What limits would this put on God

Claiming that matter is eternal at creation strikes me as being contrary to the nature of God.

So, the claim that God is limited to eternal laws and eternal matter would limit our Lord how?

imge said:

Here’s just one scripture:

Psalms 19 9 God’s laws are pure, eternal, just. 10 They are more desirable than gold. They are sweeter than honey dripping from a honeycomb. 11 For they warn us away from harm and give success to those who obey them.

Gods laws were written on stone by Gods finger as a symbol to be eternal. If you read each of them they apply to yesterday, today and tomorrow. The only scripture in the whole Bible written by our Creator and Savior are His commandments.

You can find those in Exodus 20.

God bless

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Is God himself subject to those laws?

Is God subject to matter?

Yes, the controversy does exist.

Clare73 said:

If only God is eternal, why is it called eternal life?

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This is off the top of my head and I need to research this. God has no beginning himself, He always is. eternal life is one entering into it at some point and it goes on forever.

Is God immutable? What is the significance of the immutability of God?

However, this attribute of immutability has been increasingly challenged in recent years. Many today would question whether the idea of God’s immutability is sustainable, biblical, or even helpful.
The Immutability of God | Tabletalk

12. The Immutability of God | Bible.org

Hi JAL, smile,

So, the claim that God is limited to eternal laws and eternal matter would limit our Lord how?

You failed to answer my question above. Your rambling looks odd at best.

My concepts of God are from his Word.

When did God's stream of consciousness begin?

If you knew the Bible you would know that God is "I am that I am" without a beginning.

Concerning your philosopher R.C. Sproul I will let him speak for himself because it looks like you are leaving a lot out of your statements.
"Second, God is not capricious or arbitrary. He does not act irrationally, nor does He show or permit violence purposelessly. That doesn’t mean we always know why a particular evil occurs at a given place or time. Because we don’t know all the reasons behind each particular evil, we can’t make facile connections between guilt and disaster, between a person’s sin and the evil that befalls him. Texts including the book of Job and John 9 keep us from universally declaring that pain is a specific punishment for specific sin. That means that when inexplicable disasters occur, we must say with Martin Luther, “Let God be God.” Job’s cry that “the Lord gave, and the Lord has taken away; blessed be the name of the Lord” (Job 1:21) was not a superficial display of piety or a denial of pain. Instead, Job bit his lip and clenched his stomach as he remained faithful in the middle of tragedy and unmitigated suffering. Job knew who God was, and he refused to curse Him.

Third, this isn’t the best of all possible worlds. This world is fallen. Suffering is here only because sin has marred an otherwise good creation. Of course, that doesn’t mean all suffering is tied to a particular sin or that we can draw a one-to-one correlation between the degree of a person’s sin and the degree of his suffering. However, suffering belongs to the full complex of sin that people visit upon this world. As long as creation suffers from the violence of men, it returns this violence. The Bible tells us that creation gets angry with its human masters and exploiters. Instead of stewarding the earth wisely and replenishing it, we exploit and pollute it. Until Christ returns with the new heavens and earth, we’ll deal with tempests, earthquakes, and floods. Until then, we’ll yearn for a renewed creation.

Finally, evil is not ultimate. Christianity never denies the horror of evil, but neither does it regard evil as having any power above or equal to God. Scripture’s final word on evil is triumph. Creation groans as it awaits its final redemption, but this groaning is not futile. Over all creation stands the resurrected Christ—Christus Victor—who has triumphed over the powers of evil and will make all things new."
Answering Evil by R.C. Sproul

God is Holy, He does not become Holy.

Your statements makes as much sense as "For Heidegger, Being is prior to the subject-object split and prior to man. Being is the past plenitude which offers its services in various epochs of history in revealing and concealing ways. Basically Being functions as the otherness for man, making claims upon him and issuing its constraints and revelations. Man is the place of Being’s disclosures. When man is a part of such a totality of Being man quickly moves from his claims and transcending functions to Beings’s claims and transcendence over him. Being thus makes its presence known as otherness to man. While Being is more pronounced in the writings of the later Heidegger it is assumed in the early writings, too, only there it is poorly presented. Because infinite transcendence resides in Dasein’s constitution and within temporality it is just a matter of time before Being appears in its otherness to Dasein. It is the same nonhuman form of infinite transcendence that dwells both in Dasein and Being, as well as in their togetherness. Infinite transcendence is’the far side’ of finite transcendence that resides in totalities making extraordinary claims on us and provides all those excesses we are familiar with in transcendence. Infinite transcendence is thus an outside transcendence, and also an alien anti-human force within finitude."
From Dasein to Being in Heidegger’s totality
Cosmological argument - Wikipedia

"How many times have you heard atheists say that they do not believe in God because they believe in the Big Bang theory? Somewhere in that reasoning are unchallenged assumptions about the matter, or material, that makes up the universe. Is matter eternal like some suppose? Can it produce intelligence? In this mock debate between Dr. Sproul and Dr. John Gerstner, they look at the question, “Is There a God?”"
Is There a God? by Various Teachers

There is no problem with God incarnating into human form.

