The Holy Spirit

fli · May 25, 2021

Matt 10:16 "Behold, I send you out as sheep in the midst of wolves. Therefore be wise as serpents and harmless as doves. 17 But beware of men, for they will deliver you up to councils and scourge you in their synagogues. 18 You will be brought before governors and kings for My sake, as a testimony to them and to the Gentiles. 19 But when they deliver you up, do not worry about how or what you should speak. For it will be given to you in that hour what you should speak; 20 for it is not you who speak, but the Spirit of your Father who speaks in you. NKJV

Matthew 10: 20 the Spirit of the Father would be speaking in the disciples Jesus sent out. This is a statement by Jesus.

Luke 12:11 "Now when they bring you to the synagogues and magistrates and authorities, do not worry about how or what you should answer, or what you should say. 12 For the Holy Spirit will teach you in that very hour what you ought to say." NKJV

Luke states the Holy Spirit would teach the disciples what to say. Therefore; the Spirit of the Father is the Holy Spirit. This is also a statement from Jesus.

John 15:26 "But when the Helper comes, whom I shall send to you from the Father, the Spirit of truth who proceeds from the Father, He will testify of Me. 27 And you also will bear witness, because you have been with Me from the beginning. NKJV

The Helper proceeds from the Father.

John 14:26 But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you. NKJV

The Helper is the Holy Spirit and from John 15 the Helper proceeds from the Father. The Spirit of the Father is the Holy Spirit.

Acts 28:25 So when they did not agree among themselves, they departed after Paul had said one word: "The Holy Spirit spoke rightly through Isaiah the prophet to our fathers, NKJV

The Holy Spirit was in Isaiah the prophet.

1 Peter 1:10 Of this salvation the prophets have inquired and searched carefully, who prophesied of the grace that would come to you, 11 searching what, or what manner of time, the Spirit of Christ who was in them was indicating when He testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ and the glories that would follow. NKJV

The Spirit of Jesus was in the prophets. Therefore the Spirit of Jesus is the Holy Spirit.

Der Alte · May 25, 2021

fli said:
Matt 10:16 "Behold, I send you out as sheep in the midst of wolves. Therefore be wise as serpents and harmless as doves. 17 But beware of men, for they will deliver you up to councils and scourge you in their synagogues. 18 You will be brought before governors and kings for My sake, as a testimony to them and to the Gentiles. 19 But when they deliver you up, do not worry about how or what you should speak. For it will be given to you in that hour what you should speak; 20 for it is not you who speak, but the Spirit of your Father who speaks in you. NKJV
Matthew 10: 20 the Spirit of the Father would be speaking in the disciples Jesus sent out. This is a statement by Jesus.
Luke 12:11 "Now when they bring you to the synagogues and magistrates and authorities, do not worry about how or what you should answer, or what you should say. 12 For the Holy Spirit will teach you in that very hour what you ought to say." NKJV
Luke states the Holy Spirit would teach the disciples what to say. Therefore; the Spirit of the Father is the Holy Spirit. This is also a statement from Jesus.
John 15:26 "But when the Helper comes, whom I shall send to you from the Father, the Spirit of truth who proceeds from the Father, He will testify of Me. 27 And you also will bear witness, because you have been with Me from the beginning. NKJV
The Helper proceeds from the Father.
John 14:26 But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you. NKJV
The Helper is the Holy Spirit and from John 15 the Helper proceeds from the Father. The Spirit of the Father is the Holy Spirit.
Acts 28:25 So when they did not agree among themselves, they departed after Paul had said one word: "The Holy Spirit spoke rightly through Isaiah the prophet to our fathers, NKJV
The Holy Spirit was in Isaiah the prophet.
1 Peter 1:10 Of this salvation the prophets have inquired and searched carefully, who prophesied of the grace that would come to you, 11 searching what, or what manner of time, the Spirit of Christ who was in them was indicating when He testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ and the glories that would follow. NKJV
The Spirit of Jesus was in the prophets. Therefore the Spirit of Jesus is the Holy Spirit.

There is one God! The Holy Spirit is called/referred to as God, in scripture, but the Spirit is not the Father or the Son. Acts of the apostles 5:3-4, Acts of the apostles 28:25-27.
Scripture which identify the Holy Spirit as God

<>Acts of the apostles 5:3 But Peter said, Ananias, why hath Satan filled thine heart to lie to the Holy Ghost, and to keep back part of the price of the land?
4 Whiles it remained, was it not thine own? and after it was sold, was it not in thine own power? why hast thou conceived this thing in thine heart? thou hast not lied unto men, but unto God.

