The Two Sides of the Coin of Faith

RickReads said:

but having somebody insinuating I am a sinner all time gets old after awhile.

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You said, I quote:

Maybe you are for holy living. But by this kind of statement appears to make me think that you are against godly living. If that is the case, you need to know that God's Word commands the following of us.

1. Let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God (‭‭2 Corinthians‬ ‭7:1‬).

2. Let us not be [Do not be] weary in well doing: for in due season we shall reap, if we faint not (Galatians 6:9) (2 Thessalonians 3:13 says, “Be not weary in well doing”).

3. We should be holy and without blame before him in love (Ephesians 1:4).

4. We should be living* to the praise of his glory, like when we first trusted in Christ (Ephesians 1:12).

4. Be angry, and sin not; But do not let the sun go down upon your wrath [in your anger]; Neither give place to the devil [i.e. by sinning in your anger] (Ephesians 4:26-27).

5. Mortify [put to death] your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry (Colossians 3:5).

6. Put off all these things: Anger, wrath, malice, blasphemy, filthy communication out of your mouth (Colossians 3:8).

7. Do not take part in the sins of others (1 Timothy 5:22).

8. Keep yourself pure (1 Timothy 5:22).

9. Flee youthful lusts; But follow righteousness, faith, charity [love], peace, with them that call on the Lord out of a pure heart (2 Timothy 2:22).

10. We should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world; Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ (Titus 2:12-13).

11. Take heed, brethren, that there not be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God. But exhort one another daily, while it is called Today; so as to prevent anyone in being hardened through the deceitfulness of sin (Hebrews 3:12-13).

12. Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord (Hebrews 12:14)

13. Rid yourselves of all malice, all deceit, hypocrisy, envy, and all evil speaking (1 Peter 2:1).

14. We should live unto righteousness (1 Peter 2:24).

15. Beware that you be not led away with the error of the wicked, and fall from your own steadfastness (2 Peter 3:17).

16. Remember the words which were spoken before of the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ; How that they told you there should be mockers in the last time, who should walk after their own ungodly lusts. These be they who separate themselves, sensual, having not the Spirit (Jude 1:17-19).

17. Be ye holy; for I am holy. (1 Peter 1:16).

RickReads said:

So now it`s your position that I must find people to condemn? Ridiculous.

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The Lord Jesus says,
“Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment.” (John 7:24).

The apostle Paul says,
“For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within? But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person.” (1 Corinthians 5:12-13).

“But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.” (1 Corinthians 5:11).

RickReads said:

So now it`s your position that I must find people to condemn? Ridiculous.

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It is also not us that condemns but it is God's Word that does so. Jesus says,


This does not sound like what you are talking about in that all we have to do is just believe alone in Jesus and nothing else to be saved. This is why we have to look at the the whole counsel of God's Word. For how do you interpret Matthew 6:15? It does not sound like it fits in with what you believe.

RickReads said:

I don`t ordinarily come out like that unless I`m giving somebody else a pep talk. God expects his people to be humble, but having somebody insinuating I am a sinner all time gets old after awhile.

Among other things, I`m a crippled old man so my sin options are limited. I think Highlighter has quite an imagination.

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So you don't take the standard OSAS interpretation that believers can commit grievous sin (like lying, lusting, hating, etc.) and still be saved?

Do you not interpret Romans 3:10, Romans 3:23, and 1 John 1:8 as referring to how believers in how they must always commit some kind of grievous or serious sin (mortal sin) on some level within their whole life. Do you not believe that believers cannot stop committing grievous sin this side of Heaven?

RickReads said:

You are motivated by self-preservation
because if you don`t do what God wants then he`ll do horrible things to you.

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And why would I believe that? Well, here is...

The Bible’s teaching that serious sin is separation from GOD,

[God said to Adam,]
"But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die." (Genesis 2:17).

[Eve said to the serpent,]
"But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die. (Genesis 3:3).

And the serpent said unto the woman,
"Ye shall not surely die." (Genesis 3:4).

"...she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat. And the eyes of them both were opened, and they knew that they were naked..." (Genesis 3:6-7).

"Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned." (Romans 5:12).

