Nathan@work
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- Feb 19, 2021
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In other words, I did not 'create' my kids. I 'begot' them.
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But Jesus is not a created being correct? I mean He was in heaven before He came to earth as a man, so He has always just existed as far as we know correct? So Jesus created Satan?
hen why does the Son not know the day or time of the Day of the Lord?
Then why does the Son not know the day or time of the Day of the Lord?
the Lord said to him, “I am the Lord. Tell Pharaoh, Egypt’s king, everything that I’ve said to you.” Exodus 6:29
Statements like this are from God the Father, correct? The New Testament is God the Father speaking through Jesus, is that correct? Jesus says that the Father is in Him. So was the Old Testament mainly God the Father speaking?
Isaiah 9:6 should clarify this for you. Be blessed.the Lord said to him, “I am the Lord. Tell Pharaoh, Egypt’s king, everything that I’ve said to you.” Exodus 6:29
Statements like this are from God the Father, correct? The New Testament is God the Father speaking through Jesus, is that correct? Jesus says that the Father is in Him. So was the Old Testament mainly God the Father speaking?
Then why does no one know the hour of the day of the Lord, not the Son or the Holy Spirit but only the Father?
Jesus is indeed a created being. He is the God-man. Clearly God is uncreated. But the man is created. Jesus did not exist in the beginning of time, but the Son / Word of God was begotten before all ages.
Hi our minds have difficulty in understanding the concept of the trinity all being God and equally God and yet having distinct roles in the one God head. In the beginning God said let there be light and then let us create man in our image. This is the 1st hint God is compound and complex.
In Col 1 there is a passage that helped me a lot on this.
9 For this reason we also, since the day we heard it, do not cease to pray for you, and to ask that you may be filled with the knowledge of His will in all wisdom and spiritual understanding; 10 that you may walk worthy of the Lord, fully pleasing Him, being fruitful in every good work and increasing in the knowledge of God; 11 strengthened with all might, according to His glorious power, for all patience and longsuffering with joy; 12 giving thanks to the Father who has qualified us to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in the light. 13 He has delivered us from the power of darkness and conveyed us into the kingdom of the Son of His love, 14 in whom we have redemption through His blood,[fn] the forgiveness of sins.
15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. 16 For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him. 17 And He is before all things, and in Him all things consist. 18 And He is the head of the body, the church, who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, that in all things He may have the preeminence.
In this passage we see both the Father and the son mentioned and we see the Father qualifies us in paragraph one and we see the son redeemed us in paragraph two.
In paragraph two the narrative of the purpose of all creation is stated. All things were created through Him and for Him. 17 And He is before all things, and in Him all things consist. 18 And He is the head of the body, the church, who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, that in all things He may have the preeminence.
We are made in the image of God that being with self awareness and an eternal soul. God is infinite and we are finite. The fullness of the creation is for fellowship with God. Jesus is the word become flesh or the manifestation of the Father incarnate. The infinite through the son is the mediator between us and the Father. This is why Jesus has the preeminence and Jesus gives all glory to the Father yet the purpose or creation reads like a book with plot lines and Jesus coming to ransom man was known all along. In rev we see when the LORD returns the kingdoms of this world have become the kingdoms of our LORD and His Christ and He shall reign forever. After the 1000 year kingdom has come the new jerusalem comes down and we will see Jesus have the preeminence and he is worthy for having taken the lowest place to receive this glory. In that day we may understand it a bit better but perhaps read Dan 7 and you will see the same thing the son of man before the ancient of days and the son of man is given the kingdom that comes and covers the earth and has no end. when this is all done and come full circle we might have a better clue to what Jesus meant by this, And now, O Father, glorify Me together with Yourself, with the glory which I had with You before the world was.
the 2nd ecumenical counsel will be rejected when the LORD comes and is king over all the earth. This is probably not the place to open this debate in length but in every depiction of the kingdom coming evil is quashed and righteousness and peace have come and the passages that are specific like Zech 14 where Jerusalem is being overrun and half the city is taken and the LORD comes and melts those invaders and the LORD is king over all the earth. The nations which are left must now keep the feast of Tabernacle and worship the king or they get no rain. The new river created by the splitting of the mount of Olives flows year round and flows east which would take it to the dead sea which Ezekiel notes is going to be healed and a prosperous fishing town at the time the 12 tribes receive their inheritance. ch 47I agree with most of your post except for the pre-Millennial aspect; this was rejected at the Second Ecumenical Council.
