Noachian Flood discussion - Bible skeptics vs Lion IRC and friends :)

HitchSlap said:

And this fire happens when, exactly?

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Any day now.

Tinker Grey said:

Any day now.

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Not exactly.

The next dispensation comes first.

The thousand-year millennial reign of Christ.

Bobber said:

But when Jesus saw this, He was indignant and told them, “Let the little children come to Me, and do not hinder them! For the kingdom of God belongs to such as these." Mark 10:15

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So you're actually claiming that Jesus was there saving all of the children from the flood waters?

Odd that Genesis never mentions this.

MIDutch said:

So you're actually claiming that Jesus was there saving all of the children from the flood waters?

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Saving their souls from Hell.

Bradskii said:

Let me know when you've decided.

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I think I made myself perfectly clear.

inquiring mind said:

The wives are named in the Book of Jubilees (160–150 BC) the names of the wives of Noah, Shem, Ham and Japheth are as follows:

· Wife of Noah – Emzara

· Wife of Shem – Sedeqetelebab

· Wife of Ham – Na'eltama'uk

· Wife of Japheth – 'Adataneses

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The Book of Jubilees is not canon. I asked for the passage in Genesis that mentions their names.

AV1611VET said:

Saving their souls from Hell.

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Odd that Genesis doesn't mention that.

I noticed you left that part of my comment out of your response.

MIDutch said:

So you're actually claiming that Jesus was there saving all of the children from the flood waters?

Odd that Genesis never mentions this.

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He did. Little children. Kingdom of Heaven belongs to them. Mark 10:15 Or are you concluding God has to put this on every page of the Bible?

inquiring mind said:

14,000


If it leaked as bad as you guys claim, it washed overboard.


It was no doubt built well.


No one knows for sure that amount of energy was released.

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Just like with everything else concerning Noah's flood and the Ark, you just make things up as you go, don't you?

No evidence, no experimentation (for as much money as Christians have tithed over the past 2000 years, you'd think someone could have gotten some money together to build an ACTUAL ark to see if it can do what the Bible says it did), no research, nothing. Just fabricate "apologetics" as necessary, just forge something the believers will believe, just make grandiose claims that never pan out, just blame the New World Order/government/scientists/the Catholic Church/the Illuminati/the media/etc. ad nauseum for "hiding the evidence that proves the truth of our words".

Predictable.

MIDutch said:

Odd that Genesis doesn't mention that.

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It doesn't have to.

One of the first things that is taught to a new convert is that doctrines are spread out all over the Bible.

You can't expect one passage to explain everything; but you have to take the Scriptures as a whole.

Children drowned in the Flood; but we learn later on that they're in Heaven now.

MIDutch said:

(for as much money as Christians have tithed over the past 2000 years, you'd think someone could have gotten some money together to build an ACTUAL ark to see if it can do what the Bible says it did),

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I think they're a little smarter than that, don't you?

Bobber said:

He did. Little children. Kingdom of Heaven belongs to them. Mark 10:15 Or are you concluding God has to put this on every page of the Bible?

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What I'm saying is that you are making stuff up to cover up the uncomfortable details in the story.

The flood kills children.

People point out how cruel, inhumane and evil this is.

Your reply is "well, it didn't actually happen that way since Jesus was there to wisk them all off to heaven.

Jesus didn't even exist until 2500 years after the flood.

You're just trying to sugarcoat your horrific story.

AV1611VET said:

I think they're a little smarter than that, don't you?

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Yes, in fact I do, because they know it would be an epic failure of (dare I say it) Biblical proportions that the entire world would see.

Complete and utter humiliation would finally put an end to any talk of the ark being real and that can't be allowed to happen.

AV1611VET said:

It doesn't have to.

One of the first things that is taught to a new convert is that doctrines are spread out all over the Bible.

You can't expect one passage to explain everything; but you have to take the Scriptures as a whole.

Children drowned in the Flood; but we learn later on that they're in Heaven now.

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How convenient. Just keep reading until you find a passage that says what you want it to say.

MIDutch said:

What I'm saying is that you are making stuff up to cover up the uncomfortable details in the story.

The flood kills children.

People point out how cruel, inhumane and evil this is.

Your reply is "well, it didn't actually happen that way since Jesus was there to wisk them all off to heaven.

Jesus didn't even exist until 2500 years after the flood.

You're just trying to sugarcoat your horrific story.

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I never said the children didn't physically perish in the flood of course they did BUT their spirits the REAL person went to Heaven. And Jesus didn't start existing when he was born of a virgin in Luke 1:27 . He was God manifested in the flesh. He told ever the religious Pharisees before Abraham was I AM. Jn 8:58 The name for God.

MIDutch said:

Just like with everything else concerning Noah's flood and the Ark, you just make things up as you go, don't you?

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MIDutch said:

No evidence, no experimentation (for as much money as Christians have tithed over the past 2000 years, you'd think someone could have gotten some money together to build an ACTUAL ark to see if it can do what the Bible says it did), no research, nothing.

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Life-size Noah's Ark replica draws tourists in Netherlands

MIDutch said:

Yes, in fact I do, because they know it would be an epic failure of (dare I say it) Biblical proportions that the entire world would see.

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I agree, but I think you're missing the point.

MIDutch said:

Complete and utter humiliation would finally put an end to any talk of the ark being real and that can't be allowed to happen.

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The real Ark ... Noah's Ark ... cannot be recreated as it was built in Noah's time.

It had no screws, no fasteners, no bolts, no nails: just wood and pitch.

Kinda like an igloo or log cabin.

So even attempting to build it would see it collapse under its own weight.

MIDutch said:

How convenient. Just keep reading until you find a passage that says what you want it to say.

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And never stop reading either.

I'm reading the Bible for the 13th time now; but some in our church have read It over 20 times.

MIDutch said:

What I'm saying is that you are making stuff up to cover up the uncomfortable details in the story.

The flood kills children.

People point out how cruel, inhumane and evil this is.

Your reply is "well, it didn't actually happen that way since Jesus was there to wisk them all off to heaven.

Jesus didn't even exist until 2500 years after the flood.

You're just trying to sugarcoat your horrific story.

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Jesus is God, he is the creator. When God speaks in the Old Testament that is Jesus.
John 1:3
Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made.

This is why they crucified him.
John 8:58 - Then Jesus said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM.”

Matthew 26:65
Then the high priest tore his clothes and said, "He has spoken blasphemy! Why do we need any more witnesses? Look, now you have heard the blasphemy.
The sentence for claiming to be God was death, that was why they crucified him.

Jesus came in the form of a man 2500 years after the flood but he always excised as God. We may argue over things like the flood, but any Christian will tell you that Jesus is God, that is what the Christian faith is built on. Any main stream church minister will tell you that.

myst33 said:

The simulation hypothesis, the hollographic universe, the emergent reality... and probably also the weirdnes of the quantum world that creates our macro reality and is dependent of the measurement effect.

(the 1+1 = 2 does not always work in the quantum world)

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So we can measure all of these, and there is disagreement about those measurements? Pray tell, what have we measured about the simulation hypothesis?