Pain and Sacrifice

SongOnTheWind · May 16, 2021

I didn't know where else to put this, so just move it where it's appropriate if need be

Why did pre-hebraic and exo-hebraic (outside of) religions readily self-inflict pain and sacrifice? I can't wrap my head around offering my child to molech, or volunteering as a virgin to be mutilated and sacrificed. People would readily cut themselves. They would cut others, and kill others.

I know that we who once dwelt in darkness have been brought into God's marvellous light, but did no one in those religions ever question ANY of it? Why was suffering and pain and sacrifice so sacred?

Genuinely trying to understand. Thoughts, anyone? Please feel free to share, however big or small.

honey badger · May 16, 2021

SongOnTheWind said:
I didn't know where else to put this, so just move it where it's appropriate if need be

Why did pre-hebraic and exo-hebraic (outside of) religions readily self-inflict pain and sacrifice? I can't wrap my head around offering my child to molech, or volunteering as a virgin to be mutilated and sacrificed. People would readily cut themselves. They would cut others, and kill others.

I know that we who once dwelt in darkness have been brought into God's marvellous light, but did no one in those religions ever question ANY of it? Why was suffering and pain and sacrifice so sacred?

Genuinely trying to understand. Thoughts, anyone? Please feel free to share, however big or small.

its all of mans reasoning pictured as a bottomless pit we fall into, Cain and Abel and their offerings to God He did not ask for ...

to understand this is to understand that sin is a perception of lack whereby all things become of gain ....

SongOnTheWind · May 16, 2021

I'm sorry, I don't understand. Are you saying that Cain and Abel are to blame for these religions? Is sin simply a perceived phenomenon with no consequence? Please explain.

honey badger · May 16, 2021

SongOnTheWind said:
I'm sorry, I don't understand. Are you saying that Cain and Abel are to blame for these religions? Is sin simply a perceived phenomenon with no consequence? Please explain.

Cain and Abel are Adams two sons/perceptions of himself which are also seen in the eating of a tree bearing two fruits and further depicted in the two seeds (seed of a women and seed of a serpent) our garden/soul/mind is seeded by and the mixing of these two which birth a third part (lukewarm) as a perception of self/truth which carries us or covers/clothes us ...

Adam was naked/uncovered but did not know it until it was revealed to him by his women/soul having come out from his side, understanding this be Gods will ...

If I had not come and spoken to them, they would not have had sin; but now they have no excuse for their sin.

the answering of your question will by no means be revealed in a few posts albeit when you start seeing it you will see it in a single verse ... even in a single word ...

SongOnTheWind · May 16, 2021

Right... I still don't understand how any of this relates to the religions I mentioned, except that those religions were in direct disobedience to God and therefore based upon sin. Cain is not the seed of the serpent, he is one of Adam's sons who made his own choices. Eve was a human being made in the image of God. She was take out of Adam's rib but that doesn't make her his soul. They both had their own souls. If you have some answer to reveal then please don't hold back. Make yourself as clear and understandable as possible, as I'm having a hard time seeing what you're getting at.

Shalom

honey badger · May 16, 2021

SongOnTheWind said:
Right... I still don't understand how any of this relates to the religions I mentioned, except that those religions were in direct disobedience to God and therefore based upon sin. Cain is not the seed of the serpent, he is one of Adam's sons who made his own choices. Eve was a human being made in the image of God. She was take out of Adam's rib but that doesn't make her his soul. They both had their own souls. If you have some answer to reveal then please don't hold back. Make yourself as clear and understandable as possible, as I'm having a hard time seeing what you're getting at.

Shalom

until you put your own reasoning aside ( do not lean on your own understanding ) what i write will sound gibberish to you ...

SongOnTheWind · May 16, 2021

Until you speak plainly, I don't think we can communicate on the subject. Up to you .

Shalom

honey badger · May 16, 2021

SongOnTheWind said:
Until you speak plainly, I don't think we can communicate on the subject. Up to you .

Shalom

the disciples thought Jesus was speaking plainly, but he was still speaking in allegories and so when they said they understood he made joke of it by asking "Now do you believe?

SongOnTheWind · May 16, 2021

Sorry, but you're not Jesus. If you don't want to discuss anything, you don't have to. If you don't have anything to contribute, that's ok too. I don't think that faith was ever a joke to the Lord - in fact, it's written - in His direct Words: "When the Son of Man comes again, will He find faith on the earth?"

This is very far from the subject I wished to discuss. I will wait for genuine interest to take the discourse further.

Be blessed

GospelS · May 16, 2021

SongOnTheWind said:
I didn't know where else to put this, so just move it where it's appropriate if need be

Why did pre-hebraic and exo-hebraic (outside of) religions readily self-inflict pain and sacrifice? I can't wrap my head around offering my child to molech, or volunteering as a virgin to be mutilated and sacrificed. People would readily cut themselves. They would cut others, and kill others.

