Does God love all or some?

Dan1988 said:

Can you show me where God said He loves all, I've never seen that in the Bible but I did read that He hates some and loves others before they're even born.

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Jesus said God the Father "is Love", etc, and that the true and highest and greatest commandments all each hang upon, or all hinge upon Love, etc...

And as for God the Spirit, He does hate some, or at least did hate some, etc, but that hatred might fade in and with and given enough time, etc, or it might have already passed, etc, I'm afraid I don't know that part yet, etc...? If it or that has passed yet, etc...?

But I don't believe all are saved or will all ever all be completely saved, for reasons I already stated and said, etc...

Not everyone attaining to a true saving faith, that leads to a true saving repentance, etc...

Anyway,

God Bless!

Neogaia777 said:

Jesus said God the Father "is Love", etc, and that the true and highest and greatest commandments all each hang upon, or all hinge upon Love, etc...

And as for God the Spirit, He does hate some, or at least did hate some, etc, but that hatred might fade in and with and given enough time, etc, or it might have already passed, etc, I'm afraid I don't know that part yet, etc...

But I don't believe all are saved or will all ever all be completely saved, for reasons I already stated and said, etc...

Not everyone attaining to a true saving faith, that leads to a true saving repentance, etc...

Anyway,

God Bless!

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I still don't know how you came to believe these things but God never said any of it.

God is hate and He is love as well, so please use both eyes when you read the Bible.

There's no such this as God the Spirit, there's only One God in three persons. God doesn't have a personality disorder where His Holy Spirit goes off and does something independently of the Father and Son.

Jesus is Jehovah God, He created the universe and every speck of dust in it and His Holy Spirit has always existed in Him and He never changes a single thing. If He hates you He hates you for eternity, if He loves you He loves you far all eternity.

What you believe doesn't cange anything, God is the same forever and His will shall be done exactly as He predestined it to be done and what we believe about Him changes nothing.

public hermit said:

How do you know God doesn't hate you?

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I know He doesn't hate me because I know God is not a liar

Dan1988 said:

All I know is your dead wrong, God definitely doesn't love everyone. He said He hates some people before they're even born.

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Really?
So God who is love, 1 John 4:8, who is perfect, Matthew 5:48, who made us all in his image, Genesis 1:26-27 and who declared all his creation to be VERY good, Genesis 1:31, planned, and chose, to hate some of those he had created in his own image?

Dan1988 said:

He didn't kill billions of men women and children with a flood because He loved them

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He sent the flood because the world had become wicked and people loved sin more than they loved God, Genesis 6:5-6.
Do you think that Noah knocked up the ark over night and no one had any warning? Most likely it took him years, and people would have wanted to know why he was building an enormous boat in the middle of the desert. I am pretty sure that had people repented at that point, they would have been saved - as the people of Ninevah were.

Dan1988 said:

and He won't cast billions into he lake of fire to be tormented forever because He loves them.

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If people reject God all their lives, knowingly reject him and his love, when they die they will have died in their sins, without a Saviour and without eternal life. God will not force those who chose to reject him to live with him forever. That would be hell for them; living with someone they had hated and rejected.
How many people this will refer to, we don't know; maybe billions, maybe not. God is judge and he is just - he knows whether someone has truly rejected him, or not. Maybe it's the false image of God portrayed by some Christians that they are rejecting, maybe it's the church, maybe they've had difficult lives and are resentful that God didn't help them, or had actually been told by Christians, "you don't have enough faith" or "this is your punishment."

As I've asked in other threads, why would God create people in his image, choose for them to never know him and then punish them for doing just that?
If "billions" end up being cast into the lake of fire, it won't be because God hated them; more that they hated God.

Neogaia777 said:

Jesus said God the Father "is Love", etc, and that the true and highest and greatest commandments all each hang upon, or all hinge upon Love, etc...

And as for God the Spirit, He does hate some, or at least did hate some, etc, but that hatred might fade in and with and given enough time, etc, or it might have already passed, etc, I'm afraid I don't know that part yet, etc...

But I don't believe all are saved or will all ever all be completely saved, for reasons I already stated and said, etc...

Not everyone attaining to a true saving faith, that leads to a true saving repentance, etc...

