An Adventist view of the Sabbath Commandment - and why it is applicable to all mankind

Jun 26, 2003
8,127
1,189
Visit site
✟258,241.00
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Private
First of all, there is no reason to think otherwise. We know John was a disciple of Jesus and He was a Jew/Israelite that did the customs that included remembering the Sabbath each week.

Secondly, we know that John knew the great love Jesus had for Him and was very intimate with it. Knowing and understanding the love of Christ changes you and it is evident in what he writes.

Jesus never declared any day to be His day - other than the Sabbath.

I'll restate the fact that this is a huge thing to be written like that. Through it, we see that by the Spirit of God we know what the Sabbath was all about.


So you have no authority, just conjecture on your part? For 1800 years the church never taught to worship on the Sabbath. It was the Judahizers that taught this, and the Judahizers were rebuked.
I know you mean well, but your teaching was not taught in Christianity until Ellen White with her husband started the Seventh Day Adventists in 1860. Ellen White also becomes suspect when she attempts to defend the Albigensians. Albigensians or Cathars were dualist that taught that spirit was good matter was evil. This is a direct contradiction of Genesis 1:31 that says God saw all that He had created and it was very good. I don’t know why she would mention them in the Great Controversy.
She also mentions the Waldensians. There is some debate as to whether they kept the Sabbath or the term Sabat referred to the wooden sandals they wore. Walsensians were eventually associated with Calvinists and in 1975 merged with Methodists. Why didn’t they join the SDA?

Do you have any authoritative source that says John the Apostle meant the Sabbath when he said the Lord’s day?
 
Upvote 0

Nathan@work

Always ready :)
Feb 19, 2021
1,025
360
45
Garfield
✟27,017.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
So you have no authority, just conjecture on your part? For 1800 years the church never taught to worship on the Sabbath. It was the Judahizers that taught this, and the Judahizers were rebuked.
I know you mean well, but your teaching was not taught in Christianity until Ellen White with her husband started the Seventh Day Adventists in 1860. Ellen White also becomes suspect when she attempts to defend the Albigensians. Albigensians or Cathars were dualist that taught that spirit was good matter was evil. This is a direct contradiction of Genesis 1:31 that says God saw all that He had created and it was very good. I don’t know why she would mention them in the Great Controversy.
She also mentions the Waldensians. There is some debate as to whether they kept the Sabbath or the term Sabat referred to the wooden sandals they wore. Walsensians were eventually associated with Calvinists and in 1975 merged with Methodists. Why didn’t they join the SDA?

Do you have any authoritative source that says John the Apostle meant the Sabbath when he said the Lord’s day?

Ummm.....I am not SDA. I do not believe the SDA teaches what I have been saying. An SDA member is welcome to tell me if I am wrong on that or not.

I am not saying anyone has to worship on the Sabbath. I think you may be associating my using the term 'Sabbath' with me thinking people should do or no do certain things on the weekly Sabbath?

As a believer in Christ, and part of His body the Church, I have as much authority as any other believer to point out that John was speaking of the Sabbath and giving new light to it. There is no reason to think he otherwise meant something else.
 
Upvote 0

Valletta

Well-Known Member
Oct 10, 2020
8,307
3,082
Minnesota
✟214,305.00
Country
United States
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
So you have no authority, just conjecture on your part? For 1800 years the church never taught to worship on the Sabbath. It was the Judahizers that taught this, and the Judahizers were rebuked.
I know you mean well, but your teaching was not taught in Christianity until Ellen White with her husband started the Seventh Day Adventists in 1860. Ellen White also becomes suspect when she attempts to defend the Albigensians. Albigensians or Cathars were dualist that taught that spirit was good matter was evil. This is a direct contradiction of Genesis 1:31 that says God saw all that He had created and it was very good. I don’t know why she would mention them in the Great Controversy.
She also mentions the Waldensians. There is some debate as to whether they kept the Sabbath or the term Sabat referred to the wooden sandals they wore. Walsensians were eventually associated with Calvinists and in 1975 merged with Methodists. Why didn’t they join the SDA?

Do you have any authoritative source that says John the Apostle meant the Sabbath when he said the Lord’s day?
You are correct. Indeed the Lord's Day was Sunday, as a day of honor recognizing Jesus rose on Sunday.
SDAs regard the Bible as being the Word of God and infallible, they should remember it was the Catholic Church that chose the books of the Bible, and preached, kept, and translated Biblical text into so many common languages to bring the Word of God to the people. No Catholic Church, no Bible. Why do SDAs accept the Bible but not Sundays as days to honor our Lord?
 
