(Mental) illness, upbringing and sin

Paulomycin

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The quote is not from the Bible because that is not a Biblical view so you have to use what a man says instead. It’s a theology to relief man of guilt from what he did. Sin is not his fault.

Since it’s your theology can you please give me a Bible verse that says “man is totally depraved.” It’s a doctrine invented by Augustine.

I see you're not reading the actual verses. I didn't want to have to dump them on you like this, but. . .

Is man basically good or basically evil?
  • Ecclesiastes 7:29 - “See, this alone I found, that God made man upright, but they have sought out many schemes.”
  • Romans 5:7-8 - For one will scarcely die for a righteous person—though perhaps for a good person one would dare even to die—but God shows his love for us in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us.
  • Romans 5:12,19 - sin came into the world through one man, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men because all sinned… by the one man’s disobedience the many were made sinners
c.f. Job 15:14-16, 25:4-6; Ecclesiastes 9:3

All men? Are there any exceptions?
  • Psalm 143:2 - Enter not into judgment with your servant, for no one living is righteous before you.
  • Romans 11:32 - For God has consigned all to disobedience, that he may have mercy on all. (c.f. Galatians 3:22)
  • Romans 3:23 - for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God
  • 2 Chronicles 6:36 - “there is no one who does not sin”
  • Isaiah 53:6 - All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned—every one—to his own way
  • Micah 7:2-4 - The godly has perished from the earth, and there is no one upright among mankind; they all lie in wait for blood, and each hunts the other with a net. Their hands are on what is evil, to do it well; the prince and the judge ask for a bribe, and the great man utters the evil desire of his soul; thus they weave it together. The best of them is like a brier, the most upright of them a thorn hedge.
  • Romans 3:9-12 - What then? Are we Jews any better off? No, not at all. For we have already charged that all, both Jews and Greeks, are under sin, as it is written: “None is righteous, no, not one; no one understands; no one seeks for God. All have turned aside; together they have become worthless; no one does good, not even one.” (c.f. Psalm 14:1-3, 53:1-3)
  • 1 John 1:8,10 - If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we say we have not sinned, we make [God] a liar, and his word is not in us.
  • Mark 10:18/Luke 18:19 - And Jesus said to him, “Why do you call me good? No one is good except God alone.
c.f. 1 Kings 8:46; 116:11, 130:3, 143:2; Proverbs 20:9; Ecclesiastes 7:20; Jeremiah 2:29; Micah 7:2-4, Mark 10:18; Luke 18:19; Romans 5:12-14; 1 Corinthians 5:9-10; James 3:2; etc., etc.

Are people good deep down?
  • Mark 7:21-23 - “For from within, out of the heart of man, come evil thoughts, sexual immorality, theft, murder, adultery, coveting, wickedness, deceit, sensuality, envy, slander, pride, foolishness. All these evil things come from within, and they defile a person.” (c.f. Matthew 15:19)
  • Psalm 5:9 - For there is no truth in their mouth; their inmost self is destruction; their throat is an open grave; they flatter with their tongue.
Are men totally depraved? Is every faculty of the person corrupted?
Heart/Mind (Deceitful)
  • Jeremiah 17:9 - “The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately sick; who can understand it?”
  • Titus 1:15-16 - to the defiled and unbelieving, nothing is pure; but both their minds and their consciences are defiled.
  • Ecclesiastes 9:3 - Also, the hearts of the children of man are full of evil, and madness is in their hearts while they live, and after that they go to the dead.
  • Romans 1:28-31 - And since they did not see fit to acknowledge God, God gave them up to a debased mind to do what ought not to be done. They were… foolish
  • Ephesians 4:17-18 - you must no longer walk as the Gentiles do, in the futility of their minds. They are darkened in their understanding, alienated from the life of God because of the ignorance that is in them, due to their hardness of heart.
  • Jeremiah 10:7-8,14 - among all the wise ones of the nations and in all their kingdoms there is none like you. They are both stupid and foolish… Every man is stupid and without knowledge
  • Matthew 15:19 - “For out of the heart come evil thoughts, murder, adultery, sexual immorality, theft, false witness, slander.” (c.f. Mark 7:21-23)
  • Genesis 6:5 & 8:21 - The Lord saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every intention of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually… from his youth.
  • Proverbs 10:20 - the heart of the wicked is of little worth.
  • Proverbs 28:26 - Whoever trusts in his own [heart] is a fool
c.f. Deuteronomy 29:2-4; Psalm 10:4, 36:1-2, 58:4-5, 94:11; Proverbs 10:20; Ecclesiastes 8:11; Ezekiel 11:19, 36:26; Matthew 13:14; Mark 7:21-23; Romans 8:7; Ephesians 4:17-18, 23

That's about 1/3 of the way in. . .
 
