6 States enact Laws protecting Drivers who run over Anti-Abortion Protesters with their cars.

tz620q

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2015-01-22T211807Z_1799139061_GM1EB1N0CF101_RTRMADP_3_USA-ABORTION.JPG
During March for Life, the streets are temporarily shut down so that the march can happen without worrying about blocking traffic. The main issue is getting all the people on and off buses that are parked outside the Mall area.
 
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parousia70

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This seems like an odd way for a Catholic to frame this discussion.

Catholics are far from homogenous, and the CCC Mandates that the conscience of the individual Catholic is to be the final arbiter in moral decision making of that individual Catholic.

It seems odd to me that you would attempt to assert that what YOUR individual Conscience tells you, must therefore be applied to every Catholic homogenously.

But I think it doesn't take too much thought to realize that the intent of this law is quite different than defending people who plow maliciously into protesters.

But it's written far too broadly. It coudl have been much more narrowly penned to reflect ONLY that intent. But it wasn't. Which is why it likely will not stand up to the first Legal Challenge.

It appears to me that the law was to protect people who are driving and find their car surrounded by rioters. If those rioters are breaking glass, setting cars on fire, and throwing molotov cocktails into businesses, it is not an unreasonable thing to think that the motorist might be afraid for their life.

Plenty of Laws already on the books that allow the use of lethal force if you are in fear for your life and being attacked....
Why would this one be needed?

So the question is whether the motorist is justified in trying to extricate their car from the riot and whether this can include hitting people blocking their egress. It is not unreasonable for "peaceful" protesters to move and let the car go on.

This law says "3 people gathered constitutes a Riot" - C'mon.. you seem reasonable... Ever been to a 3 person Riot?
 
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parousia70

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During March for Life, the streets are temporarily shut down so that the march can happen without worrying about blocking traffic. The main issue is getting all the people on and off buses that are parked outside the Mall area.
And the Bottom Picture you didn't include in your quote??
Do you assert the rights of the Driver of the car to freely pass supersede the rights of the Pro Life Protesters Blocking it? or Vis Versa?
 
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tz620q

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And the Bottom Picture you didn't include in your quote??
Do you assert the rights of the Driver of the car to freely pass supersede the rights of the Pro Life Protesters Blocking it? or Vis Versa?
I do know what happens during the March for Life. So I commented on that picture.

On the black and white picture, I can only deduce by the age of the car, the style of the clothes, and the black and white photo that this is a very old photo probably from the 70's or 80's. As I stated earlier, I do not agree with these tactics of blocking traffic; but unless the driver feels personally in danger, he should not have the right to run over people.
 
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lsume

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These states have introduced bills to protect drivers who run over protesters - CNN

And other types of protesters of course....

But it sure seems like these conservatives didn't think this through, now that anyone in these states who runs over an anti-abortion protester blocking entrance to a clinic has what the law calls an "affirmative defense", giving them automatic and immediate immunity from prosecution.
As I currently see things, America may fall quickly. All a Christian can do is pray for God’s Will.
 
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TribulationSigns

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As I currently see things, America may fall quickly. All a Christian can do is pray for God’s Will.

It is not America that I am worried about. It is the unfaithful New Testament congregation that is falling away. The only signs and wonders we shall be before Christ returns are natural signs, such as the increase of false teachers, the apostasy in the Church, the degradation of society, the unnatural affections between same-sex couples, the forsaking of God and the collapse of the family and marriage union, etc. THESE are the signs and wonders of our day, which the blind cannot see and the unfaithful congregation denies.

It's my view that every single conscientious Christian should "inherently" know that this world is totally different from what it was in the past, and that Satanic forces are at work in the Church bringing it down to the level of the world. So, whatever level that the world sinks to, the Church is soon to follow. Personally, I don't think it's really rocket science. It's quite obvious. I really can't think of one single abomination in the world that hasn't found it's way up into the Church today. From Homosexuality and Evolution to Divorce and Remarriage and everything in between. And the next wave of abominations come on a daily basis. They are all creeping up into the Churches like a disease. And that has never been, to any great degree before, even in its previous darkest hours. Those who can't see what is the difference today are, generally speaking, in a state of denial.

There was not the image of the beast being cabled into our living rooms daily indoctrinating everyone in the religion of envy, in the lust of the eyes, the pleasure of swearings. The religion of evolution in the love of self. The religion of greed, filling the basket of never satisfied. The religion of self-respect (or pride if you like), wherein no one can tell us what to do. Because really, it's much better to watch TV and judge by the imaginations of our own heart, than to search out a doctrine in scripture. And of course, your favorite and mine, the religion of lust. Need I say more? The fact is, people today have so much on their plate, and they are so mired down in self and the wickedness of this world, they don't know which way is up. Literally! Right is wrong, up is down, sin is righteousness, and righteousness is sin. And on a scale that is unprecedented. The Church doesn't know how far it has fallen from the faith because they are under strong delusion, which being interpreted is deception. They have been "seduced" by the beast in a way that has never happened before.

