SabbathBlessings

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That didn't answer my question. Did Paul ever say he is saved by the New Covenant?

On the contrary, he said Romans 11:27, which is a future event, as far as the New Covenant with Israel is about.
No one is saved by an agreement, we are saved by God's grace though our faith. Obeying is a fruit of our faith.
 
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Guojing

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No one is saved by an agreement, we are saved by God's grace though our faith. Obeying is a fruit of our faith.

So when you said "Paul is under the New Covenant", you hold that as your personal belief?
 
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SabbathBlessings

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So when you said "Paul is under the New Covenant", you hold that as your personal belief?
Not just Paul, everyone.

Do you really believe only God's people are literal Israelites and everyone else is not God's people?


Hebrews 8:10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, declares the Lord: I will put my laws into their minds, and write them on their hearts, and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.
 
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Guojing

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Not just Paul, everyone.

Do you really believe only God's people are literal Israelites and everyone else is not God's people?

We are in Christ, thru the Body of Christ. When God sees us, he sees us "in Christ".

We are saved thru being in that same body (Ephesians 1:7).

If you prefer to be saved under the New Covenant, you don't have forgiveness of your sins NOW, you will only receive that in the future, together with saved Israel (Hebrews 8:12)
 
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SabbathBlessings

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We are in Christ, thru the Body of Christ. When God sees us, he sees us "in Christ".

We are saved thru being in that same body (Ephesians 1:7).

If you prefer to be saved under the New Covenant, you don't have forgiveness of your sins NOW, you will only receive that in the future, together with saved Israel (Hebrews 8:12)
You are quoting from the new covenant!

Hebrews 8:10 This is the covenant I will establish with the people of Israel
after that time, declares the Lord.
I will put my laws in their minds
and write them on their hearts.
I will be their God,
and they will be my people.
11 No longer will they teach their neighbor,
or say to one another, ‘Know the Lord,’
because they will all know me,
from the least of them to the greatest.
12 For I will forgive their wickedness
and will remember their sins no more.”


According to you, this promise does not apply to you.
12 For I will forgive their wickedness
and will remember their sins no more.”

because
Hebrew 8:10 This is the covenant I will establish with the people of Israel
after that time, declares the Lord.

Which is not the case and the point we have been trying to make. If we are of Christ we are part of God's Israel and heir to the promises and inheritances.
 
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Guojing

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You are quoting from the new covenant!

Hebrews 8:10 This is the covenant I will establish with the people of Israel
after that time, declares the Lord.
I will put my laws in their minds
and write them on their hearts.
I will be their God,
and they will be my people.
11 No longer will they teach their neighbor,
or say to one another, ‘Know the Lord,’
because they will all know me,
from the least of them to the greatest.
12 For I will forgive their wickedness
and will remember their sins no more.”


According to you, this promise does not apply to you.
12 For I will forgive their wickedness
and will remember their sins no more.”

because
Hebrew 8:10 This is the covenant I will establish with the people of Israel
after that time, declares the Lord.

Which is not the case and the point we have been trying to make. If we are of Christ we are part of God's Israel and heir to the promises and inheritances.

I stated that I have present salvation in the Body of Christ (Ephesians 1:7).

I am not under that New Covenant promised to Israel only, which gives them a future salvation (Hebrews 8:12)

I will is future tense.

Which is better to you, present or future salvation?
 
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SabbathBlessings

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I stated that I have present salvation in the Body of Christ (Ephesians 1:7).

I am not under that New Covenant promised to Israel only, which gives them a future salvation (Hebrews 8:12)

I will is future tense.

Which is better to you, present or future salvation?

We have forgiveness now when we repent, in the New Covenant which is what everyone is under. Paul states this clearly that we are one in Christ, there is no Jew or Gentile. God's people are not just literal Jews, they are anyone who believes and is in Christ.

Romans 2:28 For he is not a Jew who is one outwardly, nor is circumcision that which is outward in the flesh; 29 but he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the Spirit, not in the letter; whose praise is not from men but from God.

Galatians 3:28 26 For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. 27 For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ. 28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 And if you are Christ’s, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Salvation is grace through our faith and grace is God's gift to us. We are judged though through our works (our actions) and that standard is God's laws 1 John 3:4 I don't think it's wise to want all the blessing God gives us without thinking that God's will for us does not apply.

It's been nice chatting, need to run for now.
 
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Guojing

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We have forgiveness now when we repent, in the New Covenant which is what everyone is under. Paul states this clearly that we are one in Christ, there is no Jew or Gentile. God's people are not just literal Jews, they are anyone who believes and is in Christ.

Romans 2:28 For he is not a Jew who is one outwardly, nor is circumcision that which is outward in the flesh; 29 but he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the Spirit, not in the letter; whose praise is not from men but from God.

