The Gap and The Sumer Creation Myth

RickReads

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What about some of the points I made in post #31, one of them being this?

Genesis 2:23 And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man.

Per what you are proposing this would be meaning after the following.

Genesis 1:27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.


This verse says---male and female created he them. What were females called in Genesis 1:27? They couldn't be called women since they would not have been taken out of man like the one in Genesis 2 was, this assuming your position. If they were not women, what were they then? Since when is an adult female and a woman not one and the same?

I believe Adam was made after the creation of men and women in Genesis 1:27. Further, I believe God was training him to be their King. To answer the question, the females were women.

The point of making Eve from Adams's rib was to make her part of their royal bloodline.
 
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FreeGrace2

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Let's assume for a moment that the creation days are 1000 years in length each. If Adam was created and formed on day 6 of a thousand year day, what if he was created and formed at the beginning of that day, or in the middle of that day? That would mean he would have already lived a thousand years before God even rests on the 7th day, or that he already lived 500 years before God rested on the 7th day if he was created and formed in the middle of day 6.

How then can this have nothing to do with Adam's lifespan since this would have made him 1930 years old when he died if he was created and formed at the beginning of day 6, or he would have been 1430 years old when he died if he was created and formed in the middle of day 6, in this example?

If the creation days only involve 24 hour periods, it wouldn't matter what time of the day on day 6 Adam was created and formed. He would still be 930 years old when he died, which then agrees with Genesis 5 and not contradicts it instead.
Very interesting thoughts! I think the real question is how the number of 930 years was calculated.

Was it from the very day Adam was created, or the very day Adam died spiritually when he ate the fruit?

Since Adam and the woman could have lived a long time BEFORE their rebellion, that would have an effect on how to calculate Adam's life.

Since we don't know how long Adam and the woman lived before their rebellion, I think the 930 years was from the day of their rebellion, beacause that's when their bodies actually began to age and slowly deteriorate.

And all the rest of their progeny tended to live in the 900's of years.

Obviously, we can't prove either way. Just saying.
 
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Well, I think Adam was made on the eighth day not the sixth. So for me, it's not an issue. Certainly, if Adam can be shown to be a sixth-day man then a problem arises.
The Bible plainly states it in Genesis 1. Why do you have a problem with that?

In my opinion both Adam and the resurrection of Christ are 8th-day events. For this reason, I think Sunday to be the appropriate day of worship for the followers of Yeshua.
Sunday isn't the 8th day. It's the FIRST day of the week. And Christians worship on the FIRST day because that is the day that Jesus was resurrected.
 
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FreeGrace2

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I believe Adam was made after the creation of men and women in Genesis 1:27. Further, I believe God was training him to be their King. To answer the question, the females were women.

The point of making Eve from Adams's rib was to make her part of their royal bloodline.
Kinda makes my head spin. :swoon:

Let's consider Scripture:

Acts 17:26 - From one man he made all the nations, that they should inhabit the whole earth; and he marked out their appointed times in history and the boundaries of their lands.

The "one man" here refers to Adam, and humanity came from him. There were no "men and women" before Adam. If you think so, where is your evidence for that?

Then we have more from Paul: Romans 5:12 - 12 Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all people, because all sinned—

Again, these verses prove that Adam was, in fact, the very FIRST HUMAN being on earth and in history.

But I'd like to see your evidence as well.
 
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RickReads

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Kinda makes my head spin. :swoon:

Let's consider Scripture:

Acts 17:26 - From one man he made all the nations, that they should inhabit the whole earth; and he marked out their appointed times in history and the boundaries of their lands.

The "one man" here refers to Adam, and humanity came from him. There were no "men and women" before Adam. If you think so, where is your evidence for that?

Then we have more from Paul: Romans 5:12 - 12 Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all people, because all sinned—

Again, these verses prove that Adam was, in fact, the very FIRST HUMAN being on earth and in history.

But I'd like to see your evidence as well.

To see my evidence you would have to consider such foolishness as science, anthropology, etc.

Noah's family are the only ones recorded to have survived the flood and they were all direct descendants of Adam.