There was not the total worldwide slide into acceptance of ungodly degradations such as homosexuality, nor the embracing of the "normalcy" of sexual immorality everywhere. Homosexuality has always been an anomaly, even in the world. But in our day it has become something not unusual at all, and indeed quickly becoming part of everyday life. How many Churches speak of homosexuality as an abomination anymore, humm? It's a little sin at best, that Christians should not speak against, because it's "unloving". Christians look upon the widespread sexual immorality today as a matter of adiaphora. And how can these things be? Yes, there may have been pockets of such diverse behaviors in the past, but we are talking about a global degradation here, even in America. There has never been a time when personal irresponsibility rules as it does now. Or when women were the heads in God's House almost routinely. Or when the casual consent to divorce is in "almost" every single Church. None of this was even rampant in the world in the past, "MUCH LESS" in the Church! These are all precedent setting, common on this scale only in our day. And it should be obvious to any conscientious Christian that there has been a serious change in the Church, and that decay is eating away at its foundations. And yet, not only is it "not obvious," these abominations are outright justified and the decay denied. Because we are in a war. Funny thing about warfare in these high places, it's spiritual rather than carnal. Wherein, if we endure to the end, to withstand in the evil day, we shall do well.

Ephesians 6:12-13
  • "For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.
  • Wherefore take unto you the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand."

But all of this is really a matter of spiritual discernment. If we are led by the Spirit to have a heightened sense of God's holiness, then I have no doubt that we will see abominations when they are in the Church. And we will recognize them for what they are, and that they are of a nature that we must not be in agreement with. It is then that we will separate ourselves from it. So it's not a matter of convincing anyone of abominations, it's a matter of being able to recognize abominations "by" the power of God, rather than men.

Nevertheless, to be sure, these things we see today are things that have never happened in the past on this level, and seeing how they aren't going to subside, but grow worse and worse, we will never see happen again.

Matthew 24:21-22
  • "For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
  • And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened."
That time may well be so far upon us that we can't see the forest for the trees.
 
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tz620q

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Catholics are far from homogenous, and the CCC Mandates that the conscience of the individual Catholic is to be the final arbiter in moral decision making of that individual Catholic.

It seems odd to me that you would attempt to assert that what YOUR individual Conscience tells you, must therefore be applied to every Catholic homogenously.
I think you are referring to CCC 1782
1782 Man has the right to act in conscience and in freedom so as personally to make moral decisions. "He must not be forced to act contrary to his conscience. Nor must he be prevented from acting according to his conscience, especially in religious matters."53

But you can't stop there
II. THE FORMATION OF CONSCIENCE

1783 Conscience must be informed and moral judgment enlightened. A well-formed conscience is upright and truthful. It formulates its judgments according to reason, in conformity with the true good willed by the wisdom of the Creator. The education of conscience is indispensable for human beings who are subjected to negative influences and tempted by sin to prefer their own judgment and to reject authoritative teachings.


So to be pro-abortion and Catholic one must accept that God wills us to kill fetuses in the womb and that the Catholic Church does not have an authoritative teaching on abortion.



But it's written far too broadly. It coudl have been much more narrowly penned to reflect ONLY that intent. But it wasn't. Which is why it likely will not stand up to the first Legal Challenge.



Plenty of Laws already on the books that allow the use of lethal force if you are in fear for your life and being attacked....
Why would this one be needed?



This law says "3 people gathered constitutes a Riot" - C'mon.. you seem reasonable... Ever been to a 3 person Riot?
The law in this section on affirmative defense reads thus-
870.07 Affirmative defense in civil action; party convicted of riot.—
(1) In a civil action for damages for personal injury, wrongful death, or property damage, it is an affirmative defense that such action arose from an injury or damage sustained by a participant acting in furtherance of a riot. The affirmative defense authorized by this section shall be established by evidence that the participant has been convicted of a riot or an aggravated riot prohibited under s. 870.01, or by proof of the commission of such crime by a preponderance of the evidence.
(2) In a civil action in which a defendant raises an affirmative defense under this section, the court must, on motion by the defendant, stay the action during the pendency of a criminal action that forms the basis for the defense, unless the court finds that a conviction in the criminal action would not form a valid defense under this section.


So the injured person, if convicted of participating in a riot cannot bring forward a civil suit for personal injury, etc. This is similar to other laws that set out affirmative defense against those in the commission of crimes. So if someone is in your house to rob you, trips over something you left out and falls down your stairs and is injured. The commission of the crime can be used as an affirmative defense against the civil suit. This does not necessarily stop the government from bringing a criminal suit against the plaintiff. It is only a remedy against the civil action.
 