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Paulomycin

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The quote is not from the Bible because that is not a Biblical view so you have to use what a man says instead. It’s a theology to relief man of guilt from what he did. Sin is not his fault.

Since it’s your theology can you please give me a Bible verse that says “man is totally depraved.” It’s a doctrine invented by Augustine.

And if you don't like the term "Total Depravity," it can be easily substituted with the term, "Total Inability."
 
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Dorothy Mae

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And if you don't like the term "Total Depravity," it can be easily substituted with the term, "Total Inability."
My experience with those who got their theology from others and not the Bible is that they cannot see that scriptures used do not say anything close to that claimed, but I will try.

The position that no one is (insert adjective) is knocked down by any single verse that says one person was. No one or none or all is a fragile one.

“And the righteous men, they shall judge them” Ezekiel.

Job “There was a man....that was perfect and upright..”

Zechariah and Elisabeth were both called „righteous“ in the Bible.

David spoke repeatedly of the righteous.

Jesus spoke of the righteous.

He who does what is right is righteous.

How come the Bible identifies some men as righteous by name? That’s because the concept of Total Depravity hadn’t been invented and wasn’t God’s explanation for sin.

God says we want and do not have. That’s his answer.
 
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Paulomycin

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My experience with those who got their theology from others and not the Bible is that they cannot see that scriptures used do not say anything close to that claimed, but I will try.

But you're not even disputing the actual scriptures cited. Therefore, they stand uncontested.

The position that no one is (insert adjective) is knocked down by any single verse that says one person was.

That was way more than a single verse.

“And the righteous men, they shall judge them” Ezekiel.

Job “There was a man....that was perfect and upright..”

Zechariah and Elisabeth were both called „righteous“ in the Bible.

David spoke repeatedly of the righteous.

Jesus spoke of the righteous.

He who does what is right is righteous.

How come the Bible identifies some men as righteous by name?

Because true righteousness is by faith alone, which is accounted as righteousness (Genesis 15:6, Romans 4:3). Not your claim of inborn self-righteousness. Everyone's born under the curse of Adam. It goes without saying. Typically, the word from the verses you cited is rendered "blameless." It doesn't follow if you translated all these people as literally without sin!

Also, if you're claim of innate self-righteousness were true, then Jesus' death wasn't necessary, because you claim that some could bootstrap themselves by their own self-righteousness.

God says we want and do not have. That’s his answer.

Pretty sure you're taking this one out of context.

In any case, it appears you're okay with recklessly contradicting Romans 3:10, Psalm 14:1-3, Psalm 53:1-3, etc. etc. the list goes on and on.
 
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Dorothy Mae

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And if you don't like the term "Total Depravity," it can be easily substituted with the term, "Total Inability."
You know, man says he is totally unable and God says, “this command I’m giving you today is not too difficult for you.”

That is what God says about our ability not to murder, not to steal, to honor parents, etc. I’m going with Gods view.

None of those scriptures support TD. None. The Gish method doesn’t prove the theology. It is disproven by any verse that calls a man “righteous” and there is more than one.
 
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Dorothy Mae

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But you're not even disputing the actual scriptures cited. Therefore, they stand uncontested.



That was way more than a single verse.



Because true righteousness is by faith alone, which is accounted as righteousness (Genesis 15:6, Romans 4:3). Not your claim of inborn self-righteousness. Everyone's born under the curse of Adam. It goes without saying. Typically, the word from the verses you cited is rendered "blameless." It doesn't follow if you translated all these people as literally without sin!

Also, if you're claim of innate self-righteousness were true, then Jesus' death wasn't necessary, because you claim that some could bootstrap themselves by their own self-righteousness.



Pretty sure you're taking this one out of context.

In any case, it appears you're okay with recklessly contradicting Romans 3:10, Psalm 14:1-3, Psalm 53:1-3, etc. etc. the list goes on and on.
Don’t accuse me of that which I did not say.

Jesus said he came for the “sick” not the righteous. I assure you, God doesn’t hate the righteous.

I think you don’t understand the weakness of ANY “all are xyz” position because ONE example where it isn’t so and the statement is shown to be untrue.
 
