ARE ALL THE 10 COMMANDMENTS IN THE OLD AND NEW TESTAMENT?

LoveGodsWord · Apr 11, 2021

Bob S said:
All that post just to "conclude" that because Paul wrote 31 Do we, then, nullify the law by this faith? Not at all! Rather, we uphold the law.

I submit to you that you have taken verse 31 completely out of context to try to prove Paul didn't really write in 2Cor that the ten commandments were done away. How about explaining the preceding verses in chapter 31?

27 Where, then, is boasting? It is excluded. Because of what law? The law that requires works? No, because of the law that requires faith. 28 For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from the works of the law. 29 Or is God the God of Jews only? Is he not the God of Gentiles too? Yes, of Gentiles too, 30 since there is only one God, who will justify the circumcised by faith and the uncircumcised through that same faith.

No place in Rom 31 does it tell us we are under the laws of the Sinai covenant. Eph 2:15, Gal 3:19 ETC..

Sorry Bob but I do not believe your submission (interpretation) agrees with the scriptures shared with you so we might have to agree to disagree on that one as I believe we have Paul disagreeing with Paul and contradicting himself if we believe that Paul says in one breath that Gods' law is abolished and in the next breath we hear Paul say no, faith does not abolish the law, it establishes the law in the next or elsewhere for example circumcision is nothing and uncircumcision is nothing but the keeping of the commandments of God. No one here has ever told you that we are justified by keeping the law so the scriptures your providing in support of your belief that God's law is abolished is not relevant to our discussion here but thanks for sharing your view but it is not one that I agree with according to the scriptures shared with you. Of course you are free to believe as you wish as that is between you and God the same as what I believe is between me and God. Perhaps you can pray about what has been shared with you or if you have any questions I would be happy to discuss them with you. I am always happy to discuss the scriptures with you Bob. Thank you for the discussion.

Bob S · Apr 12, 2021

LoveGodsWord said:
No one here has ever told you that we are justified by keeping the law so the scriptures your providing in support of your belief that God's law is abolished is not relevant to our discussion here but thanks for sharing your view but it is not one that I agree with according to the scriptures shared with you.

That is not true. Many of your posts tell us if we love God, we will keep His commandments, referring to the ten commandments. The real meaning of that statement is unless we keep the ten commandments, we don't love God. Certainly, if we don't love God then why would we even want to go to Heaven? We know you LGW, we know you through your writing. You are good and I am sure you have fooled many, but you are not fooling me.

Bob S · Apr 12, 2021

Ellen, your prophet is not fooling me either when she wrote the following:

It means eternal salvation to keep the Sabbath holy unto the Lord. God says: "Them that honor Me I will honor." {6T 356.4}

But if we turn aside from the fourth commandment, so positively given by God, to adopt the inventions of Satan, voiced and acted by men under his control, we cannot be saved. We cannot with safety receive his traditions and subtleties as truth. {RH, July 6, 1897 par. 4}

No one who disregards the fourth commandment, after becoming enlightened in regard to the claims of the Sabbath, can be held guiltless in the sight of God. {RH, July 6, 1897 par. 14}

All will be judged according to the light that has shone upon them. If they have light upon the Sabbath, they cannot be saved in rejecting that light.{HS 234.3}

I do know one thing about what isn't sin, I know that it is not a sin for not observing the 7th-day Sabbath that was given only to one nation on Earth. The covenant given to Israel which contained the Sabbath command was not, in any way, linked to the Israelites salvation Ex 19:5-6. God told Moses the law He was about to give Israel was to make them a Holy nation. It was a covenant of laws that were to be the governing rules while they sojourned in the desert and when they finally went into the Promised Land, Canaan. Israelites were saved just as was Abraham, you and I, saved by faith. By contrast, the new covenant is the covenant of salvation for all mankind. Israel’s Promised Land is defunct as is the covenant that governed the people.

SabbathBlessings · Apr 12, 2021

Bob S said:
That is not true. Many of your posts tell us if we love God, we will keep His commandments, referring to the ten commandments. The real meaning of that statement is unless we keep the ten commandments, we don't love God. Certainly, if we don't love God then why would we even want to go to Heaven? We know you LGW, we know you through your writing. You are good and I am sure you have fooled many, but you are not fooling me.

Is it @LoveGodsWord who is asking to keep the commandments or is it our Savior?

John 14:15 15 “If you love Me, keep My commandments.

John 15:10 If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love, just as I have kept My Father’s commandments and abide in His love.

These scriptures should be words in red in your Bible.

JLB777 · Apr 13, 2021

LoveGodsWord said:
Where did I say that the Sabbath begins at sunset everyday? I didn't

You said the Sabbath begins at sunset.

You didn’t mention any particular day.

Again which day is the Sabbath? When does it begin; on which day?

JLB

JLB777 · Apr 13, 2021

LoveGodsWord said:
Yes but what the scriptures do say is that it is fine to travel to Church on the Sabbath as Jesus and the disciples did. Luke 4:16; Acts of the Apostles 17:2

Again you don’t quote scripture, but state your opinion, then proceed to “tag” your opinion with a scripture reference. This is a common tactic of those who are promoting a doctrine that is less than biblical.

And He came to Nazareth, where He had been brought up; and as was His custom, He entered the synagogue on the Sabbath, and stood up to read. Luke 4:16

As we can see, the word Church is not mentioned, nor is any specific distance mentioned.

Synagogues are for those who practice Judaism. A religion that denies Jesus Christ is the Messiah and denies He is the Son of God.

As we can all see, this is not instructions from Jesus or Hs apostles as to how the Church is to observe the Sabbath under the New Covenant.

No wonder you didn’t quote the scripture.

