Render unto Ceaser

Jaxxi · Mar 12, 2021

No. The Lord has a

Jofes said:
In three of the gospels, why do we see the exact story of the taxes?
What does money have to do with the gospel?
Is not all of the Gold and Silver, God's?
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[Haggai 2:8 – The silver is Mine, and the gold is Mine, says the LORD of Heaven’s Armies.]

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Matthew 22:15-22
Mark 12:13-17
Luke 20:20-26

All of these passages of scriptures end with:

22 When the heard this they were amazed...
17 And they were all amazed at him.
26 ...And astonished by his answer, they became silent

Just wondering, Jofes

No the Lord has a strong sense of paying to uphold and run the community. We are to pay our tithe to run the overhead of the church and help the needy, and we are to " give that to Caesar which is Caesars, which is our taxes to fund the community, pay for libraries, military, poor and sanitation. God renders these things as being our equal duty. Each should get 10%. God is a jealous God but He is not a greedy God. Money is the tool of Satan, which is how he buys souls . Hollywood, fame, fortune. The Kardashians didn't amass their fortune by going to church!

Render therefore to all their dues: tribute to whom tribute is due, custom to whom custom, fear to whom fear, honor to whom honor. Romans 13:7

Therefore the Lord established the kingdom in his hand; and all Judah brought Jehoshaphat presents, and he had riches and honor in abundance. 2Chronicles 17:5

And when Jehoshaphat and his people came to take away the spoil from them, they found among them in abundance both riches with the dead bodies and precious jewels, which they stripped off for themselves, more than they could carry away; and they were three days in gathering the spoil, it was so much. 2 Chronicles 20:25

He hath swallowed down riches, and he shall vomit them up again; God shall cast them out of his belly. Job 20:15

A little that a righteous man hath is better than the riches of many wicked. Psalm 37:16

Behold, these are the ungodly, who prosper in the world; they increase in riches. Psalm 73:12

but the cares of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, and the lusts of other things entering in, choke the Word, and it becometh unfruitful. Mark 4:19

Jofes · Mar 12, 2021

Jaxxi said:
No. The Lord has a

No the Lord has a strong sense of paying to uphold and run the community. We are to pay our tithe to run the overhead of the church and help the needy, and we are to " give that to Caesar which is Caesars, which is our taxes to find the community, pay for libraries, military, poor and sanitation. God renders these things as being our equal duty. Each should get 10%. God is a jealous God but He is not a greedy God. Money is the tool of Satan, which is how he buys souls . Hollywood, fame, fortune. The Kardashians didn't amass their fortune by going to church!

Render therefore to all their dues: tribute to whom tribute is due, custom to whom custom, fear to whom fear, honor to whom honor. Romans 13:7

Therefore the Lord established the kingdom in his hand; and all Judah brought Jehoshaphat presents, and he had riches and honor in abundance. 2Chronicles 17:5

And when Jehoshaphat and his people came to take away the spoil from them, they found among them in abundance both riches with the dead bodies and precious jewels, which they stripped off for themselves, more than they could carry away; and they were three days in gathering the spoil, it was so much. 2 Chronicles 20:25

He hath swallowed down riches, and he shall vomit them up again; God shall cast them out of his belly. Job 20:15

A little that a righteous man hath is better than the riches of many wicked. Psalm 37:16

Behold, these are the ungodly, who prosper in the world; they increase in riches. Psalm 73:12

but the cares of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, and the lusts of other things entering in, choke the Word, and it becometh unfruitful. Mark 4:19

=============================================
The love of money is the root to every kind of evil.

I am a wealthy man because, only God has made me rich, and I use this wealth to spread His word.
Jesus tells me to give to someone money and they say to me," I don't need anything or want anything." I look at them in amazement and say, "You mean to tell me you do not know of anyone that is in need?" " That you could give this money to."

Jofes

Fervent · Mar 12, 2021

Nathan@work said:
No. I’m not.

Do you know the definition of interpretation?

God never says we should interpret.

Can you show me where He says that?

in·ter·pre·ta·tion
/inˌtərprəˈtāSH(ə)n/
Learn to pronounce

noun

the action of explaining the meaning of something.

When you present the meaning of Jesus holding up the coin as saying it belongs to Caesar, you are interpreting. So unless you're simply going to describe what is in the Bible and take absolutely no meaning from it, you must interpret it. To deny that you interpret is self-deception and nothing more.

