The Hebrew text of Genesis 1-11

miamited · Jun 22, 2021

Isaiah 41:10 said:
The limits of the human imagination are without bounds.

I agree with you, and I'm certainly not claiming that what Ken Ham conceives as artwork in his Ark project is necessarily all truth. But that's not God's word. Just as you have done, Mr. Ham has taken some of the reading of God's word and attempted to make some sense of it. Maybe he's right and maybe he isn't. But again, that's not God's word. Further, I'm not convinced that Mr. Ham does what he does for entertainment purposes. I believe his intentions are to bring the word of God to life for people who might want to visit his display as an entertainment venue, but it's really his way of teaching the truth of God. I have been there and he does use it to take some opportunity to share with the visitors the truth of who Jesus is. There's a manger scene and a crucifixtion scene also. He has a wonderful planetarium there. It's actually got some great recliner seats so you don't have to crane and stretch your neck to look up at the stars that surround overhead.

But, I certainly understand that not all people, apparently even christians, will support what he does in his way to teach others about the Creator God. Hey, I read the Left Behind series and I don't agree with the authors on the chronology of the rapture and the tribulation. But I sure know that when the books first came out there was a lot of noise and hubbub made among people about the series and, therefore, many who were exposed to God who might not have ever been exposed in a fellowship service or reading of God's word. We don't really have any idea of all the ways that God can make Himself known upon the earth.

God bless,
Ted

miamited · Jun 22, 2021

@Isaiah 41:10

Isaiah 41:10 said:
At least when you say you believe in things, you directly defer to scripture. However there is a lot of abstraction going on where, if the world is 6000 years old, then it must also mean that dinosaurs and humans squared off in combat.

That would be correct. The dinosaurs, at some time in the past history of the earth, did live at the same time that mankind was on the earth. Now, how much interaction was had between the two groups is debatable. The earth is a big place and, as far as we know, in the days before the flood, and especially shortly after, the earth as a whole, was sparsely populated. Also, based on the dinosaur finds that we have, much like lions, they don't seem to have populated the whole earth, although their bones have been found on every continent. But, some places had more than others it appears. Dinosaur fossils have been found on every continent of Earth, including Antarctica but most of the dinosaur fossils and the greatest variety of species have been found high in the deserts and badlands of North America, China and Argentina. Where these 'most' fossils have been found were likely lightly, if at all, populated in the times that the dinosaurs lived.

God bless,
Ted

Job 33:6 · Jun 22, 2021

miamited said:
@Isaiah 41:10

That would be correct. The dinosaurs, at some time in the past history of the earth, did live at the same time that mankind was on the earth. Now, how much interaction was had between the two groups is debatable. The earth is a big place and, as far as we know, in the days before the flood, and especially shortly after, the earth as a whole, was sparsely populated. Also, based on the dinosaur finds that we have, much like lions, they don't seem to have populated the whole earth, although their bones have been found on every continent. But, some places had more than others it appears. Dinosaur fossils have been found on every continent of Earth, including Antarctica but most of the dinosaur fossils and the greatest variety of species have been found high in the deserts and badlands of North America, China and Argentina. Where these 'most' fossils have been found were likely lightly, if at all, populated in the times that the dinosaurs lived.

God bless,
Ted

Without corroboration with creation, I disagree with the above. Dinosaurs are not found beyond Mesozoic layers, and with that, nothing we see with our eyes indicates that they shared any time at all with people.

Why do you think it is that no dinosaurs are found in paleozoic strata? Nor in cenozoic strata?.

Much like gladiator battles, these ideas of dinosaurs and people living side by side rests souly in your mind.

AV1611VET · Jun 22, 2021

Isaiah 41:10 said:
Why do you think it is that no dinosaurs are found in paleozoic strata? Nor in cenozoic strata?

This strata stuff is for the birds (pun intended).

Evolution requires that LONG periods of time be found between these strata, whereas, if the earth has only been in existence since 4004 BC, then these strata aren't really strata.

If you take a window blind and write "T Rex" on the outside surface, and Adam at the core of the blind, you see those two terms just inches apart.

But when you pull the window blind down, as evolutionists do, you see T Rex at the bottom and Adam at the top.

Then you claim the two weren't contemporary, since "millions of years" passed between the top of the blind and the bottom.