JLB777 · Apr 13, 2021

LoveGodsWord said:
No dear friend you are wrong but let me explain why from the scriptures. Preparation day is taught in Exodus 16:4-30 in context to the Sabbath and preparing for to keep the Sabbath by preparing all our food the day before the Sabbath. Something also known and taught in the new testament scriptures (Matthew 27:62; Mark 15:42; Luke 23:54; John 19:31). If you will notice there is nothing in regards to doing animal sacrifices in Gods 4th commandment in Exodus 20:8-11 and in the laws of preparing for the Sabbath in Exodus 16:4-30.

In regards to the laws for remission of sins and animal sacrifice these are shadow laws fulfilled in the body of Christ in the new covenant *Colossians 2:16. So under the old covenant for example the "shadow laws" for remission of sins pointed to the coming of the Messiah in Christ and his work on our behalf under the new covenant based on better promises according to Hebrews 8:1-6. The earthly Sanctuary along with the Levitical Priesthood, the laws for remission of sins, animal sacrifices and sin offerings and anything involved with them are fulfilled and continued in Christ who is now our new High Priest *Hebrews 7:1-25

Under the old covenant God's people looked forward in faith to the coming of the Messiah while in the new covenant today God's people look back to the coming of Christ and the fulfillment of the prophetic laws which are now continued in the body of Christ to which they all pointed to *Colossians 2:17; John 1:29; Hebrews 8:1-6; Hebrews 9:1-17; Hebrews 10:1-17. What this means for us today under the new covenant is that there is no more "shadow laws" of an earthly Sanctuary, no more laws of the Levitical Priesthood, not more animal sacrifices and sin offerings which are now fulfilled and continued in Christ based on better promises *Hebrews 8:1-6.

Jesus is now our great high Priest *Hebrews 7:1-25 ministering on our behalf in the Heavenly Sanctuary that the Lord pitched and not man *Hebrews 8:2 who is also God's perfect sacrifice for the sins of the world *John 1:29; 36; Hebrews 9:1-28; Hebrews 10:14-24; 1 John 2:2; Romans 5:8; Ephesians 5:2; Hebrews 10:10-12; 1 Peter 2:24; 2 Corinthians 5:21; 1 John 4:10. Jesus as our true sacrifice for the sins of the world. So anything here associated with the old covenant Levitical Priesthood and Sanctuary service and laws for remission of sins are no longer applicable for us today in the new covenant.

Hope this is helpful.

More of your opinion, with no actual scripture!

Here are what scriptures look like —

Then he said to them, “This is what the Lord has said: ‘Tomorrow is a Sabbath rest, a holy Sabbath to the Lord. Bake what you will bake today, and boil what you will boil; and lay up for yourselves all that remains, to be kept until morning.’ ” So they laid it up till morning, as Moses commanded; and it did not stink, nor were there any worms in it. Then Moses said, “Eat that today, for today is a Sabbath to the Lord; today you will not find it in the field. Six days you shall gather it, but on the seventh day, the Sabbath, there will be none.”
Now it happened that some of the people went out on the seventh day to gather, but they found none. And the Lord said to Moses, “How long do you refuse to keep My commandments and My laws? See! For the Lord has given you the Sabbath; therefore He gives you on the sixth day bread for two days. Let every man remain in his place; let no man go out of his place on the seventh day.” So the people rested on the seventh day. Exodus 16:23-30

And the Lord spoke to Moses, saying, “Speak also to the children of Israel, saying: Surely My Sabbaths you shall keep, for it is a sign between Me and you throughout your generations, that you may know that I am the Lord who sanctifies you. You shall keep the Sabbath, therefore, for it is holy to you. Everyone who profanes it shall surely be put to death; for whoever does any work on it, that person shall be cut off from among his people. Work shall be done for six days, but the seventh is the Sabbath of rest, holy to the Lord. Whoever does any work on the Sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death.
Exodus 31:12-15

Then Moses gathered all the congregation of the children of Israel together, and said to them, “These are the words which the Lord has commanded you to do: Work shall be done for six days, but the seventh day shall be a holy day for you, a Sabbath of rest to the Lord. Whoever does any work on it shall be put to death. You shall kindle no fire throughout your dwellings on the Sabbath day.”Exodus 35:1-3

Now while the children of Israel were in the wilderness, they found a man gathering sticks on the Sabbath day. And those who found him gathering sticks brought him to Moses and Aaron, and to all the congregation. They put him under guard, because it had not been explained what should be done to him.
Then the Lord said to Moses, “The man must surely be put to death; all the congregation shall stone him with stones outside the camp.” So, as the Lord commanded Moses, all the congregation brought him outside the camp and stoned him with stones, and he died. Numbers 15:32-36

‘And on the Sabbath day two lambs in their first year, without blemish, and two-tenths of an ephah of fine flour as a grain offering, mixed with oil, with its drink offering— this is the burnt offering for every Sabbath, besides the regular burnt offering with its drink offering. Numbers 28:9

Do you claim the Church is to observe these Sabbath requirements?

JLB

LoveGodsWord · Apr 13, 2021

JLB777 said:
More of your opinion, with no actual scripture!

Here are what scriptures look like —

Then he said to them, “This is what the Lord has said: ‘Tomorrow is a Sabbath rest, a holy Sabbath to the Lord. Bake what you will bake today, and boil what you will boil; and lay up for yourselves all that remains, to be kept until morning.’ ” So they laid it up till morning, as Moses commanded; and it did not stink, nor were there any worms in it. Then Moses said, “Eat that today, for today is a Sabbath to the Lord; today you will not find it in the field. Six days you shall gather it, but on the seventh day, the Sabbath, there will be none.”
Now it happened that some of the people went out on the seventh day to gather, but they found none. And the Lord said to Moses, “How long do you refuse to keep My commandments and My laws? See! For the Lord has given you the Sabbath; therefore He gives you on the sixth day bread for two days. Let every man remain in his place; let no man go out of his place on the seventh day.” So the people rested on the seventh day. Exodus 16:23-30

