Davy

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You are the one who is heterodox while I’m orthodox ,traditional ,historical and biblical Christianity. You believe exactly like the JW cult by denying the Resurrection and His present humanity . You have a false christ. You also deny that Jesus is the Son of man presently.

I believe The Word of God as written. You obviously don't, otherwise you wouldn't mock what Apostle Paul wrote in 1 Corinthians 15.

That's right, you are not mocking me! You are mocking Apostle Paul, for he is who gave the witness that flesh and blood CANNOT inherit the kingdom of God! Thus you... are calling Apostle Paul a liar.
 
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Jesus is YHWH

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I believe The Word of God as written. You obviously don't, otherwise you wouldn't mock what Apostle Paul wrote in 1 Corinthians 15.

That's right, you are not mocking me! You are mocking Apostle Paul, for he is who gave the witness that flesh and blood CANNOT inherit the kingdom of God! Thus you... are calling Apostle Paul a liar.
I’m not mocking anyone just correcting your false teachings
 
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Davy

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I’m not mocking anyone just correcting your false teachings

You are mocking what Apostle Paul wrote in 1 Corinthians 15 about the resurrection, because that... is what I am proclaiming, as written. So explain the following... if you can. I want others to see the false tradition of men you hang on instead of heeding what Paul said below...

1 Cor 15:48-50
48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.

49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.

50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
KJV
 
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Jesus is YHWH

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You are mocking what Apostle Paul wrote in 1 Corinthians 15 about the resurrection, because that... is what I am proclaiming, as written. So explain the following... if you can. I want others to see the false tradition of men you hang on instead of heeding what Paul said below...

1 Cor 15:48-50
48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.

49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.

50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
KJV
You don’t understand the Resurrection or what it means that Jesus is still the Son of man meaning having that nature of man- body , soul and spirit .

next…….
 
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Davy

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You don’t understand the Resurrection or what it means that Jesus is still the Son of man meaning having that nature of man- body , soul and spirit .

next…….

Scared of that 1 Cor.15 Scripture I posted, we see.
 
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ChetSinger

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I believe The Word of God as written. You obviously don't, otherwise you wouldn't mock what Apostle Paul wrote in 1 Corinthians 15.

That's right, you are not mocking me! You are mocking Apostle Paul, for he is who gave the witness that flesh and blood CANNOT inherit the kingdom of God! Thus you... are calling Apostle Paul a liar.
I suggest you speak with your pastor or priest about this.

For 2000 years the church has taught the resurrection of Jesus was a physical one: his body was missing from the tomb, and he ate a fish in front of his disciples.

We also will share in the same physical resurrection as Jesus has.

His body has been glorified. So will ours be, and I don't know what exactly that means. Nevertheless in the resurrection we will live on a new physical earth and have glorified yet physical bodies.

Do you have a problem with this? Many Christians do because a popular image of the Christian afterlife is that we're all standing on clouds, with wings, playing harps. That isn't at all the picture we get in the final two chapters of the Bible.

Please contact your pastor or priest.
 
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I suggest you speak with your pastor or priest about this.

For 2000 years the church has taught the resurrection of Jesus was a physical one: his body was missing from the tomb, and he ate a fish in front of his disciples.

We also will share in the same physical resurrection as Jesus has.

His body has been glorified. So will ours be, and I don't know what exactly that means. Nevertheless in the resurrection we will live on a new physical earth and have glorified yet physical bodies.

Do you have a problem with this? Many Christians do because a popular image of the Christian afterlife is that we're all standing on clouds, with wings, playing harps. That isn't at all the picture we get in the final two chapters of the Bible.

Please contact your pastor or priest.
Amen !
 
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Davy

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I suggest you speak with your pastor or priest about this.

For 2000 years the church has taught the resurrection of Jesus was a physical one: his body was missing from the tomb, and he ate a fish in front of his disciples.

We also will share in the same physical resurrection as Jesus has.

His body has been glorified. So will ours be, and I don't know what exactly that means. Nevertheless in the resurrection we will live on a new physical earth and have glorified yet physical bodies.

Do you have a problem with this? Many Christians do because a popular image of the Christian afterlife is that we're all standing on clouds, with wings, playing harps. That isn't at all the picture we get in the final two chapters of the Bible.

Please contact your pastor or priest.

You mean a pastor or priest that DENIES the 1 Corinthians 15 Scripture that Apostle Paul wrote, showing what 'type' body the resurrection is? (i.e., a "spiritual body").