It is God's nature that does not change.

Jesus is fully God and fully Man.

Col 2:9 New American Standard Bible
For in Him all the fullness of Deity dwells in bodily form,

John 1:14
Easy-to-Read Version
14 The Word became a man and lived among us. We saw his divine greatness—the greatness that belongs to the only Son of the Father. The Word was full of grace and truth.




Saying God has no free choice is just funny.
Yes, he is limited by himself, his nature.

Both sides that matter is eternal and not eternal comes from pagan philosphers.
Referring to a philospher who happens to be a Christian does not change that fact.

It is likely, I misunderstood you, sorry.

The most popular evangelical theologian of our generation - you classify him as a philosopher? If you say so.

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I don't see him as most popular, well liked ok. He calls himself a Philosopher. Dr. R.C. Sproul Jr. to Rector & Chair of Philosophy and Theology https://reformationbiblecollege.org...jr-to-rector-chair-of-philosophy-and-theology

Nope. Matter cannot produce intelligence. That wouldn't make sense. Sentience must be innate to matter, as I hold. Matter can awaken to FULL sentience (there are different levels of sentience) but it cannot CREATE sentience, it cannot BECOME sentient.

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Agreed.

An immutable God became man? Please.
Reiterating a contradiction doesn't resolve it.

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It is not a contradiction. Smile.

What's hilarious is your pretending there is no contradiction here. How can an immutably holy God freely choose to become unholy?

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Jesus was not unholy Luke 1:35 also Lamb without blemish or spot.
Luke 1:35
Easy-to-Read Version
35 The angel said to Mary, “The Holy Spirit will come to you, and the power of the Most High God will cover you. The baby will be holy and will be called the Son of God.

So you were lying when you claimed that all your beliefs came from the Word?

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No, all Theology includes some philosophy (how to think) and scripture.

Matthew 10:28
“Don’t be afraid of people. They can kill the body, but they cannot kill the soul. The only one you should fear is God, the one who can send the body and the soul to be destroyed in hell.

1 Corinthians 6:19
You should know that your body is a temple for the Holy Spirit that you received from God and that lives in you. You don’t own yourselves.

2 Corinthians 4:16
Living by Faith
That is why we never give up. Our physical body is becoming older and weaker, but our spirit inside us is made new every day.

2 Corinthians 5
Easy-to-Read Version
5 We know that our body—the tent we live in here on earth—will be destroyed. But when that happens, God will have a home for us to live in. It will not be the kind of home people build here. It will be a home in heaven that will continue forever. 2 But now we are tired of this body. We want God to give us our heavenly home. 3 It will clothe us and we will not be naked. 4 While we live in this tent, we have burdens and so we complain. I don’t mean that we want to remove this tent, but we want to be clothed with our heavenly home. Then this body that dies will be covered with life. 5 This is what God himself made us for. And he has given us the Spirit as the first payment to guarantee the life to come.

6 So we always have confidence. We know that while we live in this body, we are away from the Lord. 7 We live by what we believe will happen, not by what we can see. 8 So I say that we have confidence. And we really want to be away from this body and be at home with the Lord. 9 Our only goal is to always please the Lord, whether we are living here in this body or there with him. 10 We must all stand before Christ to be judged. Everyone will get what they should. They will be paid for whatever they did—good or bad—when they lived in this earthly body.

2 Corinthians 7:1
Dear friends, we have these promises from God. So we should make ourselves pure—free from anything that makes our body or our soul unclean. Our respect for God should make us try to be completely holy in the way we live.

Galatians 2:20
So I am not the one living now—it is Christ living in me. I still live in my body, but I live by faith in the Son of God. He is the one who loved me and gave himself to save me.