Upvote 0

Nathan@work

Always ready :)
Feb 19, 2021
1,025
360
45
Garfield
✟27,017.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
You are correct. Indeed the Lord's Day was Sunday, as a day of honor recognizing Jesus rose on Sunday.
SDAs regard the Bible as being the Word of God and infallible, they should remember it was the Catholic Church that chose the books of the Bible, and preached, kept, and translated Biblical text into so many common languages to bring the Word of God to the people. No Catholic Church, no Bible. Why do SDAs accept the Bible but not Sundays as days to honor our Lord?
Is it only because the Catholic Church deemed Monday the Lords day that you believe it is?

Do you believe everything the Catholic Church has deemed to be?


John wrote Revelation long before the Catholic Church was organized and compiled the Bible.

In other words, John was not following Catholic Church doctrine when he said he was in the Spirit on the Lords day. He was an Israelite and as such would have recognized the Sabbath as the Lords day - as should we.
 
Upvote 0

BobRyan

Junior Member
Angels Team
Site Supporter
Nov 21, 2008
51,351
10,606
Georgia
✟911,824.00
Country
United States
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
Right, the weekly Sabbath was to remind them of the actual Sabbath day of creation. That is why they observed it from sundown to sundown.

The weekly Sabbath observance was a direct reference to the Sabbath day God rested - which is what the command is to remember.

Remember the Sabbath(singular) to keep it(singular) holy - not remember the Sabbaths(plural) to keep them(plural) holy.

I see your point - but in that same command "the 7th day is THE Sabbath of the LORD (YHWH)"


"8 “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God. In it you shall do no work: "

The way you are defining it - we are never "in it"
 
Upvote 0

BobRyan

Junior Member
Angels Team
Site Supporter
Nov 21, 2008
51,351
10,606
Georgia
✟911,824.00
Country
United States
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
So you have no authority, just conjecture on your part? For 1800 years the church never taught to worship on the Sabbath. It was the Judahizers that taught this, and the Judahizers were rebuked.

1. There is not one single text of any NT leader rebuking someone for keeping the Sabbath.


I know you mean well, but your teaching was not taught in Christianity until Ellen White

2. Adventists were first-day Adventists until a Bible study and a few meetings with Seventh-day Baptists opened their eyes to important Bible details.

3. And the fact that ALL TEN of the TEN commandments (not just nine) are written on the heart and mind under the NEW Covenant is a Bible fact that Bible scholars in almost all Christian denominations admit to - as we saw on page 1 of this thread.


Do you have any authoritative source that says John the Apostle meant the Sabbath when he said the Lord’s day?

1. Rev 1 contains no reference at all to week-day-1
2. Even the RCC admits that the LORD's Day as given in the Bible - is Saturday
3. Is 58:13 calls Sabbath "The Holy Day of the LORD"
4. Mark 2:28 "The Son of man is LORD of the Sabbath".

Nothing like that exists in scripture for "week day 1".

And of course "every Sabbath" Acts 18:4 - Gospel preaching to gentiles and Jews in the NT.

You are correct. Indeed the Lord's Day was Sunday, as a day of honor recognizing Jesus rose on Sunday.

At some point tradition created that idea - but it is not a text in the Bible.
 
  • Like
Reactions: HIM
Upvote 0

dqhall

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Jul 21, 2015
7,547
4,171
Florida
Visit site
✟766,603.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
No - should it??
Christ himself said that even an ox-in-ditch form of relief is justified Deut 22:4, Luke 14:5
Thanks. Wanting a Sabbath rest is not a problem. Having a day off seems to be universal now. The Chinese have a five day work week. In India they work Mon to Sat with Sun off.
 
Upvote 0

Nathan@work

Always ready :)
Feb 19, 2021
1,025
360
45
Garfield
✟27,017.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
I see your point - but in that same command "the 7th day is THE Sabbath of the LORD (YHWH)"


"8 “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God. In it you shall do no work: "

The way you are defining it - we are never "in it"

The command is separate than the way they were instructed to observe it.

They were to observe it in a manner that would always point them to Christ. Just like the sacrifices and all the other laws pointed to Christ in their observance.

However, the command itself, was to remember the Sabbath day of creation.

Moses wrote in how they were to observe the command of the Sabbath, in with the commandments instead of just outside of them like the others.

The details of how they were to observe the ten commands followed in the rest of the Torah.

