Chauvin Guilty

Landon Caeli · Apr 21, 2021

Danthemailman said:
Pelosi faces intense backlash after thanking George Floyd for 'sacrificing your life for justice'

...Such a bizarre thing to say.

apogee · Apr 21, 2021

Landon Caeli said:
...Such a bizarre thing to say.

It sounds a bit like something one might say to a turkey, just prior to thrusting root vegetables into its lifeless abdominal cavity. :-/

Jake Arsenal · Apr 21, 2021

When on-duty LEOs abuse citizens, there is no justice available. Punishment of the individual is not justice because the officer brings down the full weight of government on the victim.

LEOs should be held to a higher standard, but qualified immunity holds them to a lower standard.

Blessed are we who trust to God for justice and mercy.

SummerMadness · Apr 21, 2021

Pavel Mosko said:
Yes I was watching Tim Pool videos lots. The defense did a much better job than was widely reported in the press there should have been reasonable doubt on some of those charges. But meanwhile you got the jury being threatened enough where it was on the verge of a mistrial, even by the report of the Judge who should have sequestered the jury weeks or months ago. So this is as much mob justice as actual justice.

The media had nothing to do with the weak and unconvincing argument put up by the defense. Pool has no idea what he's talking about and it is clear from this "commentary" of his that those pictures of him hanging out with white supremacists was not just for show.

SummerMadness · Apr 21, 2021

Danthemailman said:
I don't always agree with everything that Candace Owens has to say. From watching the video, things do not look good for Derek Chauvin at all, so I'm not surprised by a guilty verdict.

Nor do I. She is one of those black grifters that shows up every few years, where they claim they don't see color or hate focus on race, yet they make their entire careers about attacking black people. They know this is lucrative because ingratiating themselves to attacking black people as a black person makes them "unique" in the media landscape. It's dancing for that bag.

Confused-by-christianity · Apr 21, 2021

Jake Arsenal said:
When on-duty LEOs abuse citizens, there is no justice available. Punishment of the individual is not justice because the officer brings down the full weight of government on the victim.

LEOs should be held to a higher standard, but qualified immunity holds them to a lower standard.

Blessed are we who trust to God for justice and mercy.

You rated my post funny?

rjs330 · Apr 21, 2021

Confused-by-christianity said:
Peelian principles - Wikipedia

I'm reading about the Peelian Principles now...
The article says it is a "Policing by Consent" model. The Policing by consent model is;
1) Police are considered citizens with a uniform.
2) They have power to police their fellow citizens with the "implicit consent" of those fellow citizens.
3) Legitimacy of police comes from public support. Public support comes from transparency about powers, integrity in exercising powers and accountability.

Does the American police have this model?
The concept that the public consent to being policed? That this consent may be removed by the public is they deem it necessary?
Do they consider themselves fellow citizens with a job to do, or do they consider themselves a seperate branch of govt / state ?
Do they consider questions of legitimacy?

I think over all police do follow the Peekian Principles. But not all of them for sure. In too many places they don't have accountability. The police unions have too much power when it come to disciplining or getting rid of bad cops. In too many cases it takes an incident like Chauvins to be able to get rid of the cop, when in reality he it she should have been gotten rid of a long time ago.

rjs330 · Apr 21, 2021

I do believe the jury was intimidated by this whole mob. Can you imagine? If they would have come back with not guilty on a charge then the man would have attacked them and their families.

What Chauvin did was wrong. I don't believe Chauvin was guilty of all charges.

Second-degree murder does not require the prosecution to prove Chauvin had "an intent" to kill Floyd, but the state must prove that Chauvin attempted to commit the underlying felony of assault in the third degree. Assault is defined as the intentional infliction of bodily harm, so prosecutors must prove Chauvin "intentionally" applied unlawful force without consent and it resulted in "bodily harm."

