What must I do to be saved?

Bible Highlighter

Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul.
Supporter
Jul 22, 2014
41,433
7,859
...
✟1,187,903.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
John 5:24, KJV: "Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall NOTcome into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life."

You fail to understand that when Jesus says “He that heareth my word” is in reference to obeying what Jesus says. For obviously if somebody listens to a person and does not actually do what they say then they are not really hearing that person. So those who believe on Jesus and does what He says has everlasting life and they shall not come into condemnation, etc.; Also see Matthew 7:26-27.

You said:
John 3:16 KJV: For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him SHOULD NOT PERISH but HAVE everlasting life.

And you gotta keep reading. John 3:20 says all who do evil hate the light.

You said:
John 6:37-39 KJV All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out. For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me. And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again on the last day. John 6:47 KJV: Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life.

I already addressed this post with you before.

You said:
Hebrews 10:14 KJV By the which will (will of God) we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all. And every priest standeth daily ministering and offering oftentimes the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins: But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins FOR EVER, sat down on the right hand of God; From henceforth expecting till his enemies be made his footstool. For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified. Hebrews 10:17 And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.

And you gotta keep reading. Hebrews 10:26 says if we willfully sin after we receive the knowledge of the truth, there remains no more sacrifice for sins.

You said:
Romans 10:10-11 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.

Right, you have to keep confessing Jesus to others as a part of salvation that is why you would not be ashamed of Jesus. Also, if you read Romans 11:21-22, it says for us to continue in his goodness otherwise we can be cut off just like the Jews were cut off.

You said:
If you are trusting in your good works to save you, God calls that sin or iniquity and if you don’t repent, this is what you have to look forward to.

I don't believe in Works Alone Salvationism. I believe we are initially and foundationally saved by God's grace through faith in Jesus Christ as the Savior and in believing in the gospel in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4. But make no mistake, the gospel call is... God has chosen us to salvaton through sanctification of the Spirit and a belief of the truth (See: 2 Thessalonians 2:13-14).

You said:
Matthew 7:22-33 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

It was not because of their works as to the reason why they were cast out by Jesus. It was because they worked sin or iniquity. They justified a sin and still be saved type belief. How so? Jesus said in a few verses down (verses 26-27) that everyone who does not do what He says is like a fool who built his house upon the sand and when a storm came, great was the fall of that house. Jesus did not make an example of how we should not have done what He said and to just trust in the finished work of Christ.

You said:
Isaiah 64:6 But we are all as an unclean thing, and all OUR righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away.

Right, and as I told you before. Read verse 5.

You said:
Romans 8:38-39 For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Who is Paul talking to? Those who love God and those who are called according to his purpose (Romans 8:28). Jesus says if you love me, keep my commandments (John 14:15). Paul says in 1 Corinthians 16:22 that if any man loves not the Lord Jesus Christ, let him be accursed.

You said:
Romans 11:6 And if by grace, then is it NO MORE of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.

Again, Romans 11:6 is in reference to the Jews and their false Works ALONE type belief and Paul is not referring to the necessity of the work of faith that follows after being saved by God's grace (See: Romans 11:1-2).

You said:
Ephesians 2:8-9 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that NOT OF yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.

Right, Ephesians 2:8-9 is referring to Initial Salvation and Foundational Salvation. It is basically saying we are not saved by “Works ALONE Salvationism” (Which would be by Man Directed Works) without God's grace. For verse 9 is the kind of work that a man would boast in himself by doing it. But verse 10 switches gears and talks about a completely different kind of work. It refers to God directed works done through the believer in the Sanctificaton Process because these are the kind of works we were created unto Christ Jesus to do (after we are saved by God's grace).

You said:
What about those who backslide? Hebrews 10:38-39 Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him. But WE (Those who are saved by trusting in Jesus) are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul. If we are in sin - Hebrews 12:6-8 For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth. If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not? But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons. Hebrews 12:11 Now no chastening for the present seemeth to be joyous, but grievous: nevertheless afterward it yieldeth the peaceable fruit of righteousness unto them which are exercised thereby.