"For the wages of sin is death..." (Romans 6:23).

"But your iniquities have separated between you and your God, and your sins have hid his face from you, that he will not hear." (Isaiah 59:2).

"Now we know that God hears not sinners: but if any man be a worshipper of God, and does his will, him he hears." (John 9:31).

“If I regard iniquity in my heart, the Lord will not hear me:” (Psalms 66:18).

“...whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.”
(Matthew 5:22).

28 “But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.
29 And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.
30 And if thy right hand offend thee, cut it off, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.” (Matthew 5:28-30).

“But whoso committeth adultery with a woman lacketh understanding: he that doeth it destroyeth his own soul.” (Proverbs 6:32).

“But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.” (Matthew 6:15).

“Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.” (Matthew 7:21)

Important Note: If you were to look at 1 Thessalonians 4:3 you would learn that the will of God (i.e. the Father) is to be holy or it is our sanctification; And Hebrews 12:14 says, without holiness no man shall see the Lord.

“22 On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’
23 And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.’” (Matthew 7:22-23 ESV).

“26 And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:
27 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.”
(Matthew 7:26-27).

“15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.
16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?
17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.
18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.” (Matthew 7:15-20).

"For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins." (Hebrews 10:26).

"he that commits sin is of the devil." (1 John 3:8).

"everyone who does evil hates the light." (John 3:20).

"Repent therefore of this thy wickedness, and pray God, if perhaps the thought of thine heart may be forgiven thee." (Acts of the Apostles 8:22).

6 "If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth.
7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin." (1 John 1:6-7).

"He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him." (1 John 2:4).

"Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him." (1 John 3:15).

"He that saith he is in the light, and hateth his brother, is in darkness even until now." (1 John 2:9).

"In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother." (1 John 3:10).

41 "The Son of Man will send his angels, and they will gather out of his kingdom all causes of sin and all law-breakers,
42 and throw them into the fiery furnace. In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
43 Then the righteous will shine like the sun in the kingdom of their Father. He who has ears, let him hear." (Matthew 13:41-43 ESV).


“For by thy words thou shalt be justified, and by thy words thou shalt be condemned.” (Matthew 12:37).

"They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate." (Titus 1:16).

3 "If any man teach otherwise, and consent not to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which is according to godliness;
4 He is proud, knowing nothing,..." (1 Timothy 6:3-4).

"...God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble."
(James 4:6).

21 For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.
22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off." (Romans 11:21-22).

16 "There is a sin unto death..."
17 "...and there is a sin not unto death." (1 John 5:16-17).

"But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death." (Revelation 21:8).

19 "Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication,, lasciviousness,
20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God." (Galatians 5:19-21).

5 "Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affe
ction, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry:
6 For which things' sake the wrath of God cometh on the children of disobedience:
7 In the which ye also walked some time, when ye lived in them." (Colossians 3:5-7).

5 “...God;
6 ...will render to every man according to his deeds:
7 To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:
8 But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath,
9 Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile;
10 But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile:
11 For there is no respect of persons with God.
12 For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law” (Romans 2:5-12).

“But when the righteous turneth away from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, and doeth according to all the abominations that the wicked man doeth, shall he live? All his righteousness that he hath done shall not be mentioned: in his trespass that he hath trespassed, and in his sin that he hath sinned, in them shall he die.” (Ezekiel 18:24).

9 “Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God. “ (1 Corinthians 6:9-10).

“Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.” (James 2:17).

"And cast ye the unprofitable servant into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth." (Matthew 25:30).

“For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.” (Romans 8:13).

RickReads said:

but having somebody insinuating I am a sinner all time gets old after awhile.

Among other things, I`m a crippled old man so my sin options are limited. I think Highlighter has quite an imagination.

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According to what you said, I got the impression that you were for the idea that a believer can sin and still be saved (Which implies that even believers are sinners). For you said, I quote:


Want to talk about OSAS? - Post #877.

So you don't believe by one grievous sin a believer is out of God's kingdom. This means you believe a person can sin and still be saved on some level.

