Does God love all or some?

Does God love all or some?


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Jesse Dornfeld

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If God doesn't love everybody, then the next time some calamity affects me, I'm going to be telling myself I must be one of those that God doesn't love.

But in truth, if disaster strikes, or someone ends up not saved, that doesn't mean God loves that person any less. God so loved *the world,* not some of the people in it, but *the entire world,* that He sent His Son. That's John 3:16, for which the "whosoever" means anybody who wants to. Nobody is going to be sorry for their sins, come to God and beg forgiveness and claim the blood of Christ, only for God to answer, "Sorry, it doesn't apply to you. I don't love you."

And then there's 1 John 4:8, which states that God IS love. How is it possible for someone who IS love, not to love some people?

I have family members I don't associate with for various reasons that have nothing to do with not loving them. It's just that if we continued to have contact, bad things would happen. It's the same thing with those who reject God. That's their choice. They are separated from God because they willed it, not because He didn't love them.

John 3:16 has a clause. Whoever BELIEVES in him, not just anyone, but those who believe in Christ's sacrifice is who Christ died for.
 
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Hmm

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Does God love everyone, yes. Does God love everyone the same, no. Because the question doesn't talk about degrees of love,

There are no degrees of unconditional love that's why, as the Prodigal Son will confirm.
 
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public hermit

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No, because if I do, it signifies that God loves everyone the same, and he doesn't. That's the problem with the question. Does God love everyone, yes. Does God love everyone the same, no. Because the question doesn't talk about degrees of love, it makes it look like I would be agreeing with what Anders Nygren has put forward, and I disagree with him.

Okay, that makes sense. I honor your position.
 
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LovebirdsFlying

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John 3:16 has a clause. Whoever BELIEVES in him, not just anyone, but those who believe in Christ's sacrifice is who Christ died for.
Whoever believes in Him will inherit eternal life.

But He was sent in the first place because God so loved the world.

And you didn't address the fact that God IS love. It's not something He does. It's something He is.
 
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Saint Steven

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No, because if I do, it signifies that God loves everyone the same, and he doesn't. That's the problem with the question. Does God love everyone, yes. Does God love everyone the same, no. Because the question doesn't talk about degrees of love, it makes it look like I would be agreeing with what Anders Nygren has put forward, and I disagree with him.
Perhaps the love is the same, but the expressions of that love differ?

God certainly has special relationships with some that are different than his relationship with others. But does that mean a difference in love? (quantity/quality)
 
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Jesse Dornfeld

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There are no degrees of unconditional love that's why, as the Prodigal Son will confirm.

Why do you think God has unconditional love for everyone?
 
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Jesse Dornfeld

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Whoever believes in Him will inherit eternal life.

But He was sent in the first place because God so loved the world.

And you didn't address the fact that God IS love. It's not something He does. It's something He is.

Jesus said Himself he was sent for the lost sheep of Israel, not everyone.
 
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Saint Steven

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No, because if I do, it signifies that God loves everyone the same, and he doesn't. That's the problem with the question. Does God love everyone, yes. Does God love everyone the same, no. Because the question doesn't talk about degrees of love, it makes it look like I would be agreeing with what Anders Nygren has put forward, and I disagree with him.
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There are no votes for "God loves some".
 
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Jesse Dornfeld

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Perhaps the love is the same, but the expressions of that love differ?

God certainly has special relationships with some that are different than his relationship with others. But does that mean a difference in love? (quantity/quality)

It's a difference in love qualitatively if you believe no everyone goes to heaven. It's also a different kind of love categorically because some he saves and some he doesn't.
 
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Saint Steven

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Jesse Dornfeld

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Yet he personally commissioned the Apostle Paul to go to whom?

The gentiles. This doesn't mean Christ was picking everyone. There is still a difference between saved and unsaved, correct? So how would you describe God's love for you? Would you say it is the same as the staunch atheist who repeatedly hardens his heart towards God?
 
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Saint Steven

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It's a difference in love qualitatively if you believe no everyone goes to heaven. It's also a different kind of love categorically because some he saves and some he doesn't.
There is a case to be made for God saving everyone. Now that's love.

1 John 2:2
He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world.

Romans 11:32
For God has bound everyone over to disobedience so that he may have mercy on them all.

Titus 2:11
For the grace of God has appeared, bringing salvation for all people,

1 Timothy 4:10
That is why we labor and strive, because we have put our hope in the living God, who is the Savior of all people, and especially of those who believe.

1 John 4:14
And we have seen and testify that the Father has sent his Son to be the Savior of the world.

1 Corinthians 15:22
For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive.
 
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Did you vote?
There are no votes for "God loves some".

Yeah, I'm actually surprised there's not one vote for "some." Maybe that's an indication that the pole questions lack sufficient nuance. Honestly, having watched CF posters for a good bit, I felt confident some would choose "some." Lol. But, nope.
 
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Religiot

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Oh my. Please, say more.
You do know that God drowned everyone on earth, except Noah, and his family, right?