The humans whose ancestors were made before Adam perished in the flood as did most of the animals who predated Adam.
 
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FreeGrace2

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To see my evidence you would have to consider such foolishness as science, anthropology, etc.
So, basically, you are admitting that you aren't very interested in what God's Word says about the human race, huh.

Noah's family are the only ones recorded to have survived the flood and they were all direct descendants of Adam.
So what's your point? Your claim is that Adam came after "men and women". So where is your evidence? I suppose you have evidence from "science, anthropology, etc" to support your claim, even if it is contradicted by God's very Word?

The humans whose ancestors were made before Adam perished in the flood as did most of the animals who predated Adam.
What flood? Are you referring to Noah's flood? Why or how does that flood have anything to do with Adam, who was created WAY before the flood.

Noah came along 9 generations AFTER Adam, if you accept Scripture, which, at this point, I'm not sure you do.

Luke 3-
36 the son of Cainan, the son of Arphaxad, the son of Shem, the son of Noah, the son of Lamech,
37 the son of Methuselah, the son of Enoch, the son of Jared, the son of Mahalalel, the son of Kenan,
38 the son of Enosh, the son of Seth, the son of Adam, the son of God.

Count backwards from Adam and you see 9 generations between Adam and Noah.

But, if you prefer "anthropology"........
 
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We have to take a step back and ask ourselves, “Why do I believe in this?”
List any personal influencing reasons why it sounds better to you to believe in the belief you hold to.

I would encourage Gap Theory Propnents here to challenge your belief by looking at the reasons here that refute a Gap Theory type belief.

What Is the Gap Theory? (The Ruin and Reconstruction Theory?)

Don't just throw these reasons aside as if they need to be ignored or you need to refute them. Actually consider that they may be true and seek out the truth on both sides on this matter and see what makes more sense in God's Word as a whole.

Personally, an Old Earth aligns with more of the secular world that seeks to explain away God. Surely wordly Scientists do not have everything correct when it comes to the age of the Earth. I don't get any clear idea that there is a Gap Theory when I read the Bible. It's not obvious. So if it was really important, then why did God not make it obvious in His Word? What advantage does God have to hide this truth from those who read the Bible plainly?

For example: I do believe God does hide certain truths within His Word, but I believe it is a test on our part in regards to trusting whether He is good or not. Take for example the topic of the Lake of Fire. Will the wicked burn for all eternity for a finite amount of crimes done here on this Earth? Or will the wicked perish, or be destroyed, and be no more, as Scripture says? See, the very character of God and His goodness is on trial here by the kind of beliefs that we hold to about God. I think tradition can be strong, and or sometimes we want the approval of our Pastor or church, etc. and so we just come to accept what they believe (Without really doing the heavy research on our own with God's help).
 
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Why does God have to re-create light again?
Why does God have to re-create the stars again?
Why does God have to divide the light from the darkness if He did that already?
Romans says death came by Adam's sin. Yet, the Gap Theory suggests there was death before Adam.
Something just does not add up.
 
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I remember when I was approached about the Gap Theory. It was from a Christian group who rejected the traditional view of the Trinity. They also did not believe a person can be saved on their deathbed, too. Also, it is a dangerous thing to add to God's Word. To say something happened inbetween verses 1 and 2 when it does not clearly say anything happened there is to fall dangerously close to the warning given to us in Revelation not to add to His Word. I don't want to be under any curses for adding to God's Word. So yeah, I want to steer clear of adding to what His Word says. Now, to say it is may be possible but you are not saying it is hardcore biblical fact, that is one thing. But one needs to make that fact clear. Theories are not what the Word of God says plainly. Show me a verse or passage that clearly teaches the Gap Theory. If you try to do so, you simply will not find one. It's all in the person's imagination.
 
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We have to take a step back and ask ourselves, “Why do I believe in this?”
List any personal influencing reasons why it sounds better to you to believe in the belief you hold to.
The meaning of specific words in the Hebrew PLUS in the NT Greek.

I would encourage Gap Theory Propnents here to challenge your belief by looking at the reasons here that refute a Gap Theory type belief.

