Eternal Salvation Demands Obedience

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Mr. M

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Your theory adds human works to salvation, so you don't need the concept of grace in it.
The topic of the thread is the obedience that must accompany Salvation.
I offered no theory of salvation. "Eternal Salvation Demands Obedience" means exactly what has
been stated in the thread: what is expected of those who have received Salvation. Obedience.
You derailed
the thread with your rude and inappropriate comments and suppositions.
It is by Grace from
first to last.
If all that Grace pertains to is Salvation, then this exhortation is meaningless:

2 Peter 3:18 But grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.

Start over. Take it from the top. Read post #1. Think. I have no desire to get into this type
of discussion with a fellow senior veteran, but you have been off-topic, rude and shallow.
Your comprehension of Grace is the perfect companion for your comprehension of Salvation.
Unfortunately, you never really grasped the topic, or added any useful or edifying response
to the discussion. Just an agenda that is not welcome on this thread.


 
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FreeGrace2

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The topic of the thread is the obedience that must accompany Salvation.

Yes, I got that.

I offered no theory of salvation.
Well, you did, actually.

"Eternal Salvation Demands Obedience" means exactly what has
been stated in the thread: what is expected of those who have received Salvation. Obedience.
OK, now you are being more specific. That's good. Yes, I agree. But the way the topic was worded sure sounds as though obedience is NECESSARY for salvation.

Do you see where I'm coming from?

You derailed the thread with your rude and inappropriate comments and suppositions.
It is by Grace from first to last.
I was responding to what the title sounded like.

Absolutely salvation is by grace from first to last.

If all that Grace pertains to is Salvation, then this exhortation is meaningless:
2 Peter 3:18 But grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.
Yes, this command is for believers. Just as all the commands for holiness.

Start over. Take it from the top. Read post #1. Think. I have no desire to get into this type
of discussion with a fellow senior veteran, but you have been off-topic, rude and shallow.
Your comprehension of Grace is the perfect companion for your comprehension of Salvation.

Seems you are a veteran of insults.

Unfortunately, you never really grasped the topic, or added any useful or edifying response
to the discussion. Just an agenda that is not welcome on this thread.
Since you did clarify what you meant by the title, I have no problem with this thread.

btw, my "agenda" is simply to defend truth. It seemed you were pushing works for salvation, which I clearly indicated in my initial post.

Now that we have that cleared up, I hope your thread is edifying to all who read it.

I'll unwatch.
 
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Mr. M

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OK, now you are being more specific. That's good. Yes, I agree. But the way the topic was worded sure sounds as though obedience is NECESSARY for salvation.

Do you see where I'm coming from?
No I do not..that is what you chose to see. I asked you to go back and look again without bias.
This is not the first time someone jumped in with both feet based on an assumption. At the age
of 65, I have seen enough to discern these things. "Sure sounds as though" generally means
how someone interpreted.

Seems you are a veteran of insults.
You suggested I deface my Bible because you were convinced that I was unfamiliar with
a "Bible dictionary" definition of Grace.
Unmerited favor? How about enduring the persecutions that the apostles faced in their walk.
By Grace? Yes. The Power of God. They faced immediate opposition. Their response?
As quoted in the OP, "we ought to obey God, not men". They were beaten, yet rejoiced.
How does someone do that? By Grace.
It seemed you were pushing works for salvation, which I clearly indicated in my initial post.
Yeah, I got that. Your initial post was in no way a response to what was posted in the OP.
You readily admit to responding to the title, which you 'assumed' was 'suggesting' that
salvation by works was being 'implied'....ha ha.
If anything, I am a veteran of not being insulted by such condescending comments.
You should be able to handle it as well as you are willing to dish it out. It's all good.
 
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FreeGrace2

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This was the whole jist of my post:
"FreeGrace2 said:
It seemed you were pushing works for salvation, which I clearly indicated in my initial post."
Yeah, I got that.
Good then.

Your initial post was in no way a response to what was posted in the OP.
Well then. You didn't get it. My post WAS in res[ponse to the OP. How can you not know that?

It's all good.
I think so too.
 
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Danthemailman

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John 14:15 If you love Me, keep My commandments.
We must not confuse 'descriptive' passages of scripture with 'prescriptive' passages of scripture. Those who "keep" (Greek word "tereo" - guard, observe, watch over) His commandments demonstrate their love for Christ. 1 John 2:3 - By this we know that we have come to know Him, (already know Him/demonstrative evidence) if we keep His commandments.

I don't draw any lines. I will not be the one to judge. Where did Christ draw the line?
He drew a clear one at forgiveness.
Matthew 6:
14
For if you forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you.
15 But if you do not forgive men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.
Unforgiveness is the mark of an unbeliever and forgiveness would be the mark of a genuine believer. We should forgive others because God, through Christ, has forgiven us (Ephesians 4:32). It is inconceivable that someone who has truly experienced God's forgiveness could refuse to grant forgiveness to others.

Jesus drew the line in the sand here: John 3:18 - He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

This is not about earning salvation, or losing salvation. It is about being a "good and faithful servant". Anyone who objects to the notion of serving Christ in obedience as trying to "earn salvation" is simply encouraging others toward being a "wicked and lazy servant". If you know what Christ endured in obedience so that we could be forgiven, then "here am I, send me", becomes a part of your vocabulary.

