1 John 1:9

Butterball1 · Feb 20, 2021

Dave L said:
Spiritually dead people cannot grasp spiritual truth. And all are born spiritually dead in Adam. Faith is the fruit of having the Holy Spirit.

Yes they can. Thoe in Acts 2 and Acts 7 were lost, spiritually dead. Those in Acts 2 who heard Peter and those in Acts 7 who heard Stephen understood what Peter & Stephen said. The difference is how the message was received. Those in Acts 2 were pricked in their hearts believing what they heard and understood while those in Acts 7 were cut in their heart hating and not believing what they heard and understood.

Dave L · Feb 20, 2021

Butterball1 said:
Obedience to Christ is part of salvation Hebrews 5:9. Therefore those who obey CHrist are taking advantage of what Christ did for man on the cross. Thoe that disobey Christ are letting it pass by.

Lk 6:46 "And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?"
Matthew 7:21 "Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven."

What you do not understand is the new birth is a new nature that loves obedience to Christ and hates sin. It is hypocrisy to act this way as a person who is not born again.

Dave L · Feb 20, 2021

Butterball1 said:
Yes they can. Thoe in Acts 2 and Acts 7 were lost, spiritually dead. Those in Acts 2 who heard Peter and those in Acts 7 who heard Stephen understood what Peter & Stephen said. The difference is how the message was received. Those in Acts 2 were pricked in their hearts believing what they heard and understood while those in Acts 7 were cut in their heart hating and not believing what they heard and understood.

Hint. They were believers or they would not have asked Peter about the plan. Whoever believes has eternal life.

Butterball1 · Feb 20, 2021

Dave L said:
What you do not understand is the new birth is a new nature that loves obedience to Christ and hates sin. It is hypocrisy to act this way as a person who is not born again.

What the BIble teaches is that no one can experience the new birth while living in rebellion to God. It takes obedience in believing repenting confession and submission to baptism in order to be born again. WHy was Nicodemus and other Pharisees as him not born again? They rebelled against God Luke 7:30

Dave L · Feb 20, 2021

Butterball1 said:
What the BIble teaches is that no one can experience the new birth while living in rebellion to God. It takes obedience in believing repenting confession and submission to baptism in order to be born again. WHy was Nicodemus and other Pharisees as him not born again? They rebelled against God Luke 7:30

You cannot stop rebelling against God unless he gives you a new heart of love for him.
“And the LORD thy God will circumcise thine heart, and the heart of thy seed, to love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, that thou mayest live.” Deuteronomy 30:6 (KJV 1900)

Butterball1 · Feb 20, 2021

Dave L said:
Hint. They were believers or they would not have asked Peter about the plan. Whoever believes has eternal life.

They were beleivers because they UNDERSTOOD what Peter preached to them while yet still lost. Faith comes by hearing, hearing by the word of God Romans 10:17. If the spiritually dead cannot understand as you claim, then they would never would have been able to understand what Peter was preaching therefore nevr come to have belief.

Dave L · Feb 20, 2021

Butterball1 said:
They were beleivers because they UNDERSTOOD what Peter preached to them while yet still lost. Faith comes by hearing, hearing by the word of God Romans 10:17. If the spiritually dead cannot understand as you claim, then they would never would have been able to understand what Peter was preaching therefore nevr come to have belief.

They were born again Jews entering the New Covenant.

Butterball1 · Feb 20, 2021

Dave L said:
You cannot stop rebelling against God unless he gives you a new heart of love for him.
“And the LORD thy God will circumcise thine heart, and the heart of thy seed, to love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, that thou mayest live.” Deuteronomy 30:6 (KJV 1900)

God does not force one to have a new heart against their will. Those that quit their rebelling against God and start doing as God said then it can be seen by their obedience they have a new heart. So those that obey God create a new heart in themselves Ezekiel 18:31. God gives people a new heart Ezekiel 36:26 by giving man the instructions man needs to obey and those that do obey in that sense God gave them a new heart. Man cannot create a new heart in himself apart from God, apart from obeying God. So it takes both God (His word) and man (obedience to God's word) for man to have a new heart.

Dave L · Feb 20, 2021

Butterball1 said:
God does not force one to have a new heart against their will. Those that quit their rebelling against God and start doing as God said then it can be seen by their obedience they have a new heart. So those that obey God create a new heart in themselves Ezekiel 18:31. God gives people a new heart Ezekiel 36:26 by giving man the instructions man needs to obey and those that do obey in that sense God gave them a new heart.

People hate him by nature. If he doesn't forcefully change people for the better, none would be saved.

Butterball1 · Feb 20, 2021

Dave L said:
They were born again Jews entering the New Covenant.