I don't honestly believe that Belief Alone-ism leads any believer to be truly chastened. Correction only makes sense if one knows that sin can destroy a person's soul in the afterlife. But if I knew that no sin can separate me from God, then how I live would not really matter (even if I was chastened). You implied George Sodini was saved by the passage you quoted. Where was his correction or chastisement?

You said:
Ephesians 1:13-14 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, (having believed you were) ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise. Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the PURCHASED possession, unto the praise of his glory.

Again, we know that other seals can be broken in the Bible. So the seal you talk about is not a padlock or a bank vault. Hebrews 3 talks about how we are not to harden our heart by the deceitfulness of sin whereby we would depart from the living God.

You said:
John 10:28-30 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand. I and my Father are one.

Read the context. Verse 27 (John 10:27) tells us the kind of sheep that will have eternal life and never perish. It says these kind of sheep are the kind that FOLLOW Jesus.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Bible Highlighter

Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul.
Supporter
Jul 22, 2014
41,433
7,859
...
✟1,187,903.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
You mock grace. Calling it easy believism. Mocking a man for his moral failures and mistakes, calling he doesnt deserve the grace of God. And im the one flaming?

Where is that love, you so much boast?

I was trying to help you.

Anyways, so you don't believe in easy believism? So there needs to be some level of holy living to show forth for a believer after they are saved by God's grace?
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

GraceInChrist

Active Member
Feb 22, 2021
287
33
29
Heredia
✟17,779.00
Country
Costa Rica
Faith
Lutheran
Marital Status
Widowed
You fail to understand that when Jesus says “He that heareth my word” is in reference to obeying what Jesus says. For obviously if somebody listens to a person and does not actually do what they say then they are not really hearing that person. So those who believe on Jesus and does what He says has everlasting life and they shall not come into condemnation, etc.; Also see Matthew 7:26-27.



And you gotta keep reading. John 3:20 says all who do evil hate the light.



I already addressed this post with you before.



And you gotta keep reading. Hebrews 10:26 says if we willfully sin after we receive the knowledge of the truth, there remains no more sacrifice for sins.



Right, you have to keep confessing Jesus to others as a part of salvation that is why you would not be ashamed of Jesus. Also, if you read Romans 11:21-22, it says for us to continue in his goodness otherwise we can be cut off just like the Jews were cut off.



I don't believe in Works Alone Salvationism. I believe we are initially and foundationally saved by God's grace through faith in Jesus Christ as the Savior and in believing in the gospel in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4. But make no mistake, the gospel call is... God has chosen us to salvaton through sanctification of the Spirit and a belief of the truth (See: 2 Thessalonians 2:13-14).



It was not because of their works as to the reason why they were cast out by Jesus. It was because they worked sin or iniquity. They justified a sin and still be saved type belief. How so? Jesus said in a few verses down (verses 26-27) that everyone who does not do what He says is like a fool who built his house upon the sand and when a storm came, great was the fall of that house. Jesus did not make an example of how we should not have done what He said and to just trust in the finished work of Christ.



Right, and as I told you before. Read verse 5.



Who is Paul talking to? Those who love God and those who are called according to his purpose (Romans 8:28). Jesus says if you love me, keep my commandments (John 14:15). Paul says in 1 Corinthians 16:22 that if any man loves not the Lord Jesus Christ, let him be accursed.



Again, Romans 11:6 is in reference to the Jews and their false Works ALONE type belief and Paul is not referring to the necessity of the work of faith that follows after being saved by God's grace (See: Romans 11:1-2).



Right, Ephesians 2:8-9 is referring to Initial Salvation and Foundational Salvation. It saying we are not saved by “Works ALONE Salvationism” (Which would be by Man Directed Works). For verse 9 is the kind of work that a man would boast in himself by doing it. But verse 10 switches gears and talks about a completely different kind of work. It refers to the God directed work done through the believer in the Sanctificaton Process because these are the kind of works we were created unto Christ Jesus to do.



