Gentiles aren't now & never were,under Mosaic law

BrotherJJ · May 4, 2021

Kenny'sID said:
As to the question you said you answered, I didn't know I asked one and still not sue what you are talking about?

On your other questions, be more clear...please.. Give the simple condensed question and I'll reply with the simple answer.

I ask you again.

Is the NT body of Christ under this law commandment? And it's penalty for non-compliance?

4) Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. Six days you shall labor and do all your work, but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates. For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it.

Numbers 15:32 a man gathered sticks on the sabbath day. Vs 33, he's brought before Moses, Aaron & all the congregation. Vs 34, he's locked up until they seek God's council. Vs 35, the Lord say's STONE him to DEATH. Vs 36, the CONGREGATION STONED him to DEATH as commanded by Lord & Moses.

pescador · May 4, 2021

BrotherJJ said:
I ask you again.

Is the NT body of Christ under this law commandment? And it's penalty for non-compliance?

4) Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. Six days you shall labor and do all your work, but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates. For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it.

Numbers 15:32 a man gathered sticks on the sabbath day. Vs 33, he's brought before Moses, Aaron & all the congregation. Vs 34, he's locked up until they seek God's council. Vs 35, the Lord say's STONE him to DEATH. Vs 36, the CONGREGATION STONED him to DEATH as commanded by Lord & Moses.

No. The body of Christ is not under law but under God's grace. Period.

Antinomian · May 4, 2021

BrotherJJ said:
(NOTE: These gentiles heard about Christ's sin payment & resurrection. They believed: NO repentance, water baptism, circumcision, they brought no sin sacrifice to the Temple, No Mosaic law keeping etc. Thru faith & faith alone they were eternally sealed with God's indwelling Holy Spirit)

Dear BrotherJJ,
I've actually done a deep dive study into the relationship between the Mosaic Law and the Gentiles and I've come down soundly on your side of the argument. In fact, I created a little website and posted a 23 pg. article specifically proving your main point; namely, the Gentiles, saved or lost, are not now nor ever have been placed under the burden of keeping the OT Mosaic law. I also prove that the Mosaic Law was a quid pro quo (something for something) contract exclusively between the children of Israel and God. I believe you'll enjoy reading my brief study titled, "A Practical Look at the Law". You can download a pdf copy from this link.

Practical Look at the Law

That was my seminal study and you'll need to read it first. If per chance you enjoy reading it, the study of the law compelled me immediately to write A Brief Survey of Ephesians and it's actually far more exciting than the study on the law but they build on each other so be sure to read the law study first. You can download that Ephesians study here:

Brief Survey of Ephesians

Searching for Truth / Liberty Pursuit!

BrotherJJ · May 4, 2021

Amplified Bible
Eph 2:15 by abolishing in His [own crucified] flesh the hostility caused by the Law with its commandments contained in ordinances [which He satisfied]; so that in Himself He might make the two into one new man, thereby establishing peace.
Bible Gateway passage: Ephesians 2 - Amplified Bible
(MY NOTE: Jesus sin atoning death & resurrection: ABOLISHED sins condemnation/judgments administered thru ordinances commanded in the old now OBSOLETE [Heb 8:13] Mosaic law covenant)

Col 2:
13 When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your flesh (worldliness, manner of life), God made you alive together with Christ, having [freely] forgiven us all our sins
Bible Gateway passage: Colossians 2 - Amplified Bible
(MY NOTE: At conversion/salvation Christ placed His Holy Spirit in you, simultaneously, He forgave all your sins Past-Present-Future & imputed His Righteousness onto you. Whereby you are now the righteousness of God in Christ (2 Cor 5:21)

14 having canceled out the certificate of debt consisting of legal demands [which were in force] against us and which were hostile to us. And this certificate He has set aside and completely removed by nailing it to the cross.
Bible Gateway passage: Colossians 2 - Amplified Bible
(MY NOTE: By canceling/Removing ALL your sin debt owed/administered in Mosaic law ordinances. The Mosaic laws power to collect is now mute. No sin = No debt owed. Faith in Jesus death & resurrection paid ALL your sin debt owed.)

Jn 1:17 17 For the Law was given through Moses, but grace [the unearned, undeserved favor of God] and truth came through Jesus Christ.
Bible Gateway passage: John 1 - Amplified Bible
(MY NOTE: Grace = our undeserved/unworked for favor/blessing from God. Is accessed through our faith placed in Christ's sin atoning death & resurrection)

Rom 2:14 (A) When Gentiles, who do not have the Law [since it was given only to Jews]
Bible Gateway passage: Romans 2 - Amplified Bible
(MY NOTE: Gentiles aren't & never were under Mosaic covenant law ordinances)

Rom 6:14 For sin will no longer be a master over you, since you are not under Law [as slaves], but under [unmerited] grace [as recipients of God’s favor and mercy].
Bible Gateway passage: Romans 6 - Amplified Bible
(MY NOTE: Written to believers Rom 1:7. Believer's you're NOT under Mosaic law punishment ordinances!)

Rom 4:15 For the Law results in [God’s] wrath [against sin], but where there is no law, there is no violation [of it either].
Bible Gateway passage: Romans 4 - Amplified Bible
(MY NOTE: Once our Lord/God/Redeemer/Savior REMOVES our sin. We are NOT GUILTY of any law transgression)

Rom 7:6 But now we have been released from the Law and its penalty, having died [through Christ] to that by which we were held captive, so that we serve [God] in the newness of the Spirit and not in the oldness of the letter [of the Law].
Bible Gateway passage: Romans 7 - Amplified Bible
(MY NOTE: RELEASED! From sins condemnation/judgments administered thru ordinances commanded in the old now OBSOLETE [Heb 8:13] Mosaic law covenant)

Rom 8:1 Therefore there is now no condemnation [no guilty verdict, no punishment] for those who are in Christ Jesus [who believe in Him as personal Lord and Savior].
Bible Gateway passage: Romans 8 - Amplified Bible
(MY NOTE: Believers ALL you're sins have been PARDONED!)