Nathan@work · Mar 13, 2021

Fervent said:
in·ter·pre·ta·tion
/inˌtərprəˈtāSH(ə)n/
Learn to pronounce

noun

the action of explaining the meaning of something.

When you present the meaning of Jesus holding up the coin as saying it belongs to Caesar, you are interpreting. So unless you're simply going to describe what is in the Bible and take absolutely no meaning from it, you must interpret it. To deny that you interpret is self-deception and nothing more.

Well I’m not sure how you do it, and if you interpret then that is your prerogative.

I read and let God speak to me. I don’t just decide for myself He is silent and wants me to make a decision on what He wants.

Have I interpreted before? Yes, but it is wiser to let Him explain. Your Faith will grow more that way.

Fervent · Mar 13, 2021

Nathan@work said:
Well I’m not sure how you do it, and if you interpret then that is your prerogative.

I read and let God speak to me. I don’t just decide for myself He is silent and wants me to make a decision on what He wants.

Have I interpreted before? Yes, but it is wiser to let Him explain. Your Faith will grow more that way.

Sounds like you're simply elevating your interpretation to the level of God's voice. Does the Holy Spirit guide in interpretation? Yes, but it's still interpretation. Denying that you interpret is nothing more than a self-delusion and an elevation of your internal biases to equality with God's word.

Nathan@work · Mar 13, 2021

Fervent said:
Sounds like you're simply elevating your interpretation to the level of God's voice. Does the Holy Spirit guide in interpretation? Yes, but it's still interpretation. Denying that you interpret is nothing more than a self-delusion and an elevation of your internal biases to equality with God's word.

No. If you choose to treat revealed truth from the Spirit as just self delusion it’s your choice.

I choose to accept it and let it build my Faith because of it.

Jaxxi · Mar 13, 2021

Jofes said:
=============================================
The love of money is the root to every kind of evil.

I am a wealthy man because, only God has made me rich, and I use this wealth to spread His word.
Jesus tells me to give to someone money and they say to me," I don't need anything or want anything." I look at them in amazement and say, "You mean to tell me you do not know of anyone that is in need?" " That you could give this money to."

Jofes

Money is the root of all evil but Evil is not the root of all money.

Every man also to whom God hath given riches and wealth, and hath given power to eat thereof and to take his portion and to rejoice in his labor, this is the gift of God. Ecclesiastes 5:19

I believe God gives some wealth to certain people because He takes delight in how they share and give to others. Having money is not evil but hoarding it is. How the Rothschild's and Rockefellers can hoard their old money is beyond me when people are starving but I guess it is theirs to do as they wish with. Who are we to judge? It feels unfair that some people will live their whole lives never knowing what it feels like to go on a vacation or do something enjoyable like stay in a hotel and go to a theme park or visit another country when for some people this is commonplace. It doesn't mean that the poor don't work hard enough to have earned it- I see people on the bus who like myself will never know these things and I feel for them. They look so tired from working two jobs just to scrape by because they are raising kids being the sole provider and never got the opportunity to thrive or inherit old money but I guess they find happiness in their own way with a plastic pool on their patio or a walk to the library but inside I know they'd give anything to see the ocean or take a cruise just once and would treasure that experience for their lifetime because those are the kinds of gifts that help you keep going. The closest I have came is Tijuana. Does that count? :ebil:

Jaxxi · Mar 13, 2021

Fervent said:
in·ter·pre·ta·tion
/inˌtərprəˈtāSH(ə)n/
Learn to pronounce

noun

the action of explaining the meaning of something.

When you present the meaning of Jesus holding up the coin as saying it belongs to Caesar, you are interpreting. So unless you're simply going to describe what is in the Bible and take absolutely no meaning from it, you must interpret it. To deny that you interpret is self-deception and nothing more.

Would you assume interpret and comprehend to mean the same thing? Some of us try to read and understand the Bible but I don't know if He is busy, or just unavailable but I don't always hear the Holy Spirit when I am reading so I have to fall back on my God- given gifts of comprehension and rely on the translation to be accurate and mean what was intended because that is what I have to work with! It is difficult however when a translation is given that is trying to convey a meaning that does not translate properly. For example, Hades and Sheol and Gehenna and the Lake of fire are different places but some Bibles translate these all to mean hell. So when we hear of hell, which place are they talking about?

Fervent · Mar 13, 2021

Nathan@work said:
No. If you choose to treat revealed truth from the Spirit as just self delusion it’s your choice.

I choose to accept it and let it build my Faith because of it.

