Discussion Spiritual Warfare

ARBITER01 said:

Not at all.

A Christian, with a bit of knowledge and experience, can easily learn to deal with evil spirits.

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Absolutely true, but despite that, the number of Christians willing to tackle deliverance is microscopic.

Francis Drake said:

Absolutely true, but despite that, the number of Christians willing to tackle deliverance is microscopic.

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That would only affirm how leaderless the body of Christ is. People are not wanting to grow up in discipleship, but are more concerned about worldly issues.

But anyways, deliverance is a spiritual healing, so it is tied to the gifts of healings. The examples of how it is done are numerous with Jesus, so we should see His example when we witness it.

ARBITER01 said:

That would only affirm how leaderless the body of Christ is.

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In my view, the deliverance ministry was never meant to be about leadership, but should be the normal well used weaponry of every Christian.

ARBITER01 said:

Not at all.

A Christian, with a bit of knowledge and experience, can easily learn to deal with evil spirits. People involved in witchcraft, who know what they are doing, will keep at you for a long period of time, and depending on their knowledge and determination, they can kill you if you don't know how to counteract them. It's a whole other level of spiritual warfare that I don't wish on anyone.

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What happened to Satan getting permission from God before he can act as we read in Job.

Job 1
6 One day the angels came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan also came with them. 7 The Lord said to Satan, “Where have you come from?”

Satan answered the Lord, “From roaming throughout the earth, going back and forth on it.”

8 Then the Lord said to Satan, “Have you considered my servant Job? There is no one on earth like him; he is blameless and upright, a man who fears God and shuns evil.”

9 “Does Job fear God for nothing?” Satan replied. 10 “Have you not put a hedge around him and his household and everything he has? You have blessed the work of his hands, so that his flocks and herds are spread throughout the land. 11 But now stretch out your hand and strike everything he has, and he will surely curse you to your face.”

12 The Lord said to Satan, “Very well, then, everything he has is in your power, but on the man himself do not lay a finger.”

Francis Drake said:

In my view, the deliverance ministry was never meant to be about leadership, but should be the normal well used weaponry of every Christian.

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What I was identifying was the lack of discipleship for believers from leadership. If our so-called church leaders are more worried about discussing/promoting worldly issues instead of GODLY issues, then there will ultimately be a breakdown of spiritual maturity and growth in the body.

Not everyone has the will and determination to go-it-alone with GOD as maybe you and I do, hence why leadership should always be focused on discipleship and the growth of leaders and ministries under their own ministry.

We need to be honest and look where we are right now. Why don't we have people with Gifts of Healings ministries in every state of our country? We have plenty of wannabes but no true ministries.

Carl Emerson said:

What happened to Satan getting permission from God before he can act as we read in Job.

Job 1
6 One day the angels came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan also came with them. 7 The Lord said to Satan, “Where have you come from?”

Satan answered the Lord, “From roaming throughout the earth, going back and forth on it.”

8 Then the Lord said to Satan, “Have you considered my servant Job? There is no one on earth like him; he is blameless and upright, a man who fears God and shuns evil.”

9 “Does Job fear God for nothing?” Satan replied. 10 “Have you not put a hedge around him and his household and everything he has? You have blessed the work of his hands, so that his flocks and herds are spread throughout the land. 11 But now stretch out your hand and strike everything he has, and he will surely curse you to your face.”

12 The Lord said to Satan, “Very well, then, everything he has is in your power, but on the man himself do not lay a finger.”

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You're not coming up against satan directly.

A lot of this is still mainly underground at this point, but it has been around for a very long time in history.

Prayer is a universal law. Anyone has the ability to pray to GOD, but these people are using corrupt forms of prayer for their own selfish desires in the world, and some of these folks think they are spiritually powerful enough to try their hand out doing battle against others, ie Christians.

To me, that is actual spiritual warfare, where you are up against one or more of satan's followers and it comes down to your faith, skill, and spiritual strength to overcome.