Why did Moses decide to put the observance of it within the ‘list’? I think it was because they had already been given the rules of observance before getting to Horeb. So they were familiar with it more so than the others.

What we do know is that it is an interjection of observance rules based on the fact the reason changes when it is repeated in Deuteronomy.

So again, the 4th commandment is to remember the Sabbath day of creation, the ceremonial/ritual observance of it was a weekly Sabbath.

Those ceremonial/ritual aspects were fulfilled in Christ. The commandment still stands though. Now we observe it in the Spirit, through our rest in Christ.
 
Upvote 0

HIM

Friend
CF Ambassadors
Site Supporter
Mar 9, 2018
3,985
1,749
58
Alabama
Visit site
✟375,906.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
The command is separate than the way they were instructed to observe it.
No it is not.




So again, the 4th commandment is to remember the Sabbath day of creation, the ceremonial/ritual observance of it was a weekly Sabbath.

No the commandment Is to remember, mark THE Day, AND keep it holy. AND To do ALL OUR Labor and all our work the OTHER six, BUT the Seventh Day is the Sabbath of God AND on it we shall not do any of OUR work BECAUSE God rested on the Seventh AND BECAUSE He did He blessed and Hallowed, Set it apart for HOLY USE it.
Question; If it was blessed and Hallowed back on the Seventh day at the end of Creation and was STILL Blessed and Hallowed, set apart for Holy use at Mt. Sinai. Is it still Blessed and Hallowed in honor of Creation TODAY?

YES!


Exod 20:8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
Exod 20:9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
Exod 20:10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:
Exod 20:11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

Those ceremonial/ritual aspects were fulfilled in Christ. The commandment still stands though. Now we observe it in the Spirit, through our rest in Christ.
ON the SEVENTH DAY. If we do not then we are sinning.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

HIM

Friend
CF Ambassadors
Site Supporter
Mar 9, 2018
3,985
1,749
58
Alabama
Visit site
✟375,906.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Moses wrote in how they were to observe the command of the Sabbath, in with the commandments instead of just outside of them like the others.

The details of how they were to observe the ten commands followed in the rest of the Torah.
The commands as given on Sinai are complete in and of themselves. The details on how we are to observe them are within all the commands themselves as spoken by our Lord God.
 
Upvote 0
Jun 26, 2003
8,127
1,189
Visit site
✟258,241.00
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Private
Ummm.....I am not SDA. I do not believe the SDA teaches what I have been saying. An SDA member is welcome to tell me if I am wrong on that or not.

I am not saying anyone has to worship on the Sabbath. I think you may be associating my using the term 'Sabbath' with me thinking people should do or no do certain things on the weekly Sabbath?

As a believer in Christ, and part of His body the Church, I have as much authority as any other believer to point out that John was speaking of the Sabbath and giving new light to it. There is no reason to think he otherwise meant something else.

There is no evidence that John was speaking of the Sabbath when he said the Lord’s day. There is evidence that the apostles taught that the Lord’s day was the day of Christ’s Resurrection, the first day of the week. Your claim of personal authority is placing yourself above the word of God
In Christianity there is more evidence that Jesus Christ has taken the place of the Sabbath. Matthew 16:25 whoever wants to save his life will lose it whoever loses his life for My sake shall find it. Colossians 3 says to set our minds on things above and not on earthly things. We are dead to the world alive to Christ
The Apostles never taught Sabbath keeping or circumcision as necessary for Christians. They did teach rest from earthly labors and new life in Christ. The plain reading of Romans
14 and Colossians 2 teaches against keeping the Sabbath as a day, but our rest is in Christ
We do not worship a day, we worship the Lord. Psalm 94 warns us do not grow stubborn as your fathers did in the wilderness although they has seen all of my works. They are a people whose hearts go astray and they do not know my ways. I swore in my wrath they shall not enter my rest
 
Upvote 0

Danthemailman

Well-Known Member
Jul 18, 2017
3,702
2,813
Midwest
✟304,979.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Ex 20:11 makes the case that the first text showing that humans were obligated to keep God's Sabbath - was Gen 2:1-3.

Gen 2:1-3
And so the heavens and the earth were completed, and all their heavenly lights. 2 By the seventh day God completed His work which He had done, and He rested on the seventh day from all His work which He had done. 3 Then God blessed the seventh day and sanctified it, because on it He rested from all His work which God had created and made.
The passage simply says that God rested on the seventh day from all His work which He had done. There is no command here in Genesis 2:1-3 for humans to keep the sabbath.

