The great commission is false

A_Thinker

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For several reasons, It is my contention that the great commission was meant for the 11 that Jesus was directly addressing and in no way did it extend past the 11.

Pro-active Evangelism should not be the focus of the modern Christian. I am not saying that we shouldnt evangelize, but this evangelism should be a response to inquiry, not a pro-active pursuit. Rather, anyone outside of the 11 who were given the directive are called to focus on living a disciplined, Godly life. A natural outflowing of this pursuit should draw people to us for inquiry, but we arent supposed to seek it out actively.
Matthew 28

16 Then the eleven disciples went to Galilee, to the mountain where Jesus had told them to go. 17 When they saw him, they worshiped him; but some doubted. 18 Then Jesus came to them and said, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. 19 Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.

How could the eleven "make disciples of all nations" ?

And what is the extent on Jesus' promise at the end of verse 20 ... "And lo, I am with you always, ... even until the end of the world." ?

Now, I, for one, am of the opinion ... that the charge of evangelism (i.e. spreading the gospel) ... is upon the Church, rather than being specifically upon christians. Which is why God the Holy Spirit has placed Evangelists within the Church, perhaps beginning with Paul, the great evangelist.

It occurs to me, from my scriptural study, is that it is Paul, alone, of the Apostles ... which takes the particular task of evangelism.

Noone evangelized like Paul, ... who was preaching Christ in the synagogues soon after his conversion. Because of this, there were threats upon Paul's life, ... so much so, that the other disciples had to smuggle him out of town to save his life.

Paul's zeal might be compared with those christians who have been at the forefront of missionary efforts throughout the centuries since the the great commission, ... and who lives have often been forfeit in the efforts.

The christian who is not called specifically to evangelism, likely, has more of the calling to share his/her faith as appropriate ... as did Phillip when he was called to evangelize the Ethiopian eunuch. These are, by nature, particularly personal circumstances, oftentimes one-on-one, where the recipient of the gospel message has been prepared, in some way, to receive that message.

Paul's message to the more typical non-evangelistic christian is to "work quietly" within your respective societies, while holding forth to your calling and identification as a Christ follower.

To balance that, however, Peter calls upon all christians to "always be prepared to give an answer" ... for those who might seek understanding of the reasoning for our belief. According to Christ, we are to be a "light upon a hill", though not necessarily a searchlight, (which peers into the hearts and living of every human creature), ... and salt in our societies. We should be peculiar enough ... to warrant notice by those around us, ... who might be drawn into the faith.

And, we should be like Phillip, ... open to the leading of the Spirit, to witness to that special soul ... to whom the Lord is calling.

Though individual christians are, often, faulted for their lack of participation in the execution of the Church's evangelistic mission, ... I think that, by and large, the mission has been successful, ... to making Christ known worldwide ... and of giving rise to a significant people who visibly call themselves by His name.

I don't so much think that we are called, individually, to knock upon every door around us like the Jehovah's Witnesses, ... but I do believe that we are called to be known as Christ-followers within our respective circles (working, playing, shopping, voting, etc.) ... and to be responsive to those occasions for which our personal witness is appropriate.

I still recall how casually, and yet genuinely, my mother, who was a classic introvert, ... often engaged her periodic grocery shoulder-mates ... with the invitation to seek Christ. Her quiet engagement was personal, and heart-felt, and typically, ... warmly received ...
 
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A_Thinker

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All are called to give a gentle witness. Sometimes you're the only one at the side of a death bed or beside a co-worker in stress and you are the only one with The Answer for that person and the person doesn't even know to ask. And we are not called to let that person slip off into eternal hell and never open our mouths but to say it's not my job..
I agree with your assessment of our call to witness (i.e. to be a witness of Christ to the spiritually dying ...) ... but I think that we should always be aware ... that the power to save lies solely within the hands of God, ... and whether we allow ourselves to be used of God in that arena or not, ... God always accomplishes His will, ... and loses none of those who would come to Him.

Yes, He condescends to use us in His work, ... yet His work is accomplished nontheless ...
 
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Saint Steven

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He’s not correct.

The Church is the light of the world a city on a hill that cannot be hidden.

Matthew 5:14
Seems like you are missing the point. The scripture you quoted proves the topic point, not yours. The topic author is saying that people will be drawn to us (like a city on a hill). A city is stationary, it doesn't go anywhere.
 
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A_Thinker

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“I don’t respect that at all. If you believe that there’s a heaven and hell and people could be going to hell or not getting eternal life or whatever, and you think that it’s not really worth telling them this because it would make it socially awkward, and atheists who think that people shouldn’t proselytize — ‘Just leave me alone, keep your religion to yourself.’

“How much do you have to hate somebody to not proselytize?” Jillette asked. “How much do you have to hate somebody to believe that everlasting life is possible and not tell them that? If I believed beyond a shadow of a doubt that a truck was coming at you and you didn’t believe it, and that truck was bearing down on you, there’s a certain point where I tackle you. And this is more important than that.”

