Transphobic abuse hurled at Caitlyn Jenner at CPAC conference, called a 'sick freak'

FireDragon76 said:

Why? There are other remedies and civil penalties without having to invoke criminal ones, such as marriage counseling, divorce, etc. Or do you just enjoy hurting people?

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Government's purpose is to execute enforcement of the law, and US laws used to be based on the laws given to Israel by God.
Homosexuality used to be illegal, so was Adultery
We were blessed as a nation for adhering to God's laws, and over time in the last 60 years since we abandoned God, we're collapsing.
The Sexual revolution and explosion of homosexuality are shown in Romans 1... and following those 2 things.. is the collapse of society celebrating sin and degrading into lawlessness.
If the country wants to recover and be blessed again? It'll have to acknowledge God as creator again and keep His laws
But I think it's too late for this country to do that.
I think this country is being judged.

Jamdoc said:

Well, Bruce Jenner.

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That was her maiden name -- she changed it.

TLK Valentine said:

That was her maiden name -- she changed it.

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Not from being married, from him diving head first into sin and mental illness.

Jamdoc said:

We were blessed as a nation for adhering to God's laws, and over time in the last 60 years since we abandoned God, we're collapsing.

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The U.S. is one of the most religious countries of Western nations. It ain't abandoning God that's America's issue.

The Sexual revolution and explosion of homosexuality are shown in Romans 1... and following those 2 things.. is the collapse of society celebrating sin and degrading into lawlessness.

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Canada legalized gay marriage in 2005. We've been doing just fine ever since. You can rest easy, homosexuality isn't ruining your society.

Electing people like Trump on the other hand...

FireDragon76 said:

That's part of the problem... some Christians make it sound like homosexuality or transsexualism are akin to human trafficking or rape in terms of their moral gravity... and those of us not invested in Christian doctrines are left scratching our heads as to how we are supposed to accomodate that sort of animosity in a society that must bend towards justice. Opposition seems the only clear answer.

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The gravity of transsexualism, especially when it involves surgery, is very significant. There are very high suicide rates, the operations are irreversible and have a drastic effect on one's sexual life and ability to procreate, and gender dysphoria is something that affects one's core identity. It's actually not on par with homosexuality gravity-wise. I really don't think you can casually lump transsexualism in with a general critique of Christian sexual ethics. It goes far beyond Christian sexual ethics, and Christians are by no means the only concerned party.

But opposition is not a bad answer for those who are opposed. My point was that tolerance is a weak answer. It limps as soon as the seriousness of the issues exceeds a certain threshold.

Jamdoc said:

Romans 1:21-32 pretty much describes the last 60 years of the US, in perfect sequence. the US started not recognizing God as the creator, God gave people over to unclean lusts, and.... we had a sexual revolution. Then, we (as a nation) declared that there is no God, and started worshiping the creation (humanism, Gaia worship/environmentalism), which was followed by the gay rights and LGBT movement, which is right in line with Romans 1:26-27. Then finally God gives them over to a reprobate mind, and the result is all sin and unrighteousness, and concluding with the celebration of sin and open derision of God.
It's just eerie how it goes in that exact order. Sexual revolution, explosion of homosexuality, followed by a collapsing society that openly celebrates sin.

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The USA or any country was never supposed to be a Conservative Christian only country. The problem is Some religious people, want the countries to be only their religious belief system and that's it. If you want to have Conservative Christ belief only. Keep it in your home and church. The possible collapse of America wont be about what you call sexual sin. It will be more about the stealing this land from the Indians. Or the slave issue. Conservative Christians and non Christians republicans can keep trying to ignore the issue. But it seems to be a huge issue. Since people are realizing the betrayal.

Jamdoc said:

Not from being married, from him diving head first into sin and mental illness.

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The heckler said as much, just not in so many words.

Quartermaine said:

Living life as openly and honestly as everyone else isn't waving anything in anyone's face and expecting an entire group of people to hide who they are isn't disagreeing

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Of course its being waved in our face. It's all over the media and in TV and it isn't being shown as a sin but as something good and right. Well it isn't, its a sexual sin the same as adultery. So is heterosexual couples living together, so is inappropriate contentography watching.
But you don't care about those other sins.

If I say "Adultery is sin" Will you claim they can't help themselves and that they should be proud and live their life the way they want? Will you call me a hater for calling out adultery? Bet you won't. In fact you will ignore it and skip over any references we make to other sexual sins and focus in on that one area that you want to push.

I make no distinction between the various sexual sins, they are all sins. You and society can claim these things are not sins all you want, but they are sins and God will demand a reckoning. You think it wouldn't be easier for us if God didn't say it was a sin? Of course it would be, but he does and so it is. We don't get to decide what is a sin and what isn't, God does.

Quartermaine said:

face prejudice, discrimination, and hate for being celibate and then you can get congratulated.

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No one is saying that people should face hate. Hate is also a sin, just as much a sin as anything else we have mentioned.
Romans 3:23

23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,
And we include ourselves in this. This is why Jesus was crucified.

pitabread said:

The U.S. is one of the most religious countries of Western nations. It ain't abandoning God that's America's issue.

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Being "religious" is not the same thing as following Christ and cleaving to God.