Although God's rest on the seventh day did foreshadow a future sabbath law, there is no Biblical record of the sabbath before the children of Israel left the land of Egypt. Nowhere in Scripture is there any hint that sabbath keeping was practiced from Adam to Moses.

The word "sabbath" first appears in Exodus 16:23 - Then he said to them, “This is what the Lord has said: ‘Tomorrow is a sabbath rest, a holy sabbath to the Lord. Bake what you will bake today, and boil what you will boil; and lay up for yourselves all that remains, to be kept until morning.

Look at Deuteronomy 5:1-15 which gives the commandments to Israel. 2 The Lord our God made a covenant with us in Horeb. 3 The Lord did not make this covenant with our fathers, but with us, those who are here today, all of us who are alive.

Nehemiah 9:13 - Then You came down on Mount Sinai, And spoke with them from heaven; You gave them just ordinances and true laws, Good statutes and commandments. 14 So You made known to them Your holy sabbath, And laid down for them commandments, statutes and law, Through Your servant Moses.

Ex 20:11
11 For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea and everything that is in them, and He rested on the seventh day; for that reason the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy (same word as in Gen 2 - Sanctified)

Ex 20:8-11 declares that God's act of Sanctifying something on Earth - creates an obligation for mankind to honor it.

Ex 20:10 "the seventh day is the Sabbath of the LORD (YHWH)"
Exodus 20 is written to the Israelites under the old covenant. Exodus 20:1 - And God spoke all these words, saying: 2 "I am the Lord your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage."

Mark 2:27 "the Sabbath was made for mankind - not mankind MADE for the Sabbath" speaks to the "making of both" in Gen 1-2:3.
The sabbath is made for man and the Israelites are of mankind. Jesus did not say ALL mankind here (Jew and Gentile alike). Exodus 31:16-17 and Deuteronomy 5:15 are very clear on this.

Sabbath observance was a sign between God and Israel (and not ALL mankind). "The Israelites are to observe the sabbath, celebrating it for the generations to come as a lasting covenant. It will be a sign between me and the Israelites forever, for in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, and on the seventh day he abstained from work and rested." (Exodus 31:16-17)

*In Deuteronomy 5, Moses restates the Ten Commandments to the next generation of Israelites. Here, after commanding sabbath observance in verses 12–14, Moses gives the reason the sabbath was given to the Israelites (and not ALL mankind). "Remember that you were slaves in Egypt and that the Lord your God brought you out of there with a mighty hand and an outstretched arm. Therefore the Lord your God has commanded you to observe the Sabbath day." (Deuteronomy 5:15)

No wonder gentiles are commanded not to profane the Sabbath in Is 56:6.
Is 56:
Also the foreigners who join themselves to the Lord,
To attend to His service and to love the name of the Lord,
To be His servants, every one who keeps the Sabbath so as not to profane it,
And holds firmly to My covenant;
In regards to Isaiah 56:2-6, foreigners were to "join themselves to the Lord;" and "love the name of the Lord;" and "be his servants;" and "take hold of God's covenant." The old covenant. But to do this they had to be circumcised, for God said: "No foreigner uncircumcised in heart and uncircumcised in flesh, of all the foreigners who are among the sons of Israel, shall enter My sanctuary." (Ezekiel 44:9). When Gentiles thus "joined themselves to the Lord" they CEASED BEING GENTILES and became proselytes to the Jewish religion. They kept the Sabbath AS JEWISH PROSELYTES, NOT as Gentiles.

But WHERE ARE GENTILES as Gentiles ever commanded to keep the sabbath? Furthermore, if the sabbath was of universal application, why were the Gentiles called "strangers?" The apostle Paul, speaking of the Gentiles during the Jewish age, says they were "strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world?" (Ephesians 2:12).

And when God gave the sabbath commandment at Sinai, why did he make it binding only on "the stranger that is within your gates?" (Exodus 20:10). Where is the passage that proves the sabbath was binding on the Gentile OUTSIDE the gates? All this shows the sabbath was NOT universally applied. If it had been, there would have been no "strangers from the covenants of promise."

This obligation regarding the Sabbath commandment continues for all mankind - as it is included in the Law "written on heart and mind" under Jeremiah's New Covenant Jer 31:31-34 and is applicable to all mankind for all eternity after the cross in the New Earth according Is 66:23.
In regards to Isaiah 66:22-23, this merely teaches that from month to month and from week to week, God’s people will worship Him. In the new heaven and the new earth, we read there will have no need of the sun or moon, there will be no night there, but one perpetual day and the glory of God will illuminate it. (Revelation 21:23-25) How then could there be a cycle of seven days that would allow for literally keeping the weekly sabbath day under the law? The Isaiah passage simply means that God’s people will perpetually worship Him in contrast to keeping the weekly sabbath day under the law.