And the Lord spoke to Moses, saying, “Speak also to the children of Israel, saying: Surely My Sabbaths you shall keep, for it is a sign between Me and you throughout your generations, that you may know that I am the Lord who sanctifies you. You shall keep the Sabbath, therefore, for it is holy to you. Everyone who profanes it shall surely be put to death; for whoever does any work on it, that person shall be cut off from among his people. Work shall be done for six days, but the seventh is the Sabbath of rest, holy to the Lord. Whoever does any work on the Sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death.
Exodus 31:12-15

Then Moses gathered all the congregation of the children of Israel together, and said to them, “These are the words which the Lord has commanded you to do: Work shall be done for six days, but the seventh day shall be a holy day for you, a Sabbath of rest to the Lord. Whoever does any work on it shall be put to death. You shall kindle no fire throughout your dwellings on the Sabbath day.”Exodus 35:1-3

Now while the children of Israel were in the wilderness, they found a man gathering sticks on the Sabbath day. And those who found him gathering sticks brought him to Moses and Aaron, and to all the congregation. They put him under guard, because it had not been explained what should be done to him.
Then the Lord said to Moses, “The man must surely be put to death; all the congregation shall stone him with stones outside the camp.” So, as the Lord commanded Moses, all the congregation brought him outside the camp and stoned him with stones, and he died. Numbers 15:32-36

‘And on the Sabbath day two lambs in their first year, without blemish, and two-tenths of an ephah of fine flour as a grain offering, mixed with oil, with its drink offering— this is the burnt offering for every Sabbath, besides the regular burnt offering with its drink offering. Numbers 28:9

Do you claim the Church is to observe these Sabbath requirements?

JLB

No dear friend but let me explain why again. You are providing old covenant scripture that are not applicable to those living in the new covenant as the death penalty was not only for openly breaking the Sabbath (4th commandment) but for openly breaking anyone of God's 10 commandments in the old covenant *Deuteronomy 13:6-18; 1 Samuel 26:19; Deuteronomy 13:1-10; 17:2-5; 27:15; Deuteronomy 7:25-26; Leviticus 24:10-17; Exodus 31:14-15; 35:2; Leviticus 20:9; Deuteronomy 21:18-21; Exodus 21:17; Exodus 21:12-14; Leviticus 20; John 8:5; Exodus 21:16; Deuteronomy 19:15-21. That was to teach God's people the wages of sin (breaking any one of God's 10 commandments) is death as it does in the New Covenant *Romans 6:23 although Jesus says vengeance is mine at his 2nd coming *Romans 12:17-19; Revelation 22:12.

Also no dear friend I have not provided my own opinion I have provided scripture as shown in the posts you are quoting from that you have not addressed and refuse to respond to that demonstrate that the Word of God that I have provided are Gods' Words not mine that disagree with you.

According to God's word, all those who continue in known unrepentant sin will not enter into the kingdom of heaven *Hebrews 10:26-27 because they reject the gift of God's dear son *Romans 6:23. Obedience to God's law is not how we are saved it is the fruit of God's work in us as we believe and follow his word. If our faith has no fruit it is dead *James 2:18-20; 26 and our tree will be cast down and thrown into the fire *Matthew 3:10; 7:19-20; 13:49-50. We are saved by grace through faith and not of ourselves it is a gift of God *Ephesians 2:8. We are all sick with sin and need a Physician *Matthew 9:12-13. Jesus says arise take up your bed and walk. I believe him. How about you?

God's 4th commandment is one of the 10 commandments that gives us the KNOWLEDGE of what SIN is when broken *Romans 3:20. God's Word says if we knowingly break any one of God's commandments when God gives us a knowledge of the truth of his Word (James 4:17; Acts of the Apostles 17:30-31) we stand guilty before God of sin in James 2:10-11 and if we do not seek him in repentance and forgiveness according to the scriptures we are in danger of the Judgement according to Paul in Hebrews 10:26-27.

God's people are in every church according to Jesus in John 10:16 and He knows that many break this commandment out of ignorance and in times of ignorance God winks at *Acts of the Apostles 17:30-31 because what they have been taught in the Churches they may be in is not the truth of Gods' Word. Jesus says that the hour is coming and NOW is that he will call his people out from following the teachings and traditions of men to worship God in Spirit and in truth according to the truth of His Word *JOHN 4:23-24

Sunday worship is a tradition and teaching of man that has led many to break the commandments of God. Jesus says that if we follow the traditions of man that break the commandments of God we are not worshiping God in Matthew 15:3-9. There is not one scripture in all of God's Word that says that God's 4th Commandment is now ABOLISHED and we are now commanded to keep Sunday as a Holy day of rest.

Who should we follow the teachings and traditions of men or the Word of God? Who should we believe the Words of men or the Word of God? According to the scriptures Gods' sheep hear His Voice (the Word) and follow him. Those who do not hear will not follow him because they are not His sheep according to Jesus in John 10:26-27. Let's pray that we can all be His sheep.

Hope this helps.

JLB777 · Apr 14, 2021

LoveGodsWord said:
No dear friend but let me explain why again. You are providing old covenant scripture that are not applicable to those living in the new covenant as the death penalty was not only for openly breaking the Sabbath (4th commandment) but for openly breaking anyone of God's 10 commandments in the old covenant

Actually you are the one quoting Old Testament scriptures from the law of Moses to validate keeping the Sabbath today.

I am asking if you, if you yourself believe the Church is to observe these commandments from the law of Moses today.

Yes or No?

Here are the specific commandments I am asking you about.