All praise & thanks to our Lord/God & Savior Jesus the Christ! For FULFILLING heavens required law payment for sin. And ABOLISHING death & condemnation administrated in the old OBSOLETE [Heb 8:13] Mosaic law covenant.

At Calvary Jesus PAID all the believers sin debt owed. Faith placed in in Jesus sin atoning death & resurrection forgives ALL our sins Past-Present-Future, redeeming us from death & separation from our heavenly Father. And giving us His promise/guarantee of eternal life in His Holy Presents. AMEN & Amen!!

Jonaitis · May 4, 2021

I agree with the title of this thread. The Mosaic Law was primarily focused on the tenure of the land of Canaan for the people of Israel. However, it contained certain moral truths that preexisted the covenant that it remains an obligations of all nations to obey (ex. decalogue).

Soyeong · May 4, 2021

pescador said:
No. The body of Christ is not under law but under God's grace. Period.

While it is true that we are not under the law, but under grace, the law that Paul describes us as not being under was a law where sin had dominion over us, which does not describe the law of God, but the law of sin. In Psalms 119:29, David wanted God to be gracious to him by teaching him to obey the Mosaic Law, so that is what it means to be under grace. Likewise, in Exodus 33:13, Moses wanted God to be gracious to him by showing him His ways, and God's laws show us His ways (Deuteronomy 10:12-13).

Soyeong · May 4, 2021

Jonaitis said:
I agree with the title of this thread. The Mosaic Law was primarily focused on the tenure of the land of Canaan for the people of Israel. However, it contained certain moral truths that preexisted the covenant that it remains an obligations of all nations to obey (ex. decalogue).

By what standard do you use to determine which of God's laws contain moral truths and which laws are moral to disobey?

Soyeong · May 4, 2021

BrotherJJ said:
I ask you again.

Is the NT body of Christ under this law commandment? And it's penalty for non-compliance?

4) Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. Six days you shall labor and do all your work, but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates. For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it.

Numbers 15:32 a man gathered sticks on the sabbath day. Vs 33, he's brought before Moses, Aaron & all the congregation. Vs 34, he's locked up until they seek God's council. Vs 35, the Lord say's STONE him to DEATH. Vs 36, the CONGREGATION STONED him to DEATH as commanded by Lord & Moses.

Jesus gave himself to pay the penalty for our sins, so it would be unjust the enforce a penalty that has already been paid. Still the fact that God considers breaking the Sabbath to be worthy of the death penalty and the fact that Jesus gave himself to pay that penalty should make us want to go and sin no more by l living in obedience to God's law.

Jonaitis · May 4, 2021

Soyeong said:
By what standard do you use to determine which of God's laws contain moral truths and which laws are moral to disobey?

The same standard by which all men are convicted of God's existence (Romans 1:18-23).

There are two kinds of laws: natural and positive. The first is revealed by the light of nature in what we call general revelation, that which is known in the world (murder, theft, adultery, etc). The second is not common to all men, and must be known by special revelation (do not eat the forbidden fruit, circumcise your males, etc). Positive laws are generally established within a covenant relationship between God and a particular group, such as Israel, that aren't required or naturally known to others. This would include the law of Eden, where Adam was commanded to not eat the forbidden fruit. This was a commandment revealed in a special manner to Adam that would not have been known naturally, and often such positive commands lead to a reward within that covenant agreement. In every covenant agreement, however, contains morality. The natural laws are required by all men, regardless of their covenant relationship with God. They are affixed to every covenant God makes with men, including the Mosaic (which made it evident in writing as a reminder to a morally corrupt people).

Soyeong · May 4, 2021

Jonaitis said:
The same standard by which all men are convicted of God's existence (Romans 1:18-23).

There are two kinds of laws: natural and positive. The first is revealed by the light of nature in what we call general revelation, that which is known in the world (murder, theft, adultery, etc). The second is not common to all men, and must be known by special revelation (do not eat the forbidden fruit, circumcise your males, etc). Positive laws are generally established within a covenant relationship between God and a particular group, such as Israel, that aren't required or naturally known to others. This would include the law of Eden, where Adam was commanded to not eat the forbidden fruit. This was a commandment revealed in a special manner to Adam that would not have been known naturally, and often such positive commands lead to a reward within that covenant agreement. In every covenant agreement, however, contains morality. The natural laws are required by all men, regardless of their covenant relationship with God. They are affixed to every covenant God makes with men, including the Mosaic (which made it evident in writing as a reminder to a morally corrupt people).

When you say that every covenant contains morality, are you saying that for the people in that covenant it is immoral to break any of the laws of that covenant, or are you saying that each covenant contains natural laws and only those natural laws are immoral to disobey, while it is not immoral to disobey everything else? Was it only immoral for Adam to eat of the tree because only he was given the special revelation to not to eat of the tree, but not immoral for Eve to do so? Do laws that are given by special revelation teach us how to do what is godly, truth, or about aspects of God's attributes or divine nature, or about how to know God?

Jonaitis · May 4, 2021

Soyeong said:
When you say that every covenant contains morality, are you saying that for the people in that covenant it is immoral to break any of the laws of that covenant, or are you saying that each covenant contains natural laws and only those natural laws are immoral to disobey, while it is not immoral to disobey everything else? Was it only immoral for Adam to eat of the tree because only he was given the special revelation to not to eat of the tree, but not immoral for Eve to do so? Do laws that are given by special revelation teach us how to do what is godly, truth, or about aspects of God's attributes or divine nature, or about how to know God?

