The history of how Sunday worship came about

prodromos said:

LOL. Projecting much?

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No---and you?

mmksparbud said:

No---God did not make all days Holy. Keeping the Sabbath every day does not make you Holy---it makes you LAZY.

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Esplane me this. . .how does commanded resting (Exodus 31:14-15, Exodus 35:2-3;
Numbers 15:32-36, Jeremiah 17:21-22, Jeremiah 17:27, Exodus 23:3; Deuteronomy 5:14) make you lazy?

For the commandment clearly states we are to work 6 days a week,

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Which does not null spiritual rest from our own works to save and resting in Jesus' finished salvation work which saves.

The OT Sabbath and the promised full-time rest in Canaan were a pre-figure of the NT full-time rest in the finished work of Jesus Christ to atone, as the sacrifices were a prefigure of the atonement itself.

and the 7th day is Holy---God alone decides what is Holy, for He alone can make anything Holy. Sorry, but not even the Pope can do that--he just thinks he can.

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Clare73 said:

Esplane me this. . .how does commanded resting (Exodus 31:14-15, Exodus 35:2-3;
Numbers 15:32-36, Jeremiah 17:21-22, Jeremiah 17:27, Exodus 23:3; Deuteronomy 5:14) make you lazy?
Which does not null spiritual rest from our own works to save and resting in Jesus' finished salvation work which saves.

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The statement made was that every day is Holy and thus a Sabbath day. God said the commandment is to work 6 days and then rest on the 7th day. To rest 7 days a week is what is not holy but lazy and still goes against the commandment to work 6 days a week. And, the word in Genesis 2 in the original Hebrew is "cease". not rest. We are to cease our own work, spend that time in communion with God. God is not interested in our interpretation of things---it's His opinion that matters and He gives it, He leaves obedience to it or not up to us. You want to do things differently?---No problem, just stand in line behind Cain.

2 and~he~will~much~FINISH(V) (וַיְכַל / wai'khal) Elohiym (אֱלֹהִים / e'lo'him) in~the~DAY (בַּיּוֹם / ba'yom) the~SEVENTH (הַשְּׁבִיעִי / hash'vi'i) BUSINESS~him (מְלַאכְתּוֹ / mê'lakh'to) WHICH (אֲשֶׁר / a'sher) he~did~DO(V) (עָשָׂה / a'sah) and~he~will~CEASE(V) (וַיִּשְׁבֹּת / wai'yish'bot) in~the~DAY (בַּיּוֹם / ba'yom) the~SEVENTH (הַשְּׁבִיעִי / hash'vi'i) from~ALL (מִכָּל / mi'kol) BUSINESS~him (מְלַאכְתּוֹ / mê'lakh'to) WHICH (אֲשֶׁר / a'sher) he~did~DO(V) (עָשָׂה / a'sah)

RMT: and Elohiym finished in the seventh day his business which he did, and he ceased in the seventh day from all his business which he did,

Clare73 said:

Which does not null spiritual rest from our own works to save and
resting full-time in Jesus' finished salvation work which saves.

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mmksparbud said:

The statement made was that every day is Holy and thus a Sabbath day. God said the commandment is to work 6 days and then rest on the 7th day. To rest 7 days a week is what is not holy but lazy

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Non-responsive to my point above

and still goes against the commandment to work 6 days a week. And, the word in Genesis 2 in the original Hebrew is "cease". not rest. We are to cease our own work, spend that time in communion with God. God is not interested in our interpretation of things---it's His opinion that matters and He gives it, He leaves obedience to it or not up to us. You want to do things differently?---No problem, just stand in line behind Cain.

