What exactly are the standards?

disciple Clint

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It's not so black and white as that, actually.

Some white people do use the N word, ... but if they use it publicly (i.e. outside of their niche), there will likely be consequences.

Black people may also use the N word, and will also face the consequence of their usage of it. The word is rarely used publicly, except in extremely niche commercial ventures. Black people can get into serious (life or death) trouble for using the word to offend their hearers, ... otoh, if its use is intimate ... and not for offense, ... then it can be acceptable to some hearers.

I dare say most of American blacks don't use the word, and its usage is certainly frowned upon socially. Though, once again, there is a small niche of the black population which will use the word (in their social settings) for street cred.

The N word is used, by those blacks who use it non-offensively, as a way to take some of the sting out of the word by taking some control over its usage.

For reasons of personal circumstance, non-blacks cannot claim to use the word in any of these more non-offensive ways. Their usage of it will publicly (i.e. outside of their own circle), will almost always be seen as being offensive, ... and consequences for its use may have to be faced.

It's really not a situation where some may use the word ... and some may not, but that ALL must be prepared to face the social (or personal) cost ... of using the word.
My experience is slightly different than yours, when I am with a group of black youths I hear the N word repeatedly used by them. I also hear it in the music that is popular with them.
 
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A_Thinker

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My experience is slightly different than yours, when I am with a group of black youths I hear the N word repeatedly used by them. I also hear it in the music that is popular with them.
Perhaps you missed my qualifications here ...

" The word is rarely used publicly, except in extremely niche commercial ventures."

... and here ...

" ... there is a small niche of the black population which will use the word (in their social settings) for street cred.

Also, the N word is used, by those blacks who use it non-offensively, as a way to take some of the sting out of the word by taking some control over its usage."
 
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disciple Clint

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Perhaps you missed my qualifications here ...

" The word is rarely used publicly, except in extremely niche commercial ventures."

... and here ...

" ... there is a small niche of the black population which will use the word (in their social settings) for street cred.

Also, the N word is used, by those blacks who use it non-offensively, as a way to take some of the sting out of the word by taking some control over its usage."
I think your concept of a small niche of the black population and my concept of a small niche are vastly different. AND what you have posted and what I have observed are directly related to the question of how a 14 year old girl is supposed to know that she should not use the N word when talking to her black friend that she by the way considered a close friend at one time.
 
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A_Thinker

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I think your concept of a small niche of the black population and my concept of a small niche are vastly different. AND what you have posted and what I have observed are directly related to the question of how a 14 year old girl is supposed to know that she should not use the N word when talking to her black friend that she by the way considered a close friend at one time.
People are (sometimes) held accountable for their words. That was a lesson I had learned by age 14.

There were certain words which, if used by me at home, in school, and even in some private settings, ... would consistently result in me having to face the consequences for their use. (Probably, the house next-door had a slightly different set of words which were similarly off-limits.)

This young lady either failed to learn, ... and/or is in the process of learning, that lesson.
 
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essentialsaltes

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how a 14 year old girl is supposed to know that she should not use the N word

I would say from her parents. But I know in many homes the parents may also use the N word from time to time. My step-father said, 'That's just how I was brought up.'
 
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Ana the Ist

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Perhaps you missed my qualifications here ...

" The word is rarely used publicly, except in extremely niche commercial ventures."

... and here ...

" ... there is a small niche of the black population which will use the word (in their social settings) for street cred.

Also, the N word is used, by those blacks who use it non-offensively, as a way to take some of the sting out of the word by taking some control over its usage."

Actually, it's also used in the black community as a derogatory and demeaning term....you know, a lot.
 
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A_Thinker

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Actually, it's also used in the black community as a derogatory and demeaning term....you know, a lot.
So ... you live in the black community ?

I've lived in black communities for 62 years ... and I, rarely, hear it used.

Now, there are places I could choose to go ... where I would be more apt to hear the word, but then, there are white communities that I could go to ... where, if they didn't know a black was around, they would be using the word in a demeaning way.

Heck, there are some white communities that I know of where, if I was the only black around, I would likely hear that word used against me. (It just so happens that I live in a rather large urban enclave, ... which is surrounded by counties where the Klan once reigned supreme).

Even blacks who might choose to use the word are careful about using it derogatorily, ... unless they are ready to fight ... and the majority of blacks, simply, aren't in to all of that ...
 
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Ana the Ist

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So ... you live in the black community ?

I've lived in black communities for 62 years ... and I, rarely, hear it used.

Remarkable.