I don't honestly believe that Belief Alone-ism leads any believer to be truly chastened. Correction only makes sense if one knows that sin can destroy a person's soul in the afterlife. But if I knew that no sin can separate me from God, then how I live would not really matter (even if I was chastened). You implied George Sodini was saved by the passage you quoted. Where was his correction or chastisement?



Again, we know that other seals can be broken in the Bible. So the seal you talk about is not a padlock or a bank vault. Hebrews 3 talks about how we are not to harden our heart by the deceitfulness of sin whereby we would depart from the living God.



Read the context. Verse 27 (John 10:27) tells us the kind of sheep that will have eternal life and never perish. It says these kind of sheep are the kind that FOLLOW Jesus.

I was trying to help you. So you don't believe in easy believism? So there needs to be some level of holy living to show forth for a believer after they are saved by God's grace?

You are preaching to me another gospel. Negating the free gift of grace in his finish work of the cross. Nevertheless you twited scriptures saying, it doesnt mean what they. They mean what they say. You just want to reject grace.
 
Upvote 0

Bible Highlighter

Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul.
Supporter
Jul 22, 2014
41,433
7,859
...
✟1,187,903.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
You are preaching to me another gospel. Negating the free gift of grace in his finish work of the cross. Nevertheless you twited scriptures saying, it doesnt mean what they. They mean what they say. You just want to reject grace.

Like said before, I accept grace just fine. I just do not accept the grace as taught in popular Christianity vs. what the Bible says. I mean, what do you make of Titus 2:11-12? It says that God's grace teaches us to deny ungodliness and that we should live righteously and godly in this present world. What do you make of 2 Thessalonians 2:13-14? The gospel call is... God has chosen us to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and a belief of the truth.

I believe the gospel is 1 Corinthians 15:1-4. But there is a call of the gospel according to 2 Thessalonians 2:13-14. Yes, the call of the gospel is not the gospel. It is another thing. Do you even know what that gospel call is?

Yet, you say I preach another gospel.
You need to prove with Scripture that I am preaching another gospel.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Bible Highlighter

Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul.
Supporter
Jul 22, 2014
41,433
7,859
...
✟1,187,903.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
You are preaching to me another gospel. Negating the free gift of grace in his finish work of the cross. Nevertheless you twited scriptures saying, it doesnt mean what they. They mean what they say. You just want to reject grace.

You implied before that George Sodini who is believer in Free Grace who turned out to be a mass murderer and who took his own life is saved by quoting Luke 18:9-14. Is this what you are saying? Can a believer commit gross sins (like murder), and not repent of them and still be saved all because they believe in the finished work of Christ?
 
Upvote 0

GraceInChrist

Active Member
Feb 22, 2021
287
33
29
Heredia
✟17,779.00
Country
Costa Rica
Faith
Lutheran
Marital Status
Widowed
You implied before that George Sodini who is believer in Free Grace who turned out to be a mass murderer and who took his own life is saved by quoting Luke 18:9-14. Is this what you are saying? Can a believer commit gross sins (like murder), and not repent of them and still be saved all because they believe in the finished work of Christ?
Yes, repenting of sin is a work.
 
Upvote 0

GraceInChrist

Active Member
Feb 22, 2021
287
33
29
Heredia
✟17,779.00
Country
Costa Rica
Faith
Lutheran
Marital Status
Widowed
Like said before, I accept grace just fine. I just do not accept the grace as taught in popular Christianity vs. what the Bible says. I mean, what do you make of Titus 2:11-12? It says that God's grace teaches us to deny ungodliness and that we should live righteously and godly in this present world. What do you make of 2 Thessalonians 2:13-14? The gospel call is... God has chosen us to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and a belief of the truth.

I believe the gospel is 1 Corinthians 15:1-4. But there is a call of the gospel according to 2 Thessalonians 2:13-14. Yes, the call of the gospel is not the gospel. It is another thing. Do you even know what that gospel call is?