A positive law becomes just as authoritative as a natural law within that covenant community, because God commands obedience to it. If broken, it is a sin, but only to members of that covenant. So while it was a sin for Jews to eat pork, because it was commanded by God, it was not so for the rest of the world. Israel was punished according to their own covenant law.

In terms of special revelation, they reveal more about God and his will than nature would to a heathen. While natural/general revelation may speak of God as an all-powerful, all-wise and all-good Creator, and that he punishes offenses committed against him, it could not reveal that faith in Jesus Christ will save them from eternal damnation. This must be preached to people, because it is not naturally known. In part, this is why paganism is flawed in terms of religion, yet they are not without religion.

Soyeong · May 5, 2021

Antinomian said:
Dear BrotherJJ,
I've actually done a deep dive study into the relationship between the Mosaic Law and the Gentiles and I've come down soundly on your side of the argument. In fact, I created a little website and posted a 23 pg. article specifically proving your main point; namely, the Gentiles, saved or lost, are not now nor ever have been placed under the burden of keeping the OT Mosaic law. I also prove that the Mosaic Law was a quid pro quo (something for something) contract exclusively between the children of Israel and God. I believe you'll enjoy reading my brief study titled, "A Practical Look at the Law". You can download a pdf copy from this link.

Practical Look at the Law

Hello,

The way to testify about God's nature is straightforwardly based on God's nature, not on any particular covenant, and God's nature is eternal, so any instructions that God has ever given for how to testify about His nature are eternally valid regardless of which covenant we are under. God is not a respecter of persons, so we can take the way that God has acted or what He commanded as precedent for how God will act or for how we should act in the same situation. God only commanded Adam not to eat of the tree, but Eve was in the same situation, so she understood that she was also forbidden to eat of the tree. Some situations are more unique than others, but if two people are in the same situation, then God's nature being eternal and unchanging should leads us to expect consistency. If God were to make a covenant with one group of people were it was righteous to help the poor and a covenant with another group of people where it was righteous to take advantage of the poor, then God's nature would not be eternal. The command that God has given to other people to help the poor teaches us something true about God's eternal nature, so we shouldn't need God to directly give us that command in order for us to know that it is something that we ought to do. We ought to live in a way that testifies about God's nature, so while it is good to understand whom a law was given to, it is not good to focus on that so much that we lose sight of what that law teaches us about the nature of Whom it was given by.

God's ways are all aspects of His nature and testify about God's nature through walking in His ways is the way to know God. In Genesis 18:19, God knew Abraham that he may command His children and those of His household to guard the way of the Lord by doing righteousness and justice, so that the Lord may bring to Abraham what He has promised him, namely that through His offspring all of the nations of the earth would be blessed. In Exodus 33:13, Moses said that if he found grace in God's eyes to teach him His ways that he might know Him, and Israel too. In Psalms 119:29-30, David wanted to put false ways far from Him, for God to be gracious to him by teaching Him to obey His law, and to choose the way of faithfulness, so God's law is something that they wanted God to teach them and it has always been an economy of grace and faith, not works-based. In Psalms 119:1, blessed are those who walk in the way of the Lord, so the children of Abraham could have been gracious to someone by doing something to bless them for a day, but if they really wanted to be gracious to someone, then they could teach them how to be blessed for a lifetime by teaching them how to walk in the way of the Lord. The Mosaic Law was how the children of Abraham knew how to be blessed for a life time and there are many verses that describe is as being instructions for how to walk in God's ways, such as Deuteronomy 10:12-13, Isaiah 2:2-3, Joshua 22:5, Psalms 103:7, and many others, so the fulfillment of the promise made to Abraham was for them to bless the nations by teaching them to turn from their wicked ways and how to walk in God's ways by obeying the Mosaic Law, which has its ultimate fulfillment in Christ, who is the way, who set a sinless example for us to follow of how to walk in obedience to the Mosaic Law, and who was sent to bless us by turning us from our wicked ways (Acts 3:25-26).

God's nature is eternal, so God's laws for how to testify about His nature are eternal, which means that they existed prior to when they were given to Moses, and there are many examples of God's laws being followed prior to Sinai. In Genesis 39:9, Joseph knew that it was a sin to commit adultery, which was long before the Mosaic Covenant was made. In Genesis 4:7, God told Cain that sin was crouching at the door and that he must master it, which implies that he already knew what sin is and must have been given laws in that regard. In Genesis 26:3-5 God said that he would establish the promise he made to Abraham that in his offspring all of the nations would be blessed because he heard God's voice and kept His charge, His commandments, His statutes, and His laws.

In Romans 2:12-14, only doers of the Mosaic Law will be justified and believing Gentiles will by nature do what is requires, so this supports Gentiles being obligated to obey it. Gentiles didn't have the law because Jews were in change of copying and maintaining Torah scrolls, but if you own a copy of the Bible, then you have the law, and you can read it for yourself. Perishing without the law is not a preferable alternative to being judged by it.

