the covenant with Abraham. But I'm not avoiding dealing with the subject that's simply not the text in question
 
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BobRyan

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I've never known them to say the fourth commandment is binding on gentile Christians, .

The Baptist Confession of Faith (1689) ... 19. The Law of God
2. The same law that was first written in the heart of man continued to be a perfect rule of righteousness after the Fall, and was delivered by God upon Mount Sinai in the TEN commandments, and written in two tables, the first four containing our duty towards God, and the other six, our duty to man.

3. Besides this law, commonly called the moral law, God was pleased do give the people of Israel ceremonial laws containing several typical ordinances. These ordinances were partly about their worship, and in them Christ was prefigured along with His attributes and qualities, His actions, His sufferings and His benefits. These ordinances also gave instructions about different moral duties. All of these ceremonial laws were appointed only until the time of reformation, when Jesus Christ the true Messiah and the only lawgiver, Who was furnished with power from the Father for this end, cancelled them and took them away.

5. The moral law ever binds to obedience everyone, justified people as well as others, and not only out of regard for the matter contained in it, but also out of respect for the authority of God the Creator, Who gave the law. Nor does Christ in the Gospel dissolve this law in any way, but He considerably strengthens our obligation to obey it.


Yesterday at 5:37 PM #573
There is a thread where I posted the links to my text quote of some of that online info for readers --

Jun 23, 2021 #2


So then if we "click" #2


I am glad these Sunday sources all affirm all TEN of the Ten Commandments for Christians and do so in a way that is consistent with the interpretation of the Sabbath in Eden that you see in most of the Sabbath keeping groups - having the start of the Sabbath for all mankind in Eden.

The Baptist Confession of Faith,
the Westminster Confession of Faith ,
D.L. Moody,
R.C Sproul,
Matthew Henry,
Thomas Watson
Eastern Orthodox Catechism
The Catholic Catechism

Example of Bible Details leading these scholars to agree on the TEN as being included in the moral law of God written on the heart under the NEW Covenant - to this very day.

The "easy part" that Christians on "BOTH sides" agree with is that
1. Ex 20:7 "do not take God's name in vain" is one of the TEN
2. That it was a SIN to take God's name in vain in Eden and all through history NO Matter that the TEN were not on stone until after Ex 20. And it is the unit of TEN that is pulled into the reader's view by Paul in Eph 6:1-2 saying "Honor your father and mother" is "the FIRST COMMANDMENT WITH a promise"
3. That it is STILL a sin to "take God's name in vain" even though that is the only commandment not quoted from in the NT.
4. That Jeremiah and is readers would have included all TEN in the Law of God written on the heart in Jer 31:31-34 under the NEW Covenant (verbatim unchanged in Heb 8:6-12)
5. That to ignore one is to ignore them all James 2
6. That Bible scholars on BOTH sides of the Sabbath debate admit to these details in the Bible about "the TEN".
7. That EVEN though God gave Israel the TEN Commandments and it was a SIN for them to take God's name in vain - it did mean that everyone else could take God's name in vain - and that would be just fine.

These points are so obvious - they are irrefutable.

As could be predicted very many of the Sabbath-opposing posts on this thread have tried to oppose Bible doctrine affirmed by Bible scholars on BOTH sides of the debate (AS IF) that opposition singled out Adventists in some way.


One cannot blame those texts on Sabbath-keepers (if not "on Adventists" entirely ) as IF the much older Bible scholarship position that oppose the Sabbath POV of Adventists - were merely following Adventist teaching.

You can't blame Adventists for what even their opponents teach BEFORE there ever was an Adventist.

Seems like an obvious detail - but notice how many posts get "stuck" on that very point posting "you Adventists say" and then follows a Bible text or POV that even the anti-Sabbath Bible scholars hold to be true! That opposition logic would only work "if Adventists wrote the bible" - which we did not. (for anyone still in doubt on that point)


And yet you saw me give that list of points in agreement - which you are still not commenting on.