This passage, Act 5:3-4, above, identifies the Holy Spirit as God by equating lying to the H.S. with lying to God.

<>Acts of the apostles 28:25 And when they agreed not among themselves, they departed, after that Paul had spoken one word, Well spake the Holy Ghost by Esaias the prophet unto our fathers,
26 Saying, Go unto this people, and say, Hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and not perceive:
27 For the heart of this people is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes have they closed; lest they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.

This passage Act 28:25-27, above, identifies the Holy Spirit as YHWH by saying the H.S. spoke words which were spoken by YHWH, in Isa 6:8-10, below.

<>Isaiah 6:8 Also I heard the voice of the Lord, [יהוה/YHWH] saying, Whom shall I send, and who will go for us? Then said I, Here am I; send me.
9 And he said, Go, and tell this people, Hear ye indeed, but understand not; and see ye indeed, but perceive not.
10 Make the heart of this people fat, and make their ears heavy, and shut their eyes; lest they see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and understand with their heart, and convert, and be healed
<>Hebrews 10:15 Whereof the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before,
16 This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;
17 And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more. [O.T. see יהוה/YHWH, Jer 31:33-34]

This passage, Heb 10:15-17, above, identifies the Holy Spirit as YHWH by saying words spoken by YHWH, in Jer 31:33-34, below, were spoken by the H.S.

<>Jeremiah 31:33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, [יהוה/YHWH] I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.
34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more
<>Hebrews 3:7 Wherefore (as the Holy Ghost saith, To day if ye will hear his voice,
8 Harden not your hearts, as in the provocation, in the day of temptation in the wilderness:
9 When your fathers tempted me, proved me, and saw my works forty years.
10 Wherefore I was grieved with that generation, and said, They do alway err in their heart; and they have not known my ways. [O.T. יהוה/YHWH, Ps 95:10]
11 So I sware in my wrath, They shall not enter into my rest.) [O.T. יהוה/YHWH, Deu 1:34-35]

This passage, Heb 3:7-11, above, identifies the Holy Spirit as YHWH by saying words spoken by YHWH in Psa 95:10-11, and Deu 1:34-35, below, were spoken by the Holy Spirit.

<>Psalms 95:10 Forty years long was I [יהוה/YHWH vs. 6]grieved with this generation, and said, It is a people that do err in their heart, and they have not known my ways:
11 Unto whom I sware in my wrath that they should not enter into my rest.
<>Deuteronomy 1:34 And the LORD [יהוה/YHWH] heard the voice of your words, and was wroth, and sware, saying,
35 Surely there shall not one of these men of this evil generation see that good land, which I sware to give unto your fathers,

There is one God! The Father, the Son, and the Spirit, all three are called/referred to as God, in scripture, but each has a distinct mind, will, and self; John 16:13, 1 Corinthians 12:11, Philippians 2:5, John 5:26, Romans 8:27, Matthew 26:39, 1 Corinthians 2:16.

Clare73 · May 25, 2021

fli said:
Matt 10:16 "Behold, I send you out as sheep in the midst of wolves. Therefore be wise as serpents and harmless as doves. 17 But beware of men, for they will deliver you up to councils and scourge you in their synagogues. 18 You will be brought before governors and kings for My sake, as a testimony to them and to the Gentiles. 19 But when they deliver you up, do not worry about how or what you should speak. For it will be given to you in that hour what you should speak; 20 for it is not you who speak, but the Spirit of your Father who speaks in you. NKJV

Matthew 10: 20 the Spirit of the Father would be speaking in the disciples Jesus sent out. This is a statement by Jesus.

Luke 12:11 "Now when they bring you to the synagogues and magistrates and authorities, do not worry about how or what you should answer, or what you should say. 12 For the Holy Spirit will teach you in that very hour what you ought to say." NKJV

Luke states the Holy Spirit would teach the disciples what to say. Therefore; the Spirit of the Father is the Holy Spirit. This is also a statement from Jesus.

John 15:26 "But when the Helper comes, whom I shall send to you from the Father, the Spirit of truth who proceeds from the Father, He will testify of Me. 27 And you also will bear witness, because you have been with Me from the beginning. NKJV

The Helper proceeds from the Father.

John 14:26 But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you. NKJV

The Helper is the Holy Spirit and from John 15 the Helper proceeds from the Father. The Spirit of the Father is the Holy Spirit.