God chose Israel for the purpose of being a light and a blessing to the nations, so there isn't much sense in the nations rejecting the light and the blessing of God's word because it was given to Israel for the purpose of teaching it to them instead of being directly given to them. In Jeremiah 31:31-33, the New Covenant was only made to the house of Judah and the house of Israel and it involves following God's law, so be careful about what you want to insist was exclusively only for Israel. In Ephesians 2:19, everything in verse 12 is no longer true in that Gentiles are no longer strangers or aliens, but are now fellow citizens of Israel along with the saints in the household of God. In 1 Peter 2:9-10, Gentiles are included as part of God's chosen people, a holy nation, a royal priesthood, and a treasure of God's own possession, which are terms used to describe Israel (Deuteronomy 7:6), so Gentiles also have the delight of getting to obey the laws that God gave for how to fulfill those roles. It is only through faith in Christ that Gentiles are able to become joined with Israel, partake of the New Covenant, and submit to God's law. David said repeatedly throughout the Psalms that he loved the Mosaic Law and delighted in obeying it, so if you consider the Psalms to be Scripture and to therefore express a correct view of the Mosaic Law, then you will share it, as Paul did (Romans 7:22), and if you don't see it as something that you should want God to be gracious to you by giving you the gift of teaching you how obey it, then you have fundamentally misunderstood it.

Indeed, nothing good can come without acknowledging the truth and the Mosaic Law is truth (Psalms 119:142). In John 8:31-36, it is sin in transgression of God's law that puts us in bondage, while it is the truth that sets us free, so you are proclaiming bondage, not liberty. It is contradictory for someone to think that they are not under God's law and have no obligation to refrain from what it reveals to be sin, while also thinking that they don't have the freedom to sin and that they need salvation from sin.

In Exodus 12:38, there was a mixed multitude that went up with them out of Egypt, so there were Gentiles as the foot of Sinai. In Joshua 8:33, Israel was inclusive of both the foreigner and the native born, so there have always been righteous Gentiles who after affiliated themselves with the God of Israel, who have sought by faith to turn from their wicked ways and to learn how to walk in God's ways. The Greek word "ekklesia" is translated as "church" and is used in Acts 7:37 and many times in the Septuagint to refer to Israel in the wilderness, so it has always referred to the assembly of God's chosen people. In Acts 15:16-17, they saw themselves as the restoration of Israel in fulfillment of prophecy, not as a brand new entity.

Exodus 19:6 has been fulfilled and Israel did renegotiate the terms (Exodus 20:19).

Unbelievers are obligated to repent from doing what God's law reveals to be sin even though they aren't under the New Covenant, so there is nothing about not being under the Mosaic Covenant that means that we aren't obligated to repent from doing what God's law reveals to be sin. The law has been given, so it is no longer the case that there is no law, but now you have ready access to it. In 1 Corinthians 6:9-11, Paul clearly does not consider everything to be lawful, but rather the Corinthians considering everything to be lawful was a major problem that he was writing that letter to correct.

(Responded up to 4-What is the purpose of the law?)

BrotherJJ · May 5, 2021

Jesus sinless God blood (1 Tim 3:16), eternally (Heb 13:20) FULFILLED heavens required sin payment/DEATH. Right here Jesus mission is completed. He Finished the work (Jn 19:28) He was sent to accomplish (Lk 19:10). He FILFILLED the laws sin payment requirement!

The only way to remove the sin stain from a soul. Is faith placed in Jesus finished/Law Fulfilling sin atoning/propitiatory sacrifice & resurrection.

Beyond that how this sacrificial atonement retired/abolished the need for OT daily temple sacrifices. In addition nullifyed sins punitive requirements imposed by now also adolished OT Mosais laws.

Amplified Bible
Eph 2:15 by abolishing in His [own crucified] flesh the hostility caused by the Law with its commandments contained in ordinances [which He satisfied]; so that in Himself He might make the two into one new man, thereby establishing peace.
Bible Gateway passage: Ephesians 2 - Amplified Bible
(MY NOTE: Jesus sin atoning death & resurrection: ABOLISHED sins condemnation/judgments administered thru ordinances commanded in the old now OBSOLETE [Heb 8:13] Mosaic law covenant)

Col 2:
13 When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your flesh (worldliness, manner of life), God made you alive together with Christ, having [freely] forgiven us all our sins
Bible Gateway passage: Colossians 2 - Amplified Bible
(MY NOTE: At conversion/salvation Christ placed His Holy Spirit in you, simultaneously, He forgave all your sins Past-Present-Future & imputed His Righteousness onto you. Whereby you are now the righteousness of God in Christ (2 Cor 5:21)

14 having canceled out the certificate of debt consisting of legal demands [which were in force] against us and which were hostile to us. And this certificate He has set aside and completely removed by nailing it to the cross.
Bible Gateway passage: Colossians 2 - Amplified Bible
(MY NOTE: By canceling/Removing ALL your sin debt owed/administered in Mosaic law ordinances. The Mosaic laws power to collect is now mute. No sin = No debt owed. Faith in Jesus death & resurrection paid ALL your sin debt owed.)

Soyeong · May 5, 2021

BrotherJJ said:
Jesus sinless God blood (1 Tim 3:16), eternally (Heb 13:20) FULFILLED heavens required sin payment/DEATH. Right here Jesus mission is completed. He Finished the work (Jn 19:28) He was sent to accomplish (Lk 19:10). He FILFILLED the laws sin payment requirement!

The only way to remove the sin stain from a soul. Is faith placed in Jesus finished/Law Fulfilling sin atoning/propitiatory sacrifice & resurrection.

Beyond that how this sacrificial atonement retired/abolished the need for OT daily temple sacrifices. In addition nullifyed sins punitive requirements imposed by now also adolished OT Mosais laws.