Well, one can find those types of preachers or priests in many Churches. Doesn't mean what they preach on the subject is per God's Word.

After all, the fact that Lord Jesus' flesh body was... transfigured, because it was missing, is NOT the same matter that Apostle Paul was covering in 1 Corinthians 15 about 'our' resurrection.

So would you like to attempt to explain the following, since @Jesus is YHWH refuses to do so?

1 Cor 15:48-50
48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.

49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.

50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
KJV
 
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You mean a pastor or priest that DENIES the 1 Corinthians 15 Scripture that Apostle Paul wrote, showing what 'type' body the resurrection is? (i.e., a "spiritual body").

Well, one can find those types of preachers or priests in many Churches. Doesn't mean what they preach on the subject is per God's Word.

After all, the fact that Lord Jesus' flesh body was... transfigured, because it was missing, is NOT the same matter that Apostle Paul was covering in 1 Corinthians 15 about 'our' resurrection.

So would you like to attempt to explain the following, since @Jesus is YHWH refuses to do so?

1 Cor 15:48-50
48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.

49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.

50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
KJV
Paul declares in 1 Cor 15 that your faith is in vain and you are still dead in your sins since you deny the bodily Resurrection / Ascension of Christ.

hope this helps !!!
 
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Davy

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Paul declares in 1 Cor 15 that your faith is in vain and you are still dead in your sins since you deny the bodily Resurrection / Ascension of Christ.

hope this helps !!!

Still denying that 1 Corinthians 15:48-50 Scripture we see.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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@Jesus is YHWH ; @Davy and @ChetSinger we are all brothers in Christ. Let's by Gods' grace show each other some respect and Christian love and patience. Even if we might disagree on some things we can still be loving and friendly in our discussions here.

Perhaps there is some middle ground here in your discussions on what type of body we might have after the resurrection as shown in the scriptures below. I believe the scriptures teach as @ChetSinger pointed out that Jesus had a physical body at His resurrection while on the earth. According John in the book of Revelation 1:12-18 in the Heavenly Sanctuary Jesus had a heavenly immortal body just like we will after the first resurrection as shown in 1 Corinthians 15:50-57. The description of Jesus in Heaven is obviously different to what Jesus looked like on earth with a physical mortal body right?

Look at what the scriptures say below....

1 Thessalonians 4:13-18
[13], But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.
[14], For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
[15], For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
[16], For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
[17], Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
[18], Wherefore comfort one another with these words.

The above scriptures connects to what Paul also says here in Corinthians...

1 Corinthians 15:50-57
[50], Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
[51], Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
[52], In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
[53], For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
[54], So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.
[55], O death, where is thy sting? O grave,6 where is thy victory?
[56], The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law.
[57], But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.

So in order to have immortality we will need a new body that is suited for immortality and no longer have a mortal body that dies.

Hope this is helpful.
 
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Jesus is YHWH

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@Jesus is YHWH ; @Davy and @ChetSingerwe are all brothers in Christ. Let's by Gods' grace show each other some respect and Christian love and patience. Even if we might disagree on some things we can still be loving and friendly in our discussions here.

Perhaps there is some middle ground here in your discussions on what type of body we might have after the resurrection as shown in the scriptures below. I believe the scriptures teach as @ChetSinger pointed out that Jesus had a physical body at His resurrection while on the earth. According John in the book of Revelation 1:12-18 in the Heavenly Sanctuary Jesus had a heavenly immortal body just like we will after the first resurrection as shown in 1 Corinthians 15:50-57. The description of Jesus in Heaven is obviously different to what Jesus looked like on earth with a physical mortal body right?

Look at what the scriptures say below....

1 Thessalonians 4:13-18
[13], But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.
[14], For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
[15], For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
[16], For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
[17], Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
[18], Wherefore comfort one another with these words.

The above scriptures connects to what Paul also says here in Corinthians...

1 Corinthians 15:50-57
[50], Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
[51], Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
[52], In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
[53], For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
[54], So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.
[55], O death, where is thy sting? O grave,6 where is thy victory?
[56], The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law.
[57], But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.

So in order to have immortality we will need a new body that is suited for immortality and no longer have a mortal body that dies.

Hope this is helpful.
And the bodily Resurrection and Ascension of Christ is the most foundational truth in the NT. It’s at the center of the gospel message in which the apostles gave their lives for in death.
 