Yet, you say I preach another gospel.
You need to prove with Scripture that I am preaching another gospel.
Titus 2:11-12
It clearly says should, not have to. Also it says teaching, not that making us do it.

..........................................


2 Thessalonians 2:13-14
Hebrews 10
10 By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

Does it say sanctified by our woks or our love or our flesh?
 
Upvote 0

GraceInChrist

Active Member
Feb 22, 2021
287
33
29
Heredia
✟17,779.00
Country
Costa Rica
Faith
Lutheran
Marital Status
Widowed
You implied before that George Sodini who is believer in Free Grace who turned out to be a mass murderer and who took his own life is saved by quoting Luke 18:9-14. Is this what you are saying? Can a believer commit gross sins (like murder), and not repent of them and still be saved all because they believe in the finished work of Christ?
Jhon 3
19 And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.


20 For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved.


21 But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.

The purpose of the light to expose how much we failed and we need grace. I we abound in this light we are found guilty within our hearts. Nevertheless, exposing how much we are lost makes it imposible for the people who believe their works are needed for salvation, so they avoid grace. They dont want their filthy rags to be exposed. No one does good not one, only God.

Luke 18:19
“And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? none is good, save one, that is, God.”
 
Upvote 0

Bible Highlighter

Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul.
Supporter
Jul 22, 2014
41,433
7,859
...
✟1,187,903.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Titus 2:11-12
It clearly says should, not have to. Also it says teaching, not that making us do it.

The word “should” can be defined in the dictionary as:

Should:
“must; ought (used to indicate duty, propriety, or expediency):
Example: You should not do that.”

Source:
Definition of should | Dictionary.com

Also, lets look at the context of Titus 2:11-12.

Paul says, “They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.” (Titus 1:16).

So one of the identifying marks of vain talkers and deceivers is that they deny God by a lack of good works and by being disobedient. So no. When Titus 2:11-12 says that we should live godly in this present world it is saying should in a way that is a must or a requirement. Like... you should wear a parachute if you decide to skydive. Or... you should carry a license if you drive. Or... you should not be near fallen down power lines.

Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you withdraw yourselves from every brother who walks disorderly (2 Thessalonians 3:6).

Yet, you are suggesting or implying that being disorderly is just the norm of the Christian life. Yet, 2 Thessalonians 3:6 says that we are to withdraw ourselves from every brother who walks disorderly.

You said:
2 Thessalonians 2:13-14
Hebrews 10
10 By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

Does it say sanctified by our woks or our love or our flesh?

Look at the context of 2 Thessalonians 2:13-14. In verse 12 it makes a polar opposite contrast of what it says in verse 13.

Verse 13 says “sanctification of the Spirit,” and “belief of the truth.”
Verse 12 says the polar opposite of this by saying “had pleasure in unrighteousness,” and “believed not the truth.”

Verse 13 says “belief of the truth” and “sanctification of the Spirit.
Verse 16 says, “good hope through grace,” and verse 17 says, “stablish you in every good word and work.” So the context is talking about God's grace through faith, and good works as a part of the sanctification of the Spirit.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

GraceInChrist

Active Member
Feb 22, 2021
287
33
29
Heredia
✟17,779.00
Country
Costa Rica
Faith
Lutheran
Marital Status
Widowed
The word “should” can be defined in the dictionary as:

Should:
“must; ought (used to indicate duty, propriety, or expediency):
Example: You should not do that.”

Source:
Definition of should | Dictionary.com

Also, lets look at the context of Titus 2:11-12.

Paul says, “They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.” (Titus 1:16).

So one of the identifying marks of vain talkers and deceivers is that they deny God by a lack of good works and by being disobedient. So no. When Titus 2:11-12 says that we should live godly in this present world it is saying should in a way that is a must or a requirement. Like... you should wear a parachute if you decide to skydive. Or... you should carry a license if you drive. Or... you should not be near fallen down power lines.

Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you withdraw yourselves from every brother who walks disorderly (2 Thessalonians 3:6).