Anyone guilty of third-degree murder under Minnesota state law caused the death of another person by perpetuating an act "eminently dangerous" to others and evincing a depraved mind, without regard for human life, but without intent to cause death, Cahill explained. And second-degree manslaughter requires jurors to believe that Chauvin caused Floyd's death through negligence and consciously took the chance of causing severe injury or death.

Thought the altercation Chauvin did not show any intent of the use of felony force on Floyd. Floyd asked to be taken out of the car. And I didn't see any indication of a depraved mind either. Kneeling on someone is a valid tactic in police work to hold someone down. It's not deprivation of mind. And certainly not considered a felony assault.

HOWEVER: In my area police are taught that once someone in under control that they are to sit them up as soon as possible. I have no idea what Minnesota teaches so I can't speak to that.

I believe this was a clear cut case if 2nd degree manslaughter. Chauvin caused Floyd's death by negligence and consciously took a chance on causing harm to him by remaining on his back and neck for nine minutes. I believe he was totally guilty of that.

Derek Chauvin charges explained: What prosecutors must prove

wonderkins · Apr 21, 2021

Confused-by-christianity said:
How about you?

I think for starters, and I think it applies to any form of government, at the foundation would be as in 1 Peter 2:13-17, which is essentially punish those who do evil and praise those who do good.

Beyond that, taking from what I've learned from a conversation between Jocko Willink and Steven Crowder, police officers of every type would receive regular and extensive training in jiu jitsu over the life of their career. I'm not involved in it myself, but I understand it is a great practice in discipline and self defense. I think for an officer to be able to subdue someone long before ever having to resort to a gun or other weapon would be an extremely effective skill. It may not work in something like a drug fueled rage or worse, but the chances would be much higher.

There should also probably be a limit on the ability of unions to protect problematic officers. I could be wrong there.

I believe the majority of officers are good people who love their job and sincerely want to serve their communities. When bad cops turn up, they should be weeded out. But until then, the police should be defended against the media who only want to make all officers the enemy.

Confused-by-christianity · Apr 21, 2021

rjs330 said:
I think over all police do follow the Peekian Principles. But not all of them for sure. In too many places they don't have accountability. The police unions have too much power when it come to disciplining or getting rid of bad cops. In too many cases it takes an incident like Chauvins to be able to get rid of the cop, when in reality he it she should have been gotten rid of a long time ago.

Was Chauvin a problem officer with a history of violence against citizens? (I haven't read anything on this bit recently).

chilehed · Apr 21, 2021

Silverback said:
Ok...Chauvin was a dirty COP, but one thing, one simple thing was left out of this...if you can say "I can't breath" you can breath, Chauvin did not choke him out with his knee on his neck, as the Doctor who performed his autopsy claimed.

If you can talk, you have a patent airway...period. As the airway closes the "audibility" of speech diminishes, but it witnesses 20 feet away can hear him claim "I can't breath" then he can breath.

This is such rubbish. As a volunteer first responder I can assure you that people suffering from critical respiratory distress can say "I can't breath" up until the moment they lose consciousness and die. George Floyd was in obvious respiratory distress, and Chauvin ABSOLUTELY had a duty to respond to it. In not doing so he was criminally negligent.

Race hustlers like Maxine Waters are despicable, and her reckless stoking of the mob is very likely to result in this getting overturned on appeal. She and everyone like her should be ashamed of themselves.

Swag365 · Apr 21, 2021

chilehed said:
This is such rubbish. As a volunteer first responder I can assure you that people suffering from critical respiratory distress can say "I can't breath" up until the moment they lose consciousness and die. George Floyd was in obvious respiratory distress, and Chauvin ABSOLUTELY had a duty to respond to it. In not doing so he was criminally negligent.

Race hustlers like Maxine Waters are despicable, and her reckless stoking of the mob is very likely to result in this getting overturned on appeal. She and everyone like her should be ashamed of themselves.

What evidence is there that the jury's decision was influenced by a mob? None.