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hislegacy

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These states have introduced bills to protect drivers who run over protesters - CNN

And other types of protesters of course....

But it sure seems like these conservatives didn't think this through, now that anyone in these states who runs over an anti-abortion protester blocking entrance to a clinic has what the law calls an "affirmative defense", giving them automatic and immediate immunity from prosecution.

Class A misleading title:

No place does the article address pro abortion/pro life - in fact abortion is mentioned NOWHERE. The last time there was an instance of abortion protesting from either side big enough to stop traffic was a good 25 years ago.

I would encourage you to edit your title to reflect a more truthful representation. There are a number of people who will decry it for misleading.
 
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lsume

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It is not America that I am worried about. It is the unfaithful New Testament congregation that is falling away. The only signs and wonders we shall be before Christ returns are natural signs, such as the increase of false teachers, the apostasy in the Church, the degradation of society, the unnatural affections between same-sex couples, the forsaking of God and the collapse of the family and marriage union, etc. THESE are the signs and wonders of our day, which the blind cannot see and the unfaithful congregation denies.

It's my view that every single conscientious Christian should "inherently" know that this world is totally different from what it was in the past, and that Satanic forces are at work in the Church bringing it down to the level of the world. So, whatever level that the world sinks to, the Church is soon to follow. Personally, I don't think it's really rocket science. It's quite obvious. I really can't think of one single abomination in the world that hasn't found it's way up into the Church today. From Homosexuality and Evolution to Divorce and Remarriage and everything in between. And the next wave of abominations come on a daily basis. They are all creeping up into the Churches like a disease. And that has never been, to any great degree before, even in its previous darkest hours. Those who can't see what is the difference today are, generally speaking, in a state of denial.

There was not the image of the beast being cabled into our living rooms daily indoctrinating everyone in the religion of envy, in the lust of the eyes, the pleasure of swearings. The religion of evolution in the love of self. The religion of greed, filling the basket of never satisfied. The religion of self-respect (or pride if you like), wherein no one can tell us what to do. Because really, it's much better to watch TV and judge by the imaginations of our own heart, than to search out a doctrine in scripture. And of course, your favorite and mine, the religion of lust. Need I say more? The fact is, people today have so much on their plate, and they are so mired down in self and the wickedness of this world, they don't know which way is up. Literally! Right is wrong, up is down, sin is righteousness, and righteousness is sin. And on a scale that is unprecedented. The Church doesn't know how far it has fallen from the faith because they are under strong delusion, which being interpreted is deception. They have been "seduced" by the beast in a way that has never happened before.

There was not the total worldwide slide into acceptance of ungodly degradations such as homosexuality, nor the embracing of the "normalcy" of sexual immorality everywhere. Homosexuality has always been an anomaly, even in the world. But in our day it has become something not unusual at all, and indeed quickly becoming part of everyday life. How many Churches speak of homosexuality as an abomination anymore, humm? It's a little sin at best, that Christians should not speak against, because it's "unloving". Christians look upon the widespread sexual immorality today as a matter of adiaphora. And how can these things be? Yes, there may have been pockets of such diverse behaviors in the past, but we are talking about a global degradation here, even in America. There has never been a time when personal irresponsibility rules as it does now. Or when women were the heads in God's House almost routinely. Or when the casual consent to divorce is in "almost" every single Church. None of this was even rampant in the world in the past, "MUCH LESS" in the Church! These are all precedent setting, common on this scale only in our day. And it should be obvious to any conscientious Christian that there has been a serious change in the Church, and that decay is eating away at its foundations. And yet, not only is it "not obvious," these abominations are outright justified and the decay denied. Because we are in a war. Funny thing about warfare in these high places, it's spiritual rather than carnal. Wherein, if we endure to the end, to withstand in the evil day, we shall do well.

Ephesians 6:12-13
  • "For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.
  • Wherefore take unto you the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand."

But all of this is really a matter of spiritual discernment. If we are led by the Spirit to have a heightened sense of God's holiness, then I have no doubt that we will see abominations when they are in the Church. And we will recognize them for what they are, and that they are of a nature that we must not be in agreement with. It is then that we will separate ourselves from it. So it's not a matter of convincing anyone of abominations, it's a matter of being able to recognize abominations "by" the power of God, rather than men.

Nevertheless, to be sure, these things we see today are things that have never happened in the past on this level, and seeing how they aren't going to subside, but grow worse and worse, we will never see happen again.

Matthew 24:21-22
  • "For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
  • And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened."
That time may well be so far upon us that we can't see the forest for the trees.
Until said professing Christians are converted, they are unable to See clearly. Except there come a great falling away first;
2Thes.2
[1] Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,
[2] That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
[3] Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
 
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Ignatius the Kiwi

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The DC march for life is an organized political event isn't it? Much like the so-called Women's march. I'm pretty sure they have an agreement for that. As for the other pictures, if they get run over doing something stupid why would I defend them? I would still maintain the position that pro-lifers are less likely to be run over, so I think the trade in lives is alright.