Yet, you are suggesting or implying that being disorderly is just the norm of the Christian life. Yet, 2 Thessaloninans 3:6 says that we are to withdraw ourselves from every brother who walks disorderly.



Look at the context of 2 Thessalonians 2:13-14. In verse 12 it makes a polar opposite contrast of what it says in verse 13.

Verse 13 says “sanctification of the Spirit,” and “belief of the truth.”
Verse 12 says the polar opposite of this by saying “had pleasure in unrighteousness,” and “believed not the truth.”

Verse 13 says “belief of the truth” and “sanctification of the Spirit.
Verse 16 says, “good hope through grace,” and verse 17 says, “stablish you in every good word and work.” So the context is talking about God's grace through faith, and good works as a part of the sanctificationof the Spirit.
Wow, that is some talent to take verses out of context. I guess you are seal not believe the truth.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Bible Highlighter

Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul.
Supporter
Jul 22, 2014
41,433
7,859
...
✟1,187,903.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
20 For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved.


21 But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.

Well, I highlighted verse 20 to show you that everyone who does evil hates the light and neither comes to the light unless his deeds should be reproved. Meaning, he seeks forgiveness with the Lord Jesus Christ and he forsakes his sins. Those who continue to do evil simply hate the light (i.e. they hate the real Jesus of the Bible). For the Jesus of the Bible called sinners to repentance (Luke 5:32).

You said:
The purpose of the light to expose how much we failed and we need grace.

Nope. Not true. God's grace teaches us to deny ungodliness and that we should live righteously and godly in this present world (Titus 2:11-12). Paul says let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit perfecting holiness in the fear fo God (See: 2 Corinthians 7:1).

You said:
They dont want their filthy rags to be exposed.

You are again misquoting Isaiah out of context.

When you read Isaiah 64:6, you also have to read Isaiah 64:5 that says,

“You meet him who rejoices and does righteousness,...” (Isaiah 64:5) (NKJV).

In other words, God meets the one who rejoices and does righteousness.


You said:
No one does good not one, only God.

So you still hold to Romans 3:10, and Romans 3:23 as applying to every believer in their present day walk? If so, then you need to also be fair and apply Romans 3:11 to the equation, as well. For it says, “There is none who understands; There is none who seeks after God.” (Romans 3:11). So if you want to truly apply those other verses to your life, then you need also apply Romans 3:11 to your life, as well. If this is the case, then you would not be qualified to actually teach the Scriptures.

You said:
Luke 18:19
“And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? none is good, save one, that is, God.”

Right, a person on their own (without God) is not good. They can only do good by allowing God to do the good work through them and to change their heart and life so as to allow the Holy Spirit to bring forth the fruits (like love, joy, peace) within their lives. A good tree is known by it's fruit. A Christian can only be good by allowing the light of Christ or God to shine through them. We are just temples for God. But without God, no believer can be good or do good by any means. But we must also understand that Jesus also said, “A good man out of the good treasure of the heart bringeth forth good things: and an evil man out of the evil treasure bringeth forth evil things.” (Matthew 12:35). So how can a man be good? By submitting completely to God by being a willing vessel of God to flow through their life. For to live is Christ, and to die is gain.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Bible Highlighter

Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul.
Supporter
Jul 22, 2014
41,433
7,859
...
✟1,187,903.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Wow, that is some talent to take verses out of context. I guess you are seal not believe the truth.

If you disagree with the dictionary and the context, then that is on you, friend.
 
Upvote 0

DamianWarS

Follower of Isa Al Masih
Supporter
May 15, 2008
9,486
3,322
✟858,457.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
Acts 16:30-31 says "believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved"

But I see many here adding their own conditions to earn salvation.
Not conditions but ceritera as to what believe on the Lord Jesus Christ is and what it is not. Christ reveals that "not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven" so at the very least this seems to identify that belief is not broadly applied and we need to understand belief works and when it doesn't work.
 
Upvote 0