Acts 28:25 So when they did not agree among themselves, they departed after Paul had said one word: "The Holy Spirit spoke rightly through Isaiah the prophet to our fathers, NKJV

The Holy Spirit was in Isaiah the prophet.

1 Peter 1:10 Of this salvation the prophets have inquired and searched carefully, who prophesied of the grace that would come to you, 11 searching what, or what manner of time, the Spirit of Christ who was in them was indicating when He testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ and the glories that would follow. NKJV

The Spirit of Jesus was in the prophets. Therefore the Spirit of Jesus is the Holy Spirit.

Yes, and a separate person of the Triune God who is God.

fli · May 25, 2021

Clare73 said:
Yes, and a separate person of the Triune God who is God.

Paul seemed to think that there was a Spirit of Jesus, a Spirit of God and a Spirit of the Father. He used those terms to explain about walking in the Spirit.

Rom 8:9 a But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. b Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His. 10 And if Christ is in you, the body is dead because of sin, but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. 11 But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you. NKJV

Verse 9a Paul writes one is in the Spirit if they have the Spirit of God.

Let's read on. Verse 9b if one does not have the Spirit of Jesus they are not His. Paul states one must have the Spirit of Jesus or they are not saved. Now we have the Spirit of Jesus and the Spirit of God. We have the Spirit of God if we are in the Spirit and to be saved we must have the Spirit of Jesus. Let's read on,

Verse 10 if we have the Spirit of Jesus in us our body is dead but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. We have eternal life because of the Spirit of Jesus who gives us righteousness. Romans 8:3 our flesh is dead because in our flesh we sin without even trying.

Verse 11 If the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus is in us He gives life to our flesh. In Galatians 1:1 Paul clearly states that God the Father raised Jesus. Also in Ephesians 1:20 He raised Him and seated Him at His right Hand. Jesus sits at the right hand of the Father. Now we have the Spirit of God, the Spirit of Jesus and the Spirit of the Father. We have of the Spirit of God (verse 9a) if we are in the Spirit. We are in the Spirit when we are in obedience and walking as the Father wants us to walk. Therefore, the Spirit of God being referred to in verse 9a is the combined Spirits of the Father and Jesus.

In verse 9b the Spirit of Jesus is only in people who belong to Jesus. That Spirit of Jesus is the Holy Spirit of promise spoken of in Ephesians 1: 13. Jesus is the only way into Heaven. Only by being in Jesus do we get adopted. We also with the Spirit of Jesus upon belief also receive the Spirit of the Father. If we did not get the Father's Spirit we would immediately die.

John 15:1-2 the Father is the vine dresser. If we are not walking in the Spirit we are not producing fruit. 1 Corinthians 11: 27-32 He begins to make us sick. If we continue He will withdraw His Spirit from us and we sleep. The Father has taken away our branch from the vine and taken us to heaven.

The Spirit of the Father is the Holy Spirit. Acts 28:25 1Peter 1:11 The Spirit of Jesus is the Holy Spirit.

Clare73 · May 25, 2021

fli said:
Paul seemed to think that there was a Spirit of Jesus, a Spirit of God and a Spirit of the Father. He used those terms to explain about walking in the Spirit.

It is all one and the same Spirit, just as the three divine persons are all one and the same God.

We don't want to put asunder what God has joined.

Rom 8:9 a But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. b Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His. 10 And if Christ is in you, the body is dead because of sin, but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. 11 But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you. NKJV

Verse 9a Paul writes one is in the Spirit if they have the Spirit of God.

Let's read on. Verse 9b if one does not have the Spirit of Jesus they are not His. Paul states one must have the Spirit of Jesus or they are not saved. Now we have the Spirit of Jesus and the Spirit of God. We have the Spirit of God if we are in the Spirit and to be saved we must have the Spirit of Jesus. Let's read on,

Verse 10 if we have the Spirit of Jesus in us our body is dead but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. We have eternal life because of the Spirit of Jesus who gives us righteousness. Romans 8:3 our flesh is dead because in our flesh we sin without even trying.

Verse 11 If the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus is in us He gives life to our flesh. In Galatians 1:1 Paul clearly states that God the Father raised Jesus. Also in Ephesians 1:20 He raised Him and seated Him at His right Hand. Jesus sits at the right hand of the Father. Now we have the Spirit of God, the Spirit of Jesus and the Spirit of the Father. We have of the Spirit of God (verse 9a) if we are in the Spirit. We are in the Spirit when we are in obedience and walking as the Father wants us to walk. Therefore, the Spirit of God being referred to in verse 9a is the combined Spirits of the Father and Jesus.