Amplified Bible
Eph 2:15 by abolishing in His [own crucified] flesh the hostility caused by the Law with its commandments contained in ordinances [which He satisfied]; so that in Himself He might make the two into one new man, thereby establishing peace.
Bible Gateway passage: Ephesians 2 - Amplified Bible
(MY NOTE: Jesus sin atoning death & resurrection: ABOLISHED sins condemnation/judgments administered thru ordinances commanded in the old now OBSOLETE [Heb 8:13] Mosaic law covenant)

Col 2:
13 When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your flesh (worldliness, manner of life), God made you alive together with Christ, having [freely] forgiven us all our sins
Bible Gateway passage: Colossians 2 - Amplified Bible
(MY NOTE: At conversion/salvation Christ placed His Holy Spirit in you, simultaneously, He forgave all your sins Past-Present-Future & imputed His Righteousness onto you. Whereby you are now the righteousness of God in Christ (2 Cor 5:21)

14 having canceled out the certificate of debt consisting of legal demands [which were in force] against us and which were hostile to us. And this certificate He has set aside and completely removed by nailing it to the cross.
Bible Gateway passage: Colossians 2 - Amplified Bible
(MY NOTE: By canceling/Removing ALL your sin debt owed/administered in Mosaic law ordinances. The Mosaic laws power to collect is now mute. No sin = No debt owed. Faith in Jesus death & resurrection paid ALL your sin debt owed.)

Jesus specifically said that he came not to abolish the law in contrast with saying that he came to fulfill it and with warning against relaxing the least part of it or teaching others to do the same, so you should not interpret fulfilling the law as abolishing it.

BrotherJJ · May 5, 2021

Adam, mankind's patriarch sinned/transgressed against a soveriegn Creator's law.

1 Jn 3:4 Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

Rom 6:23 [A] the wages of sin is death

Rom 5:18 Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.
(MY NOTE: Adam's sin placed all his offspring/mankind under the death sentence)

Rom 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

Heavens required payment to purge/remove sin is blood:

Lev 17:11 For the life of the flesh is in the blood, and I have given it to you on the altar to make atonement for your souls; for it is the blood that makes atonement, by reason of the life [which it represents]
(MY NOTE: This verse is referring to OT Levitical law animal sacrifice atonement, innocent blood covering for sins of the guilty.)

Heb 9:22 In fact under the Law almost everything is cleansed with blood, and without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness [neither release from sin and its guilt, nor cancellation of the merited punishment].
(MY NOTE: This verse refers to Christ's NT once for all time sin atoning sacrifice that forever removes sins of the guilty)

KJV Dictionary Definition: PROPITIATION.
2. In theology, the atonement or atoning sacrifice offered to God to assuage his wrath and render him propitious to sinners. Christ is the propitiation for the sins of men. Rom.3. 1 John 2.
PROPITIABLE - Definition from the KJV Dictionary
(MY NOTE: Propitiation = an atoning sacrifice & Christ is that sacrifice for the sins of men).

1 Jn 4:10 In this is love, not that we loved God, but that He loved us and sent His Son to be the propitiation [that is, the atoning sacrifice, and the satisfying offering] for our sins [fulfilling God’s requirement for justice against sin and placating His wrath].
Bible Gateway passage: 1 John 4 - Amplified Bible
(MY NOTE: Faith in Christ's sin atoning sacrifice frees us from God's wrath enacted via Deut 28:16-60)

Matt 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
(MY NOTE: Jesus said He was sent to fulfill heavens law.)

At Calvary Jesus sin atoning LAW FULFILLING mission is completed. He Finished the work (Jn 19:28) He was sent to accomplish (Lk 19:10). Jesus sinless God blood (1 Tim 3:16), eternally (Heb 13:20) paid in full & FULFILLED heavens required sin payment/DEATH.

The only way to remove the sin stain from a soul:
Is faith placed in Jesus Law Fulfilling propitiatory atoning sacrifice. Found in Jesus death (sins required wage PAID) burial (proof Jesus died) & resurrection (Father's receipt, sins required payment, received & accepted)

When Jesus died the Temple veil was torn in 1/2 (Matt 27:51) It's here the old covenant Levitical priesthood & punitive sin judgments imposed by Mosaic laws, are both rendered obsolete (Heb 8:13). Every believer in Christ's sin atoning sacrifice & resurrection is under grace not law.

Col 2:14 having canceled out the certificate of debt consisting of legal demands [which were in force] against us and which were hostile to us. And this certificate He has set aside and completely removed by nailing it to the cross.
Bible Gateway passage: Colossians 2 - Amplified Bible
(MY NOTE: By canceling/Removing ALL your sin debt owed/administered in Mosaic law ordinances. The Mosaic laws power to collect is now mute. No sin = No debt owed. Faith in Jesus death & resurrection paid ALL your sin debt owed.)

The strength of the law & death is sin (1 Cor 15:56).

Faith in Christ's once for all time (Heb 10:12) sin atoning sacrifice REMOVES all the believers sins, Past-Present-Future! Once your sins are removed, there in NO transgression of the law.

Jn 1:29 The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.

Rev 1:5 And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,

All praise, glory & honor belong to our Lord/God & Savior, Jesus the Christ! AMEN & Amen.

pescador · May 6, 2021

BrotherJJ said:
Adam, mankind's patriarch sinned/transgressed against a soveriegn Creator's law.

1 Jn 3:4 Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

Rom 6:23 [A] the wages of sin is death

Rom 5:18 Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.
(MY NOTE: Adam's sin placed all his offspring/mankind under the death sentence)

Rom 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

Heavens required payment to purge/remove sin is blood:

Lev 17:11 For the life of the flesh is in the blood, and I have given it to you on the altar to make atonement for your souls; for it is the blood that makes atonement, by reason of the life [which it represents]
(MY NOTE: This verse is referring to OT Levitical law animal sacrifice atonement, innocent blood covering for sins of the guilty.)

Heb 9:22 In fact under the Law almost everything is cleansed with blood, and without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness [neither release from sin and its guilt, nor cancellation of the merited punishment].