Anyway,

God Bless!

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It may sound harsh, but we are never instructed or taught to ever question anything God has said or what He does or why He does what He does.

To question God is a very grievous sin, we are commanded to trust and obey. So whenever we hear people say "I don't believe God would do such a thing because it's just not fair or loving".

We need to always remember that his ways are infinitely higher than ours, so we can expect it to be impossible to understand His ways. But just because His ways are so high above ours that we can't understand them doesn't mean that He is not fair or righteous or loving. It just means we don't understand Him.

God has hidden a lot from us at this time but He will reveal a lot more to us in eternity. We will be learning more about Him everyday forever in eternity.

Strong in Him said:

Really?
So God who is love, 1 John 4:8, who is perfect, Matthew 5:48, who made us all in his image, Genesis 1:26-27 and who declared all his creation to be VERY good, Genesis 1:31, planned, and chose, to hate some of those he had created in his own image?



He sent the flood because the world had become wicked and people loved sin more than they loved God, Genesis 6:5-6.
Do you think that Noah knocked up the ark over night and no one had any warning? Most likely it took him years, and people would have wanted to know why he was building an enormous boat in the middle of the desert. I am pretty sure that had people repented at that point, they would have been saved - as the people of Ninevah were.



If people reject God all their lives, knowingly reject him and his love, when they die they will have died in their sins, without a Saviour and without eternal life. God will not force those who chose to reject him to live with him forever. That would be hell for them; living with someone they had hated and rejected.
How many people this will refer to, we don't know; maybe billions, maybe not. God is judge and he is just - he knows whether someone has truly rejected him, or not. Maybe it's the false image of God portrayed by some Christians that they are rejecting, maybe it's the church, maybe they've had difficult lives and are resentful that God didn't help them, or had actually been told by Christians, "you don't have enough faith" or "this is your punishment."

As I've asked in other threads, why would God create people in his image, choose for them to never know him and then punish them for doing just that?
If "billions" end up being cast into the lake of fire, it won't be because God hated them; more that they hated God.

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Jesus described two kingdoms and two kinds of people. The kingdom of darkness with it's children being the children of the Devil. And the kingdom of God with it's children being the children of God.
Yes God did create us in His image, but we lost that image when our parents sinned and became the subjects of Satan. Satan is the Prince of this world, and every natural person is His subject and they bare His image.
We see in Genesis 3:5 that Adams son Seth, was not born in the image of God. He was born baring Adams image and Adam had already sinned by that time so he had the death sentence hanging over his head.

Everyone since that time was also born with that sin nature and we all belong to Satan. As prisoners of Satan we have no power to overcome Him because He is the most powerful and intelligent creature in the universe. Only God Himself has the ability to defeat Him and take His kingdom from Him.

God was never under any obligation to save a single sinner, so it's a foolish question to ask why He saves some and leaves others in their sin. The intelligent question is "why Does He save anyone" He gave us the answer to that question. He did it for His own glory, so none shall ever boast.

The Church is full of boastful people who think God owes them eternal paradise because they were smart enough to work out that eternal paradise is better than eternal torment in the lake of fire. This should offend any intelligent person, as it claims that the world greatest minds choose to go to hell and reject eternal paradise.

Dan1988 said:

It may sound harsh, but we are never instructed or taught to ever question anything God has said or what He does or why He does what He does.

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I'm not questioning God, everything I am saying, or implying or stating, is stated in scripture, etc...

And that's not questioning God, etc...

Dan1988 said:

To question God is a very grievous sin, we are commanded to trust and obey.

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Again, I am not doing that, and I am trusting and obeying Him right now, etc...

Dan1988 said:

So whenever we hear people say "I don't believe God would do such a thing because it's just not fair or loving".

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That's kind of exactly one of my points, you people are judging God (a far, far worse sin than just questioning Him, etc), (which I wasn't even doing, etc), anyway, you people are judging God based on what you think is right or wrong, or fair and unfair, and that's just not right or fair, etc, and it rejects truth also, etc...

Dan1988 said:

We need to always remember that his ways are infinitely higher than ours, so we can expect it to be impossible to understand His ways.