You can demonstrate it even better with a slinky.

chad kincham · Oct 27, 2021

PrincetonGuy said:
The vast majority of scholars of the Hebrew text of Genesis 1-11 (both Christian and Jewish) ignore the interpretation of the passage in a manner that allows young earth creationism to be a Biblical doctrine. Indeed, they ignore the interpretation of the passage in such a manner because the Hebrew text does not allow for that interpretation. Why? Because Genesis 1-11 is written in a genre of literature that is greatly different from the rest of Genesis—and that genre of literature is the same genre of literature in which epic tales, sages, myths, and legends are written. Moreover, it depicts the earth as having been created flat and covered with a solid dome with real, genuine windows (or floodgates) in it that God opened during the flood to allow the waters from above the dome to flow out.

Gen. 1:6. And God said, "Let there be a dome in the midst of the waters, and let it separate the waters from the waters."
7. So God made the dome and separated the waters that were under the dome from the waters that were above the dome. And it was so.
8. God called the dome Sky. And there was evening and there was morning, the second day.

Gen. 7:11. In the six hundredth year of Noah's life, in the second month, on the seventeenth day of the month, on that day all the fountains of the great deep burst forth, and the windows of the heavens were opened. (NRSV)

Gen. 1:6. Then God said, "Let there be a dome in the middle of the waters, to separate one body of water from the other." And so it happened:
7. God made the dome, and it separated the water above the dome from the water below it.
8. God called the dome "the sky." Evening came, and morning followed-the second day.

Gen. 7:11. In the six hundredth year of Noah's life, in the second month, on the seventeenth day of the month: it was on that day that
All the fountains of the great abyss burst forth,
and the floodgates of the sky were opened. (NAB)

The doctrine of young earth creationism requires that this language be spiritualized or poeticized while interpreting the six days, etc., as literal! As a conservative, evangelical Christian, I believe that the Bible should be very carefully read rather than messed with to force it to defend ones own person beliefs.

Not true at all.

The 1,000 page tome, ‘the Genesis flood’ by Whitcomb and Morris didn’t spiritualize any part of the Genesis account, nor claim the earth is flat.

The dome is presented in the book as a Dyson sphere of thin ice surrounding the earth, acting like a greenhouse, making the whole earth a temperate paradise with no deserts or polar ice.

This was broken up at the time of the flood - however the vast majority of flooD water came from within the earth, not from the heavens - the fountains of the deep were broken up to cause the flood.

Job 33:6 · Oct 27, 2021

AV1611VET said:
This strata stuff is for the birds (pun intended).

Evolution requires that LONG periods of time be found between these strata, whereas, if the earth has only been in existence since 4004 BC, then these strata aren't really strata.

If you take a window blind and write "T Rex" on the outside surface, and Adam at the core of the blind, you see those two terms just inches apart.

But when you pull the window blind down, as evolutionists do, you see T Rex at the bottom and Adam at the top.

Then you claim the two weren't contemporary, since "millions of years" passed between the top of the blind and the bottom.

You can demonstrate it even better with a slinky.

The best part of this response is that the question was never answered haha.

PrincetonGuy · Oct 28, 2021

chad kincham said:
Not true at all.

The 1,000 page tome, ‘the Genesis flood’ by Whitcomb and Morris didn’t spiritualize any part of the Genesis account, nor claim the earth is flat.

The dome is presented in the book as a Dyson sphere of thin ice surrounding the earth, acting like a greenhouse, making the whole earth a temperate paradise with no deserts or polar ice.

This was broken up at the time of the flood - however the vast majority of flooD water came from within the earth, not from the heavens - the fountains of the deep were broken up to cause the flood.

What I wrote is entirely true and is fully supported by hundreds of research papers, numerous commentaries on the Hebrew text of Genesis in English, German, and French, and by hundreds of volumes on the Pentateuch, the Hextateuch, the Old Testament, ancient Semitic languages, ancient Semitic cultures, and other related disciplines.

The Genesis Flood was written by two men who did not know so much as the first three letters of the Hebrew alphabet! Furthermore, neither of these two men had completed so much as a B.A. or B.S. degree in geology or any other subject relevant to the geography or topography of the earth giving them no more than a high school knowledge of the subjects. Indeed, neither of them had completed so much as a B.A. or B.S. degree in any field of science! Henry Morris’ education was in hydraulic engineering but throughout his life he flaunted his Ph.D. in a willful and deliberate attempt to deceive people into believing that he was academically qualified to have an opinion about young earth creationism.

To say it simply and honestly, The Genesis Flood is a work of imaginative fiction written by two men who disgraced themselves academically and led astray millions of simple folks who did not know any better.

HIM · Oct 28, 2021

PrincetonGuy said:
The vast majority of scholars of the Hebrew text of Genesis 1-11 (both Christian and Jewish) ignore the interpretation of the passage in a manner that allows young earth creationism to be a Biblical doctrine.