I can think of another couple of reasons.
One is that within the Godhead there are different roles and responsibilities.
More probably Jesus was dealing with the fact people were going to set dates for his second advent and he was trying to head that off. Of course some do it anyway.
the 2nd ecumenical counsel will be rejected when the LORD comes and is king over all the earth. This is probably not the place to open this debate in length but in every depiction of the kingdom coming evil is quashed and righteousness and peace have come and the passages that are specific like Zech 14 where Jerusalem is being overrun and half the city is taken and the LORD comes and melts those invaders and the LORD is king over all the earth. The nations which are left must now keep the feast of Tabernacle and worship the king or they get no rain. The new river created by the splitting of the mount of Olives flows year round and flows east which would take it to the dead sea which Ezekiel notes is going to be healed and a prosperous fishing town at the time the 12 tribes receive their inheritance. ch 47
You see in Luke 1 Jesus mission is declared 9 But when she saw him,[fn] she was troubled at his saying, and considered what manner of greeting this was. 30 Then the angel said to her, “Do not be afraid, Mary, for you have found favor with God. 31 And behold, you will conceive in your womb and bring forth a Son, and shall call His name JESUS. 32 He will be great, and will be called the Son of the Highest; and the Lord God will give Him the throne of His father David. 33 And He will reign over the house of Jacob forever, and of His kingdom there will be no end.”
67 Now his father Zacharias was filled with the Holy Spirit, and prophesied, saying:
68 “Blessed is the Lord God of Israel,
For He has visited and redeemed His people,
69 And has raised up a horn of salvation for us
In the house of His servant David,
70 As He spoke by the mouth of His holy prophets,
Who have been since the world began,
71 That we should be saved from our enemies
And from the hand of all who hate us,
72 To perform the mercy promised to our fathers
And to remember His holy covenant,
73 The oath which He swore to our father Abraham:
74 To grant us that we,
Being delivered from the hand of our enemies,
Might serve Him without fear,
75 In holiness and righteousness before Him all the days of our life.
This exact before and after picture is coming and future and quite literal. I can back this up with at least 100 passages all harmonious on this literal idea. The allegorical view of the 2nd counsel is in error and the church is not Israel although there is merit to the spiritual kingdom and Israel too but those concepts do not nullify the future destiny that if taken literally is not veiled but quite clear. Anyways you you are free to keep your views but I suggest you be like a Barean and try to see the possibility of your conclusions if you just believed what it said would actually come to pass.
There are at least 2 explanations on that and both might be true to some degree.
1) Christ was speaking from the stand point of Kenosis. In the Incarnation before the Crucifixion he set aside most of his Divine privileges and attributes to be human so he can be tempted like we are etc. Hebrews 4:15.
This also allows Christ to be a good example for us. Because he did not have any advantages different than what a righteous believer would. (If he did then we could say "Well yes but he was divine.. he didn't have my problem...") 1 Peter 2:21-25, John 13:15
Kenosis - Wikipedia
2) This statement is a direct allusion to the Hebrew custom of weddings. In Israel weddings were actually done as surprise parties. After the groom had eventually prepared the house, room or lodging where he would live with his bride they would secretly organize a banquet party. When everything was done, the groom would try to come around in the middle of the night one night and snatch the bride away to a secret wedding party in progress. And the person actually who picked the exact time or gave the final OK, was the Father of the Groom who basically sponsored everything, and the head person organizing the feast etc.
Ah, basically the same arguments I used, except I presume you were unaware of that of St. Chrysostom.
Yeah I haven't read of him in that context. Most of that saint I know is from the liturgy, and a few odds and ends quotes. "Christ trampling down death by his own death." being the immediate one that comes to mind. Now I will have to go back and see what Johnny Gold Mouth said!
He was such a good preacher, at times I wish ministers who aren’t good at preaching would just use portions of his homilies. I say portions because he tended to preach at the ninth hour, using Noone as a preaching service separate from and after the liturgical synaxis, and some of his sermons are long. But some, like the Paschal homily, are extremely compact.
I only ever use his Paschal homily and the similar Paschal homily of St. Athanasius, because I have never heard a modern day priest do a better job of explaining Easter than either of them.