Removing the laws of God- what does it really mean?

Religiot said:

I'm not interested in playing along with your pretense of hostility,

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Ditto.

Michael Collum said:

I'm not reading previous posts.

furthermore, your interpretation =/= the scriptures.

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My posts of the scriptures equal the scriptures.

--you would've known that had you bothered to look.

Religiot said:

My posts of the scriptures equal the scriptures.

--you would've known that had you bothered to look.

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Satan quoted scriptures to Jesus in the desert, but this did not make them true.

May God be true and every man a liar. (Romans 3:4)

Michael Collum said:

Ditto.

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Sorry, but one of us started out by twisting what the other said, to such a degree, as to cause doubt as to whether or not the other had at all read what was said.

The pretense here is not shared.

No-one can "remove" God's laws. You either ignore them, or accept them, but they are always present, and enforced by God, regardless of how humans choose to relate to them.

Religiot said:

Sorry, but one of us started out by twisting what the other said, to such a degree, as to cause doubt as to whether or not the other had at all read what was said.

The pretense here is not shared.

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All I get here is I didn't address you, and you started arguing with me and accusing me of stuff.

So that's pretty hostile.

imge said:

There is more than one Sabbath in the Bible. There is the moral Sabbath that God established at creation before sin Genesis 2:3 and than wrote in stone Exodus 20:8-11. God said His Sabbath is a perpetual covenant, meaning it can not be broken ever. The Sabbath you are referring to in Colossians is the ceremonial Sabbath(s) the Sabbath festivals, if you read Colossians 2:16 its all about food and drink and there is nothing in God’s commandments about food or drink Exodus 20. God asked us to REMEMBER His Sabbath which is why on the New Earth all will worship Him each and every Saturday. Isaiah 66:23.

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Heb 4:1-11, v.9, is referring to the weekly Sabbath of Ex 20:11; Dt 5:15,
where the Sabbath was a shadow of the things to come, and
the reality (rest from our own works to save ourselves) is found in Christ, not in a day of the week.

The Sabbath is fulfilled in Christ (Heb 4:9-11).

Michael Collum said:

Satan quoted scriptures to Jesus in the desert, but this did not make them true.

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The scriptures are true, but to cite them as Satan did, in part, out of context, and contradictory to the meaning is sin, mortal sin, in-fact.

I cite the scriptures complete, in context, and in harmony with the meaning--something you would've known had you bothered to look.

Religiot said:

The scriptures are true, but to cite them as Satan did, in part, out of context, and contradictory to the meaning is sin, mortal sin, in-fact.

I cite the scriptures complete, in context, and in harmony with the meaning--something you would've known had you bothered to look.

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Why should I? According to the latter half of James Chapter 3, there's no reason to go look. I'm feeling the need to pray fervently from the posts that I have read. Very disorienting spirit.

Michael Collum said:

All I get here is I didn't address you, and you started arguing with me and accusing me of stuff.

So that's pretty hostile.

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I pointed out, with specificity, what you did, and you pretended as if it were my fault, which only served to add to the incredulity of what you first said; as does this response now.

--Instead of continuing in your wasteful pretense, why not just address what I've proved by the scriptures here on this thread?

Religiot said:

I pointed out, with specificity, what you did, and you pretended as if it were my fault, which only served to add to the incredulity of what you first said; as does this response now.

--Instead of continuing in your wasteful pretense, why not just address what I've proved by the scriptures here on this thread?

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This is odd, are you sure you didn't reply to my post initially by mistake? I don't recall having a reason to discuss things with you.

It seems like some sort of strategy to get people to look at your posts by starting an argument, but no one does that so .... anyway, whatever just happened, I'm sure It'll be a repressed memory before long.

Michael Collum said:

Why should I?

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"He that answereth a matter before he heareth it, it is folly and shame unto him." --Proverbs 18:13

Michael Collum said:

I'm feeling the need to pray fervently from the posts that I have read. Very disorienting spirit.

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Your effort at ad hominem is the real disorientation from what is at issue here--so, again, why not just put that same effort to responding to what I've proven by the scriptures?

pescador said:

Fundamentally, there are two ways that you can be guided through life to do God's will: the law and the Holy Spirit. If you haven't been born again and received the Holy Spirit then you must be guided externally by the law. If you have been born again and received the Holy Spirit then you are guided internally by Him.

They cannot co-exist! If you received the Holy Spirit you are "dead to the law"!

If you haven't been born again then there must be external rules in place to guide your behavior (and the behavior of others). So there is a definite need for law, both God's law and human law (in that order).

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Please some clarification needed :
A. What exactly do you mean by "dead to the law"?
B. What or which law are you referring to?

Michael Collum said:

This is odd, are you sure you didn't reply to my post initially by mistake? I don't recall having a reason to discuss things with you.

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Do you normally enter such a deep pretense on accident? if so, I must say, I find that hilarious.

Michael Collum said:

It seems like some sort of strategy to get people to look at your posts by starting an argument, but no one does that so .... anyway, whatever just happened, I'm sure It'll be a repressed memory before long.

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Your sarcasm is fitting.

Truly, instead, why not just spend the time in a dialog about what the scriptures say?

Clare73 said:

Jesus replaces Moses as the Mediator/Lawgiver, and was giving new law.