(MY NOTE: This verse refers to Christ's NT once for all time sin atoning sacrifice that forever removes sins of the guilty)

KJV Dictionary Definition: PROPITIATION.
2. In theology, the atonement or atoning sacrifice offered to God to assuage his wrath and render him propitious to sinners. Christ is the propitiation for the sins of men. Rom.3. 1 John 2.
PROPITIABLE - Definition from the KJV Dictionary
(MY NOTE: Propitiation = an atoning sacrifice & Christ is that sacrifice for the sins of men).

1 Jn 4:10 In this is love, not that we loved God, but that He loved us and sent His Son to be the propitiation [that is, the atoning sacrifice, and the satisfying offering] for our sins [fulfilling God’s requirement for justice against sin and placating His wrath].
Bible Gateway passage: 1 John 4 - Amplified Bible
(MY NOTE: Faith in Christ's sin atoning sacrifice frees us from God's wrath enacted via Deut 28:16-60)

Matt 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
(MY NOTE: Jesus said He was sent to fulfill heavens law.)

At Calvary Jesus sin atoning LAW FULFILLING mission is completed. He Finished the work (Jn 19:28) He was sent to accomplish (Lk 19:10). Jesus sinless God blood (1 Tim 3:16), eternally (Heb 13:20) paid in full & FULFILLED heavens required sin payment/DEATH.

The only way to remove the sin stain from a soul:
Is faith placed in Jesus Law Fulfilling propitiatory atoning sacrifice. Found in Jesus death (sins required wage PAID) burial (proof Jesus died) & resurrection (Father's receipt, sins required payment, received & accepted)

When Jesus died the Temple veil was torn in 1/2 (Matt 27:51) It's here the old covenant Levitical priesthood & punitive sin judgments imposed by Mosaic laws, are both rendered obsolete (Heb 8:13). Every believer in Christ's sin atoning sacrifice & resurrection is under grace not law.

Col 2:14 having canceled out the certificate of debt consisting of legal demands [which were in force] against us and which were hostile to us. And this certificate He has set aside and completely removed by nailing it to the cross.
Bible Gateway passage: Colossians 2 - Amplified Bible
(MY NOTE: By canceling/Removing ALL your sin debt owed/administered in Mosaic law ordinances. The Mosaic laws power to collect is now mute. No sin = No debt owed. Faith in Jesus death & resurrection paid ALL your sin debt owed.)

The strength of the law & death is sin (1 Cor 15:56).

Faith in Christ's once for all time (Heb 10:12) sin atoning sacrifice REMOVES all the believers sins, Past-Present-Future! Once your sins are removed, there in NO transgression of the law.

Jn 1:29 The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.

Rev 1:5 And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,

All praise, glory & honor belong to our Lord/God & Savior, Jesus the Christ! AMEN & Amen.

Chopping up Scripture into a verse from one "book", a verse from another "book", a verse from yet another "book", etc. from both the Old and New Testaments doesn't prove anything. Any doctrine, including the worst heresies, can be "proven" by carving up the Bible into separate, disconnected, out-of-context verses.

Exodus 10:26b, "For we must take these animals to serve the Lord our God". Take them from whom?

Deuteronomy 17:12, "The person who pays no attention to the priest currently serving the Lord your God there, or to the judge—that person must die, so that you may purge evil from Israel." So if you ignore a priest you must die.

Deuteronomy 29:18b, "beware that there is among you no root producing poisonous and bitter fruit". So, meat and veggies only...

1 Kings 5:4, "But now the Lord my God has made me secure on all fronts; there is no adversary or dangerous threat." So, Satan doesn't exist.

2 Kings 1:3c, "‘You must think there is no God in Israel!"

And those out-of-context verses are from just the first few books of the Bible. See how easy it is to make the Bible say what you want it to say instead of what it actually says?

As my signature below states, Eisegesis is the process of interpreting text in such a way as to introduce one's own presuppositions, agendas or biases. It is commonly referred to as reading into the text.

2BeholdHisGlory · May 6, 2021

Paul created the context in Romans 10:1-21 using a bunch of verses from various books
Excluding his "interjections" Paul starts in Leviticus 18:5 Then he turns to Deuteronomy 30:12-14 (uses two verses there). Next he goes into Isaiah 28:16 and then immediately turns to Joel 2:32. After that he returns to Isaiah but not the same chapter in Isaiah 52:7 then he skips up to Isaiah 53:1 Paul then turns to Psalms 19:4 and then reaches back once more into Deuteronomy 32:21 then returns to Isaiah for the fourth time (but again, not the same chapter) Isaiah 65:1-2 (two verses here)

Folks might give Paul some heck over how he observes the kind of context we might insist upon. You can do it correctly Paul shows that is possible to do so with the Holy Spirit.

Soyeong · May 6, 2021

pescador said:
Chopping up Scripture into a verse from one "book", a verse from another "book", a verse from yet another "book", etc. from both the Old and New Testaments doesn't prove anything. Any doctrine, including the worst heresies, can be "proven" by carving up the Bible into separate, disconnected, out-of-context verses.

Exodus 10:26b, "For we must take these animals to serve the Lord our God". Take them from whom?

Deuteronomy 17:12, "The person who pays no attention to the priest currently serving the Lord your God there, or to the judge—that person must die, so that you may purge evil from Israel." So if you ignore a priest you must die.

Deuteronomy 29:18b, "beware that there is among you no root producing poisonous and bitter fruit". So, meat and veggies only...

1 Kings 5:4, "But now the Lord my God has made me secure on all fronts; there is no adversary or dangerous threat." So, Satan doesn't exist.