Then he said to them, “This is what the Lord has said: ‘Tomorrow is a Sabbath rest, a holy Sabbath to the Lord. Bake what you will bake today, and boil what you will boil; and lay up for yourselves all that remains, to be kept until morning.’ ” So they laid it up till morning, as Moses commanded; and it did not stink, nor were there any worms in it. Then Moses said, “Eat that today, for today is a Sabbath to the Lord; today you will not find it in the field. Six days you shall gather it, but on the seventh day, the Sabbath, there will be none.”
Now it happened that some of the people went out on the seventh day to gather, but they found none. And the Lord said to Moses, “How long do you refuse to keep My commandments and My laws? See! For the Lord has given you the Sabbath; therefore He gives you on the sixth day bread for two days. Let every man remain in his place; let no man go out of his place on the seventh day.” So the people rested on the seventh day. Exodus 16:23-30

And the Lord spoke to Moses, saying, “Speak also to the children of Israel, saying: Surely My Sabbaths you shall keep, for it is a sign between Me and you throughout your generations, that you may know that I am the Lord who sanctifies you. You shall keep the Sabbath, therefore, for it is holy to you. Everyone who profanes it shall surely be put to death; for whoever does any work on it, that person shall be cut off from among his people. Work shall be done for six days, but the seventh is the Sabbath of rest, holy to the Lord. Whoever does any work on the Sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death.
Exodus 31:12-15

Then Moses gathered all the congregation of the children of Israel together, and said to them, “These are the words which the Lord has commanded you to do: Work shall be done for six days, but the seventh day shall be a holy day for you, a Sabbath of rest to the Lord. Whoever does any work on it shall be put to death. You shall kindle no fire throughout your dwellings on the Sabbath day.”Exodus 35:1-3

Now while the children of Israel were in the wilderness, they found a man gathering sticks on the Sabbath day. And those who found him gathering sticks brought him to Moses and Aaron, and to all the congregation. They put him under guard, because it had not been explained what should be done to him.
Then the Lord said to Moses, “The man must surely be put to death; all the congregation shall stone him with stones outside the camp.” So, as the Lord commanded Moses, all the congregation brought him outside the camp and stoned him with stones, and he died. Numbers 15:32-36

‘And on the Sabbath day two lambs in their first year, without blemish, and two-tenths of an ephah of fine flour as a grain offering, mixed with oil, with its drink offering— this is the burnt offering for every Sabbath, besides the regular burnt offering with its drink offering. Numbers 28:9

Do you claim the Church is to observe these Sabbath requirements?

Yes or No?

JLB

LoveGodsWord · Apr 14, 2021

JLB777 said:
Actually you are the one quoting Old Testament scriptures from the law of Moses to validate keeping the Sabbath today.

I am asking if you, if you yourself believe the Church is to observe these commandments from the law of Moses today.

Yes or No?

Here are the specific commandments I am asking you about.

Then he said to them, “This is what the Lord has said: ‘Tomorrow is a Sabbath rest, a holy Sabbath to the Lord. Bake what you will bake today, and boil what you will boil; and lay up for yourselves all that remains, to be kept until morning.’ ” So they laid it up till morning, as Moses commanded; and it did not stink, nor were there any worms in it. Then Moses said, “Eat that today, for today is a Sabbath to the Lord; today you will not find it in the field. Six days you shall gather it, but on the seventh day, the Sabbath, there will be none.”
Now it happened that some of the people went out on the seventh day to gather, but they found none. And the Lord said to Moses, “How long do you refuse to keep My commandments and My laws? See! For the Lord has given you the Sabbath; therefore He gives you on the sixth day bread for two days. Let every man remain in his place; let no man go out of his place on the seventh day.” So the people rested on the seventh day. Exodus 16:23-30

And the Lord spoke to Moses, saying, “Speak also to the children of Israel, saying: Surely My Sabbaths you shall keep, for it is a sign between Me and you throughout your generations, that you may know that I am the Lord who sanctifies you. You shall keep the Sabbath, therefore, for it is holy to you. Everyone who profanes it shall surely be put to death; for whoever does any work on it, that person shall be cut off from among his people. Work shall be done for six days, but the seventh is the Sabbath of rest, holy to the Lord. Whoever does any work on the Sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death.
Exodus 31:12-15

Then Moses gathered all the congregation of the children of Israel together, and said to them, “These are the words which the Lord has commanded you to do: Work shall be done for six days, but the seventh day shall be a holy day for you, a Sabbath of rest to the Lord. Whoever does any work on it shall be put to death. You shall kindle no fire throughout your dwellings on the Sabbath day.”Exodus 35:1-3

Now while the children of Israel were in the wilderness, they found a man gathering sticks on the Sabbath day. And those who found him gathering sticks brought him to Moses and Aaron, and to all the congregation. They put him under guard, because it had not been explained what should be done to him.
Then the Lord said to Moses, “The man must surely be put to death; all the congregation shall stone him with stones outside the camp.” So, as the Lord commanded Moses, all the congregation brought him outside the camp and stoned him with stones, and he died. Numbers 15:32-36

‘And on the Sabbath day two lambs in their first year, without blemish, and two-tenths of an ephah of fine flour as a grain offering, mixed with oil, with its drink offering— this is the burnt offering for every Sabbath, besides the regular burnt offering with its drink offering. Numbers 28:9

Do you claim the Church is to observe these Sabbath requirements?

Yes or No?

JLB

What do you think the full post you are responding to says where your micro-quoting me in the post you are quoting from? Here let me cut it and paste it in here for you again perhaps you missed it....

This was in response to your use of the old covenant scriptures in regards to those who were killed for breaking the 4th commandment and all Gods' commandments under the old covenant...

LoveGodsWord wrote (post # 409): "You are providing old covenant scripture that are not applicable to those living in the new covenant as the death penalty was not only for openly breaking the Sabbath (4th commandment) but for openly breaking anyone of God's 10 commandments in the old covenant *Deuteronomy 13:6-18; 1 Samuel 26:19; Deuteronomy 13:1-10; 17:2-5; 27:15; Deuteronomy 7:25-26; Leviticus 24:10-17; Exodus 31:14-15; 35:2; Leviticus 20:9; Deuteronomy 21:18-21; Exodus 21:17; Exodus 21:12-14; Leviticus 20; John 8:5; Exodus 21:16; Deuteronomy 19:15-21.