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Dorothy Mae

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Your last quote, "We are not sinners because we sin, we sin because we're sinners." is a demonstrated in a proper use of the word, 'because', in this verse from your list mentioned above.
  • Romans 5:12,19 - sin came into the world through one man, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men because all sinned… by the one man’s disobedience the many were made sinners
Notice there are at least two ways to take the logical progression of thought in this passage. Is "because" used to say that death spread to all men as a result of the fact that they all sinned? It seems to me obvious it is not saying that --it is either sying just the opposite, or in saying 'because' it is short for something like, "We know this, because". The whole statement is a rhetorical, "[We know that] death spread to all men because all sinned", or "...because -[of the fact] that all sinned."

I think the same construction is acceptable in several other passages of Scripture. John 3:18 is one of them: "Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because they have not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son."
How does that fit with “he who does what is right IS RIGHTEOUS?” Does he do what is right because he is righteous, naturally? Seems fair.
 
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Mark Quayle

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How does that fit with “he who does what is right IS RIGHTEOUS?” Does he do what is right because he is righteous, naturally? Seems fair.
Concerning, “he who does what is right IS RIGHTEOUS?” The context must rule, I think. .

As a stand-alone it can be taken to mean what you propose ("he [does] what is right because he is righteous, naturally"), or it can mean just the reverse, stating the obvious, that it is righteous to do what is right. It can mean that a person who does what is righteous (even suddenly, forsaking evil) is counted righteous.

The context is not specific but seems to favor something along the lines you proposed, in that the one who does right is righteous by natural effect of being righteous, but I have to add the qualifier --contextually, it seems a result of him with whom the righteous is identified. That is, when you say 'naturally', if you mean, in-and-of-himself righteous, then no, you woud be wrong, there. It is in Christ (the larger context, and, I think, more than hinted at in this context) that we have been made righteous.
 
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Dorothy Mae

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Concerning, “he who does what is right IS RIGHTEOUS?” The context must rule, I think. .

As a stand-alone it can be taken to mean what you propose ("he [does] what is right because he is righteous, naturally"), or it can mean just the reverse, stating the obvious, that it is righteous to do what is right. It can mean that a person who does what is righteous (even suddenly, forsaking evil) is counted righteous.

The context is not specific but seems to favor something along the lines you proposed, in that the one who does right is righteous by natural effect of being righteous, but I have to add the qualifier --contextually, it seems a result of him with whom the righteous is identified. That is, when you say 'naturally', if you mean, in-and-of-himself righteous, then no, you woud be wrong, there. It is in Christ (the larger context, and, I think, more than hinted at in this context) that we have been made righteous.
The difficulty is there are several people called “righteous” in the Bible before Jesus. I am only repeating what the Bible says. I’m not making implications.

If the Bible says it I accept it. If I have to adjust my understanding I’m prepared to do so.

What I can say from experience is that matters of God and man are far more complex than imagined if one what’s truth. Truth is what I seek.
 
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Mark Quayle

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The difficulty is there are several people called “righteous” in the Bible before Jesus. I am only repeating what the Bible says. I’m not making implications.

If the Bible says it I accept it. If I have to adjust my understanding I’m prepared to do so.

What I can say from experience is that matters of God and man are far more complex than imagined if one what’s truth. Truth is what I seek.

You are right they are far more complex, but they are also far more simple, all from which POV you see any one matter. For eg our view of sin is kind of backwards. It is against God, and therefore far worse than we imagine, yet it is not just the sins we esteem that confound us, but sinfulness. And there is no end to such examples.

Those called righteous in Scripture are either not given qualifiers, or are said to be righteous by some fact. There is none that is said (nor shown) to be righteous in and of himself. Nor do I know of any with whom God had not had prior dealings before he was called righteous.

Also, I am righteous, if I belong to Christ, because he is my representative. I am counted righteous because he is righteous. It is not in-an-of-myself, nor of my performance.
 
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Paulomycin

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You know, man says he is totally unable and God says, “this command I’m giving you today is not too difficult for you.”

^ No reference. No verse. No context. I'm not falling for this tactic. If you're not being dodgy, then bring the direct citation.

None of those scriptures support TD. None. The Gish method doesn’t prove the theology. It is disproven by any verse that calls a man “righteous” and there is more than one.

That's funny. I've only heard atheists accuse others of the "Gish method." In any case, you're simply dismissing the verses via "proof by assertion." The verses still exist. You've given no alternate interpretation for any of them. Not that you could, anyway. If you even tried, you'd contradict the Bible more than you're contradicting it already.

Don’t accuse me of that which I did not say.