East of Eden · Apr 21, 2021

tryphena rose said:
It's just expected at this point as the anarcho communists Antifa have taken over the city of Portland. Riots, looting, burning down buildings are all common place. They don't actually care about black lives, they just use it to push their own agenda to destroy the "evil that is capitalism". Black lives matter really isn't so different in this however.

Yup, yet the dirty cops at the DOJ insist 'white supremacists' (has anyone met one?) are the real problem. These Portland vermin actually set up an autonomous zone last year there. Like the KKK before them, BLM/Antifa are the military wing of the Democratic Party.

zippy2006 · Apr 21, 2021

chilehed said:
Race hustlers like Maxine Waters are despicable, and her reckless stoking of the mob is very likely to result in this getting overturned on appeal. She and everyone like her should be ashamed of themselves.

It will likely be appealed, and that will largely be Waters' fault, but do you think it will be overturned? Maybe one or two of the counts will be overturned, but I doubt all three will be overturned.

East of Eden · Apr 21, 2021

apogee said:
It sounds a bit like something one might say to a turkey, just prior to thrusting root vegetables into its lifeless abdominal cavity. :-/

About the view of human life the left has, being products of random chance.

Der Alte · Apr 21, 2021

Swag365 said:
You think that he died from a drug overdose or an unknown act of God, and that it was merely a coincidence that a heavy man had his knee pressed on his neck for nine minutes?
That’s one heck of a coincidence don’t you think?
If Floyd was a 95 year old man with heart problems I suppose you would say that he died from natural causes because he was old and had a poor heart, and that the police officer’s conduct had nothing to do with his death?
It seems a bit silly to me for anyone to conclude that the police officer’s conduct was not a significant contributing factor in his death, as if he was certain to die anyway and it’s just a random coincidence that a police officer was sitting on his neck for 9 minutes.

Posted this before. Very little response.
Here is why I think it was the wrong verdict.
.....The jury copped out from fear and reacted to all the insanity outside. Chauvin's knees on Floyd's neck and back could not have stopped him from breathing.
Wanting to see things for myself. I weighed myself 220 lbs, then knelt on the same scales with my toes on the floor just like Chauvin. Guess what only 166 lbs, that is 83 lbs per knee. Then I pressed up against a wall as close as I could, with my head turned to the side. I could easily pass my clinched fist between my neck and the wall. So what prevented Floyd from breathing? Certainly not the knee on his neck.
.....And I'm pretty sure one has to have air in their lungs to speak. If I can't breathe I can't talk.
.....So where did all this stuff come from? Remember the Michael Brown death, Ferguson Missouri. People running around holding up their hands yelling "Hands up, don't shoot." It never happened. Brown did NOT have his hands up and he was moving toward the officer when he was shot.
.....I read the grand jury findings one of the witnesses never saw what happened she was in a room away from the action and only repeated what her boyfriend told her. It was in the report. This police photo of a blood stain in the street where Michael Brown was shot. Note the long trail extending to the lower right. This is evidence that Brown was moving when he was shot.

Last

chilehed · Apr 21, 2021

Swag365 said:
What evidence is there that the jury's decision was influenced by a mob? None.

Doesn't matter. There were huge mobs, she did everything she could stoke them against the jury, and the jury wasn't sequestered until they went into deliberations so there's little chance they didn't know about it. I'm not a lawyer, but it sounds like a slam dunk to me.

zippy2006 said:
It will likely be appealed, and that will largely be Waters' fault, but do you think it will be overturned? Maybe one or two of the counts will be overturned, but I doubt all three will be overturned.

It would be appealed even if Waters hadn't acted that way, but she sure made the defense case for an appeal easier. I've learned to not try to predict judicial rulings, but if it's overturned because of the threats of mob action then I don't see any reasonable way to not overturn all of them.

Der Alte · Apr 21, 2021

Swag365 said:
What evidence is there that the jury's decision was influenced by a mob? None.