That list reads like this --

The "easy part" that Christians on "BOTH sides" agree with is that
1. Ex 20:7 "do not take God's name in vain" is one of the TEN
2. That it was a SIN to take God's name in vain in Eden and all through history NO Matter that the TEN were not on stone until after Ex 20. And it is the unit of TEN that is pulled into the reader's view by Paul in Eph 6:1-2 saying "Honor your father and mother" is "the FIRST COMMANDMENT WITH a promise"
3. That it is STILL a sin to "take God's name in vain" even though that is the only commandment not quoted from in the NT.
4. That Jeremiah and is readers would have included all TEN in the Law of God written on the heart in Jer 31:31-34 under the NEW Covenant (verbatim unchanged in Heb 8:6-12)
5. That to ignore one is to ignore them all James 2
6. That Bible scholars on BOTH sides of the Sabbath debate admit to these details in the Bible about "the TEN".
7. That EVEN though God gave Israel the TEN Commandments and it was a SIN for them to take God's name in vain - it did not mean that everyone else could take God's name in vain - and that would be just fine.

==================
Which are the very points where anti-Sabbath arguments here fall on their swords
 
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tall73

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what they are doing is opposing everything SDAs say in affirmation of section 19 and saying "you SDAs... you SDAs..." at the end of those opposing statements "as if" we authored C.H. Spurgeon's Baptist Confession of Faith.

Fair enough, in that the particular element is held by many more than SDA's.
 
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BobRyan

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As for Moody, I'd be interested in what he had to say about the sabbath that Bob thinks supports Christian sabbatarianism. I'm pretty sure Moody wasn't a sabbatarian. .

He liked the view that the 4th commandment is binding on all Christians and in fact all mankind - but "edited" to point to week-day-1

======= short snips of the Sabbath commandment section ---


THE TEN COMMANDMENTS

BY THE
DWIGHT L. MOODY

The Ten Commandments:
Exodus 20:2-17

.
The Fourth Commandment
Remember the Sabbath Day, to keep it holy. Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: for in six days the LORD made heaven and Earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath Day, and hallowed it.


THERE HAS BEEN an awful letting-down in this country regarding the Sabbath during the last twenty-five years, and many a man has been shorn of spiritual power, like Samson, because he is not straight on this question. Can you say that you observe the Sabbath properly? You may be a professed Christian: are you obeying this commandment? Or do you neglect the house of God on the Sabbath day, and spend your time drinking and carousing in places of vice and crime, showing contempt for God and His law? Are you ready to step into the scales? Where were you last Sabbath? How did you spend it?

I honestly believe that this commandment is just as binding today as it ever was. I have talked with men who have said that it has been abrogated, but they have never been able to point to any place in the Bible where God repealed it. When Christ was on earth, He did nothing to set it aside; He freed it from the traces under which the scribes and Pharisees had put it, and gave it its true place.

"The Sabbath was made for man, and not man for the Sabbath." (Mark 2:27)

It is just as practicable and as necessary for men today as it ever was- in fact, more than ever, because we live in such an intense age.

The Sabbath was binding in Eden, and it has been in force ever since. The fourth commandment begins with the word remember, showing that the Sabbath already existed when God wrote this law on the tables of stone at Sinai.
How can men claim that this one commandment has been done away with when they will admit that the other nine are still binding?

I believe that the Sabbath question today is a vital one for the whole country. It is the burning question of the present time. If you give up the Sabbath the church goes; if you give up the church the home goes; and if the home goes the nation goes. That is the direction in which we are traveling.

The church of God is losing its power on account of so many people giving up the Sabbath, and using it to promote selfishness.

.
HOW TO OBSERVE THE SABBATH

"Sabbath" means "rest," and the meaning of the word gives a hint as to the true way to observe the day. God rested after creation, and ordained the Sabbath as a rest for man. He blessed it and hallowed it. Remember the rest-day to keep it holy.

...


Mr. Gladstone recently told a friend that the secret of his long life is that amid all the pressure of public cares he never forgot the Sabbath, with its rest for the body and the soul.

·
When I was a boy, the Sabbath lasted from sundown on Saturday to sundown on Sunday,


Someone has said that without the Sabbath, the Church of Christ could not, as a visible organization, exist on earth.


Parents, if you want your children to grow up and honor you, have them honor the Sabbath day.


On the other hand, honoring the fourth commandment brings blessing:

"If thou turn away thy foot from the Sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on My holy day; and call the Sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words: then shalt thou delight thyself in the LORD; and I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth, and feed thee with the heritage of Jacob thy father: for the mouth of the LORD hath spoken it." (Isaiah 58:13-14)

…...