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His ways and His truth is not something He is keeping from us or has kept extremely hidden...

And you seem to be saying it's impossible to know Him, or Them, and that is maybe just only is, or is only because of, or is only due to only your own lack of understanding/knowledge/level of comprehension only, etc, and that's just not right or correct (or very "fair") at all, etc...

It is very, very much very, very possible to know and/or understand Him...

Dan1988 said:

But just because His ways are so high above ours that we can't understand them doesn't mean that He is not fair or righteous or loving. It just means we don't understand Him.

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So, since you don't understand, it is completely impossible for others to understand...?

Is that what you are saying, etc...?

Cause I would strongly disagree, etc...

And would say that just maybe you might just need to elevate your consciousness a little bit more or bit maybe, etc...

And take you blinders off also, etc...

Dan1988 said:

God has hidden a lot from us at this time but He will reveal a lot more to us in eternity. We will be learning more about Him everyday forever in eternity.

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It seems that He has hidden much more from some than He has from others, etc...

But, anyway...

God Bless!

TedT said:

James 1: 13 When tempted, no one should say, “ God is tempting me.” For God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does He tempt anyone. 14 But each one is tempted when by his own evil desires he is lured away and enticed.… cannot be reconciled with the doctrine that GOD causes people to sin UNLESS they have a prior commitment to a doctrine that forces this interpretation upon this verse (eisegesis) by the use of doublethink.

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Why pray "lead us not into temptation" if God doesn't do that? Our wicked heart tempts us, but God makes sure it is successful many times.

BNR32FAN said:

“The king’s heart is like channels of water in the hand of the LORD; He turns it wherever He wishes. Every man’s way is right in his own eyes, But the LORD weighs the hearts. To do righteousness and justice Is desired by the LORD more than sacrifice.”
‭‭Proverbs‬ ‭21:1-3‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

Did you ever consider that God turns the hearts of kings to righteousness and justice not towards ungodliness? The verse you posted didn’t reveal the entire message brother Dave. If God turns their heart wherever He wishes and God desires them to do righteousness and justice then doesn’t that mean that He turns their heart away from sin not towards it?

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Only in OT Israel. All kingdoms are under Satan's proximate control and rulers play only by his rules.

BNR32FAN said:

So your saying that God made Ahab take Naboth’s vineyard then punished him for it?

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Yes. Just as he made Jesus suffer under the Romans/Jews.

TedT said:

This is sophistry with no real meaning at all.

A match does not create dark, only light. Objects opaque to light create the dark. GOD created light as a metaphor for HIM being light with no dark in HIM. HE created us with a free will and an equal ability and opportunity to choose to accept HIM or to reject HIM and oppose HIS light by putting their faith in HIS claims as the lies of an evil false god. This and only this is the cause of all dark.

YHWH gave us this choice because HE created us to be HIS marriage partner as shown by the marriage of the Church with the Lamb Being the culmination of the story of creation and HIS relationship with HIS creation.

No forced love is a true love.
No forced marriage is a true marriage.
Therefore we had to have a free will and create our own willingness to love and marry HIM to fulfill HIS purpose in our creation. But a free will is also able to reject HIS claims to be our GOD and HIS marriage proposal so we also had to be able to repudiate HIM and HIS light and so create the dark that must be banished from this reality which will become HIS heaven forever.

Yes HE created all things in HIS light but some then turned opaque and resisted HIS light by their own free will choice. Only HIS giving them a free will to be able to fulfill HIS desire for a real loving marriage with them did HE ALLOW, not cause or create, their dark.

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Are you giving God's glory to wicked people?

Dan1988 said:

You added the word "everyone" and Jesus strictly forbids adding anything to His perfect Word.
This is why the Church is divided, we have people superimposing their views and conditions on Gods Word.
I'm not sure what makes you think you have the right to tell God what He should have said. But with all due respect I reject your addition to His Word as heresy

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2 Timothy 2:14
Keep reminding God’s people of these things. Warn them before God against quarreling about words; it is of no value, and only ruins those who listen.