Conflation appears to be your MO...
You realize these laws make it legal TO ATTACK someone BECAUSE you FEEL inconvenienced, right?

Why is this a problem?

Why would you support the use of lethal force on someone that you believe is inconveniencing you?

Why shouldn't i?



Please demonstrate how BLM and/or Antifa want this, or recant the accusation..

Given that they've defended a black girl who was about to stab another black girl and have defended rioting as mostly peaceful protests up to the tune of 2 billion dollars of property damage in the name of a man overdosed on drugs, I get the feeling BLM cares nothing for law. So No, i won't take back the accusation.

You're free to defend them though.
 
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chad kincham

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These states have introduced bills to protect drivers who run over protesters - CNN

And other types of protesters of course....

But it sure seems like these conservatives didn't think this through, now that anyone in these states who runs over an anti-abortion protester blocking entrance to a clinic has what the law calls an "affirmative defense", giving them automatic and immediate immunity from prosecution.

The reasons for those laws are self evident- protestors surround a car, pound on it try to turn it over, make them fear for their life and panic, then when they hit the gas to escape the mob and someone gets run over, liberal states charge the driver, especially if they’re conservative



.
 
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Bruce Leiter

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These states have introduced bills to protect drivers who run over protesters - CNN

And other types of protesters of course....

But it sure seems like these conservatives didn't think this through, now that anyone in these states who runs over an anti-abortion protester blocking entrance to a clinic has what the law calls an "affirmative defense", giving them automatic and immediate immunity from prosecution.

This report is outdated being from 2017, and none of the bills have been enacted into laws, according to the report. Have they since then? I haven't heard of that happening.
 
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PaulCyp1

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And no doubt they have very precise definitions concerning which people standing in a street carrying a sign are "protestors". Like people who are carrying a sign stating "Happy Birthday" or "Congratulations on your graduation"? Or "Smoking causes cancer"? If these people are not "protestors", why would a person carrying a sign that reads "Life matters" or "Babies are human" be considered a "protestor"? The sign isn't "protesting" anything. It is just stating a simple fact. In any case, carrying such a sign is clearly a constitutional right. If the people carrying the signs are blocking traffic, deal with that minor offense. But don't attack people's constitutional rights.
 
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chilehed

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I don't care whether there's a special law covering this or not: if a mob surrounds my car and starts beating on it and screaming at me, I'm hitting the gas. No legitimate law says that I have to allow myself to get beaten by a pack of thugs, and if they get hurt trying to it's on them.
 
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Ignatius the Kiwi

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Because God commands it.

-CryptoLutheran

Where does God command we protect those who recklessly protest on motorways at danger to themselves and others?

I would reccomend watching videos of these idiots and seeing how they behave. To a man they try to stop cars moving forward with their bodies. Then they proceed to attack the drivers and are surprised when the driver panics and gets out of there.

God doesnt command us to support reckless protests or stupid methods.
 
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chad kincham

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The remarks I see here are a canard from the left.

Rioters and protesters don’t get run over for inconveniencing drivers by blocking traffic.

They get run over for surrounding a car, pounding on it, trying to turn it over, making the driver fear for their life until they panic and drive through them to escape.

Then leftist prosecutors charge the driver.

Hence the laws that prevent prosecution of the victim.
 
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apogee

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Where does God command we protect those who recklessly protest on motorways at danger to themselves and others?

I would reccomend watching videos of these idiots and seeing how they behave. To a man they try to stop cars moving forward with their bodies. Then they proceed to attack the drivers and are surprised when the driver panics and gets out of there.

God doesnt command us to support reckless protests or stupid methods.

I think you are correct in that there are no commands in the bible that specifically relate to correct Motorway usage, or whether you should support protests, that you consider reckless, or to be employing unintelligent methods.

I have been attacked whilst being sat in a car, and thankfully cars tend to provide quite a bit of protection, at least at first. For absolutely no apparent reason this man (probably under the influence of drugs/alcohol) climbed onto my windshield and began punching it with the aim of getting through to my face, I was not alone in the car, I had a friend next to me who was also pretty shocked.

I did dispatch with my unprovoked attacker quite quickly, by accelerating the car in a circle and letting centripetal force have its way with him. Thankfully, he was seemingly uninjured, apart from maybe his bruised pride, and his equally bruised rear end.

Attacking someone in a car is a spectacularly stupid thing to do, they definitely have the advantage. If a group of people mob your car and cause you to fear for you life, then I think you have every justification to act using whatever you think the minimal necessary amount of force is.

You do not have a right to mow down people that annoy you. If you genuinely have such little care for other humans, than I fear for your soul.
 
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