2 and~he~will~much~FINISH(V) (וַיְכַל / wai'khal) Elohiym (אֱלֹהִים / e'lo'him) in~the~DAY (בַּיּוֹם / ba'yom) the~SEVENTH (הַשְּׁבִיעִי / hash'vi'i) BUSINESS~him (מְלַאכְתּוֹ / mê'lakh'to) WHICH (אֲשֶׁר / a'sher) he~did~DO(V) (עָשָׂה / a'sah) and~he~will~CEASE(V) (וַיִּשְׁבֹּת / wai'yish'bot) in~the~DAY (בַּיּוֹם / ba'yom) the~SEVENTH (הַשְּׁבִיעִי / hash'vi'i) from~ALL (מִכָּל / mi'kol) BUSINESS~him (מְלַאכְתּוֹ / mê'lakh'to) WHICH (אֲשֶׁר / a'sher) he~did~DO(V) (עָשָׂה / a'sah)

RMT: and Elohiym finished in the seventh day his business which he did, and he ceased in the seventh day from all his business which he did,

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Clare73 said:

Non-responsive to my point above

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Not really. You have your own version of things that is not biblical. God tells us to plant the seeds, that as much as we can do, but I would consider in prayer what has been shared with you between the difference of the commandment to keep holy the seventh day Sabbath found in Exodus 20:8-11 and the rest we receive in Christ for those who obey. God bless

Romans 14
Easy-to-Read Version
Don’t Criticize Others
14 Be willing to accept those who still have doubts about what believers can do. And don’t argue with them about their different ideas. 2 Some people believe they can eat any kind of food,[a] but those who have doubts eat only vegetables. 3 Those who know they can eat any kind of food must not feel that they are better than those who eat only vegetables. And those who eat only vegetables must not decide that those who eat all foods are wrong. God has accepted them. 4 You cannot judge the servants of someone else. Their own master decides if they are doing right or wrong. And the Lord’s servants will be right, because the Lord is able to make them right.

5 Some people might believe that one day is more important than another. And others might believe that every day is the same. Everyone should be sure about their beliefs in their own mind. 6 Those who think one day is more important than other days are doing that for the Lord. And those who eat all kinds of food are doing that for the Lord. Yes, they give thanks to God for that food. And those who refuse to eat some foods do that for the Lord. They also give thanks to God.

Clare73 said:

Working six days a week does not null spiritual rest from our own works to save and resting full-time in Jesus' finished salvation work which saves.

Your counter argument of Scripture requiring six days of physical work does not address the point above.

Non-responsive to my point above.

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imge said:

Not really.

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Perhaps you could show how it addresses the point presented.

Clare73 said:

Esplane me this. . .how does commanded resting (Exodus 31:14-15, Exodus 35:2-3;
Numbers 15:32-36, Jeremiah 17:21-22, Jeremiah 17:27, Exodus 23:3; Deuteronomy 5:14) make you lazy?
Which does not null spiritual rest from our own works to save and resting in Jesus' finished salvation work which saves.

The OT Sabbath and the promised full-time rest in Canaan were a pre-figure of the NT full-time rest in the finished work of Jesus Christ to atone, as the sacrifices were a prefigure of the atonement itself.

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The 7th day Sabbath is the 7th day Sabbath! It prefigures nothing---it is God's Holy day---always was and always will be.
Isa 66:22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain.
Isa 66:23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD.

Daniel Marsh said:

5 Some people might believe that one day is more important than another. And others might believe that every day is the same.

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Some people may believe James 2 - others might not.

Some people may read Is 66:23 where find that for all eternity after the cross in the New Earth "from Sabbath to Sabbath shall all mankind come before me to Worship" - - others may not.

Rom 14 says that "one man observes one day above another (in the list of Bible approved annual holy days of Lev 23) - while another man observes them all.. He who observes the day observes it unto the Lord"

mmksparbud said:

No---God did not make all days Holy. Keeping the Sabbath every day does not make you Holy---it makes you LAZY. .

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As Paul said 2 Thess 3:10 " if anyone is not willing to work, then he is not to eat, either."


Paul condemns observance of even one pagan day -

Gal 4:
8 However at that time, when you did not know God, you were slaves to those which by nature are not gods. 9 But now that you have come to know God, or rather to be known by God, how is it that you turn back again to the weak and worthless elementary principles, to which you want to be enslaved all over again? 10 You meticulously observe days and months and seasons and years. 11 I fear for you, that perhaps I have labored over you in vain.

dqhall said:

You should do good every day of the week, not only on Saturday.