Dan1988 said:

The word "world" in that verse means "cosmos" as in universe. Hope that helps but it still doesn't say every single person in the universe.
microsoft gave the world personal computers, now according to your wonderful philosophy all 7.4 billion people have a PC. It's amazing what you can create when you chase a dime down a rabbit hole, they say a Jew created the Grand Canyon when he dropped a dime down a rabbit hole

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Sounds like an antisemitic comment.

Dan1988 said:

It may sound harsh, but we are never instructed or taught to ever question anything God has said or what He does or why He does what He does.

To question God is a very grievous sin, we are commanded to trust and obey. So whenever we hear people say "I don't believe God would do such a thing because it's just not fair or loving".

We need to always remember that his ways are infinitely higher than ours, so we can expect it to be impossible to understand His ways. But just because His ways are so high above ours that we can't understand them doesn't mean that He is not fair or righteous or loving. It just means we don't understand Him.

God has hidden a lot from us at this time but He will reveal a lot more to us in eternity. We will be learning more about Him everyday forever in eternity.

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You characterize God as a cosmic tyrant. Not sure he appreciates that.

Dan1988 said:

God was never under any obligation to save a single sinner, so it's a foolish question to ask why He saves some and leaves others in their sin. The intelligent question is "why Does He save anyone" He gave us the answer to that question. He did it for His own glory, so none shall ever boast.

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Did you vote in the poll at the beginning of the topic. Cast your vote.

Dan1988 said:

Jesus described two kingdoms and two kinds of people. The kingdom of darkness with it's children being the children of the Devil.

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God did not create people, in his own image, who would belong to the devil.

Dan1988 said:

Yes God did create us in His image, but we lost that image when our parents sinned and became the subjects of Satan.

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Yes, and through Jesus we are able to be reconciled to God and have forgiveness and eternal life.

Dan1988 said:

We see in Genesis 3:5 that Adams son Seth, was not born in the image of God. He was born baring Adams image and Adam had already sinned by that time so he had the death sentence hanging over his head.

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A person can still be in the image of God, even if they physically resemble a human parent.
The Messiah was descended from Seth, not Cain the murderer, Luke 3:38.

Dan1988 said:

Everyone since that time was also born with that sin nature and we all belong to Satan.

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I don't believe a 1 day old baby belongs to Satan, nor a toddler who dies before they know God.
If they did, the only conclusion could be that God created them, gave them a shirt, and maybe hellish, life and then sent them to hell.

Dan1988 said:

God was never under any obligation to save a single sinner, so it's a foolish question to ask why He saves some and leaves others in their sin.

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No it isn't - Scripture does not teach us of a God like that.
Scripture says that even after Adam and Eve sinned and God punished them, he made them clothes from animal skin (because they were ashamed of their nakedness.) It says that God did not kill Cain for killing his brother but let him live. It says that Noah, Abraham, Jacob, Moses, David, Jonah, King Ahab and the nation of Israel were given second chances when they sinned against God. Israel, in particular, saw God's miracles, were led by a pillar of fire, walked across the Red Sea, were given God's law at Sinai and provided for in the wilderness. They still grumbled against God each time, yet they were given time to repent.
God saved all those who obeyed him and put lamb's blood on the door posts of their house - not all those whom he felt like saving.

Dan1988 said:

The intelligent question is "why Does He save anyone"

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Because he is love, 1 John 4:8.
He is light, 1 John 1:5, and there is no darkness in him at all.
He is perfect, Matthew 5:48.
He is full of compassion, Exodus 34:6-7, Psalms 103:8, Psalms 116:5, Psalms 145:8-9, Isaiah 54:7, Isaiah 54:10.
He wants all to know him and be saved 2 Peter 3:9.

Dan1988 said:

He did it for His own glory,

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So God says that he is best glorified by saving only a few people and leaving the others in hell? On what basis does he save? As it is not by OUR works or good deeds, it could only be on a whim. Really? Does your security rest in God's whim? Supposing he changed his mind, and after a period of time felt that he didn't want to save you after all? Doesn't sound very loving to me, or give any assurance of security or reason to trust him.

John says that the cross shows God's love, 1 John 3:16.

Dave L said:

Yes. Just as he made Jesus suffer under the Romans/Jews.

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He didn't make Jesus suffer.
Jesus willingly laid down his life for the sheep.