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ChetSinger

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You mean a pastor or priest that DENIES the 1 Corinthians 15 Scripture that Apostle Paul wrote, showing what 'type' body the resurrection is? (i.e., a "spiritual body").
Every church I'm aware of except the Jehovah's Witnesses preaches the bodily resurrection of Christ and the bodily resurrection of ourselves. Every single one. How can you not be aware of this? Do you attend church?

I think you mean well but you're misinterpreting 1 Corinthians 15. If you attend a church please bring this to your teachers. If you're not, I think it's good to find one.
 
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Still denying that 1 Corinthians 15:48-50 Scripture we see.

A lesson on exegesis below not eisegesis like you have demonstrated davy. You are quoting passages without understanding the meaning Paul is conveying in this chapter. Its all about the literal physical bodily Resurrection of Christ. Below I will demonstrate this fundamental and essential truth through exegesis of the passage.

Jesus said a spirit does not have flesh and bones as you see that I have. Blood is the life of both man and animal. In 1 Cor 15 it also represents the corruptible body which the bible says cannot inherit the kingdom of God. Jesus resurrected body was no longer corruptible but was a new glorified body of flesh and bones.

Luke 24:39
39 " See My hands and My feet, that it is I Myself; touch Me and see, for a spirit does not have flesh and bones as you see that I have."

Gen 9:4-6
4 "Only you shall not eat flesh with its life, that is, its blood. 5 "Surely I will require your lifeblood; from every beast I will require it. And from every man, from every man's brother I will require the life of man.

6 " Whoever sheds man's blood,
By man his blood shall be shed,
For in the image of God
He made man.

1 Corinthians 15:50
50 Now I say this, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable.

Paul not only states that one of the main tenants of the gospel is the belief that Jesus rose from the dead, but in verse 17, he goes on to say that “if Christ has not been raised, your faith is worthless; you are still in your sins.” For centuries, Christians have taught and defended the doctrine of the resurrection – teaching that Jesus physically rose in the same human body in which He died. Notice the correlation between the perishable human body and the imperishable resurrected body as described in 1 Corinthians 15:42-44:
“So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown a perishable body, it is raised an imperishable body; it is sown in dishonor, it is raised in glory; it is sown in weakness, it is raised in power; it is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body. If there is a natural body, there is also a spiritual body.”


The Greek term, “soma for “body” is always used in Scripture to refer to physical nature. Likewise, the term “spiritual is used in the Scripture to denote “supernatural” behavior—not a “spiritual” essence of being. Thus, the phrase “spiritual body” in the passage above speaks of a “physical supernatural” body—not a “spirit body.” Another example of the term “spiritual” referring to “supernatural” behavior is 1 Corinthians 2:15 where we read, “But he who is spiritual appraises all things, yet he himself is appraised by no man.” The “spiritual” person in both of these passages is behaving in a “supernatural” way, not ontologically transforming “human” essence into “spirit” essence.

1 CORINTHIANS 15:50: “Now I say this, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable.”
Jehovah’s Witnesses claim that Jesus could not have risen in His human body of flesh and bones, because Scripture states that “flesh and blood” cannot inherit the kingdom of God. Notice that Jesus did not say that His resurrected body was made of “flesh and blood.” Rather, He said His body was made of “flesh and bone” (Luke 24:39). This is significant because the term “flesh and blood” is often used in Scripture to refer to mortal humanity,in contrast to the imperishable, resurrected body alluded to by the phrase, “flesh and bones.”
As noted earlier, Jesus’ blood provided the atonement for sin. He did not take His “blood” back, but merely resurrected his body of flesh and bones. Far from claiming that the resurrected human body cannot inherit God’s kingdom, this passage asserts that the mortal, perishable human body (made of flesh and blood) cannot inherit the immortal, imperishable kingdom of God. Indeed as 1 Corinthians 15:53 states, “this perishable must put on the imperishable, and this mortal must put on immortality.”

A spiritual body denotes an immortal body. A spiritual body is one that is dominated by the spirit, not one that is devoid of matter.The Greek word pneumatikos means a body that is directed by the spirit as opposed to one under the dominion of the flesh.It is not ruled by the flesh that perishes but by the spirit that endures. (1 Cor 15:50-58). A spiritual body does no mean immaterial or invisible but immortal and imperishable.