1. CESSATION FROM SECULAR WORK

A man ought to turn aside from his ordinary employment one day in seven. There are many whose occupation will not permit them to observe Sunday, but they should observe some other day as a Sabbath. Saturday is my day of rest, because I generally preach on Sunday, and I look forward to it as a boy does to a holiday. God knows what we need...

Sabbath-breaker, are you ready to step into the scales?
 
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mmksparbud

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THAT is simply a SDA taught responce to the question at had.

Those were historical facts, not "SDA Taught responce!"
Those 3 predictions you implied did not happen, when they obviously did. No comment on that?

"Had our nation remained united it would have had strength, but divided it must fall. {1T 259.1}"
*****

It did not remain divided.
 
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BobRyan

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Those were historical facts, not "SDA Taught responce!"
Those 3 predictions you implied did not happen, when they obviously did. No comment on that?

"Had our nation remained united it would have had strength, but divided it must fall. {1T 259.1}"
*****

It did not remain divided.

The problem with this thread on page 39 and at post #771 is that it is "every topic" on SDAs not simply one of them so I don't think anyone can seriously be expected to read all the posts or even follow all the active topics on it.

I don't think it is the fault of the OP

Why do SDA preach more about the Sabbath rather then making Jesus the center of SDA preaching? Yes, I have visited SDA churches before. Everytime, not a word about Jesus, always centered their sermon on the Sabbath.

I think it may be that the Title does not provide any topic at all other than "SDAs preach"
 
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Ceallaigh

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You would need to do a lot of reading to see all of them in their context. The Catholic doctrine is most fully spelled out in a papal encyclical by John Paul II, Dies Domini.

Bob can direct you to highlights of the various documents if you like. Or he can dig up direct links to original source material if you want to read a larger amount.

I agree with him that many do indicate the ten commandments are binding. But they tend to apply that to a re-cast version with Sunday. And when you get into the particulars about Sabbath, they are not on board.

The bigger issue is that someone who says the Bible is the only thing that matters pushing these other views, because there is a consensus. But then they reject consensus on the various Adventist disctinctives, and that is a badge of honor.

Now what he would say is that this is the issue where non-sda and sda scholarship agree.

Yeah, but not all non-sda scholarshipo does agree. There are other views, and more nuance to the views as well. And that doesn't change the fact that you are appealing to opinions instead of the Scriptures through this whole line of argument.

The Bible isn't the only thing that matters though. SDA doctrine also matters. At least to most of them I'm sure. I read Moody's piece. It's going by the spirit of the law rather than the letter of the law. I would imagine the other pieces are similar in that regard.

But really I don't see much point in lengthy articles or doctrines that may either add to or subtract from the 4th commandment, which simply is "Remember the Sabbath day by keeping it holy. Six days you shall labor and do all your work, but the seventh day is a sabbath to the Lord your God. On it you shall not do any work".

Modern secularism actually increased that quite a bit with the institution of the 5 day 40 hour work week. I remember a long time ago hearing an old farmer say that back in the day, to them a 40 hour work week would have been like the Millennium.
 
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Ceallaigh

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He liked the view that the 4th commandment is binding on all Christians and in fact all mankind - but "edited" to point to week-day-1

======= short snips of the Sabbath commandment section ---


THE TEN COMMANDMENTS

BY THE
DWIGHT L. MOODY

The Ten Commandments:
Exodus 20:2-17

.
The Fourth Commandment
Remember the Sabbath Day, to keep it holy. Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: for in six days the LORD made heaven and Earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath Day, and hallowed it.


THERE HAS BEEN an awful letting-down in this country regarding the Sabbath during the last twenty-five years, and many a man has been shorn of spiritual power, like Samson, because he is not straight on this question. Can you say that you observe the Sabbath properly? You may be a professed Christian: are you obeying this commandment? Or do you neglect the house of God on the Sabbath day, and spend your time drinking and carousing in places of vice and crime, showing contempt for God and His law? Are you ready to step into the scales? Where were you last Sabbath? How did you spend it?