Furthermore, if you insist on sabbath observances based on Isaiah 66:23, then you also need to observe new moons as well. Yet from what I hear, SDA's don’t observe new moons, which is inconsistent. New moons require night, which requires night in heaven, yet there is no day and night cycles in heaven. You cannot have "new moon to new moon" or "sabbath days" without day and night. Will there be Levital priests in the new heaven? If Isaiah 66:23 teaches that we will keep the sabbath day in the new heaven, then it also teaches in Isaiah 66:21 that the Levitical priests will be in the new heaven, because it is also mentioned. What happened to the Levitical priesthood under the new covenant terms? Priesthood changed so did the law. Hebrews 7:12 - For when the priesthood is changed, the law must be changed also. *The old and new covenants do not mix.*

No wonder even non-Bible Sabbath keeping scholarship admits to these Bible details --
D.L. Moody
Baptist Confession of Faith Sectn 19
Westminster Confession of Faith Sectn 19
R.C Sproul
(C.H. Spurgeon)
etc

Some examples - here #7
and here: #8
======================= FYI

interesting comment about God's act of sanctifying something - creating an obligation for mankind to honor it.
Very cunning, but you are not fooling me. There is no obligation for ALL mankind (Jews and Gentiles alike) to keep the sabbath under the old or new covenant.

*Sabbath keeping with all it's rules and regulations, was part of a covenant with Israel (Exodus 16:23, 29; 31:12-18; 35:1-3; Leviticus 19:30; 23:2-3, 32; Numbers 15:32-36; 28:1-10; 29:39-40; I Chronicles. 23:30-31; II Chronicles 31:2-4; Isaiah 1:13; Amos 8:5; Nehemiah 10:31) that is not binding on Christians under the new covenant. (Colossians 2:16-17)

Your SDA gospel (which is a mixture of law and grace) culminates in "salvation by grace plus law, faith plus works." (Galatians 1:6-9)
 
  • Agree
Reactions: Nathan@work
Upvote 0

BobRyan

Junior Member
Angels Team
Site Supporter
Nov 21, 2008
51,351
10,606
Georgia
✟911,824.00
Country
United States
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
There is evidence that the apostles taught that the Lord’s day was the day of Christ’s Resurrection, the first day of the week.

Think of how helpful it would be in the case of that suggestion - if you posted those texts that say "The Lord's day is the day of Christ's Resurrection" . As the one who started this thread I will freely agree that Christ was resurrected on Week-day-1 in the Bible and that is Sunday. He was also resurrected at the time of a full Moon.

In Christianity there is more evidence that Jesus Christ has taken the place of the Sabbath.

Did you mean to say "in scripture" or "in the NT text" or are you talking about 1000's of years of tradition in Christianity and not scripture?

Matthew 16:25 whoever wants to save his life will lose it whoever loses his life for My sake shall find it.

I cannot fathom the amount of inference it would take to turn that statement into "Christ has taken the place of the Sabbath". If you would like to show us how that can be done ... .please do.

Colossians 3 says to set our minds on things above and not on earthly things. We are dead to the world alive to Christ

I cannot fathom the amount of inference it would take to turn that statement into "Christ has taken the place of the Sabbath". If you would like to show us how that can be done ... .please do.


The Apostles never taught Sabbath keeping or circumcision as necessary for Christians.

The Apostles never mentioned "do not take God's name in vain" - it does not mean they rejected that commandment. The "Every Sabbath" gospel preaching practice is in scripture -- Acts 18:4

They did teach rest from earthly labors

No they didn't

"if anyone will not work - neither let him eat" 2 Thess 3:10

1 Thess 2: 9 For you recall, brothers and sisters, our labor and hardship: it was by working night and day so as not to be a burden to any of you, that we proclaimed to you the gospel of God. 10 You are witnesses, and so is God, of how devoutly and rightly and blamelessly we behaved toward you believers; 11 just as you know how we were exhorting and encouraging and imploring each one of you as a father would his own children, 12 so that you would walk in a manner worthy of the God who calls you into His own kingdom and glory.


There is no "Jesus Christ has taken the place of the Sabbath" in your texts.