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true.

dqhall said:

Jesus and his disciples were picking grain on the seventh day of the week.

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but not working and not "harvesting" or farming on God's Holy Sabbath.

dqhall said:

Jesus healed on the seventh day of the week,

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And so may we relieve suffering on that day.

thus he was accused of breaking the law, even the decalogue.

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Accroding to the Bible the non-Christian Jews loved to falsely accuse Christ and the disciples - I choose not to join the non-Christian Jews in that effort.

Jesus said, “The Sabbath was made for mannkind, not mankind for the Sabbath" which speaks to the making of Both in Eden in Gen 1:2 - 2:24

klutedavid said:

These are the two commandments that Jesus gave.

1 John 3:23-24
This is His commandment, that we believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, just as He commanded us. The one who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. We know by this that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.

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I see your list does not include "do not take God's name in vain" and "have no other God's before Me" and "Love God with all your heart"... interesting.

Heb 8:6-12 says Jesus gave ALL the commandments at Sinai.

Jesus flat out condemns setting aside the commandments of God in Mark 7:6-12

In Matt 19 Jesus said "KEEP the Commandments" and when specifically asked "which ones" - he quotes from the Law of Moses exclusively

mmksparbud said:

The 7th day Sabbath is the 7th day Sabbath! It prefigures nothing

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Patterns, shadows, types, etc. pefigured spiritual realities of the NT.

A Sabbath Day (day of rest) is a shadow (Colossians 2:16), type, pattern, etc.--as were the sacrifices, feasts, cleansings--of the new order to come in the New Covenant.

---it is God's Holy day---always was and always will be.

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It is God's day of rest from his work of creation.

Christ fulfilled the shadows (Sabbath), patterns (first Adam), types (sacrifices) of the OT.

And they always will be, in Christ.

Clare73 said:

A Sabbath Day (day of rest) is a shadow (Colossians 2:16), type, pattern, etc.--as were the sacrifices, feasts, cleansings, of the new order to come in the New Covenant.

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The annual Sabbaths of Lev 23 were "shadows" pointing forward to Christ, originating at Sinai and not given to mankind in Eden.

By contrast the weekly Sabbath originated in Eden for mankind Mark 2:27, Gen 2:1-3 Ex 20:11 and was not given in the form of animal sacrifice in Eden. It is part of the moral law of God written on the heart under the New Covenant -- see Jer 31:31-34

Bible details so easy to see that Bible scholars on BOTH sides of the Sabbath debate in almost all major Christian denominations agree on that very clear teaching.

Clare73 said:

Patterns, shadows, types, etc. pefigured spiritual realities of the NT.

A Sabbath Day (day of rest) is a shadow (Colossians 2:16), type, pattern, etc.--as were the sacrifices, feasts, cleansings, of the new order to come in the New Covenant.

It is God's day of rest from his work of creation.

Christ fulfilled the shadows (Sabbath), patterns (first Adam), types (sacrifices) of the OT.

And they always will be, in Christ.

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As I said---the Sabbath does not prefigure anything. It is the day that God set aside to worship Him. It not prefigure --it does not point forward--It points back to creation week and the fact that God is the creator of all.

Gen 2:1 Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them.
Gen 2:2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.
Gen 2:3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

Exo 20:8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
Exo 20:9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
Exo 20:10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:
Exo 20:11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

The Sabbath day is not a part of the ceremonial laws. It is a part of the 10 commandments and will still be kept in the new earth as was shown you. It is not crucified with Christ anymore than ANY OF THE OTHER 9 WERE. The 10 were written by God, written on stone, and kept in the Ark, whi9ch is a copy of the heavenly and represents the very throne of God. The ceremonial laws were dictated by God---written by Moses on parchment, and kept outside the Ark. The Sabbath does not point forward to the crucifixion of Christ---never did. No Lamb represents it.
It is the Day of the Lord, the day that He ceased His work of creation, and we are to cease our work, as He did, as Jesus did, for He is the creator of all and it is He that created it, and kept it throughout His life and we are to do as He did.

mmksparbud said:

As I said---the Sabbath does not prefigure anything.

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The NT disagrees with you (Colossians 2:16-17).