What you're not saying is just as telling as what you're not doing. I think you're deliberately omitting the direct scripture references because you don't want to be caught taking them out of context.

Jesus said he came for the “sick” not the righteous. I assure you, God doesn’t hate the righteous.

Mark 2:16-18

16 And when the scribes and Pharisees saw Him eating with the tax collectors and sinners, they said to His disciples, “How is it that He eats and drinks with tax collectors and sinners?”

17 When Jesus heard it, He said to them, “Those who are well have no need of a physician, but those who are sick. I did not come to call the righteous, but sinners, to repentance.

^ Congrats Dorothy, you just took sides with the Pharisees. Please repent.

I think you don’t understand the weakness of ANY “all are xyz” position because ONE example where it isn’t so and the statement is shown to be untrue.

You mean like I did just now with Mark 2? By your rules, as you stated, your only option now is to repent (a.) or move the goalposts (b.).
 
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Dorothy Mae

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^ No reference. No verse. No context. I'm not falling for this tactic. If you're not being dodgy, then bring the direct citation.
Now what I am commanding you today is not too difficult for you or beyond your reach. Deut 30:11 Sometimes I quote the Bible without reference to see if others are like the Bereans who looked matters up to see if it is so. Those who refuse do not want to know if it is so.
That's funny. I've only heard atheists accuse others of the "Gish method." In any case, you're simply dismissing the verses via "proof by assertion." The verses still exist. You've given no alternate interpretation for any of them. Not that you could, anyway. If you even tried, you'd contradict the Bible more than you're contradicting it already.
But not a single verse says man is born totally depraved as a baby. Not one. They say that some or one man was bad in some form. All the verses you quote say that a or some are bad. None say humankind is depraved. That was invented by Augustine.
What you're not saying is just as telling as what you're not doing. I think you're deliberately omitting the direct scripture references because you don't want to be caught taking them out of context.
Every verse you quoted is taken out of context. All of them. Two standards?
Mark 2:16-18

16 And when the scribes and Pharisees saw Him eating with the tax collectors and sinners, they said to His disciples, “How is it that He eats and drinks with tax collectors and sinners?”

17 When Jesus heard it, He said to them, “Those who are well have no need of a physician, but those who are sick. I did not come to call the righteous, but sinners, to repentance.

^ Congrats Dorothy, you just took sides with the Pharisees. Please repent.
Explain. There is no such statement in what I wrote. What Jesus says is that there are righteous (who really are in Gods eyes) which you refuse to admit.
You mean like I did just now with Mark 2? By your rules, as you stated, your only option now is to repent (a.) or move the goalposts (b.).
Huh? The Bible calls some people righteous. Get over it.

You do not understand that if a persons says “all subjects are ——-“,then I need only ONE example to disprove it. It’s an important understanding to have.
 
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Dorothy Mae

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You are right they are far more complex, but they are also far more simple, all from which POV you see any one matter.
That makes no sense and is logically impossible.
For eg our view of sin is kind of backwards. It is against God, and therefore far worse than we imagine, yet it is not just the sins we esteem that confound us, but sinfulness. And there is no end to such examples.
Find me one where the actual terribly wrong deed done is not as important to God as some kind of nature we cannot help, please. When God is angry over sin, He generally listed the deeds done. I don’t recall a verse that says He’s angry because of a nature we cannot help. That really just an excuse and no one, not even you, is likely to say to the one who does you a great wrong, “it’s OK. You can’t help it as you are just sinful.”
Those called righteous in Scripture are either not given qualifiers, or are said to be righteous by some fact. There is none that is said (nor shown) to be righteous in and of himself. Nor do I know of any with whom God had not had prior dealings before he was called righteous.
Why not just accept the compliment they received without trying to degrade it?
Also, I am righteous, if I belong to Christ, because he is my representative. I am counted righteous because he is righteous. It is not in-an-of-myself, nor of my performance.
If there is nothing a man has ever actually done that God calls righteous his whole life, the Judgement Seat of Christ won’t be a pleasant experience for that one. No “well DONE” (done means what we did) will be heard.
 
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Mark Quayle

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Now what I am commanding you today is not too difficult for you or beyond your reach. Deut 30:11 Sometimes I quote the Bible without reference to see if others are like the Bereans who looked matters up to see if it is so. Those who refuse do not want to know if it is so.
I don't mean any disrespect, DM, but that sounds like a bit of self-importance. There are many on this site quoting; one guy lately complains his posts "are replete" with verses, and nobody cares to deal with them. But why should we? If you have a point to prove, don't expect someone else to prove your point. (His verses pretty much all sounded the same, merely demonstrating will and choice, which he took as proof of Freewill. There was no use in dealing with each one. As it turns out, there was no use in dealing with even one, or with all of them, with him.)