What Is the Gap Theory? (The Ruin and Reconstruction Theory?)
OK, I read every point associated with the Gap theory and every point that tried to refute the gap. The difficulty side made a whole lot of assumptions that are not valid.

The list of points FOR a gap are quite legitimate and based on the FACTS of what words mean.

1. "waw" is a conjunction and is used for both "and" and "but". But since the Septuagint translates v.2 as "BUT" we need to understand those 70 translators understood the Hebrew far better than any scholar today.

2. "hayah" I've taken the time to research from biblehub.com how many times the exact for of that word in v.2 occurs in the rest of the OT and how the various translations rendered it. From the difficulty side, #13, said that 'was' is the normal rendering. That is FALSE. Of the 111 times the exact form of 'hayah' occurs, it was translated as "became/become" nearly 60% of the time, while it was rendered as 'was' only 6% of the time.

3. Already noted the Septuagint.

4. tohu wabohu. I did the same with these 2 words. Most of the time they were translated as a uninhabited wasteland or words to that effect.

5,6. no comment

7. "creation vs made". From the "refutation side" point 21 said any distinction between the 2 is not valid. That is flat wrong! The Hebrew barah (create) means to create out of nothing, as in "God SPOKE the world into being". Came from nothing. The Hebrew ash (made) means to create/made out of something, which God did with Adam's physical body. But not his soul. See Gen 1;26,27. In the first verse, God made. In the second verse, God created. Different words. Different meanings.

8. Isa 45:18. This is a HUGE point. If we accept Gen 1:2 as translated, then there is a direct CONTRADICTION with Isa 45:18.

In 1:1,2 we have "God created the earth AND the earth WAS tohu".

But, in Isa 45:18 we have "God did not create the earth tohu". While some translations have "in vain" for 'tohu', the NASB has "a waste place", which fits its uses in the other verses in the OT.

The only way to fix the contradiction is to understand 1:2 as , "but the earth became tohu". And there is strong support for that translation.

9-11. various OT passages. No comment. I haven't studied them.

12. angelic fall. While it's obvious there was, we have no idea how it relates to eareth before God created Adam. So any type of explanation IS a theory.

But what isn't a theory, from the meaning of the Hebrew words, is that there IS a time gap between v.1 and v.2.

15. pre-Adamic people. This would be a theory. The Bible doesn't say.

As for the list of "difficulties":

1. "no mention of creation". Uh, what do they think 1:1 is about then? Of course there is mention of initial creation of the universe.

btw, it was very good that God excluded any information as to HOW the earth BECAME tohu. If He had done that, one can just imagine how many people would have gotten all mixed up with whatever happened, and probably applied God's actions towards fallen angels as legitimate towards people. Angels and humans are apples to oranges. No comparison.

2. "not the historical view". so what? Translators had zero context to translate v.2 properly. But comparing the words in v.2 as rendered elsewhere in the OT, the translators didn't use the MOST COMMON usage for v.2.

3. "Genesis not cryptic". Meaning that God "did not inform us" of any time gap, etc. Yes He did. The very words of v.2 tells us that the earth became tohu.

4. The point was mere assumption.

5. "contrary to Scripture". "no explicit verse about a previous creation". Fact is, there is only ONE initial creation, 1:1 is clear. v.2 tells us about the earth became something it wasn't initially. So everything that follows is a restoration of initial creation, not a new one.

6. 'no direct statement of judgment'. So what? Why does there need to be. Any judgment would have been directly at whoever was being judged, which wasn't humanity. See point 12 above.

7. "no death before sin". Animals could easily have died if fallen angels were on earth before Adam was created. In fact, Ezek 28 says that Lucifer was in "Eden, the Garden of God". After Satan rebelled, who is to say he didn't still have access to earth. We can't say either way. But we still have the Hebrew word meanings.

8. "God made the world very good". OK. That verse refers to the restoration. And God would have made the universe very good as well, 1:1.