I don't treat revealed truth as self-delusion, but your elevation of your interpretation to a revealed interpretation is self-delusion. It's a non-starter for discussion because there is no room for correction, your interpretation is divine so someone showing you error is only going to compromise what has supposedly been revealed. It's nothing more than religious arrogance.

Fervent · Mar 13, 2021

Jaxxi said:
Would you assume interpret and comprehend to mean the same thing? Some of us try to read and understand the Bible but I don't know if He is busy, or just unavailable but I don't always hear the Holy Spirit when I am reading so I have to fall back on my God- given gifts of comprehension and rely on the translation to be accurate and mean what was intended because that is what I have to work with! It is difficult however when a translation is given that is trying to convey a meaning that does not translate properly. For example, Hades and Sheol and Gehenna and the Lake of fire are different places but some Bibles translate these all to mean hell. So when we hear of hell, which place are they talking about?

Comprehension is a part of the interpretive act, but not the whole of it. The Holy Spirits direction is a complex beast, for me it's usually more about pointing me at a particular passage than exegeting it.

Nathan@work · Mar 13, 2021

Fervent said:
I don't treat revealed truth as self-delusion, but your elevation of your interpretation to a revealed interpretation is self-delusion. It's a non-starter for discussion because there is no room for correction, your interpretation is divine so someone showing you error is only going to compromise what has supposedly been revealed. It's nothing more than religious arrogance.

You may see it as arrogance, but I cannot help what you see.

Jesus was accused of such things all the time, so it does not bother me when someone does it to me.

I’ll still tell the truth, no matter if people do not see it as such.

Fervent · Mar 13, 2021

Nathan@work said:
You may see it as arrogance, but I cannot help what you see.

Jesus was accused of such things all the time, so it does not bother me when someone does it to me.

I’ll still tell the truth, no matter if people do not see it as such.

Now you're comparing yourself to Jesus? Oy vey.

Nathan@work · Mar 13, 2021

Fervent said:
Now you're comparing yourself to Jesus? Oy vey.

1 Peter 4:13 (ESV)
But rejoice insofar as you share Christ’s sufferings, that you may also rejoice and be glad when his glory is revealed.

Fervent · Mar 13, 2021

Nathan@work said:
1 Peter 4:13 (ESV)
But rejoice insofar as you share Christ’s sufferings, that you may also rejoice and be glad when his glory is revealed.

Are you really claiming that not having your interpretaion taken as the word of God himself is suffering? Is the Holy Spirit talking to you alone?

Nathan@work · Mar 13, 2021

Fervent said:
Are you really claiming that not having your interpretaion taken as the word of God himself is suffering? Is the Holy Spirit talking to you alone?

I do not understand your question.

Fervent · Mar 13, 2021

Nathan@work said:
I do not understand your question.

You claim your interpretation is revealed, and chances are there's no one who agrees with your readings 100%. So is the Holy Spirit talking to you alone, so that your understanding is perfect?

Nathan@work · Mar 13, 2021

Fervent said:
You claim your interpretation is revealed, and chances are there's no one who agrees with your readings 100%. So is the Holy Spirit talking to you alone, so that your understanding is perfect?

I know that what I’ve stated about that passage is true.

I do not believe that I am the only one that knows it’s true.

I know that I am not the only one the Spirit teaches.

Have you asked God what is meant by what Jesus said?

Fervent · Mar 13, 2021

Nathan@work said:
I know that what I’ve stated about that passage is true.

I do not believe that I am the only one that knows it’s true.

I know that I am not the only one the Spirit teaches.

Have you asked God what is meant by what Jesus said?

Yes, I have. And the answer agrees with my contextual analysis. So now you're limiting the Holy Spirit's divine interpretation to this one verse, and not every single understanding you have about the Bible? Why some, but not all?

Nathan@work · Mar 13, 2021

Fervent said:
Yes, I have. And the answer agrees with my contextual analysis. So now you're limiting the Holy Spirit's divine interpretation to this one verse, and not every single understanding you have about the Bible? Why some, but not all?

This is not the only passage I know about. There are others.

Why do you think I am limiting it to this one?

Fervent · Mar 14, 2021

Nathan@work said:
This is not the only passage I know about. There are others.

Why do you think I am limiting it to this one?

It doesn't matter if the limit is to this one, or to some subset. The point is you're hedging and limiting rather tthan holding tha 100% of your positions on the Bible are accurate, divine interpretations.

Render unto Ceaser

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