Well I spent many a formative year in and around Akron OH. I wouldn't be able to accurately count the number of times I heard one black person tell another, in anger,

"Expletive you (insert racially derogatory term we're talking about)".

Thousands of times? Hundreds of thousands of times?

But maybe you're talking about a very different black community.
 
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A_Thinker

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Remarkable.

Well I spent many a formative year in and around Akron OH. I wouldn't be able to accurately count the number of times I heard one black person tell another, in anger,

"Expletive you (insert racially derogatory term we're talking about)".

Thousands of times? Hundreds of thousands of times?

But maybe you're talking about a very different black community.
I was definitely raised away from such extremes of American society. The families I grew up around (and chose to live my around, subsequently) were hard-working black families who placed more value on making our way in the world ... than getting into some noisy cat-fight on the city streets.

P.S. I'm sure Akron has a majority of people who are pursuing a similar type of life ...
 
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SummerMadness

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So ... you live in the black community ?

I've lived in black communities for 62 years ... and I, rarely, hear it used.

Now, there are places I could choose to go ... where I would be more apt to hear the word, but then, there are white communities that I could go to ... where, if they didn't know a black was around, they would be using the word in a demeaning way.

Heck, there are some white communities that I know of where, if I was the only black around, I would likely hear that word used against me. (It just so happens that I live in a rather large urban enclave, ... which is surrounded by counties where the Klan once reigned supreme).

Even blacks who might choose to use the word are careful about using it derogatorily, ... unless they are ready to fight ... and the majority of blacks, simply, aren't in to all of that ...
Same here, I often wonder what black community these people are talking about because what I see is very different. It's quite diverse, with different levels of education and an array of backgrounds. I rarely heard the N word used in my nearly 4 decades.
 
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Ana the Ist

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I was definitely raised away from such extremes of American society. The families I grew up around (and chose to live my around, subsequently) were hard-working black families who placed more value on making our way in the world ... than getting into some noisy cat-fight on the city streets.

P.S. I'm sure Akron has a majority of people who are pursuing a similar type of life ...

Ok...I'm all for not stereotyping. We all have different experiences and I'm certainly not trying to discount yours.

But let's not pretend that the black community "took ownership" of the word and it's only something positive now.

That's not true.
 
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Ana the Ist

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Same here, I often wonder what black community these people are talking about because what I see is very different. It's quite diverse, with different levels of education and an array of backgrounds. I rarely heard the N word used in my nearly 4 decades.

Again, remarkable.

Because I remember times it was used 4 times in the same sentence.
 
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A_Thinker

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Ok...I'm all for not stereotyping. We all have different experiences and I'm certainly not trying to discount yours.

But let's not pretend that the black community "took ownership" of the word and it's only something positive now.

That's not true.
You know, quite often ... more than one thing is true, especially when you're dealing with a diverse population.

And there was a movement in some segments of the black community ... to take some of the sting out of the word, ... by using it in a non-derogatory and non-demeaning way. My decision was to avoid the usage altogether, but I respect that the effort did have some good effect. Of course, such doesn't mitigate what derogatory and demeaning usage there is ...
 
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Bradskii

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Again, remarkable.

Because I remember times it was used 4 times in the same sentence.

Obviously a film with Samuel L Jackson in it.

I won't link to any examples, but back in the '70's there were albums released by two UK comedians Peter Cook and Dudley Moore under the name of Derek and Clive. Which simply comprised the two of them chatting. Using the worst possible language you can imagine. It was almost an excercise in seeing what they could get away with. The shock value was off the scale (Google/Youtube them at your peril).

And a friend and I were talking about them a few years ago while having a beer. I don't see him that often but when we do meet up we sometimes slip into Derek and Clive mode (sotto voce) and try and outdo each other by how disgustingly obscene and non pc we can be. And we are in paroxysms of laughter. We're like a couple of kids telling dirty jokes. Make of that what you will...
 
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Ana the Ist

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Obviously a film with Samuel L Jackson in it.

I won't link to any examples, but back in the '70's there were albums released by two UK comedians Peter Cook and Dudley Moore under the name of Derek and Clive. Which simply comprised the two of them chatting. Using the worst possible language you can imagine. It was almost an excercise in seeing what they could get away with. The shock value was off the scale (Google/Youtube them at your peril).

And a friend and I were talking about them a few years ago while having a beer. I don't see him that often but when we do meet up we sometimes slip into Derek and Clive mode (sotto voce) and try and outdo each other by how disgustingly obscene and non pc we can be. And we are in paroxysms of laughter. We're like a couple of kids telling dirty jokes. Make of that what you will...

You're regular people...but I'm pretty sure you're using paroxysms wrong.
 
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