12. "too much is made of the Hebrew "waw". No, it's very important, because that word was used both ways; as "and" and as "but". And the 70 Hebrew scholars of the Septuagint rendered it "but". They were better at Hebrew than anyone today.

13. "was or became". They claim the 'normal rendering is was', but I refuted that in point 2 above. Nearly 60% of all uses of that exact same form used in the rest of the OT it was rendered as "became/become".

14. "unformed unfilled" per 'tohu wabohu'. As already shown, most of the time those words are translated as a desolated wasteland or an uninhabited desert/waste place, or words to that effect.

16. "Jesus did not believe in any gap from original creation to Adam", and Mark 10:6 was cited. “But at the beginning of creation God ‘made them male and female.’ My lexicon says this for the word "creation": "properly, ro reduce from a state of disorder and wildness". Hm. Exactly how Gen 1:2 sounds from the proper translation of the key words.

My lexicon refers this word to ‘ktisis’. This Greek word is found under ‘κτίζω’. Under this word we read: “to reduce from a state of wildness and disorder”, from Bagster & Sons lexicon.

Thayer's Greek Lexicon
STRONGS NT 2936: κτίζω

κτίζω: 1 aorist ἔκτισα; perfect passive ἐκτισμαι; 1 aorist passive ἐκτίσθην; the Sept. chiefly for בָּרָא; properly, to make habitable, to people, a place, region, island (Homer, Herodotus, Thucydides, Diodorus, others); hence to found, a city, colony, state, etc.

So from 2 independent Greek lexicon sources, this Greek word for ‘creation’ refers to a creation from a state of disorder and wildness. Or, to make something habitable that wasn’t habitable before.

Kittel’s Theological Dictionary of the New Testament notes that in a long dissertation of κτίζω, that “in the religion of many peoples chaos stands at the beginning of being and becoming”.

The Exegetical Dictionary of the New Testament, by Balz and Schneider Eds. makes notes that “the OT creation narratives are most intelligible within the framework of ancient Near Eastern views, each motif has parallels.

The New International Dictionary of New Testament Theology & Exegesis, by Sylva, notes that κτίζω is used in the the Septuagint for the rebuilding of Jerusalem in Ezra 5:17. It further notes that the word group for κτίζω is used always of divine creation, with 1 exception, in 1 Pet 2:13.

Silva also connects κτίζω with the believer being a new creation. This point is also noted in Kittel’s text. This parallels the restoration of the earth in Gen 1 with regeneration of the believer.

The major mythologies (Greek, Roman and Norse) are all parallel accounts, with the names changed among the 3, which is best explained by understanding that Genesis 6 involved fallen angels contaminating the human race, which led God to destroy it, save 8 people; Noah and his family.

In a similar way, the account of creation from Adam and Eve was passed down among the generations. So the common thread of “chaos” in so many different religions would have come from what Genesis 1:2 actually says in the original, not in how every English translation renders it.

17. Isa 45:18 Already discussed above. Common translation is contradicted by Isa 45:18. The proper translation removes any contradiction.

21. "no distinction between create and made". See 7. above.

22. Ezek 28. "more likely a heavenly place". That is presumption. 13 You were in Eden, the garden of God; Why would there be an Eden, a garden in heaven and also on earth? The obvious fact is that Satan was in the garden of eden even before he rebelled.

23. "time of judgment of angels not specified". Of course not. Why would God mix up history of angels with history of humanity? It would have caused all kinds of confusion and weird religions.

26. "God's failure". Well, let's consider the pre-flood world. Did mankind fail there? Sure did. And God wiped them all out, except 8. How about end times? Does mankind fail there? Sure will. And God will wi;pe them all out too. Except all resurrected and raptured believers. Who will reside for eternity on the new earth.

Just saying.

Don't just throw these reasons aside as if they need to be ignored or you need to refute them.
I ask you to do this with my responses.

Actually consider that they may be true and seek out the truth on both sides on this matter and see what makes more sense in God's Word as a whole.
Fair enough. Been there, done that. Amen.

btw, I was disappointed that Heb 11:3 was not mentioned, which provides more understanding.

"By faith we understand that the universe was formed (katartizo) at God’s command, so that what is seen was not made out of what was visible."