2 Kings 1:3c, "‘You must think there is no God in Israel!"

And those out-of-context verses are from just the first few books of the Bible. See how easy it is to make the Bible say what you want it to say instead of what it actually says?

As my signature below states, Eisegesis is the process of interpreting text in such a way as to introduce one's own presuppositions, agendas or biases. It is commonly referred to as reading into the text.

The fact that you can deliberately take verses from different locations out of context does not give you justification to assume that every instance of quoting verses from different locations is taking them out of context. Finding support from multiple locations that speak about the same topic is a sound hermetical practice and is certainly better than someone basing their position off of a single verse that has no support from the rest of the Bible. This is from an article that speaks about the difference between eisegesis and exegesis:

"EXEGESIS
First, the interpreter reads the passage and, to fully understand the context, he reads the histories of both Uzziah and Jotham (2 Chronicles 26-27; 2 Kings 15:1-6, 32-38). In his observation, he discovers that King Uzziah was a good king who nevertheless disobeyed the Lord when he went to the temple and offered incense on the altar—something only a priest had the right to do (2 Chronicles 26:16-20). Uzziah’s pride and his contamination of the temple resulted in his having “leprosy until the day he died” (2 Chronicles 26:21).

Needing to know why Uzziah spent the rest of his life in isolation, the interpreter studies Leviticus 13:46 and does some research on leprosy. Then he compares the use of illness as a punishment in other passages, such as 2 Kings 5:27; 2 Chronicles 16:12; and 21:12-15."

If you don't want to believe me, then you can look up other examples of articles that speak about the difference for yourself.

JohnBankai · Aug 21, 2021

Matthew 7:21-23
21Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. 22Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? 23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Who is Jesus talking to here? To me it sounds like he is talking to Christians. These Christians say didn't we proclaim you and do all these works in your name and his reply is no your not a Christian cause you work of iniquity. What's iniquity?

Gross immorality or injustice; wickedness.
n. A grossly immoral act; a sin.
n. Lack of equity; gross injustice; unrighteousness; wickedness

If you keep committing the same sin over and over and never change and then just proclaim Jesus forgives all sin isn't this false. I understand how I am saved but now that I am saved how do I live in this world. The Lord tells me to be on this world not from it. I must be separate so how do I live separate if I don't follow the laws he said is sin. I am truly asking. I am a brother who reads and the more I read the more I feel we suppose to not look like the world. We not suppose to talk like the world. I am not claiming the law saves me. Jesus saves me. Now that I am saved and blessed with the holy spirit shouldn't I walk as he walked. With the power of the holy spirit isn't it possible to walk like him.

1John 2:3-6
3And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments. 4He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 5But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him. 6He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked.

I don't really understand this type of Christianity. Like do we really think if Jesus was in our church he would instruct you to cut a tree down and decorate it with gold and silver like the pagans do who celebrate winter solstice. Just an example. In the book of revelations it has letters to the churches. Are we not those churches? They get some bad reports and some get reports that they will be denied access to heaven if they don't fix it. Shouldn't this be a red flag for us to fix things. How can we be a clean bride for the bridegroom if we full of sin who just repents for the same sin every day. Like the food laws, if I tell you a doctor told me to stay away from those unhealthy foods my brothers support me with no end. If I say I I not eating those foods cause God tells me not too. Everyone flips out saying why you under law? Why am I under the law if I eat the foods the God says are good for me to have a long healthy life? Why do we as Christians take part in so many secular pagan rituals but will flip out if I say I celebrate God's feasts. Have you studied them? They are great especially if you have a family. They very interactive with reading scripture, tasting herbs, etc.

Hezekiah81 · Aug 21, 2021

BrotherJJ said:
The 10 commandments were given (as posted) to: the House of Jacob who's name God changed (Gen 32:28) to Israel. Jacob's children became the Nation of Israel.

Having said that, not being under Mosaic law doesn't mean no rules/law.

Matt 22:
37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.

38 This is the first and great commandment.

39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.
(NOTE: Also see: Mk 12:29, Jn 13:34, 15:12, 1 Jn 3:11, 23, 1 Jn 4:7)

Rom 13:10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

Gal 5:14 For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

If we truly love God & our brother: We won't covet, steal, murder etc.

1 Jn 3:4 Sin is a transgression of the Law:

We've all have broken God's law. No one can say he's not a sinner UNTIL a means is provided (not to take away a the law) but to remove the sin, which is the transgression of the law.

Under the law (God gave Moses, to give, to Israel), compliance invoked blessings (Deut 28:1-14). Non-compliance invoked curses (Deut 28:15-68). When Jesus became a curse (Gal 3:13) He REDEEMED every believers from all non-compliance curses/penalties invoked from breaking the law (Rom 5:20).

When scripture say's you're not under the law. It means the penalties due for non-compliance are no longer levied/imposed. Jesus paid every believers due wage (death). He took all the laws sin invoked judgments/curses upon Himself for us.

Jesus sin atoning payment is found in His: death (sins required wage PAID), burial (proof Jesus died) & resurrection (Fathers receipt, sins payment received & accepted). Is seized/accessed via FAITH (Rom 5:1-2, 10:9-10, Eph 1:13,. 2:8) placed in the faithful, obedient work & resurrection of Jesus the Christ!

Christ's righteousness (Jer 23:6 & 33:16) is imputed/transferred (Rom 4:3-8) onto us & our sins are imputed/transferred onto Christ. While the Temple was operating the High Priest had authority to impute/transfer sin (Lev 16:21).

Christ our Great High Priest (Heb 4:14) has the power to not only impute our sin onto Himself. Our High Priest can also impute His righteousness onto Himself. See Lev 4 & Rom 4 for additional imputation context.