Here are some direct citations about how God feels concerning those that reject Him:

"And ye shall not walk in the manners of the nation, which I cast out before you: for they committed all these things, and therefore I abhorred them." --Leviticus 20:23

"The foolish shall not stand in thy sight: thou hatest all workers of iniquity." --Psalms 5:5

"Thou shalt destroy them that speak leasing: the Lord will abhor the bloody and deceitful man." --Psalms 5:6

"For the wicked boasteth of his heart's desire, and blesseth the covetous, whom the Lord abhorreth." --Psalm 10:3

"These six things doth the Lord hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him: a proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood, an heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief, a false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren." --Proverbs 6:16-19

"I found Israel like grapes in the wilderness; I saw your fathers as the firstripe in the fig tree at her first time: but they went to Baal–peor, and separated themselves unto that shame; and their abominations were according as they loved. As for Ephraim, their glory shall fly away like a bird, from the birth, and from the womb, and from the conception. Though they bring up their children, yet will I bereave them, that there shall not be a man left: yea, woe also to them when I depart from them Ephraim, as I saw Tyrus, is planted in a pleasant place: but Ephraim shall bring forth his children to the murderer. Give them, O Lord: what wilt thou give? give them a miscarrying womb and dry breasts. All their wickedness is in Gilgal: for there I hated them: for the wickedness of their doings I will drive them out of mine house, I will love them no more: all their princes are revolters. Ephraim is smitten, their root is dried up, they shall bear no fruit: yea, though they bring forth, yet will I slay even the beloved fruit of their womb. My God will cast them away, because they did not hearken unto him: and they shall be wanderers among the nations." --Hosea 9:10-17

"For I will no more pity the inhabitants of the land, saith the Lord: but, lo, I will deliver the men every one into his neighbour's hand, and into the hand of his king: and they shall smite the land, and out of their hand I will not deliver them. And I will feed the flock of slaughter, even you, O poor of the flock. And I took unto me two staves; the one I called Beauty, and the other I called Bands; and I fed the flock. Three shepherds also I cut off in one month; and my soul lothed them, and their soul also abhorred me. Then said I, I will not feed you: that that dieth, let it die; and that that is to be cut off, let it be cut off; and let the rest eat every one the flesh of another." Zechariah 11:6-9

I'm just stating the facts.
 
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Jesse Dornfeld

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As I mentioned, the parable of The Prodigal Son for one. What does the parable mean to you?

I'm not sure your conclusion follows. It was the son of the man, not the mans neighbor.
 
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fhansen

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And unrighteousness is just as un-measurable as righteousness in relation to our salvation. Is there any human that cannot be saved by God? Is grace only effective on a percentage of the population?

In reference to salvation, there is only one thing that can be measured with any confidence. That's Christ's finished work on our behalf.

The good works we do are the evidence of a transformation having taken place. They are not a requirement for salvation. Otherwise we are saving ourselves.
God can do whatever He wants, of course, including just placing everyone in heaven to begin with if that's the plan anyway. Instead we've been sent here, to a place of education/formation, testing, hopefully refinement and a movement down the road of righteousness rather than not on it at all or away from it. It's ridiculous to think that Christians can't and don't need to be personally righteous now. We must at least be on that road, otherwise shades of Is 5:20 should start dancing in our heads. I'd read 1 John 1 and 3.
 
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You do know that God drowned everyone on earth, except Noah, and his family, right?

Here are some direct citations about how God feels concerning those that reject Him:

"And ye shall not walk in the manners of the nation, which I cast out before you: for they committed all these things, and therefore I abhorred them." --Leviticus 20:23

"The foolish shall not stand in thy sight: thou hatest all workers of iniquity." --Psalms 5:5

"Thou shalt destroy them that speak leasing: the Lord will abhor the bloody and deceitful man." --Psalms 5:6

"For the wicked boasteth of his heart's desire, and blesseth the covetous, whom the Lord abhorreth." --Psalm 10:3

"These six things doth the Lord hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him: a proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood, an heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief, a false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren." --Proverbs 6:16-19

"I found Israel like grapes in the wilderness; I saw your fathers as the firstripe in the fig tree at her first time: but they went to Baal–peor, and separated themselves unto that shame; and their abominations were according as they loved. As for Ephraim, their glory shall fly away like a bird, from the birth, and from the womb, and from the conception. Though they bring up their children, yet will I bereave them, that there shall not be a man left: yea, woe also to them when I depart from them Ephraim, as I saw Tyrus, is planted in a pleasant place: but Ephraim shall bring forth his children to the murderer. Give them, O Lord: what wilt thou give? give them a miscarrying womb and dry breasts. All their wickedness is in Gilgal: for there I hated them: for the wickedness of their doings I will drive them out of mine house, I will love them no more: all their princes are revolters. Ephraim is smitten, their root is dried up, they shall bear no fruit: yea, though they bring forth, yet will I slay even the beloved fruit of their womb. My God will cast them away, because they did not hearken unto him: and they shall be wanderers among the nations." --Hosea 9:10-17

"For I will no more pity the inhabitants of the land, saith the Lord: but, lo, I will deliver the men every one into his neighbour's hand, and into the hand of his king: and they shall smite the land, and out of their hand I will not deliver them. And I will feed the flock of slaughter, even you, O poor of the flock. And I took unto me two staves; the one I called Beauty, and the other I called Bands; and I fed the flock. Three shepherds also I cut off in one month; and my soul lothed them, and their soul also abhorred me. Then said I, I will not feed you: that that dieth, let it die; and that that is to be cut off, let it be cut off; and let the rest eat every one the flesh of another." Zechariah 11:6-9

I'm just stating the facts.

Okay, fair enough. Will you do me a favor and vote "some" so the pole will better reflect the opinions on the thread?
 
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