Divorce is wrong

buzuxi02

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couples. It would help me if an informed Orthodox member could educate me, please. Is there a definitive policy about the Church's response to divorce?
It doesn't like it. But I'm not aware of a policy unless you mean if there are categories for divorce. Divorce is granted for adultery, spousal abuse, apostasy, and abandonment. If they get divorced in the civil sphere the church may grant permission for a second remarriage in the church up to the bishop.
 
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seeking.IAM

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Divorce is granted for adultery, spousal abuse, apostasy, and abandonment. If they get divorced in the civil sphere the church may grant permission for a second remarriage in the church up to the bishop.

Thank you.
 
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E.C.

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I am a marriage and family therapist who has counseled Orthodox couples. It would help me if an informed Orthodox member could educate me, please. Is there a definitive policy about the Church's response to divorce? If there is discretion, is it at the discretion of the Priest or the Bishop as to the Church's response to such matters? I've heard certain things claimed in sessions and I am never quite sure what is factual.
We try to avoid it. Buzuxi listed a few examples. Typically the Church tries to do almost anything under the sun to try and preserve the marriage, but even then the Church recognizes that sometimes it is the course of action to take. Maybe even for the salvation of someone's soul, but that's a bit above my paygrade.
 
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seeking.IAM

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We try to avoid it...

Thank you. I was most interested in knowing the Church's handling post-divorce, especially after one has had multiple divorces, let's say 2 or 3. Does the party remain in good standing with the church? Are such persons ever ex-communicated? If so, under what conditions and at whose discretion?
 
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buzuxi02

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Your only allowed up to three marriages in Orthodoxy after baptism. Doesn't matter if your widowed or divorced.
Orthodox marriage is very different from a secular understanding (granted even the laity doesnt know this so perhaps it makes no difference).
For example the word "love" is not found in the marriage service and only mentioned once in the betrothal rite. If both candidates getting married have been married before the marriage service is shortened and certain somber prayers are included while the crowning is omitted. There is also an age limit and other restrictions which can disqualify you from getting a church service.

The modern notions of what marriage is are foreign to Orthodoxy.
 
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Love... who the heck needs that in a marriage, man! :sick::sick:

Your only allowed up to three marriages in Orthodoxy after baptism. Doesn't matter if your widowed or divorced.
Orthodox marriage is very different from a secular understanding (granted even the laity doesnt know this so perhaps it makes no difference).
For example the word "love" is not found in the marriage service and only mentioned once in the betrothal rite. If both candidates getting married have been married before the marriage service is shortened and certain somber prayers are included while the crowning is omitted. There is also an age limit and other restrictions which can disqualify you from getting a church service.

The modern notions of what marriage is are foreign to Orthodoxy.
 
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seeking.IAM

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Love... who the heck needs that in a marriage, man! :sick::sick:

Interesting thing that not all cultures have so called "love marriages," yet their divorce rate is better than ours. So much for love. Go figure.
 
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Yep. And there are Muslim marriages where the woman is beaten and treated like garbage. But, hey, man, no divorce! So kiddos to them!!

Interesting thing that not all cultures have so called "love marriages," yet their divorce rate is better than ours. So much for love. Go figure.
 
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tapi

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Indeed. At its best, marriage is a constant performance. One can always aspire for a greater martyrdom; this should be taken into account by priests when counseling for marriage. Those who wish to be perfect should seek out the worst possible partner to attain the more beautiful crown. All the "love" stuff, that's some modern garbage if I've ever seen it. The only thing that matters is to keep the covenant and the rules and regulations as strictly as possible. There is no other way.
 
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seeking.IAM

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Yep. And there are Muslim marriages where the woman is beaten and treated like garbage. But, hey, man, no divorce! So kiddos to them!!

I think it was unnecessary to turn this discussion into Muslim bashing. Many cultures besides Muslims have arranged marriages. One needs to look no farther than our own Old Testament.
 
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buzuxi02

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Love... who the heck needs that in a marriage, man! :sick::sick:
Well if they agree to marry I imagine there is a degree of compatibility. But then again nowadays in our society100% of divorced couples were in love at one point.
But I opened my mouth too quick in my previous post and Ephesians 5,:21-30 is read during the marriage service, so love is mentioned. But takes a back seat to petitions such as these:

Priest: Your wife shall be as a fruitful vine on the sides of your house....
Priest: Your children like young olive plants around your table....
Priest: Yea! You shall see your children's children, and peace be upon Israel....
...That there may be given unto them soberness of life, and fruit of the womb as may be most expedient for them; let us pray to the Lord.
That they may rejoice in the beholding of sons and daughters; let us pray to the Lord.
That there may be granted unto them the happiness of abundant fertility, and a course of life blameless and unashamed; let us pray to the Lord.
That there may be granted unto them and unto us all prayers that tend unto salvation; let us pray to the Lord...

As we can see from the above petitions the Orthodox marriage service is not your conventional western wedding service with exchanging vows etc. First a heck of alot of fertility prayers are recited. Meaning old people "in love" looking to marry is not something we endorse as we have no rite to accommodate them
 
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buzuxi02

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I think it was unnecessary to turn this discussion into Muslim bashing. Many cultures besides Muslims have arranged marriages. One needs to look no farther than our own Old Testament.
My parents are one. Will be 50 years next year. In fact there is a Greek word called προξενιά ( proxenia) translates as "matchmaking" still a common thing amongst greeks. While not exactly an arranged marriage, expect if your single, to get calls from friends, and uncles and aunts to go out with someone they know for potential marriage.
There is also the occasional monk who specializes in it.
 
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As an Episcopalian I dare say your opinion on the issue in an Orthodox sub forum is something to be taken with a grain of salt. Episcopalians have little understanding of Orthodox marriage practices or values. And it is not Muslim-bashing at all. Your emphasis in your post was on not getting divorced. A couple that stay married have a good marriage. I disagree. You see love as not necessary. While I suppose it’s technically not required, I cannot fathom it and wouldn’t have married a woman I don’t love. I love my wife VERY much, 22 years strong almost, 3 kids. Love and commitment without divorce. Who’da thunk it.

I think it was unnecessary to turn this discussion into Muslim bashing. Many cultures besides Muslims have arranged marriages. One needs to look no farther than our own Old Testament.
 
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Landos

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Ephesians 5:25: 'Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;'
Ephesians 5:33: 'Nevertheless let every one of you in particular so love his wife even as himself; and the wife [see] that she reverence [her] husband.'


The Bible commands husbands to love their wives and for wives to respect and revere their husbands.
 
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