The doctrine of young earth creationism requires that this language be spiritualized or poeticized while interpreting the six days, etc., as literal! As a conservative, evangelical Christian, I believe that the Bible should be very carefully read rather than messed with to force it to defend ones own person beliefs.

Six literal days in verse 9, so six literal days in verse 11 which is the reason for the commandment.

Exod 20:9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
Exod 20:10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:
Exod 20:11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

chad kincham · Oct 28, 2021

PrincetonGuy said:
Henry Morris’ education was in hydraulic engineering but throughout his life he flaunted his Ph.D. in a willful and deliberate attempt to deceive people into believing that he was academically qualified to have an opinion about young earth creationism.

A PhD in anything establishes that person as a first rate mind, capable of learning most anything they choose to learn.

Quote: a PhD is an academic degree focusing on original research, data analysis and the evaluation of theory.

HIM · Oct 28, 2021

chad kincham said:
A PhD in anything establishes that person as a first rate mind, capable of learning most anything they choose to learn.

Quote: a PhD is an academic degree focusing on original research, data analysis and the evaluation of theory.

Ever had a doctor who gave you a bad diagnosis?

PrincetonGuy · Oct 28, 2021

chad kincham said:
A PhD in anything establishes that person as a first rate mind, capable of learning most anything they choose to learn.

Quote: a PhD is an academic degree focusing on original research, data analysis and the evaluation of theory.

A Ph.D. “establishes that person as a first rate mind, capable of learning most anything they choose to learn”—that is, unless the holder of the degree is one of more than 3,000,000 scientists around the world who believe in the theory of evolution, or is one of thousands of scholars of the Old Testament who know for a fact that the first eleven chapters of Genesis are NOT an accurate account of historic events, but are a collection of heavily redacted epic tales, sagas, myths, and/or legends. What hypocrisy!

chad kincham · Oct 28, 2021

PrincetonGuy said:
A Ph.D. “establishes that person as a first rate mind, capable of learning most anything they choose to learn”—that is, unless the holder of the degree is one of more than 3,000,000 scientists around the world who believe in the theory of evolution, or is one of thousands of scholars of the Old Testament who know for a fact that the first eleven chapters of Genesis are NOT an accurate account of historic events, but are a collection of heavily redacted epic tales, sagas, myths, and/or legends. What hypocrisy!

Jesus taught that the law and the prophets from Moses is all literal, and an accurate account of actual events, from Adam and Eve, to the great flood, to Jonah in the belly of the fish, (which He said was a SIGN of His own death, burial and resurrection), which unequivocally settles it, no matter how many educated apostates who are “ever learning but unable to come to the truth” and who promote “science, falsely called” say its allegory or metaphor and not an actual and factual account.

PrincetonGuy · Oct 29, 2021

chad kincham said:
Jesus taught that the law and the prophets from Moses is all literal, and an accurate account of actual events, from Adam and Eve, to the great flood, to Jonah in the belly of the fish, (which He said was a SIGN of His own death, burial and resurrection), which unequivocally settles it, no matter how many educated apostates who are “ever learning but unable to come to the truth” and who promote “science, falsely called” say its allegory or metaphor and not an actual and factual account.

One of the most basic tenets of the Christian faith is that Jesus had both a human nature and a divine nature. In His humanity, he had a human brain with its limitations. He knew only what His Father taught him, and what he learned from his family and neighbors. Therefore, He grew up believing that the earth is flat and that all of the rest of the first eleven chapters of Genesis was an accurate account of actual events in history. However, the earth is NOT flat and Genesis 1-11 is written in the same genre of literature and as are epic tales, sagas, myths, and legends. God is God, and He made up His own rules concerning the inspiration of Scripture, and He has never been bound by the conventions of religious men and women.

Moreover, having an accurate understanding of the Bible does not make a man an apostate, and using the appellative “apostates” to describe Christians who love the Bible enough to devote their lives to the study of it is tantamount to calling Jesus Himself an apostate. (Matt. 25:40). However, we see it all the time—men who have no facts to support their beliefs and counter the beliefs of their opponents resort to castigating their opponents. And when they perceive that that is not enough—they resort to quoting the beloved Apostle Paul out of context in 1 and 2 Timothy, and thereby make a mockery of him and what he taught. And it does not end there—they even quote a severely wrong translation of the Greek word γνῶσις.

Is it any wonder that hundreds of millions of people around the world believe that Christians are the scourge of the earth?

The Hebrew text of Genesis 1-11

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