#1. Numbers 35:16-18 says it only takes one act of murder to be a murderer; And Leviticus 20:10 says it only takes one act of adultery to be an adulterer.

#2. Jesus Himself regarded just looking at a woman once as an act of adultery (Matthew 5:28).

#3. John says, "No murderer has eternal life abiding in them." (1 John 3:15).

#4. Proverbs 6:32 says "Whosoever commits adultery with a woman lacks understanding: he that does it destroys his own soul."

#5. Jesus Himself says that just looking at a woman in lust (Which is adultery) is potential for a person to be cast bodily in hell fire (See Matthew 5:28-30).

#6. David needed to confess of his sin in order to be forgiven (See Psalms 51).

#7. 1 John 1:9 says if we confess our sins he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

#8. Revelation 21:8 says, "But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone: which is the second death." Murderers and whoremongers will be cast into the lake of fire. All liars will be cast into the lake of fire. ALL liars, and not just some. NO murderer has eternal life abiding in them (1 John 3:15).

RickReads said:

When a child of God sins the Bible says God will deal with that person. The scripture indicates that all Christians receive this type of correction. Do I believe Christians fall short and still stay saved? Yes I do.


5 And ye have forgotten the exhortation which speaketh unto you as unto children, My son, despise not thou the chastening of the Lord, nor faint when thou art rebuked of him:

6 For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.

7 If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?

8 But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons.

I think your attacks on my character say more about you than they do me.

Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.

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Was George Sodini and Kenneth Nally corrected? Sorry, I am just not buying that correction is for those who believe in Belief Alone-ism because this kind of belief can easily lead people to think that they can sin and still be saved (Whether you want that to happen or not). Many in the Belief Alone Camp hold to the view that they will always commit grievous sin this side of Heaven. Even you have said that you do not believe that committing one sin kicks you out of the Kingdom. Yet, Jesus said if we look upon a woman in lust, we are in danger of hellfire (Matthew 5:28-30). Jesus said if we do not forgive, we will not be forgiven (Matthew 6:15). It sounds like you believe that you have to do these sins a lot in order to be condemned. The Bible does not say that. Yes, there is forgiveness if we do sin. We can confess and forsake sin so as to have mercy (See: Proverbs 28:13, and 1 John 1:9, and 1 John 1:7).

The purpose of correction is to get the person to stop their error. But the Belief Alone Camp believes they will always commit some kind of grievious sin in this life.
For example: A master corrects his dog in pooping on the carpet so as to get the animal to stop pooping on the carpets. So the goal of correction is obedience. In Belief Alone-ism... obedience is just optional and not a requirement as a part of being in God's Kingdom.

RickReads said:

I`ve shared very little about what I believe with you because you aren`t interested in having a real discussion and sharing views. You can`t get past the fact that I believe Jesus is the Savior and you accuse everyone who believes that of being sinful. We can`t get anywhere with you doing that.

For you, the whole gospel revolves around God burning everyone who is imperfect with hellfire.

I don`t see it that way. Really, I`d like you just stop posting messages at me.

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You said in another thread that you don't believe that a person loses salvation via by one sin. So this means you believe that a Christian can sin and still be saved on some level. I asked you if George Sodini and or Kenneth Nally were saved, and you refused to answer. It's very simple. They were not saved because you need to confess and forsake sin in order to have mercy (Proverbs 28:13). You cannot confess and forsake sin when faith is gone. For it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this, the judgment.

RickReads said:

I`ve shared very little about what I believe with you because you aren`t interested in having a real discussion and sharing views. You can`t get past the fact that I believe Jesus is the Savior and you accuse everyone who believes that of being sinful. We can`t get anywhere with you doing that.

For you, the whole gospel revolves around God burning everyone who is imperfect with hellfire.

I don`t see it that way. Really, I`d like you just stop posting messages at me.

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Jesus is the Savior, but not in the way that Belief Alone-ism suggests. Jesus saves in forgiving us our past sins, and He does not give us a license to sin. Jesus also saves us in helping us to overcome grievous or serious sin that the Bible condemns.

“He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.” (1 John 3:8).