John 6 - Jesus is the bread of life.. Jesus did not take the place of food either.
 
Upvote 0

BobRyan

Junior Member
Angels Team
Site Supporter
Nov 21, 2008
51,351
10,606
Georgia
✟911,824.00
Country
United States
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
Ex 20:11 makes the case that the first text showing that humans were obligated to keep God's Sabbath - was Gen 2:1-3.

Gen 2:1-3
And so the heavens and the earth were completed, and all their heavenly lights. 2 By the seventh day God completed His work which He had done, and He rested on the seventh day from all His work which He had done. 3 Then God blessed the seventh day and sanctified it, because on it He rested from all His work which God had created and made.

Ex 20:11
11 For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea and everything that is in them, and He rested on the seventh day; for that reason the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy (same word as in Gen 2 - Sanctified)

Ex 20:8-11 declares that God's act of Sanctifying something on Earth - creates an obligation for mankind to honor it.

Ex 20:10 "the seventh day is the Sabbath of the LORD (YHWH)"

The passage simply says that God rested on the seventh day from all His work which He had done.

If that is all it said - we would not be seeing "all those other words" there in Gen 2:1-3 and Ex 20:11.

There is no command here in Genesis 2:1-3 for humans to keep the sabbath.
[/QUOTE]

Ex 20:11 says that Gen 2:1-3 does in fact have that command -- the "made it holy" phrase in Ex 20:11 commandment is the same word as "sanctified it" in Gen 2:3. This is irrefutable.

Although God's rest on the seventh day did foreshadow a future sabbath law,
[/QUOTE]

Bible scholars in almost all Christian denominations agree that the Sabbath is in Eden. Not is not just Ex 20:11 pointing to Gen 2:1-3 but the scholarship also admits it.

there is no Biblical record of the sabbath before the children of Israel left the land of Egypt
[/QUOTE]

There is no Biblical record of Israel told not to covet and not to take God's name in vain before Ex 20 -- Bible scholars in almost all Christian denominations agree that the Ten Commandments are the moral law of God given to mankind in Eden.

.
The word "sabbath" first appears in Exodus 16:23 -
[/QUOTE]

Gen 2:3 we find Shabath -- Strong's H7673 -
Strong’s Definitions [?](Strong’s Definitions Legend):
שָׁבַת shâbath, shaw-bath'; a primitive root; to repose, i.e. desist from exertion; used in many implied relations (causative, figurative or specific):—(cause to, let, make to) cease, celebrate, cause (make) to fail, keep (sabbath), suffer to be lacking, leave, put away (down), (make to) rest, rid, still, take away.​


The act of God who "Blessed and Sanctified" in Gen 2:3
Reminder of God's act who "Blessed and Sanctified" Ex 20:11

and of course this Sabbath in Eden teaching is also affirmed by Bible scholars in almost all major Christian denominations

The Baptist Confession of Faith,
the Westminster Confession of Faith ,
D.L. Moody,
R.C Sproul,
Matthew Henry,
Thomas Watson
Eastern Orthodox Catechism
The Catholic Catechism
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Nathan@work

Always ready :)
Feb 19, 2021
1,025
360
45
Garfield
✟27,017.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
No it is not.






No the commandment Is to remember, mark THE Day, AND keep it holy. AND To do ALL OUR Labor and all our work the OTHER six, BUT the Seventh Day is the Sabbath of God AND on it we shall not do any of OUR work BECAUSE God rested on the Seventh AND BECAUSE He did He blessed and Hallowed, Set it apart for HOLY USE it.
Question; If it was blessed and Hallowed back on the Seventh day at the end of Creation and was STILL Blessed and Hallowed, set apart for Holy use at Mt. Sinai. Is it still Blessed and Hallowed in honor of Creation TODAY?

YES!


Exod 20:8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
Exod 20:9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
Exod 20:10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:
Exod 20:11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

ON the SEVENTH DAY. If we do not then we are sinning.

Yes it is. :) If you notice there is a period at the end of the commandment. That marks the difference between the commandment, and how God wanted them to observe the commandment.

The commandment stands as is - "Remember the Sabbath to keep it holy".

And as stated before, it is singular - not plural.

To answer your question. Yes. The Sabbath day is blessed and holy.

That is why they observed the weekly and yearly Sabbaths, to remember the Sabbath day that God blessed and made holy.

That is why we observe the rest we have in Christ, who is our Sabbath, in the new way of the Spirit, to remember the Sabbath day that God blessed and made holy.