Ephesians 2:14
Christ is the reason we are now at peace. He made us Jews and you who are not Jews one people. We were separated by a wall of hate that stood between us, but Christ broke down that wall. By giving his own body,

Philippians 3:21
He will change our humble bodies and make them like his own glorious body. Christ can do this by his power, with which he is able to rule everything.

Colossians 1:22
But now he has made you his friends again. He did this by the death Christ suffered while he was in his body. He did it so that he could present you to himself as people who are holy, blameless, and without anything that would make you guilty before him.

Hebrews 10
Easy-to-Read Version
Jesus Christ—the Only Sacrifice We Need
10 The law gave us only an unclear picture of the good things coming in the future. The law is not a perfect picture of the real things. The law tells people to offer the same sacrifices every year. Those who come to worship God continue to offer those sacrifices. But the law can never make them perfect. 2 If the law could make people perfect, those sacrifices would have already stopped. They would already be clean from their sins, and they would not still feel guilty. 3 But that’s not what happens. Their sacrifices make them remember their sins every year, 4 because it is not possible for the blood of bulls and goats to take away sins.

5 So when Christ came into the world he said,

“You don’t want sacrifices and offerings,
but you have prepared a body for me.
6 You are not pleased with the sacrifices of animals killed and burned
or with offerings to take away sins.
7 Then I said, ‘Here I am, God.
It is written about me in the book of the law.
I have come to do what you want.’”

8 Christ first said, “You don’t want sacrifices and offerings. You are not pleased with animals killed and burned or with sacrifices to take away sin.” (These are all sacrifices that the law commands.) 9 Then he said, “Here I am, God. I have come to do what you want.” So God ends that first system of sacrifices and starts his new way. 10 Jesus Christ did the things God wanted him to do. And because of that, we are made holy through the sacrifice of Christ’s body. Christ made that sacrifice one time—enough for all time.

11 Every day the priests stand and do their religious service. Again and again they offer the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins. 12 But Christ offered only one sacrifice for sins, and that sacrifice is good for all time. Then he sat down at the right side of God. 13 And now Christ waits there for his enemies to be put under his power. 14 With one sacrifice Christ made his people perfect forever. They are the ones who are being made holy.

15 The Holy Spirit also tells us about this. First he says,

16 “This is the agreement I will make
with my people in the future, says the Lord.
I will put my laws in their hearts.
I will write my laws in their minds.”

17 Then he says,

“I will forget their sins
and never again remember the evil they have done.”

18 And after everything is forgiven, there is no more need for a sacrifice to pay for sins.

Come Near to God
19 And so, brothers and sisters, we are completely free to enter the Most Holy Place.[c] We can do this without fear because of the blood sacrifice of Jesus. 20 We enter through a new way that Jesus opened for us. It is a living way that leads through the curtain—Christ’s body. 21 And we have a great priest who rules the house of God. 22 Sprinkled with the blood of Christ, our hearts have been made free from a guilty conscience, and our bodies have been washed with pure water. So come near to God with a sincere heart, full of confidence because of our faith in Christ. 23 We must hold on to the hope we have, never hesitating to tell people about it. We can trust God to do what he promised.

James 2:26
A person’s body that does not have a spirit is dead. It is the same with faith—faith that does nothing is dead!

1 Peter 2:24
Christ carried our sins in his body on the cross. He did this so that we would stop living for sin and live for what is right. By his wounds you were healed.

1 Peter 4:1
Changed Lives
Christ suffered while he was in his body. So you should strengthen yourselves with the same kind of thinking Christ had. The one who accepts suffering in this life has clearly decided to stop sinning.

2 Peter 1:14
I know that I must soon leave this body. Our Lord Jesus Christ has shown me that.

Colossians 2:9
Easy-to-Read Version
9 I say this because all of God lives in Christ fully, even in his life on earth.

Colossians 1:19
Easy-to-Read Version
19 God was pleased for all of himself to live in the Son.

John 1:29
Jesus, the Lamb of God
The next day John saw Jesus coming toward him and said, “Look, the Lamb of God. He takes away the sins of the world!

1 Peter 1:19
You were bought with the precious blood of Christ’s death. He was a pure and perfect sacrificial Lamb.

1 Peter 1:19
Instead, you were liberated by the precious blood of Christ, like that of a flawless, spotless lamb.

1 Peter 1:19
King James Version

19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:


Revelation 15:3
They sing the song of Moses, God’s servant, and the song of the Lamb, saying, “Great and awe-inspiring are your works, Lord God Almighty. Just and true are your ways, king of the nations.