Salvation vs : service.

The first part made the least sense:

Sidon said:

Unless we died on the Cross, sinless, after we were first the pre-incarnate Word, there is no chance that our "trying to be good", is going to pay for our Lifetime of Sin.

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And the second part made the least sense too:

Sidon said:

This won't stop the self saver from trying to get you up on your Cross.

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The third part, I didn't understand at all:

Sidon said:

As this is why they are on this forum and its why they infect all Christian forums.

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Sidon said:

Welcome to a "christian" forum, and welcome the world of Christ Rejectors, at large.

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Ligurian said:

Sidon said:

Pauline Theology always stings a Legalist.
The blood of Jesus always offends a self saver.
The devil hates the Cross and he will always find people to oppose it with his gospel of works and commandment keeping.
This is nothing new.
Read Jude.

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Revelation 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.
Revelation 12:11 And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.
John 14:21 He that hath My commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth Me shall be loved of My Father, and I will love him, and will manifest Myself to him. Matthew 10:25 Matthew 12:31
Jude 1:4 For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.

Sidon said:

See, its the devil who wants you under the commandments and the law, as if you are back in the Old Testament.

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Revelation 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

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Sidon said:

Your dishonesty is stacking up today.

Listen,
I said that you cut and paste your theology, vs, asking me a question.
I did not say you cut and paste my Quotes.
I just said the opposite., in fact., same as you just did again.
You made the same false statement again, and you do not use my QUOTES as your proof.
Why?
Because you cant, and that is why you post false insinuation, only.

Want to try it again?

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Matthew 7:1 Judge not, that ye be not judged. 2 For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again. 3 And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye? 4 Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and, behold, a beam [is] in thine own eye? 5 Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye.

This would work on Sidon if he were brothers with setst777. But that's highly unlikely.

Sidon said:

I see that its easy for you to say that "sidon"is using denominations to "divide" people, yet you didn't explain how.
Did you know that a false innuendo is the same thing as a "bald faced lie"?

And....
You probably have realized that i only Teach Pauline Theology, and this isn't a "denomination".

Also.

Let me explain the people who have created the idea that the Grace of God, when taught as "Justification by faith, without works", accused Paul of teaching that we are to sin, so that Grace may come.
See that?
That is legalism attacking Paul, before a greek text ever showed up.
That is the teaching of the deceived, who do not accept "Justification by Faith", accusing Paul of preaching "License to sin".

These are those whom Jude says are committing the "error of Cain", who have swapped Grace into the idea that the Gift of God, and to be made righteous, is teaching "licentiousness".
These are the worst type of legalists. Who try to destroy the faith of believers with their theology of commandment keeping and self saving.
So, notice the Apostle said they veiled themselves.. They "crept in, unaware"..
This is my "How to spot the Devil" Threads.
This means that these Legalist, who contradict The Cross and do not accept "Grace through Faith" and reject PAUL.....and avoid "the simplicity that is in Christ",...... these dark lights.....what they do, is they find real believers and they try to convince them that the Grace of God, if understood as "made righteous", is to be taught that this is License to sin.

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Pauline Gospel:

Romans 1:5 (NIV) 5 Through him we received grace and apostleship to call all the Gentiles to the obedience that comes from faith for his name’s sake.

Romans 16:25-26 (NIV) 25 Now to him who is able to establish you in accordance with my gospel, the message I proclaim about Jesus Christ, in keeping with the revelation of the mystery hidden for long ages past, 26 but now revealed and made known through the prophetic writings by the command of the eternal God, so that all the Gentiles might come to the obedience that comes from faith

That is what a disciple is – a faithful follower of Jesus, obeying all things He commands of us. That is the Gospel.

Matthew 28:19-20 (NIV)
19 Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you.

The obedience that comes from faith is not a works salvation; rather, that is the Gospel.

Acts 11:26 (WEB) 26 The disciples were first called Christians in Antioch.

Disciple = Christian

To be a disciple of Lord Jesus is to follow Him, and to obey all things that He commands of us.

setst777 said:

Show me any Scripture that teaches that God guarantees that our faith will never fail?

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"23And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. 24Faithful is he that calleth you, who also will do it."—1 Thess. 5

Sidon said:

Theology isn't the Scriptures.
Theology is the interpretation.
This isnt a lie, its a fact.
I dont accuse you of posting verses.. i said you post your theology misusing them.

You should not do that.

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I did not cut and past theology. That is completely false.

GOD Shines Forth! said:

"23And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. 24Faithful is he that calleth you, who also will do it."—1 Thess. 5

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Paul is addressing the Christian Thessalonian Church - those who are already faithful.

God, for His part, is faithful to bring to pass our (the Believer/Christian) sanctification. As we view the Scriptures, we understand that God’s faithfulness in bringing about our sanctification is accomplished by His Spirit who indwells the believer.

Yet, the Spirit's work of sanctification in the believer is dependent on the believer remaining faithful demonstrated by living and walking by the Spirit God gave us.