In verse 9b the Spirit of Jesus is only in people who belong to Jesus. That Spirit of Jesus is the Holy Spirit of promise spoken of in Ephesians 1: 13. Jesus is the only way into Heaven. Only by being in Jesus do we get adopted. We also with the Spirit of Jesus upon belief also receive the Spirit of the Father. If we did not get the Father's Spirit we would immediately die.

John 15:1-2 the Father is the vine dresser. If we are not walking in the Spirit we are not producing fruit. 1 Corinthians 11: 27-32 He begins to make us sick. If we continue He will withdraw His Spirit from us and we sleep. The Father has taken away our branch from the vine and taken us to heaven.

The Spirit of the Father is the Holy Spirit. Acts 28:25 1Peter 1:11 The Spirit of Jesus is the Holy Spirit.

Albion · May 25, 2021

fli said:
The Spirit of Jesus was in the prophets. Therefore the Spirit of Jesus is the Holy Spirit.

FWIW, this website (Christian Forums) bars non-Trinitarians from posting on subforums such as this one which are labelled "Christians only."

fli · May 25, 2021

I cited 2 scriptures that linked the Holy Spirit and the Spirit of Jesus.

Since you have accused me of being non-Christian I will await the moderators verdict.

Albion · May 25, 2021

fli said:
I cited 2 scriptures that linked the Holy Spirit and the Spirit of Jesus.

Since you have accused me of being non-Christian I will await the moderators verdict.

I didn't accuse you of being non-Christian.

What I offered you was a friendly "heads up" about non-Trinitarians not being eligible to post on the "Christians only" subforums. You can read it for yourself in the CF rules.

fli · May 25, 2021

Albion said:
I didn't accuse you of being non-Christian.

What I offered you was a friendly "heads up" about non-Trinitarians not being eligible to post on the "Christians only" subforums. You can read it for yourself in the CF rules.

i appoligize. it sounded like a threat to me. i guess i'm to sensitive.

Presbyterian Continuist · May 26, 2021

It is true that the Holy Spirit has been referred to as the spirit of Christ. This is in harmony with the Holy Spirit's mission, to reveal Christ. When the Holy Spirit speaks to us, it is the same as Christ speaking to us. He will not say anything different to what Christ would say. But the person of Christ is seated beside the Father in heaven, being our advocate, interceding to the Father for us.

disciple Clint · May 26, 2021

fli said:
Paul seemed to think that there was a Spirit of Jesus, a Spirit of God and a Spirit of the Father. He used those terms to explain about walking in the Spirit.

Rom 8:9 a But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. b Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His. 10 And if Christ is in you, the body is dead because of sin, but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. 11 But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you. NKJV

Verse 9a Paul writes one is in the Spirit if they have the Spirit of God.

Let's read on. Verse 9b if one does not have the Spirit of Jesus they are not His. Paul states one must have the Spirit of Jesus or they are not saved. Now we have the Spirit of Jesus and the Spirit of God. We have the Spirit of God if we are in the Spirit and to be saved we must have the Spirit of Jesus. Let's read on,

Verse 10 if we have the Spirit of Jesus in us our body is dead but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. We have eternal life because of the Spirit of Jesus who gives us righteousness. Romans 8:3 our flesh is dead because in our flesh we sin without even trying.

Verse 11 If the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus is in us He gives life to our flesh. In Galatians 1:1 Paul clearly states that God the Father raised Jesus. Also in Ephesians 1:20 He raised Him and seated Him at His right Hand. Jesus sits at the right hand of the Father. Now we have the Spirit of God, the Spirit of Jesus and the Spirit of the Father. We have of the Spirit of God (verse 9a) if we are in the Spirit. We are in the Spirit when we are in obedience and walking as the Father wants us to walk. Therefore, the Spirit of God being referred to in verse 9a is the combined Spirits of the Father and Jesus.

In verse 9b the Spirit of Jesus is only in people who belong to Jesus. That Spirit of Jesus is the Holy Spirit of promise spoken of in Ephesians 1: 13. Jesus is the only way into Heaven. Only by being in Jesus do we get adopted. We also with the Spirit of Jesus upon belief also receive the Spirit of the Father. If we did not get the Father's Spirit we would immediately die.

John 15:1-2 the Father is the vine dresser. If we are not walking in the Spirit we are not producing fruit. 1 Corinthians 11: 27-32 He begins to make us sick. If we continue He will withdraw His Spirit from us and we sleep. The Father has taken away our branch from the vine and taken us to heaven.