That was to teach God's people the wages of sin (breaking any one of God's 10 commandments) is death as it does in the New Covenant *Romans 6:23 although Jesus says vengeance is mine at his 2nd coming *Romans 12:17-19; Revelation 22:12. According to God's word, all those who continue in known unrepentant sin will not enter into the kingdom of heaven *Hebrews 10:26-27 because they reject the gift of God's dear son *Romans 6:23. Obedience to God's law is not how we are saved it is the fruit of God's work in us as we believe and follow his word.

If our faith has no fruit it is dead *James 2:18-20; 26 and our tree will be cast down and thrown into the fire *Matthew 3:10; 7:19-20; 13:49-50. We are saved by grace through faith and not of ourselves it is a gift of God *Ephesians 2:8. We are all sick with sin and need a Physician *Matthew 9:12-13. Jesus says arise take up your bed and walk. I believe him. How about you?

God's 4th commandment is one of the 10 commandments that gives us the KNOWLEDGE of what SIN is when broken *Romans 3:20. God's Word says if we knowingly break any one of God's commandments when God gives us a knowledge of the truth of his Word (James 4:17; Acts of the Apostles 17:30-31) we stand guilty before God of sin in James 2:10-11 and if we do not seek him in repentance and forgiveness according to the scriptures we are in danger of the Judgement according to Paul in Hebrews 10:26-27."

So no of course we do not kill anyone for openly breaking anyone of Gods' 10 commandments in the new covenant. As posted earlier. Jesus says vengeance is mine at his 2nd coming *Romans 12:17-19; Revelation 22:12.

Now all this was already posted in response to your questions from your earlier post. Perhaps you can take your time and read what you are quoting from before responding as it would help the conversation

Your welcome

JLB777 · Apr 15, 2021

LoveGodsWord said:
What do you think the full post you are responding to says where your micro-quoting me in the post you are quoting from? Here let me cut it and paste it in here for you again perhaps you missed it....

This was in response to your use of the old covenant scriptures in regards to those who were killed for breaking the 4th commandment and all Gods' commandments under the old covenant...

LoveGodsWord wrote (post # 409): "You are providing old covenant scripture that are not applicable to those living in the new covenant as the death penalty was not only for openly breaking the Sabbath (4th commandment) but for openly breaking anyone of God's 10 commandments in the old covenant *Deuteronomy 13:6-18; 1 Samuel 26:19; Deuteronomy 13:1-10; 17:2-5; 27:15; Deuteronomy 7:25-26; Leviticus 24:10-17; Exodus 31:14-15; 35:2; Leviticus 20:9; Deuteronomy 21:18-21; Exodus 21:17; Exodus 21:12-14; Leviticus 20; John 8:5; Exodus 21:16; Deuteronomy 19:15-21.

That was to teach God's people the wages of sin (breaking any one of God's 10 commandments) is death as it does in the New Covenant *Romans 6:23 although Jesus says vengeance is mine at his 2nd coming *Romans 12:17-19; Revelation 22:12. According to God's word, all those who continue in known unrepentant sin will not enter into the kingdom of heaven *Hebrews 10:26-27 because they reject the gift of God's dear son *Romans 6:23. Obedience to God's law is not how we are saved it is the fruit of God's work in us as we believe and follow his word.

If our faith has no fruit it is dead *James 2:18-20; 26 and our tree will be cast down and thrown into the fire *Matthew 3:10; 7:19-20; 13:49-50. We are saved by grace through faith and not of ourselves it is a gift of God *Ephesians 2:8. We are all sick with sin and need a Physician *Matthew 9:12-13. Jesus says arise take up your bed and walk. I believe him. How about you?

God's 4th commandment is one of the 10 commandments that gives us the KNOWLEDGE of what SIN is when broken *Romans 3:20. God's Word says if we knowingly break any one of God's commandments when God gives us a knowledge of the truth of his Word (James 4:17; Acts of the Apostles 17:30-31) we stand guilty before God of sin in James 2:10-11 and if we do not seek him in repentance and forgiveness according to the scriptures we are in danger of the Judgement according to Paul in Hebrews 10:26-27."

So no of course we do not kill anyone for openly breaking anyone of Gods' 10 commandments in the new covenant. As posted earlier. Jesus says vengeance is mine at his 2nd coming *Romans 12:17-19; Revelation 22:12.

Now all this was already posted in response to your questions from your earlier post. Perhaps you can take your time and read what you are quoting from before responding as it would help the conversation

Your welcome

Still dodging the question I see.

It’s a simple yes or no.

I am asking if you, if you yourself believe the Church is to observe these commandments from the law of Moses today.

Yes or No?

Here are the specific commandments I am asking you about.

Then he said to them, “This is what the Lord has said: ‘Tomorrow is a Sabbath rest, a holy Sabbath to the Lord. Bake what you will bake today, and boil what you will boil; and lay up for yourselves all that remains, to be kept until morning.’ ” So they laid it up till morning, as Moses commanded; and it did not stink, nor were there any worms in it. Then Moses said, “Eat that today, for today is a Sabbath to the Lord; today you will not find it in the field. Six days you shall gather it, but on the seventh day, the Sabbath, there will be none.”
Now it happened that some of the people went out on the seventh day to gather, but they found none. And the Lord said to Moses, “How long do you refuse to keep My commandments and My laws? See! For the Lord has given you the Sabbath; therefore He gives you on the sixth day bread for two days. Let every man remain in his place; let no man go out of his place on the seventh day.” So the people rested on the seventh day. Exodus 16:23-30

And the Lord spoke to Moses, saying, “Speak also to the children of Israel, saying: Surely My Sabbaths you shall keep, for it is a sign between Me and you throughout your generations, that you may know that I am the Lord who sanctifies you. You shall keep the Sabbath, therefore, for it is holy to you. Everyone who profanes it shall surely be put to death; for whoever does any work on it, that person shall be cut off from among his people. Work shall be done for six days, but the seventh is the Sabbath of rest, holy to the Lord. Whoever does any work on the Sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death.
Exodus 31:12-15