I know that we who once dwelt in darkness have been brought into God's marvellous light, but did no one in those religions ever question ANY of it? Why was suffering and pain and sacrifice so sacred?

Genuinely trying to understand. Thoughts, anyone? Please feel free to share, however big or small.

I think that's how dangerous sin is. Pagans believe that they ought to offer sacrifices, atone and pain themselves to please their gods so to achieve salvation and redemption of their souls and progress to a higher level of spiritual sense, knowledge, power, and next life. Anyone outside the presence of God and His grace would eventually become like that. Nothing satisfies people that are outside Christ. There is no meaning, purpose, and identity. So they do all kinds of things and in that process, even go to such extremes as taking pleasure in cutting themselves or killing others. It makes them feel they are useful and powerful. The spiritual power of darkness is a real thing and they get to experience that and find it to be the right way. There are still such things being done in today's world among many pagan religions. They become more like satan (beasts) through their sinful blood sacrifices opening themselves to be invaded by evil spirits within just as believers would become more like true Adam (human being) through the power of the precious blood of Christ and Holy Spirit in us.

SongOnTheWind · May 17, 2021

GospelS said:
I think that's how dangerous sin is. Pagans believe that they ought to offer sacrifices, atone and pain themselves to please their gods so to achieve salvation and redemption of their souls and progress to a higher level of spiritual sense, knowledge, power, and next life. Anyone outside the presence of God and His grace would eventually become like that. Nothing satisfies people that are outside Christ. There is no meaning, purpose, and identity. So they do all kinds of things and in that process, even go to such extremes as taking pleasure in cutting themselves or killing others. It makes them feel they are useful and powerful. The spiritual power of darkness is a real thing and they get to experience that and find it to be the right way. There are still such things being done in today's world among many pagan religions. They become more like satan (beasts) through their sinful blood sacrifices opening themselves to be invaded by evil spirits within just as believers would become more like true Adam (human being) through the power of the precious blood of Christ and Holy Spirit in us.

Thank you for your reply

What really irks me is, as you say, they really take pleasure in pain - even their own self-inflicted pain. The bible tells us:
Isaiah 5:20
Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!

Something else has occured to me just now: people who self harm and cut their wrists because of depression. Erotic asphyxiation, and other bsdm stuff. Is this demonic? I even heard that some old pagan practises would be to self-punish by whipping yourself until you bled, or having yourself dragged by a horse til you bled.

Do you think some modern 'normal' practises of today mirror those of old pagan ritual? That society at large just treats it all as psychological or preference, rather than recognising the spiritually dark side of things?

SongOnTheWind · May 18, 2021

SongOnTheWind said:
Thank you for your reply

What really irks me is, as you say, they really take pleasure in pain - even their own self-inflicted pain. The bible tells us:
Isaiah 5:20
Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!

Something else has occured to me just now: people who self harm and cut their wrists because of depression. Erotic asphyxiation, and other bsdm stuff. Is this demonic? I even heard that some old pagan practises would be to self-punish by whipping yourself until you bled, or having yourself dragged by a horse til you bled.

Do you think some modern 'normal' practises of today mirror those of old pagan ritual? That society at large just treats it all as psychological or preference, rather than recognising the spiritually dark side of things?

Please note, I am not attempting to make light of these things. I myself am suffering from depression. although, by God's grace, it has eased in recent years. It would help me to know exactly the battle I'm facing though. Are we merely treating physical symptoms of a spiritual affliction? That was my reasoning behind the above questions. Thank you for your understanding

mindfulzen · Aug 6, 2021

SongOnTheWind said:
Thank you for your reply

What really irks me is, as you say, they really take pleasure in pain - even their own self-inflicted pain. The bible tells us:
Isaiah 5:20
Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!

Something else has occured to me just now: people who self harm and cut their wrists because of depression. Erotic asphyxiation, and other bsdm stuff. Is this demonic? I even heard that some old pagan practises would be to self-punish by whipping yourself until you bled, or having yourself dragged by a horse til you bled.

Do you think some modern 'normal' practises of today mirror those of old pagan ritual? That society at large just treats it all as psychological or preference, rather than recognising the spiritually dark side of things?

I cannot know, only speculate. Selfharm can be done because of evil powers, but I do think it is mostly good people in pain, that want a physical pain to subdue a psychological/spiritual pain. I am pretty sure that there are some followers today, who does fledge themselves in some festivls. And worse. Can only tell you what documentaries have said about it. Enduring physical pain, brings your spiritual focus, so apparently get closer to God. And something about paying for their own sin. Saw a documentary on history or discovery about it. But I do not remember what it was called. I do not want to join that festival, yikes.

SongOnTheWind · Aug 6, 2021

Didn't Roman Catholics used to do this as a form of penance? All kinds of things, really.

Pain and Sacrifice

Well-Known Member

i am

Well-Known Member

i am

Well-Known Member

i am

Well-Known Member

i am

Well-Known Member

A Daughter of Zion Seeking Her Father in Heaven!

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Similar threads