Galatians 3:28 26 For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. 27 For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ. 28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 And if you are Christ’s, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Salvation is grace through our faith and grace is God's gift to us. We are judged though through our works (our actions) and that standard is God's laws 1 John 3:4 I don't think it's wise to want all the blessing God gives us without thinking that God's will for us does not apply.

It's been nice chatting, need to run for now.

But Paul never states "The New Covenant" in any of those passages you used.

You cannot insert that term in Paul's letters from Romans to Philemon, as and when you feel like it.
 
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SabbathBlessings

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But Paul never states "The New Covenant" in any of those passages you used.

You cannot insert that term in Paul's letters from Romans to Philemon, as and when you feel like it.
Christ is our New Covenant Isaiah 42-6-7. I would not want to write myself out of the New Covenant!
 
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LoveGodsWord

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As we have already debated at length, we are not Israel in anyway, so the New Covenant could not be for us (Hebrews 8:8)
But I know you disagree, so let's leave it as that.

Did we have a debate? Forgive me dear friend but I do not remember this taking place. I only remember providing scripture showing who God's people in the new covenant are (starting here linked), and you denying Gods' Word with your words. That is not a debate. Hebrews 8:8 does not say or teach anywhere the new covenant is not for Gods' people in the new testament scriptures. In fact if you continue reading further from Hebrews 8:8-12 you will see it is quoting Jeremiah 31:31-34 which actually disagrees with you. You may want to check your scriptures before posting them. It is clear you do not know what the new covenant is or what the old covenant points to.

Hope this is helpful
 
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SabbathBlessings

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That is your preference but this has nothing to do with the point about Paul.
It’s not really a preference, it’s following God’s Word. God wrote the new covenant Hebrews 8:10, Jeremiah 31:33 which has His laws written on our heart. We no longer obey God because He commanded us to Exodus 20, we obey because we have a changed heart, we want to obey because when we walk in God’s Spirit, we no longer want to sin. We can test ourselves that we are walking with the Holy Spirit when we keep the commandments. Jesus provides us the Holy Spirit to help us obey. John 14:15-18, Acts 5:32. Paul and everyone else including you and I are under this covenant. Jesus is our high priest in the New Covenant and not sure why anyone who loves Jesus would not want to be part of God’s people, which He talks about in the new covenant.
 
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Guojing

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It’s not really a preference, it’s following God’s Word. God wrote the new covenant Hebrews 8:10, Jeremiah 31:33 which has His laws written on our heart. We no longer obey God because He commanded us to Exodus 20, we obey because we have a changed heart, we want to obey because when we walk in God’s Spirit, we no longer want to sin. We can test ourselves that we are walking with the Holy Spirit when we keep the commandments. Jesus provides us the Holy Spirit to help us obey. John 14:15-18, Acts 5:32. Paul and everyone else including you and I are under this covenant. Jesus is our high priest in the New Covenant and not sure why anyone who loves Jesus would want to be part of God’s people, which He talks about in the new covenant.

Let me repeat that question “where did paul ever state he and we are saved under the new covenant?”
 
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SabbathBlessings

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Let me repeat that question “where did paul ever state he and we are saved under the new covenant?”
Are you implying if God says something, in order for us to obey God we have to repeat what God says first, otherwise God's Words are not valid? Sorry, I'm having a hard time following your logic here.
 
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Guojing

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Are you implying if God says something, in order for us to obey God we have to repeat what God says first, otherwise God's Words are not valid? Sorry, I'm having a hard time following your logic here.

No, you are making a claim that Paul is under the New Covenant. I am just asking you whether that is your personal belief, or it is something that is scriptural.

I am fine if you believe that to be true for yourself.
 
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SabbathBlessings

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No, you are making a claim that Paul is under the New Covenant. I am just asking you whether that is your personal belief, or it is something that is scriptural.

I am fine if you believe that to be true for yourself.
I am claiming we all are under the New Covenant unless you want to delete Jeremiah 31:33, Hebrews 8:10
 
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Guojing

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I am claiming we all are under the New Covenant unless you want to delete Jeremiah 31:33, Hebrews 8:10

If that is your personal belief, I am fine as I stated.

But don't use Paul to back that personal belief when he said no such thing.
 
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Guojing

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God said it! He is our Creator and Savior.

God said he WILL make a new covenant with the house of Judah and the house of Israel (Hebrews 8:8)

You changed Hebrews 8:8, in your mind, into

God said it is already made with all of us in the Body of Christ.

You don't want to understand Hebrews 8:8 literally.
 
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SabbathBlessings

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God said it WILL make a new covenant with the house of Judah and the house of Israel (Hebrews 8:8)

You changed Hebrews 8:8, in your mind, into

God said it is already made with all of us in the Body of Christ.
Yes, in the New Covenant.
 
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