'katartizo' has these meanings:
to adjust thoroughly, unite completely, to prepare, to complete, adjust to fit, to repair, refit, a complete adjustment. The bolded words support a restoration.

Personally, an Old Earth aligns with more of the secular world that seeks to explain away God.
Yes, it seems Ken Hamm of Answers in Genesis and the Creation Museum cannot separate an old earth from evolution. He treats any old earth idea as coming from an evolutionist. Well, he is wrong. While evolution demands an old earth, an old earth does NOT demand evolution. Especially an old earth with a time gap between Gen 1:1 and 1:2.

Surely wordly Scientists do not have everything correct when it comes to the age of the Earth. I don't get any clear idea that there is a Gap Theory when I read the Bible. It's not obvious.
It's not obvious because Gen 1:2 was very poorly translated. And I do not blame the translators. They had nothing to work with, other than v.1. But since God said NOTHING about what occurred between the 2 verses, we only have theories about what might or did occur. However, v.2 stands clear that something DID happen to earth and God katartizo'd it. Excuse my Greek.

So if it was really important, then why did God not make it obvious in His Word?
This is assumption. I claim He did in 1:2. You just have to dig in the original to find it.

What advantage does God have to hide this truth from those who read the Bible plainly?
By avoiding a whole lot of confusion. Can't you imagine the confusion if God revealed all His dealings with the rebel angels? Just imagine all the irrelevant "doctrines" that man would apply to humanity. I'm glad He didn't.
 
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It's not obvious because Gen 1:2 was very poorly translated.

This is at the heart of the problem as to why you don't understand.

Faith comes by hearing the Word of God (Romans 10:17). For 1 Thessalonians 2:13 says, “...when you received the word of God which you heard of us, you received it not as the word of men, but as it is in truth, the word of God, which effectually works also in you that believe.” For any verse or passage in the Bible we do not receive or believe, that seed will not remain in our heart, and the enemy will steal and snatch that word (seed) away from us and it will be as if such a verse or passage does not exist (even though it is written and preserved by God).

The last enemy to be destroyed is death (1 Corinthians 15:26).
God called the creation to be very good in Genesis chapter 1.
How can it be a very good creation if death happened?
The corruption of death would be from sin.
In Revelation 21:4, there will be no more death.
Again, the Gap Theory is purely imaginary. No actual verse teaches this theory.
It's why no actual verse can be quoted that actually teaches it clearly.
There is no verse that says, “And so God destroyed the previous world, and re-created the Earth again in seven days.” It would not be a seven day creation and be unique.
So where there no stars and no light in the previous universe?
Did God say, Let there be Light again?
Did God say, Let there be animals again?
No. Surely not.
That would only be your imagination working overtime.

The Gap Theory was only invented to fit into secular Science's view of an Old Earth. Christians are afraid to be laughed at by the secular world. So believing in a Gap Theory helps to build a bridge with the secular world.
 
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The Gap Theory is false because God says that the Earth is formless and void. So it was not even a sphere yet.

God dividing the light from the darkness in Genesis 1 sounds like a new event happening on the Earth and not a repeat occurence.

Adam's genealogy is traced back to Adam and nobody else in Luke chapter 3.
Sin and death came as a result of Adam and not a previous creation.

Show me in the Bible where sin and death happened before Adam with some kind of previous creation.

I know that nobody can really do that because such a thing does not exist.
 
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Personally, an Old Earth aligns with more of the secular world that seeks to explain away God. Surely wordly Scientists do not have everything correct when it comes to the age of the Earth.

The Gap Theory was only invented to fit into secular Science's view of an Old Earth. Christians are afraid to be laughed at by the secular world. So believing in a Gap Theory helps to build a bridge with the secular world.

The gap between Genesis v.1 and v2 does not automatically mean an old earth. It is an undetermined length of time.

The realisation there is a gap was noted long before evolution proponents. Origen (2nd century) taught a gap as did Jewish rabbis.
 