For there is nothing that can tranform or changes lives more than Jesus Christ; That is why God's people preach the good news of Jesus Christ so as to be saved by Him. For Jesus has fixed up broken homes (or familes). Jesus has drawn the alcoholic away from the bottle. Jesus has helped the gambler to put down his cards and walk away from the game. Jesus has helped the drug addict from the power of the needle. Jesus has helped the harlot from being a slave to sexual sin and money. For Jesus Christ changes lives. Jesus changed my life and He continues to change lives today (Making them new creations in His image).

"Therefore if any man be in Christ,
he is a new creature: old things are passed away;
behold, all things are become new."
(2 Corinthians 5:17).

RickReads said:

I`m not interested in sharing my thoughts with you about your issues. You are a modern-day lone wolf Pharisee with no followers and no real connections to the Church. People who know me would be shocked by your accusations of me but our purpose is raising up radical, passionate, aggressive lovers of God and people from the next generation who will love deeply, serve sacrificially, speak truthfully, live holy and go globally in the supernatural power and presence of the Holy Spirit – calling all people to confess Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior.

We wouldn`t understand why somebody would want to go around condemning other believers as you do. Jesus reserved his strongest criticism for the
self-righteous of his time.

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Actually, the OP of this thread is about the discussion of the two sides of the coin of faith. I made my case with Scripture, and it is up to you to explain those verses that you disagree with in the OP. The thread is not about me or you. The OP discussion is this: While faith can in context refer to a belief, faith can also refer to obeying the Lord, as well. It's a part of the faith to obey Jesus because faith comes by hearing, and hearing the Word of God (Romans 10:17). That is hearng the words of Jesus. For Jesus told us to do many things. Jesus said, why do you call me, Lord, Lord and do not what I say? (Luke 6:46).

In any event, may the Lord bless you even if we disagree strongly on Scripture.

RickReads said:

Well, obviously I made a mistake when I posted on your thread. It`s a mistake I won`t repeat in
future.

I commented on the fact that you never mention the Holy Spirit in your OP. It`s a critical omission on your part and that`s putting it mildly.

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And this is just another one of your false accusations without you actually reading what I wrote.

For I said in the OP.

So in conclusion:

Faith is like a coin that has two sides to it. The first side of the coin of faith is trusting or believing in God's grace and seeking forgiveness with the Lord Jesus and believing the gospel, and the second side (or other side) of the coin of faith is the “work of faith.” (that is a part of the Sanctification Process of the Holy Spirit that helps us to live a holy life).

“Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord:" (Hebrews 12:14).

“And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;" (Hebrews 5:9).

“For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.” (Romans 8:13).

Source:
See the bottom of: Post #1

To all:

The Bible says that, “…the devils also believe, and tremble.” (James 2:19). So faith that truly matters is not like that of demons. It’s not a belief alone.

James 2:26 says:
“For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.”

Can a dead faith save anyone?
This is why faith and works breath in harmony with each other. They are symbiotic. But many today want to separate the two.

Jesus says a good tree cannot bring forth bad fruit and a good tree cannot bring forth bad fruit (See Matthew 7:18). In other words, one’s faith being the true and real deal is if there is good fruit.

To those who have ears to hear:

Some may make wrong assumptions against what I believe.
However, to make the truth clear to all, I declare that Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life. Jesus is the vine. Jesus is the source of eternal life. If we abide in Christ, then good fruit and not bad fruit will be the result. If we have faith, then we will be faithful. By faith Abraham... obeyed. For Hebrews 11:8 says: “By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance, obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went.” James says, “I will show you my faith by my works.” Why? Because it is the work of God being done through the believer when they believe and or trust in the Lord. It is the proof God lives in a person. The good fruit is proof that the vine (Christ who is life) is in a person. James also says: “Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?” (James 2:22). So works makes a person's faith perfect. We also learn that keeping the Word is whereby the love of God is perfected. For in 1 John 2:5, the apostle John says, “But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him.” Keeping the word is a part of the faith. For faith comes by hearing (obeying) the Word of God (See: Romans 10:17).

I hope this helps.

May the Lord's good ways be upon you all.

With loving kindness to you in Christ.

Sincerely,

BL. Highlighter.