2 Timothy 3:1-5

1 This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come.
2 For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,
3 Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good,
4 Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.

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You can go to church every Sunday and still have 0 faith, and still die and go to Hell.

Canada legalized gay marriage in 2005. We've been doing just fine ever since. You can rest easy, homosexuality isn't ruining your society.

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That's funny. really funny.
You're blind and can't even see the collapse.


and I cropped out the other line but I should address it.
Our problem isn't in political leaders.
There are no political leaders that are going to lead us to any kind of "greatness" There is no political solution for the problems we're facing, because what we're facing is an intensifying of "birth pains" before the second coming of Jesus.
Every single year from now until the return of Christ is going to involve more earthquakes, more volcanic eruptions, more heat waves, more hurricanes and cyclones and tornadoes, more drought, and worse and worse fire seasons.
Climate change doesn't cause earthquakes and volcanic eruptions.
Now there is climate change, God foresaw it, and is going to intervene before it becomes life threatening by itself. He's not going to let us make the planet uninhabitable.
But eventually His wrath is going to do that, before He restores it to its intended beauty.

Jamdoc said:

Well, Bruce Jenner.

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Her name is Caitlyn Jenner.

When someone tells you their name, then use that name. It's called being polite.

Skreeper said:

Her name is Caitlyn Jenner.

When someone tells you their name, then use that name. It's called being polite.

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*shrugs* guess it's unpolite then.

zippy2006 said:

The gravity of transsexualism, especially when it involves surgery, is very significant. There are very high suicide rates, the operations are irreversible and have a drastic effect on one's sexual life and ability to procreate, and gender dysphoria is something that affects one's core identity. It's actually not on par with homosexuality gravity-wise. I really don't think you can casually lump transsexualism in with a general critique of Christian sexual ethics. It goes far beyond Christian sexual ethics, and Christians are by no means the only concerned party.

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First, that kind of paternalistic attitude on the part of Christians is offensive, especially when many of their own institutions are not at all good examples of healthy human relationships or behaviors (and that's a huge understatement).

Secondarily, gender reassignment surgery is not synonymous with being trans, making most of those potential concerns irrelevant.

Thirdly, gender reassignment surgery is akin to cosmetic surgery in terms of its moral weight, as far as I am concerned. We allow people to undergo cosmetic surgeries, despite the fact they are not risk free and they alter one or more organs of the body, so I see no reason to attach stigma to gender reassignment surgery.

Ignatius the Kiwi said:

*shrugs* guess it's unpolite then.

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Does it bother you when someone refuses to use the name you want them to use when they refer to you?

If not, I will just start calling you Kevin.

rjs330 said:

Transgenders still suffer deeply even before they know what is wrong. They suffer before anyone else even knows about them. Even after surgeries and hormones they still suffer. And anyone who decides to mutilate their bodies and take significant amounts of drugs that transforms their bodies is facing impairment. Often they do poorly in many areas. No matter how well those around them treat them.

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Clearly, transgendered people have a difficult lot in life, but think more deeply before claiming that surgery and medication is a crucial issue. Many people use surgery (body modification) to fix physical issues and medication to fix chemical imbalances. Unless you condemn these interventions in all circumstances, be reticent to use them as an argument in this instance.

coffee4u said:

Of course its being waved in our face. It's all over the media and in TV and it isn't being shown as a sin but as something good and right. Well it isn't, its a sexual sin the same as adultery. So is heterosexual couples living together, so is inappropriate contentography watching.

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It would be better and more truthful if, particularly as Christians we refrained from lumping transgender in with sexual sin. Just because it can relate to secondary sex characteristics does not mean it is a sexual sin. Sexual sin can only pertain to the thought or act of sex in the wrong context.

FireDragon76 said:

That's almost as bad. That kind of paternalistic attitude on the part of Christians is offensive, especially when many of their own institutions are not at all good examples of healthy human relationships (and that's a huge understatement).

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Standard Christian human relationship vs Surgically removing one's penis or grafting on a fake penis.

The former is more unhealthy how exactly?

Skreeper said:

Does it bother you when someone refuses to use the name you want them to use when they refer to you?

If not, I will just start calling you Kevin.

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You could do that but I would just be more confused than anything. Close though, since my name does begin with a K. Mind you, I'm not the one arguing we need to respect how each person identifies. In violating your own precept you make a pretty bad case for it. Are you about being polite or simply scoring a victory?

Ignatius the Kiwi said:

Standard Christian human relationship vs Surgically removing one's penis or grafting on a fake penis.

The former is more unhealthy how exactly?

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It's akin to cosmetic surgery as far as I am concerned. It doesn't carry any more moral gravitas than that.

FireDragon76 said:

It's akin to cosmetic surgery as far as I am concerned. It doesn't carry any more moral gravitas than that.

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I didn't realize the only function of the private parts is that they are aesthetic.

Ignatius the Kiwi said:

You could do that but I would just be more confused than anything. Close though, since my name does begin with a K. Mind you, I'm not the one arguing we need to respect how each person identifies. In violating your own precept you make a pretty bad case for it. Are you about being polite or simply scoring a victory?

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I'm all for the victories, baby. At least on this site.

But just to be clear, if you don't care how I refer to you then me calling you Kevin would not be unpolite.