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BeyondET

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The Nephilim was around after the expels from garden gone before the flood. advance men, which is why Cain built a city and people made all things of bronze and iron and had flutes and harps etc. by the third generation from Adam, Cain's descendants the tent folks and musicians sons of God.

The Nephilim
Gen 1
26 Then God said, “Let Us make man in Our image, after Our likeness, to rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air, over the livestock, and over all the earth itself and every creature that crawls upon it.”

The sons of God
Gen 2
8 And the LORD God planted a garden in Eden, in the east, where He placed the man He had formed.

Gen 5
1 This is the book of the generations of Adam. In the day that God created man, He made him in His own likeness.
 
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BeyondET

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earth was the deep and heavens was the waters. and God was over both, for He wraps Himself in darkness the secret place.

gen 1:2
2 Now the earth was formless and void, and darkness was over the surface of the deep. And the Spirit of God was hovering over the surface of the waters.
 
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This is at the heart of the problem as to why you don't understand.
What, my refutation of the 'difficulties' listed?

Faith comes by hearing the Word of God (Romans 10:17). For 1 Thessalonians 2:13 says, “...when you received the word of God which you heard of us, you received it not as the word of men, but as it is in truth, the word of God, which effectually works also in you that believe.” For any verse or passage in the Bible we do not receive or believe, that seed will not remain in our heart, and the enemy will steal and snatch that word (seed) away from us and it will be as if such a verse or passage does not exist (even though it is written and preserved by God).
You've got to be kidding!! Just because I did the research and found that the actual Hebrew words in 1:2 were different and SOLVED the contradiction with Isa 45:18, you say that I do "not believe" Scripture? Pure fantasy on your part.

The last enemy to be destroyed is death (1 Corinthians 15:26).
That will happen at the GWT judgment in Rev 20:15.

God called the creation to be very good in Genesis chapter 1.
Yes, both original creation and the restoration. Heb 11:3, remember?

How can it be a very good creation if death happened?
Death wasn't part of either the initial creation OR the restoration. All death followed each. Why is that hard to believe?

The corruption of death would be from sin.
Agreed.

In Revelation 21:4, there will be no more death.
Do you understand the time frame of Rev 21? Or not?

Again, the Gap Theory is purely imaginary.
That would be your opinion.

No actual verse teaches this theory.
Gen 1:2 actually does show it. This isn't about teaching, it's simply about the FACTS. If you disagree, then engage yourself and prove where I'm wrong.

I've already done my homework on your list of "difficulties" and noted the flaws.

It's why no actual verse can be quoted that actually teaches it clearly.
Well, if you ignore the related FACTS, sure. In the beginning, God created the heaens and earth, BUT the earth BECAME an UNINHABITED WASTELAND. That's pretty clear if you are fluent in English.

There is no verse that says, “And so God destroyed the previous world, and re-created the Earth again in seven days.”
Well, here's the catch in your opinion. Who said God "destroyed the previous world". I, as an old earther, don't believe that. Instead, it seems more likely that Satan did it after being ejected from heaven in his rebellion.

We already know that he was in Eden before "iniquity was found in him" per Ezek 28:15. Why is that hard to grasp or believe?

It would not be a seven day creation and be unique.
So where there no stars and no light in the previous universe?
I don't know or care. I wasn't there. All I know is what the Bible says.

Did God say, Let there be Light again?
Did God say, Let there be animals again?
No. Surely not.
That would only be your imagination working overtime.
what a laugh. I'm the one who has done his homework and proved that "hayah" is MORE COMMONLY translated as "became/become" in 1:2 by a long shot. Why don't you do some homework and see for yourself? But the YEC all claim that "hayah" is translated as 'was' way more commonly. That is a flat out LIE.

The Gap Theory was only invented to fit into secular Science's view of an Old Earth.
it appears that you didn't even do your homework as to how or when the idea of a time gap appeared.