“This guy was a really good guy. He was polite and honest and sane, and he cared enough about me to proselytize and give me a Bible, which had written in it a little note to me — not very personal, but just ‘Liked your show,’ and then listed five phone numbers for him and an e-mail address if I wanted to get in touch,” Jillette said.
The one issue in this anecdote, ... is that Jillette, undoubtably, was already aware of the gospel (hence his accurate recounting of the its benefits), ... yet, he would ascribe hatred ... to every christian who crosses his path ... who doesn't personally share the gospel with him.

Most Americans know the gospel, ... and have made their initial choice, ... which, of course, ... is not to say that God cannot use any one particular of our voices ... to ultimately break the hold that Satan ... or worldliness ... has upon the hearts of individuals. Which may be exactly what's happening in the incident that Jillete describes.

My personal conviction is that ... we are not called individually to evangelize to all (who could live under such a call).

Rather, we are called to witness to those to whom God calls us ... for God knows the state of the hearts of any recipients.

Jesus, Himself, said to "not cast your pearls before swine ... or dogs", ... and to be prepared, at times, to "shake the dust from your feet" and move on to, possibly, greener pastures ...
 
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A_Thinker

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The topic author is saying that people will be drawn to us (like a city on a hill). A city is stationary, it doesn't go anywhere.
True ... our highest objective is, then, ... to keep the light bright and shining ...
 
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Saint Steven

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True ... our highest objective is, then, ... to keep the light bright and shining ...
Right.
In reality the gospel is foolishness to those who are perishing and no one can come unless the Spirit draws them. Therefore beating people over the head with apologetic arguments does more harm than good.
 
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Leaf473

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Wow, great topic!.

The Matthew Version talks about teaching, and I don't think that's for everyone. Not everyone should be a teacher.

I like how Peter puts it
"Always be ready to give an answer to everyone who asks you about the hope you have, with humility and respect."

When we as Christians live with hope and joy, that is when we are the city set on a hill.
 
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A_Thinker

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Right.
In reality the gospel is foolishness to those who are perishing and no one can come unless the Spirit draws them. Therefore beating people over the head with apologetic arguments does more harm than good.
I have come to the understanding that effective evangelism is more about communicating with the HEART, ... rather than the MIND ...
 
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Dave G.

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I agree with your assessment of our call to witness (i.e. to be a witness of Christ to the spiritually dying ...) ... but I think that we should always be aware ... that the power to save lies solely within the hands of God, ... and whether we allow ourselves to be used of God in that arena or not, ... God always accomplishes His will, ... and loses none of those who would come to Him.

Yes, He condescends to use us in His work, ... yet His work is accomplished nontheless ...
He has the power to save indeed, not us.
 
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A_Thinker

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The Matthew Version talks about teaching, and I don't think that's for everyone. Not everyone should be a teacher.
James 3:1, NIV: "Not many of you should become teachers, my fellow believers, because you know that we who teach will be judged more strictly."
 
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Love First

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Seems like you are missing the point. The scripture you quoted proves the topic point, not yours. The topic author is saying that people will be drawn to us (like a city on a hill). A city is stationary, it doesn't go anywhere.

We are not called to be unprofitable servants. If you shine your light you will spread the gospel by the power of the Spirit like a raging fire or a lighthouse. Do you think the Lord Jesus Christ cowered in the shadows and was afraid to share? Every disciple who is perfectly trained shall be as his master. Follow him.
 
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Saint Steven

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I have come to the understanding that effective evangelism is more about communicating with the HEART, ... rather than the MIND ...
Right.
The other aspect is being specifically led by the Spirit. Even Jesus did not act on his own accord, but was instructed by the Father in all he did.

John 8:28 NRSV
So Jesus said, “When you have lifted up the Son of Man, then you will realize that I am he, and that I do nothing on my own, but I speak these things as the Father instructed me.
 
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Saint Steven

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Do you think the Lord Jesus Christ cowered in the shadows and was afraid to share?
Jesus knew enough to wait for a green light.
See post #32

Do you see operating in the flesh as not cowering in the shadows, nor afraid to share?

Peter jumped out of the shadows to cut a man's ear off. Jesus restored the man and rebuked Peter. (John 18:10-11)
 
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A_Thinker

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Sometimes you're the only one at the side of a death bed or beside a co-worker in stress and you are the only one with The Answer for that person and the person doesn't even know to ask.
I, once, walked in upon a work colleague who was, visibly, undergoing distress.

She related to me that her marriage was falling apart, her job was in jeopardy (I knew that it was gone), she was having nightmares about being cut into pieces, ... and she was cutting up her little "blood drive" heart magnets.