None of us have the time to look them all up and check the context, even the ones we are familiar with, (like this one you quote), just to be sure our take is exegetically right. It has been a long time since someone has brought up a thought here and shown it from scripture to be worth considering, that I have not heard before. At least, provide a beginning point for debate.
 
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Mark Quayle

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Find me one where the actual terribly wrong deed done is not as important to God as some kind of nature we cannot help, please.
Romans 8: "7 because the mind of the flesh is hostile to God: It does not submit to God’s law, nor can it do so. 8 Those controlled by the flesh cannot please God." From this sinful mind of flesh proceed the individual sins.

But you are attempting to show my example is a poor one, not that I am wrong in the premise I was trying to demonstrate by parallel. You are moving the goalposts.
That makes no sense and is logically impossible.
We generally look at everything backwards, when it comes to spiritual matters. We take sins between humans to be between humans, and not primarily against God. We think God is like us, and use ourselves for examples of how God should behave. (He is a father, no? We are the Bride of Christ, no? The Word of God is similar to the word of man. etc etc

As a more remote example of what I'm driving at there, consider that to God, the means of existence is as simple as can be. But science rides the edge of self-contradiction trying to unravel the complication, and still has a long long way to go. Both complex and simple, depending on the POV.

I don’t recall a verse that says He’s angry because of a nature we cannot help.

What does being at "enmity with God' mean? Why does he mention peace between God and the Elect by the work of Christ? --because there is enmity, until Christ satisfied God's wrath. “Therefore, since we have been made righteous through his faithfulness, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ." Romans 5 These and many more show our nature is contrary to God. No need to add "because of a nature we cannot help." We cannot because we WILL not". It is not like we want to --we will behave according to our nature. Your way of putting it, "a nature we cannot help" is faulty --we promote that nature! We are eager participants in our separation from God.

hat really just an excuse and no one, not even you, is likely to say to the one who does you a great wrong, “it’s OK. You can’t help it as you are just sinful.”

That's true enough, though irrelevant. Who is saying this? Not God, nor Calvinism. Why would they? The one who does wrong did wrong.

Why not just accept the compliment they received without trying to degrade it?

Are you serious?? How is it degrading to attribute all goodness to God instead of to man? If God calls me righteous, it is either by standing because of Christ my substitute, or because of accomplishment. If because of accomplishment, even that is not mine, though it take all my effort.

If there is nothing a man has ever actually done that God calls righteous his whole life, the Judgement Seat of Christ won’t be a pleasant experience for that one. No “well DONE” (done means what we did) will be heard.

Seems to me you really have no idea of what we are made for. This life is not for this life and we are not made for ourselves. What do you think this means --that we do our part to somehow increase what God does? --"Apart from me you can do nothing."
 
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Dorothy Mae

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I don't mean any disrespect, DM, but that sounds like a bit of self-importance. There are many on this site quoting; one guy lately complains his posts "are replete" with verses, and nobody cares to deal with them. But why should we? If you have a point to prove, don't expect someone else to prove your point. (His verses pretty much all sounded the same, merely demonstrating will and choice, which he took as proof of Freewill. There was no use in dealing with each one. As it turns out, there was no use in dealing with even one, or with all of them, with him.)

None of us have the time to look them all up and check the context, even the ones we are familiar with, (like this one you quote), just to be sure our take is exegetically right. It has been a long time since someone has brought up a thought here and shown it from scripture to be worth considering, that I have not heard before. At least, provide a beginning point for debate.
That sounds ok until one realizes I gave exactly ONE verse, just one. Your argument falls pretty flat when the test was whether a reader was willing to look up one verse. It’s wasn’t the Gish that so many deal out bombarding with verses none of which come close to what is claimed.
 
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Paulomycin

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Now what I am commanding you today is not too difficult for you or beyond your reach. Deut 30:11 Sometimes I quote the Bible without reference to see if others are like the Bereans who looked matters up to see if it is so. Those who refuse do not want to know if it is so.

Excuses-excuses. Let's get to work. . .