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I don’t think Jesus replaces Moses. I also would not call it a new law.

I put quotation marks around the word law to show something. Not to insinuate Jesus command was a new law per say.

But the man who was healed had to make a choice. I whole heartedly believe that he made the choice he did because he knew he was not ‘breaking’ Gods laws by doing so.

The problem is that mankind thinks they know how to interpret Gods laws. Jesus made sure to let us know that we have no clue how to interpret them.

I would guess that 99% of the people on this forum would say they have never murdered anyone. But, if we were to apply what Jesus said He considered murder, that number would be 0%. In fact, some are guilty of doing it while participating in this thread.

Spraxies said:

Please some clarification needed :
A. What exactly do you mean by "dead to the law"?
B. What or which law are you referring to?

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Dead to the law: "So, my brothers and sisters, you also died to the law through the body of Christ, so that you could be joined to another, to the one who was raised from the dead, to bear fruit to God." Romans 7:4

Once one has become a believer, is born again, and receives the Holy Spirit, then He is our guide. The OT law -- the Mosaic law -- has no authority over us. Paul explains this in terms of marriage in Romans...

Romans 7:1-5, "Or do you not know, brothers and sisters (for I am speaking to those who know the law), that the law is lord over a person as long as he lives? For a married woman is bound by law to her husband as long as he lives, but if her husband dies, she is released from the law of the marriage. So then, if she is joined to another man while her husband is alive, she will be called an adulteress. But if her husband dies, she is free from that law, and if she is joined to another man, she is not an adulteress. So, my brothers and sisters, you also died to the law through the body of Christ, so that you could be joined to another, to the one who was raised from the dead, to bear fruit to God."

Religiot said:

With respect, I didn't think about it at all: I just defer to what God says--I'll post the reference further below.

Adam didn't know either, but ate for another reason.

That theory is contrary to what God says.

Yes, in part, for the denial of the tree of life did prevent the ongoing of his life.

Man does indeed know good from evil--wisdom in his own eyes is just a result of evil, not the knowledge thereof, but it's effect.

What God says about this matter:

"And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever: therefore the Lord God sent him forth from the garden of Eden, to till the ground from whence he was taken. So he drove out the man; and he placed at the east of the garden of Eden Cherubims, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to keep the way of the tree of life." --Genesis 3:22-24


Yes, Satan is indeed a liar, but more specifically, the father of it, yet you failed to see his lie in the garden, for in all that he said, he lied but in one thing alone, when he said, "Ye shall not surely die."

This is the lie that pervades all religion, to this day, the immortality of man, presupposed, with or without God: the first lie remains, unchanged, throughout the ages. --the Dragon succeeds in deceiving the whole world, but the very elect of God, for they have been preserved from his power to twist God's word, thus it is impossible for them to be carried away. Amen.

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So do you believe Satan said anything that was true to Eve?

Mankind knows of good ‘and’ evil. Think about what you read when you read it. Man does not know good ‘from’ evil. You will never find that written in the Bible at least.

Religiot said:

To love each other as God commands, presupposes loving God, for the command follows from God, thus to love God first is required; thereby is the order preserved; otherwise, the affection towards others would be inordinate.

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But let me show you it's not possible to love your neighbor without loving God, and it is easy to love God and your neighbor, no where in these next verses does it say OK you tried to obey all the little laws one at a time come into my kingdom.

Matthew chapter 25 starting with verse 31

The Sheep and the Goats

31 “When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, he will sit on his glorious throne. 32 All the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. 33 He will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left.

34 “Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. 35 For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, 36 I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’

37 “Then the righteous will answer him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? 38 When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? 39 When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?’

40 “The King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.’

41 “Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42 For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, 43 I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.’

44 “They also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?’

45 “He will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.’

46 “Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.”

Nathan@work said:

I don’t think Jesus replaces Moses.

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Moses was Mediator/Lawgiver.
See Gal 3:19-20; 1Tim 2:5; Heb 8:6, 9:15, where Jesus is the new Mediator.

I also would not call it a new law.

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Jesus is also new Lawgiver (Mt 5:23-47, 12:7-8, 19:9, 21:23-27; chp 23.

I put quotation marks around the word law to show something. Not to insinuate Jesus command was a new law per say.

But the man who was healed had to make a choice. I whole heartedly believe that he made the choice he did because he knew he was not ‘breaking’ Gods laws by doing so.

The problem is that mankind thinks they know how to interpret Gods laws. Jesus made sure to let us know that we have no clue how to interpret them.

I would guess that 99% of the people on this forum would say they have never murdered anyone. But, if we were to apply what Jesus said He considered murder, that number would be 0%. In fact, some are guilty of doing it while participating in this thread.

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Religiot said:

"He that answereth a matter before he heareth it, it is folly and shame unto him." --Proverbs 18:13

Your effort at ad hominem is the real disorientation from what is at issue here--so, again, why not just put that same effort to responding to what I've proven by the scriptures?

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Religiot said:

Do you normally enter such a deep pretense on accident? if so, I must say, I find that hilarious.

Your sarcasm is fitting.

Truly, instead, why not just spend the time in a dialog about what the scriptures say?

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Hi there, you win the argument, but I won't read your scripture posts.

Have a nice day.