I honestly believe that this commandment is just as binding today as it ever was. I have talked with men who have said that it has been abrogated, but they have never been able to point to any place in the Bible where God repealed it. When Christ was on earth, He did nothing to set it aside; He freed it from the traces under which the scribes and Pharisees had put it, and gave it its true place.

"The Sabbath was made for man, and not man for the Sabbath." (Mark 2:27)

It is just as practicable and as necessary for men today as it ever was- in fact, more than ever, because we live in such an intense age.

The Sabbath was binding in Eden, and it has been in force ever since. The fourth commandment begins with the word remember, showing that the Sabbath already existed when God wrote this law on the tables of stone at Sinai.
How can men claim that this one commandment has been done away with when they will admit that the other nine are still binding?

I believe that the Sabbath question today is a vital one for the whole country. It is the burning question of the present time. If you give up the Sabbath the church goes; if you give up the church the home goes; and if the home goes the nation goes. That is the direction in which we are traveling.

The church of God is losing its power on account of so many people giving up the Sabbath, and using it to promote selfishness.

.
HOW TO OBSERVE THE SABBATH

"Sabbath" means "rest," and the meaning of the word gives a hint as to the true way to observe the day. God rested after creation, and ordained the Sabbath as a rest for man. He blessed it and hallowed it. Remember the rest-day to keep it holy.

...


Mr. Gladstone recently told a friend that the secret of his long life is that amid all the pressure of public cares he never forgot the Sabbath, with its rest for the body and the soul.

·
When I was a boy, the Sabbath lasted from sundown on Saturday to sundown on Sunday,


Someone has said that without the Sabbath, the Church of Christ could not, as a visible organization, exist on earth.


Parents, if you want your children to grow up and honor you, have them honor the Sabbath day.


On the other hand, honoring the fourth commandment brings blessing:

"If thou turn away thy foot from the Sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on My holy day; and call the Sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words: then shalt thou delight thyself in the LORD; and I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth, and feed thee with the heritage of Jacob thy father: for the mouth of the LORD hath spoken it." (Isaiah 58:13-14)

…...


1. CESSATION FROM SECULAR WORK

A man ought to turn aside from his ordinary employment one day in seven. There are many whose occupation will not permit them to observe Sunday, but they should observe some other day as a Sabbath. Saturday is my day of rest, because I generally preach on Sunday, and I look forward to it as a boy does to a holiday. God knows what we need...

Sabbath-breaker, are you ready to step into the scales?

I read, How Shall We Spend the Sabbath? from Golden Counsels by D. L. Moody

Regarding this, I have to wonder why no New Testament author touched on it in the way Moody did, even just a verse or two.
 
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BobRyan

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The Bible isn't the only thing that matters though. SDA doctrine also matters.

True - that is why we rely on sola scriptura testing for our 28 Fundamental Beliefs.

At least to most of them I'm sure. I read Moody's piece. It's going by the spirit of the law

Moody agrees with the various confessions of faith that the TEN Commandments are included in the moral law of God still binding on all (including the saints) and given to mankind in Eden and specifically that the Sabbath commandment itself applied in Eden for mankind as well as to this very day.

All the pesky details some posts try to reposition as "just SDAs know this..."

But really I don't see much point in lengthy articles or doctrines that may either add to or subtract from the 4th commandment,

They would not be needed were it not for all the "just you SDAs know about this... or that..." kind of posts -- and then the very details that are being questioned turn out to be "not just you SDAs" at all but rather Bible scholars on BOTH sides of the Sabbath discussion.

So a bit of "reality" being used to maintain accurate context in the discussion.
 
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Ceallaigh

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And yet you saw me give that list of points in agreement - which you are still not commenting on.

That list reads like this --

The "easy part" that Christians on "BOTH sides" agree with is that
1. Ex 20:7 "do not take God's name in vain" is one of the TEN
2. That it was a SIN to take God's name in vain in Eden and all through history NO Matter that the TEN were not on stone until after Ex 20. And it is the unit of TEN that is pulled into the reader's view by Paul in Eph 6:1-2 saying "Honor your father and mother" is "the FIRST COMMANDMENT WITH a promise"
3. That it is STILL a sin to "take God's name in vain" even though that is the only commandment not quoted from in the NT.
4. That Jeremiah and is readers would have included all TEN in the Law of God written on the heart in Jer 31:31-34 under the NEW Covenant (verbatim unchanged in Heb 8:6-12)
5. That to ignore one is to ignore them all James 2
6. That Bible scholars on BOTH sides of the Sabbath debate admit to these details in the Bible about "the TEN".
7. That EVEN though God gave Israel the TEN Commandments and it was a SIN for them to take God's name in vain - it did not mean that everyone else could take God's name in vain - and that would be just fine.