Satan may direct them at points, if they are true sold out followers of him, but they are mainly doing their own thing.

ARBITER01 said:

You're not coming up against satan directly.

A lot of this is still mainly underground at this point, but it has been around for a very long time in history.

Prayer is a universal law. Anyone has the ability to pray to GOD, but these people are using corrupt forms of prayer for their own selfish desires in the world, and some of these folks think they are spiritually powerful enough to try their hand out doing battle against others, ie Christians.

To me, that is actual spiritual warfare, where you are up against one or more of satan's followers and it comes down to your faith, skill, and spiritual strength to overcome.

Satan may direct them at points, if they are true sold out followers of him, but they are mainly doing their own thing.

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Hi Arbiter

We wrestle not these corrupt praying folks, but rather, principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.
Thanks be to God who always causes us to triumph in Christ Jesus.
And we have been fully equipped with the armor
AND we have deliverance via encampment of the angel of the Lord
AND we have Jesus who is always interceeding on our behalf.
AND we have, "The Lord is a man of war: the Lord is his name."
AND we have the aforementioned prcious promises

ARBITER01 said:

You're not coming up against satan directly.

A lot of this is still mainly underground at this point, but it has been around for a very long time in history.

Prayer is a universal law. Anyone has the ability to pray to GOD, but these people are using corrupt forms of prayer for their own selfish desires in the world, and some of these folks think they are spiritually powerful enough to try their hand out doing battle against others, ie Christians.

To me, that is actual spiritual warfare, where you are up against one or more of satan's followers and it comes down to your faith, skill, and spiritual strength to overcome.

Satan may direct them at points, if they are true sold out followers of him, but they are mainly doing their own thing.

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Blessings in Christ Jesus! I ran into what you are describing just for writing on these boards. I had to go get some help from two groups of prayer warriors. The next day at work I heard these words, "I have heard the prayers of my people and have turned that back against there own necks." It was over. The Lord does not take lightly these abominable things that people do.

sunlover1 said:

Hi Arbiter

We wrestle not these corrupt praying folks, but rather, principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.
Thanks be to God who always causes us to triumph in Christ Jesus.
And we have been fully equipped with the armor
AND we have deliverance via encampment of the angel of the Lord
AND we have Jesus who is always interceeding on our behalf.
AND we have, "The Lord is a man of war: the Lord is his name."
AND we have the aforementioned prcious promises

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Hey Sunlover,..

I would look at what you posted here,...

...but rather, principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

That is not specific to only evil spirits. A lot of folks over the years have taken this section of scripture and only applied it just to fallen angels, territorial spirits and such, especially in books they write about on spiritual warfare.

My experience over almost 30 years has been quite different.

GTW27 said:

Blessings in Christ Jesus! I ran into what you are describing just for writing on these boards. I had to go get some help from two groups of prayer warriors. The next day at work I heard these words, "I have heard the prayers of my people and have turned that back against there own necks." It was over. The Lord does not take lightly these abominable things that people do.

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Most of them that are operating in this arena don't want to be known, but they want to test what they know against others (especially Christians) to see what works and doesn't, and build confidence in their skills.

You're usually not coming up against one, and it's normally better to not try and take on folks like this alone. Kudos for recognizing the problem and seeking help.

ARBITER01 said:

Hey Sunlover,..

I would look at what you posted here,...

...but rather, principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

That is not specific to only evil spirits. A lot of folks over the years have taken this section of scripture and only applied it just to fallen angels, territorial spirits and such, especially in books they write about on spiritual warfare.

My experience over almost 30 years has been quite different.

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Okay.

But it says "We wrestle NOT flesh and blood..."
So, I'm confused by your answer.

GTW27 said:

Blessings in Christ Jesus! I ran into what you are describing just for writing on these boards. I had to go get some help from two groups of prayer warriors. The next day at work I heard these words, "I have heard the prayers of my people and have turned that back against there own necks." It was over. The Lord does not take lightly these abominable things that people do.