Then Moses gathered all the congregation of the children of Israel together, and said to them, “These are the words which the Lord has commanded you to do: Work shall be done for six days, but the seventh day shall be a holy day for you, a Sabbath of rest to the Lord. Whoever does any work on it shall be put to death. You shall kindle no fire throughout your dwellings on the Sabbath day.”Exodus 35:1-3

Now while the children of Israel were in the wilderness, they found a man gathering sticks on the Sabbath day. And those who found him gathering sticks brought him to Moses and Aaron, and to all the congregation. They put him under guard, because it had not been explained what should be done to him.
Then the Lord said to Moses, “The man must surely be put to death; all the congregation shall stone him with stones outside the camp.” So, as the Lord commanded Moses, all the congregation brought him outside the camp and stoned him with stones, and he died. Numbers 15:32-36

‘And on the Sabbath day two lambs in their first year, without blemish, and two-tenths of an ephah of fine flour as a grain offering, mixed with oil, with its drink offering— this is the burnt offering for every Sabbath, besides the regular burnt offering with its drink offering. Numbers 28:9

Do you claim the Church is to observe these Sabbath requirements?

Yes or No?

JLB

tampasteve · Apr 15, 2021

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Bob S · Apr 15, 2021

imge said:
Is it @LoveGodsWord who is asking to keep the commandments or is it our Savior?

John 14:15 15 “If you love Me, keep My commandments.

John 15:10 If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love, just as I have kept My Father’s commandments and abide in His love.

It would seem like you believe the Father's commandments are the same as Jesus commandments. It seems to me that if they are the same Jesus would not have clarified in verse 10 any difference. The fact is that the verse indicates that there is a difference in the commands the Father gave and the commands Jesus has given us. Jesus was under the old covenant laws which meant he was obligated to keep all of the Holy days of that covenant. Jesus' commandments to us never mention the keeping of days.

These scriptures should be words in red in your Bible.

Only if I have a red-letter Bible.

LoveGodsWord · Apr 15, 2021

Bob S said:
It would seem like you believe the Father's commandments are the same as Jesus commandments. It seems to me that if they are the same Jesus would not have clarified in verse 10 any difference. The fact is that the verse indicates that there is a difference in the commands the Father gave and the commands Jesus has given us. Jesus was under the old covenant laws which meant he was obligated to keep all of the Holy days of that covenant. Jesus' commandments to us never mention the keeping of days.

Only if I have a red-letter Bible.

Hello Bob, According to the scriptures, Jesus says if a house be divided against itself, that house cannot stand (Mark 3:25) and Jesus and the father are one in mind, purpose and Spirit *John 10:30; 14:10-11; 17:23. The old testament scriptures do not contradict the new testament scriptures they point to the new testament scriptures just as love is not separate from law and grace it is expressed in obedience to law *Romans 13:8-10; James 2:8-12; Matthew 22:36-40 and points to God's grace that we receive through faith *Ephesians 2:8-9. This same faith does not abolish Gods' law according to the scriptures it establishes Gods law in the life of those who believe and follow Gods' Word *Romans 3:31 as we walk in His Spirit *Galatians 5:16. For example the two great commandments to love God with all of our mind heart and soul and our neighbor as ourselves is not a new commandment. Jesus is quoting from Deuteronomy 6:5 and Leviticus 19:18 when he says in Matthew 22:40 "On these two great commandments of love hang all the law and the prophets". Paul also agreeing with Jesus showing how we love our neighbor not doing those things in God's 10 commandments that are against our neighbor showing that we love our neighbor by obedience to Gods' law not by breaking it. Paul goes on to state all those commandments that are our duty of love to our fellow man by quoting God's 10 commandments in Romans 13:8-10. James goes a step further by showing that if we keep all of God's 10 commandments as our duty of love to our neighbor in James 2:10-11 and break any one of them we stand guilty before God of sin. So to claim that the father has different commandments to the son and that Jesus has different laws to the Father and the laws of Jesus delete the laws of the father is not biblical according to the scriptures.

JLB777 · Apr 16, 2021

JLB777 said:
Still dodging the question I see.

It’s a simple yes or no.

I am asking if you, if you yourself believe the Church is to observe these commandments from the law of Moses today.

Yes or No?

Here are the specific commandments I am asking you about.

Then he said to them, “This is what the Lord has said: ‘Tomorrow is a Sabbath rest, a holy Sabbath to the Lord. Bake what you will bake today, and boil what you will boil; and lay up for yourselves all that remains, to be kept until morning.’ ” So they laid it up till morning, as Moses commanded; and it did not stink, nor were there any worms in it. Then Moses said, “Eat that today, for today is a Sabbath to the Lord; today you will not find it in the field. Six days you shall gather it, but on the seventh day, the Sabbath, there will be none.”
Now it happened that some of the people went out on the seventh day to gather, but they found none. And the Lord said to Moses, “How long do you refuse to keep My commandments and My laws? See! For the Lord has given you the Sabbath; therefore He gives you on the sixth day bread for two days. Let every man remain in his place; let no man go out of his place on the seventh day.” So the people rested on the seventh day. Exodus 16:23-30

And the Lord spoke to Moses, saying, “Speak also to the children of Israel, saying: Surely My Sabbaths you shall keep, for it is a sign between Me and you throughout your generations, that you may know that I am the Lord who sanctifies you. You shall keep the Sabbath, therefore, for it is holy to you. Everyone who profanes it shall surely be put to death; for whoever does any work on it, that person shall be cut off from among his people. Work shall be done for six days, but the seventh is the Sabbath of rest, holy to the Lord. Whoever does any work on the Sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death.
Exodus 31:12-15