1, 2, 3 and 7. Regarding Exodus 20:7, cross references are: Leviticus 19:12, Deuteronomy 6:13, Deuteronomy 10:20 which are about swearing and taking oaths. In Matthew 5:34 Jesus addresses swearing and taking oaths.

Also I think Exodus 20:7 can be associated with blaspheming the name of God.

As it is written: "God’s name is blasphemed among the Gentiles because of you." Romans 2:24

"Are they not the ones who are dragging you into court? 7 Are they not the ones who are blaspheming the noble name of him to whom you belong?" James 2:7.

4. Well Jeremiah 31:31-34 starts off with:

The days are coming,” declares the Lord,
“when I will make a new covenant
with the people of Israel
and with the people of Judah.
It will not be like the covenant
I made with their ancestors
when I took them by the hand
to lead them out of Egypt,

because they broke my covenant,
though I was a husband to them,”
declares the Lord.


It seems to me that's saying right off that the New Covenant is not the same as the Old Covenant. Or put another way, that the New Covenant replaced the Old Covenant. Or that the Old Covenant became obsolete.

5. "For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it." James 2:10. James said the whole law. Not just the ten commandments, but the whole law. And there's no SDA or sabbatarian in general who does not stumble on at least one point of the whole law. Therefore James is saying they all are guilty of breaking all ten commandments, along with all the other commandments of the law. Surely I'm not the first one to point this out.

6. That Bible scholars on BOTH sides of the Sabbath debate admit to these details in the Bible about "the TEN".

I'm sure there's a meeting of the minds at some point. Like so:

kvOdEdf.png



==================
Which are the very points where anti-Sabbath arguments here fall on their swords

In my opinion if you're of the mindset of achieving a total sustained victory, you're going to end up totally closing your mind and heart, so that nothing can upset it. And trying to reason with someone with that mindset, is like trying to reach someone who's put themselves behind a wall.
 
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coffee4u

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” this is a bit premature, rest is never apart from God and fellowship with God. Worship and fellowship go hand and hand.

You don't need to go to a building that has been designated as a church to have fellowship with God. Some of us believe everyday is a day of rest in God.
Romans 14:5
One person esteems one day above another; another esteems every day alike. Let each be fully convinced in his own mind.


Suggesting that not attending a service on Saturday will lead to the mark of the beast is a horrific thing to say and only alienates people even more from your church. I know you didn't say it but another SDA.
Believe it or not Christians, those following Christ, can actually believe different doctrines backed by scripture. Not talking here of things that people added or came up with from outside of scripture, but just the pure reading of scripture.
We believe Romans makes it clear that we do not have to esteem one day above another.
No one is trying to push that you shouldn't esteem Saturday as higher either, that is between you and God, but your constant pushing of Saturday service onto us as something we should do is tiresome and unneeded.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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Please understand. I am not your enemy. I am only posting Bible truths.
But you have not pointed out any bible truths in regards to the Sabbath have you? I think this has been clearly demonstrated in detailed scripture responses to you that you seem to ignore and refuse to address.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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This is a DEAD horse!

Agreed, only God's Word is true and we should believe and follow it (Romans 3:4; Acts of the Apostles 5:29). Where is the scripture that says God's 4th commandment has been abolished and we are now commanded to keep Sunday as a holy day of rest? There is none. As posted earlier, Sunday worship is a man-made, teaching and tradition that has led many to break God's 4th commandment. Jesus warns us in Matthew 15:3-9 that if we follow, man-made teachings and traditions that brake the commandments of God we are not following God. There is not one scripture in all of Gods Word that says Gods' 4th commandment has now been abolished and we are now commanded to keep Sunday or the first day of the week as a holy day of rest. So according to Jesus in Matthew 15:3-9 if we follow the man-made teaching and tradition of Sunday worship while breaking God's 4th commandment "seventh day" Sabbath of Gods' 10 commandments that give us the knowledge of what sin is when broken, who are you believing and following; God or man?