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indeed. He does not .. because it's HIM, they fight against.
Remember when Jesus said to Paul, "I am Jesus, who you persecute"

sunlover1 said:

Okay.

But it says "We wrestle NOT flesh and blood..."
So, I'm confused by your answer.

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It's a spiritual battle not a fleshly/physical one, and they are just a much a tool for satan's devises against us as evil spirits.

Witchcraft is rebellion against GOD. There's a reason GOD said not to permit a witch to live in exodus, GOD hates witchcraft.

sunlover1 said:

Okay.

But it says "We wrestle NOT flesh and blood..."
So, I'm confused by your answer.

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Paul is drawing a parallel between spiritual and physical wrestling so that we understand the need of spiritual armour as opposed to physical armour.

Too many think they can correct their earthly problems by dealing with physical issues, completely missing the invisible issues.

Both are necessary, that's why after he had healed and delivered them, Jesus often told them to go and sin no more. ie. Change your earthly/physical activities, because those activities were what opened the door to the spiritual attacks.

If someone had demons of lasciviousness because of promiscuous behaviour, I would not command the spirits to leave, unless he/she was also prepared to repent and leave that lifestyle.

So although Paul said we were not fighting flesh and blood, he was making sure we were correctly armoured and weaponised to also deal with the hidden demons as well as the flesh, not instead.

ARBITER01 said:

Most of them that are operating in this arena don't want to be known, but they want to test what they know against others (especially Christians) to see what works and doesn't, and build confidence in their skills.

You're usually not coming up against one, and it's normally better to not try and take on folks like this alone. Kudos for recognizing the problem and seeking help.

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I have had to walk out of darkness pretty much alone most of the time and learn that as long as I was rightly relating to His Body, the Grace was there to overcome whatever was thrown at me.

Jesus has the final say regarding what we encounter.

Jesus equips us to deal with it.

In fact He deals with it through us.

It is not a contest - never was...

Carl Emerson said:

I have had to walk out of darkness pretty much alone most of the time and learn that as long as I was rightly relating to His Body, the Grace was there to overcome whatever was thrown at me.

Jesus has the final say regarding what we encounter.

Jesus equips us to deal with it.

In fact He deals with it through us.

It is not a contest - never was...

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His experience is not at the mercy of your ideas, nor is mine.

A good 98% of Christianity is absolutely clueless to this sort of activity going on, and it's because a majority of our brethren are spiritually immature, they have book knowledge but no real experience.

ARBITER01 said:

You're not coming up against satan directly.

A lot of this is still mainly underground at this point, but it has been around for a very long time in history.

Prayer is a universal law. Anyone has the ability to pray to GOD, but these people are using corrupt forms of prayer for their own selfish desires in the world, and some of these folks think they are spiritually powerful enough to try their hand out doing battle against others, ie Christians.

To me, that is actual spiritual warfare, where you are up against one or more of satan's followers and it comes down to your faith, skill, and spiritual strength to overcome.

Satan may direct them at points, if they are true sold out followers of him, but they are mainly doing their own thing.

Click to expand...

You present a case for Satan and His followers to have free reign over what they propose to do.

This is not correct and not scriptural.

It does not come down to your own faith skill and spiritual strength.

I comes down to learning to submit and cooperate with what He wants to do.

Again I repeat - there is not a contest if you move in His authority.

Carl Emerson said:

You present a case for Satan and His followers to have free reign over what they propose to do.

This is not correct and not scriptural.

It does not come down to your own faith skill and spiritual strength.

I comes down to learning to submit and cooperate with what He wants to do.

Again I repeat - there is not a contest if you move in His authority.

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And I'll repeat to you, my experience is not at the mercy of you and your ideas.

ARBITER01 said:

And I'll repeat to you, my experience is not at the mercy of you and your ideas.

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You are welcome to back up your claims with scripture.

Carl Emerson said:

You are welcome to back up your claims with scripture.

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It was already identified as true, in fact, sunlover posted the applicable scripture section.