2 Cor 5:21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.
(NOTE: We become the righteousness of God thru faith in Christs works)

Lk 16:16 The law and the prophets were until John: since that time the kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it.
(MY NOTE: Even for the Jew Mosaic law was preached & in effect, UNTIL, the death & resurrection of Jesus the Christ)

Acts 13:39 And by him all that believe are justified from all things, from which ye could not be justified by the law of Moses.
(MY NOTE: The Mosaic law is just, BUT, can't justify anyone. The law is holy, BUT, can't make anyone holy. The law is righteous, BUT, can't make anyone righteous)

Paul's Holy Spirit inspired writing proclaims:
The law, written & engraved in stones, is an administrator of death (Col 3:7) & a administrator of condemnation (Col 3:9)

2 Cor 3:
6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.
MY NOTE: Written to believers (2 Cor 1:1) The letter/law/administers death. But, the NT Holy Spirit's administration is, thru faith, life giving).

7 But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:
(MY NOTE: Mosaic law was put on notice at Jesus death when the temple veil was torn in 1/2 (Matt 27:51). And retired completely when Jesus sent the eternal life giving Holy Spirit at Pentecost/Acts 2:4)

8 How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?

9 For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory.
(MY NOTE: Context, Mosaic law is an administrator of condemnation. BTW there is NO condemnation in Christ believers/Rom 8:1)

Gal 2:21 do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.
(MY NOTE: Righteousness isn't accessed/obtained by law keeping)

Gal 3:
19 It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made
(MY NOTE: The law was added & in effect, UNTIL, Christ/the promised seed should come)

23 Before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed
(MY NOTE: BEFORE faith came, the law was in effect)

24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith
(MY NOTE: The law is a teacher, it's job/purpose is to identify, expose & condemn sin. Only after we understand & acknowledge we have sinned against our creator God's sovereign rule. Can we by faith be justified = Judicially proclaimed righteous by our sovereign creator God)

25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster
(MY NOTE: Once we've acknowledged & confessed our sins. Placed/proclaimed our faith in Christ's sin atoning payment. Found in His death, burial & resurrection (1 Cor 15:1-4). We are no longer under the curses/penalties invoked from breaking the law. (Deut 28:15-60)

Rom 3:20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.
(MY NOTE: The law teaches/schools/equips us with the knowledge to understand what sin is)

Rom 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.
( MY NOTE: The law teaches/reveals sins, lust, covetousness etc)

Rom 3:21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;
(MY NOTE: Written to NT believers (Rom 1:7). The righteousness of God written of by Moses & the prophets is now revealed separate from/without the works of the law)

Rom 10:3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.
(MY NOTE: Context vs 1, Israel. Because Israel was going about to establish their own righteousness thru Mosaic law keeping. They had missed/fallen from God's grace)

Rom 10:4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
(MY NOTE: Christ ended accessing righteousness thru workslaw keeping)

Gal 3:13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:

Rom 3:24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus

Rom 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.
(MY NOTE: Sin has NO power over the blood bought believer. BTW: believers aren't perfect, just forgiven)

1 Cor 15:
55 O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory?

56 The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law.

57 But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.

Eph 1:7 In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

Eph 2:5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved)

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
(MY NOTE: A GIFT is given, not earned. Having said that, a gift can be rejected) When we accept Gods GIFT of GRACE; mix it with our FAITH in Christ's redemptive sin payment & resurrection. We are SAVED & SEALED with Christ's indwelling Holy Spirit. See: Eph 1:14 & 4:30, 2 Cor 1:22 & 5: Tim 1:14)

Eph 2:9 says, Not of works, lest any man should boast.
(MY NOTE: In regards to salvation our own works are worthless. It's our FAITH placed in God & Christ's FINISHED redemptive work & resurrection)

Rom 11:6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works

Tit 2:11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
(MY NOTE: Grace has a name it's Jesus Christ)

AMP Bible:
Col 2:13 When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your flesh (worldliness, manner of life), God made you alive together with Christ, having [freely] forgiven us all our sins,
(MY NOTE: Written to believers (Col 1:1&6) Christ, having forgiven us ALL our sins)

Col 2:14 having canceled out the [g]certificate of debt consisting of [h]legal demands [which were in force] against us and which were hostile to us. And this certificate He has set aside and completely removed by nailing it to the cross.

Col 2:15 When He had disarmed the rulers and authorities [those supernatural forces of evil operating against us], He made a public example of them [exhibiting them as captives in His triumphal procession], having triumphed over them through the cross.

2 Tim 1:9 Who hath saved us, & called us with an holy calling, "not according to our works" but "according to his own purpose and grace" which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,
(NOTE: According to HIS own purpose & GRACE. NOT according to our works)

Tit 3:5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Spirit;
(NOTE: Via God's MERCY/grace, thru FAITH in Christ's sin payment & resurrection & the gift of Christ's indwelling Holy Spirit. Not in our own good works or law keeping)

Rom 5:
10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

11 And not only so, but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement.

17 much more they which receive abundance of grace & the of "gift of righteousness" shall reign by one, Jesus Christ

18 Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one "free gift came upon all men unto justification" of life. Peace, JJ

(Leviticus 19:18) Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of your people, but thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself: I Am the Lord. [ You speak as if God was giving new commandments, Jesus was quoting right out of the good old Hebrew scriptures, he just taught in such a new and profound way everyone marveled because who knows God's word better than himself. God gives us many precepts and commandments to live by. Yes love completes the law and if your always acting out of love you have met the requirements of it, but that doesn't abolish God's commandments.] (Matthew 5:17-18) Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfill. 18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

Gentiles aren't now & never were,under Mosaic law

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