The Spirit of the Father is the Holy Spirit. Acts 28:25 1Peter 1:11 The Spirit of Jesus is the Holy Spirit.

are you familiar with the term School Spirit, it does not mean that the school has a spirit of its own.

disciple Clint · May 26, 2021

Oscarr said:
It is true that the Holy Spirit has been referred to as the spirit of Christ. This is in harmony with the Holy Spirit's mission, to reveal Christ. When the Holy Spirit speaks to us, it is the same as Christ speaking to us. He will not say anything different to what Christ would say. But the person of Christ is seated beside the Father in heaven, being our advocate, interceding to the Father for us.

The Trinity shares the same rational mind and will or maybe it would be more accurate to say that the essence of God has one ration mind and will.

Doveaman · May 31, 2021

Clare73 said:
It is all one and the same Spirit, just as the three divine persons are all one and the same God.

We don't want to put asunder what God has joined.

God is Holy and God is Spirit, therefore God is Holy Spirit.
The Father is Holy and the Father is Spirit, therefore the Father is Holy Spirit.
The Son is Holy and the Son is Spirit, therefore the Son is Holy Spirit.
The Holy Spirit is Holy and the Holy Spirit is Spirit, therefore the Holy Spirit is Holy Spirit.

Presbyterian Continuist · May 31, 2021

Doveaman said:
God is Holy and God is Spirit, therefore God is Holy Spirit.
The Father is Holy and the Father is Spirit, therefore the Father is Holy Spirit.
The Son is Holy and the Son is Spirit, therefore the Son is Holy Spirit.
The Holy Spirit is Holy and the Holy Spirit is Spirit, therefore the Holy Spirit is Holy Spirit.

Sounds like a form of Gnostic teaching to me.

Doveaman · May 31, 2021

Oscarr said:
Sounds like a form of Gnostic teaching to me.

Does that mean you disagree, and why?

Presbyterian Continuist · May 31, 2021

Doveaman said:
Does that mean you disagree, and why?

What you appear to be saying is that the Father and the Son are the Holy Spirit. Gnostic teaching involves Jesus just being a spirit with a phantom type of body.

Doveaman · May 31, 2021

Oscarr said:
What you appear to be saying is that the Father and the Son are the Holy Spirit. Gnostic teaching involves Jesus just being a spirit with a phantom type of body.

2 Corinthians 3:17 - “Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom."

Is the Spirit of the Lord the Holy Spirit?

Albion · Jun 1, 2021

Doveaman said:
God is Holy and God is Spirit, therefore God is Holy Spirit.

No, God is therefore holy and a spirit.

The Holy Ghost, who is referred to in Scripture, is the third "person" of the Holy Trinity. And, by the way, this is exactly why changing "Holy Ghost" to "Holy Spirit," which was done a little while ago, was a mistake.

The idea was to clarify the fact that the Holy Ghost is not a spook like we find in stories of hauntings, but a non-physical spirit being.

Unfortunately, aside from the people who were helped by that change, there appear to have been a lot more who, as a result of the change, concluded from the word spirit that it's a synonym for God the Father.

pescador · Jun 1, 2021

Albion said:
No, God is therefore holy and a spirit.

The Holy Ghost, who is referred to in Scripture, is the third "person" of the Holy Trinity. And, by the way, this is exactly why changing "Holy Ghost" to "Holy Spirit," which was done a little while ago, was a mistake.

The idea was to clarify the fact that the Holy Ghost is not a spook like we find in stories of hauntings, but a non-physical spirit being.

Unfortunately, aside from the people who were helped by that change, there appear to have been a lot more who, as a result of the change, concluded from the word spirit that it's a synonym for God the Father.

So you believe in ghosts?

The Holy Spirit is a spirit.

John 4:24, "God is spirit, and the people who worship him must worship in spirit and truth."

John 1:1, "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was fully God."

So there is a Godhead in which all are spirits except for the brief time that Jesus became a person fo a few years.

Doveaman · Jun 1, 2021

Albion said:
No, God is therefore holy and a spirit.

God is therefore a holy spirit. :oldthumbsup:

The Holy Ghost, who is referred to in Scripture, is the third "person" of the Holy Trinity. And, by the way, this is exactly why changing "Holy Ghost" to "Holy Spirit," which was done a little while ago, was a mistake.

Is the Holy Ghost a holy spirit?

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