Then Moses gathered all the congregation of the children of Israel together, and said to them, “These are the words which the Lord has commanded you to do: Work shall be done for six days, but the seventh day shall be a holy day for you, a Sabbath of rest to the Lord. Whoever does any work on it shall be put to death. You shall kindle no fire throughout your dwellings on the Sabbath day.”Exodus 35:1-3

Now while the children of Israel were in the wilderness, they found a man gathering sticks on the Sabbath day. And those who found him gathering sticks brought him to Moses and Aaron, and to all the congregation. They put him under guard, because it had not been explained what should be done to him.
Then the Lord said to Moses, “The man must surely be put to death; all the congregation shall stone him with stones outside the camp.” So, as the Lord commanded Moses, all the congregation brought him outside the camp and stoned him with stones, and he died. Numbers 15:32-36

‘And on the Sabbath day two lambs in their first year, without blemish, and two-tenths of an ephah of fine flour as a grain offering, mixed with oil, with its drink offering— this is the burnt offering for every Sabbath, besides the regular burnt offering with its drink offering. Numbers 28:9

Do you claim the Church is to observe these Sabbath requirements?

Yes or No?

JLB

It’s sad that a simple question can seem to be answered.

The answer is no. The Church is not required to observe the Sabbath as required by the law of Moses.

So the question is, what specific requirements is the Church required to observe concerning the Sabbath?

We must ask for specific scriptural statements from Jesus or His Apostles, as to how the Church is required to observe the Sabbath under the New Covenant, since some organizations claim that eternal damnation will result for the one who doesn’t “keep the Sabbath”, the 4th Commandment.

One would think, if keeping the Sabbath correctly was so crucial to ones salvation that one could easily find specific instructions from Jesus or His Apostles, as to how to keep the Sabbath under the New Covenant, since we are no longer under the law of Moses.

I and many others have repeatedly asked this question over the years, to @LovesGodsWord but only received scriptures from the law, or scriptures that showed Paul went into a synagogue on the Sabbath to teach about Christ, or a vague reference about it’s ok to “do good” on the Sabbath.

So far, based on the teaching of LovesGodsWord, we have this —

New Testament requirements for keeping the Sabbath:

Paul went to a synagogue as a Jew, on the Sabbath to reason with Jews about Christ.
Doing good

Can anyone else add some things to this list, so we can bring some much needed clarity to the issue of specific instructions for keeping the Sabbath.

JLB

SabbathBlessings · Apr 16, 2021

JLB777 said:
It’s sad that a simple question can seem to be answered.

The answer is no. The Church is not required to observe the Sabbath as required by the law of Moses.

So the question is, what specific requirements is the Church required to observe concerning the Sabbath?

We must ask for specific scriptural statements from Jesus or His Apostles, as to how the Church is required to observe the Sabbath under the New Covenant, since some organizations claim that eternal damnation will result for the one who doesn’t “keep the Sabbath”, the 4th Commandment.

One would think, if keeping the Sabbath correctly was so crucial to ones salvation that one could easily find specific instructions from Jesus or His Apostles, as to how to keep the Sabbath under the New Covenant, since we are no longer under the law of Moses.

I and many others have repeatedly asked this question over the years, to @LovesGodsWord but only received scriptures from the law, or scriptures that showed Paul went into a synagogue on the Sabbath to teach about Christ, or a vague reference about it’s ok to “do good” on the Sabbath.

So far, based on the teaching of LovesGodsWord, we have this —

New Testament requirements for keeping the Sabbath:

Paul went to a synagogue as a Jew, on the Sabbath to reason with Jews about Christ.

Doing good

Can anyone else add some things to this list, so we can bring some much needed clarity to the issue of specific instructions for keeping the Sabbath.

JLB

The question was answered in detail, but you can’t force someone to “hear” what they don’t want to.

Danthemailman · Apr 16, 2021

JLB777 said:
It’s sad that a simple question can seem to be answered.

The answer is no. The Church is not required to observe the Sabbath as required by the law of Moses.

Amen! Sabbath keeping with all it's rules and regulations, was part of a covenant with Israel (Exodus 16:23, 29; 31:12-18; 35:1-3; Leviticus 19:30; 23:2-3, 32; Numbers 15:32-36; 28:1-10; 29:39-40; I Chronicles. 23:30-31; II Chronicles 31:2-4; Isaiah 1:13; Amos 8:5; Nehemiah 10:31) that is not binding on Christians under the new covenant. (Colossians 2:16-17)

LoveGodsWord · Apr 16, 2021

Danthemailman said:
Amen! Sabbath keeping with all it's rules and regulations, was part of a covenant with Israel (Exodus 16:23, 29; 31:12-18; 35:1-3; Leviticus 19:30; 23:2-3, 32; Numbers 15:32-36; 28:1-10; 29:39-40; I Chronicles. 23:30-31; II Chronicles 31:2-4; Isaiah 1:13; Amos 8:5; Nehemiah 10:31) that is not binding on Christians under the new covenant. (Colossians 2:16-17)

According to the scriptures everyone of God's 10 commandments are repeated in the new covenant (scriptures here) which of course is to God's ISRAEL *Hebrews 8:10-11 from Jeremiah 31:31-34 and Ezekiel 36:24-27. If we are not a part of God's ISRAEL in the new covenant we have no part in God's new covenant promise which is to ISRAEL who is defined in the new covenant as not longer being those of the flesh but those of the Spirit *Romans 9:6-8; Galatians 3:28-29; Romans 2:28-29. Therefore are all those who now believe and follow God's Word. Gentile believers are now grafted in with Jewish believers *Romans 11:13-27 and we are all one in Christ *Ephesians 2:11-13; Colossians 3:11; Romans 10:11-13. Therefore the Sabbath not according to old covenant rules and regulations but according to the 4th commandment of God's 10 commandments in Exodus 20:8-11 is still a requirement for Christian living as are all of God's 10 commandments according to Jesus and the Apostles (scripture support here). James of course show this beyond any doubt when he says if we break anyone of God's 10 commandments we stand guilty before God of sin in James 2:10-11. Colossians 2:16 of course is in regards to the sabbaths in the feast days which is the context of the scriptures not Gods' 4th commandment of the 10 commandments made before law and sin outside of the shadows pointing backwards not forwards to the finished work of creation *Genesis 2:1-3; Exodus 20:8-11.