[Rom 7:4-6 ESV] Likewise, my brothers, you also have died to the law through the body of Christ, so that you may belong to another, to him who has been raised from the dead, in order that we may bear fruit for God. For while we were living in the flesh, our sinful passions, aroused by the law, were at work in our members to bear fruit for death. But now we are released from the law, having died to that which held us captive, so that we serve in the new way of the Spirit and not in the old way of the written code.
 
Upvote 0

Nathan@work

Always ready :)
Feb 19, 2021
1,025
360
45
Garfield
✟27,017.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
There is no evidence that John was speaking of the Sabbath when he said the Lord’s day. There is evidence that the apostles taught that the Lord’s day was the day of Christ’s Resurrection, the first day of the week. Your claim of personal authority is placing yourself above the word of God
In Christianity there is more evidence that Jesus Christ has taken the place of the Sabbath. Matthew 16:25 whoever wants to save his life will lose it whoever loses his life for My sake shall find it. Colossians 3 says to set our minds on things above and not on earthly things. We are dead to the world alive to Christ
The Apostles never taught Sabbath keeping or circumcision as necessary for Christians. They did teach rest from earthly labors and new life in Christ. The plain reading of Romans
14 and Colossians 2 teaches against keeping the Sabbath as a day, but our rest is in Christ
We do not worship a day, we worship the Lord. Psalm 94 warns us do not grow stubborn as your fathers did in the wilderness although they has seen all of my works. They are a people whose hearts go astray and they do not know my ways. I swore in my wrath they shall not enter my rest

There is no evidence that John was not speaking of the Sabbath. There is more evidence to it than against it. Usually, it is best to go with the evidence than personal conjecture.

Christ did not take the place of the Sabbath. He is the Sabbath. Always has been the Sabbath. That is why Israel was taught to observe the weekly Sabbaths so carefully. They were to point to Christ and our rest in Him.

I agree that the weekly observance of the Sabbath is not something taught for the believer in Christ. That does not mean we should not remember the Sabbath day itself and keep it holy in our hearts. I think if that had been done over the years then evolution would not have gotten such a foothold.
 
Upvote 0

Nathan@work

Always ready :)
Feb 19, 2021
1,025
360
45
Garfield
✟27,017.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
The commands as given on Sinai are complete in and of themselves. The details on how we are to observe them are within all the commands themselves as spoken by our Lord God.

I think you might rethink that.

Jesus taught that to be angry with your brother is to be guilty of murder. You do not find that written in Exodus 20 or Deuteronomy 5.
 
Upvote 0

BobRyan

Junior Member
Angels Team
Site Supporter
Nov 21, 2008
51,351
10,606
Georgia
✟911,824.00
Country
United States
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
Look at Deuteronomy 5:1-15 which gives the commandments to Israel. 2 The Lord our God made a covenant with us in Horeb. 3 The Lord did not make this covenant with our fathers, but with us, those who are here today, all of us who are alive.

Everyone agrees that God had not setup the nation of Israel until Ex 16-20 so that nation covenant did not exist until then ... still it was a 'sin' to take God's name in vain. And Bible scholars admit it as noted on page 1 of the thread.


Gen 26:5
5 Abraham obeyed Me and fulfilled his duty to Me, and kept My commandments, My statutes, and My laws.

Nehemiah 9:13 - Then You came down on Mount Sinai, And spoke with them from heaven; You gave them just ordinances and true laws, Good statutes and commandments. 14 So You made known to them Your holy sabbath, And laid down for them commandments, statutes and law, Through Your servant Moses.

Interesting how that Gen 26:5 phrase keeps getting used.

Exodus 20 is written to the Israelites under the old covenant. Exodus 20:1 - And God spoke all these words, saying: 2 "I am the Lord your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage."

It is the same moral law of God that is in the New Covenant of Jer 31:31-34 known to both Jeremiah and his readers as Bible scholars in all major denominations admit as noted on page 1.


The sabbath is made for man and the Israelites are of mankind. Jesus did not say ALL mankind

He also did not say "do not take God's name in vain" - but mankind is also not supposed to break that commandment. Mark 2:27 does not say "Sabbath was made for some group within mankind" - rather Jesus speaks of the "making of BOTH" mankind AND the Sabbath as we see in Gen 1- Gen 2:3 "The Sabbath was made for mankind and not mankind made for the Sabbath"

No wonder Bible scholars in all major denominations admit to this Bible detail as noted on page 1.