Galatians 5:24-25 (WEB)
24 Those who belong to Christ have crucified the flesh with its passions and lusts.
25 If we live by the Spirit, let us also walk by the Spirit.

God is faithful to bring our sanctification and salvation to pass, and to preserve us without blame, but only as we (Christians) remain faithful to God demonstrated in a commitment to live out that sanctified life that God commands of us. We do this as we remain in the faith, committed to walk by the Spirit of God who indwells us.

Romans 8:3-4 (WEB)
3 For what the law couldn’t do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God did, sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and for sin, he condemned sin in the flesh; 4 that the ordinance of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

Not every Christian will remain faithful to walk by the Spirit. Many will grieve and quench the Spirit. Others will insult the Spirit by continual sinning and so be condemned. Hebrews 10:26-32

Not everyone who was given the Spirit by faith will remain faithful to live a sanctified life, otherwise, why would Paul warn the Thessalonians, in the very same letter to them, about their responsibility to walk in that sanctified life by the Spirit he gave them?

1 Thessalonians 4:3-8 (WEB)
3 For this is the will of God: your sanctification, that you abstain from sexual immorality, 4 that each one of you know how to control his own body in sanctification and honor, 5 not in the passion of lust, even as the Gentiles who do not know God, 6 that no one should take advantage of and wrong a brother or sister in this matter; because the Lord is an avenger in all these things, as also we forewarned you and testified. 7 For God called us not for uncleanness, but in sanctification. 8 Therefore he who rejects this doesn’t reject man, but God, who has also given his Holy Spirit.

We (who have His Spirit, verse 8) can reject God when we sin. Sin is a rejection of God’s authority over us, and this grieves God’s Spirit who indwells us. We are sanctified by God as we live sanctified lives before Him by His Spirit living in us.

1 Thessalonians 3:5 (WEB) For this cause I also, when I could not stand it any longer, sent that I might know your faith, for fear that by any means the tempter had tempted you, and our labor would have been in vain.

As we see from the above Scriptures that Paul wrote in the very same letter to the Thessalonians, he never expressed that the faith and sanctification of those he was writing to was guaranteed to the end. In addition, Paul never taught that faith was guaranteed to any of the churches he wrote to.

Paul did not even guarantee his own faithfulness to the end until near his impending martyrdom.

Philippians 3:12-14 (WEB)
12 Not that I have already obtained, or am already made perfect; but I press on, that I may take hold of that for which also I was taken hold of by Christ Jesus.
13 Brothers, I do not regard myself as yet having taken hold, but one thing I do: forgetting the things which are behind, and stretching forward to the things which are before, 14 I press on toward the goal for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus.

1 Corinthians 9:23-27 (WEB)
23 Now I do this for the sake of the Good News, that I may be a joint partaker of it. 24 Do not you know that those who run in a race all run, but one receives the prize? Run like that, that you may win. 25 Every man who strives in the games exercises self-control in all things. Now they do it to receive a corruptible crown, but we an incorruptible. 26 I therefore run like that, not aimlessly. I fight like that, not beating the air, 27 but I beat my body and bring it into submission, lest by any means, after I have preached to others, I myself should be rejected.

Near the time of the Apostle Paul’s martyrdom, only then could Paul say with confidence that he had stayed the course, endured, and fought the good fight of faith.

2 Timothy 4:6-9 (WEB) 6 For I am already being offered, and the time of my departure has come. 7 I have fought the good fight. I have finished the course. I have kept the faith. 8 From now on, the crown of righteousness is stored up for me, which the Lord, the righteous judge, will give to me on that day; and not to me only, but also to all those who have loved his appearing.

Paul did not even guarantee the faith of Timothy, whom Paul personally taught.

1 Timothy 4:16 (WEB)
16 Pay attention to yourself and to your teaching. Continue in these things, for in doing this you will save both yourself and those who hear you.

So, to rightly understand “1 Thessalonians 5:23-24” we consider the context of the whole Letter to the Thessalonians, and the context of Scripture itself, just as we have done. When we do this, then we understand that, for God’s part, He is faithful to bring about all good things for us. However, that promise is for those who stand by faith, living and walking by His Spirit who lives in the Christian as he continues to believe represented in following Lord Jesus, living and walking by His Spirit in us.

Sidon said:

You said you quoted me in this post you wrote...

"You are misrepresenting what people are stating on this forum, which is dishonest and divisive."""""


Do you see my Quote in your post?
This is because you lied.
Now, do you want to go and edit that post, and put my quote in it?
It wont help you.

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??? I have no idea what you are talking about. Do you see your quote in the post I am now responding to?

Sidon said:

Here is your post.

"""You are misrepresenting what people are stating on this forum, which is dishonest and divisive."""

That is all you posted.
Yet you just told us you posted my Quote.
You didnt.
Stop lying.

Now, you do have the option to go and edit your post, and add a quote of mine.
It would not surprise me if you did.
Help yourself.

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That is my statement, of which most of those you are presently dialoguing with can fully attest to, that this is what you are doing. This misrepresenting of others is throughout almost everyone of your posts, just pick one.