Do you own a TV and do you watch the news.

“I hope that we are going to get a verdict that says ‘guilty, guilty, guilty,’” Waters continued.
“If we don’t we cannot go away. We have got to get more confrontational. We have got to make sure that they know that we mean business,” said Waters, an 82-year-old Democrat now in her 16th term in office.
Maxine Waters urges ‘confrontation’ if Chauvin found not guilty

Der Alte · Apr 21, 2021

Swag365 said:
You think that he died from a drug overdose or an unknown act of God, and that it was merely a coincidence that a heavy man had his knee pressed on his neck for nine minutes.
That’s one heck of a coincidence don’t you think?
If Floyd was a 95 year old man with heart problems I suppose you would say that he died from natural causes because he was old and had a poor heart, and that the police officer’s conduct had nothing to do with his death?
It seems a bit silly to me for anyone to conclude that the police officer’s conduct was not a significant contributing factor in his death, as if he was certain to die anyway and it’s just a random coincidence that a police officer was sitting on his neck for 9 minutes.

Did you even read my post? I was not giving my unsupported opinion
.....Once again, it was the wrong verdict. The jury copped out from fear and reacted to all the insanity outside. Chauvin's knees on Floyd's neck and back could not have stopped him from breathing.
.....Wanting to see things for myself. I weighed myself 220 lbs, then knelt on the same scales with my toes on the floor just like Chauvin. Guess what only 166 lbs, that is 83 lbs per knee. Then I pressed up against a wall as close as I could, with my head turned to the side. I could easily pass my clinched fist between my neck and the wall. So what prevented Floyd from breathing? Certainly not the knee on his neck.
.....And I'm pretty sure one has to have air in their lungs to speak. If I can't breathe I can't talk. If I can talk then I can breathe.
.....So where did all this stuff come from? Remember the Michael Brown death, Ferguson Missouri? People running around holding up their hands yelling "Hands up, don't shoot." It never happened. Brown did NOT have his hands up and he was moving toward the officer when he was shot.
I read the grand jury findings one of the witnesses never saw what happened she was in a room away from the action and only repeated what her boyfriend told her. It was in the Grand Jury findings.

SummerMadness · Apr 21, 2021

Der Alte said:
Did you even read my post? I was not giving my unsupported opinion
.....Once again, it was the wrong verdict. The jury copped out from fear and reacted to all the insanity outside. Chauvin's knees on Floyd's neck and back could not have stopped him from breathing.
.....Wanting to see things for myself. I weighed myself 220 lbs, then knelt on the same scales with my toes on the floor just like Chauvin. Guess what only 166 lbs, that is 83 lbs per knee. Then I pressed up against a wall as close as I could, with my head turned to the side. I could easily pass my clinched fist between my neck and the wall. So what prevented Floyd from breathing? Certainly not the knee on his neck.
.....And I'm pretty sure one has to have air in their lungs to speak. If I can't breathe I can't talk. If I can talk then I can breathe.
.....So where did all this stuff come from? Remember the Michael Brown death, Ferguson Missouri? People running around holding up their hands yelling "Hands up, don't shoot." It never happened. Brown did NOT have his hands up and he was moving toward the officer when he was shot.
I read the grand jury findings one of the witnesses never saw what happened she was in a room away from the action and only repeated what her boyfriend told her. It was in the Grand Jury findings.

Medical experts and scientific testimony countered what you're arguing and was far more convincing, including standing up to cross examination. If the jury was not convinced, then it's because the defense was weak (i.e., incorrect) or incompetent.

Plus your aasertion that one must have air in his lungs in order to speak is completely incorrect, but that wouldn't even matter. Dying from asphyxia does not mean there was no air in his lungs, it means oxygen could not efficiently reach his tissue. You know, the guy resting in his neck prevented that, as testified by all the experts, Chauvin murdered him.

Chauvin Guilty

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