We are doing nothing but circular debating! You as an SDA are imbedded in that teaching and it will not natter one iotta what you are shown....so why are we do this?????

Nonsense. I have only provided you with scripture that disagrees with your teachings. We have investigated all your claims and accusation and scriptures you believe support your interpretation of the scriptures and shown from the scriptures alone that your claims and accusations are simply not biblical.

Matthew 19:16-19........."And someone came to Him and said, “Teacher, what good thing shall I do that I may obtain eternal life?” 17And He said to him, “Why are you asking Me about what is good? There is only One who is good; but if you wish to enter into life, keep the commandments.”



keep the commandments.

keep the commandments.

keep the commandments.



18Then he said to Him, “Which ones?”



“Which ones?”

“Which ones?”

“Which ones?”



19.

And Jesus said, “YOU SHALL NOT COMMIT MURDER;

YOU SHALL NOT COMMIT ADULTERY;

YOU SHALL NOT STEAL;

YOU SHALL NOT BEAR FALSE WITNESS;

HONOR YOUR FATHER AND MOTHER; and

YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.”



WHERE IS "KEEP THE SABBATH"???????

God's Word does not teach lawlessness (without law) Matthew 19:16-23 only mentions those commandments of our duty of loving our neighbor as our self. Did you also notice that these scriptures did not mention any of the first four commandments of Gods 10 commandments which are our duty of love to God?

Are you going to try and argue here that we are now free to have other Gods, make idols and worship them and use Gods' name in vain because these commandments were not mentioned in Matthew 19:16-23? Jesus focused on telling the rich young ruler to keep the commandments and started quoting the second six commandments that are our duty of love to our fellow man (Matthew 19:18-19) where the young ruler said to Jesus knowing something was wrong all these I have kept from my youth up what lack I (v20)? Jesus told him "If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me." (Matthew 19:21). Jesus told him this to show the right young ruler that yes he was obeying the second six commandments but was breaking the first two commandments about having other Gods and making idols of His riches. He loved his money and possessions more than he loved God and the rich young ruler went away sorrowful because he knew what Jesus was telling him (Matthew 15:22). How many commandments are in Gods' 10 commandments according to the scriptures? You do know there are 10 commandments in the 10 commandments right (see Exodus 34:28; Deuteronomy 4:13 and Deuteronomy 10:4; Exodus 20:1-17).

Where is Jesus telling you in Matthew 19:16-19 we are no longer required to keep the first four commandments of our duty of love to God by quoting the second six commandments of our duty of love to our fellow man? Where is the first commandment of having no other Gods (Exodus 20:3). Where is the second commandment about making idols and worshiping them (Exodus 20:4-5). Where is the commandment for taking God's name in vain? (Exodus 20:7). Are you seriously trying to argue we are now free to break any one of God's 10 commandments when all through the new testament scriptures we are told to obey them and that breaking anyone of them is sin *James 2:10-11?

Now a very simple, down to earth common sense, logical question. IF JESUS PLACED AS MUCH EMPHASIS ON SABBATH KEEPING AS YOU DO, WHY DID HE NOT EVEN SUGGEST IT IN THE COMMANDMENTS HE TOLD US TO KEEP??????

A question that has no basis in truth or in the scriptures. You may want to consider it was the custom of Jesus to keep the Sabbath *Luke 4:16. Jesus taught us that he was the Lord and creator of the Sabbath that he made for all mankind *Mark 2:27-28. Jesus taught us how to correctly keep and obey Gods' 4th commandment in Matthew 12:1-12 and that it is lawful to do good on the Sabbath. Your question as shown here disagrees with scripture.

Good Lord......If Jesus was an SDA.....he would have said KEEP THE SABBATH, jump around keep the sabbath, run in circles keep the sabbath. KEEP THE SABBATH blah blah blah the SABBATH.

Why would Jesus say keep the Sabbath when Gods' people were already keeping the Sabbath for over 4000 years and were already keeping the Sabbath commandment as well as all that other 10 commandments? According to the scriptures Jesus says that the Sabbath was made for mankind and that he is the Lord and creator of it in Mark 2:27-28; John 1:1-4; 14. They are Gods' Words not mine and I believe them. How about you? As shown above again through the scriptures your claims and arguments here are not biblical.