From the context of John 3, Nicodemus had not been born again. Whose fault was that? Nicodemus' for not obeying John thereby rejecting God's counsel Luke 7:30.

John Mullally · Feb 20, 2021

Dave L said:
Spiritually dead people cannot grasp spiritual truth. And all are born spiritually dead in Adam. Faith is the fruit of having the Holy Spirit.

Peter states the remedy for spiritually dead people in Acts 2:38-39. This is good news (termed Gospel) unless you are tied to supporting some unscriptural theology. Here, Peter promises the remission of sins and gift of the Holy Spirit (this is arguably salvation) to those who repent and are baptized (in verse 38). Peter pleads with the crowd throughout this passage - which shows that God is not against you and that there is no exclusive club. Verse 39 says that that offer extends to today.

Acts 2:36 “Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly that God has made this Jesus, whom you crucified, both Lord and Christ.” 37 Now when they heard this, they were cut to the heart, and said to Peter and the rest of the apostles, “Men and brethren, what shall we do?” 38 Then Peter said to them, “Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. 39 For the promise is to you and to your children, and to all who are afar off, as many as the Lord our God will call.” 40 And with many other words he testified and exhorted them, saying, “Be saved from this perverse generation.” 41 Then those who gladly received his word were baptized; and that day about three thousand souls were added to them.

Note how this passage does not support "God only saves who He choses to save."

Dave L · Feb 20, 2021

Butterball1 said:
From the context of John 3, Nicodemus had not been born again. Whose fault was that? Nicodemus' for not obeying John thereby rejecting God's counsel Luke 7:30.

God saves only those he chooses to save.
“Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour? What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,” Romans 9:21–23 (KJV 1900)

Butterball1 · Feb 20, 2021

Dave L said:
People hate him by nature. If he doesn't forcefully change people for the better, none would be saved.

No verse says people hate due to a nature they were born with. People hate what they hear and understand by choice. Those in Acts 7 hated Stephen's message not because they did not understand it. But because they did understand, chosing not to like it to the point of killing Stephen.

Der Alte · Feb 20, 2021

Dave L said:
Only the born again can identify with this. It's the salvation experience.

Butterball1 said:
The context of 1 John 1:7-9 is John is writing to those who are Christians. And saying IF they continue to walk in the light and IF they continue to confess their sins then they will continually have their sins cleansed away. Justification is a process not a one and done deal completed when one has faith only regardless of what the Christian ever does.

Dave L · Feb 20, 2021

Butterball1 said:
No verse says people hate due to a nature they were born with. People hate what they hear and understand by choice. Those in Acts 7 hated Stephen's message not because they did not understand it. But because they did understand, chosing not to like it to the point of killing Stephen.

Find the love of God in the natural born person.

“Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.” Galatians 5:19–21 (KJV 1900)

Find it in the born-again.

“But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law. And they that are Christ’s have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts. If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit. Let us not be desirous of vain glory, provoking one another, envying one another.” Galatians 5:22–26 (KJV 1900)

Dave L · Feb 20, 2021

This means some pass as Christians but will fall away.

Butterball1 · Feb 20, 2021

Dave L said:
God saves only those he chooses to save.
“Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour? What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,” Romans 9:21–23 (KJV 1900)

God saves anyone that chooses to obey Him Hebrews 5:9.

In the context of Romans 9, those Jews, due to thier own choice in disobeying God in rejecting Christ 1 Thessalonains 2:14-16

Butterball1 · Feb 20, 2021

Dave L said:
Find the love of God in the natural born person.

“Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.” Galatians 5:19–21 (KJV 1900)

Find it in the born-again.

“But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law. And they that are Christ’s have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts. If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit. Let us not be desirous of vain glory, provoking one another, envying one another.” Galatians 5:22–26 (KJV 1900)

You will not find works of the flesh in a newly born person. Love and hate come as one mentally matures gaining understanding of what is right and to be loved and what is wrong and is to be hated, Isaiah 7:15-16

Dave L · Feb 20, 2021

Butterball1 said:
God saves anyone that chooses to obey Him Hebrews 5:9.

In the context of Romans 9, those Jews, due to thier own choice in disobeying God in rejecting Christ 1 Thessalonains 2:14-16

You are making the identity of whom he saves, a work of the flesh that cannot save.

Dave L · Feb 20, 2021

Butterball1 said:
You will not find works of the flesh in a newly born person. Love and hate come as one mentally matures gaining understanding of what is right and to be loved and what is wrong and is to be hated, Isaiah 7:15-16

Why do babies die? The wages of sin (hate) are death.

1 John 1:9

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This is me about 1 yr. old.

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