BobRyan said:

As Paul said 2 Thess 3:10 " if anyone is not willing to work, then he is not to eat, either."


Paul condemns observance of even one pagan day -

Gal 4:
8 However at that time, when you did not know God, you were slaves to those which by nature are not gods. 9 But now that you have come to know God, or rather to be known by God, how is it that you turn back again to the weak and worthless elementary principles, to which you want to be enslaved all over again? 10 You meticulously observe days and months and seasons and years. 11 I fear for you, that perhaps I have labored over you in vain.

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A good thing none of us observes the Lupercalia or mourns Adonis.

Clare73 said:

The NT disagrees with you (Colossians 2:16-17).

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No it doesn't. Maybe you should re-read the NT because Jesus talks all about the Sabbath throughout the NT. He was even accused of breaking the Sabbath, which He wasn't, so therefore He was keeping it, like He did all of His Fathers commandments and asked us to as well. John 15:10

key word rest

Hebrews 4
Easy-to-Read Version

4 And we still have the promise that God gave those people. That promise is that we can enter his place of rest. So we should be very careful that none of you fails to get that promise. 2 Yes, the good news about it was told to us just as it was to them. But the message they heard did not help them. They heard it but did not accept it with faith. 3 Only we who believe it are able to enter God’s place of rest. As God said,

“I was angry and made a promise:
‘They will never enter my place of rest.’”

But God’s work was finished from the time he made the world. 4 Yes, somewhere in the Scriptures he talked about the seventh day of the week. He said, “So on the seventh day God rested from all his work.” 5 But in the Scripture above God said, “They will never enter my place of rest.”

6 So the opportunity is still there for some to enter and enjoy God’s rest. But those who first heard the good news about it did not enter, because they did not obey. 7 So God planned another special day. It is called “today.” He spoke about that day through David a long time later using the words we quoted before:

“If you hear God’s voice today,
don’t be stubborn.”

8 We know that Joshua did not lead the people into the place of rest that God promised. We know this because God spoke later about another day for rest. 9 This shows that the seventh-day rest for God’s people is still to come. 10 God rested after he finished his work. So everyone who enters God’s place of rest will also have rest from their own work just as God did. 11 So let us try as hard as we can to enter God’s place of rest. We must try hard so that none of us will be lost by following the example of those who refused to obey God.

12 God’s word is alive and working. It is sharper than the sharpest sword and cuts all the way into us. It cuts deep to the place where the soul and the spirit are joined. God’s word cuts to the center of our joints and our bones. It judges the thoughts and feelings in our hearts. 13 Nothing in all the world can be hidden from God. He can clearly see all things. Everything is open before him. And to him we must explain the way we have lived.

Jesus Christ Is Our High Priest
14 We have a great high priest who has gone to live with God in heaven. He is Jesus the Son of God. So let us continue to express our faith in him. 15 Jesus, our high priest, is able to understand our weaknesses. When Jesus lived on earth, he was tempted in every way. He was tempted in the same ways we are tempted, but he never sinned. 16 With Jesus as our high priest, we can feel free to come before God’s throne where there is grace. There we receive mercy and kindness to help us when we need it.

Footnotes

1. Hebrews 4:4 Quote from Gen. 2:2.
2. Hebrews 4:9 seventh-day rest Literally, “Sabbath rest,” meaning a sharing in the rest God began after he created the world.
3. Hebrews 4:12 God’s word God’s teachings and commands.

BobRyan said:

The annual Sabbaths of Lev 23 were "shadows" pointing forward to Christ, originating at Sinai and not given to mankind in Eden.

By contrast the weekly Sabbath originated in Eden for mankind Mark 2:27, Gen 2:1-3 Ex 20:11 and was not given in the form of animal sacrifice in Eden. It is part of the moral law of God written on the heart under the New Covenant -- see Jer 31:31-34

Bible details so easy to see that Bible scholars on BOTH sides of the Sabbath debate in almost all major Christian denominations agree on that very clear teaching.

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All Sabbaths were the same--a day of rest.

God made no distinctions between them, and gave no different regulations for them.