*In Deuteronomy 5, Moses restates the Ten Commandments to the next generation of Israelites.

restates but does not "rewrite" - no chisling of new stone in Deut 5 -

No wonder gentiles are specifically singled out for Sabbath keeping in Is 56:6
No wonder Sabbath "made for mankind" in Mark 2:27
No wonder Bible scholars admit to this.

In regards to Isaiah 56:2-6, foreigners were to "join themselves to the Lord;" and "love the name of the Lord;" and "be his servants;" and "take hold of God's covenant."

Jeremiah points to the New Covenant in the OT - the Law of God written on the heart as Moses also affirms. Gentiles could be saved in OT and NT.

As Isaiah 56 says "a house of prayer for ALL nations" - not merely for "one nation".

The old covenant. But to do this they had to be circumcised, for God said: "No foreigner uncircumcised in heart and uncircumcised in flesh, of all the foreigners who are among the sons of Israel, shall enter My sanctuary." (Ezekiel 44:9). When Gentiles thus "joined themselves to the Lord" they CEASED BEING GENTILES and became proselytes to the Jewish religion. They kept the Sabbath AS JEWISH PROSELYTES, NOT as Gentiles.

Is 56
7 Even those I will bring to My holy mountain,
And make them joyful in My house of prayer.
Their burnt offerings and their sacrifices will be acceptable on My altar;
For My house will be called a house of prayer for all the nations.”

gentile prayer and sacrifice accepted

Prayer was never restricted to those standing in the temple - it was also granted to those who prayed toward it - a house of prayer for all nations.

1 Kings 2 - Solomon's dedication prayer
28 Nevertheless, turn Your attention to the prayer of Your servant and to his plea, Lord, my God, to listen to the cry and to the prayer which Your servant prays before You today, 29 so that Your eyes may be open toward this house night and day, toward the place of which You have said, ‘My name shall be there,’ to listen to the prayer which Your servant will pray toward this place. 30 And listen to the plea of Your servant and of Your people Israel, when they pray toward this place; hear in heaven Your dwelling place; hear and forgive!


1. Ezek 44 is about gentiles living in Israel who are not Christians not born again "uncircumcised in heart" being excluded. And gentiles could not come into the inner court. But many converted gentiles were allowed to "pray" - as we see in Acts 13, 17, 18 who are not circumcised.

Not even Jews could "enter" the temple - only Levites who had specific jobs there. The people praying were physically outside the Holy and most Holy Place. Gentiles were always allowed to pray toward the house of God.

2. there is no command that gentiles had to be circumcised to be saved in OT or NT. But still that was the heretical claim made in of Acts 15:1 - and refuted
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

BobRyan

Junior Member
Angels Team
Site Supporter
Nov 21, 2008
51,351
10,606
Georgia
✟911,824.00
Country
United States
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
This obligation regarding the Sabbath commandment continues for all mankind - as it is included in the Law "written on heart and mind" under Jeremiah's New Covenant Jer 31:31-34 and is applicable to all mankind for all eternity after the cross in the New Earth according Is 66:23.

In regards to Isaiah 66:22-23, this merely teaches that from month to month and from week to week, God’s people will worship Him.

It says from "Sabbath to Sabbath" and shows TWO cycles - a monthly one and a weekly one - not just "every day".


In the new heaven and the new earth, we read there will have no need of the sun or moon, there will be no night there, but one perpetual day and the glory of God will illuminate it. (Revelation 21:23-25)

It says that only about the city - not about planet Earth - the New Earth. God knew what He was talking about in Is 66:23.

Furthermore, if you insist on sabbath observances based on Isaiah 66:23, then you also need to observe new moons as well.

I do agree that in the New Earth both the 7th day Sabbath AND the New Moon will be holy days... days of holy convocation because in the New Earth there will have been TWO creation events, one in Gen 1-2 and another one for the "New Earth" in Rev 21.

Which does not solve the problem you have for trying to get around Is 66:23



Very cunning, but you are not fooling me. There is no obligation for ALL mankind (Jews and Gentiles alike) to keep the sabbath under the old or new covenant.

Sabbath for mankind Mark 2:27
Sabbath for all mankind IS 66:23
Sabbath specifically for gentiles Isa 56:6
Gentiles meeting "every Sabbath" along with Jews to hear Gospel preaching Acts 18:4

No wonder Bible scholars in almost all Christian denominations affirm that the Sabbath was given to mankind in Eden.

No amount of "you SDAs" posts can change these irrefutable facts. Bible details matter.
 
Upvote 0