Bob S · Apr 17, 2021

LoveGodsWord said:
It seems quite preposterous, that God would give the seventh day Sabbath to mankind at creation (Genesis 2:1-3), re-introduce it to Israel BEFORE Sinai - after they lost sight of it in captivity (Exodus 16:4-23; 27-29), codify it at Sinai (Exodus 20:1-17) having all His people observe it, including Christ, then change it to Sunday, just to change it back to Friday sunset - Saturday sunset.

It would be preposterous until you know the real truth. The Sabbath was not given to all "mankind" at creation. There is absolutely nothing to indicate that Adam and Eve were made to rest when God did. Teaching otherwise is false teaching. You cannot prove such a thing and only makes us leery. Nothing in all of history gives any hint that anyone ever observed the Seventh-day as a day of rest until just before Sinai. God didn't have the Israelites rest while fleeing Egypt. Only after they were safe across the Red Sea did He teach them to observe a day.

THE SABBATH HAS NEVER CHANGED AND IS STILL TO BE OBSERVED!

Correct it never changed and since it was part of the old covenant laws it just became obsolete, as did all of the other ritual given only to Israel, with the coming of Jersus and the new covenant. Jesus never told His disciples to teach keeping a day. If it were a salvational issue, like you teach, surely teaching proper observation to Gentiles would be at the top of the list. Our omnipotent God surely would have known that His children would not be concerned with something that was never taught.

LoveGodsWord · Apr 17, 2021

Bob S said:
The Sabbath was not given to all "mankind" at creation. There is absolutely nothing to indicate that Adam and Eve were made to rest when God did. Teaching otherwise is false teaching. You cannot prove such a thing and only makes us leery. Nothing in all of history gives any hint that anyone ever observed the Seventh-day as a day of rest until just before Sinai. God didn't have the Israelites rest while fleeing Egypt. Only after they were safe across the Red Sea did He teach them to observe a day.

Do you think Jesus got it wrong Bob when he days that the Sabbath was made for all mankind in Mark 2:27? Yet we know is it Jesus who is the God of creation and Lord of the Sabbath according to John 1:1-4; 14; Ephesians 3:9; Colossians 1:6; Mark 2:28 and Matthew 12:8 so for me I think Jesus knows what he is talking about here. Jesus says that the Sabbath was made for mankind.

According to the scriptures the Sabbath was made on the "seventh day" of the creation week where God blessed "the seventh day" and made it a holy day of rest *Genesis 2:1-3. There was no Jew, no Israel no Moses when God created the Sabbath for mankind at that time. There was only Adam and Eve the parents of all mankind that were created on the sixth day of the week according to Genesis 1:26:31.

So to claim that the Sabbath was only made for the Jews and the nation of Israel is not biblical according to the new covenant scriptures provided. This said I do agree that according to the scriptures that the Sabbath is an everlasting covenant with God's ISRAEL but according to the new covenant scriptures Gods' ISRAEL in the new covenant are no longer those that are born of the flesh but those who are born of the Spirit *John 3:3-7 who do not practice sin according to John which is defined as breaking anyone of God's 10 commandments (including the Sabbath which is one of God's 10 commandments -Exodus 20:8-11) in 1 John 3:4-9.

God's ISRAEL in the new covenant therefore according to the scriptures are all those who believe and follow Gods' Word and have been born again through faith to enter into God's new covenant promise of a new heart to love *Romans 9:6-9; Galatians 3:28-29; Romans 2:28-29; Hebrews 8:10-12 from Jeremiah 31:31-34 and Ezekiel 36:24-27. If we are not a part of God's ISRAEL according to these scriptures as have no part in Gods' new covenant promise. Gentiles believers are now grafted in with Jewish believers and we are all now one in Christ *Romans 11:13-27; Ephesians 2:11-13; Galatians 3:28-29; Romans 10:12; Colossians 3:11.Therefore as the scriptures teach in Hebrews 4:9 THEREFORE IT REMAINS FOR THE PEOPLE OF GOD TO KEEP THE SABBATH.

The Sabbath according to the scriptures is an everlasting covenant Bob and a sign that we as God's people (Israel) in both the old and new covenant's worship the true and only God of creation and it is God who saves us from our sins *Ezekiel 20:12; 20. If we are not a part of God's ISRAEL who in the new covenant are now all those who believe and follow God's Word we have no part in God's new covenant promise which is to ISRAEL according to the scriptures.

Bob S said:
Correct it never changed and since it was part of the old covenant laws it just became obsolete, as did all of the other ritual given only to Israel, with the coming of Jersus and the new covenant. Jesus never told His disciples to teach keeping a day. If it were a salvational issue, like you teach, surely teaching proper observation to Gentiles would be at the top of the list. Our omnipotent God surely would have known that His children would not be concerned with something that was never taught.

Bob here your mixing up the old covenant shadow laws from the Mosaic book of the covenant *Exodus 24:7 and the laws for remission of sins that are fulfilled and continued in Christ based on better promises (Hebrews 7:1-25; Hebrews 8:1-13; Hebrews 9:1-27 and Hebrews 10:1-22 with God's eternal law (10 commandments) that are all repeated in the new covenant as a the standard for Christian living that give us the knowledge of what sin is when broken and righteousness when obeyed *1 John 3:4; Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; Psalms 119:172. According to James if we break anyone of God's 10 commandments we stand guilty before God of sin *James 2:10-11.

May God bless us as we seek Him through His Word.

ARE ALL THE 10 COMMANDMENTS IN THE OLD AND NEW TESTAMENT?

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