The covenant you cited is contingent to Deuteronomy 30:17-20. If you ever read the Bible, then you know the Israelites failed to keep their end of the agreement. Moreover, the people publicly swear to serve the Lord in Joshua 24:14-25 (please read the whole thing), but a back & forth argument starts. Joshua calls them out on the insincerity of their collective hearts:

14 [Joshua speaking] “Now therefore, fear the Lord, serve Him in sincerity and in truth, and put away the gods which your fathers served on the other side of the River and in Egypt. Serve the Lord!

19 But Joshua said to the people, “You cannot serve the Lord, for He is a holy God. He is a jealous God; He will not forgive your transgressions nor your sins.

21 And the people said to Joshua, “No, but we will serve the Lord!”

22 So Joshua said to the people, “You are witnesses against yourselves that you have chosen the Lord for yourselves, to serve Him.”

And they said, “We are witnesses!”

23 “Now therefore,” he said,put away the foreign gods which are among you, and incline your heart to the Lord God of Israel.”

But their disobedience continued all the way into the book of Judges, "In those days there was no king in Israel; everyone did what was right in his own eyes." Judges 2:11-13 & 21:25, "Everyone did what was right in his own eyes."

But not a single verse says man is born totally depraved as a baby. Not one.

Not one? Too bad you never read the Bible. . .
  • Psalm 51:5 - Behold, I was brought forth in iniquity, and in sin did my mother conceive me.
  • Genesis 8:21 - the Lord said in his heart, “I will never again curse the ground because of man, for the intention of man’s heart is evil from his youth.”
  • Psalm 58:3 - The wicked are estranged from the womb; they go astray from birth, speaking lies.
  • John 3:6 - “That which is born of the flesh is flesh”
  • Psalm 58:3 - The wicked are estranged from the womb;
    (c.f. Proverbs 22:15)
^ There's five for you to straight-up ignore, contradict, and/or eisegetically torture to death, if you don't repent.

They say that some or one man was bad in some form. All the verses you quote say that a or some are bad. None say humankind is depraved.

You can't point to any specifics and you're reading-into it. What part of "all" did you fail to comprehend? It's as-if you deliberately overlooked every-single-use of "all" in all those verses!
  • Psalm 143:2 - Enter not into judgment with your servant, for no one living is righteous before you.
  • Romans 11:32 - For God has consigned all to disobedience, that he may have mercy on all. (c.f. Galatians 3:22)
  • Romans 3:23 - for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God
  • 2 Chronicles 6:36 - “there is no one who does not sin”
  • Isaiah 53:6 - All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned—every one—to his own way
  • Micah 7:2-4 - The godly has perished from the earth, and there is no one upright among mankind; they all lie in wait for blood, and each hunts the other with a net. Their hands are on what is evil, to do it well; the prince and the judge ask for a bribe, and the great man utters the evil desire of his soul; thus they weave it together. The best of them is like a brier, the most upright of them a thorn hedge.
  • Romans 3:9-12 - What then? Are we Jews any better off? No, not at all. For we have already charged that all, both Jews and Greeks, are under sin, as it is written: “None is righteous, no, not one; no one understands; no one seeks for God. All have turned aside; together they have become worthless; no one does good, not even one.” (c.f. Psalm 14:1-3, 53:1-3)
  • 1 John 1:8,10 - If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we say we have not sinned, we make [God] a liar, and his word is not in us.
  • Mark 10:18/Luke 18:19 - And Jesus said to him, “Why do you call me good? No one is good except God alone.
That was invented by Augustine.

You can't prove that accusation anywhere, and Augustine didn't write the tidel wave of verses you're getting drowned with.

Every verse you quoted is taken out of context. All of them.

Then restore every-single-verse in its proper context! Correct me by showing the proper context! Show my objective errors in the text, if you can. Otherwise, you're blatantly contradicting scripture.

Explain. There is no such statement in what I wrote. What Jesus says is that there are righteous (who really are in Gods eyes) which you refuse to admit.

Where? The only ones who claimed they were righteous were the judgy self-righteous Pharisees. You have to admit you're sick to meet The Great Physician. "I did not come to call the righteous," means the righteous are not called. John 10:27 - My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me.

Huh? The Bible calls some people righteous. Get over it.

You fail to explain why they're called that, or how they even got there. Hint: Hebrews 11. It was by faith, not your imaginary innate self-righteousness.

You do not understand that if a persons says “all subjects are ——-“,then I need only ONE example to disprove it. It’s an important understanding to have.

You mean like I did with Mark 2? By your rules, as you stated, you have been disproven with more than one example. Many, in fact! Stop jumping to conclusions in your imagination, and actually read the text for a change. No excuses.
 
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