Called the gap theory, it was first introduced by Dr. Thomas Chalmers, a Presbyterian minister from Edinberg University in 1814, in an attempt to harmonize the geologic data of the day with Scripture. Keep in mind that Charles Darwin was born in 1809, 5 years before Chalmers wrote about a time gap between Gen 1:1 and 1:2! Yet, Answers In Genesis claims that Chalmers imposed “anti-biblical philosophical assumptions onto the geological observations”. In fact, Chalmers was influenced by Charles Lyell, who developed the “geological columns” and age of earth and universe in 1796. Darwin was also influenced by Lyell and wrote Origin of the Species in 1859, some 45 years after Chalmer’s work. So it doesn’t appear that Chalmers was at all influenced by “anti-biblical philosophical assumptions onto geological observations” ie; evolution. He was, on the other hand, influenced by actual geological observations. This is an important clarification.

Christians are afraid to be laughed at by the secular world.
Actually, Christians would have a better stance if they agreed with an old earth and explained a time gap that comes from the Bible. As it is, they ARE laughed at because of the obvious evidence for an old earth.

So believing in a Gap Theory helps to build a bridge with the secular world.
Right! And the opportunity to share what the Bible says about the earth.

As it is now, Christians can't even get their foot in the door with secular scientists. Too much laughing, as you note.

This isn't about being afraid of being laughed at. It's about what the words actually mean.

An old earth doesn't change ANYTHING. No effect on any doctrine, or theology. It's just a fact. And a fact that allows believers to teach these secular (atheist) scientists about the accuracy of God's Word.

They have no answer when shown the facts that point to an old earth from the Bible. As it is, the YEC have no logical or reasonable answer to an old earth.

If more believers paid attention to the Bereans of Acts 17:11, and did some homework, there would be educated believers.

My church had an elective some years ago, a video series by Ken Ham. During discussion following one of the videos the subject of carbon dating came up. It was pointed out that carbon dating is accurate only out to about 10,000 - 15,000 years.

The moderator just shot himself in the foot, or head, I don't know which. Here's why. Most conservative evangelicals believe that Adam was created about 4,000 years ago, give or take. So at the present time, the YEC believe the earth was created about 6,000 years ago. So if that were true, the carbon dating SHOULD show numbers LESS than the limit of its accuracy, but instead, it shows very high numbers of years.

How do you explain that fact?

And you ignored many of the points I made, such as the contradiction between the conventional translation of Gen 1:2 with Isa 45:18.

You've got to face that problem if you want to be taken seriously. And you can forget that lame 'in vain' excuse. The NASB is a formal equivalent translation. And they translated that verse as:

"For thus says the LORD, who created the heavens(He is the God who formed the earth and made it, He established it and did not create it a waste place, but formed it to be inhabited ), "I am the LORD, and there is none else."

From biblehub.com -
Strong's Concordance
tohu: formlessness, confusion, unreality, emptiness
Original Word: תֹּהוּ
Part of Speech: Noun Masculine
Transliteration: tohu
Phonetic Spelling: (to'-hoo)
Definition: formlessness, confusion, unreality, emptiness
NAS Exhaustive Concordance
Word Origin
from an unused word
Definition
formlessness, confusion, unreality, emptiness
NASB Translation
chaos (1), confusion (1), desolation (1), emptiness (1), empty space (1), formless (2), futile (2), futile things (1), meaningless (2), meaningless arguments (1), nothing (2), waste (3), waste place (2).
 
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The Gap Theory is false because God says that the Earth is formless and void. So it was not even a sphere yet.
Glad to know you were there and noticed. lol Go to biblehub.com and SEE FOR YOURSELF what "tohu" means.

God dividing the light from the darkness in Genesis 1 sounds like a new event happening on the Earth and not a repeat occurence.
Who said it had happened before? Is that your imagination running again?

Adam's genealogy is traced back to Adam and nobody else in Luke chapter 3.
Because Adam is the FIRST human.

Sin and death came as a result of Adam and not a previous creation.
Speaking of the human race only. And naturally. However, Satan was the FIRST SINNER, hands down. But you are not willing to think rationally.

Show me in the Bible where sin and death happened before Adam with some kind of previous creation.
Show me in the Bible where the earth is said to be as young as Adam.

I know that nobody can really do that because such a thing does not exist.
Duh.
 
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