Paul makes these parallels:

Earthly- Heavenly (verse 40)
Perishable- Imperishable (verse 42)
Weak- Powerful(verse 43)
Natural-Supernatural(verse 44)
Mortal- Immortal(verse 53)

The content shows that spiritual (pneumatikos) could be translated supernatural in contrast to natural from the parallels of perishable and imperishable, corruptible and incorruptible. Pneumatikos is translated supernatural in 1 Cor 10:4 regarding the supernatural rock that followed them in the wilderness. In the translation spiritual refers to physical objects. In 1 Cor 10:45 Paul spoke of the spiritual rock that followed Israel in the wilderness from which they got spiritual drink 1 Cor 10:4.But the OT story (Ex 17,Num 20)reveals it was a physical rock from which they got literal water to drink. The actual water they drank from the material rock was produced supernaturally. Further Paul spoke about a spiritual man 1 Cor 2:15 he obviously did not mean an invisible, immaterial man with no corporeal body. He was as a matter of fact speaking of a flesh and blood human being whose life is lived by the supernatural power of God, a literal person whose life is Spirit directed. A spiritual man is one who is taught by the Spirit and who receives the things that come from the Spirit of God. (1 Cor 2:13-14). The resurrection body can be called a spiritual body in much the same way we speak of the bible being a spiritual book. Regardless of their spiritual source and power both the resurrection body and the bible are material objects.

Life giving Spirit does not speak of the nature of Christ’s resurrected body but of the divine origin of the resurrection. Jesus physical body came back to life only by the power of God.(Rom 1:4). Paul is speaking about its spiritual source not its physical substance as a material body. If spirit describes the nature of Christ’s resurrected body then Adam with whom He is contrasted must not have a soul since he is described as of the earth, made of dust (verse 47). But the bible clearly says that Adam was a living soul(Gen 2:7). Christ’s body is called a spiritual body(soma) which always means a physical body when referring to an individual human being. The resurrected body is called spiritual and life giving spirit because its source is in the spiritual realm, not because its substance is immaterial. Christ’s supernatural resurrection body is from heaven as Adams natural body was from the earth. (verse 47). But just as the one from earth has an immaterial soul even so the One from heaven has a material body. Rhodes


1 Cor 15:50-54
50 I declare to you, brothers, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable. 51 Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will all be changed— 52 in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed. 53 For the perishable must clothe itself with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality. 54 When the perishable has been clothed with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality, then the saying that is written will come true: "Death has been swallowed up in victory."

Paul said earlier in the chapter if Christ be not risen your faith is in vain and you are still dead in your sins- an unbeliever who is lost. Those who deny the physical bodily resurrection of Jesus such as the JW's who teach that Jesus is now a spirit based being fit into this camp. They deny the resurrection.

If we look at what Paul is saying in this passage, it is that corruptible flesh and blood shall not enter the kingdom. Paul says corruptible does not inherit the incorruptible. Paul is not saying the resurrection body will not have flesh but what he declares is that resurrected body will not have perishable flesh. Remember in Luke Jesus said see here My hands and feet, touch Me a spirit/ghost does not have flesh and bones as you see that I have. Peter, Paul and John all agree that Jesus still had flesh well after His ascension. 1 John being the last of the books of the three Apostles declared that Jesus having come in the flesh and those who deny this are the spirit of antichrist. John makes it clear that the Incarnation was permanent. Jesus is forever both God and man. This is what Paul teaches in the whole 15th chapter of 1 Corinthians. The glorious physical bodies that we will have in the resurrection. We will have incorruptible bodies just as Jesus now has in heaven.


A) Soul= immortal, imperishable
B) Flesh=mortal, perishable

Now in the resurrection in 1 cor 15 the perishable (your body now ) with put on the imperishable(body that does not perish)

hope this helps !!!
 
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Hebrewselevensix

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Matt 24:31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

1 thes 3: 13 To the end he may stablish your hearts unblameable in holiness before God, even our Father, at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ with all his saints.

are they in graves?
 
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Davy

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No just your butchering of the text like the JWs do as well. Birds of a feather

You are still in DENIAL of the Scriptures I see...

1 Cor 15:44-50
44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.

47 The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.

48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.

49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.

50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
KJV
 
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You are still in DENIAL of the Scriptures I see...

1 Cor 15:44-50
44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.

47 The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.

48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.

49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.

50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
KJV
Try reading my previous post with some common sense and understanding.

All you do is quote scripture without comprehension of the passage. I exegeted it with biblical definitions and Paul’s usage of them from 1 Corinthians.

atleast JWs interact with the text and respond point by point which is more than I can say about your unbiblical methods.

next………..
 
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