Luke 17:10 So likewise you, when you have done all those things which you are commanded,
say, ‘We are unprofitable servants. We have done what was our duty to do.
We could never earn our salvation no matter how obedient we may be. In regards to the parable of the talents in Matthew 25, the first two servants deposited their money with the bankers (Matthew 25:27) but the third servant buried his money in the ground (vs. 25). The third servant had been given a talent according to his ability and the opportunity to believe and bear fruit in accordance, but chose to reject it.

Also, the fact that the latter man in this parable is called "wicked" and "slothful" and an "unprofitable servant" (Matthew 25:30) who is cast out into outer darkness indicates that he was not a true disciple of the master. The idea of this parable is that all true believers will produce fruit in varying degress. All genuine believers are fruitful, but not all are equally fruitful (Matthew 13:23). Those who produce no results are not truly converted.

Two of these servants were children of God, but not the third. Children of God are not cast out into outer darkness. The fact that this man is called a "servant" does not necessarily mean that he was saved. *The Jews were called the Lord’s servants, but they were not all saved.

Leviticus 25:55 - For the children of Israel are servants to Me; they are My servants whom I brought out of the land of Egypt.

Nehemiah 1:6 - please let Your ear be attentive and Your eyes open, that You may hear the prayer of Your servant which I pray before You now, day and night, for the children of Israel Your servants, and confess the sins of the children of Israel which we have sinned against You. Both my father’s house and I have sinned.

Isaiah 43:10 - “You (Israel vs. 1) are My witnesses,” says the Lord, And My servant whom I have chosen..

The Lord won't honor you for doing your job, but He is well pleased when you do so with
His Spirit. The Covenant of Eternal Salvation written on your heart demands that you do,
and convicts you when you do not. This is the overcoming Life.
I love you Dan man. I posted those scriptures in the OP #1 to encourage others to be faithful. 1 Corinthians 4:2 Moreover it is required in stewards that one be found faithful.
I am feeling the love and back at you. :) We should always strive to be faithful.
 
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Butterball1

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Hebrews 5:8, 9 Though he were a Son, yet He learned obedience by the things
which He suffered; and being made perfect, He became the author of eternal
salvation unto
all them that obey Him.

Acts 5:
29
But Peter and the other apostles answered and said: We ought to
obey God rather than men.
30
The God of our fathers raised up Jesus whom you murdered by
hanging on a tree.
31 Him God has exalted to His right hand to be Prince and Savior, to give
repentance to Israel and forgiveness of sins.
32 And we are His witnesses to these things, and also the Holy Spirit
whom God has given to those who obey Him.

True. There is no example of God saving those that continue to live in rebellion and disobedience to His will....."In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:" 2 Thessalonians 1:8
 
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Mr. M

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True. There is no example of God saving those that continue to live in rebellion and disobedience to His will....."In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:" 2 Thessalonians 1:8
Yes, obeying the Lord is our commitment to His Purpose, continuing to present the
Gospel of Eternal Salvation to our world today, two centuries after these simple words
were spoken by His Witnesses: "We ought to obey God". Acts 5:29
 
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FreeGrace2

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True. There is no example of God saving those that continue to live in rebellion and disobedience to His will....."In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:" 2 Thessalonians 1:8
It seems you believe that if one of His own children become rebellious and disobedient that He will UN-born them and send them to hell, or something like that.

However, in the same epistle you quoted, let's examine another verse:

2 Thess 2:12 - and so that all will be condemned who have not believed the truth but have delighted in wickedness.

Condemnation is for those who have not believed. Or one could say have NEVER believed. Because those who have NEVER believed have NOT believed.

Once a person believes, they are saved and cannot be condemned. Because they HAVE believed.

Even the second soil "believed for a while", according to Luke 8:13.

Do you believe Luke 8:13? They are Jesus' own words.

Or John 10:28 - I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand.
 
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Butterball1

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It seems you believe that if one of His own children become rebellious and disobedient that He will UN-born them and send them to hell, or something like that.

However, in the same epistle you quoted, let's examine another verse:

2 Thess 2:12 - and so that all will be condemned who have not believed the truth but have delighted in wickedness.

Condemnation is for those who have not believed. Or one could say have NEVER believed. Because those who have NEVER believed have NOT believed.

Once a person believes, they are saved and cannot be condemned. Because they HAVE believed.

Even the second soil "believed for a while", according to Luke 8:13.

Do you believe Luke 8:13? They are Jesus' own words.

Or John 10:28 - I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand.
it takes obedience to God's will to become saved and remain saved. ALL disobedient people will be lost including those Christians who turn from serving "obedience unto righteousness" to "obeying sin unto death" Romans 6:16. Obedience must be life long, it's not a one time one and done deal.

Lk 8:13 "They on the rock are they, which, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, which for a while believe, and in time of temptation fall away." Ths speaks of those who obeyed for a while therefore saved but later quit obeying and fell away.
 
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Brightfame52

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Faith and Repentance are graces Christ is the author of. Acts 5:31

31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.

Heb 12:2

2 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.

The word author in Heb 12:2 and Prince in Acts 5:31 are the same greek word archēgos:
  1. that by which anything begins to be, the origin, the active cause

  2. So Christ is the first cause of both faith and repentance !

 
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HARK!

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MOD HAT ON

Per the OP's request:

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MOD HAT OFF
 
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