Take Care.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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Keeping 9 of the Comments is reapeated throughout the NT. Paul goes on about what kind of commandment braking will keep one from entering the Kingdom.

Brain you claim to be a Sabbath keeper. Is that really true? The more I read your posts I cannot see that. If so why are you a Sabbath keeper if you do not believe in keeping the Sabbath? You claim here that keeping nine of the commandments is repeated all through the New testament? That claim is simply not true and is not biblical. All of Gods' 10 commandments are repeated all through the New Testament scriptures and Gods' people according to the scriptures keep all the commandments of God because James says if we break anyone of them we stand guilty before God of sin *James 2:10-11.
What your posting here is simply unbiblical but allow me to explain why I say this. According to the scriptures everyone of God's 10 commandments are repeated in the new testament!

1 You shall have no other gods before Me.
It is written: You shall worship the Lord your God and Him only you shall serve. (Luke 4:8; Matthew 4:10; Revelation 14:7)

2 You must not make for yourself a carved image, a likeness of anything in heaven, on earth, or under the sea.
God is Spirit and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth. (John 4:24; Acts 15:20; 1 Corinthians 6:9; Ephesians 5:5; 1 Peter 4:3; 1 John 5:21; Revelation 2:14)

3 You shall not take the Name of the Lord your God in vain.
(1 Timothy 6:1, James 2:7)

4 Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. – Binding on all Christians today -Hebrews 4:9
The Sabbath [seventh day] was made for man, not man for the Sabbath, so the Son of Man is Lord even of the Sabbath. (Mark 2:27-28, Hebrews 4; Matthew 12:8; Matthew 12:1-8; 10-12; 24:20; Mark 3:1-5; Luke 6:1-10; 13:14-16; 14:1-5; John 7:22-23; 9:14; Mark 1:21; Mark 6:2; Luke 4:16; 31; Luke 14:1; 23:56; Matthew 10-12; 24:20; Mark 3:1-5; Luke 6:1-10; 13:14-16; 14:1-5; John 7:22-23; 9:14; Mark 1:21; Mark 6:2; Luke 4:16; 31; Luke 14:1; 23:56; John 2:6; Matthew 16:24; 1; (After the death of Jesus) Matthew 24:20; Matthew 28:1; Acts 13:14; 13:27; 13:44; 15:21; 16:13; 17:2; 18:4; Hebrews 4:1-5; 9-11; Revelations 1:10 (see Matthew 12:8)

5 Honor your father and mother.
Children, obey your parents in the Lord, for this is right. (Ephesians 6:1; Colossians 3:20; Matthew 15:4; Matthew 19:19)

6 You shall not murder.
I say to you, love your enemies, bless those who curse you, pray for those who abuse you, that you may be sons of your Father in heaven. (Matthew 5:44-45; Matt. 5:21-26; Romans 13:9; 1 Timothy 1:9; 1 John 3:15; James 2:11; Matthew 19:18)

7 You shall not commit adultery.
I say to you whoever even looks at another in lust has already committed adultery in their heart. (Matthew 5:28, 1 Cor. 5:11, 1 Cor. 6:18, Galatians 5:19, Hebrews 13:4, James 2:11, Matthew 19:19, Romans 13:9)

8 You shall not steal.
Neither thieves, the greedy, or drunkards and robbers will inherit the Kingdom. (1 Corinthians 6:10, Romans 2:21, Mark 7:21, Ephesians 4:28, Romans 13:9, Matthew 19:18)

9 You shall not bear false witness.
For by your words, you will be justified and by your words you will be condemned. (Matthew 15:19, Ephesians 4:25, Col. 3:9; Matthew 19:18, Romans 13:9)

10 You shall not covet your neighbors possessions.
Take heed and beware of covetousness, for one’s life does not consist of the things he possesses. (Luke 12:15, Romans 7:7, Ephesians 5:3, 1 Timothy 6:10, Hebrews 13:5, Romans 13:9)

...................

Sorry Brian your words do not agree with what the bible says here in regards to the Sabbath in the new testament scriptures.

Hope this was helpful though.
 
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