I shared the gospel with her, even though she claimed a Buddhist belief, and had, previously, disdained the notion of a heavenly Father ... because of all of the negative circumstances she had had gone through in her life. She certainly seemed to comprehend the understanding of the negative effect of sin, ... and she, simultaneously, seemed to have some hope in the power of LOVE to heal. But, despite that, we parted without me ever knowing the effect of our discussion. I pray that it was a help to her.
 
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Butterball1

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Matthew 28

And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.

How could the eleven "make disciples of all nations" ?

And what is the extent on Jesus' promise at the end of verse 20 ... "And lo, I am with you always, ... even until the end of the world." ?
The fact the Apostles have not, will not live until the end of the world implies that Christ will be with any Christian who participates in carrying out the great commission all through time till the end of the world. Christ is with those today who carry out the great commission as He was with those who carried out the great commission 500 years ago, 1000 years ago, 2000 years ago as He will be with those 500 years from now (if the world still exists) that carry out the great commission. Obviously the great commission was not limited to the Apostles only but is REQUIRED of all Christians through all time till the end of time. If evangelism completely stopped with the Apostles, then no new disciples would be made (per Matthew 28:19-20) and Christianity would have died out probably by the middle of the second century.

Ezekiel 3:18-19 there was an OT principle that if the righteous did not warn the wicked of his iniquities God would require the blood of the wicked at the hand of the righteous....Yet if thou warn the wicked, and he turn not from his wickedness, nor from his wicked way, he shall die in his iniquity; but thou hast delivered thy soul.
Paul echoed this principle in his own evangelism, Acts of the Apostles 18:6; Acts of the Apostles 20:26. Paul would not be held accountable, responsible by God for failing to preach to those people. Their being lost is upon their own heads, Paul did his responsiblity in planting and watering, 1 Corinthians 3:6. Jonah had been given the responsibilty to preach to the wicked of Nineveh and warn them but ran away from that responsibility and was punished. Later he fuflfilled that responsibility given him.

Therefore the great commission has never been just an option for Christians at any time in history, but a requirement till the end of the world. The fact Jesus commanded "go" implies the Christian is to be proactive in carrying it out, not be passive or only when it may be convenient. Paul told young evangelist Timothy "Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine. For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables." Paul is essentially commanding Timothy to preach it when they want to hear it and preach it when they don't want to hear it. Either way, PREACH IT!

Albert Barnes commentary on preaching "out of season":
Out of season - ἀκαίρως akairōs. This word does not elsewhere occur in the New Testament. It is the opposite of the former, and means that a minister is to seek opportunities to preach the gospel even at such periods as might be inconvenient to himself, or when there might be hindrances and embarrassments, or when there was no stated appointment for preaching. He is not to confine himself to the appointed times of worship, or to preach only when it will be perfectly convenient for himself, but he is to have such an interest and earnestness in the work, that it will lead him to do it in the face of embarrassments and discouragements, and whenever he can find an opportunity. A man who is greatly intent on an object will seek every opportunity to promote it. He will not confine himself to stated times and places, but will present it everywhere, and at all times. A man, therefore, who merely confines himself to the stated seasons of preaching the gospel, or who merely preaches when it is convenient to himself, should not consider that he has come up to the requirement of the rule laid down by the apostle. He should preach in his private conversation, and in the intervals of his public labors, at the side of the sick bed, and wherever there is a prospect of doing good to any one. If his heart is full of love to the Saviour and to souls, he cannot help doing this.
 
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Saint Steven

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... But, despite that, we parted without me ever knowing the effect of our discussion. I pray that it was a help to her.
One plants, another waters; God gives the increase.

1 Corinthians 3:6-8 NIV
I planted the seed, Apollos watered it, but God has been making it grow. 7 So neither the one who plants nor the one who waters is anything, but only God, who makes things grow. 8 The one who plants and the one who waters have one purpose, and they will each be rewarded according to their own labor.
 
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Love First

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Jesus knew enough to wait for a green light.
See post #32

Do you see operating in the flesh as not cowering in the shadows, nor afraid to share?

Peter jumped out of the shadows to cut a man's ear off. Jesus restored the man and rebuked Peter. (John 18:10-11)

Did I not say shine your light by the power of the Holy Spirit?
 
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Saint Steven

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Did I not say shine your light by the power of the Holy Spirit?
No, you did not. Hopefully that's what you meant.

Have you ever had a green light experience? (a Spirit-led encounter)
 
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Love First

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No, you did not. Hopefully that's what you meant.

Have you ever had a green light experience? (a Spirit-led encounter)

Maybe you should go back and read what I said.

No, I’ve never had a spiritual experience I’m the abominable snowman.

Have a nice day man.
 
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anti-conformist

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So what you’re trying to say then is that it is the responsibility of the original apostles to make disciples of all nations in this current generation?

no, you missed the pertinent point...pro-active... We should tell people just not proactively pursue evangelism
 
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